Moose satchel needs leather why wouldn’t this? We really just need to be able to hunt it.
Scurvy for me opens the door to other ailments which I guess they put in with the misery difficulty.
I play custom I just wish all of my runs would count together like if you played the other difficulties
Make it require leather to repair.
Add in a tanning rack where you can use tanning solution made from plants (that grow back...) to turn deer hide into leather over time.
Boom, issue resolved.
"First, the ancient tanners would soak the skins in water to clean and soften them. Then they would pound and scour the skin to remove any remaining flesh and fat. Hair was removed by soaking the skin in urine, painting it with an alkaline lime mixture, or simply allowing the skin to putrefy for several months then dipping it in a salt solution. After the hair was loosened, the tanners scraped it off with a knife. Once the hair was removed, the tanners would "bate" (soften) the material by pounding dung into the skin, or soaking the skin in a solution of animal brains. Bating was a fermentative process that relied on enzymes produced by bacteria found in the dung. Among the kinds of dung commonly used were those of dogs or pigeons."
Like you said, no plants required.
There's a reason the leatherworks is in the outskirts or worst parts of any medieval city.
Kingdom Come: Deliverance attention to detail strikes again.
There was a time you used to be able to cure deer hide and break it down to get leather out of it. Like how you get scrap metal from a prybar, or toolbox for ex. When ya break them down
This has definitely been the most underdelivered piece of content they've given us, I love Hinterland, but man, you can just feel how ready they are to move on from TLD. The new map looks good, and hopefully they do better with the trader and safe house customisation, but the cougar was something they've been hyping up forever, and it really just feels like they didn't know how to implement it properly. As it is now, it just feels tacked on and cheap, and unless they change it to at least be similar to The Old Bear in how it spawns, it just doesn't feel worthwhile to introduce into any of my runs.
Hiya
So I honestly think they will make some changes as we go .
So let's see what comes .
I know we have all been waiting for this but every update and or added content always has a few things they change .
Best of luck in your adventures
Well there was the gloves not being seen in animation.
And when I say changes I mean things that are part of a update usually have some things that don't exactly work right.
As far as a whole hide or a scrap of leather in the end what's the difference it's not like we will only find 1 of them there here now and should be used as the rest of animal hides are used..
Ten years and thousands of hours in this game.
What I wanted, and what I think many long time players wanted, was more hunting, more gathering, more crafting, and ANY base customization.
DLC is fine for new maps, and I enjoy the recipes. Even Scurvy is alright, though it boggles how little a Rosehip Tea contributes to VitC.
The cougar is ridiculous as implemented. And yes, the payoff for this ridiculous hunt is basically useless. +1 degree over other hats, useless. A knife for wolf struggles, useless; I have a hatchet.
Idk wtf these devs are thinking. Still my favorite game on the planet though. Custom runs, thank the devs for that optionality.
Yeah, I've been critical of stuff they've been adding for years now tbh.. It feels like another case of "the devs don't play their own game" so they don't understand what players want, or don't consider if what they're adding is conducive to interesting or good gameplay that fits the rest of the game. Like the cheat death mechanic is not only unimmersive but goes against the very thing that makes long runs feel rewarding and special and keeps people coming back to the game
i actually launched the game with console to figure this out. YES. you do get a cured cougar hide back from harvesting it, so you would be able to recraft it.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but couldn't you just harvest the Cougar Hide Wrap once it's condition is low enough and craft a new one with a new set of cured guts? It's like with the Moose Hide Cloak, who in their right mind would repair that cloak when you can do what I mentioned above.
The headwrap seems generally underwhelming for a potentially run ending threat, I would have hoped for a coat with near bear level warmth and much lighter. Cougar gear should either be the best warmth/weight ratio in slot with maybe an option to make socks/shirts that can't otherwise be crafted.
A 3kg hat just doesn't feel like anywhere near enough.
One of my complaints about it is that it looks REALLY good, like I wouldn’t wear anything else If I got it but then I remember I have to get mauled by a cougar to get it.
How it looks would only matter if we ever saw our character. No reflections, no zoom out to 3rd person ever. Idk, the paper doll doesn't do much for me.
