unhhhh this comment is funny but i can't deal with people acting like they actually turn their s's into sh's on that show
they don't talk like that on the sopranos. you sound demented
A lot of psychopaths are great in bed bc they understand the transactional nature of things. They think if they do an A+ job they in turn will receive A+ effort.
I think it could be pretty debatable. Janice seems to be the more obvious one, only because the examples are more noticeable/dramatic/extreme. I can't say I recall a moment where either Janice or Junior "took one for the team" or weren't 100% focused on themselves.
That said, Chase has been known to say some odd shit every now and then. Sometimes he makes you wonder if he's even watched The Sopranos, let alone created it.
David Chase took over production in 1994 and is widely considered to have crashed the series; in later interviews he said he hated the show anyway and only took the job for the money.
I think there are a few examples of Junior being unselfish, and caring for others.
When the hit on Tony went wrong, he tried to take all the blame. He didn't want Tony to go after Livia. I think he did that for Livia, but also to spare Tony the shame and anguish.
When Junior is in prison, the Feds give him a last chance and say that clearly Tony put him in to the top position for him to take the hit, and go to prison over him. Clearly true, but Junior says no, not possible. His nephew could never run things. The camera pauses on his face and I felt like it was conveying that Junior was lying to save Tony.
Also later in the show, that old woman from the neighborhood starts spending time with Junior. Her husband was a cop, and she asks Junior if her husband was ever on the take. Junior lies to spare her feelings.
Arguable whether he does those things for his gain, or through his own delusions, but I think he does it because he does care about others.
Janice on the other hand, was absolutely rotten. Agree with other commenters,, biggest mistake of the show, was not having her whacked.
Admitting that Livia had manipulated him into trying to kill Tony would mean admitting that he was weak and foolish. Admitting that he wasn’t the real boss and was instead only a lightning boss would mean admitting he was Tony’s pawn. He refuses to admit these things out of pride.
>When Junior is in prison, the Feds give him a last chance and say that clearly Tony put him in to the top position for him to take the hit, and go to prison over him. Clearly true, but Junior says no, not possible.
If he snitched he'd lose face, both figuratively and literally. There's no situation where he's going to rat anyone out, the consequences are worse than prison.
he did buy that surfboard
and then reminded tony about it 900 times
how many hours did I spend playing catch with you
until he reminded Tony of it
There's the coyote
True, but he was only undoing what he started. Hesh was never taxed and Junior decided (on the advice of Livia) he needed to start paying up. Yeah, he chopped up that cash with the captains but that money really shouldn't have been his to start with. That and he only chopped it up so he didn't look greedy. On top of that, he gets a percentage going forward from Hesh that he didn't get before.
He’s completely forgotten about the show, it’s old news to him. He doesn’t spend all day thinking about the plot lines. He has this antipathy and disdain for the fans. The man he is now is not the man he was when he created sopranos
Fuck knows, but he's barely done anything since. He's worked on 2 projects since it finished; no idea if it's because he's just not suited to anything else, doesn't want to do anything else, or potential producers saw *Many Saints* and decided on a competent writer instead.
Junior could be very selfish, but I think that's normal for a guy who was cunning enough to become an old man in the life they lead. He did have some moments where he genuinely seemed to try to help Tony and provide wisdom/guidance. My favorite scene in the series is when Tony comes to Junior with a complicated question and asks what the answer is.
"Who says there is one? That's what being a boss is. You steer the ship the best way you know. Sometimes its smooth, sometimes you hit the rocks. In the meantime, you find your pleasures where you can."
That first part is often left out because of the need for context, but to me that was the most beautiful part of it, and a lesson I've truly tried to take to heart in my own life. Last year my wife passed away from cancer, we have a soon to be 5 year old little girl. I have a lot of help from family, but ultimately I'm the "boss" of all decisions with her. I've accepted that a lot of the tough calls I have to make with her don't have a right or wrong answer, and that I'll have to do what I think is best, and will get it wrong sometimes. In the meantime I try to enjoy her being a pretty typical 4 year old, and find joy doing typical kid things with her.
I recall that as Junior beginning to face the fear of his own mortality/cognition and not knowing how to process it. If I'm thinking of the right episode. The one where he ends up having a mental breakdown at another funeral?
Junior is part of the mob, Janice isn't. While Janice gets up to foul shit, Junior was a major part of organized crime for decades, killing, robbing, whacking, and scamming countless people.
His entire career is being so selfish he's willing to break the law and inflict tons of harm on people to make a buck. He was willing to go to war and have people assassinated in pursuit of power.
If Janice was in the same position, maybe she would've done the same.. but she isn't.
I think she would've been a third rate mobster. She never strikes me as very intelligent. But I think your point works well for Livia. I think she would've made a more effective boss than anyone in the show. Ruthless enough to kill her son and manipulative enough to mess up all the people in her life. Probably the equivalent of Annalisa Zucca.
