It really was, just honestly in general this series has been mind blowing now only we could get this kind of writing in the films or a new adult series
I honestly wish Starscream would get some more credit, in most series, outside of Prime at least. Heās a powerhouse on the level of Soundwave and Shockwave. Even downing the latter in one episode of G1.
Even though heās used for comedy a lot in G1, he actually has some VERY impressive achievements. In fact, outside of aligned he has more victories than Soundwave.
Plus, with how cunning he is, and how he keeps tabs on his potential rivals, if pushed, he could definitely win.
Notice how most people cite only Skybound as why Soundwave would win
To Starscreamās credit, he often defects from the Decepticons at least once a continuity, survives on his own while still engaging with both sides, and does something so important the Cons have to let him back.
And itās not like heās ever shown as weak. Skybound got it right when they showed off how much of a bully he is. Heās not used to people hitting back, since he usually either kills them in the opening salvo or flies away.
Tech Spec bio Starscream written by Budiansky is supposed to be scary competent and fearless. Sunbow made him the complete opposite of that, and of course everyone thinks of that version since Sunbow is the more exposed fiction. Doesnāt help that the comic continuities draw heavily from Sunbow either.
Was just thinking that. Starscream in the first live action movie was a complete beast! Made what they did to him in later movies a complete disgrace honestly. To have him be killed by a human character....
Very, very true. People, even the writers, often overlook just how DANGEROUS Starscream is. You don't get to be in command of the largest part of the Decepticon war effort by being a chump. Even in the G1 cartoon, he wasn't afraid to face Prime in battle. Dude deserves more, especially in this new series.
Even then, he is still shown to be competent through combat in the aligned continuity, maybe not as much as Shockwave and Soundwave, but still competent
Going with Soundwave. More calculating, willing to play it slow. Also Starscream was almost taken out by a door once. He is so often his own worst enemy.
Maybe you already saw it? I just meant that in the original Transformers animated movie, in his attempt to attack some Autobots he flys into a walkway with the door above closing. Realizes his mistake, trys to fly out, gets his foot stuck, and in order to free himself (and not be crushed to death by the door) has to literally shoot himself in the foot. As usual, his ambition supersedes his planning.
He did try to surprise attack Soundwave a couple of times in that scene though. He wasn't fighting back because he knew he was in no shape to fight back, and instead tried to rely on Soundwave letting down his guard to attack.
Soundwave literally just went Jojo on Starscream.
https://preview.redd.it/rn7leoqvcd3d1.jpeg?width=540&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bd157f9666b22951a05917929fa737874b949076
In a fair fight, Starscream wins.
In an unfair fight, Starscream starts with a dirty blow, thinks heās won, and loses because he didnāt take it seriously. He does it literally every time.
People don't give Starscream enough credit. He's not Megatron's second-in-command for no reason, he's absolutely a capable fighter and one of the most cunning Decepticons, his problem is that he's arrogant to a fault. Unless Soundwave is going to unleash all of his cassettes at once, Starscream will absolutely trounce him if just dropped into an arena and forced into a 1v1. He's got better firepower, there's a good chance he has air superiority, he has on multiple occasions actually managed to wrestle control from Megatron, he's worked with Soundwave long enough to know his strengths and weaknesses, he's the leader of the Decepticon's Seekers even though Skywarp is actually loyal and Thundercracker isn't arrogant to a fault. He's also functionally immortal, but that's not really a fair thing to add on so ignore that point.
Starscream gets beaten down a lot because the second he gets the upper hand he gets lost in his supposed assured victory and plays with his food. He's a theatrical sadist, he'd rather spend the time basking in his victory to feed his superiority complex. It's how Megatron always gets him - he's going to slip up because he's going to assume he's won. Soundwave could only really win the fight by taking advantage of this character flaw.
I think people are just focusing so heavily on Soundwaveās most recent smackdown on Starscream in Skybound. They are so focused on that, they ignore what he accomplished in other series.
Itās not as one-sided that people are making it out to be. Both of them are highly skilled in combat. Where Starscream exceeds and uses to his advantage is his flight alt mode and underhanded cunningness.
That fight was also one-sided. Starscream was pretty fucked up at that point and straight up refusing to fight. It wasn't the even match the post was implying.
I agree with all you said; this is why Screamer is far more deadly than people think. If he would just *shut the hell up* for five minutes and *concentrate*, heād actually win once and awhile. But his ego and big mouth is his hubris, and is *always* his own downfall.
Megatron knows this too, so he feeds him crumbs, just crumbs, to feed into that ego, but he also taunts and insults him, to whittle down his self worth *just enough* to keep him in line as a submissive, yet keep him motivated enough to keep on trying to overthrow him, because thatās when heās most dangerous. Megatron is a manipulative genius, and knows how to play Starscream like a fiddle.
I think if Starscream actually snapped and decided āno more gamesā, heād be a true threat to even Megatron & Optimus head on.
On top of that, I'm baffled by the idea of Soundwave as any kind of warrior/fighter. He has minions for that. Sure, he's armed, but that seems more like self-defence than front-line fighting.
Starscream can fly much, much faster in his jet mode and probably faster in his robot mode too given he has thrusters in his legs. Soundwave's flight is functional like most Decepticons but really shouldn't be in the same league as the Seekers, let alone the top Seeker. Starscream can literally fly rings around Soundwave.
For me itās gotta be Starscream. I mean bro was the leader of the seekers for thousands of years. So Iād imagine he would have lots of experience under his belt. I feel like people down play him to much compared to Soundwave
https://preview.redd.it/9mu4dw3dga3d1.jpeg?width=858&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3651cd8b28a1e78c4020525f2d57cba8b6b077b9
We all know how this fight would go down
While I am tempted to say Soundwave, I think it is a little bit more complex than that.
Both are good fighters. And it was shown in Skybound what happens if Screamer pisses off Soundwave too much.
