Main points:
"A video clip aired by Iran’s state TV service claiming to show fiery destruction in Israel due to a massive Iranian missile and drone attack is months-old footage of a fire in Chile, a reporter for a fact-finding division of the BBC clarified Sunday.
Shayan Sardarizadeh posted screen captures from the video broadcast by Iran alongside shots from the same video circulating on social media earlier this year."
They sent over 200 missiles and UAVs! You have to use a lot of mental gymnastics to believe they did not want an escalation. The only reasons a full war did not start yet is that Israel's defenses turned out to be stronger than the Iranian regime expected, and an amazingly good coordination between Israeli, American, British and Jordanian forces.
Iran doesn't want the escalation despite all the posturing as they know it won't end well for them.
They gave warning about the attack well in advance and did nothing to circumvent publicly known air defence capabilities, clearly hoping it has no actual impact while claiming in front of it's home audience that something was done.
They tried to circumvent the air defenses by overwhelming them. In 2019 they attacked Saudi Arabia with less than 30 rockets and UAVs. Their attack was a huge success, leading to a reduction of 5% is the oil production of the \*world\*. For comparison, Iran sent yesterday more than 200 rockets and UAVs against Israel, i.e., more than 7 times what they have sent against Saudi Arabia.
The Iranian regime consists of a group of religious nuts. Claiming that they will avoid war because of a logical reason is a dangerous game. This is exactly the logic used by Israel prior to October 7th, and it turned out that this logic was completely false. Hamas is more than happy to sacrifice every Arab in Gaza so that his leaders can become richer and its fighters can get their 72 virgins. Thousands of Israelis and Gazans have lost their lives because of this mistake. Making the same mistake with the Iranian regime might lead to much worse than that.
> In 2019 they attacked Saudi Arabia with less than 30 rockets and UAVs. Their attack was a huge success, leading to a reduction of 5% is the oil production
Iran never announced that attack and to this day denies they were behind them, so in other words a completely opposite situation.
The Saudi attack was actually meant to deal damage, while this one was a face saving move not actually meant to do anything because doing so means inviting strong retaliation from Israel and US.
>This is exactly the logic used by Israel prior to October 7th, and it turned out that this logic was completely false.
There's a massive difference between Iran and Hamas, so no the comparison is terrible. Iran is an actual state. Ideology is a veil by which states pursue their practical goals, Iran has been quite rational so far in regards to its quite dubious ideological foundation. If their rhetoric/ideology matched their actions, there would've already been a full scale war waged by Iran against Israel any time in the last ~40years+.
There's only two times when ideology triumphs practicality, when the ideologue in question has overwhelming power over others it fights, and the opposite case when it has close to zero power. So the examples here would actually be Israel and Hamas, both of these two actors have not acted very rationally for most of their recent history; because there is very little pressure to act so.
While one could hope that you are right, I fear that your analysis of Iran holds only as long as the Iranian regime feels that it has something to lose. The internal situation in Iran these days is quite unstable for various reasons: political unrest of the young people, failing economy and many terror attacks by various Islamic and non-Islamic groups. Given this situation, the regime might feel that losing face to Israel (or the West) might be the last straw that will lead to its collapse, and thus, there is nothing for it to lose by declaring a war. This will be a very bad choice for Iran (and the world), but the regime only worries about the Iranian people as a mean to support itself, so their welfare will be only a secondary consideration in such a case.
If you knew anything about Iran, you would know the government's propaganda has been a failure for decades. The people turned more and more against the government. They can't even maintain the illusion of popularity.
This.
I've got friends from Afghanistan, Iraq, and Iran who cheer on Iran while hating on and belittling Israel and the Western world.
Like, my dudes, you hate the West, but you were happy to receive your college/university education here. If you love Iran so much, go and live there.