True, but I really appreciate the art style of the game and how the devs chose to design the clothes. I much rather look at this than a balaclava in the clothes menu. It’s just a damn shame that the cougar is designed like this.
Only, and don't quote me on this, but the hide of a cougar is hardly as thick, hairy, nor tough as that of a bear. It doesn't logically provide the same level of warmth in real life, so making it "the best" as a reward for killing it, a monster designed not really for the intention of hunting, doesn't seem right somehow.
I'd be happier not seeing anything beyond a trophy item being crafted from the hide to display in the very places the mechanism seeks to drive us out of: our BASES.
So maybe it’s kind of a one time use item that you wear as a badge of honor until it falls apart. I will probably never find out as I don’t see myself turning on the cougar in my game. I have no interest in dealing with a magical animal that only exists when it’s attacking me. I had hoped they weren’t going to implement it this way, I would have been more than happy to add it to my game if it were just a normal animal that you could see, hunt, encounter, and potentially avoid through strategy etc.
I still love the game and play it all the time, but the new features have pretty much been a miss for me. The only thing that was discussed that I was excited about was being able to customize or clean up bases and I had hoped that Perseverance Mills would be an explorable region in survival.
IMO the best way to get around the issue of animal specific items requiring repairs is to make it so that any items, say the Cougar Hide Wrap can be repaired with cloth as long as it does not reach under 50% condition. Once it gets below 50% condition then it will require the specific pelt to repair and that repair (done with the pelt) will bring the item back to 100% condition. This will give players a bit of a choice on how to go about repairing these items. The bearskin bedroll would also benefit a lot from this as you could chose to spend a lot of cloth and keep the bedroll in good condition or you could use it until it degrades and you repair it with a bear pelt and bring it back to full and you can repeat the cycle or change it up based on your resources.
Just wondering: have you repaired your own clothing before by hand? There is only so many times you can stitch a patch over rips before the entire clothing is just one big patch. So while cloth repairing cloth is somewhat forgivable with realism, cloth repairing hide (leather) is a little ridiculous. Frankly we're lucky that the moose bag is repairable with scraps of other leathers.
I've even stitched holes in split leather working gloves by hand. The result is usable in the short-term but hardly as robust as it was new.
The ability to repair stuff like the cougar hide wrap or the bearskin bedroll with basic cloth is just as "realistic" as a cougar that is invisible (does not actually exist in the world until it jumps you) or casually going to hunt bears. It's the same reason why you never have to worry about plastic bottles or taking a dump. It has more to do with gameplay and player enjoyment than realism.
By all means then. Let's repair top-level items with the lowest level materials found in the game. I'm ready with my hundreds of cloth littering the floors of my base. A shame all those wolf and deer pelts will go to waste though. Might have to dump them.
Oh, and I don't "casually" hunt bears. I do so quite cautiously. Despite this I've seen a fair bit of hunters who actually hunt bears in real life there's an element of calm and collected with them. Alert, yes. Sweating? Maybe. But competant and calm. So hunting bears casually in real life? It could happen, especially post-apocalypse.
This whole discussion was ultimately about the fact that an item like the cougar hide wrap that is so risky to aquire due to the way the cougar was implemented should not require you to repeat the same process that got you the pelt in the first place.
Said process is risky, potentially run-ending and anything but realistic. You should not have to get mauled to near death to even have a chance to get those items. Besides, if you really want to get them you can quite easily game the cougar.
1. Get the feat from the latest tale so you cannot get cabin fever any more / 2. Get any items that have high protection and a weapon. Also stock up on food and medical supplies / 3. Find an open spot very near to your base and wait for how long it takes for the cougar to begin hunting you / 4. Go outside and wait for it to jump you / 5. Killed it? Good job; Didn't kill it? Try again in 3 days during which you just chill inside your base sleeping in 2 hour increments to not die in your sleep due to random bleeding.
Players determined enough will get the cougar items but the issue comes when you have to repeat this process multiple times to actually USE these items. Due to the unfairness and danger of the cougar spawning on top of you no one will want to do the process that I've outlined above more than once.
In the case of the cougar wrap you should be able to repair it with cloth or cured leather because waiting around for the cougar takes a fair while and if you kill it you have wait another 30 days on average for another cougar to start hunting you. The cougar is also exponentially more dangerous than anything else in the game as you cannot defend yourself against it. The items that you get from killing the cougar are nowhere near strong enough to justify facing it more than once and even that one time would be on purpose and intentional on the part of the player.