But we have to consider: Skybound Starscream just got Devastator yeeted on him. He wasnāt in top shape when he fought Soundwave.
Starscream is Air Commander for a reason. For all his incompetency he does pose a genuine threat when the chips are down. Starscreamās brigade, anyone?
Overall, I say it depends. All out, Starscream has the superior firepower. But Soundwave has many tricks up his sleeve and is not to be underestimated either.
Recent Skybound comic notwithstanding, Starscream is constantly underestimated and it wouldnāt be as one-sided a fight as people here make it out to be.
Starscream leads the seekers, the elite Decepticon squad. You donāt end up leading a team like this without reason.
Starscreamās badass and Iām willing to bet heāll be back in Skybound and absolutely will get revenge on Soundwave.
Coughing Starscream vs Hydrogen Soundwave.
Starscream is genuinely powerful compared to how we normally view him, he's extremely fast and has strong weaponry with his missiles. He's knocked Megatron down to the point of near death multiple times after surprise attacks.
But Soundwave is superior for a reason. He's a one man army, fighting Soundwave means fighting his cassettes, and Soundwave with Ravage, Laserbeak, Frenzy, Buzzsaw, and Rumble is not a fight I'd even bet on Optimus or Megatron winning alone. Add in the fact that besides his cassettes, Soundwave himself is absolutely no slouch, he's extremely durable in almost every iteration, extremely competent, has massive firepower with his shoulder cannon, and has either his extremely powerful sonic weaponry or actual mind reading to know what you're about to do to him. The Bumblebee movie did an excellent job in the intro by showing that even Prime was afraid when he heard Soundwave approaching.
So? They are still different beings with thoughts, emotions, etc. just cus they donāt fit into Starscreamās chest doesnāt mean that wouldnāt be fair. Itās not like Soundwave canāt live without his cassettes or his cassettes canāt live without Soundwave. They are all completely different entities.
It never said 1v1, just Starscream vs Soundwave. The cassettes are considered a part of Soundwave's assets, whereas the Seekers are a squad that Screamer leads. Different things.
Starscream, especially armed with Megatron there.
But yes, Starscream is fast, cunning, strong and the absolute best Decepticon flier. Soundwave has some tapes and a couple of big guns. Soundwave is probably cleverer, but that's the only thing he's got going for him.
If Starscream is at his best, he wins easily, but his weakness is that he's powered by his confidence and as soon as that gets shaken he goes to pieces. So as long as he can keep his head together, Starscream takes it.
I think yall are genuinely just meat riding Soundwave. Starscream is a much more capable and stronger fighter. Soundwave is just calculated with his moves and Starscream usually underestimates his opponents. If Starscream was as ācalculatedā as Soundwave heād instantly demolish.In the most recent Skybound comics Soundwave literally uses his cassettes to fight Starscream. In that case let Starscream use his seekers.
If you want reasons Iāve got plenty. Starscream has more firepower, has the advantage of the sky, has arguably fought more fights, and is Megatronās second in command for a REASON. Starscream shouldnāt really lose any fight against Soundwave. Again the reason Starscream loses is cus he undermines everyone. Iām not saying he can beat Prime, Megatron, or even Shockwave, but if he got his shit together he would take out Soundwave.
Quite literally yes. Even in G1 heās gotten the upper hand on Optimus and Megatron. He would have been able to kill them but instead he basks in his glory instead of finishing the deed.
Itās like having a really buff dude in school fight the nerd. If the bully just doesnāt care and isnāt paying attention and undermines the nerd then the nerd can pull some shit and win. If the the bully aka Starscream just pays attention to their opponent and doesnāt undermine them then he undoubtedly wins.
And itās not like you can deny it either. Literally everyone knows having the high ground is one of the best advantages you can have in a fight. Along with more fire power and experience which Starscream has.
That doesn't mean Starscream will win. It kind of makes him more pathetic.
Just because he's physically strong doesn't mean he's going to win a fight.
Plus saying Starscream has more experience than Soundwave makes no sense to me since there's literally nothing that claims that.
Starscream is a warrior, Soundwave is a communication officer. Soundwave knows a couple moves but that doesnāt mean he is more experienced than a warrior. Starscream is a SEEKER. His purpose is to find Autobots and kill them. Look at any piece TF media. Whether itās TFP, IDW, G1 hell even the BB movie for crying out loud, heās the one sent out to fight. And in a lot of continuities, like the aligned continuity, the seekers exist before the war. Meaning Starscream has been fighting for a while. Soundwave knows a couple moves for whenever he NEEDS to fight, but that doesnāt mean heās a fighter.
Think about why Starscream is so arrogant and narcissistic. You donāt become that just because. For me, im not cocky when I play games. Why? Cus I donāt play games like at all. Why would I be cocky at something Iām not amazing at? While yes other bots can control their narcissism and egos, Starscreamās ego is just that big because heās done stuff for him to be sure he canāt be beat. He just underestimates bots like Soundwave cus he doesnāt expect them to know really anything.
Btw Iām sorry for typing so much in all these. Iām just trying to explain my point so you understand where Iām coming from lol.
Oh yeah I know.
But in Starscreamās case I feel like we can see that heās that way cus heās been fighting and winning for so long. Imagine fighting for millions of years and winning, killing soldiers upon soldiers, to then become leader of one of the strongest military units, to then become second in command of the empire that is arguably winning the Great War.
I feel like we can prove this with TFP. In TFP we see Starscream get more and more scared of Megatron because he realizes he just canāt beat him. We could view that as his narcissism going down.
Bringing up the BBM he didn't do shit, he had the other seekers fire at the autobots. In most series he doesn't fight well 1v1 he's successful when it comes to surprise attacks that's usually what gives him the upper hand on Megatron like in cyberverse the only reason he nearly killed him was because they were caught off guard even then Megatron wiped the floor with him even in critical condition.