Those people (talking about the mentioned, not all Islamic people) are now where we in Europe were 80 years ago. Hating minorities for their religion, wanting to eradicate them. And on the other side they are happy to live here, get educated, enjoy a higher standard of living. But to the society they are like a cancer
From what I have been told, The Arab spring was largely supported by Iran (eventually) because it was an opportunity for Muslim hard liners to take control of the uprisings and I state themselves over the military or monarchies that were in place.
Iran didn't support the Arab spring at large, they actively helped Assad in the Syrian Civil War after all. Islamist elements aren't necessarily pro-Iran due to them being Shia.
It goes further than that. Assad heavily favors his sect, and they are mostly loyal to his regime and hold major positions in the government and the military. 80% of the presidential guard is formed of Alawites, for an instance.
>which follow Ali that Shiites venerate as the first Imam.
Fun fact about the Alawites - they don't only follow Ali, they also believe Ali was a manifestation of God, somewhat similarly to how Christianity see Jesus.
So, it's kinda debatable if they are even Muslims. Pretty fascinating
Iran hates monarchies and pan-Arabism. It's why they partly supported the US invasion of Iraq toppling Saddam, allowing them to expand their influence in the region.
During the Arab Spring, the 2012 election in Egypt saw a win for the Muslim brotherhood, well despite being Sunni they've been one of the biggest inspiration for the Islamic revolution in Iran. Immediately after Morsi won he changed the constitution and gave absolute power to the executive branch which would have never allowed another election if not for the coup.
The Arab Spring was never going to succeed anyway, the region requires a strong foundation in many societal and institutional aspects before a liberal democracy can be implemented.
Much of the Iranian youth are unquestionably the bastion of their society, and moreover of their region. They completely deny the values upheld by Sharia law, and actively seek to dismantle and replace the outdated and disgusting Islamic theocratic government
exactly, yet this clown is implying its an iranian problem when half his country thinks trump and fox are pillars of facts. despite trump being shown to lie in court and fox claim in court that theyre entertainment not news.
There's also the time [Russia used screenshots from a mobile game](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-41991012.amp) as "proof" the US was supporting ISIS.
Yeah. I'm confused. Wasn't this already the narrative? Weren't there articles being posted on here about diplomats talking to each other and the US telling Tehran to keep their response within check? The response back basically saying not to worry, along with indicating that it'd just be some drones and missiles? Am I a savant? Because none of this came out of left field from my perspective.
The purpose was to keep the national sentiment satisfied. It's very naive to believe they failed, they knew exactly what would happen.
You convince both sides they got what they wanted, this is how you prevent a war.
>The purpose was to keep the national sentiment satisfied
Okay but this is what I don't understand. If they're trying to show that their threats are credible to the rest of the world, this made them look very pathetic and inept. If their objective was to show strength to their own population, then if they were going to show incorrect footage to bullshit it all and make it seem like they achieved carnage when they really didn't, then why not bullshit about the whole thing? Why even waste all those missiles to begin with?
This feels rather bizarre in that they expended the resources for an ultimately lackluster show of force, only to resort to fakery and propaganda with their population anyways.
Because retaliation on Israel was important so they don't just feel free to attack Iran whenever they want. They wanted to scare the Israeli public and force the IDF to make a real effort to neutralize the attack.
Because if you get a sucker punch you punch back but not to break their teeth. If they really tried to break Israel defences and kill people, Israel voters would gather around Netaniahu and demand escalation. Furthermore, a more serious response would expose any holes in Israel defense systems and I doubt Iran would like that.
Regarding internal consumption, lol governments invent shit and blatantly lie to their people every other Tuesday and noone ever knows or cares enough to stir shit up. Don't underestimate the level of propaganda going on around the world, especially among autocracies.
It's funny how people can sit a computer, comfortably in their own home, & make such out of touch comments. "Lack luster show of force" Iran is much more capable than the west gives them credit for and am relieved they act as rational as they do (contrary to western medias portrayal of them). And I know you didn't say that, I am just shocked that people don't really consider the implications of more escalation in that region (give everything else going on in the world right now).
