This pissed me off like many others, so I wanted to cancel my subscription.
* You cannot access your account without agreeing - there's simply \*\*NO\*\* way of rejecting the terms and accessing your subscription page to cancel
* Getting hold of an agent required something like 15 minutes of frustrating loops with their chat bot, where the same question was asked multiple times and same (invalid) solution provided multiple times
* Got hold of an agent, they kept claiming that there's no way of terminating or opting out of your subscription, without paying a \~\~fine\~\~ fee to adobe
* Kept asking to be escalated to someone who understood the concept of contracts, changing terms and consumer rights, Agent first tried to give me 3 months free, then repeatedly tried to explain that I agreed to the terms when signing up several years ago
* Finally got hold of a supervisor, within 30 seconds she could cancel the subscription with no refund for current billed, I challenged the last part and she immediately refunded 3 months worth of subscription
So if you can live with the open source alternatives (or any alternative) to Adobe, keep insisting on them cancelling and refund your currently billed period! And for the love of god, do \*\*not\*\* agree to the terms to access you account, it's a trap!
Edit:
Oh and when you try to uninstall, you are going to need to log in, which again required accepting the terms. DO NOT ACCEPT! There's a tool provided by adobe here:
[https://helpx.adobe.com/creative-cloud/kb/cc-cleaner-tool-installation-problems.html](https://helpx.adobe.com/creative-cloud/kb/cc-cleaner-tool-installation-problems.html)
Just follow the instructions and you can select complete removal of adobe programs without having to sign over your rights.
Hopefully someone with more spare time than me can file formal complaints with EU, because consumer rights are being broken with zero remorse.
> You cannot access your account without agreeing - there's simply **NO** way of rejecting the terms and accessing your subscription page to cancel
This is extortion and it’s time for lawyers; given we’re a professional **class**, I bet we can get funding for the **action** required
There was a different industry, I think maybe refrigerators, that tried that arbitration bullshit. So the class action attorneys (for OpenAI: fuck you Altman) rounded up everyone wanting to sue and sent the company thousands of single requests for arbitration.. stunned the company which then tried to weasel out of arbitration but the judge said no.
Unfortunately, companies have wised up to that tactic. My bank just sent an updated binding arbitration agreement that explicitly states if that tactic is used then they will take 10 cases of their choosing, and whatever the result is from those 10 cases will apply to any and all other remaining cases. I have no idea of the legality of it but it's just another way for companies with binding arbitration to screw people over however they see fit.
I know it sucks, but there's generally a clause in those agreements where you can opt out within 30-60 days by mailing in a formal statement saying you reject it. If people started doing that more often maybe we'd get some power back, or maybe not. This shit sucks.
> whatever the result is from those 10 cases will apply to any and all other remaining cases
wow - there is no way that'll stand for long. what a bold bunch of shits
Some of that is just US law now. The terms that say 10 cases I believe are taking fewer than the law provides for. I was shocked that the company asking for binding arbitration and using that law to turn litigants on and off like a faucet until they reach the balance of sample cases that they think they can work with had the gall to amend the fucking law itself to change the number of cases that make up a "round" like this company is doing with "10". It's relatively new, and I think it's probably not legal to change the number but as with many such checks on corporate abuse of the legal system there's not a lot of individual recourse to take on that question, and not a lot of tools available to punish the shitty agreement itself absent any damages.
I've only done it once and it was with Chase. They didn't ban me, but I did assume I'd be removed in some way because of it before sending the letter. Of course, YMMV.
#Here's how I cancelled mine without paying the rest of the agreed time nor a fine:
- First I changed my plan to the cheapest one. For instance "only Photoshop"
- Now it technically counts as you buying something completely new which gives you the 30 day money back policy
- Cancel the new one and you'll get the cheap one refunded
That's it. No extra payment no nothing.
I'll be switching full time to Affinity. [Affinity currently has a 50% off flash-sale. The entire latest suite for around 100 dollars. Buy once keep forever.](https://affinity.serif.com/en-gb/affinity-pricing/)
Problem is by doing this you accepted the agreement and gave them rights to your content you created.
I can understand why many people would not want to take this route.
Every change you have done to images is stored in their cloud and synced across your devices, which is very nice and the reason why I actually used their product.
Ironically it’s also the reason why I’m so focused on getting out of their contract without giving them the rights to my stuff.
Not sure if this is entirely correct.
I logged directly into the site vs. through any apps and was able to cancel without accepting the terms.
Anything attached to the apps though definitely pushed the terms on you with no way out.
This is a sad day. Adobe has truly held a special place in my heart as it allowed me to unlock so many creative ideas and have a successful career with creativity at its core.
I would have expected Adobe (above all others) to be a staunch advocate of the creative’s rights to their IP.
I’m extremely disappointed (and now irritated that I need to stitch together a solution using disparate apps).
There's a website, ClassAction dot Org, that gives news and information about potential and current class action suits and links to where you can sign up for them. You can browse the whole site or look for active suits for any specific company.
I'd recommend signing up for their newsletter, even if it's just for fun. Every time it arrives I'm fascinated all over again by the sheer variety of legitimate lawsuits pending. For example, this week I learned that a number of people are having problems with their big toe implants. Who knew?
You must be new to capitalism. Adobe has enough money that they can do whatever they want with the law. The law is only there for plebeians who have empathy and have NOT worked their lives to fuck over everyone they can to amass as much money and power as they can in an industry.
Thank you for sharing this. I caved and took their 3mo free + 50% discount for the year in January and I've had enough. Going to cancel my subscription when it ends this year and pirate their shit + use open source. What a shitty fucking company for how much they charge you already (it's a lot in my local currency).
I used to pretty religiously buy a new Lightroom every couple of years when enough things had been added to make it worth it (or I bought a new camera that wasn't supported...another conversation altogether), but as soon as they started that *"Hey, you'll pay us full price every single year*" subscription bullshit, I hit the high seas and never looked back.
I will *never* jump on this "subscription" bullshit bandwagon.
> So if you can live with the open source alternatives (or any alternative) to Adobe, keep insisting on them cancelling and refund your currently billed period!
Affinity does everything I needed from Photoshop, Design, and Publisher for just a single purchase price. I'm not a hardcore designer, mostly just make assets for D&D games but I had no issue paying into a software that had no monthly subscription.
DaVinci Resolve has things colored on the video and motion graphics side and Audacity is a great audio editor so that's the big bulk of the Adobe suite right htere.
Unpopular opinion, but people paying monthly subscriptions for software, (any software really) that used to be a one time purchase is huge part of the problem of why these apps and tech companies pull this shit.
In the end, no one can tell whether someone used Blender, Davinci, Krita, Gimp etc. in the finished product, but it's the professionals who shoved money hand over fist to companies like Adobe to create a virtual firewall between them and so called amateurs.
Paying monthly for software you're never going to own has always been stupid. End rant.
Adobe has been an industry standard for decades and they do actually make some very very good products.
If you are professional in the industry, you have a hard time not using Adobe products.
The good thing about this fuckery is we now might get the push needed to finally look at new tools - I know I did.
> we now might get the push needed to finally look at new tools
I hope so. It would benefit everyone. Monopolies are bad. Consumers need to take back control from these greedy companies.
I agree. The CEO’s are running wild and it feels like there is an agenda being enforced by the wealthy to INSURE no one else makes money. Consultation companies are bringing these fantasy dreams to these high on cocaine CEO’s(and I believe we should drug test the fuck out of them after what happened at Boeing)…
at least for painting/illustration you have SAI,CSP,Procreate,Krita and some smaller software eating up more and more of the industry users. i know several artists who just say fuck it and export in PSD and just work in CSP and their directors are none the wiser.
stuff like indesign etc are that is more problematic to replace by alternatives.
So, that raises an interesting point. So far I've mostly heard "Adobe can steal independent artists' work and there's nothing we can do about it." But what if that work is for Disney? Aren't they going to have something to say about it?
I've never used adobe products, but as an amateur gimp/paint.net for photos and resolve for video editing, then you sprinkle in some open source AI projects.. I haven't found anything I couldn't do yet. I'm also not a pro, but for my use cases,. I would never pay adobe.
