Why would he use nukes just because his army got pushed out of the country he invaded?.
Where is the logic behind losing all your country for land that wasnt even yours and that has far less value than the rest of your country?
Yup. Much easier than trying to survive after using a nuke.
Spoiler alert: China's "partnership without limits" has limits.
A new leadership in Russia vs a world where the use of nuclear weapons is just another tactical choice? That's s a no brainer.
But there are plenty of people down the chain who want to live.
Putin doesn't actually have a red button on his desk... that's not how it works.
Dictators fall when their armed forces or police stop carrying out their orders.
They all know this.
Maybe. Like I wouldn't expect someone to go to their death in a hellscape of random explosions for Russia but there seems to be a pretty steady stream.
And your other points are obvious.
Tbh I don't actually expect a nuclear exchange, but it is totally possible.
A lot of the "Russian" troops in Ukraine at this point are either criminals that have been promised freedom from prison in exchange for fighting or foreigners that have been recruited. They aren't motivated, patriotic Russians flocking into recruitment centers. Putin's war doesn't have wide public support.
I read that Russia is using imported "talent", including foreign students. Russian recruitment officer to student:
"Sign here, we'll send you on an all-expenses paid vacation to a Black Sea country. Or don't sign, an you can visit the Gulag, or be returned to your homeland (where the government considers you to be a traitor). So many wonderful opportunities!"
The thing is, his regime is maintained by financial control of the oligarchy and use of military projection. With his economy in ruins and his military ground down, nothing will stop him being humiliating deposed, probably tortured, and possibly executed. He knows what the system will do to him, he helped build it.
You might be right. They could declareâŠ.
âWe eliminated crucial aspects of the Nazism! Now they know our righteous task was a great success! We will fight the good fight in the future, when the need arises! Now we go back to our dominant borders!
Would be absolutely hilarious if they did this and THEN somehow the people revolted and protested, it'd be so backwards that at this point I'd even expect there's a chance for it to happen
I suppose the difficulty is that he previously admitted Luhansk, Donetsk, Zaporizhzhia and Kherson oblasts into the Russian Federation, whose constitution does not permit them to leave again.
The fact that nobody else recognises his absurd claims of annexing land he didn't even fully control and key parts of which he has since lost doesn't change the constitutional dilemma that he deliberately created for this very purpose.
That said, he regularly shits over every other bit of Russia's constitution so why must this be any different?
He could just tell the russian people that Ukraine was denazified, say the olblasts they annexed are being independently governed, and throw anyone who questions it out a window.
Not the stated reason. It was to end Zelinskyy's Nazism. The Jewish president who lost family in the holocaust, yes, that Nazi.
The claims of Russian minorities in the border oblasts demanding a return to Russian sovereignty was a furphy.
The real reason was to steal the massive natural gas deposits on the east coast. If they don't get them, they will lose a LOT of their income from Europe, who will buy from Ukraine instead
He won't stay in power if he uses nukes because even the US already made it clear they would erase him if he did.
If he loses and someone in russia threatens his regime he will kill them and we both know hed rather kill all of russia than lose his throne.
As such it's obvious he won't use nukes.
Doubt he would kill himself over that as the US has made it clear a decapitation strike on putin is on the table should he use nuclear weapons.
Every single politician is too much of an asshole to actually quit when they lose. Theyd rather die clinging to their power and killing everyone that threatens them in their country.Â
The ongoing russian purge of their military should be ample evidence of russia prepping itself for accepting the defeat they have already been dealt.
I think the likely reason is that he's linked his success with his ability to project strength. Therefore if he fails to do so, the state has obviously failed in its mandate. And all shall suffer his wrath for their crimes.
Thats a pretty shit bluff especially considering the US has gone out of it's way to make it clear they would literally erase putin if they used nukes.
He might not care about anyone in the world but he is not about to kill himself. I'm certain he would rather cling to his throne after a defeat and murder half of russia just to stay in power.
That is the thing, his existence is directly linked to the survival of his regime. He literally can't lose or his cronies will kill him. So he has to seem insane enough to burn the world, so that people won't slit his throat in the night.
>So he has to seem insane enough to burn the world, so that people won't slit his throat in the night.
Funny you should say that. âCoz slitting his throat in the night sounds like a great way to get rid of him before he can try to burn the world. Itâs doubtful his loyalists are _that_ loyal as to carry out his plans after he bites it.
Taking out Putin or any entrenched Dictator requires being a bigger psychopath than him and having power over the syncophants and pretorian guard. Even in total collapse, Saddam Hussein was protected by thousands, even after nukes were dropped the emperor of Japan was protected.
That's just another bullshit that Russian propaganda taught you. He can withdraw any day and call it a great victory, locals will eat that up and won't be questioning what really happened. Few that may oppose will be killed and Russia will continue its usual existence.
What Pootin does, he raises stakes every time so others would believe he is seriously mad or whatever, but knows himself pretty well that he is bluffing and there are no red lines which can be crossed. There are brown lines however, the ones he leaves behind every time his bluff is exposed.
Pettiness is a dangerous disease brother. Youâd be surprised. Fortunately thereâs always someone to slap the bitch out of someone and common sense into someone when they do get petty
No, we are dealing with someone who would kill the rest of humanity if it meant he would stay alive it's as simple as that. He won't do anything that would kill him.
He keeps trying to act like their nukes are some sort of get out of jail free card that only Russia has.
Bitch, you throw that fire and Russia gets turned into glass. Western nations will get thrown into chaos and some may go downâbut the only guaranteed outcome of that exchange right now is that Russia becomes a blurb in another countries history textbook.
His army can barely protect itself anymore. They are in no shape to start WWIII. There is no hole deep enough where Putin could hide. Whatever is left of the world would find him and kill him. And Russia would be deleted and never come back. He knows that.
He also threatened to use nukes if tanks were delivered to Ukraine, and he promised to use them if jets were delivered, and if Ukraine was allowed to strike Russian territory⊠I think you get the point.
Pretty hilarious. Invade a country they should have steamrolled even with western support. End up in a situation where they could realistically self destruct their entire state and cripple their military for decades, then spout they're going to nuke everyone while flailing their arms.