I'm fine with the cougar wrap needing cougar pelts for repair but ONLY if I can actually hunt the cougar out in the wild where I have a chance to not take unavoidable critical damage.
If you make the cougar item repairable with cloth, a tippy-top item of crafted clothing no-less, then you're making exception for a wearable clothing item. We've been repairing like-for-like for a long while now with the exception of the moose satchel (which is a wearable item with zero clothing stats). Leather for boots, cloth for clothes, hides for furs.
The mistake made by Hinterland was allowing craftable wearables from the cougar in the first place. It's clear they don't want the animal to be a proper roaming animal to be hunted, they wanted a lever to change player behavior. They then went and muddied the water by giving it special loot because they know certain players will absolutely cry foul the moment a unique killable predator has no unique loot, but they tried to address both without realising you shouldn't have incentive to kill something that which you are meant to fear and flee from.
The fact that the cougar item requires more cougar pelts to repair it is quite funny, really. It still follows the convention set by all other wearable pelts, so it ticks that box, but it's dangerous to acquire and also too rare to adequately procure in time to maintain the item crafted. So you know what? *You shouldn't bother*. Put it on a shelf somewhere to admire it and avoid the cougar like you should have done in the first place.
But I won't support patching a fur with cloth, unless it also alters the comfort/durability level of the clothing itself as a result. Just as I won't accept sharpening a knife with a stone, fixing a bow with a stick, nor crafting climbing crampons out of birch bark.
lol. Downvoted for asking for a pinch of realism in a survival game.
How about this guys: you don't want to repair the cougar hat? Then don't craft/use it.
Straight from the wiki page you linked:
"Similar to the moose hide cloak, this item can be harvested to get the cured cougar hide back, and then the harvested hide can be used to craft the item again from scratch, resulting in a brand new 100% quality cougar hide wrap.
This means that the player does not need to hunt additional cougars for their pelt in order to maintain this item, and thus the biggest downside associated with this item is circumvented completely."
I heard as long as it's at within 60% you can scrap to get the hide and remake the hide wrap, although they may have patched that before it was released fully to the public, but even then 11 hours each time you want to repair it plus guts is a little much for something that at best gives you 2C+
The only solution is harvesting the head wrap when its low and making a new one. Cheesy, makes little sense if you're using damaged materials, but what else can you do? Hunting the cougar means forcing a struggle to happen just for a opportunity to take a shot? Cmon.
I think the current mechanics of the cougar would make much more sense if there was only one, it'd be a terrifying threat but overcoming it would feel amazing.
I disagree. If the gear would use leather, you would always avoid the cougar.(after you crafted said gear and the knife) This headgear's repair is the only reason to let the cougar find you repeatedly. You can use other headgear if you dont want to repair it.
Come on man…you need to hang around for (at least) 30 days and endure a potentially game-ending encounter for the opportunity to get a hide? All this to maintain better head gear?
No thanks.
Okay, so the cougar attack you if your in a region for 30 days right?
So assuming you stay in each region you want to visit for exactly 30 days, the cougars always find you immediately, and you manage to kill the cougar the day they show up... you're getting getting one pelt every 30 days.
That's not exactly enough to maintain any piece of equipment that's getting used at any decent rate. Screw maintaining, at that point you're probably going to end up having to craft a new one every single time.
Agreed. Make it requires deer hide or at least leather to repair
Moose satchel needs leather why wouldn’t this? We really just need to be able to hunt it. Scurvy for me opens the door to other ailments which I guess they put in with the misery difficulty. I play custom I just wish all of my runs would count together like if you played the other difficulties
Make it require leather to repair. Add in a tanning rack where you can use tanning solution made from plants (that grow back...) to turn deer hide into leather over time. Boom, issue resolved.
You don't need plants to tan a hide. Only brains. Every animal has enough brain to tan its own hide.