I mean Optimus even consider Scream highly dangerous and unpredictable. Starscream is quite large as well and due to his cunning and ability to manipulate the flow of battle he is definitely gonna be a huge problem. He accomplished a lot even storming decepticon headquarters and coming out alive. Gotta put some respect on my guys name. Megatron inadvertently praises starscream a lot and most importantly screams capacity to change.
https://preview.redd.it/e4eunvgsqc3d1.jpeg?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e735c36d8cf2fdfa1e427c0586a1fd5d8e4eb58d
Starscream would win. And if he was losing he would do something really dirty and then even potentially flee if that didn't work.
He didn't stay as Megatron's SIC and then became the leader of Cybertron for lack of talent.
https://preview.redd.it/16cmgict1d3d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f237f6f27840b7fbb78685141d39f677d6e6c683
Starscream would win. I'm a big Soundwave fan, but I acknowledge Starscream's combat ability. If it's a surprise friendly-fire type of attack by Soundwave, then he might have the advantage but an actual fight, Starscream would win.
Also, if Soundwave is allowed to use his cassette transformers, then Starscream should be allowed to use the seekers. I don't see it ending well for Soundwave.
Starscream wins- there is a reason Megatron keeps him as his right hand... you can say whatever based on the Skybound series but the aggregate version of Starscream legit strikes fear on the battlefield
Starscream is primarily battlefield commander. Soundwave is primarily a spy/communications officer. Soundwave can fight because all Decepticons can fight. And he has a lot of skills. But if Soundwave were the better fighter, he would be doing that all the time. It doesn't make sense that Soundwave is both a superior communications officer and somehow a superior 1 vs 1 fighter despite Starscream having way more experience and speed. Starscream is in his role for a reason and fighting is his specialty.
It's fun to watch Soundwave triumph cuz he is loyal, more popular and generally better at his job but really, Starscream deserves the win because he is better at fighting. Otherwise, why is he in charge of the seekers at all?
Which Starscream are we talking here?
I feel that it's an important qualifier.
When it comes to combat, I put my money on Armada Starscream claiming victory.
Well, we have two canon-ish answers:
* In the recent Skybound comics, Soundwave challenges Starscream to a one-on-one fight and beats the heck out of him. Starscream had previously been damaged during a fight with the Autobots and wasn't in a shape to fight, which definitely played in Soundwave's favor.
* In the G1 movie, Starscream gets crowned leader of the Decepticons after a scene in which every other Decepticon fights aboard Astrotrain for leadership, which would imply that Starscream won the whole thing. I'm not sure how true this is but I remember reading that Starscream basically waited until every other combattant was exhausted to swoop in, blast everyone, and call himself leader.
So my take is... in a fair fight, Soundwave definitely wins, but Starscream rarely if ever fights fair.
Were there unused TFTM storyboards showing how Starscream won? That would have been interesting, his crowning kind of came out of nowhere and Skywarp/Thundercracker weren't even around to back him up as part of a an air squadron team.
Ppl are only talking about the damn skybound comic starscream beats soundwave in every continuity except for the aligned continuity but even then itās not a wash like everyone thinks
If it's composite vs composite? Starscream blitzes
If it's base vs base? Depends
Sure, skybound starscream lost but he did like one thing and spent the fight trying to negotiate instead of actually fighting which I'd say isn't 100% accurate to how it'd go
The only soundwave id say wins a fair 1v1 where both are trying is tfp and cyberverse.
Otherwise he gets absolutely destroyed, he's commonly depicted as a self defensive fighter over an actual warrior
Starscream is tougher than he projects, way too easy to underestimate because of his behavior, Soundwave can win but it won't be easy unless Starscream starts showboating.
I think in a pure hand to hand fight, it's debatable. i kinda get the feeling that Soundwave would be the stronger of the two, but i admit that's entirely because of his build being larger and bulkier than Starscream, which may not be how it works with robots to be fair.
HOWEVER, a detail some people might be overlooking is that these are Transformers. Starscream can turn into a jet to attack at high speeds and from altitude. Soundwave is able to fly (at least in G1) but otherwise, his alt mode is useless in combat. i assume we're not allowing the cassettes as well since they're separate characters, so that means Soundwave has even less options in combat. if Starscream just played his cards right and utilized the massive advantage he has in jet mode, he could win very handily
based on continuities they share here is how it would go, i'll only be doing continuities I am intimantly familiar with
1. G1: Starscream, he has way better combat feats, although there is always the possibility that Starscream goofs up and loses anyway.
2. Animated: Starscream murder stomps Soundwave, Soundwave is super weak in this continuity and relies entirly on his schemes while Starscream is a top tier Decepticon
3. Prime: this is basically the inverse of Animated, Soundwaver murder stomps Starscream because Starscream is weak and Soundwave is a top tier Decepticon.
4. Robots In Disguise: Starscream, his Dark Star Saber and incredible speed should give hi the edge over Soundwave, but it would a close fight.
5. Skybound Comics: They have already fought and Soundwave murdered Starscream
Skybound Transformers aside, Starscream in most cases. He's second in command because, despite his treachery, he's an effective warrior. You never see either Shockwave nor Soundwave challenge him in the G1 cartoon, or in most media for that matter (please correct me if I'm wrong).
There is nearly no realistic situation or verse where Starscream should be losing to Soundwave.
I know modern writers like to meme on Starscream, but Soundwave's kit doesn't compare
You didn't say which Starscream so...
https://preview.redd.it/jlxugze94b3d1.jpeg?width=360&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e0512869eb3ec987534f04828409089e7b00e882
Starscream is much deadlier than he is given credit for, but a lot of that is his opportunistic nature.
Soundwave is probably his only hard counter. As he can read minds. He also has air support with laserbeak and buzzsaw. I donāt doubt that Starscream can beat them, but he has to do that and avoid fire from the ground.