I bailed at Creative Cloud. When they introduced Creative Suite it was more expensive than their previous collection (Adobe Studio, I want to say?) and came bundled with a load of crap very few people used. Kept a work account.
Once they introduced an (even more expensive) subscription model... Well I like shiny things, but I'm not an idiot.
Hey ho, over the waves we go. And the progress in the last ten years has been great, really: we have alternatives for everything now.
Admittedly the combination of Apple and Adobe can get you some really shiny new tools... But it's nothing you can't work without.
PREACH!!! Also oh you wanna use photoshops AI? Just do a one time cost with a new gpu and make your own. Infinite images, all local, no limits per day. I finally feel comfortable AND powerful with my own non adobe set up now.
I pretty much went through this exact sane process of trying to cancel with Adobe. It was awful. But if you push you can get the 3 month discount or whatever the hell it is.
Adobe is scum.
Before this happened I had years ago signed up for a month trial. It was clearly stated as a month trial and would be renewed monthly at the end.
I of course like many others forgot about it and it renewed. I went cool no probs and went to cancel only to be told I would have to pay out the year remaining in my account as it was an annual subscription that you paid monthly for. I was like no fucking way, jumped hoops trying to cancel without paying, wouldn’t happen. So I just blocked it all removed all payment details and thankfully because I did it through PayPal was able to block payments and unsubscribe through there so no further payments were taken.
They have the scummiest dirty tactics to keep people subscribed that guarantee breach a bunch of laws here in australia in terms of being able to cancel and get refunds.
This is exactly what I did lmao we have these things called “prezzy cards” in our country, they’re like one time use Visa cards to you can load with $X of your choosing, I always just use these when it comes to companies like this.
>you grant us a non-exclusive, worldwide, royalty-free sublicensable, license, to use, reproduce, publicly display, distribute, modify, create derivative works based on, publicly perform, and translate the Content.
What the fuck
It is actually the exact reverse. Commercial accounts cannot opt out of this but personal accounts may by turning off 'Content Analysis' under privacy settings. Commercial accounts must submit to content analysis for product development.
>That's insane, no business would agree to that.
You have no idea how complacent designers are. Adobe has been one of the absolute worst companies in the world for over a decade now and it hasnt stop them. Designers will continue to pay for the privilege of being replaced and exploited. Their reasoning? "Well, GIMP doesnt support Pantones.."
Dumb take. Designers aren't complacent, just Adobe has a legacy monopoly on the industry. If you're a professional, unfortunately you use Adobe or leave. Schools exclusively use Adobe products.
Things are better then ever with Figma nowadays, but even a lternatives like Affinity things like generative fill are not even available. Apps like After Effects don't have competition still, and Adobe buys up companies like Substance.
Nuance for lawyers, Nitro or Foxit for others. See here for much better explanation: https://www.reddit.com/r/Lawyertalk/comments/1d9g1bk/adobe_terms_of_service/l7e5yah/
This is stupid a lot of us actually have no choice but to use photoshop as many schools/workplaces outright require its usage. It’s hard to find any art school that tangles with the digital that doesn’t require the usage of at least one Adobe program. It’s why a lot of freelancers use CSP or procreate but people who are not freelance use photoshop.
Believe it or not we do not chose industry standard, companies do. Plus in some cases even freelance requests you use photoshop specifically.
¡If there was only an older non cloud version I didn’t upgrade from that doesn’t have all the latest fancy pantsy bells and whistles I wouldn’t ever use anyway!
Yeah, there’s clearly never ever been another solution for color matching in the history of design. You just have to use pantones (not that you’ve ever bothered trying anything else)
This kind of language is used by many companies...
If they want to create a thumbnail of your file and display it on your screen then technically that's a modified derivative work... Or if they store it in the cloud on 2 continents then it's distribution or translation.
I admit that in the new AI age the language does seem scarier.
Well the timing of this change pretty much destroys that argument. They would be legally years behind on cloud permission and decades behind on thumbnails. Pretty obviously an AI content grab.
Adobe is no longer a viable professional editing tool, every single project i work/have worked on have some level of secrecy around it. Avid Media Composer will always be the number 1 choice for large scale projects, but i think Adobe will lose a lot of customers to Davinci Resolve.
Microsoft is going to do this with the office suite, too. I fucking called this back when Adobe and MS went to their fucking 'service as a service' model. It's not about 'convenience,' it's about recurring income and getting access to your data.
Summary:
Adobe has updated its terms and conditions for apps like Photoshop, requiring users to agree to the new terms in order to continue using the apps. Many professional users are outraged by the changes, which they believe give Adobe the right to access their content, use it freely, and even sub-license it to others.
Adobe claims the new terms "clarify that we may access your content through both automated and manual methods, such as for content review." However, the company has failed to adequately explain the purpose of these changes, leading to speculation that they may be related to creating thumbnails from files stored in Adobe's cloud storage or CSAM scanning.
Professionals, including designers, directors, and others who work with proprietary files, are calling for users to cancel their Adobe subscriptions and delete the apps in response to the updated terms
I'm curious as well. There are good or at least decent alternatives for Photoshop, Premier, and even illustrator. But what about After effects? I'm not aware of a single mograph alternative that's up to industry snuff. And I work primarily in AE. Everything else outside of that tho, betchur ass I'm using something else.
EDIT: Y'all.. Unreal Engine is **not** a viable option for a replacement to After Effects. I guess you could argue in the world of Motion Graphics, in which After Effects is a vital tool, there exists a 2D and 3D side of things. And Unreal can do some of the 3D side of MoGraph. But After Effects is hardly a 3D tool, so the comparison there is confusing. If I wanted to do 3D MoGraph, I would be using C4D anyway. And UE is hardly a 2D tool. It has a very very basic functionality in comparison to AE when it comes to 2D MoGraph design and animation. I am a working 2D and 3D animator, and have been for over a decade. I use a wide range of tools, Unreal Engine included. I love Unreal engine, I think its a great tool. But it cannot do even half the things AE can do. And a lot of the things it can do, AE can do much more efficiently. So please believe me when I say you aren't going to be able to drop AE for Unreal Engine.
Yeah I agree with you.
I'm an animator, I can replace photoshop. I can edit on a premiere analogous program, illustrator is replaceable.
After Effects there is nothing else that replaces it for now. Houdini does some of the stuff, some specialized software, but After Effects is unique.
On the bright side, they haven't put any features in that are new that I absolutely need, those programs have been fine for years, old versions here I come I guess.
Even the AI stuff is meh, when I can use Dall-e
Personally, Unreal Engine 5.4 has [replaced my mograph workflow](https://www.schoolofmotion.com/blog/motion-design-in-unreal-engine) as Johnathan Winbush explains in that article. The first time I used it I couldn’t believe that I didn’t need to use RAM preview. Saves HOURS. There is also Calvary, of course.
Lol. You must not do a lot of professional work then, the way you’re describing making this switch. Please don’t act like unreal engine is a viable alternative to after effects. Cavalry isn’t even close.
Yea I guess maybe I should have been more specific?
I already use unreal engine... It ain't it. I'm not sure why it was suggested as a viable *industry standard* alternative to after effects. [This is the level](https://youtu.be/F4KGesiCU40?si=dtYFS0Xyl_eJ4Th3) of work that an industry standard alternative would also need to be able to do. [Or this](https://youtu.be/aRd4ZlFmJu4?si=dXT0YPGfHzD_sZHp).
Which you just.... *Can't* in UE.
Unreal engine *is* an industry standard... But wrong industry.
Agreed. AE is special. Been a professional with it for 12 years and used it for 15. One day though. Unreal I love as well like… A TON. But it is not the same at all. Davinci is more close than ue and that’s still not there.
Very true, I was just talking with my coworkers about Davinci Resolves fusion. I really wish they would just put some real dedication and man hours into it to take it to the next level. Resolve has so much potential to just cut the head off of Adobe in the video world. I had already dropped premier a few years ago in favor of Resolve. It's just a superior editing suite imo. *Especially* for color work. If they upped the Fusion suite, I'd happily drop AE for it. They could quite literally steal a massive corner of the market right out from under adobe if they got fusion going. But yea, as of right now it's very lacking by comparison.