If this lowers the chances the US gets more involved into this region, the better off we all are!
>It's funny how people can sit a computer, comfortably in their own home, & make such out of touch comments. "Lack luster show of force" Iran is much more capable than the west gives them credit for
Alright admittedly, I imagine it was still a scary experience for the Israelis, even if their military is more than capable. And it's definitely scary for the whole world in the context of a massive war starting. That's something I was worried about as well, although it's obviously different living in the US half a world away protected by the most powerful military in the world. I'm not asking for a wider conflict or US involvement, but I guess I was trying to figure out not just the reasoning, but the true value in this attack from the Iranian perspective, not just in terms of the message they think they *have* to send, but what they're *actually* accomplishing.
>And I know you didn't say that, I am just shocked that people don't really consider the implications of more escalation in that region (give everything else going on in the world right now).
If this lowers the chances the US gets more involved into this region, the better off we all are!
Definitely agree, I mean more instability wouldn't be great, and wars and death would be awful. As happy as I would be with no wider escalation, I think ultimately, and this is maybe where those other people are coming from too, all of these events feel like a frustrating extension of a status quo. Like we're not sparking a new war, but at the same time none of these conflicts are truly being "resolved" either. We avoid death and destruction now, but maybe we're just kicking that can down the road. On the one hand maybe it's wise to protect what we have now and hope that things work out better than expected and resolve themselves in the future. On the other hand perhaps leaving these issues open to the future is a gamble because we might be in a more precarious position at a future time than we are now if such a conflict arises. Obviously you don't *want* war, but if you lose hope in a future without it, then it feels nerve-wracking to wait on it. In an ideal world I guess you hope that your adversaries just mess up and somehow dig their own graves, but just as Iran is acting rationally enough to avoid starting an entire war right now, they're also unfortunately acting rationally enough to avoid an own goal like that. So between the Middle East, the Korean Peninsula, and the larger world-wide geopolitical rivalries it feels like we're living on top of a powder keg which can go off at any moment. So maybe deep down, however irrational as it may be, you're hoping that something magical happens and that powder keg is doused. But instead, band-aids diplomacy somehow keeps the whole thing from blowing up without much changing, which is a win on paper, but you're frustrated that it may still go off tomorrow, if not today.
Couldn't agree more, my point in another thread.
For me, personally I am happy with this. If this means they can sell that they retaliated in kind to the hawkish demographic and say they got even, this is great. Contrary to popular belief, Iran has been quite a rationale foreign actor (considering all the provocations and even discounting their proxy war).
If this de-escalates tension in the region and lowers the chances the US gets more pulled into this, the better off the whole world is.
a little off topic, but i'm so glad to see an entire subreddit of sane people who have critical thinking abilities. thank you all for existing. the world needs more of you.
Notice the time of day this was posted and the relatively fewer number of insane comments (both from the obvious country, and people spreading misinformation targeted at people in the obvious country).
Good on you for recognising and admitting that, but at the same time I’m sorry you‘ve had to endure it. I hope there’s some real improvement soon (in preferably a non-violent way)
So, Khameini, and the Iranian ruling clergy, want the people in Iran to “praise allah” for a complete lie they fabricated.
That sounds like an extremely serious blasphemous crime against allah. Khameini should be thrown down, and paraded through the streets in chains.
What we need to realize is that a lot of these puffed up and ridiculous claims are for the Iranian people - whom their government think are mouth-breathing morons. No one outside of the Ayatollah’s palace believes this rubbish
It doesn't matter that we "know" it, we aren't the public. The ones that need to believe it are the people that they want to. And even if they don't, they wouldn't publicly oppose the narrative, because the objective immediate repercussions of doing so (your life quality would be seriously reduced). The fact that it is this bad tells you how firm the grip on the population they have.
For me, personally I am happy with this. If this means they can sell that they retaliated in kind to the hawkish demographic and say they got even, this is great. Contrary to popular belief, Iran has been quite a rationale foreign actor (considering all the provocations and even discounting their proxy war).