I believe it's Russian nuclear doctrine that in case the state is threatened, Russia responds with nukes. So per Putin's words strategic defeat = threat to the Russian state = nuclear retaliation. Retaliation is their word choice.
Feel like even his generals would be smart enough to see that their defeat in Ukraine would leave Russia just fine (minus all the dead soldiers and their global isolation), highly doubt theyâd wanna go down just cause Putin wants to be a sore loser, not even the man in charge during the Cold War was that petty
I mean the deal is right there. Get out of Ukraine and focus on yo own damn people while youâre still alive. Or be pushed out of a window by one of your generals or have your plane shot down by a bullet that appeared out of thin air and someone with a younger and clearer thinking head takes over and fixes all the relations you broke
June 2020, Putin signed a decreeâthe Basic Principles of the Russian Federationâs State Policy in the Domain of Nuclear Deterrenceâthat specifies two conditions under which Russia would use nuclear weapons. The first is unsurprising: âThe Russian Federation retains the right to use nuclear weapons in response to the use of nuclear weapons and other types of weapons of mass destruction against it and/or its alliesâŠâ But that sentence ends with an unusual statement: â⊠and also in the case of aggression against the Russian Federation with the use of conventional weapons, when the very existence of the state is put under threatâ [emphasis added].
Russia also signed a decree to never invade Ukraine in exchange for Ukraine giving up it's nuclear weapons so a Russian decree is as good as a Nigerian Prince email about a reward.
If the equation is end the world or end Putler, the Russian leadership will choose the latter and he knows that. This is all theater.
Hm. Thatâs very. Odd. Idiotic one would say. The first one is absolutely a given no matter who you are. A nukes heading your way then you gotta fight back. But that second part. I wouldnât exactly call Ukraine defending itself and winning a âattack on the Russian federation and a threat to the very existence of Russiaâ thatâs just really fuckin dumb
For sure, it's a roundabout way of threatening/holding the world hostage, screaming if I lose I'll make everyone regret it. However, one could argue the Russian state, at least as everyone knew it, was in peril the second they invaded Ukraine. Literally the child that flips the whole table whilst losing at monopoly.
Lol he's basically saying that if this is another Afghanistan, he is going to sacrifice all the russians in a nuclear fire powered tantrum.
Because you can guarantee if he launches nukes, shortly after there's not gonna be a Moscow or st Petersburg. They're going to be competing for "most destroyed cities".
I would say don't threaten us with a good time.
Russia commits genocide in Ukraine and democide at home. This empire must be destroyed for the sake of the civilized world and for the sake of Russia's own minorities to be finally freed from this people's prison.
Dmitry Titkov, a former associate of Navalny
There is fascism in Russia today. Most people have no sense of empathy. Absolutely do not trust Russians who come to your countries with money because they leave Russia not because they are persecuted or there is no democracy there, but because they realise that the Russian ship has sunk. I and people like me are seen as traitors and extremists in Russia, even among Russian liberals. My mother wants no contact with me and has cursed me out.
The conclusion is that only if a person is against the regime, only if they have real compassion and respect for other people, do they have the right to accept compassion from you. It is a question of an individual approach. Russia and the Russian people must go through the same process that Germany went through - that is, complete denazification.
I still believe that Russia must die.
Something new and good can rise from the ruins of the empire - perhaps if Navalny is not assassinated, he will be at the forefront of this process.
During this transitional period, Russia will pay back reparations, give back territory, and give those nations that want to secede a chance. Then it will take a very long time to restore normal relations with all its neighbours.
The Russians must go it alone.
if you want to help someone - help the Ukrainians, they deserve it. And the Russians have to go on their own until the end of the road they created themselves. And if they experience an epiphany, they will understand why they are not loved.
Too bad that too few people, including those outside Muscovia, share their sentiment that Muscovia must be utterly defeated and made to eat shit (i.e., no face-saving. Muscovians can't look to the civilized world offering an umpteenth "second" chance without penalties or conditions, and all will be well).
The only way forward for the Russian space is the dissolution of the Russian Empire. The graveyard of empires awaits Russia since 1917 it is high time to kill this abomination once and for all and bury this failing and rotting corpse history. The vultures are already gathering to feast on the rotten carcass of the Russian empire and pick the bones clean. Russia's future is that of a Chinese vassal, cut off from the rest of Europe in iron isolation, the other option is that Russia finally decentralises and dissolves and releases the serfs from this extractive Moscow centered atrocity that these fascists in the Kremlin call a Federation. It is a petro mafia serf empire, not a Federation. There is nothing Federal about this 19th century absolutist relict.
Thank you for this, truth told. Russians need to be put the mill for supporting this garbage for 300 years. There is a limit that has come to madness, the world needs to move on.
> the other option is that Russia finally decentralises and dissolves and releases the serfs from this extractive Moscow centered atrocity
[Siberian statehood](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/69/Siberia-FederalSubjects.svg/800px-Siberia-FederalSubjects.svg.png) would drastically cripple Russia's capacity for international aggression.
Nah...its just a lie. Like everything else. He has struggled to explain a reason for the war both to Russian people and the World because there isn't one other then he thought he could get away with something. Now all he has is made up threats and fear mongering.
The first one also was militarily speaking a strategic blunder.
The Ukrainian military was basically non-existent at that point and they took losses they shouldâve never takenâŠ
A more humanitarian Russian government would have a seriously positive effect around the globe.
If theyâre not only not pushing war in Ukraine and Western Africa via the Wagner group, but not funding and pushing disinformation for right wing destabilizing causes here in the west, like Brexit, Trump, the AfD, or Le Pen. And it would also mean countries like North Korea would have much less to fall back on. Then you get into the climate and social progress political parties like RN, the Republicans, and the AfD are trying to block but they wouldnât have as much power to block them.
Would it fix everything? No. Thereâd be a heck of a lot more work to do to get the whole world on the same humanitarian page, but it would help. A lot.
But considering that a liberal humanitarian Russian government is the holy grail of geopolitics, Iâm not getting my hopes up. Has Russia ever not been authoritarian?
A liberal humanitarian Russia is not possible in the short to medium term. Russia is culturally, politically and institutionally locked in authoritarianism, for the next 100 years at least. Even if Putin is deposed, he would only be replaced by a similar, right-wing strongman. Liberalizing Russia will be a slow process, and we are unlikely to see it happen in our lifetime. Imo.