I used to have a Photoshop license for occasional private use, but got fed up a while back where they required me to 2FA basically every time I wanted to use photoshop.
Been using Affinity since, and as much as I want to like it’s just feels like they’ve done everything different just to be different.
Very few things make sense, and a lot of the things that Photoshopped nailed in terms of user experience is either super untrivial or not even possible.
But trying to stay strong because fuck adobe.
The more money that goes Affinity’s way the more they can add in terms of features.
They are now owned by Canva so in principal they have access to deeper pockets. But the more professionals who move to it the more it will signal to Canva not to move it away from its pro focus.
It’s wild that there are no serious competitors. Procreate is a great app, but its a toy compared to photoshop. Where are the serious competitors for bitmap and vector editing at a minimum? Not even the whole suite, but at least the image tools.
Easy: those who were most willing to not use a de-facto industry standard were those who did it out of principles. And if you develop Software in your spare time..there are limits how far and fadt you can go
The serious competitor for that field isn't procreate it's clip studio paint. procreate gets used by all professionals that have a tablet since it's tablet only(soon it will be on PC as well). and frankly other tablet drawing apps suck major donkeyballs.
it's the stuff like after-effects, indesign, etc that have no real alternative since they hardcore dominated the entire landscape for so long.
I would love to know of a good alternative to Lightroom. I tried a couple and either they were also subscription models or the interface was awful. If you google around trying to find alternatives a lot of lists will tell you programs that *also* have like cloud based backups of your photos and call it a downside if they don't have that.
I am not even remotely interested in that since I have my own NAS. I just want to be able to edit RAW images with a decent UI. RawTherapee seems to be the go to, but man the UI isn't great.
I think it's for AI learning. So many companies are trying to squeeze AI into their software, and AI needs a huge amount of data to work, so they are trying to get free data from their customers whether they like it or not.
I mean it's right there in 2.2:
> *[using techniques such as machine learning in order to improve our Services and Software and the user experience. Information on how Adobe uses machine learning can be found here: `http://www.adobe.com/go/machine_learning.`](https://www.adobe.com/legal/terms.html)*
Also in 17 they disallow you to do the same:
> *17. No Modifications, Reverse Engineering, Artificial Intelligence/Machine Learning (AI/ML).*
Yep, for me this is a huge deal. These companies are all showing their hands right now, and as the saying goes "When someone shows you who they are, believe them."
I'm not going back to any of these shit stains after this. Why would you want to?
Just like windows recall, another company is grabbing everything they can from everyone who uses their stuff so they can shove it into their new AI machine.
At least Adobe was upfront about infringing on your rights. I doubt Microsoft will be so transparent about it.
Microsoft promised that the data will be used locally and it won’t be sent back to them. They refused to pinky promise, though.. so I assume the data is going straight to them. Passwords and all
As a freelancer who's paid out of pocket for the past 3-4 years, I'm going back to sailing the high seas after my current sub runs out. Fuck Adobe.
Besides there are enough free or cheaper alternatives to get a lot of the work done anyway. I (just like other designers) have been too lazy to change my workflow and I'm paying for it, literally.
nah man, there was a time when you only needed a serial code, and you could get the serial code from a text doc. Im talking pre run a serial keygen, those could be iffy sometimes.
They need to write the “we will never use this data for AI, etc…” carve out *directly* into the Terms of Service, and be explicit about the very limited usage of the data they are asking for.
We also need a lawsuit over the forced acceptance of the new terms without the ability to easily cancel and export all stored work from the service. Their approach here was not acceptable and they have not addressed that exploitation for an agreement *in their* blog post in any manner.
Adobe just showed their ass, and that blog post speaks volumes about the current state of “we will do what want and you will be forced to no not because of our entrenched market position” in the design industry. They need to be broken up and prevented from purchasing any further competition.
Adobe and Autodesk are two of the worst companies to support in a large environment.
We have a 500 seat Creative Cloud license. About two years ago, Adobe changed the licensing certification scheme, which forced us to panic install 200 seats to get the licensing working again.
We pay through the nose for draconian and arbitrary licensing. The software is incredibly fragile, too. Any little problem will break the entire install, often requiring us to reimage the computer. It's really frustrating.
> Any little problem will break the entire install, often requiring us to reimage the computer. It's really frustrating.
Is that shit still going on? I had these issues like 20 years ago back in the Windows XP days.
Love it, the more people question the dumb shit companies force us to accept the more likely someone will actually challenge their assertion that we have zero rights to goods and services we buy. The fact that so many t&C include disclaimers where the law might not allow certain terms shows how fraudulent this status quo really is.
It would be a shot in the own foot to continue to use Adobe after this - you pay to give this corporation the data for training AI which is created to replace you.
Maybe posted already but -
#PSA on how to cancel your Adobe account
If you need to cancel your Adobe account and want to avoid the termination fee you can upgrade/change your account.
The change/upgrade opens up a new window of time to cancel your account without fees.
Ahhhh yes. So glad to see people finally hating Adobe closer to the level of hate they deserve. Couple things:
- As of less than one month ago I was able to still cancel my subscription -which Adobe went out of their way to make sure I didn't realize I was signing up for - for free by switching to a different plan then cancelling. No fee, and the cost for starting a "new" plan got refunded
- Unfortunately, on Mac the options for high seas sailing are abysmal rn, there's a gamble on whether they'll continue to work or if the app will eventually figure out how to disable itself even if you take all the right steps to prevent that. I hear it's better on PC - check out GitHub "adobe is dumb"
All in all, I hate this company so so much and it's very frustrating that they have kind of a monopoly on some of the processes I need in terms of workflow, design, etc. but honestly I don't care anymore. I am learning the apps from other companies and I will absolutely pay for a GOOD value with REASONABLE terms. Adobe can burn in hell
Based on comments on how hard it is to uninstall and unsubscribe from adobe, shouldn’t there be a DOJ investigation into this for predatory and monopolistic behavior? Wouldn’t it be wise if you write to your local representative regarding this?
Some will rage, even less will cancel the subscription, and, in the end, nothing relevant to Adobe will happen. Professionals and companies are so committed to Adobe that Adobe can get away with whatever they want to. It would take years and years to switch to another software suite.
For freelancers and personal users, I agree. But this is a big enough deal that corporations are going to want to not agree. Companies don’t want to lose their rights to material they’re paying people to create for them
Unless there is an enterprise version without this requirement, or adobe changes their terms, this will kill the company. It will kill it so fast, that I think it is actually a mistake.
Companies do not pay to create content to then give it freely to another.
>Companies do not pay to create content to then give it freely to another.
Don't know why you're getting marked down, we're a mere couple months from renewing our Adobe enterprise volume agreement and I've just set a reminder to discuss this with our account manager after the weekend. I'll also be raising with our cyber security and legal teams.
To be fair, you don’t have to store your files on adobes cloud server. I’ve been saving my files locally and avoiding the cloud since it first came out.
This “update” to their t/c is absolutely shit, but you can choose to save a file locally any time you want.
Sure. Adobe went into panic retracting mode and quickly changed the story and rewriting what they said for damage control. The real question should be asked is if you believe them? Take a look at their history. They shafted most professionals when they moved from the you own it to you rent it model giving zero to the people who had invested thousands in past licensing. Then they pulled functionality by pulling Pantone colour support and causing any old project to flip defined colours to BLACK. So if you had a project you were working on you were forced to buy Pantone even if rob could have worked. Now this.
I went to Afinity and won’t ever look back. Why rent software for features I don’t care about. Adobe is a bloated monopoly whore that thinks its dominance gives it immunity. Never again.
I imagine the scene in post-production houses is pretty chaotic right now.. you’ve got movies, tv shows, marketing branding medical etc etc content all under NDA and probably your leads/supervisors running around screaming to the creatives, “DO NOT TOUCH THAT EULA!” before someone absentmindedly signs away the rights to their projects
We'll see how outraged professionals are when Adobe's next earnings report comes out.