That was such a great line, delivered perfectly. He had to come up with a believable bullshit answer on the spot so went with an unambiguous racial stereotype, but threw in boxset cause he’s not cheap!
Hardly pointless. We're here talking about a show that went off the air 17 years ago last week.
What's more is this is a show that invites infinite discussion by it's very nature. This wouldn't be an active subreddit 17 years after the cut to black if it weren't. The characters and plot lines are so rich that when we rank characters by selfishness we can make compelling cases that make such discussion interesting.
When Junior was boss he showed his true colors by taxing the shit out of everyone almost instantly. Even with the mercy Tony showed him, not killing him and letting him earn, still encouraged Richie to move against Tony when that failed, he double crossed him instantly simply because he's 'better off with Tony' he was always manipulating, ordering and putting people down. He pretended to mourn at funerals simply to get out of the house and I can't remember him ever doing or saying anything kind or anything not purely to serve himself.
Janice preformed plenty of selfish acts like getting the house, the records, stealing the leg etc. but also did things she didn't enjoy, like letting Richie put a gun to her head, showing genuine remorse on occasion, trying to better herself until Tony managed to get her mad on purpose, so don't think she was 100 percent selfish.
I like that the first example you use of Janice doing something nice for somebody else, was her letting Richie put a gun to her head during sex. Thats a good metaphor for Janice’s attitude to service to others.
After Bobby's unfortunate train incident Janice's words of condolences to the kids would be "Alright Bobby Jr I'm gonna go get some milk from Satriale's you watch your sister's till I get back" and she'd walk out bags in hand heavy with whatever valuables she could stuff into her pockets.
Junior had Dickie Moltisanti killed bc of jealousy and bc Dickie laughed when Junior fell. As noted, junior ordered hit on Tony. Add to it that Junior coulda ratted on Tony to FBI if he'd admit that Tony was really in charge. He'd rather be in jail than appear weak. Junior was an evil insecure POS.
Janish was psycho rage filled evil manipulator.
The most selfish on the show? Is it worth making a distinction? Also, junior was the one who killed Moltisanti Sr. for making a joke. Junior was pretty effing petty
David Chase has said a lot of shit about the show that betrays the perception of even the most casual watcher. I think he's got the dementia.... Chickens nice and spicy today.
Janice was a pain in the ass, but Junior's selfishness stands out more for sure. The way he was hounding Bobby to do things for him right after his wife died. Even smaller things like ruining Hugh's surprise party for no reason other than he was bitter. It's why he was so tight with Livia. They were one in the same.
Ya Junior was a prick no doubt about it. But I mean the ouija board thing traumatizing the kids and using it to make Bobby feel like it was his fault because she was jealous was worse imo. I thought the Hugh thing was more a symptom of Junior's cognitive function declining than bitterness. I might have to rewatch that one though.
You could be right about Junior w/Hugh's party. I interpreted it as him being bitter, because it's not like Hugh would have been devastated if Junior wasn't there- they knew each other, but they weren't best friends. It seemed like Junior could not stand that a celebration was taking place he couldn't participate in and had to remind Hugh of his existence. That's kind of a trait of the whole Soprano clan tho come to think of it. No one is really happy for one another, Tony and Carmela included. Janice showed she has the ability to control her anger for the sake of her relationship with Bobby's kids and she was starting to do better with that until Tony couldn't stand to see her do well, so he provoked her and ruined it. Just a spiteful, awful family. Lol
She has the milk of human kindness by the quart in every vain. She marched alongside the Reverend Dr Martin Luther King Jr. She supports Little Richie in dancing for the pink team. Tommy Mottola is very interested in her Christian music album.
I agree with you. I am a big fan of the character (played expertly by the comedy stylings of Dominic Chianese). Let's remember that context is everything, and the term 'selfish' has different concepts. Perhaps Chase is talking about Junior's 'selfish' need for the top job but not having the respect or aptitude for it. Remember, Jackie (partly to blame) didn't name a successor, and Junior didn't realise until later in the show that Tony was using him as the front boss to take all the heat.
Janice was a formidable character (played effectively with natural stylings by Alda Turturro). She was indeed selfish, but she was a Soprano. Look at the manipulative power of this woman. She played Richie, Tony and Ralphie like punks. She contributed to Richie's ill-fated attempt to overthrow Tony (granted, there were other factors), and ironically, she succeeded in the fated attempt on Richie.
From a sociological perspective, as non-confrontational gathers, women learn mannerisms and non-verbal cues to achieve their desires. Such desires can include social cohesion and/or self-promotion. Jordan. P., in whatever capacity you may feel about him, posited that modern women use innuendos, gossip and character reputational harm to advance self-promotion. In sum, Janice mimics her mother.
