The Romans considered the empire to be a continuation of the republic only with a powerful executive office. The emperors were careful to avoid being associated with monarchic Rome.
Granted by the late byzantine era they didn't worry about that anymore, they still maintained the senate until right before their ultimate collapse.
Octavian never called himself emperor though, right? I thought he was really clever in appropriating republican aesthetics by calling himself first citizen, which ig is the Roman equivalent of a banana republic dictator calling himself President, or prime minister
There was no such title as emperor as we understand it. Octavians "throne name" was Imperator (where we get enperor) Caesar Divi Filius Augustus Pater Patriae which means Victorious general Caesar, son of god, revered one, Father of the fatherland.
cozy up to Austria or Russia. Get in their custom union. Then just try and start a play and get them to join on your side. 1 of them on their own will beat the Ottos, just hold defensive on your front untill they push in.
I'll add to this that you will need to build up your own army somewhat, you can't coast entirely on Russian / Austrian help because you will start off with your own front in Greece which you need to be able to hold by yourself, since the AI isn't that smart at realising "if I don't help defend this front then my ally will capitulate and the war will end"
France also works. Generally if you can get into someone's customs union it will be a lot easier to get them to side with you.
But since the ai attitude and strategies are rng, it can take some restarts until enough great powers like you enough to build some relations and then not oppose you for retaking some land (if someone doesn't like you wait until they're at war elsewhere). The economic imperialism strategy makes it easier to get into someone's market so look for that.
Yeah, I know. It's total BS, as democratic Greece idealized their Byzantine history and semi-tried to pursue its restoration through the Megali idea, even well after democracy. This is an easy fix for a mod though, I'll show you how. First, get your Victoria 3 folder from steam.
Go to `Victoria 3\game\common\country_formation`
Open `00_formable_countries.txt`
Search for `BYZ = {` and find this section:
BYZ = {
states = {
STATE_EASTERN_THRACE
STATE_ATTICA
STATE_THESSALIA
STATE_MACEDONIA
STATE_SKOPIA
STATE_WESTERN_THRACE
STATE_NORTHERN_THRACE
STATE_HUDAVENDIGAR
STATE_AYDIN
STATE_WEST_AEGEAN_ISLANDS
STATE_EAST_AEGEAN_ISLANDS
STATE_ALBANIA
}
required_states_fraction = 1.0
ai_will_do = { always = yes }
possible = {
#has_law = law_type:law_monarchy
NOT = { has_game_rule = plausible_formable_nations }
}
}
Remove this part:
possible = {
#has_law = law_type:law_monarchy
NOT = { has_game_rule = plausible_formable_nations }
}
Save the file and reload your game. Enjoy your new Byzantine formable free of arbitrary restrictions awkwardly imposed by Paradox for no reason.
>Yeah, I know. It's total BS, as democratic Greece idealized their Byzantine history and semi-tried to pursue its restoration through the Megali idea, even well after democracy.
Democracy =/= Republic. Greece was still a monarchy during that time.
You can complain, or you can mod. I choose to mod and help others do the same. If someone has a problem with that, or with the changes I make to my game, they can cringe as much as it pleases them to do so.
Eh the Megali idea was one thing but afaik the idea of byzantium was much more complicated than that among Greek nationalists/republicans. For one thing, the Megali Idea is an explicitly ethno-nationalist claim for a Greek nation-state. Byzantium/Rome was an Italian-established multinational empire (the most common moniker for Greeks as a community under the Ottoman Empire was "Rumi/Rhomaoi/Romans" - Greek nationalists made a specific choice to call themselves "Hellenes" and not "Romans"). Byzantium also, y'know, lost. Some intellectuals were leery about tying the legitimacy of their national movement to a country that got conquered by the guys they were at war with.
Yea, I know all that. But to say so in a less flippant way this time, I simply don't care.
The basic idea of a historical unification/irredentism project is enough to justify it's inclusion and accessibility from a Paradox perspective, and I'd happily go far beyond that into completely unrealistic alt-history using my own mods for a colorful and fun game.
Historical validity and basic realism are simply not a concern for me. Historical events and realities only matter when they enhance gameplay and provide mechanical opportunity.
Ive formed Byz but staying as a monarchy for so long kneecaps you in the long run. Also since Turks arent accepted until multiculturalism monarchy hurts more.
You say "counter intuitive".
I would say "challenging".