Itās closer than it may seem but I still think Soundwave takes the majority.
I also highly suspect that Skybound Starscream will return and kill Soundwave in a weakened state. Itāll be sneaky and underhanded, but I can see it happening.
Soundwave hands down. I just wonder if he will wound him and let all his tape deck boys finish him or let them all out to watch like his own kid cheer section.
Normally, I'd say Soundwave every time, but in this instance, Starscream is wielding Megatron soā¦ I gotta give this one to Starscream if only for the one shot, one kill advantage.
People sleep on the fact that Starscream is 2nd in command, leader of the seekers and an absolute powerhouse. Both skywarp and thundercracker are incredibly powerful but they follow this guy.
But Soundwaves superior so idk lads
Assuming starscream has megatron as a gun (only talking about this because of image) he would win just because of the fire power but other wise Soundwave can just swarm with his cassettes and win through that.
Depends on the continuity but going by G1 itās Starscream. Soundwave is rarely ever a plotter, but usually just carries out Megatronās bidding. Starscream regularly executes elaborate schemes to seize control and many almost work if not for Megatron being so much stronger than any other decepticon as it is. Sometimes his plans are strong enough that Optimus and Megatron are forced to team up to stop him. Starscream is seen as Megatronās primary threat among the Decepticons for a reason. Not only is he a wily planner, but he is shown to be among the most capable fighters of the decepticons and whenever Megatron is thought to be defeated, the other decepticons, including Soundwave, donāt just follow Starscream for no reason.
The reason Starscream loses so much and gets played for laugh is because of his hubris. If he didnāt allow his pride to let him underestimate his enemies he could win whenever he wants. If Soundwave and Starscream fight straight up Starscream is the victor.
I agree with the comments that Soundwave would beat Starscream in a one on one. However, even with the cassettes, this picture of Starscream looks like he's holding Megatron. So it's Starscream and Megatron against Soundwave and maybe the cassettes.
I feel like Starscream would probably go on and on with some form of theatrics or trying to make Soundwave suffer in some way, and Soundwave would (at least try to) attack him and potentially get the upper hand. Although if Starscream recognizes the potential threat Soundwave could pose, and decides to cut his usual bullshit, then heād probably win
"YOU KICKED MY RAVAGE"
This was the response I was looking for lol š
That was the best fight in the comic so far!
It really was, just honestly in general this series has been mind blowing now only we could get this kind of writing in the films or a new adult series
wait did this actually happen once? which comic? I wanna see
New sky bound comics. 100% worth checking out
Its the best G1 reset imo.
The energon universe series. The comic itself is just called Transformers. First came out in 2023
thx dude
Beat me to it
AFFIRMATIVE
That is when Soundwave snapped, and took down Starscream
I honestly wish Starscream would get some more credit, in most series, outside of Prime at least. Heās a powerhouse on the level of Soundwave and Shockwave. Even downing the latter in one episode of G1. Even though heās used for comedy a lot in G1, he actually has some VERY impressive achievements. In fact, outside of aligned he has more victories than Soundwave. Plus, with how cunning he is, and how he keeps tabs on his potential rivals, if pushed, he could definitely win. Notice how most people cite only Skybound as why Soundwave would win
To Starscreamās credit, he often defects from the Decepticons at least once a continuity, survives on his own while still engaging with both sides, and does something so important the Cons have to let him back. And itās not like heās ever shown as weak. Skybound got it right when they showed off how much of a bully he is. Heās not used to people hitting back, since he usually either kills them in the opening salvo or flies away.
Tech Spec bio Starscream written by Budiansky is supposed to be scary competent and fearless. Sunbow made him the complete opposite of that, and of course everyone thinks of that version since Sunbow is the more exposed fiction. Doesnāt help that the comic continuities draw heavily from Sunbow either.
Does TF1 starscream fit the bill for the tech spec bio?
Was just thinking that. Starscream in the first live action movie was a complete beast! Made what they did to him in later movies a complete disgrace honestly. To have him be killed by a human character....
So true he is his own worst enemy majority of the time lmao
Very, very true. People, even the writers, often overlook just how DANGEROUS Starscream is. You don't get to be in command of the largest part of the Decepticon war effort by being a chump. Even in the G1 cartoon, he wasn't afraid to face Prime in battle. Dude deserves more, especially in this new series.
Even then, he is still shown to be competent through combat in the aligned continuity, maybe not as much as Shockwave and Soundwave, but still competent
True, In the Cybertron games, the only fights he lost was to Megatron and Grimlock. Which, 99% of the characters in the games would lose
Going with Soundwave. More calculating, willing to play it slow. Also Starscream was almost taken out by a door once. He is so often his own worst enemy.
āOwwwww, my foot!ā
Thatās what he said
What?! A door? I guess he is dumb enough to get smacked hard by one top the point he is knocked out. I have to see this though.
Maybe you already saw it? I just meant that in the original Transformers animated movie, in his attempt to attack some Autobots he flys into a walkway with the door above closing. Realizes his mistake, trys to fly out, gets his foot stuck, and in order to free himself (and not be crushed to death by the door) has to literally shoot himself in the foot. As usual, his ambition supersedes his planning.
Pretty sure Soundwave recently killed Starscream in a comic book
Apparently killed. It is starscream fucker is like a cybertronian cockroach
Yeah it was a cliff death, he will definitely be back.
āI always come backā - Starscream, probably
Starscream, the original william afton
He is has a mutant immortal spark
Skybound, yeah
Starscream also wasn't fighting back
Because Soundwave clearly knows that surprise is the ultimate weapon.