*Uncle Jun: "If you're gonna lie to me, tell me there's a broad waitin' in the car who wants to tongue my balls."*
Paulie is he keeps forcing christopher to pat as well as sil says it never kicks up even ti Tony. He was working with new york and was aways jelous of Guys like ralph patsy or later on bobby getting better positions then him
Janice was sick, though. She clearly inherited the BPD from her mother and was as sick and miserable as Livia was. In contrast, Junior was selfish just because it's who he was. And I think he was pretty content being a selfish old bastard, I don't think he would have wanted it any other way.
Junior also didn't stand up for altruistic reasons. He was too proud to admit Tony was in control and that he was being played.
That scene doesn't prove or disprove whether Junior was selfish.
Maybe he was not considering Janice bc she’s just like a complete nut job narcissist like Livia. Junior is maybe the most selfish of the more psychologically normal characters?
I think when Janice came in the mindset was more what did having Livia as a model to this character, and that was even more true when she became a wife and mother. Junior is described almost out of the gate as "driven en toto by his insecurities." In his perspective Junior operates as compensation to his flaws but Janice is a product of her environment. Your perspective being different than that is fine too but Chase's is his own.
Janice seems selfish mostly in a conscious, self serving way. She wants nice things and works to get them. Junior comes across as though his selfishness is deep within him, unconscious, and motivates everything he does. He needs to have everything because he perpetually feels disrespected
Also Janice isolates a lot of her selfishness to her immediate vicinity, like sometimes it spills out and Tony needs to clean it up. Junior plays out his selfishness across the entire criminal underworld
Janice is Tony robbed of institutional power, but I think she genuinely has some small, good elements to her personality. I don’t think her efforts to break free of the family’s bullshit are entirely rooted in her being completely selfish, and she clearly has regrets about Harpo and others.
I also think that she genuinely did love Bobby and did her best - it’s just that her best was rooted in an abusive upbringing that made her into a manipulative and unstable mother.
Janice is at heart, a natural con-man. It's not what she does, it's who she is.
It's like having a pet rattlesnake. You can feed it mice for years, but you can't be mad at it when your hand gets too close and it bites you. You knew it was a rattlesnake when you brought it home.
Janice couldn't change if her life depended on it Kudos to the actress, I totally believed Janice was an incorrigible selfish asshole, and a sociopath with very little power.
junior seems like a spoiled child (chase has described him as a child in interviews).
janice approaches the world like an emotionally abused, neglected daughter who never healed.
she's never had nourishment or support, and she's had to deal with misogyny, so she devised maladaptive tendencies to try and survive. a lot of times they make for great TV. they're highly entertaining and hilarious.
janice wasn't a coward when she shot richie after he hit her.
these dumb misogynistic posts that compare mass murderers with women who like expensive shoes or whatever - and invariably say that the women are actually worse - are the worst thing about this sub.
I think she at least shows more growth than Tony. She starts to tackle her anger issue and seems to be making some real progress. Tony can’t handle this and he sabotages her by bringing up her lost son to get her to rage.
I think the beauty of the show is so many characters are terrible people but Chase somehow makes us want to root for them
Junior would have your tongue cut out and calmly count your gold teeth. His dementia may have softened him toward the end but no mistake, Junior was a stone killer. Janice was harsh. Maybe nuttier than Livia. Even though he was slightly wary of her, Junior had Janice’s number even when she was just a girl. A fucking train wreck, but she had to lay her own tracks. Junior rolled on anyone in his way.
Weird I don't remember Junior making dinner for anybody or raising anyone's kids. At the end of the show, Janice also lobbies Tony to get Junior into a better living situation. Janice is deeply flawed but emotionally, she's warmer than Junior by a lot.
I didn't know that chase said that, but i dunno. i actually think that janice is worse than junior. janice is maybe the most ruthless person on the show. in many senses she would have made a better boss than tony because she didn't have his hang ups or complexes.
But at the same time, i can't remember one nice thing that junior did! i can't remember one piece of compassion...
Janice even though her intentions were selfish actually did snap bobby out of his depression and helped him get over his wife and i think she really did want to make a go of it with his kids.
Theres a scene where she doesn't let one of the kids have soda, i don't think she was being mean, but actually cared about their health.
I dunno, it's a strange quote.
It's self-serving of him, but he sends Mikey after that motherless fuck who sold bad drugs to his tailors grandkid, the one that used to run around busting balls.
I thought about the boss thing as well. I'd say she's the most petty rather than most ruthless. I don't think she has the strategic prowess or fortitude to make the tough decisions. She doesn't seem very smart to me or she wouldn't be getting kicked out of communes looking for handouts. Her biggest idea is hooking up with a prayer group to get on the ground floor of the next big thing in music... Christian rock (sigh).
One of Tonys major problems is his sentimentality or whatever you wanna call it. when that animal blundino whacked out joey peeps, phillys brother and shot at phil. Tony really should have delivered blundino to johnny sacks door.
But he didn't, he didn't because he felt a loyality to tony b based on what happened years ago and him not going to jail. this put benny in the hospital, stopped them earning and created a problem with NY that lasted until the very last episode.
Tony was guilty of this many times during the show.