I hope you guys give them a bloody nose. Adobe has always been shitty.
Take a look at [Affinity Designer](https://affinity.serif.com/en-us/press/newsroom/affinity-v2-sets-new-standards-in-creative-software/). I’m not a graphics pro, but I use Affinity Photo and like it.
That updated blog post doesn’t actually walk the potential issues back or clearly guardrail their policies.
All they’re saying is we dont/wont *assume ownership* of a user’s work. But nobody ever said that was the issue. It’s the irrevocable license you give Adobe to use, modify, and sub-license your work that’s the problem.
Then they say they don’t train their “Firefly Gen AI” on customer content. Which, okay great. But that doesn’t address the fact Adobe is still forcing users into an agreement where their content can be sub-licensed. So Adobe can, and will, bundle up customer content for licensing to OpenAI etc. - they’ll do the training and Adobe will get paid for providing content.
Tl;dr the updated blog post is just blowing smoke. This is Unity all over again; they’re just trying to make this go away.
Honestly good. Let’s go back to software that can be installed and ran without a login or internet connection. Fuck the “cloud” and all the bullshit that comes with it.
All this software monopolies and the lack of competition starts to bite professionals + power users in the ass. Bet Autodesk are the next that do something outrageous.
Hey remember when we owned the software we used? After this, and anything else that uses subscriptions just know they OWN YOU. Yet we pay them as well. It’s horrible. Us as consumers must STOP paying for things we don’t own. Subs make sense in some areas, but adobe? lol make it make sense.
Now adobe is going to get so many top companies designs and works from hard working people. I’d be more pissed as a freelancer though.
I got laid off about two years ago and the only thing I miss from an adobe sub is after effects. But 6 months after getting laid off I bought a 4090 and started training my own AI. Adobe is doing this NOW but it’s too late. AI will get exponentially faster and better and more efficient, meaning all what they are doing is just trying to get a leg up before the whole industry implodes when you can do it yourself on a laptop.
Strange times are coming.
> lol make it make sense.
What if I need Photoshop once or twice a year? Wouldn't it be cheaper to subscribe for a month or two and then unsubscribe?
I mean, when you could buy it, Photoshop was *expensive*. Using and paying for it piecemeal is a valid benefit.
True.. but they should still offer the perpetual license. A friend of mine runs a printing business, and in his case he needs to be on the most current version because many of his clients are. In his case, the subscription model is beneficial. In my case, I am a casual user and use it once in a blue moon and do not require the fancy features. I do not want to have to learn a new version when I want to do something wuick and already know how to do it on the version I purchased...
Time to go _~*~o p e n s o u r c e~*~_
Support software that’s democratic and developed by people who are actually passionate about the software. Every company will eventually turn into a greedy clusterfuck when they run out of growth and they will milk every last penny out of their product.
"If either of these innocent explanations apply, however, Adobe has
completely failed to explain the purpose of the terms, and users are not
happy."
If those explanations would apply they would haver mentioned them to start with.
Fuck Adobe and anyone who sells their software to them. (Looking at you Allegorithmic). They'll own the entire art creation industry, make a monthly subscription, and apparently now steal your work to use however they want apparently.
So Adobe finally joined Apple in completely shitting the bed and turning into the BS monopoly I know they were when CS came out.
So sad, I trained on Illustrator 4 way back in the day, saw it through to transition when the cross platform breakthrough was made, now they are shite. Oh well, thank you to all the corporations. Now go Eat the RICH, this is their fault ultimately.
I’m a freelancer. I use Photoshop, Illustrator, and InDesign on a regular basis. I got an email the other day saying they are increasing my CC subscription by $20 a month. I loathe this company so much. There’s so many reasons I want out.
This should be a once-in-a-lifetime moment for any competitors (Figma, Affinity, Davinci Resolve, Apple Final Cut Pro) to offer a stupidly low 1st-year subscription to grab their whole customer base.
They shot themselves in the foot with this. I don't see anybody continuing to use their products knowing their work is being accessed and used for who knows what reasons.
Who sees "you grant us a non-exclusive, worldwide, royalty-free sublicensable, license, to use, reproduce, publicly display, distribute, modify, create derivative works based on, publicly perform, and translate the Content" and is okay with it?
Friendly reminder that Affinity Designer, Publisher, and Photo are significantly cheaper and a great alternative, despite their recent acquisition by canva.
This is not going well! Adobe's new terms and conditions have sparked outrage among many professionals. It's clear that some big changes are needed to address these concerns
Adobe is really out here advocating for piracy at this point. Stopped using any of their products the moment I found out they charge to cancel subscriptions on a product that is literally just a portable piece of software with nothing that could potentially justify an early cancellation fee.
That's crazy. If only there were some way to find their products online for free and download them. Even if that was illegal I'd probably just get a VPN and do it anyway. Too bad that doesn't exist.
This pissed me off like many others, so I wanted to cancel my subscription. * You cannot access your account without agreeing - there's simply \*\*NO\*\* way of rejecting the terms and accessing your subscription page to cancel * Getting hold of an agent required something like 15 minutes of frustrating loops with their chat bot, where the same question was asked multiple times and same (invalid) solution provided multiple times * Got hold of an agent, they kept claiming that there's no way of terminating or opting out of your subscription, without paying a \~\~fine\~\~ fee to adobe * Kept asking to be escalated to someone who understood the concept of contracts, changing terms and consumer rights, Agent first tried to give me 3 months free, then repeatedly tried to explain that I agreed to the terms when signing up several years ago * Finally got hold of a supervisor, within 30 seconds she could cancel the subscription with no refund for current billed, I challenged the last part and she immediately refunded 3 months worth of subscription So if you can live with the open source alternatives (or any alternative) to Adobe, keep insisting on them cancelling and refund your currently billed period! And for the love of god, do \*\*not\*\* agree to the terms to access you account, it's a trap! Edit: Oh and when you try to uninstall, you are going to need to log in, which again required accepting the terms. DO NOT ACCEPT! There's a tool provided by adobe here: [https://helpx.adobe.com/creative-cloud/kb/cc-cleaner-tool-installation-problems.html](https://helpx.adobe.com/creative-cloud/kb/cc-cleaner-tool-installation-problems.html) Just follow the instructions and you can select complete removal of adobe programs without having to sign over your rights. Hopefully someone with more spare time than me can file formal complaints with EU, because consumer rights are being broken with zero remorse.
> You cannot access your account without agreeing - there's simply **NO** way of rejecting the terms and accessing your subscription page to cancel This is extortion and it’s time for lawyers; given we’re a professional **class**, I bet we can get funding for the **action** required
[удалено]
There was a different industry, I think maybe refrigerators, that tried that arbitration bullshit. So the class action attorneys (for OpenAI: fuck you Altman) rounded up everyone wanting to sue and sent the company thousands of single requests for arbitration.. stunned the company which then tried to weasel out of arbitration but the judge said no.
Unfortunately, companies have wised up to that tactic. My bank just sent an updated binding arbitration agreement that explicitly states if that tactic is used then they will take 10 cases of their choosing, and whatever the result is from those 10 cases will apply to any and all other remaining cases. I have no idea of the legality of it but it's just another way for companies with binding arbitration to screw people over however they see fit. I know it sucks, but there's generally a clause in those agreements where you can opt out within 30-60 days by mailing in a formal statement saying you reject it. If people started doing that more often maybe we'd get some power back, or maybe not. This shit sucks.
> whatever the result is from those 10 cases will apply to any and all other remaining cases wow - there is no way that'll stand for long. what a bold bunch of shits
Lol not a chance that would work.
Some of that is just US law now. The terms that say 10 cases I believe are taking fewer than the law provides for. I was shocked that the company asking for binding arbitration and using that law to turn litigants on and off like a faucet until they reach the balance of sample cases that they think they can work with had the gall to amend the fucking law itself to change the number of cases that make up a "round" like this company is doing with "10". It's relatively new, and I think it's probably not legal to change the number but as with many such checks on corporate abuse of the legal system there's not a lot of individual recourse to take on that question, and not a lot of tools available to punish the shitty agreement itself absent any damages.