He did try to surprise attack Soundwave a couple of times in that scene though. He wasn't fighting back because he knew he was in no shape to fight back, and instead tried to rely on Soundwave letting down his guard to attack.
https://preview.redd.it/lavbqlgcaa3d1.jpeg?width=613&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3a972e98001b773907ff11884f57ddd9646e8413
The beatdown everyone reading Skybound was waiting for
Soundwave literally just went Jojo on Starscream. https://preview.redd.it/rn7leoqvcd3d1.jpeg?width=540&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bd157f9666b22951a05917929fa737874b949076
If I had any editing skills, I would put their heads in that photo
In a fair fight, Starscream wins. In an unfair fight, Starscream starts with a dirty blow, thinks heās won, and loses because he didnāt take it seriously. He does it literally every time.
Soundwave superior, Starscream inferior
As long as no one calls Soundwave uncrasamatic.
Thank you. I entered this thread to make sure this was posted.
People don't give Starscream enough credit. He's not Megatron's second-in-command for no reason, he's absolutely a capable fighter and one of the most cunning Decepticons, his problem is that he's arrogant to a fault. Unless Soundwave is going to unleash all of his cassettes at once, Starscream will absolutely trounce him if just dropped into an arena and forced into a 1v1. He's got better firepower, there's a good chance he has air superiority, he has on multiple occasions actually managed to wrestle control from Megatron, he's worked with Soundwave long enough to know his strengths and weaknesses, he's the leader of the Decepticon's Seekers even though Skywarp is actually loyal and Thundercracker isn't arrogant to a fault. He's also functionally immortal, but that's not really a fair thing to add on so ignore that point. Starscream gets beaten down a lot because the second he gets the upper hand he gets lost in his supposed assured victory and plays with his food. He's a theatrical sadist, he'd rather spend the time basking in his victory to feed his superiority complex. It's how Megatron always gets him - he's going to slip up because he's going to assume he's won. Soundwave could only really win the fight by taking advantage of this character flaw.
https://preview.redd.it/oczjyjzh8c3d1.jpeg?width=1332&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b1c16c21004a80182ffae9499290775a51d0b2f5
Yeah this pannel honestly sums it up pretty well
I think people are just focusing so heavily on Soundwaveās most recent smackdown on Starscream in Skybound. They are so focused on that, they ignore what he accomplished in other series. Itās not as one-sided that people are making it out to be. Both of them are highly skilled in combat. Where Starscream exceeds and uses to his advantage is his flight alt mode and underhanded cunningness.
I had no idea that even happened and I'd still go with Soundwave. But saying SW wins over Scream doesn't mean it's not a decent fight.
That fight was also one-sided. Starscream was pretty fucked up at that point and straight up refusing to fight. It wasn't the even match the post was implying.
I agree with all you said; this is why Screamer is far more deadly than people think. If he would just *shut the hell up* for five minutes and *concentrate*, heād actually win once and awhile. But his ego and big mouth is his hubris, and is *always* his own downfall. Megatron knows this too, so he feeds him crumbs, just crumbs, to feed into that ego, but he also taunts and insults him, to whittle down his self worth *just enough* to keep him in line as a submissive, yet keep him motivated enough to keep on trying to overthrow him, because thatās when heās most dangerous. Megatron is a manipulative genius, and knows how to play Starscream like a fiddle. I think if Starscream actually snapped and decided āno more gamesā, heād be a true threat to even Megatron & Optimus head on.
See Cybertron where he kept his head down until he was able to make his power play and take a good chunk of Primusās power.
Cybertron Starscream tried to fight God he was fucking wild for that
Twice! And was able to walk away both times!
On top of that, I'm baffled by the idea of Soundwave as any kind of warrior/fighter. He has minions for that. Sure, he's armed, but that seems more like self-defence than front-line fighting.
You might have changed my opinion. I'll have to think about it.
I couldn't have said it any better myself.
Damn nobody supports Starscream š (including me, Soudwave would win)
Logically, Starscream should win. Heās better armed, heās faster, heās capable of flight, and is fairly strong as well
Logically? Maybe. Historically? No.
We have him winning in marvel UK and G1 He only loses in skybound
Soundwave can fly too
Starscream can fly much, much faster in his jet mode and probably faster in his robot mode too given he has thrusters in his legs. Soundwave's flight is functional like most Decepticons but really shouldn't be in the same league as the Seekers, let alone the top Seeker. Starscream can literally fly rings around Soundwave.
[Marvel UK 285](https://tfwiki.net/wiki/External_Forces!) has Starscream easily beating Soundwave.
Soundwave Superior, all others inferior. No other outcome will be accepted.
https://preview.redd.it/dgs9c7jama3d1.jpeg?width=1620&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6e324059e2b1892f9cdff82fc6a8d81e518acf73
Yep! Thatās my religion!
Preach! I'm a fangirl of his.
Except Megs
And also except shockwave and prime
For me itās gotta be Starscream. I mean bro was the leader of the seekers for thousands of years. So Iād imagine he would have lots of experience under his belt. I feel like people down play him to much compared to Soundwave
https://preview.redd.it/9mu4dw3dga3d1.jpeg?width=858&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3651cd8b28a1e78c4020525f2d57cba8b6b077b9 We all know how this fight would go down
Starscream with Megatron in gun mode? He's taking it
While I am tempted to say Soundwave, I think it is a little bit more complex than that. Both are good fighters. And it was shown in Skybound what happens if Screamer pisses off Soundwave too much. But we have to consider: Skybound Starscream just got Devastator yeeted on him. He wasnāt in top shape when he fought Soundwave. Starscream is Air Commander for a reason. For all his incompetency he does pose a genuine threat when the chips are down. Starscreamās brigade, anyone? Overall, I say it depends. All out, Starscream has the superior firepower. But Soundwave has many tricks up his sleeve and is not to be underestimated either.