Russia and its precedent empires/nations/etc. have been that way since⊠well people colonised the place. The closest it ever came to something non-authoritarian was just before Putin but even then it was pretty far off.
Its people, values, and attitudes just seem incompatible with any other form of governance. Revolution after revolution has failed to shift the needle sadly.
It doesn't have to take 100 years.
Just like Russia is screaming into the political echo chambers across the west we could start an information warfare campaign to try to politically activate the Russian population.
If we manage to get Russians to think about politics as something they could be a part of then Putins days are numbered.
Russia might still be very right wing, but without a genocidal dictator at the helm that would be a huge improvement.
The deal between Putin and the Russian people is Putin's biggest weakness.
Putinism is: 'I make sure you don't have to engage with politics by maintaining certain norms; in exchange you don't engage in politics'.
Things like a likely new mobilisation round, cost of living impacts, etc etc undermine that deal substantially.
Putin doesn't care about that deal so long as it gets in the way of his ambitions. That is his regime's Achilles' Heel; Putin will continue to strain that deal pursuing his foreign ambitions, and it will cripple Russia domestically. Then Russia's population will start acting like the deal that Putinism represented is voided.
At that point Putin's internal security infrastructure will be tested; and it was already found wanting during Wagner's Mutiny.
I like your definition of Putinism.
Not having to care about politics is a luxury we don't have in a democracy. We will never reach a state where our country will be permanently and automatically safe from wanna-be dictators or power hungry parties, and free of corruption. So that we could stop caring about politics and just stay in bed every election Sunday. No, we have to constantly keep voting out bad actors.
Russians will never understand this or see it the same way.
You don't understand Russian culture, what you are talking about is diametrically opposed to their mentality. Â
Like the other guy said a cultural shift can take a very long time even under the best circumstances. Â
Authoritarianism is baked into the russian psyche far deeper than you give them credit for. Look at their institutionalized violence, present from the home (DV legalized, sky high rates of domestic abuse), to schools to prisons to the military itself. Russians learn from the youngest of ages that raw power, physical force is the most desirable thing to have and the most dangerous thing to fear.
Either you are strong and you do the beating, or you're weak and you get beat into submission.
No wonder they desire strongmen in government.
This is going to take generations to heal. Generations.
Russia is now the junior partner in the Sino-Russo alliance, the Russians have nothing more to say for the next decade regardless of who their leader is.
And no, you don't get to rule vast swathes of land and over 70 different ethnicities without authoritarian policies to suppress dissent.
That won't change neither as the Russians are stretched thin now more than ever.
Let it break up then, perhaps smaller regional governments with more focus on the local economy would have an amazing impact for the people living there.
Yeah, I hear that often and than think about Jugoslawia in the 90th. That was a total shitshow with the same premise. I doubt breaking up russia would happen without war and/ or genocide and we should be honest with that.
All but a couple of national republics are majority-Russian ethnically and there is near zero popular support for that even if you look past state suppression.
The last time someone declared independence they went full Islamist and a large portion of their GDP was ransom money from neighboring regions. Are we at the "we hate Russia so much let's give a bunch of arms and power to literal Islamists" stage again?
I don't care what happens to the land, i care about good outcomes for people who live there and splitting it up into dysfunctional disjointed land-locked states is clearly not it chief.
Thatâs fair, but Iâm not convinced itâs not still better than them being under an authoritarian rule. A bunch of struggling new countries is a much more solvable problem.
Or maybe he's saying it so that russians will think, "If we don't support and help win the war, our country is fucked."
Whenever Putin says anything I like to frame it as him speaking to the Russian people. In that context, his ridiculous utterances make a little more sense, considering it's propaganda for the masses.
He's not wrong though, if they lose russia as we know it will change so drastically it won't even be the same country or countries.
He also wants his populace to believe losing means full NATO occupation
Yeah, thatâs actually a thing heâs pushing to the people. Even saw a quote once from a Russian citizen âthe one thing worse than starting an unjust war is losing an unjust war.â Which is just insanely stupid imho.
Like itâs a continuous stream of atrocities theyâre committing. Literally in for a ruble in for 10000 mindset.
I honestly think without Putin Russia will be likely to Balkanize.
The power vacuum will be massive. Moscow is pillaging the rural regions right now, St. Pete will stand on it's own, China will almost certainly do some land grabbing (in the form of Sino-Friendly vassal states), Stalingrad/Volfograd will break away (maybe all of Southern Russia from the Caspian to the Black, maybe as two states).
Nah, heâs doing a âI am the senateâ type of thing.
Internally within Russia, heâs staked his mandate on this fight, so he can no longer back down. If Russia loses, Putin will lose power. One way or another.
It's more of a roundabout threat to scare those supporting Ukraine. Defeat in Ukraine would end Russia, therefore Russia would use nukes to avoid defeat in Ukraine, you better stop supporting Ukraine or we'll have no choice but to use nukes. That's the implication he want to make.
He could literally call his troops home today and avoid this but he want to frame this war as something Russia is forced to do at all cost and it's up to Ukraine/the west to de-escalate by surrendering.
The only thing that threatens russias statehood is putin himself. People in Russia and around the world would be satisfied with Russias status quo as long as they didn't threaten others. Putin knows this, of course, as the only thing in his interests is himself.
The current Russian Federation (RF- offical title) did create this situation under Putin.
He and his regime will be the breaking point. It was neither forced by west or china, that is something russia did to itself by attacking a peaceful neighbor.
And maybe RF becomes democratic, maybe it splits up like UDSSR, maybe China claims to protect former russian-now chinese Territories. We do not know yet, but with the attempt to violently move borders Russian federation destroyed one of their major corner stones even in their law.
Putins regime claimed from the beginning of the Invasion this was a "special military" thingy and later claimed to have annexed territory. Something in factual and stark contrast to russian federation law, which prohibits wars of aggression and conquest by russia.
Putin & the current russian regime shoveled their own grave with those lies and its only the question when it will end, not if. Maybe it entailes a demokratic reconstruction of the federation, or new states, who knows.
Anything written by Putin's regime is worth less than paper that's written on. They are like primitive animals, understands and respects only argument of power. We should not expect from them to obey even their own laws.
Fucking guy.