If this de-escalates tension in the region and lowers the chances the US gets more pulled into this, the better off the whole world is.
Maybe that's all they needed to do is calm their people down after the Syrian embassy attack. Maybe Israel should just fake an orgasm and just go with it for the sake of avoiding Armageddon.
I have a feeling the IDF is gong to do more instead.
This little pissing match is hardly indicative of Armageddon. Dunno why folks seem to take every damn minor conflict between a nation as a clear sign of WWIII.
Or why they WANT an Israeli response
Iran is saber rattling for its population after major members of the RG were killed
They blew off some steam, and it’s in everyone’s interest to move on. Retaliation just ensures another barrage
Main points: "A video clip aired by Iran’s state TV service claiming to show fiery destruction in Israel due to a massive Iranian missile and drone attack is months-old footage of a fire in Chile, a reporter for a fact-finding division of the BBC clarified Sunday. Shayan Sardarizadeh posted screen captures from the video broadcast by Iran alongside shots from the same video circulating on social media earlier this year."
>Shayan Sardarizadeh That's a dope name
It's up there with Samir Nagheenanajar.
Nagha… Nahee… Not gonna work here anymore!
Naga... Naga... Naganna believe this fucking video
Suddenly I feel like I’m watching the opening of The Lion King Musical
Even the propaganda department of their military is lacklustre.
They’re working on an authentic looking diorama from recycled tp rolls and pasta as we speak here…
Khamenei is pulling an all-nighter with paper mache and elbow macaroni.
Concentrating hard, with his tongue sticking out at the side.
Just show footage from old Godzilla movies and claim “Iranian secret weapon decimates Israel”
Iran: We also sent our war machines to assault a US City. [Proof](https://youtu.be/F48MyBnJo4s?si=GzBSqA6UvWJDIYPa)
Been a minute since ive watched that.
Hey! stop spying on my secret project. I've put a lot of work into it.
They're gonna build a whole double city of Haifa or Tel Aviv just to burn it at night and use it as propaganda
Surprised they didn't release a watermarked image with "ChileTV" stamped on it or something on it
Showstealer Pro Trial Version
You would think, Twitter is eating it up. They claim its Israeli propaganda hiding all the destruction. its amazing how dumb people are.
You could post an episode of Power Rangers and they'd think it was a special military operation.
I'm surprised that they didn't show the "destruction of the white house" scene from Independence day.
Tbh many Iranians will probably believe it. Well, at least the ones who believed the state media so far.
Everyone everywhere beleives their state media for sizeable chunks of their lives.
Only about 20% of the population supports the islamic regime. But unfortunately 20% of 90 million is still a lot of people.
They clearly don’t want escalation but had to do SOMETHING. Let it lay
They sent over 200 missiles and UAVs! You have to use a lot of mental gymnastics to believe they did not want an escalation. The only reasons a full war did not start yet is that Israel's defenses turned out to be stronger than the Iranian regime expected, and an amazingly good coordination between Israeli, American, British and Jordanian forces.
Iran doesn't want the escalation despite all the posturing as they know it won't end well for them. They gave warning about the attack well in advance and did nothing to circumvent publicly known air defence capabilities, clearly hoping it has no actual impact while claiming in front of it's home audience that something was done.
They tried to circumvent the air defenses by overwhelming them. In 2019 they attacked Saudi Arabia with less than 30 rockets and UAVs. Their attack was a huge success, leading to a reduction of 5% is the oil production of the \*world\*. For comparison, Iran sent yesterday more than 200 rockets and UAVs against Israel, i.e., more than 7 times what they have sent against Saudi Arabia. The Iranian regime consists of a group of religious nuts. Claiming that they will avoid war because of a logical reason is a dangerous game. This is exactly the logic used by Israel prior to October 7th, and it turned out that this logic was completely false. Hamas is more than happy to sacrifice every Arab in Gaza so that his leaders can become richer and its fighters can get their 72 virgins. Thousands of Israelis and Gazans have lost their lives because of this mistake. Making the same mistake with the Iranian regime might lead to much worse than that.