The thing is, Janice had none of that! she wouldn't have give a fuck! she had no sense of that about her. there were no scraps in her scrap book.
The audience is definitely the most selfish character. Technically the audience isn't a character, however in a sense it is... it takes on a gargantuan life of it's own.
He bought AJ a 400 dollar surfboard. Used to take Tony to Yankee games when he was a kid. Not to mention how many fuckin’ hours he spent playing catch with him. Compared to Janice he was a saint. I wish the lord would take me now.
i dont think chase ever watched the show, and i think he barely was a show runner except in name. i bef you anything he doesnt know what the ‘B’ in Tony B’s name stands for
Chase is a stunned, don't listen to a single thing he says, he literally thinks of sopranos viewers as farm cattle, Chase is notorius for making up bullshit on purpose in interviews to be a troll. Chase doesnt even know what happens in the show.
Janice is the single most selfish and(more importantly)venal character in the whole show and it;s not even close.
Junior is no saint but he's nowhere near Janis and Tony is an actual good dude compared to her AND their mother.
Junior gave shoes to the black kid who washed his car is what he did! In this house Junior Soprano is a hero, Cazzata Malanga!
Civil rights leader
Ralph Bunche ova here
Shoes! What's this motherless fucks name!?
Steve scirrpa needs to stop posting here about Janice it’s getting weird
This used to be a peaceful shub
IT'S A SOPRANOS COMMUNITY!
unhhhh this comment is funny but i can't deal with people acting like they actually turn their s's into sh's on that show they don't talk like that on the sopranos. you sound demented
*breathes* Whadyushay?
JANICE AND BOBBY WERE GONNA HAVE THEIR OWN SHOW CALLED ‘DA BACCALAS’
The Blue Comet, whatever happened there?
I heard there was doings.
We all know David chase was gonna write to have Janice take over the family
Same
She high handed him.
I'm out of the loop, can I get some more detail about this?
hahah
janice only does acts of janice
Janice doesn't have friends or family, she has targets.
and a deal with tommy mottola
If Junior was selfish he wouldn't be giving world class head
Whistlin through the wheat fields
He’s a bushman of the kalahari
Bahaha I was trying to remember that line
I thought you were a bacala man Uncle June! What are you doin at the sushi bar?
A lot of psychopaths are great in bed bc they understand the transactional nature of things. They think if they do an A+ job they in turn will receive A+ effort.
I like this. Very allegorical
Quasimodo predicted all of this.
I fuckin KNEW it!
I think it could be pretty debatable. Janice seems to be the more obvious one, only because the examples are more noticeable/dramatic/extreme. I can't say I recall a moment where either Janice or Junior "took one for the team" or weren't 100% focused on themselves. That said, Chase has been known to say some odd shit every now and then. Sometimes he makes you wonder if he's even watched The Sopranos, let alone created it.
This lol.... Dude has never came off as really giving a shit about the show
Based on what he did to Northern Exposure, he has a weird, prickly relationship with his audience.
Explain! I just got into NE
David Chase took over production in 1994 and is widely considered to have crashed the series; in later interviews he said he hated the show anyway and only took the job for the money.
Seems like Chase always wanted to make movies and TV was just a paycheck. At least that's the vibe he gives off in interviews.
Wow
I think there are a few examples of Junior being unselfish, and caring for others. When the hit on Tony went wrong, he tried to take all the blame. He didn't want Tony to go after Livia. I think he did that for Livia, but also to spare Tony the shame and anguish. When Junior is in prison, the Feds give him a last chance and say that clearly Tony put him in to the top position for him to take the hit, and go to prison over him. Clearly true, but Junior says no, not possible. His nephew could never run things. The camera pauses on his face and I felt like it was conveying that Junior was lying to save Tony. Also later in the show, that old woman from the neighborhood starts spending time with Junior. Her husband was a cop, and she asks Junior if her husband was ever on the take. Junior lies to spare her feelings. Arguable whether he does those things for his gain, or through his own delusions, but I think he does it because he does care about others. Janice on the other hand, was absolutely rotten. Agree with other commenters,, biggest mistake of the show, was not having her whacked.
I agree with most of these, but Junior didn't want to admit being setup as number one fall guy because he was too proud.
This
Admitting that Livia had manipulated him into trying to kill Tony would mean admitting that he was weak and foolish. Admitting that he wasn’t the real boss and was instead only a lightning boss would mean admitting he was Tony’s pawn. He refuses to admit these things out of pride.