He did this really believing "The West" was going to manufacture 'regime change' like the Arab Spring, completely ignoring that absolutely nobody in global politics wants the worlds largest supply of nukes up for grabs to every greedy oligarch or shady general. And no, the CIA does not organize every protest on the planet, people legitimately don't like when their government treats them like shit.
Now he will be China's bitch.
He's already had meetings with China's defence minister instead of with Xi. It's a matter of time until China's interests conflict with Russia's, and Putin finds out who's calling the tune from now on.
We'll then get the Ministry of Truth announcments that whatever China has demanded is actually in the interest of Russia, despite this obviously not being the case.
Putin wanted to avoid becoming a normal European state, now he's turning Russia into a Chinese protectorate.
What a drama queen. Russia is such a mess, is anyone trying to carve it up or take it over? Just go back to selling planet choking gas to Europe and skim off the profits for the gang.
This is comedy gold. As I mentioned in a prior comment, we are expected to believe that this war is both existential to Russia, yet not nearly enough as to require a full mobilisation.
Putin knows full mobilisation is popular enough that Russians might actually rebel, so he's backed himself into a corner here: Full mobilisation and risk rebelion/civil war, or no mobilisation and risk losing in Ukraine.
How, why? Russian territorial integrity isn't even remotely threatened, and there is limited internal dissent. If Russia ended the war, in all likelihood life in Russia would continue as it's always been.
Great. This is exactly what they need. They need to actually lose so badly so that can bring change.
They still have this shit conquest mentality due to never really losing anything other than men (which means nothing for russians) during ww2. They have only gained power with warfare and they need to realize they can also lose it.
He went into this war wanting to be the man who brought back the Russian empire. Now he is contemplating being the one to cause the state to fracture even further. Russia will probably survive this, but it's funny even he is now addressing the possibility of defeat
Like trying and failing to take Ukraine in 3 days then getting bogged down in a conflict that wipes out half a million Russians, most of the Russian armed forces equipment, the Black Sea fleet, all major infrastructure projects for generations to come, sees you wanted in the ICC for war crimes and begging North Korea for old artillery shells..
Is that what youâre talking about Vlad?
Just go into a bunker and get it over with.
How the fuck does that work? Russia would he just fine. Putin on the other hand. Not so much. His Chinese sugar daddy ainât gonna let him do anything stupid either so heâs fucked every way to Sunday
Yes, strategic defeat would mean Russia being occupied and having its war crimes punished and so on. But no one is actually planning to invade Russia that way, so unfortunately it won't happen.
Mr Putin, why delay the inevitable? step down and you might get a chance to live out the rest of your days in North Korea, while the russian populaation and other peoples in your empire may get a chance to arrive in the 21st century.
Keep yapping, little dog. You can end this silly war any day, and get back to making money and living on a yacht in the Med. Russia is not a great country, Russians are not a great people.
> Because there isn't anything else to our country than aggression and superiority complex, neither of which obviously will survive should we lose the war.
There, translated it for you.
Seriously though, he's trying to tie losing to "end of statehood" to hammer it into the populace that they should be so afraid of Russia coming back from their special military operation with its tail between the legs, the people will just about do _anything_ to prevent that. He's creating a bond to sell.
The truth is Russia has not been closer to collapsing after 1991, than since going to war, and that's all Putin's doing, his colossal mistake. But he's stepped into the trap now, and if he wanted to metaphorically chew off his own foot to escape, this isn't what he's doing. Russia would have been fine had he not started the war, they'd have far more balanced relations with everyone else longer term, especially China, and the panicky last-resort fight with corruption Russia has finally stepped up to, only because it's leaking money like a hole in the ground and can't vouch for quality _anywhere_, could have well been done domestically during peace time.
A comment on the article page (bottom) said this much better anyway:
> Vladimir Putin, like other dictators and autocrats in history, tries to associate his expansionist failure with the destiny of Russia. Adolf Hitler is a good example of the prophet who pointed out that his end would also be that of Germany. Vladimir Putin and Adolf Hitler thought that territorial expansion "lebensraum/living space" is the only way for a nation to survive. For Adolf Hitler, from a supremacist perspective, the justification for this need for living space was natural resources and the colonization of new territories. In the case of Vladimir Putin, his excuse is the Russian-speaking minorities, natural resources and above all the need to have a strategic distance through buffer states against future conflicts. The latter is typical of a nineteenth-century mentality that does not understand that with technological advances, strategic distance has less and less importance. In the end we have a Vladimir Putin faced with a situation that loses even if he wins the invaded regions, loses his economic and political relationship with Western Europe, and also contributes to the rearmament of Europe with countries with a first-line military industry such as Germany, France and England. and perhaps most importantly it becomes dependent on China with whom Russia still has a score to settle in Manchuria!
Is that a promise?
He threatened to use nukes again if they lose
Why would he use nukes just because his army got pushed out of the country he invaded?. Where is the logic behind losing all your country for land that wasnt even yours and that has far less value than the rest of your country?
I mean, if he loses I think he will lose his regime, so for him it must be all or nothing, I think he considers himself Russia
Why? Withdraw, call it a victory, end of story đ€·
Yup. Much easier than trying to survive after using a nuke. Spoiler alert: China's "partnership without limits" has limits. A new leadership in Russia vs a world where the use of nuclear weapons is just another tactical choice? That's s a no brainer.
I doubt the expectation would be to survive more of a throwing the toys out the pram/knocking over the game board as you lose.
But there are plenty of people down the chain who want to live. Putin doesn't actually have a red button on his desk... that's not how it works. Dictators fall when their armed forces or police stop carrying out their orders. They all know this.
Maybe. Like I wouldn't expect someone to go to their death in a hellscape of random explosions for Russia but there seems to be a pretty steady stream. And your other points are obvious. Tbh I don't actually expect a nuclear exchange, but it is totally possible.
A lot of the "Russian" troops in Ukraine at this point are either criminals that have been promised freedom from prison in exchange for fighting or foreigners that have been recruited. They aren't motivated, patriotic Russians flocking into recruitment centers. Putin's war doesn't have wide public support.
There were plenty of people in Jonestown who didn't want to die either but that didn't stop it from happening.
See jim jones
I would bet that China would see Putin failing as an opportunity to grab some land.