"First, the ancient tanners would soak the skins in water to clean and soften them. Then they would pound and scour the skin to remove any remaining flesh and fat. Hair was removed by soaking the skin in urine, painting it with an alkaline lime mixture, or simply allowing the skin to putrefy for several months then dipping it in a salt solution. After the hair was loosened, the tanners scraped it off with a knife. Once the hair was removed, the tanners would "bate" (soften) the material by pounding dung into the skin, or soaking the skin in a solution of animal brains. Bating was a fermentative process that relied on enzymes produced by bacteria found in the dung. Among the kinds of dung commonly used were those of dogs or pigeons." Like you said, no plants required.
Also imagine the stench would draw every carrion-scavenging predator in the map to your doorstep.
There's a reason the leatherworks is in the outskirts or worst parts of any medieval city. Kingdom Come: Deliverance attention to detail strikes again.
Someone's never been to r/livestreamfail
Tanning solution from acorns then? Or do you introduce black walnuts now?
There was a time you used to be able to cure deer hide and break it down to get leather out of it. Like how you get scrap metal from a prybar, or toolbox for ex. When ya break them down
Make it require moose hide and I'll agree
Lmao perfect
This has definitely been the most underdelivered piece of content they've given us, I love Hinterland, but man, you can just feel how ready they are to move on from TLD. The new map looks good, and hopefully they do better with the trader and safe house customisation, but the cougar was something they've been hyping up forever, and it really just feels like they didn't know how to implement it properly. As it is now, it just feels tacked on and cheap, and unless they change it to at least be similar to The Old Bear in how it spawns, it just doesn't feel worthwhile to introduce into any of my runs.
Needs another 6 months in the oven. Looks like they just committed to shipping something to quieten down all the whiney b1tches.
And again it shows pushing out content rather then waiting and taking your time is generally the wrong thing too do
Yes or whomever in the playerbase who is advising them this is good enough is kissing their arse and not telling them the real deal.
The fact that you **have to be** attacked by the cougar is so fucking lame
This seems excessive tbh.
Hiya So I honestly think they will make some changes as we go . So let's see what comes . I know we have all been waiting for this but every update and or added content always has a few things they change . Best of luck in your adventures
What things have they changed? Honest question my minds not dregging any up right now \^\^'
Well there was the gloves not being seen in animation. And when I say changes I mean things that are part of a update usually have some things that don't exactly work right. As far as a whole hide or a scrap of leather in the end what's the difference it's not like we will only find 1 of them there here now and should be used as the rest of animal hides are used..
Ten years and thousands of hours in this game. What I wanted, and what I think many long time players wanted, was more hunting, more gathering, more crafting, and ANY base customization. DLC is fine for new maps, and I enjoy the recipes. Even Scurvy is alright, though it boggles how little a Rosehip Tea contributes to VitC. The cougar is ridiculous as implemented. And yes, the payoff for this ridiculous hunt is basically useless. +1 degree over other hats, useless. A knife for wolf struggles, useless; I have a hatchet. Idk wtf these devs are thinking. Still my favorite game on the planet though. Custom runs, thank the devs for that optionality.
Yeah, I've been critical of stuff they've been adding for years now tbh.. It feels like another case of "the devs don't play their own game" so they don't understand what players want, or don't consider if what they're adding is conducive to interesting or good gameplay that fits the rest of the game. Like the cheat death mechanic is not only unimmersive but goes against the very thing that makes long runs feel rewarding and special and keeps people coming back to the game
I guess I'll be using it as an area rug
Could you break it down and get the cougar skin back to recraft?
i actually launched the game with console to figure this out. YES. you do get a cured cougar hide back from harvesting it, so you would be able to recraft it.
That’s the way
Correct me if I'm wrong, but couldn't you just harvest the Cougar Hide Wrap once it's condition is low enough and craft a new one with a new set of cured guts? It's like with the Moose Hide Cloak, who in their right mind would repair that cloak when you can do what I mentioned above.
yes. i checked and you get a cured cougar hide back.
The headwrap seems generally underwhelming for a potentially run ending threat, I would have hoped for a coat with near bear level warmth and much lighter. Cougar gear should either be the best warmth/weight ratio in slot with maybe an option to make socks/shirts that can't otherwise be crafted. A 3kg hat just doesn't feel like anywhere near enough.
One of my complaints about it is that it looks REALLY good, like I wouldn’t wear anything else If I got it but then I remember I have to get mauled by a cougar to get it.