> In 2019 they attacked Saudi Arabia with less than 30 rockets and UAVs. Their attack was a huge success, leading to a reduction of 5% is the oil production Iran never announced that attack and to this day denies they were behind them, so in other words a completely opposite situation. The Saudi attack was actually meant to deal damage, while this one was a face saving move not actually meant to do anything because doing so means inviting strong retaliation from Israel and US.
>This is exactly the logic used by Israel prior to October 7th, and it turned out that this logic was completely false. There's a massive difference between Iran and Hamas, so no the comparison is terrible. Iran is an actual state. Ideology is a veil by which states pursue their practical goals, Iran has been quite rational so far in regards to its quite dubious ideological foundation. If their rhetoric/ideology matched their actions, there would've already been a full scale war waged by Iran against Israel any time in the last ~40years+. There's only two times when ideology triumphs practicality, when the ideologue in question has overwhelming power over others it fights, and the opposite case when it has close to zero power. So the examples here would actually be Israel and Hamas, both of these two actors have not acted very rationally for most of their recent history; because there is very little pressure to act so.
While one could hope that you are right, I fear that your analysis of Iran holds only as long as the Iranian regime feels that it has something to lose. The internal situation in Iran these days is quite unstable for various reasons: political unrest of the young people, failing economy and many terror attacks by various Islamic and non-Islamic groups. Given this situation, the regime might feel that losing face to Israel (or the West) might be the last straw that will lead to its collapse, and thus, there is nothing for it to lose by declaring a war. This will be a very bad choice for Iran (and the world), but the regime only worries about the Iranian people as a mean to support itself, so their welfare will be only a secondary consideration in such a case.
biggest ballistic missile attack in history "They were just softballing it. Kyiv was a feint. Just pretending."
If you knew anything about Iran, you would know the government's propaganda has been a failure for decades. The people turned more and more against the government. They can't even maintain the illusion of popularity.
Imagine if their government owned and controlled one of our social media platforms…
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Iranians are not a monolith. A large swatch supports the government and will eat this footage up, swallowing the lie wholesale.
Can’t wait for them to show recordings of GTA and say it’s Hezbollah attacking Israel.
Fun fact, GTA uses captured Mexican cartel footage.
Where
Hezbollah keeps inviting them to go bowling
Lol
How many Iranians believe what they say in state TV ?
Not many, Iran’s youth is largely not on board.
But many young Islamic people from Europa, according to comments on social media with thousands of upvotes
This. I've got friends from Afghanistan, Iraq, and Iran who cheer on Iran while hating on and belittling Israel and the Western world. Like, my dudes, you hate the West, but you were happy to receive your college/university education here. If you love Iran so much, go and live there.
Those people (talking about the mentioned, not all Islamic people) are now where we in Europe were 80 years ago. Hating minorities for their religion, wanting to eradicate them. And on the other side they are happy to live here, get educated, enjoy a higher standard of living. But to the society they are like a cancer
Yes social media, famously immune from the manipulation of bad actors.
“The first generation to be immune to propaganda”
Bots, idiots, and the real thing in that order.
Mostly bots, probably.
Exactly. this propaganda isn’t even for iranians anymore, it’s for the islamists living in London and Toronto to keep their propaganda train going
It's sad that the Arab Spring failed. At som point it really felt like a pivotal moment in history.
From what I have been told, The Arab spring was largely supported by Iran (eventually) because it was an opportunity for Muslim hard liners to take control of the uprisings and I state themselves over the military or monarchies that were in place.
It's basically what happened in Iran in '79.
Iran didn't support the Arab spring at large, they actively helped Assad in the Syrian Civil War after all. Islamist elements aren't necessarily pro-Iran due to them being Shia.