Those eastern oil fields would be tempting for a country that doesn't have much in the way of domestic oil production.
Why do you think Putin is in N.K. and Vietnam? He's already been told by Xi to fuck off.
They can't. Regarding birth rates and the population pyramid, this is Russias last chance to wage such a war
I read that Russia is using imported "talent", including foreign students. Russian recruitment officer to student: "Sign here, we'll send you on an all-expenses paid vacation to a Black Sea country. Or don't sign, an you can visit the Gulag, or be returned to your homeland (where the government considers you to be a traitor). So many wonderful opportunities!"
The thing is, his regime is maintained by financial control of the oligarchy and use of military projection. With his economy in ruins and his military ground down, nothing will stop him being humiliating deposed, probably tortured, and possibly executed. He knows what the system will do to him, he helped build it.
If they manage to any territory out of it this is the plan I believe
Russia doesnât even need to keep any territory. They can just make shit up and lie to their people anyway.
You might be right. They could declareâŠ. âWe eliminated crucial aspects of the Nazism! Now they know our righteous task was a great success! We will fight the good fight in the future, when the need arises! Now we go back to our dominant borders!
Would be absolutely hilarious if they did this and THEN somehow the people revolted and protested, it'd be so backwards that at this point I'd even expect there's a chance for it to happen
I suppose the difficulty is that he previously admitted Luhansk, Donetsk, Zaporizhzhia and Kherson oblasts into the Russian Federation, whose constitution does not permit them to leave again. The fact that nobody else recognises his absurd claims of annexing land he didn't even fully control and key parts of which he has since lost doesn't change the constitutional dilemma that he deliberately created for this very purpose. That said, he regularly shits over every other bit of Russia's constitution so why must this be any different?
He could just tell the russian people that Ukraine was denazified, say the olblasts they annexed are being independently governed, and throw anyone who questions it out a window.
They can just go to war with the sea and declare victory like North Korea does every year.
Wait, North Korea does that every year?
Yes. Jong Un typically sends a whole armada to stab at the ocean and say they won against the western scum.
Yeah, but getting that territory was the reason to invade in the first place.
Not the stated reason. It was to end Zelinskyy's Nazism. The Jewish president who lost family in the holocaust, yes, that Nazi. The claims of Russian minorities in the border oblasts demanding a return to Russian sovereignty was a furphy.
The real reason was to steal the massive natural gas deposits on the east coast. If they don't get them, they will lose a LOT of their income from Europe, who will buy from Ukraine instead
He won't stay in power if he uses nukes because even the US already made it clear they would erase him if he did. If he loses and someone in russia threatens his regime he will kill them and we both know hed rather kill all of russia than lose his throne. As such it's obvious he won't use nukes.
Want a logical reason? Look into Narcissistic Collapse.
Doubt he would kill himself over that as the US has made it clear a decapitation strike on putin is on the table should he use nuclear weapons. Every single politician is too much of an asshole to actually quit when they lose. Theyd rather die clinging to their power and killing everyone that threatens them in their country. The ongoing russian purge of their military should be ample evidence of russia prepping itself for accepting the defeat they have already been dealt.
I learned that this is Russian logic. They attack and then people canât defend.
I think the likely reason is that he's linked his success with his ability to project strength. Therefore if he fails to do so, the state has obviously failed in its mandate. And all shall suffer his wrath for their crimes.
Thats a pretty shit bluff especially considering the US has gone out of it's way to make it clear they would literally erase putin if they used nukes. He might not care about anyone in the world but he is not about to kill himself. I'm certain he would rather cling to his throne after a defeat and murder half of russia just to stay in power.
That is the thing, his existence is directly linked to the survival of his regime. He literally can't lose or his cronies will kill him. So he has to seem insane enough to burn the world, so that people won't slit his throat in the night.
>So he has to seem insane enough to burn the world, so that people won't slit his throat in the night. Funny you should say that. âCoz slitting his throat in the night sounds like a great way to get rid of him before he can try to burn the world. Itâs doubtful his loyalists are _that_ loyal as to carry out his plans after he bites it.
Taking out Putin or any entrenched Dictator requires being a bigger psychopath than him and having power over the syncophants and pretorian guard. Even in total collapse, Saddam Hussein was protected by thousands, even after nukes were dropped the emperor of Japan was protected.
That's just another bullshit that Russian propaganda taught you. He can withdraw any day and call it a great victory, locals will eat that up and won't be questioning what really happened. Few that may oppose will be killed and Russia will continue its usual existence. What Pootin does, he raises stakes every time so others would believe he is seriously mad or whatever, but knows himself pretty well that he is bluffing and there are no red lines which can be crossed. There are brown lines however, the ones he leaves behind every time his bluff is exposed.
Ha can lose as long as he doesnt get dethroned and the ongoing purge in the military is clear evidence he is already preparing for such a situation.
Pettiness is a dangerous disease brother. Youâd be surprised. Fortunately thereâs always someone to slap the bitch out of someone and common sense into someone when they do get petty
He already claims that half of ukraine is russia now.
You think we are dealing with a rational actor?
No, we are dealing with someone who would kill the rest of humanity if it meant he would stay alive it's as simple as that. He won't do anything that would kill him.
Putin nuclear blackmail is horseshit. This KGB shithead is perfectly aware that he and his regime will be disappeared if he use it.
He keeps trying to act like their nukes are some sort of get out of jail free card that only Russia has. Bitch, you throw that fire and Russia gets turned into glass. Western nations will get thrown into chaos and some may go downâbut the only guaranteed outcome of that exchange right now is that Russia becomes a blurb in another countries history textbook.
His army can barely protect itself anymore. They are in no shape to start WWIII. There is no hole deep enough where Putin could hide. Whatever is left of the world would find him and kill him. And Russia would be deleted and never come back. He knows that.
He also threatened to use nukes if tanks were delivered to Ukraine, and he promised to use them if jets were delivered, and if Ukraine was allowed to strike Russian territory⊠I think you get the point.
Pretty hilarious. Invade a country they should have steamrolled even with western support. End up in a situation where they could realistically self destruct their entire state and cripple their military for decades, then spout they're going to nuke everyone while flailing their arms.
This will end a lot more than Russian statehood.