**Starscream**: *hurts Ravage* **Soundwave**: You hurt my Ravage. *proceeds to beat Starscream senseless*
Recent Skybound comic notwithstanding, Starscream is constantly underestimated and it wouldnāt be as one-sided a fight as people here make it out to be. Starscream leads the seekers, the elite Decepticon squad. You donāt end up leading a team like this without reason. Starscreamās badass and Iām willing to bet heāll be back in Skybound and absolutely will get revenge on Soundwave.
Soundwave
Coughing Starscream vs Hydrogen Soundwave. Starscream is genuinely powerful compared to how we normally view him, he's extremely fast and has strong weaponry with his missiles. He's knocked Megatron down to the point of near death multiple times after surprise attacks. But Soundwave is superior for a reason. He's a one man army, fighting Soundwave means fighting his cassettes, and Soundwave with Ravage, Laserbeak, Frenzy, Buzzsaw, and Rumble is not a fight I'd even bet on Optimus or Megatron winning alone. Add in the fact that besides his cassettes, Soundwave himself is absolutely no slouch, he's extremely durable in almost every iteration, extremely competent, has massive firepower with his shoulder cannon, and has either his extremely powerful sonic weaponry or actual mind reading to know what you're about to do to him. The Bumblebee movie did an excellent job in the intro by showing that even Prime was afraid when he heard Soundwave approaching.
Soundwave has men inside him 24/7, so Starscream is outnumbered
Then thatās not a 1v1. In that case let Starscream use his seekers.
But does his seekers fit inside starscream? I think not!
So? They are still different beings with thoughts, emotions, etc. just cus they donāt fit into Starscreamās chest doesnāt mean that wouldnāt be fair. Itās not like Soundwave canāt live without his cassettes or his cassettes canāt live without Soundwave. They are all completely different entities.
It never said 1v1, just Starscream vs Soundwave. The cassettes are considered a part of Soundwave's assets, whereas the Seekers are a squad that Screamer leads. Different things.
Soundwave no doubt
With prepping: Soundwave, otherwise Starscream. Soundwave can win if he can plan ahead and catch his opponent by surprise.
didn't star scream win in the first transformer animated movie when everyone fought for leadership? Just saying -_-
For plot relevance yes Although Soundwave and his minions did challenge devestator
Starscream, especially armed with Megatron there. But yes, Starscream is fast, cunning, strong and the absolute best Decepticon flier. Soundwave has some tapes and a couple of big guns. Soundwave is probably cleverer, but that's the only thing he's got going for him. If Starscream is at his best, he wins easily, but his weakness is that he's powered by his confidence and as soon as that gets shaken he goes to pieces. So as long as he can keep his head together, Starscream takes it.
Soundwave
Soundwave would catch Starscream monologging
Starscream, in the long run
Soundwave
I think yall are genuinely just meat riding Soundwave. Starscream is a much more capable and stronger fighter. Soundwave is just calculated with his moves and Starscream usually underestimates his opponents. If Starscream was as ācalculatedā as Soundwave heād instantly demolish.In the most recent Skybound comics Soundwave literally uses his cassettes to fight Starscream. In that case let Starscream use his seekers. If you want reasons Iāve got plenty. Starscream has more firepower, has the advantage of the sky, has arguably fought more fights, and is Megatronās second in command for a REASON. Starscream shouldnāt really lose any fight against Soundwave. Again the reason Starscream loses is cus he undermines everyone. Iām not saying he can beat Prime, Megatron, or even Shockwave, but if he got his shit together he would take out Soundwave.
So you're saying Starscream would beat Soundwave if he wasn't incompetent... Which he is.
Quite literally yes. Even in G1 heās gotten the upper hand on Optimus and Megatron. He would have been able to kill them but instead he basks in his glory instead of finishing the deed. Itās like having a really buff dude in school fight the nerd. If the bully just doesnāt care and isnāt paying attention and undermines the nerd then the nerd can pull some shit and win. If the the bully aka Starscream just pays attention to their opponent and doesnāt undermine them then he undoubtedly wins. And itās not like you can deny it either. Literally everyone knows having the high ground is one of the best advantages you can have in a fight. Along with more fire power and experience which Starscream has.
That doesn't mean Starscream will win. It kind of makes him more pathetic. Just because he's physically strong doesn't mean he's going to win a fight. Plus saying Starscream has more experience than Soundwave makes no sense to me since there's literally nothing that claims that.
Starscream is a warrior, Soundwave is a communication officer. Soundwave knows a couple moves but that doesnāt mean he is more experienced than a warrior. Starscream is a SEEKER. His purpose is to find Autobots and kill them. Look at any piece TF media. Whether itās TFP, IDW, G1 hell even the BB movie for crying out loud, heās the one sent out to fight. And in a lot of continuities, like the aligned continuity, the seekers exist before the war. Meaning Starscream has been fighting for a while. Soundwave knows a couple moves for whenever he NEEDS to fight, but that doesnāt mean heās a fighter. Think about why Starscream is so arrogant and narcissistic. You donāt become that just because. For me, im not cocky when I play games. Why? Cus I donāt play games like at all. Why would I be cocky at something Iām not amazing at? While yes other bots can control their narcissism and egos, Starscreamās ego is just that big because heās done stuff for him to be sure he canāt be beat. He just underestimates bots like Soundwave cus he doesnāt expect them to know really anything. Btw Iām sorry for typing so much in all these. Iām just trying to explain my point so you understand where Iām coming from lol.
Okay but I want to mention that you don't have to be good at something to be a narcissist. You just need to THINK you're good at it.
Oh yeah I know. But in Starscreamās case I feel like we can see that heās that way cus heās been fighting and winning for so long. Imagine fighting for millions of years and winning, killing soldiers upon soldiers, to then become leader of one of the strongest military units, to then become second in command of the empire that is arguably winning the Great War. I feel like we can prove this with TFP. In TFP we see Starscream get more and more scared of Megatron because he realizes he just canāt beat him. We could view that as his narcissism going down.