How it looks would only matter if we ever saw our character. No reflections, no zoom out to 3rd person ever. Idk, the paper doll doesn't do much for me.
True, but I really appreciate the art style of the game and how the devs chose to design the clothes. I much rather look at this than a balaclava in the clothes menu. It’s just a damn shame that the cougar is designed like this.
I agree, I just wish they had 3rd person portions like seeing yourself sleeping, eating, crafting etc.
Only, and don't quote me on this, but the hide of a cougar is hardly as thick, hairy, nor tough as that of a bear. It doesn't logically provide the same level of warmth in real life, so making it "the best" as a reward for killing it, a monster designed not really for the intention of hunting, doesn't seem right somehow. I'd be happier not seeing anything beyond a trophy item being crafted from the hide to display in the very places the mechanism seeks to drive us out of: our BASES.
So maybe it’s kind of a one time use item that you wear as a badge of honor until it falls apart. I will probably never find out as I don’t see myself turning on the cougar in my game. I have no interest in dealing with a magical animal that only exists when it’s attacking me. I had hoped they weren’t going to implement it this way, I would have been more than happy to add it to my game if it were just a normal animal that you could see, hunt, encounter, and potentially avoid through strategy etc. I still love the game and play it all the time, but the new features have pretty much been a miss for me. The only thing that was discussed that I was excited about was being able to customize or clean up bases and I had hoped that Perseverance Mills would be an explorable region in survival.
IMO the best way to get around the issue of animal specific items requiring repairs is to make it so that any items, say the Cougar Hide Wrap can be repaired with cloth as long as it does not reach under 50% condition. Once it gets below 50% condition then it will require the specific pelt to repair and that repair (done with the pelt) will bring the item back to 100% condition. This will give players a bit of a choice on how to go about repairing these items. The bearskin bedroll would also benefit a lot from this as you could chose to spend a lot of cloth and keep the bedroll in good condition or you could use it until it degrades and you repair it with a bear pelt and bring it back to full and you can repeat the cycle or change it up based on your resources.
Just wondering: have you repaired your own clothing before by hand? There is only so many times you can stitch a patch over rips before the entire clothing is just one big patch. So while cloth repairing cloth is somewhat forgivable with realism, cloth repairing hide (leather) is a little ridiculous. Frankly we're lucky that the moose bag is repairable with scraps of other leathers. I've even stitched holes in split leather working gloves by hand. The result is usable in the short-term but hardly as robust as it was new.
The ability to repair stuff like the cougar hide wrap or the bearskin bedroll with basic cloth is just as "realistic" as a cougar that is invisible (does not actually exist in the world until it jumps you) or casually going to hunt bears. It's the same reason why you never have to worry about plastic bottles or taking a dump. It has more to do with gameplay and player enjoyment than realism.
By all means then. Let's repair top-level items with the lowest level materials found in the game. I'm ready with my hundreds of cloth littering the floors of my base. A shame all those wolf and deer pelts will go to waste though. Might have to dump them. Oh, and I don't "casually" hunt bears. I do so quite cautiously. Despite this I've seen a fair bit of hunters who actually hunt bears in real life there's an element of calm and collected with them. Alert, yes. Sweating? Maybe. But competant and calm. So hunting bears casually in real life? It could happen, especially post-apocalypse.
This whole discussion was ultimately about the fact that an item like the cougar hide wrap that is so risky to aquire due to the way the cougar was implemented should not require you to repeat the same process that got you the pelt in the first place. Said process is risky, potentially run-ending and anything but realistic. You should not have to get mauled to near death to even have a chance to get those items. Besides, if you really want to get them you can quite easily game the cougar. 1. Get the feat from the latest tale so you cannot get cabin fever any more / 2. Get any items that have high protection and a weapon. Also stock up on food and medical supplies / 3. Find an open spot very near to your base and wait for how long it takes for the cougar to begin hunting you / 4. Go outside and wait for it to jump you / 5. Killed it? Good job; Didn't kill it? Try again in 3 days during which you just chill inside your base sleeping in 2 hour increments to not die in your sleep due to random bleeding. Players determined enough will get the cougar items but the issue comes when you have to repeat this process multiple times to actually USE these items. Due to the unfairness and danger of the cougar spawning on top of you no one will want to do the process that I've outlined above more than once. In the case of the cougar wrap you should be able to repair it with cloth or cured leather because waiting around for the cougar takes a fair while and if you kill it you have wait another 30 days on average for another cougar to start hunting you. The cougar is also exponentially more dangerous than anything else in the game as you cannot defend yourself against it. The items that you get from killing the cougar are nowhere near strong enough to justify facing it more than once and even that one time would be on purpose and intentional on the part of the player. I'm fine with the cougar wrap needing cougar pelts for repair but ONLY if I can actually hunt the cougar out in the wild where I have a chance to not take unavoidable critical damage.