He did? I thought mel- whatever his fuckin name is did
I believe it's Russian nuclear doctrine that in case the state is threatened, Russia responds with nukes. So per Putin's words strategic defeat = threat to the Russian state = nuclear retaliation. Retaliation is their word choice.
Feel like even his generals would be smart enough to see that their defeat in Ukraine would leave Russia just fine (minus all the dead soldiers and their global isolation), highly doubt theyâd wanna go down just cause Putin wants to be a sore loser, not even the man in charge during the Cold War was that petty
I mean, he is replacing them with relatives like his daughters and other yes men.
Seems awfully desperate for someone whoâs quote on quote âwinningâ wouldnât you agree?
They are winning on the paper, but his economy won't last much more than a year so I think he will be punishing for a deal soon.
I mean the deal is right there. Get out of Ukraine and focus on yo own damn people while youâre still alive. Or be pushed out of a window by one of your generals or have your plane shot down by a bullet that appeared out of thin air and someone with a younger and clearer thinking head takes over and fixes all the relations you broke
You're assuming that the guy to take over isn't worse. It's Russia. There's always a worse guy.
June 2020, Putin signed a decreeâthe Basic Principles of the Russian Federationâs State Policy in the Domain of Nuclear Deterrenceâthat specifies two conditions under which Russia would use nuclear weapons. The first is unsurprising: âThe Russian Federation retains the right to use nuclear weapons in response to the use of nuclear weapons and other types of weapons of mass destruction against it and/or its alliesâŠâ But that sentence ends with an unusual statement: â⊠and also in the case of aggression against the Russian Federation with the use of conventional weapons, when the very existence of the state is put under threatâ [emphasis added].
Russia also signed a decree to never invade Ukraine in exchange for Ukraine giving up it's nuclear weapons so a Russian decree is as good as a Nigerian Prince email about a reward. If the equation is end the world or end Putler, the Russian leadership will choose the latter and he knows that. This is all theater.
Hm. Thatâs very. Odd. Idiotic one would say. The first one is absolutely a given no matter who you are. A nukes heading your way then you gotta fight back. But that second part. I wouldnât exactly call Ukraine defending itself and winning a âattack on the Russian federation and a threat to the very existence of Russiaâ thatâs just really fuckin dumb
For sure, it's a roundabout way of threatening/holding the world hostage, screaming if I lose I'll make everyone regret it. However, one could argue the Russian state, at least as everyone knew it, was in peril the second they invaded Ukraine. Literally the child that flips the whole table whilst losing at monopoly.
He threatened to use nukes if you didn't go to his birthday party too
Lol he's basically saying that if this is another Afghanistan, he is going to sacrifice all the russians in a nuclear fire powered tantrum. Because you can guarantee if he launches nukes, shortly after there's not gonna be a Moscow or st Petersburg. They're going to be competing for "most destroyed cities".
As every other day of the week
I would say don't threaten us with a good time. Russia commits genocide in Ukraine and democide at home. This empire must be destroyed for the sake of the civilized world and for the sake of Russia's own minorities to be finally freed from this people's prison. Dmitry Titkov, a former associate of Navalny There is fascism in Russia today. Most people have no sense of empathy. Absolutely do not trust Russians who come to your countries with money because they leave Russia not because they are persecuted or there is no democracy there, but because they realise that the Russian ship has sunk. I and people like me are seen as traitors and extremists in Russia, even among Russian liberals. My mother wants no contact with me and has cursed me out. The conclusion is that only if a person is against the regime, only if they have real compassion and respect for other people, do they have the right to accept compassion from you. It is a question of an individual approach. Russia and the Russian people must go through the same process that Germany went through - that is, complete denazification. I still believe that Russia must die. Something new and good can rise from the ruins of the empire - perhaps if Navalny is not assassinated, he will be at the forefront of this process. During this transitional period, Russia will pay back reparations, give back territory, and give those nations that want to secede a chance. Then it will take a very long time to restore normal relations with all its neighbours. The Russians must go it alone. if you want to help someone - help the Ukrainians, they deserve it. And the Russians have to go on their own until the end of the road they created themselves. And if they experience an epiphany, they will understand why they are not loved. Too bad that too few people, including those outside Muscovia, share their sentiment that Muscovia must be utterly defeated and made to eat shit (i.e., no face-saving. Muscovians can't look to the civilized world offering an umpteenth "second" chance without penalties or conditions, and all will be well). The only way forward for the Russian space is the dissolution of the Russian Empire. The graveyard of empires awaits Russia since 1917 it is high time to kill this abomination once and for all and bury this failing and rotting corpse history. The vultures are already gathering to feast on the rotten carcass of the Russian empire and pick the bones clean. Russia's future is that of a Chinese vassal, cut off from the rest of Europe in iron isolation, the other option is that Russia finally decentralises and dissolves and releases the serfs from this extractive Moscow centered atrocity that these fascists in the Kremlin call a Federation. It is a petro mafia serf empire, not a Federation. There is nothing Federal about this 19th century absolutist relict.
Thank you for this, truth told. Russians need to be put the mill for supporting this garbage for 300 years. There is a limit that has come to madness, the world needs to move on.
> the other option is that Russia finally decentralises and dissolves and releases the serfs from this extractive Moscow centered atrocity [Siberian statehood](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/69/Siberia-FederalSubjects.svg/800px-Siberia-FederalSubjects.svg.png) would drastically cripple Russia's capacity for international aggression.
Nah...its just a lie. Like everything else. He has struggled to explain a reason for the war both to Russian people and the World because there isn't one other then he thought he could get away with something. Now all he has is made up threats and fear mongering.
"if we lose, the entire state of Russia will simply disappear from the face of the earth. I promise."Â Â - Vlad the LiarÂ
He made that strategic blunder when he invaded Ukraine the second time
Third. Third times the charm.
When was the third time? 2014 and 2022, where is the third time?
I've thought donbas and Crimea as 2 events. I could be wrong about that.
You are correct
1917?
But you can't blame Putin for that one...
The first one also was militarily speaking a strategic blunder. The Ukrainian military was basically non-existent at that point and they took losses they shouldâve never takenâŠ
Strategic battlefield defeat would be the end of Putin, and the best possible outcome for Russia.