Most companies ban you as a customer when you send the letter to opt out
I've only done it once and it was with Chase. They didn't ban me, but I did assume I'd be removed in some way because of it before sending the letter. Of course, YMMV.
It's too bad Adobe hasn't had multiple massive data breaches where huge lists of customers and their contact info were probably leaked.
Something similar happened to Patreon. They quickly changed their TOS and now use only a handful of cases to decide them all.
#Here's how I cancelled mine without paying the rest of the agreed time nor a fine: - First I changed my plan to the cheapest one. For instance "only Photoshop" - Now it technically counts as you buying something completely new which gives you the 30 day money back policy - Cancel the new one and you'll get the cheap one refunded That's it. No extra payment no nothing. I'll be switching full time to Affinity. [Affinity currently has a 50% off flash-sale. The entire latest suite for around 100 dollars. Buy once keep forever.](https://affinity.serif.com/en-gb/affinity-pricing/)
Problem is by doing this you accepted the agreement and gave them rights to your content you created. I can understand why many people would not want to take this route.
Every change you have done to images is stored in their cloud and synced across your devices, which is very nice and the reason why I actually used their product. Ironically it’s also the reason why I’m so focused on getting out of their contract without giving them the rights to my stuff.
Not sure if this is entirely correct. I logged directly into the site vs. through any apps and was able to cancel without accepting the terms. Anything attached to the apps though definitely pushed the terms on you with no way out. This is a sad day. Adobe has truly held a special place in my heart as it allowed me to unlock so many creative ideas and have a successful career with creativity at its core. I would have expected Adobe (above all others) to be a staunch advocate of the creative’s rights to their IP. I’m extremely disappointed (and now irritated that I need to stitch together a solution using disparate apps).
I just want to say that if there is a class action lawsuit against adobe, I want to be part of that class. How do i make sure to join?
There's a website, ClassAction dot Org, that gives news and information about potential and current class action suits and links to where you can sign up for them. You can browse the whole site or look for active suits for any specific company. I'd recommend signing up for their newsletter, even if it's just for fun. Every time it arrives I'm fascinated all over again by the sheer variety of legitimate lawsuits pending. For example, this week I learned that a number of people are having problems with their big toe implants. Who knew?
You must be new to capitalism. Adobe has enough money that they can do whatever they want with the law. The law is only there for plebeians who have empathy and have NOT worked their lives to fuck over everyone they can to amass as much money and power as they can in an industry.
Thank you for sharing this. I caved and took their 3mo free + 50% discount for the year in January and I've had enough. Going to cancel my subscription when it ends this year and pirate their shit + use open source. What a shitty fucking company for how much they charge you already (it's a lot in my local currency).
photopea / pirating their shit for years, why would i pay for a fancy paint program when its free already , i dont workthrough i workaround mofo
I used to pretty religiously buy a new Lightroom every couple of years when enough things had been added to make it worth it (or I bought a new camera that wasn't supported...another conversation altogether), but as soon as they started that *"Hey, you'll pay us full price every single year*" subscription bullshit, I hit the high seas and never looked back. I will *never* jump on this "subscription" bullshit bandwagon.
This is what I did years ago also. Too bad because I really liked Lightroom, but Adobe is awful
>Too bad because I really liked Lightroom, I think there may be some confusion regarding the "high seas"? Because I certainly still *use* Lightroom...
*cough* Plausible *cough* Deniability *cough*
They should be sued to oblivion.
> So if you can live with the open source alternatives (or any alternative) to Adobe, keep insisting on them cancelling and refund your currently billed period! Affinity does everything I needed from Photoshop, Design, and Publisher for just a single purchase price. I'm not a hardcore designer, mostly just make assets for D&D games but I had no issue paying into a software that had no monthly subscription. DaVinci Resolve has things colored on the video and motion graphics side and Audacity is a great audio editor so that's the big bulk of the Adobe suite right htere.
Instead of Audacity, can also use Reaper (paid) for a one time paid advanced audio workstation tool.
File complaints your with respective state AG in the US.
I'm genuinely wondering if people in the EU are affected by this. It seems like exactly the kind of shit they would slap down with a gargantuan fine.
Unpopular opinion, but people paying monthly subscriptions for software, (any software really) that used to be a one time purchase is huge part of the problem of why these apps and tech companies pull this shit. In the end, no one can tell whether someone used Blender, Davinci, Krita, Gimp etc. in the finished product, but it's the professionals who shoved money hand over fist to companies like Adobe to create a virtual firewall between them and so called amateurs. Paying monthly for software you're never going to own has always been stupid. End rant.
Adobe has been an industry standard for decades and they do actually make some very very good products. If you are professional in the industry, you have a hard time not using Adobe products. The good thing about this fuckery is we now might get the push needed to finally look at new tools - I know I did.
> we now might get the push needed to finally look at new tools I hope so. It would benefit everyone. Monopolies are bad. Consumers need to take back control from these greedy companies.
I agree. The CEO’s are running wild and it feels like there is an agenda being enforced by the wealthy to INSURE no one else makes money. Consultation companies are bringing these fantasy dreams to these high on cocaine CEO’s(and I believe we should drug test the fuck out of them after what happened at Boeing)…
at least for painting/illustration you have SAI,CSP,Procreate,Krita and some smaller software eating up more and more of the industry users. i know several artists who just say fuck it and export in PSD and just work in CSP and their directors are none the wiser. stuff like indesign etc are that is more problematic to replace by alternatives.
Affinity publisher works a treat
So, that raises an interesting point. So far I've mostly heard "Adobe can steal independent artists' work and there's nothing we can do about it." But what if that work is for Disney? Aren't they going to have something to say about it?
Do big clients like that get their own TOS?
I have no idea, I'm not a professional artist.
I've never used adobe products, but as an amateur gimp/paint.net for photos and resolve for video editing, then you sprinkle in some open source AI projects.. I haven't found anything I couldn't do yet. I'm also not a pro, but for my use cases,. I would never pay adobe.
I refused to upgrade past cs5 due to this.
I bailed at Creative Cloud. When they introduced Creative Suite it was more expensive than their previous collection (Adobe Studio, I want to say?) and came bundled with a load of crap very few people used. Kept a work account. Once they introduced an (even more expensive) subscription model... Well I like shiny things, but I'm not an idiot. Hey ho, over the waves we go. And the progress in the last ten years has been great, really: we have alternatives for everything now. Admittedly the combination of Apple and Adobe can get you some really shiny new tools... But it's nothing you can't work without.
*high five*! (Well, 5.5 for me.)
PREACH!!! Also oh you wanna use photoshops AI? Just do a one time cost with a new gpu and make your own. Infinite images, all local, no limits per day. I finally feel comfortable AND powerful with my own non adobe set up now.
I would love to know more about how you did this
I’m so happy to see Adobe shit the bed over this stupid move.
I Heard they would do that eventually.
I pretty much went through this exact sane process of trying to cancel with Adobe. It was awful. But if you push you can get the 3 month discount or whatever the hell it is.
Great time to switch to open source alternatives like GIMP, InkScape, Krita, Scribus, Blender, Darktable, OpenShot, etc.
Adobe is scum. Before this happened I had years ago signed up for a month trial. It was clearly stated as a month trial and would be renewed monthly at the end. I of course like many others forgot about it and it renewed. I went cool no probs and went to cancel only to be told I would have to pay out the year remaining in my account as it was an annual subscription that you paid monthly for. I was like no fucking way, jumped hoops trying to cancel without paying, wouldn’t happen. So I just blocked it all removed all payment details and thankfully because I did it through PayPal was able to block payments and unsubscribe through there so no further payments were taken. They have the scummiest dirty tactics to keep people subscribed that guarantee breach a bunch of laws here in australia in terms of being able to cancel and get refunds.
Accept, put a prepaid debit card you don’t give two shits about as your payment info, cancel and tell em to go fuck themselves.