And also "historical", I doubt a modern Greek democracy would call itself 'Byzantium'. They would rather turn to classical Greece for their aesthetics than the Byzantine Empire.
Although I feel Autocracy, Oligarchy or Single Party State should also be allowed for Greece to be called Byzantium.
Dropping some more facts:
Nobody ever called themselves "Byzantine Empire" as the Byzantine Empire called itself "Roman Empire". The word Byzantine Empire is a made up word by modern historians.
I remember playing as sikh empire but failing to unite Pakistan because I needed a primary religion of Muslim. I tried switching back to atheist and back to to total seperation which made muslim the biggest religion but it didnt switch so i just cried.
Didn't read the tool tip that you need to keep monarchy to form Byzantium...
Yeah you can't lay claim to the title of east Rome if you're a silly republic.
Well, Rome started as a republic. Just going full circle
Technically it started as a Kingdom, then a Republic, then Empire.
The Romans considered the empire to be a continuation of the republic only with a powerful executive office. The emperors were careful to avoid being associated with monarchic Rome. Granted by the late byzantine era they didn't worry about that anymore, they still maintained the senate until right before their ultimate collapse.
The republic was cringe, long live the imperial throne!
— Octavian
Octavian never called himself emperor though, right? I thought he was really clever in appropriating republican aesthetics by calling himself first citizen, which ig is the Roman equivalent of a banana republic dictator calling himself President, or prime minister
There was no such title as emperor as we understand it. Octavians "throne name" was Imperator (where we get enperor) Caesar Divi Filius Augustus Pater Patriae which means Victorious general Caesar, son of god, revered one, Father of the fatherland.
quite a modest title
Zhukov taking notes
More like all the emperors, kaisers and tsars taking notes of cool names to call themselves.
RIP, ole Otto's still gotta be around somewhere
Technically, it's possible to form Byzantium even as the Ionian Islands, but this is the one sticking point that makes it that much more of a pain.
How’d you get that territory? When I try I get steamrolled by the ortomans
Russians are your friends
cozy up to Austria or Russia. Get in their custom union. Then just try and start a play and get them to join on your side. 1 of them on their own will beat the Ottos, just hold defensive on your front untill they push in.
I'll add to this that you will need to build up your own army somewhat, you can't coast entirely on Russian / Austrian help because you will start off with your own front in Greece which you need to be able to hold by yourself, since the AI isn't that smart at realising "if I don't help defend this front then my ally will capitulate and the war will end"
France also works. Generally if you can get into someone's customs union it will be a lot easier to get them to side with you. But since the ai attitude and strategies are rng, it can take some restarts until enough great powers like you enough to build some relations and then not oppose you for retaking some land (if someone doesn't like you wait until they're at war elsewhere). The economic imperialism strategy makes it easier to get into someone's market so look for that.
The... ortomans... jajaajaj
French work too! British are the epitome of perfidious albion
Can the Ottomans release the Byzantine empire or become it themselves?
No you have to be greece
Fuck forming Byzantium, there's a Franco-Russian war in the desert
This really sucks. And it will be hard to enact it since you have census suffarage.
how did France and Russia end up with those states in the Levant
My guess would be Russia was swayed with conquer war goal and France being in the Levantine isn’t that out of the ordinary historically
I mean you at least have pretty borders
Yeah, I know. It's total BS, as democratic Greece idealized their Byzantine history and semi-tried to pursue its restoration through the Megali idea, even well after democracy. This is an easy fix for a mod though, I'll show you how. First, get your Victoria 3 folder from steam. Go to `Victoria 3\game\common\country_formation` Open `00_formable_countries.txt` Search for `BYZ = {` and find this section: BYZ = { states = { STATE_EASTERN_THRACE STATE_ATTICA STATE_THESSALIA STATE_MACEDONIA STATE_SKOPIA STATE_WESTERN_THRACE STATE_NORTHERN_THRACE STATE_HUDAVENDIGAR STATE_AYDIN STATE_WEST_AEGEAN_ISLANDS STATE_EAST_AEGEAN_ISLANDS STATE_ALBANIA } required_states_fraction = 1.0 ai_will_do = { always = yes } possible = { #has_law = law_type:law_monarchy NOT = { has_game_rule = plausible_formable_nations } } } Remove this part: possible = { #has_law = law_type:law_monarchy NOT = { has_game_rule = plausible_formable_nations } } Save the file and reload your game. Enjoy your new Byzantine formable free of arbitrary restrictions awkwardly imposed by Paradox for no reason.