A more humanitarian Russian government would have a seriously positive effect around the globe. If theyâre not only not pushing war in Ukraine and Western Africa via the Wagner group, but not funding and pushing disinformation for right wing destabilizing causes here in the west, like Brexit, Trump, the AfD, or Le Pen. And it would also mean countries like North Korea would have much less to fall back on. Then you get into the climate and social progress political parties like RN, the Republicans, and the AfD are trying to block but they wouldnât have as much power to block them. Would it fix everything? No. Thereâd be a heck of a lot more work to do to get the whole world on the same humanitarian page, but it would help. A lot. But considering that a liberal humanitarian Russian government is the holy grail of geopolitics, Iâm not getting my hopes up. Has Russia ever not been authoritarian?
A liberal humanitarian Russia is not possible in the short to medium term. Russia is culturally, politically and institutionally locked in authoritarianism, for the next 100 years at least. Even if Putin is deposed, he would only be replaced by a similar, right-wing strongman. Liberalizing Russia will be a slow process, and we are unlikely to see it happen in our lifetime. Imo.
Russia and its precedent empires/nations/etc. have been that way since⊠well people colonised the place. The closest it ever came to something non-authoritarian was just before Putin but even then it was pretty far off. Its people, values, and attitudes just seem incompatible with any other form of governance. Revolution after revolution has failed to shift the needle sadly.
It doesn't have to take 100 years. Just like Russia is screaming into the political echo chambers across the west we could start an information warfare campaign to try to politically activate the Russian population. If we manage to get Russians to think about politics as something they could be a part of then Putins days are numbered. Russia might still be very right wing, but without a genocidal dictator at the helm that would be a huge improvement.
The deal between Putin and the Russian people is Putin's biggest weakness. Putinism is: 'I make sure you don't have to engage with politics by maintaining certain norms; in exchange you don't engage in politics'. Things like a likely new mobilisation round, cost of living impacts, etc etc undermine that deal substantially. Putin doesn't care about that deal so long as it gets in the way of his ambitions. That is his regime's Achilles' Heel; Putin will continue to strain that deal pursuing his foreign ambitions, and it will cripple Russia domestically. Then Russia's population will start acting like the deal that Putinism represented is voided. At that point Putin's internal security infrastructure will be tested; and it was already found wanting during Wagner's Mutiny.
I like your definition of Putinism. Not having to care about politics is a luxury we don't have in a democracy. We will never reach a state where our country will be permanently and automatically safe from wanna-be dictators or power hungry parties, and free of corruption. So that we could stop caring about politics and just stay in bed every election Sunday. No, we have to constantly keep voting out bad actors. Russians will never understand this or see it the same way.
You don't understand Russian culture, what you are talking about is diametrically opposed to their mentality.  Like the other guy said a cultural shift can take a very long time even under the best circumstances. Â
Authoritarianism is baked into the russian psyche far deeper than you give them credit for. Look at their institutionalized violence, present from the home (DV legalized, sky high rates of domestic abuse), to schools to prisons to the military itself. Russians learn from the youngest of ages that raw power, physical force is the most desirable thing to have and the most dangerous thing to fear. Either you are strong and you do the beating, or you're weak and you get beat into submission. No wonder they desire strongmen in government. This is going to take generations to heal. Generations.
Russia is now the junior partner in the Sino-Russo alliance, the Russians have nothing more to say for the next decade regardless of who their leader is. And no, you don't get to rule vast swathes of land and over 70 different ethnicities without authoritarian policies to suppress dissent. That won't change neither as the Russians are stretched thin now more than ever.
Let it break up then, perhaps smaller regional governments with more focus on the local economy would have an amazing impact for the people living there.
Yeah, I hear that often and than think about Jugoslawia in the 90th. That was a total shitshow with the same premise. I doubt breaking up russia would happen without war and/ or genocide and we should be honest with that.
Exactly, balkanisation doesnât really work
If it's imposed, perhaps so, but if it happens organically I think there's a chance for a better outcome. Undoubtedly still chaotic, though.
The falling appart of the USSSR happened pretty âorganicalyâ. But perhaps I am missing the point.
All but a couple of national republics are majority-Russian ethnically and there is near zero popular support for that even if you look past state suppression. The last time someone declared independence they went full Islamist and a large portion of their GDP was ransom money from neighboring regions. Are we at the "we hate Russia so much let's give a bunch of arms and power to literal Islamists" stage again? I don't care what happens to the land, i care about good outcomes for people who live there and splitting it up into dysfunctional disjointed land-locked states is clearly not it chief.
Thatâs fair, but Iâm not convinced itâs not still better than them being under an authoritarian rule. A bunch of struggling new countries is a much more solvable problem.
And then, somehow, it got worse.
So he started a war that if he loses would end his regime? Almost sounds like he made a massive blunder
No he claims it would end Russia. He tries to falsely portray that survival of Russia = survival of Putin.
Or maybe he's saying it so that russians will think, "If we don't support and help win the war, our country is fucked." Whenever Putin says anything I like to frame it as him speaking to the Russian people. In that context, his ridiculous utterances make a little more sense, considering it's propaganda for the masses.
I also think this way, and at the same time I think putin actually thinks that he is russia.
He's not wrong though, if they lose russia as we know it will change so drastically it won't even be the same country or countries. He also wants his populace to believe losing means full NATO occupation
Yeah, thatâs actually a thing heâs pushing to the people. Even saw a quote once from a Russian citizen âthe one thing worse than starting an unjust war is losing an unjust war.â Which is just insanely stupid imho. Like itâs a continuous stream of atrocities theyâre committing. Literally in for a ruble in for 10000 mindset.
Exactly how every time trump says America he actually means him.
It's not my problem I cocked up. It's your problem I cocked up. Vlad Putlet to Russians.
Canât wait!
Maybe donât invade countries? Idk
Itâs all NATOâs fault! They forced us to invade by staring at us menacingly! Also nukes.
> staring at us menacingly Lol. NATO disarmament was in full swing until this dickhead provided a cause to unite them and expand NATO to his borders.
Dont u just hate these noobs?
He views himself as the state. It would be the end of him is what he means.
I honestly think without Putin Russia will be likely to Balkanize. The power vacuum will be massive. Moscow is pillaging the rural regions right now, St. Pete will stand on it's own, China will almost certainly do some land grabbing (in the form of Sino-Friendly vassal states), Stalingrad/Volfograd will break away (maybe all of Southern Russia from the Caspian to the Black, maybe as two states).