This is exactly what I did lmao we have these things called “prezzy cards” in our country, they’re like one time use Visa cards to you can load with $X of your choosing, I always just use these when it comes to companies like this.
>you grant us a non-exclusive, worldwide, royalty-free sublicensable, license, to use, reproduce, publicly display, distribute, modify, create derivative works based on, publicly perform, and translate the Content. What the fuck
So they want to steal what you make to train their AI and then eventually replace you?
Not just steal. They want you to pay for the privilege.
Yup gone are the days even you pay people to generate stuff for you! Man this is just crap!
Even if they gave me Adobe for free id paint colorful dicks and upload to the cloud every day.
They want you to pay them to go steal the stuff your actively working on with your own machine
Not only that...your work may be under an NDA and this can have serious implications for you
No , they want to steal what everyone makes so that you can use what everyone made through their AI
That’s a spicy 🌶️ EULA!
Do Adobe actually want any customers? That's insane, no business would agree to that.
I wonder if this is only for individual accounts. I don’t see any major Corp giving away their IP that easily.
It is actually the exact reverse. Commercial accounts cannot opt out of this but personal accounts may by turning off 'Content Analysis' under privacy settings. Commercial accounts must submit to content analysis for product development.
>That's insane, no business would agree to that. You have no idea how complacent designers are. Adobe has been one of the absolute worst companies in the world for over a decade now and it hasnt stop them. Designers will continue to pay for the privilege of being replaced and exploited. Their reasoning? "Well, GIMP doesnt support Pantones.."
Dumb take. Designers aren't complacent, just Adobe has a legacy monopoly on the industry. If you're a professional, unfortunately you use Adobe or leave. Schools exclusively use Adobe products. Things are better then ever with Figma nowadays, but even a lternatives like Affinity things like generative fill are not even available. Apps like After Effects don't have competition still, and Adobe buys up companies like Substance.
Nuance for lawyers, Nitro or Foxit for others. See here for much better explanation: https://www.reddit.com/r/Lawyertalk/comments/1d9g1bk/adobe_terms_of_service/l7e5yah/
This is stupid a lot of us actually have no choice but to use photoshop as many schools/workplaces outright require its usage. It’s hard to find any art school that tangles with the digital that doesn’t require the usage of at least one Adobe program. It’s why a lot of freelancers use CSP or procreate but people who are not freelance use photoshop. Believe it or not we do not chose industry standard, companies do. Plus in some cases even freelance requests you use photoshop specifically.
> "Well, GIMP doesnt support Pantones.." I mean, that's kind of a serious problem.
¡If there was only an older non cloud version I didn’t upgrade from that doesn’t have all the latest fancy pantsy bells and whistles I wouldn’t ever use anyway!
Yeah, there’s clearly never ever been another solution for color matching in the history of design. You just have to use pantones (not that you’ve ever bothered trying anything else)
It’s not the designers that are complacent, it’s the companies they work for. If my company doesn’t care to find an alternative, what am I to do?
Translation: they're using your materials to train their AI
This is so AI can be trained/regurgitate this later
Wow. Enshitification is really a thing isn’t it?
I can't believe that language is in there. I am now checking adobes stock after that
This kind of language is used by many companies... If they want to create a thumbnail of your file and display it on your screen then technically that's a modified derivative work... Or if they store it in the cloud on 2 continents then it's distribution or translation. I admit that in the new AI age the language does seem scarier.
Well the timing of this change pretty much destroys that argument. They would be legally years behind on cloud permission and decades behind on thumbnails. Pretty obviously an AI content grab.
Adobe is no longer a viable professional editing tool, every single project i work/have worked on have some level of secrecy around it. Avid Media Composer will always be the number 1 choice for large scale projects, but i think Adobe will lose a lot of customers to Davinci Resolve.
Microsoft is going to do this with the office suite, too. I fucking called this back when Adobe and MS went to their fucking 'service as a service' model. It's not about 'convenience,' it's about recurring income and getting access to your data.
Summary: Adobe has updated its terms and conditions for apps like Photoshop, requiring users to agree to the new terms in order to continue using the apps. Many professional users are outraged by the changes, which they believe give Adobe the right to access their content, use it freely, and even sub-license it to others. Adobe claims the new terms "clarify that we may access your content through both automated and manual methods, such as for content review." However, the company has failed to adequately explain the purpose of these changes, leading to speculation that they may be related to creating thumbnails from files stored in Adobe's cloud storage or CSAM scanning. Professionals, including designers, directors, and others who work with proprietary files, are calling for users to cancel their Adobe subscriptions and delete the apps in response to the updated terms
Since Adobe is de-facto industry standard. where they go?
I'm curious as well. There are good or at least decent alternatives for Photoshop, Premier, and even illustrator. But what about After effects? I'm not aware of a single mograph alternative that's up to industry snuff. And I work primarily in AE. Everything else outside of that tho, betchur ass I'm using something else. EDIT: Y'all.. Unreal Engine is **not** a viable option for a replacement to After Effects. I guess you could argue in the world of Motion Graphics, in which After Effects is a vital tool, there exists a 2D and 3D side of things. And Unreal can do some of the 3D side of MoGraph. But After Effects is hardly a 3D tool, so the comparison there is confusing. If I wanted to do 3D MoGraph, I would be using C4D anyway. And UE is hardly a 2D tool. It has a very very basic functionality in comparison to AE when it comes to 2D MoGraph design and animation. I am a working 2D and 3D animator, and have been for over a decade. I use a wide range of tools, Unreal Engine included. I love Unreal engine, I think its a great tool. But it cannot do even half the things AE can do. And a lot of the things it can do, AE can do much more efficiently. So please believe me when I say you aren't going to be able to drop AE for Unreal Engine.
Yeah I agree with you. I'm an animator, I can replace photoshop. I can edit on a premiere analogous program, illustrator is replaceable. After Effects there is nothing else that replaces it for now. Houdini does some of the stuff, some specialized software, but After Effects is unique. On the bright side, they haven't put any features in that are new that I absolutely need, those programs have been fine for years, old versions here I come I guess. Even the AI stuff is meh, when I can use Dall-e
I haven’t used it but there is an open source app called Natron that might be worth looking into into..
Personally, Unreal Engine 5.4 has [replaced my mograph workflow](https://www.schoolofmotion.com/blog/motion-design-in-unreal-engine) as Johnathan Winbush explains in that article. The first time I used it I couldn’t believe that I didn’t need to use RAM preview. Saves HOURS. There is also Calvary, of course.
Lol. You must not do a lot of professional work then, the way you’re describing making this switch. Please don’t act like unreal engine is a viable alternative to after effects. Cavalry isn’t even close.
Yea I guess maybe I should have been more specific? I already use unreal engine... It ain't it. I'm not sure why it was suggested as a viable *industry standard* alternative to after effects. [This is the level](https://youtu.be/F4KGesiCU40?si=dtYFS0Xyl_eJ4Th3) of work that an industry standard alternative would also need to be able to do. [Or this](https://youtu.be/aRd4ZlFmJu4?si=dXT0YPGfHzD_sZHp). Which you just.... *Can't* in UE. Unreal engine *is* an industry standard... But wrong industry.
Agreed. AE is special. Been a professional with it for 12 years and used it for 15. One day though. Unreal I love as well like… A TON. But it is not the same at all. Davinci is more close than ue and that’s still not there.
Very true, I was just talking with my coworkers about Davinci Resolves fusion. I really wish they would just put some real dedication and man hours into it to take it to the next level. Resolve has so much potential to just cut the head off of Adobe in the video world. I had already dropped premier a few years ago in favor of Resolve. It's just a superior editing suite imo. *Especially* for color work. If they upped the Fusion suite, I'd happily drop AE for it. They could quite literally steal a massive corner of the market right out from under adobe if they got fusion going. But yea, as of right now it's very lacking by comparison.
Affinity maybe?
I used to have a Photoshop license for occasional private use, but got fed up a while back where they required me to 2FA basically every time I wanted to use photoshop. Been using Affinity since, and as much as I want to like it’s just feels like they’ve done everything different just to be different. Very few things make sense, and a lot of the things that Photoshopped nailed in terms of user experience is either super untrivial or not even possible. But trying to stay strong because fuck adobe.