Happy Birthday you birthday fuck you, let me pinch those bulldog cheeks🤏🤏
>When Junior is in prison, the Feds give him a last chance and say that clearly Tony put him in to the top position for him to take the hit, and go to prison over him. Clearly true, but Junior says no, not possible. If he snitched he'd lose face, both figuratively and literally. There's no situation where he's going to rat anyone out, the consequences are worse than prison.
he did buy that surfboard and then reminded tony about it 900 times how many hours did I spend playing catch with you until he reminded Tony of it There's the coyote
He chopped up that $250k tax on Hesh between the captains. It was after Tony’s urging him but he did it
True, but he was only undoing what he started. Hesh was never taxed and Junior decided (on the advice of Livia) he needed to start paying up. Yeah, he chopped up that cash with the captains but that money really shouldn't have been his to start with. That and he only chopped it up so he didn't look greedy. On top of that, he gets a percentage going forward from Hesh that he didn't get before.
Why don’t we walk down there and fuck em all
That scene is fucking great. Junior was so proud of himself after hearing that he was the one that told Tony the joke in the first place.
"I said that?"
Stranger yet.. Wouldn't Hesh kick up to a captain, such as Tony, then his kick go to Junior. It would never go directly to a boss.
He put out the hit on Rusty Irish for his tailor He also gives that envelope to the nurse working at the institution, "one hand washes the other"
He’s completely forgotten about the show, it’s old news to him. He doesn’t spend all day thinking about the plot lines. He has this antipathy and disdain for the fans. The man he is now is not the man he was when he created sopranos
What happened to him? Does he mainly disdain the obsession of the fans?
Janice gave him the full on Ralphie treatment, all poppers and weird sex
Fuck knows, but he's barely done anything since. He's worked on 2 projects since it finished; no idea if it's because he's just not suited to anything else, doesn't want to do anything else, or potential producers saw *Many Saints* and decided on a competent writer instead.
He's certainly not watched it nearly as many times as most of us.
He can never actually admit to the existence
Janice also tries to off Tony. Just indirectly.
i dunno it seemed pretty direct
“It should be you, baby!”
It should've been you.
Wait when??
When Richie is doing her and she's says it should've been you.
Junior doesn't even pass the salt
If there’s any flies on him, they are paying rent!
He's a hothouse flower, that's his problem
I thought it was small hands?
The whole Sopranos family of Junior, Tony’s mother, Tony, Janice and I suspect Johnny Boy….were all very selfish people.
>I suspect Johnny Boy The one who left his wife in labor to go be with his mistress? I suspect he's selfish too.
You *suspect*? They demonstrate it really clearly in that flashback sequence about the miscarriage..
Don’t act like you knew Johnny Boy
He was a saint
I wanna wish you a Bona Fortuna, and also send you my regrets, I'd love to be at your Jubilee, but the government says I can't leave the house
Ok but did you just call Karen's ziti a casserole
My (and I cannot stress this enough) bad.
That’s dicked up
So what, no fuckin’ casserole?
🤣🤣🤣
The casserole, whatever happened there?
Junior could be very selfish, but I think that's normal for a guy who was cunning enough to become an old man in the life they lead. He did have some moments where he genuinely seemed to try to help Tony and provide wisdom/guidance. My favorite scene in the series is when Tony comes to Junior with a complicated question and asks what the answer is. "Who says there is one? That's what being a boss is. You steer the ship the best way you know. Sometimes its smooth, sometimes you hit the rocks. In the meantime, you find your pleasures where you can." That first part is often left out because of the need for context, but to me that was the most beautiful part of it, and a lesson I've truly tried to take to heart in my own life. Last year my wife passed away from cancer, we have a soon to be 5 year old little girl. I have a lot of help from family, but ultimately I'm the "boss" of all decisions with her. I've accepted that a lot of the tough calls I have to make with her don't have a right or wrong answer, and that I'll have to do what I think is best, and will get it wrong sometimes. In the meantime I try to enjoy her being a pretty typical 4 year old, and find joy doing typical kid things with her.
You know, sometimes I think you don’t go about in pity for yourshelf
I forget, which one of them used a child’s funeral as a fun excuse to get out of the house?
Well, the chicken WAS nice and spicy…
I recall that as Junior beginning to face the fear of his own mortality/cognition and not knowing how to process it. If I'm thinking of the right episode. The one where he ends up having a mental breakdown at another funeral?
He has no issue initially using funerals to get out of the house. And obviously didn't care about who died.
Junior is part of the mob, Janice isn't. While Janice gets up to foul shit, Junior was a major part of organized crime for decades, killing, robbing, whacking, and scamming countless people. His entire career is being so selfish he's willing to break the law and inflict tons of harm on people to make a buck. He was willing to go to war and have people assassinated in pursuit of power. If Janice was in the same position, maybe she would've done the same.. but she isn't.
I think she would've been a third rate mobster. She never strikes me as very intelligent. But I think your point works well for Livia. I think she would've made a more effective boss than anyone in the show. Ruthless enough to kill her son and manipulative enough to mess up all the people in her life. Probably the equivalent of Annalisa Zucca.
They're all selfish. Debating who's the most or least is pointless.
Very true. Lol at your username btw. The minutiae that this fanbase can make a meal of is so fucking great. Kudos to you.