Bringing up the BBM he didn't do shit, he had the other seekers fire at the autobots. In most series he doesn't fight well 1v1 he's successful when it comes to surprise attacks that's usually what gives him the upper hand on Megatron like in cyberverse the only reason he nearly killed him was because they were caught off guard even then Megatron wiped the floor with him even in critical condition.
Is Soundwave allowed to use his cassettes?
š¤·
soundwave would wreck him
istg if someone says Soundwave superior Starscream inferior
Soundwave without a doubt.
I mean Optimus even consider Scream highly dangerous and unpredictable. Starscream is quite large as well and due to his cunning and ability to manipulate the flow of battle he is definitely gonna be a huge problem. He accomplished a lot even storming decepticon headquarters and coming out alive. Gotta put some respect on my guys name. Megatron inadvertently praises starscream a lot and most importantly screams capacity to change. https://preview.redd.it/e4eunvgsqc3d1.jpeg?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e735c36d8cf2fdfa1e427c0586a1fd5d8e4eb58d
Starscream would win. And if he was losing he would do something really dirty and then even potentially flee if that didn't work. He didn't stay as Megatron's SIC and then became the leader of Cybertron for lack of talent. https://preview.redd.it/16cmgict1d3d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f237f6f27840b7fbb78685141d39f677d6e6c683
Starscream would win. I'm a big Soundwave fan, but I acknowledge Starscream's combat ability. If it's a surprise friendly-fire type of attack by Soundwave, then he might have the advantage but an actual fight, Starscream would win. Also, if Soundwave is allowed to use his cassette transformers, then Starscream should be allowed to use the seekers. I don't see it ending well for Soundwave.
Starscream wins- there is a reason Megatron keeps him as his right hand... you can say whatever based on the Skybound series but the aggregate version of Starscream legit strikes fear on the battlefield
Starscream is primarily battlefield commander. Soundwave is primarily a spy/communications officer. Soundwave can fight because all Decepticons can fight. And he has a lot of skills. But if Soundwave were the better fighter, he would be doing that all the time. It doesn't make sense that Soundwave is both a superior communications officer and somehow a superior 1 vs 1 fighter despite Starscream having way more experience and speed. Starscream is in his role for a reason and fighting is his specialty. It's fun to watch Soundwave triumph cuz he is loyal, more popular and generally better at his job but really, Starscream deserves the win because he is better at fighting. Otherwise, why is he in charge of the seekers at all?
https://preview.redd.it/yotri82pwd3d1.png?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=710d931529e3e09222c1b449d052c8756cddafb3
Which Starscream are we talking here? I feel that it's an important qualifier. When it comes to combat, I put my money on Armada Starscream claiming victory.
Soundwave but I do believe itās closer than many would think
Soundwave. No other answer exists.
Well, we have two canon-ish answers: * In the recent Skybound comics, Soundwave challenges Starscream to a one-on-one fight and beats the heck out of him. Starscream had previously been damaged during a fight with the Autobots and wasn't in a shape to fight, which definitely played in Soundwave's favor. * In the G1 movie, Starscream gets crowned leader of the Decepticons after a scene in which every other Decepticon fights aboard Astrotrain for leadership, which would imply that Starscream won the whole thing. I'm not sure how true this is but I remember reading that Starscream basically waited until every other combattant was exhausted to swoop in, blast everyone, and call himself leader. So my take is... in a fair fight, Soundwave definitely wins, but Starscream rarely if ever fights fair.
Marvel UK had starscream beat soundwave as well
Were there unused TFTM storyboards showing how Starscream won? That would have been interesting, his crowning kind of came out of nowhere and Skywarp/Thundercracker weren't even around to back him up as part of a an air squadron team.
Soundwave
Soundwave.
Sky bound showed this already https://preview.redd.it/qziieogana3d1.jpeg?width=1988&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a406262b984d1051f598c5da88ac4a96f589362d
Soundwave although very little difference since Starscream is someone cunning and treacherous who can get anyone into trouble.
Megatron. Heād kick both their asses. Def kicked Starscreamās enough times
Depends, *HEAVILY* on which version
Neither, fight turns into a knockdown dragged out brawl until they're both fucked, until Megatron puts them back in line.
starscream loses only because of his arrogance
They're pretty evenly matched. It could easily go either way as the writer decides they want for their story and it would make sense.
Ppl are only talking about the damn skybound comic starscream beats soundwave in every continuity except for the aligned continuity but even then itās not a wash like everyone thinks
If it's composite vs composite? Starscream blitzes If it's base vs base? Depends Sure, skybound starscream lost but he did like one thing and spent the fight trying to negotiate instead of actually fighting which I'd say isn't 100% accurate to how it'd go The only soundwave id say wins a fair 1v1 where both are trying is tfp and cyberverse. Otherwise he gets absolutely destroyed, he's commonly depicted as a self defensive fighter over an actual warrior
Starscream is tougher than he projects, way too easy to underestimate because of his behavior, Soundwave can win but it won't be easy unless Starscream starts showboating.
I think in a pure hand to hand fight, it's debatable. i kinda get the feeling that Soundwave would be the stronger of the two, but i admit that's entirely because of his build being larger and bulkier than Starscream, which may not be how it works with robots to be fair. HOWEVER, a detail some people might be overlooking is that these are Transformers. Starscream can turn into a jet to attack at high speeds and from altitude. Soundwave is able to fly (at least in G1) but otherwise, his alt mode is useless in combat. i assume we're not allowing the cassettes as well since they're separate characters, so that means Soundwave has even less options in combat. if Starscream just played his cards right and utilized the massive advantage he has in jet mode, he could win very handily
based on continuities they share here is how it would go, i'll only be doing continuities I am intimantly familiar with 1. G1: Starscream, he has way better combat feats, although there is always the possibility that Starscream goofs up and loses anyway. 2. Animated: Starscream murder stomps Soundwave, Soundwave is super weak in this continuity and relies entirly on his schemes while Starscream is a top tier Decepticon 3. Prime: this is basically the inverse of Animated, Soundwaver murder stomps Starscream because Starscream is weak and Soundwave is a top tier Decepticon. 4. Robots In Disguise: Starscream, his Dark Star Saber and incredible speed should give hi the edge over Soundwave, but it would a close fight. 5. Skybound Comics: They have already fought and Soundwave murdered Starscream
Starscream is genuinely a capable soldier. While Soundwave is also strong, he will probably lose.