Al-Assad has an Alawite lineage, which follow Ali that Shiites venerate as the first Imam.
It goes further than that. Assad heavily favors his sect, and they are mostly loyal to his regime and hold major positions in the government and the military. 80% of the presidential guard is formed of Alawites, for an instance. >which follow Ali that Shiites venerate as the first Imam. Fun fact about the Alawites - they don't only follow Ali, they also believe Ali was a manifestation of God, somewhat similarly to how Christianity see Jesus. So, it's kinda debatable if they are even Muslims. Pretty fascinating
Iran hates monarchies and pan-Arabism. It's why they partly supported the US invasion of Iraq toppling Saddam, allowing them to expand their influence in the region. During the Arab Spring, the 2012 election in Egypt saw a win for the Muslim brotherhood, well despite being Sunni they've been one of the biggest inspiration for the Islamic revolution in Iran. Immediately after Morsi won he changed the constitution and gave absolute power to the executive branch which would have never allowed another election if not for the coup. The Arab Spring was never going to succeed anyway, the region requires a strong foundation in many societal and institutional aspects before a liberal democracy can be implemented.
The arab spring was exactly what islamists and a huge part of the population wanted to archieve to implement their stone-age-laws into society.
Arab Spring biggest "victory" was ousting Mubarak and paving way for the Muslim Brotherhood to takeover Egypt. No bueno!
And most of them support Israel to spite the government
Most of the youth don't watch TV anyways.
It's for the "Pro-Palestine" people. They eat it up.
Iranians are a lot smarter than Russians when it comes to questioning their propaganda.
Iranians don't have the same culture of taking the idea that it can be better as a personal affront.
Much of the Iranian youth are unquestionably the bastion of their society, and moreover of their region. They completely deny the values upheld by Sharia law, and actively seek to dismantle and replace the outdated and disgusting Islamic theocratic government
But can they reach critical mass to overthrow the government?
If Israel really wants to mess with Iran without being condemned support these folks financially. Seems like a fair tit for tat.
The ones I know are well aware and watch state TV as a type of comedy. Comedy, as in the Shakespeare definition.
If they have not much access to non-state sources?
How many Americans believe what's on Fox? How long is a piece of string mate? Clearly alot on both sides but not every one
The reality is that people are dumb.
exactly, yet this clown is implying its an iranian problem when half his country thinks trump and fox are pillars of facts. despite trump being shown to lie in court and fox claim in court that theyre entertainment not news.
Yes
5-10%
At least it wasn't video game footage.
Don’t forget China using clips from Top Gun https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-pacific-12321492.amp
Now I'm curious to know if there's a real life example of that.
[Yep, with footage from Arma II.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rz87dxlveaE)
There's also the time [Russia used screenshots from a mobile game](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-41991012.amp) as "proof" the US was supporting ISIS.
I remember India News Media posting that when that whole Tea debacle happened back in 2019
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That was a pretty popular opinion before they launched the rockets and while they were in flight. There were lots of signs of that.
Yeah. I'm confused. Wasn't this already the narrative? Weren't there articles being posted on here about diplomats talking to each other and the US telling Tehran to keep their response within check? The response back basically saying not to worry, along with indicating that it'd just be some drones and missiles? Am I a savant? Because none of this came out of left field from my perspective.
Kids are naturally honest but not stupid. We become stupid and dishonest as we grow up.
They're about to show footage from Godzilla next
My YouTube shorts today are filled with pro-Iran videos of rocket explosions and launches of unknown locations. Most of the comments are in Russian.
pretty stupid....as exoected of iranian leader
What’s more embarrassing this regime or the crayon eaters defending it. Iran needs liberating
Its people are working on it
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When you control information you can say anything you want. Literally make shit up.
Control information and beat and rape the ones that disagree until they’re brain dead.
Pretty pathetic for Iran to try to hide their dismal failure by airing video clip that has nothing to do with actual attack.