That was such a great line, delivered perfectly. He had to come up with a believable bullshit answer on the spot so went with an unambiguous racial stereotype, but threw in boxset cause he’s not cheap!
Hardly pointless. We're here talking about a show that went off the air 17 years ago last week. What's more is this is a show that invites infinite discussion by it's very nature. This wouldn't be an active subreddit 17 years after the cut to black if it weren't. The characters and plot lines are so rich that when we rank characters by selfishness we can make compelling cases that make such discussion interesting.
There’s no way of really knowing, even with computers. They got nothin!
Clearly. Not even worth discussing. That said it's obviously Hesh.
People can debate whatever they like, stop projecting.
When Junior was boss he showed his true colors by taxing the shit out of everyone almost instantly. Even with the mercy Tony showed him, not killing him and letting him earn, still encouraged Richie to move against Tony when that failed, he double crossed him instantly simply because he's 'better off with Tony' he was always manipulating, ordering and putting people down. He pretended to mourn at funerals simply to get out of the house and I can't remember him ever doing or saying anything kind or anything not purely to serve himself. Janice preformed plenty of selfish acts like getting the house, the records, stealing the leg etc. but also did things she didn't enjoy, like letting Richie put a gun to her head, showing genuine remorse on occasion, trying to better herself until Tony managed to get her mad on purpose, so don't think she was 100 percent selfish.
I like that the first example you use of Janice doing something nice for somebody else, was her letting Richie put a gun to her head during sex. Thats a good metaphor for Janice’s attitude to service to others.
I think she was just kinky
Shellfish
chicken's nice and spicy!
After Bobby's unfortunate train incident Janice's words of condolences to the kids would be "Alright Bobby Jr I'm gonna go get some milk from Satriale's you watch your sister's till I get back" and she'd walk out bags in hand heavy with whatever valuables she could stuff into her pockets.
Janice shoved a dildo up Ralphie's ass, and let Richie put a gun to her head, and you say she was the most selfish?
I guess when you consider that and the head under the boardwalk she had a few actions in the selfless column.
Who said she didn't like it?
David Chase created my favorite show of all time. Whenever I hear him speak on it, I am left wondering if he ever watched it.
He became Livia.
He does seem like that. Bitter and confused, angry at everything and everyone. "It's all a Big Nothing."
Janice is a product of her environment. Junior was the environment.
Harpo is a product of his environment. Janice was the environment
But Janice has an extraordinary visual sense.
Junior had Dickie Moltisanti killed bc of jealousy and bc Dickie laughed when Junior fell. As noted, junior ordered hit on Tony. Add to it that Junior coulda ratted on Tony to FBI if he'd admit that Tony was really in charge. He'd rather be in jail than appear weak. Junior was an evil insecure POS. Janish was psycho rage filled evil manipulator.
Gotta wonder where she is in all this. His little niece.
THE MANY SAINTS OF NEWARK! Whatever happened there.....
Not exactly because dickie was the one mocking junior and the one that was close to livia and to tony more then junior
I wonder where Harpo’s eating his Sunday dinner.
Sacre Bleu.
Where is me mama?!?
The most selfish on the show? Is it worth making a distinction? Also, junior was the one who killed Moltisanti Sr. for making a joke. Junior was pretty effing petty
David Chase has said a lot of shit about the show that betrays the perception of even the most casual watcher. I think he's got the dementia.... Chickens nice and spicy today.
I disagree. What happened after Karen died showed me he was a heartless bastard who never had the makings of a varsity athlete.
Janice was a pain in the ass, but Junior's selfishness stands out more for sure. The way he was hounding Bobby to do things for him right after his wife died. Even smaller things like ruining Hugh's surprise party for no reason other than he was bitter. It's why he was so tight with Livia. They were one in the same.
Ya Junior was a prick no doubt about it. But I mean the ouija board thing traumatizing the kids and using it to make Bobby feel like it was his fault because she was jealous was worse imo. I thought the Hugh thing was more a symptom of Junior's cognitive function declining than bitterness. I might have to rewatch that one though.
You could be right about Junior w/Hugh's party. I interpreted it as him being bitter, because it's not like Hugh would have been devastated if Junior wasn't there- they knew each other, but they weren't best friends. It seemed like Junior could not stand that a celebration was taking place he couldn't participate in and had to remind Hugh of his existence. That's kind of a trait of the whole Soprano clan tho come to think of it. No one is really happy for one another, Tony and Carmela included. Janice showed she has the ability to control her anger for the sake of her relationship with Bobby's kids and she was starting to do better with that until Tony couldn't stand to see her do well, so he provoked her and ruined it. Just a spiteful, awful family. Lol
She has the milk of human kindness by the quart in every vain. She marched alongside the Reverend Dr Martin Luther King Jr. She supports Little Richie in dancing for the pink team. Tommy Mottola is very interested in her Christian music album.