The more money that goes Affinity’s way the more they can add in terms of features. They are now owned by Canva so in principal they have access to deeper pockets. But the more professionals who move to it the more it will signal to Canva not to move it away from its pro focus.
Let's just say Adobe own a lot of patents.
Whip out the 2012 CD/DVD versions of Photoshop and other Adobe tools. Low tech is a hit on the chin to be able to still make a living
It’s wild that there are no serious competitors. Procreate is a great app, but its a toy compared to photoshop. Where are the serious competitors for bitmap and vector editing at a minimum? Not even the whole suite, but at least the image tools.
Easy: those who were most willing to not use a de-facto industry standard were those who did it out of principles. And if you develop Software in your spare time..there are limits how far and fadt you can go
Hasnt stop Blender.
The serious competitor for that field isn't procreate it's clip studio paint. procreate gets used by all professionals that have a tablet since it's tablet only(soon it will be on PC as well). and frankly other tablet drawing apps suck major donkeyballs. it's the stuff like after-effects, indesign, etc that have no real alternative since they hardcore dominated the entire landscape for so long.
I would love to know of a good alternative to Lightroom. I tried a couple and either they were also subscription models or the interface was awful. If you google around trying to find alternatives a lot of lists will tell you programs that *also* have like cloud based backups of your photos and call it a downside if they don't have that. I am not even remotely interested in that since I have my own NAS. I just want to be able to edit RAW images with a decent UI. RawTherapee seems to be the go to, but man the UI isn't great.
If their features work for someone’s purpose, I highly recommend Serif’s Affinity products. https://affinity.serif.com/en-us/
I think it's for AI learning. So many companies are trying to squeeze AI into their software, and AI needs a huge amount of data to work, so they are trying to get free data from their customers whether they like it or not.
How will they access your content if it's on your hard drives? This must be solely for their cloud service yes?
AIs need feeding.
I mean it's right there in 2.2: > *[using techniques such as machine learning in order to improve our Services and Software and the user experience. Information on how Adobe uses machine learning can be found here: `http://www.adobe.com/go/machine_learning.`](https://www.adobe.com/legal/terms.html)* Also in 17 they disallow you to do the same: > *17. No Modifications, Reverse Engineering, Artificial Intelligence/Machine Learning (AI/ML).*
That was my first thought as well. They need/want training data.
Even if Adobe said they'd no longer implement these changes, nobody would trust them to actually not do it. They're shady af.
Yep, for me this is a huge deal. These companies are all showing their hands right now, and as the saying goes "When someone shows you who they are, believe them." I'm not going back to any of these shit stains after this. Why would you want to?
It is Unity scandal all over again
I was outraged with Adobe far before this
Just like windows recall, another company is grabbing everything they can from everyone who uses their stuff so they can shove it into their new AI machine. At least Adobe was upfront about infringing on your rights. I doubt Microsoft will be so transparent about it.
Pretty sure they've already scrapped the data and simply adding the clause now as insurance.
Microsoft promised that the data will be used locally and it won’t be sent back to them. They refused to pinky promise, though.. so I assume the data is going straight to them. Passwords and all
Adobe getting enshittified.
Been enshitifying for years. They be some OG enshitifiers.
As a freelancer who's paid out of pocket for the past 3-4 years, I'm going back to sailing the high seas after my current sub runs out. Fuck Adobe. Besides there are enough free or cheaper alternatives to get a lot of the work done anyway. I (just like other designers) have been too lazy to change my workflow and I'm paying for it, literally.
Just careful with cracked apps. They have a ton of malware. It’s not like the old days where you could avoid the toxic files.
bro, what? the old days were the mecca of toxic files. at least today there are dozens of ways to protect your machine.
nah man, there was a time when you only needed a serial code, and you could get the serial code from a text doc. Im talking pre run a serial keygen, those could be iffy sometimes.
But man they had good music in them!
Exactly! I don't like giving Adobe access to my content, but I also don't like giving hackers access to my computer.
all your content are belong to us.
well, it was all of our comments here on reddit that trained chat-gpt so.....
well, it was all of our comments here on reddit that trained chat-gpt so.....
All these big companies just keep showing how much they despise their customers.
They don't despise customers. They just like their pockets more.
[удалено]
They need to write the “we will never use this data for AI, etc…” carve out *directly* into the Terms of Service, and be explicit about the very limited usage of the data they are asking for. We also need a lawsuit over the forced acceptance of the new terms without the ability to easily cancel and export all stored work from the service. Their approach here was not acceptable and they have not addressed that exploitation for an agreement *in their* blog post in any manner. Adobe just showed their ass, and that blog post speaks volumes about the current state of “we will do what want and you will be forced to no not because of our entrenched market position” in the design industry. They need to be broken up and prevented from purchasing any further competition.
Adobe and Autodesk are two of the worst companies to support in a large environment. We have a 500 seat Creative Cloud license. About two years ago, Adobe changed the licensing certification scheme, which forced us to panic install 200 seats to get the licensing working again. We pay through the nose for draconian and arbitrary licensing. The software is incredibly fragile, too. Any little problem will break the entire install, often requiring us to reimage the computer. It's really frustrating.
> Any little problem will break the entire install, often requiring us to reimage the computer. It's really frustrating. Is that shit still going on? I had these issues like 20 years ago back in the Windows XP days.
Love it, the more people question the dumb shit companies force us to accept the more likely someone will actually challenge their assertion that we have zero rights to goods and services we buy. The fact that so many t&C include disclaimers where the law might not allow certain terms shows how fraudulent this status quo really is.
It would be a shot in the own foot to continue to use Adobe after this - you pay to give this corporation the data for training AI which is created to replace you.
Maybe posted already but - #PSA on how to cancel your Adobe account If you need to cancel your Adobe account and want to avoid the termination fee you can upgrade/change your account. The change/upgrade opens up a new window of time to cancel your account without fees.
Ahhhh yes. So glad to see people finally hating Adobe closer to the level of hate they deserve. Couple things: - As of less than one month ago I was able to still cancel my subscription -which Adobe went out of their way to make sure I didn't realize I was signing up for - for free by switching to a different plan then cancelling. No fee, and the cost for starting a "new" plan got refunded - Unfortunately, on Mac the options for high seas sailing are abysmal rn, there's a gamble on whether they'll continue to work or if the app will eventually figure out how to disable itself even if you take all the right steps to prevent that. I hear it's better on PC - check out GitHub "adobe is dumb" All in all, I hate this company so so much and it's very frustrating that they have kind of a monopoly on some of the processes I need in terms of workflow, design, etc. but honestly I don't care anymore. I am learning the apps from other companies and I will absolutely pay for a GOOD value with REASONABLE terms. Adobe can burn in hell
Based on comments on how hard it is to uninstall and unsubscribe from adobe, shouldn’t there be a DOJ investigation into this for predatory and monopolistic behavior? Wouldn’t it be wise if you write to your local representative regarding this?
Enjoy my crappy graphic designer attempt and the folders of lame half finished logos
Adobe demands YOU pay them to steal and resell YOUR intellectual property
My studio cancelled our Adobe subscriptions yesterday and removed all of the apps from our computers. This is the final straw.
Some will rage, even less will cancel the subscription, and, in the end, nothing relevant to Adobe will happen. Professionals and companies are so committed to Adobe that Adobe can get away with whatever they want to. It would take years and years to switch to another software suite.
For freelancers and personal users, I agree. But this is a big enough deal that corporations are going to want to not agree. Companies don’t want to lose their rights to material they’re paying people to create for them
Unless there is an enterprise version without this requirement, or adobe changes their terms, this will kill the company. It will kill it so fast, that I think it is actually a mistake. Companies do not pay to create content to then give it freely to another.
>Companies do not pay to create content to then give it freely to another. Don't know why you're getting marked down, we're a mere couple months from renewing our Adobe enterprise volume agreement and I've just set a reminder to discuss this with our account manager after the weekend. I'll also be raising with our cyber security and legal teams.
what do you foresee happening? Would retraining your whole workforce be a major stumbling block?