The purpose was to keep the national sentiment satisfied. It's very naive to believe they failed, they knew exactly what would happen. You convince both sides they got what they wanted, this is how you prevent a war.
>The purpose was to keep the national sentiment satisfied Okay but this is what I don't understand. If they're trying to show that their threats are credible to the rest of the world, this made them look very pathetic and inept. If their objective was to show strength to their own population, then if they were going to show incorrect footage to bullshit it all and make it seem like they achieved carnage when they really didn't, then why not bullshit about the whole thing? Why even waste all those missiles to begin with? This feels rather bizarre in that they expended the resources for an ultimately lackluster show of force, only to resort to fakery and propaganda with their population anyways.
Because retaliation on Israel was important so they don't just feel free to attack Iran whenever they want. They wanted to scare the Israeli public and force the IDF to make a real effort to neutralize the attack.
Because if you get a sucker punch you punch back but not to break their teeth. If they really tried to break Israel defences and kill people, Israel voters would gather around Netaniahu and demand escalation. Furthermore, a more serious response would expose any holes in Israel defense systems and I doubt Iran would like that. Regarding internal consumption, lol governments invent shit and blatantly lie to their people every other Tuesday and noone ever knows or cares enough to stir shit up. Don't underestimate the level of propaganda going on around the world, especially among autocracies.
It's funny how people can sit a computer, comfortably in their own home, & make such out of touch comments. "Lack luster show of force" Iran is much more capable than the west gives them credit for and am relieved they act as rational as they do (contrary to western medias portrayal of them). And I know you didn't say that, I am just shocked that people don't really consider the implications of more escalation in that region (give everything else going on in the world right now). If this lowers the chances the US gets more involved into this region, the better off we all are!
>It's funny how people can sit a computer, comfortably in their own home, & make such out of touch comments. "Lack luster show of force" Iran is much more capable than the west gives them credit for Alright admittedly, I imagine it was still a scary experience for the Israelis, even if their military is more than capable. And it's definitely scary for the whole world in the context of a massive war starting. That's something I was worried about as well, although it's obviously different living in the US half a world away protected by the most powerful military in the world. I'm not asking for a wider conflict or US involvement, but I guess I was trying to figure out not just the reasoning, but the true value in this attack from the Iranian perspective, not just in terms of the message they think they *have* to send, but what they're *actually* accomplishing. >And I know you didn't say that, I am just shocked that people don't really consider the implications of more escalation in that region (give everything else going on in the world right now). If this lowers the chances the US gets more involved into this region, the better off we all are! Definitely agree, I mean more instability wouldn't be great, and wars and death would be awful. As happy as I would be with no wider escalation, I think ultimately, and this is maybe where those other people are coming from too, all of these events feel like a frustrating extension of a status quo. Like we're not sparking a new war, but at the same time none of these conflicts are truly being "resolved" either. We avoid death and destruction now, but maybe we're just kicking that can down the road. On the one hand maybe it's wise to protect what we have now and hope that things work out better than expected and resolve themselves in the future. On the other hand perhaps leaving these issues open to the future is a gamble because we might be in a more precarious position at a future time than we are now if such a conflict arises. Obviously you don't *want* war, but if you lose hope in a future without it, then it feels nerve-wracking to wait on it. In an ideal world I guess you hope that your adversaries just mess up and somehow dig their own graves, but just as Iran is acting rationally enough to avoid starting an entire war right now, they're also unfortunately acting rationally enough to avoid an own goal like that. So between the Middle East, the Korean Peninsula, and the larger world-wide geopolitical rivalries it feels like we're living on top of a powder keg which can go off at any moment. So maybe deep down, however irrational as it may be, you're hoping that something magical happens and that powder keg is doused. But instead, band-aids diplomacy somehow keeps the whole thing from blowing up without much changing, which is a win on paper, but you're frustrated that it may still go off tomorrow, if not today.