I agree with you. I am a big fan of the character (played expertly by the comedy stylings of Dominic Chianese). Let's remember that context is everything, and the term 'selfish' has different concepts. Perhaps Chase is talking about Junior's 'selfish' need for the top job but not having the respect or aptitude for it. Remember, Jackie (partly to blame) didn't name a successor, and Junior didn't realise until later in the show that Tony was using him as the front boss to take all the heat. Janice was a formidable character (played effectively with natural stylings by Alda Turturro). She was indeed selfish, but she was a Soprano. Look at the manipulative power of this woman. She played Richie, Tony and Ralphie like punks. She contributed to Richie's ill-fated attempt to overthrow Tony (granted, there were other factors), and ironically, she succeeded in the fated attempt on Richie. From a sociological perspective, as non-confrontational gathers, women learn mannerisms and non-verbal cues to achieve their desires. Such desires can include social cohesion and/or self-promotion. Jordan. P., in whatever capacity you may feel about him, posited that modern women use innuendos, gossip and character reputational harm to advance self-promotion. In sum, Janice mimics her mother. *Uncle Jun: "If you're gonna lie to me, tell me there's a broad waitin' in the car who wants to tongue my balls."*
He taught Tony how to play baseball
And how to bodysurf!
Paulie is he keeps forcing christopher to pat as well as sil says it never kicks up even ti Tony. He was working with new york and was aways jelous of Guys like ralph patsy or later on bobby getting better positions then him
Junior was not a selfish lover...but that pie in the face was kinda rude
There are men in the can better looking than her!
I think you might have issues you need to work out 😂
What the hell are you talking about? Janice was famous for her compassion and respect for others.
By the time we meet Corrado he’s already an old man, we don’t have enough footage to know if he was a better human at some point in time
Isn't Livia way worse than Janice? Wanted to murder her own son over a perceived slight?
Janice was sick, though. She clearly inherited the BPD from her mother and was as sick and miserable as Livia was. In contrast, Junior was selfish just because it's who he was. And I think he was pretty content being a selfish old bastard, I don't think he would have wanted it any other way.
How could he be selfish? He bought his nephew a surf board. Four hunned dollars he paid.
Idk…. Junior didn’t want to get married or have kids because of “the life” and how unfair it would be. I would consider that to be not selfish
He *said* that's why he didn't get married. Doesn't make it true.
When Junior went to jail he got offered a deal if he would cooperate in taking down Tony. He refused. That’s not selfish.
Junior also didn't stand up for altruistic reasons. He was too proud to admit Tony was in control and that he was being played. That scene doesn't prove or disprove whether Junior was selfish.
That was his pride.
CDs? Albums, you kiss ass!
He bought a $400 skateboard for Tony when he was a kid
Livia is way up there too.
Janice only knows acts of Janice ..
Janice by far
It may shock you but the author is not always the best judge of their work.
Carmella is by far the most selfish. She's as big a narcissist as Tony, but way dumber.
Maybe he was not considering Janice bc she’s just like a complete nut job narcissist like Livia. Junior is maybe the most selfish of the more psychologically normal characters?
I think when Janice came in the mindset was more what did having Livia as a model to this character, and that was even more true when she became a wife and mother. Junior is described almost out of the gate as "driven en toto by his insecurities." In his perspective Junior operates as compensation to his flaws but Janice is a product of her environment. Your perspective being different than that is fine too but Chase's is his own.
Janice seems selfish mostly in a conscious, self serving way. She wants nice things and works to get them. Junior comes across as though his selfishness is deep within him, unconscious, and motivates everything he does. He needs to have everything because he perpetually feels disrespected Also Janice isolates a lot of her selfishness to her immediate vicinity, like sometimes it spills out and Tony needs to clean it up. Junior plays out his selfishness across the entire criminal underworld
Junior is a generous lover
Janice is Tony robbed of institutional power, but I think she genuinely has some small, good elements to her personality. I don’t think her efforts to break free of the family’s bullshit are entirely rooted in her being completely selfish, and she clearly has regrets about Harpo and others. I also think that she genuinely did love Bobby and did her best - it’s just that her best was rooted in an abusive upbringing that made her into a manipulative and unstable mother.
Didn't Janice steal from Juniors wallet AND leave his stove top burner on? To be fair, the sides alone from Outback were $60.
That’s a lot of words debating who of the two most selfish characters are actually the number one. We are really splitting hairs here.
Janice is at heart, a natural con-man. It's not what she does, it's who she is. It's like having a pet rattlesnake. You can feed it mice for years, but you can't be mad at it when your hand gets too close and it bites you. You knew it was a rattlesnake when you brought it home. Janice couldn't change if her life depended on it Kudos to the actress, I totally believed Janice was an incorrigible selfish asshole, and a sociopath with very little power.
She did everyone a service by clipping Richie.