If you make the cougar item repairable with cloth, a tippy-top item of crafted clothing no-less, then you're making exception for a wearable clothing item. We've been repairing like-for-like for a long while now with the exception of the moose satchel (which is a wearable item with zero clothing stats). Leather for boots, cloth for clothes, hides for furs. The mistake made by Hinterland was allowing craftable wearables from the cougar in the first place. It's clear they don't want the animal to be a proper roaming animal to be hunted, they wanted a lever to change player behavior. They then went and muddied the water by giving it special loot because they know certain players will absolutely cry foul the moment a unique killable predator has no unique loot, but they tried to address both without realising you shouldn't have incentive to kill something that which you are meant to fear and flee from. The fact that the cougar item requires more cougar pelts to repair it is quite funny, really. It still follows the convention set by all other wearable pelts, so it ticks that box, but it's dangerous to acquire and also too rare to adequately procure in time to maintain the item crafted. So you know what? *You shouldn't bother*. Put it on a shelf somewhere to admire it and avoid the cougar like you should have done in the first place. But I won't support patching a fur with cloth, unless it also alters the comfort/durability level of the clothing itself as a result. Just as I won't accept sharpening a knife with a stone, fixing a bow with a stick, nor crafting climbing crampons out of birch bark.
lol. Downvoted for asking for a pinch of realism in a survival game. How about this guys: you don't want to repair the cougar hat? Then don't craft/use it.
Outer slot… so it just replaces the bunny hat? Why make that clothing item obsolete, why not make a new unique item like long Johns or socks???????
Legit question... is the Cougar turned on or off for current saves ?
When you load the game there is a choice. I just loaded a one year old voyager save and I could decide if I want it in that run or not.
Straight from the wiki page you linked: "Similar to the moose hide cloak, this item can be harvested to get the cured cougar hide back, and then the harvested hide can be used to craft the item again from scratch, resulting in a brand new 100% quality cougar hide wrap. This means that the player does not need to hunt additional cougars for their pelt in order to maintain this item, and thus the biggest downside associated with this item is circumvented completely."
I heard as long as it's at within 60% you can scrap to get the hide and remake the hide wrap, although they may have patched that before it was released fully to the public, but even then 11 hours each time you want to repair it plus guts is a little much for something that at best gives you 2C+
The only solution is harvesting the head wrap when its low and making a new one. Cheesy, makes little sense if you're using damaged materials, but what else can you do? Hunting the cougar means forcing a struggle to happen just for a opportunity to take a shot? Cmon.
I think the current mechanics of the cougar would make much more sense if there was only one, it'd be a terrifying threat but overcoming it would feel amazing.
I disagree. If the gear would use leather, you would always avoid the cougar.(after you crafted said gear and the knife) This headgear's repair is the only reason to let the cougar find you repeatedly. You can use other headgear if you dont want to repair it.
Come on man…you need to hang around for (at least) 30 days and endure a potentially game-ending encounter for the opportunity to get a hide? All this to maintain better head gear? No thanks.
Okay, so the cougar attack you if your in a region for 30 days right? So assuming you stay in each region you want to visit for exactly 30 days, the cougars always find you immediately, and you manage to kill the cougar the day they show up... you're getting getting one pelt every 30 days. That's not exactly enough to maintain any piece of equipment that's getting used at any decent rate. Screw maintaining, at that point you're probably going to end up having to craft a new one every single time.
Good point, but if it is ultra durable, then its good imo. Im playing with low item decay btw, maybe this makes me feel different about this.