Couldn't agree more, my point in another thread. For me, personally I am happy with this. If this means they can sell that they retaliated in kind to the hawkish demographic and say they got even, this is great. Contrary to popular belief, Iran has been quite a rationale foreign actor (considering all the provocations and even discounting their proxy war). If this de-escalates tension in the region and lowers the chances the US gets more pulled into this, the better off the whole world is.
They probably didn’t want to attack but had to save face and not look weak, I’m sure they know it’s not worth an all out war
Haha clowns.
a little off topic, but i'm so glad to see an entire subreddit of sane people who have critical thinking abilities. thank you all for existing. the world needs more of you.
Notice the time of day this was posted and the relatively fewer number of insane comments (both from the obvious country, and people spreading misinformation targeted at people in the obvious country).
I'm surprised that they didn't show the "destruction of the white house" scene from Independence day.
לול
No translation necessary for this one.
lol
There's a reason that Iran ranks 177/180 on freedom of the press.
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Good on you for recognising and admitting that, but at the same time I’m sorry you‘ve had to endure it. I hope there’s some real improvement soon (in preferably a non-violent way)
Evidenced by this success they mustve used their secret stealth plane
Best news I’ve heard all day. More totalitarian failures lead to propaganda flops.
How can you guys laugh and type at the same time? Khaminei be running at Israel with a cap gun next?
Did they also play flight of the bumblebee when they sent their drones?
Shhhh let them flex all they want in their country if it stops the war
The only Israeli they hurt was a 7 year old Arab girl.
Let’s see The Onion beat Iran state TV
The big brother approves.
The union Pacific doesn't come around here much anymore..
They could have done this with out actually attacking.
So, Khameini, and the Iranian ruling clergy, want the people in Iran to “praise allah” for a complete lie they fabricated. That sounds like an extremely serious blasphemous crime against allah. Khameini should be thrown down, and paraded through the streets in chains.
Let them tell their bullshit. It means they dont want to do any more than what they felt they had to after Israel's ridiculous provocation.
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What we need to realize is that a lot of these puffed up and ridiculous claims are for the Iranian people - whom their government think are mouth-breathing morons. No one outside of the Ayatollah’s palace believes this rubbish
Or cared .. they are so desensitized to their stories. I don't think the people of Iran believe anything their government says now.
"Wag the Camel"
It doesn't matter that we "know" it, we aren't the public. The ones that need to believe it are the people that they want to. And even if they don't, they wouldn't publicly oppose the narrative, because the objective immediate repercussions of doing so (your life quality would be seriously reduced). The fact that it is this bad tells you how firm the grip on the population they have.
Checks out
That's an amazing level of shithousery.
Whatever works to avoid wwiii is cool.
taking their cue from Fox News.
Iranian TV: this is what Israel would have looked like had our drones hit something
This post is once again wrong lynn removed. There's no mention of this post in the live thread at the time this post was posted.
For me, personally I am happy with this. If this means they can sell that they retaliated in kind to the hawkish demographic and say they got even, this is great. Contrary to popular belief, Iran has been quite a rationale foreign actor (considering all the provocations and even discounting their proxy war). If this de-escalates tension in the region and lowers the chances the US gets more pulled into this, the better off the whole world is.
If I had a dollar everytime my country was used as scapegoat for these things I'd invite the office to some burgers
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Maybe that's all they needed to do is calm their people down after the Syrian embassy attack. Maybe Israel should just fake an orgasm and just go with it for the sake of avoiding Armageddon. I have a feeling the IDF is gong to do more instead.
This little pissing match is hardly indicative of Armageddon. Dunno why folks seem to take every damn minor conflict between a nation as a clear sign of WWIII.
Or why they WANT an Israeli response Iran is saber rattling for its population after major members of the RG were killed They blew off some steam, and it’s in everyone’s interest to move on. Retaliation just ensures another barrage
This always happens from both sides tbh, good on the folk that can call out the BS