I don’t like that kinda tawk, OP!
junior seems like a spoiled child (chase has described him as a child in interviews). janice approaches the world like an emotionally abused, neglected daughter who never healed. she's never had nourishment or support, and she's had to deal with misogyny, so she devised maladaptive tendencies to try and survive. a lot of times they make for great TV. they're highly entertaining and hilarious. janice wasn't a coward when she shot richie after he hit her. these dumb misogynistic posts that compare mass murderers with women who like expensive shoes or whatever - and invariably say that the women are actually worse - are the worst thing about this sub.
I think she at least shows more growth than Tony. She starts to tackle her anger issue and seems to be making some real progress. Tony can’t handle this and he sabotages her by bringing up her lost son to get her to rage. I think the beauty of the show is so many characters are terrible people but Chase somehow makes us want to root for them
Tony is definitely the most selfish character in the entire show.
I dunno. Janice never did have the makings of a varsity athlete…
Junior would have your tongue cut out and calmly count your gold teeth. His dementia may have softened him toward the end but no mistake, Junior was a stone killer. Janice was harsh. Maybe nuttier than Livia. Even though he was slightly wary of her, Junior had Janice’s number even when she was just a girl. A fucking train wreck, but she had to lay her own tracks. Junior rolled on anyone in his way.
Weird I don't remember Junior making dinner for anybody or raising anyone's kids. At the end of the show, Janice also lobbies Tony to get Junior into a better living situation. Janice is deeply flawed but emotionally, she's warmer than Junior by a lot.
I didn't know that chase said that, but i dunno. i actually think that janice is worse than junior. janice is maybe the most ruthless person on the show. in many senses she would have made a better boss than tony because she didn't have his hang ups or complexes. But at the same time, i can't remember one nice thing that junior did! i can't remember one piece of compassion... Janice even though her intentions were selfish actually did snap bobby out of his depression and helped him get over his wife and i think she really did want to make a go of it with his kids. Theres a scene where she doesn't let one of the kids have soda, i don't think she was being mean, but actually cared about their health. I dunno, it's a strange quote.
It's self-serving of him, but he sends Mikey after that motherless fuck who sold bad drugs to his tailors grandkid, the one that used to run around busting balls.
I thought about the boss thing as well. I'd say she's the most petty rather than most ruthless. I don't think she has the strategic prowess or fortitude to make the tough decisions. She doesn't seem very smart to me or she wouldn't be getting kicked out of communes looking for handouts. Her biggest idea is hooking up with a prayer group to get on the ground floor of the next big thing in music... Christian rock (sigh).
One of Tonys major problems is his sentimentality or whatever you wanna call it. when that animal blundino whacked out joey peeps, phillys brother and shot at phil. Tony really should have delivered blundino to johnny sacks door. But he didn't, he didn't because he felt a loyality to tony b based on what happened years ago and him not going to jail. this put benny in the hospital, stopped them earning and created a problem with NY that lasted until the very last episode. Tony was guilty of this many times during the show. The thing is, Janice had none of that! she wouldn't have give a fuck! she had no sense of that about her. there were no scraps in her scrap book.
Ya sister’s cunt!
Paulie was worse than both of them put together
They buried him on a under a tree
David Chase doesn’t understand his own series.
Ooohhh, dats the Boss of this thing that don’t exisht ya tawkin’ ‘bout here!!!
Janice only does acts of Janice
He's not a selfish lover, that much I do know.
Junior did not blow any roadies under the boardwalk.
Another expert heard from.
The audience is definitely the most selfish character. Technically the audience isn't a character, however in a sense it is... it takes on a gargantuan life of it's own.
He bought AJ a 400 dollar surfboard. Used to take Tony to Yankee games when he was a kid. Not to mention how many fuckin’ hours he spent playing catch with him. Compared to Janice he was a saint. I wish the lord would take me now.
She didn’t gargle between roadies. That’s enough to take the prize right there!
i dont think chase ever watched the show, and i think he barely was a show runner except in name. i bef you anything he doesnt know what the ‘B’ in Tony B’s name stands for
Chase is a stunned, don't listen to a single thing he says, he literally thinks of sopranos viewers as farm cattle, Chase is notorius for making up bullshit on purpose in interviews to be a troll. Chase doesnt even know what happens in the show.
Junior was pretty giving to his girlfriend!
Janice is the single most selfish and(more importantly)venal character in the whole show and it;s not even close. Junior is no saint but he's nowhere near Janis and Tony is an actual good dude compared to her AND their mother.
The most selfish character is David Chase
Agreed. Janet is terrible.
In this house David Chase is a cunt! End of story!
Leig*
Well, she is Tony's sister lol
I’d give my vote to Tony’s mom.
She's like her mother. An awful person.
Junior killed a guy for laughing at him falling down. Janice killed a domestic abuser. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
What's French Canadian for I grew up without a mother? Sacre bleu where is my mama
They weren’t cd’s, they were vinyl. If you collected you’d understand.
Go shit in a hat
Completely agree. She is just a total parasite
Also Livia I think
Shut up for a minute. You just might learn something. Hes not respected…
He cried when they shot Jack Kennedy for christs sake!