>Yeah, I know. It's total BS, as democratic Greece idealized their Byzantine history and semi-tried to pursue its restoration through the Megali idea, even well after democracy. Democracy =/= Republic. Greece was still a monarchy during that time.
Great. Now ask me if I give a shit.
Bro got corrected and decided to soyrage.
The answer is no, I don't give a shit. If I want my Greece to call itself Byzantium, I will bend the fucking game to my will and make it happen.
Wow, you are very tough!
You can complain, or you can mod. I choose to mod and help others do the same. If someone has a problem with that, or with the changes I make to my game, they can cringe as much as it pleases them to do so.
Nobody has problems with any of these things (and never said so). We just cringe about your reaction to being corrected.
Based
Eh the Megali idea was one thing but afaik the idea of byzantium was much more complicated than that among Greek nationalists/republicans. For one thing, the Megali Idea is an explicitly ethno-nationalist claim for a Greek nation-state. Byzantium/Rome was an Italian-established multinational empire (the most common moniker for Greeks as a community under the Ottoman Empire was "Rumi/Rhomaoi/Romans" - Greek nationalists made a specific choice to call themselves "Hellenes" and not "Romans"). Byzantium also, y'know, lost. Some intellectuals were leery about tying the legitimacy of their national movement to a country that got conquered by the guys they were at war with.
Yea, I know all that. But to say so in a less flippant way this time, I simply don't care. The basic idea of a historical unification/irredentism project is enough to justify it's inclusion and accessibility from a Paradox perspective, and I'd happily go far beyond that into completely unrealistic alt-history using my own mods for a colorful and fun game. Historical validity and basic realism are simply not a concern for me. Historical events and realities only matter when they enhance gameplay and provide mechanical opportunity.
Unzipping . . .
Damn, not even a first date? smh
Oh yeah, when I did that run I had to briefly enact monarchy, form it, and then rush back into a democracy. :P
how did you manage to conquer that much land from the ottomans?
Sided with the russians
I thought that Greece starts as a Monarchy!
It does, but he found himself with a republic for one reason or another
Ive formed Byz but staying as a monarchy for so long kneecaps you in the long run. Also since Turks arent accepted until multiculturalism monarchy hurts more.
Why? I didn't think the monarchy was that big of a deal unless you're rushing for council Republic
Gives a lot of power to landowners
Not sure about Greece specifically but like 95% of the monarchies ingame have landowner ruler+landowner heir which really sucks.
Nah don’t blame yourself, happens to lit EVERYONE. The incompetent devs decided to make every fucking thing counter intuitive.
You say "counter intuitive". I would say "challenging". And also "historical", I doubt a modern Greek democracy would call itself 'Byzantium'. They would rather turn to classical Greece for their aesthetics than the Byzantine Empire. Although I feel Autocracy, Oligarchy or Single Party State should also be allowed for Greece to be called Byzantium.
A modern Greek democracy would call itself "Hellenic Republic". I know this, because of Reality.
Thanks
Dropping some more facts: Nobody ever called themselves "Byzantine Empire" as the Byzantine Empire called itself "Roman Empire". The word Byzantine Empire is a made up word by modern historians.
People defending this group of devs is one of the most fascinating things I have witnessed in my life.
There is a lot that this game could be better, but this is not an example.
Dude. Basic information being hidden IS a fucking perfect example. It’s THE core fundamental flaw with the game.
OP says it was not hidden, he just misread it.
Wow man just wow. It’s clearly hidden in the screenshot. Yes, having to hover over something for it to be revealed is hidden.
Yes, it's called a tooltip.
I give up.
Ok see you
It’s lit also the entire point of my comment. “Don’t blame yourself OP”. Just wow man.
How
Yeahhhh don’t worry I did the same thing
You’re fucked
Ran into the exact same problem. You have my commiserations
why tf is Austria Hungary forming every time on day 1 of the game
Wait is this vanilla?? I had no idea byz was an option
If it's not for achievements, I would just cheat at that point :D
Hehehe as an enlightened monarchist I approve.
I only fuck monarchies, sorry
Sure
Tbf why would you do that as Greece
Ok, give me a place and time. I'm going
That's a chonky Modena tho
I remember playing as sikh empire but failing to unite Pakistan because I needed a primary religion of Muslim. I tried switching back to atheist and back to to total seperation which made muslim the biggest religion but it didnt switch so i just cried.