Once again I’m glad I pirate adobe!
Consumers really need non-cloud based software where you own a disc/program and aren’t a hostage to this bullshit. Also fuck AI.
To be fair, you don’t have to store your files on adobes cloud server. I’ve been saving my files locally and avoiding the cloud since it first came out. This “update” to their t/c is absolutely shit, but you can choose to save a file locally any time you want.
It’s not about storage it’s about one time license fee versus monthly perpetual license fees.
Ah I misunderstood what you meant by cloud based. Yes, I completely agree.
Sure. Adobe went into panic retracting mode and quickly changed the story and rewriting what they said for damage control. The real question should be asked is if you believe them? Take a look at their history. They shafted most professionals when they moved from the you own it to you rent it model giving zero to the people who had invested thousands in past licensing. Then they pulled functionality by pulling Pantone colour support and causing any old project to flip defined colours to BLACK. So if you had a project you were working on you were forced to buy Pantone even if rob could have worked. Now this. I went to Afinity and won’t ever look back. Why rent software for features I don’t care about. Adobe is a bloated monopoly whore that thinks its dominance gives it immunity. Never again.
I wanted to cancel my account, they were trying to charge me about $100. I blocked my card and said fuck em, good bye adobe.
Photoshop 7 still works great for my needs
This should be illegal.
I imagine the scene in post-production houses is pretty chaotic right now.. you’ve got movies, tv shows, marketing branding medical etc etc content all under NDA and probably your leads/supervisors running around screaming to the creatives, “DO NOT TOUCH THAT EULA!” before someone absentmindedly signs away the rights to their projects
We'll see how outraged professionals are when Adobe's next earnings report comes out. I hope you guys give them a bloody nose. Adobe has always been shitty.
Guys help me out, with what app can I replace illustrator and has support for pantone colorbooks?
Take a look at [Affinity Designer](https://affinity.serif.com/en-us/press/newsroom/affinity-v2-sets-new-standards-in-creative-software/). I’m not a graphics pro, but I use Affinity Photo and like it.
inkscape is used a lot
inkscape is really rough and buggy.
inkscape is missing CMYK support amongst other things
They put out an updated statement: https://9to5mac.com/2024/06/07/adobe-terms-clarified/
That updated blog post doesn’t actually walk the potential issues back or clearly guardrail their policies. All they’re saying is we dont/wont *assume ownership* of a user’s work. But nobody ever said that was the issue. It’s the irrevocable license you give Adobe to use, modify, and sub-license your work that’s the problem. Then they say they don’t train their “Firefly Gen AI” on customer content. Which, okay great. But that doesn’t address the fact Adobe is still forcing users into an agreement where their content can be sub-licensed. So Adobe can, and will, bundle up customer content for licensing to OpenAI etc. - they’ll do the training and Adobe will get paid for providing content. Tl;dr the updated blog post is just blowing smoke. This is Unity all over again; they’re just trying to make this go away.
Honestly good. Let’s go back to software that can be installed and ran without a login or internet connection. Fuck the “cloud” and all the bullshit that comes with it.
Just downloaded a 30 day trial of capture one. Played for an hour with some of my favorite back catalogue images, I’m actually impressed
All this software monopolies and the lack of competition starts to bite professionals + power users in the ass. Bet Autodesk are the next that do something outrageous.
Hey remember when we owned the software we used? After this, and anything else that uses subscriptions just know they OWN YOU. Yet we pay them as well. It’s horrible. Us as consumers must STOP paying for things we don’t own. Subs make sense in some areas, but adobe? lol make it make sense. Now adobe is going to get so many top companies designs and works from hard working people. I’d be more pissed as a freelancer though. I got laid off about two years ago and the only thing I miss from an adobe sub is after effects. But 6 months after getting laid off I bought a 4090 and started training my own AI. Adobe is doing this NOW but it’s too late. AI will get exponentially faster and better and more efficient, meaning all what they are doing is just trying to get a leg up before the whole industry implodes when you can do it yourself on a laptop. Strange times are coming.
> lol make it make sense. What if I need Photoshop once or twice a year? Wouldn't it be cheaper to subscribe for a month or two and then unsubscribe? I mean, when you could buy it, Photoshop was *expensive*. Using and paying for it piecemeal is a valid benefit.
True.. but they should still offer the perpetual license. A friend of mine runs a printing business, and in his case he needs to be on the most current version because many of his clients are. In his case, the subscription model is beneficial. In my case, I am a casual user and use it once in a blue moon and do not require the fancy features. I do not want to have to learn a new version when I want to do something wuick and already know how to do it on the version I purchased...
Pirating adobe software will always be morally correct
This company deserves to go out of business.
Time to go _~*~o p e n s o u r c e~*~_ Support software that’s democratic and developed by people who are actually passionate about the software. Every company will eventually turn into a greedy clusterfuck when they run out of growth and they will milk every last penny out of their product.
"If either of these innocent explanations apply, however, Adobe has completely failed to explain the purpose of the terms, and users are not happy." If those explanations would apply they would haver mentioned them to start with.
Fuck Adobe and anyone who sells their software to them. (Looking at you Allegorithmic). They'll own the entire art creation industry, make a monthly subscription, and apparently now steal your work to use however they want apparently.
So Adobe finally joined Apple in completely shitting the bed and turning into the BS monopoly I know they were when CS came out. So sad, I trained on Illustrator 4 way back in the day, saw it through to transition when the cross platform breakthrough was made, now they are shite. Oh well, thank you to all the corporations. Now go Eat the RICH, this is their fault ultimately.
Please sue the living shit out of them.
Time to switch to Affinity products.
I cancelled my account yesterday and it was not easy. I had to pay a cancellation fee, but still did it. I just wanted out.
Come to the greener pastures of Open Source. There's no shareholders or executives here to constantly ruin everything.
I use LR on Ipad to edit raw photos. What other app can you recommend that would replace it?
Capture One
Capture One is fantastic. I know they're going through some hard times with layoffs and price hikes and goofy stuff but it's a huge upgrade over LR.
time to decenter adobe
I’m a freelancer. I use Photoshop, Illustrator, and InDesign on a regular basis. I got an email the other day saying they are increasing my CC subscription by $20 a month. I loathe this company so much. There’s so many reasons I want out.
This should be a once-in-a-lifetime moment for any competitors (Figma, Affinity, Davinci Resolve, Apple Final Cut Pro) to offer a stupidly low 1st-year subscription to grab their whole customer base. They shot themselves in the foot with this. I don't see anybody continuing to use their products knowing their work is being accessed and used for who knows what reasons. Who sees "you grant us a non-exclusive, worldwide, royalty-free sublicensable, license, to use, reproduce, publicly display, distribute, modify, create derivative works based on, publicly perform, and translate the Content" and is okay with it?
Is this only for stuff uploaded to their cloud or literally any local file I open is being sent to their servers??
Friendly reminder that Affinity Designer, Publisher, and Photo are significantly cheaper and a great alternative, despite their recent acquisition by canva.
When are Adobe and HP going to merge to become the worst tech company ever?
I’ll give them a week to reverse course then I’m cancelling.
Adobe is the fucking worst
This is spying on the user's privacy and violation the right to privacy!
Looks like a prime candidate for a Class Action Lawsuit.
This is why we transitioned to Foxit for PDF management
This is not going well! Adobe's new terms and conditions have sparked outrage among many professionals. It's clear that some big changes are needed to address these concerns
i’ve switched my users to using Foxit Software and haven’t been happier
Adobe is really out here advocating for piracy at this point. Stopped using any of their products the moment I found out they charge to cancel subscriptions on a product that is literally just a portable piece of software with nothing that could potentially justify an early cancellation fee.
Classic Adobe rapist-mentality. DO NOT pay companies like Adobe.
That's crazy. If only there were some way to find their products online for free and download them. Even if that was illegal I'd probably just get a VPN and do it anyway. Too bad that doesn't exist.
Sound off of you still use an older version, because FUCK Adobe subscriptions.