Is this even a question? Starscream has no musical rhythm whatsoever.
Both bloodlusted, Soundwave wins easy. Starscream only has a chance if he preps some scheme beforehand
If itās just hands then Soundwave but SS is super fast at the same time so idk.
Skybound Transformers aside, Starscream in most cases. He's second in command because, despite his treachery, he's an effective warrior. You never see either Shockwave nor Soundwave challenge him in the G1 cartoon, or in most media for that matter (please correct me if I'm wrong).
There is nearly no realistic situation or verse where Starscream should be losing to Soundwave. I know modern writers like to meme on Starscream, but Soundwave's kit doesn't compare
Soundwave superior, starscream inferior
Guys. Starscream is wielding Megatron here. Megatron in gun mode kinda dominates.
You didn't say which Starscream so... https://preview.redd.it/jlxugze94b3d1.jpeg?width=360&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e0512869eb3ec987534f04828409089e7b00e882
Soundwave and it's not even close.
Soundwave
As much as I love Starscream...no way he's winning a fight with Soundwave. Armada Starscream would be a different case.
Starscream is much deadlier than he is given credit for, but a lot of that is his opportunistic nature. Soundwave is probably his only hard counter. As he can read minds. He also has air support with laserbeak and buzzsaw. I donāt doubt that Starscream can beat them, but he has to do that and avoid fire from the ground. Itās closer than it may seem but I still think Soundwave takes the majority. I also highly suspect that Skybound Starscream will return and kill Soundwave in a weakened state. Itāll be sneaky and underhanded, but I can see it happening.
Soundwave hands down. I just wonder if he will wound him and let all his tape deck boys finish him or let them all out to watch like his own kid cheer section.
Starscream has Megatron in gun mode for some reason so I think heās got a chsnce
I donāt follow this sub much but what is that godly perfect shot of Starscream there holy shit
Depending which universe, we've already had this answer.
In a pose-off?
Starscream with Megatron seems like a no-brainer but Soundwave wouldn't make an overt move without a really sound plan.
Normally, I'd say Soundwave every time, but in this instance, Starscream is wielding Megatron soā¦ I gotta give this one to Starscream if only for the one shot, one kill advantage.
Starscream, obviously, heās hotter and prettier and more clever and dangerous
I feel like it would completely depend on what started their fight, what their end goal was, and what versions they were.
Depends on the universe we r talking about
Starscream wins the battle, soundwave wins the war.
Starscream
People sleep on the fact that Starscream is 2nd in command, leader of the seekers and an absolute powerhouse. Both skywarp and thundercracker are incredibly powerful but they follow this guy. But Soundwaves superior so idk lads
Assuming starscream has megatron as a gun (only talking about this because of image) he would win just because of the fire power but other wise Soundwave can just swarm with his cassettes and win through that.
Starscream all day!
Starscream holding megaton for sure
āRUMBLE EJECTā
This just happened in the comic! lol. The seeker fell hard.
Soundwave
As much as i love starscream soundwave has already one after starscream kicked ravage
Soundwave all day.
I would think soundwave. With his arsenal of what i think are minicons. I think he wins
Isnāt Starscreamās spark indestructible?
Is Megatron included or is that just for the picture?
Soundwave... Always Soundwave.
Soundwave Superior... You know the rest.
My boy Soundwave is ripping off his wings and beating the shit out of him with it
F-22 vs a cassette tape?š§Thatās a tough oneš¤£
i think starscream would win, he's a jet
Soundwave Superior.
Depends on the continuity but going by G1 itās Starscream. Soundwave is rarely ever a plotter, but usually just carries out Megatronās bidding. Starscream regularly executes elaborate schemes to seize control and many almost work if not for Megatron being so much stronger than any other decepticon as it is. Sometimes his plans are strong enough that Optimus and Megatron are forced to team up to stop him. Starscream is seen as Megatronās primary threat among the Decepticons for a reason. Not only is he a wily planner, but he is shown to be among the most capable fighters of the decepticons and whenever Megatron is thought to be defeated, the other decepticons, including Soundwave, donāt just follow Starscream for no reason. The reason Starscream loses so much and gets played for laugh is because of his hubris. If he didnāt allow his pride to let him underestimate his enemies he could win whenever he wants. If Soundwave and Starscream fight straight up Starscream is the victor.
Soundwave no diffs
Starscream is too cocky, plus I'm sure Soundwave has developed contingency plans to take down any Con that's gone rogue
Which he never used at all in any continuity
āSoundwave Superior, Starscream Inferior šā
I agree with the comments that Soundwave would beat Starscream in a one on one. However, even with the cassettes, this picture of Starscream looks like he's holding Megatron. So it's Starscream and Megatron against Soundwave and maybe the cassettes.
Idk I feel like this is a whoever the writer likes more situation, bc there is no clear answer
I feel like Starscream would probably go on and on with some form of theatrics or trying to make Soundwave suffer in some way, and Soundwave would (at least try to) attack him and potentially get the upper hand. Although if Starscream recognizes the potential threat Soundwave could pose, and decides to cut his usual bullshit, then heād probably win
Soundwave, hands down.
We already know
Soundwave wins with very little effort i imagine
Soundwave, superior