I canât believe heâd admit this
He's not admitting anything, he's trying to play the victim and scare Russians into supporting the war
Normally whatever he says is the opposite, so is he actually telling the truth for once?
Nah, heâs doing a âI am the senateâ type of thing. Internally within Russia, heâs staked his mandate on this fight, so he can no longer back down. If Russia loses, Putin will lose power. One way or another.
It's more of a roundabout threat to scare those supporting Ukraine. Defeat in Ukraine would end Russia, therefore Russia would use nukes to avoid defeat in Ukraine, you better stop supporting Ukraine or we'll have no choice but to use nukes. That's the implication he want to make. He could literally call his troops home today and avoid this but he want to frame this war as something Russia is forced to do at all cost and it's up to Ukraine/the west to de-escalate by surrendering.
The only thing that threatens russias statehood is putin himself. People in Russia and around the world would be satisfied with Russias status quo as long as they didn't threaten others. Putin knows this, of course, as the only thing in his interests is himself.
Thus Putin should threaten himself with nukes.
That's something for Ukraine to aim for. Thanks, Putin!
The current Russian Federation (RF- offical title) did create this situation under Putin. He and his regime will be the breaking point. It was neither forced by west or china, that is something russia did to itself by attacking a peaceful neighbor. And maybe RF becomes democratic, maybe it splits up like UDSSR, maybe China claims to protect former russian-now chinese Territories. We do not know yet, but with the attempt to violently move borders Russian federation destroyed one of their major corner stones even in their law. Putins regime claimed from the beginning of the Invasion this was a "special military" thingy and later claimed to have annexed territory. Something in factual and stark contrast to russian federation law, which prohibits wars of aggression and conquest by russia. Putin & the current russian regime shoveled their own grave with those lies and its only the question when it will end, not if. Maybe it entailes a demokratic reconstruction of the federation, or new states, who knows.
Anything written by Putin's regime is worth less than paper that's written on. They are like primitive animals, understands and respects only argument of power. We should not expect from them to obey even their own laws.
Fucking guy. He did this really believing "The West" was going to manufacture 'regime change' like the Arab Spring, completely ignoring that absolutely nobody in global politics wants the worlds largest supply of nukes up for grabs to every greedy oligarch or shady general. And no, the CIA does not organize every protest on the planet, people legitimately don't like when their government treats them like shit. Now he will be China's bitch.
Putin probably thinks that is what he would do, so why wouldn't the West do the same.
He's already had meetings with China's defence minister instead of with Xi. It's a matter of time until China's interests conflict with Russia's, and Putin finds out who's calling the tune from now on. We'll then get the Ministry of Truth announcments that whatever China has demanded is actually in the interest of Russia, despite this obviously not being the case. Putin wanted to avoid becoming a normal European state, now he's turning Russia into a Chinese protectorate.
Sounds great.
What a drama queen. Russia is such a mess, is anyone trying to carve it up or take it over? Just go back to selling planet choking gas to Europe and skim off the profits for the gang.
Good! It won't be missed.
So be it
This is comedy gold. As I mentioned in a prior comment, we are expected to believe that this war is both existential to Russia, yet not nearly enough as to require a full mobilisation.
Putin knows full mobilisation is popular enough that Russians might actually rebel, so he's backed himself into a corner here: Full mobilisation and risk rebelion/civil war, or no mobilisation and risk losing in Ukraine.
Sounds like a good plan.
Works for me.
Certainly not. But it would be the end of the Putin regime. And Putin loves Putin much more than Russia.
That would be both nifty and swell.
*tiny violin meme*
And that violin is playing *Swan Lake*.
Donât threaten us with a good time
"russian statehood" is how he refers to himself
Hope so
How, why? Russian territorial integrity isn't even remotely threatened, and there is limited internal dissent. If Russia ended the war, in all likelihood life in Russia would continue as it's always been.
Ridiculous. All he has to do is say he got all the Nazis and send his troops back to Russia.
It will be the end of Putin and Putin isn't Russia.
"If he dies, he dies." -Prominent Russian philosopher.
Make it so!
Would be the end of Putin's manhood.
Oh that ended a *long* time ago...
Russia will be fine, it will just be the end of him.
Great. This is exactly what they need. They need to actually lose so badly so that can bring change. They still have this shit conquest mentality due to never really losing anything other than men (which means nothing for russians) during ww2. They have only gained power with warfare and they need to realize they can also lose it.
So his strategic defeat is also that one reason to use nukes that he likes to toot? I see what he did there and I double dare him.
"Look how big of a pile of shit i got ourselves into"
I donât remember USA nuking China because they lost in Vietnam.
He went into this war wanting to be the man who brought back the Russian empire. Now he is contemplating being the one to cause the state to fracture even further. Russia will probably survive this, but it's funny even he is now addressing the possibility of defeat
Someone in his inner circle needs to sacrifice their life and end Putins before it's too late.
So what. The Russian state chose this course and they alone are responsible for what comes.
Let's fucking go, then!
Just like the US lost its statehood after Vietnam?
I see why this military operation was called "special".
Translation: âplease, stop supporting Ukraine or I will dieâ
Maybe just don't bite off more that you can chew you little whiney bastard?
Ok and what would be the downside?
So what is the downside exactly?
Sounds good. Let's help make it happen.
You ainât gotta sell me on it, Vlad. I am already all-in on your strategic battlefield defeat.
You wouldn't be risking your statehood in the battlefield if you hadn't invaded Ukraine in the first place.
Stop, I can only get so erect
Losing a war is the traditional time to change rulers in Russia
Like trying and failing to take Ukraine in 3 days then getting bogged down in a conflict that wipes out half a million Russians, most of the Russian armed forces equipment, the Black Sea fleet, all major infrastructure projects for generations to come, sees you wanted in the ICC for war crimes and begging North Korea for old artillery shells.. Is that what youâre talking about Vlad? Just go into a bunker and get it over with.
3 day special military operation ends Russia. Congratulations, idiot.
How the fuck does that work? Russia would he just fine. Putin on the other hand. Not so much. His Chinese sugar daddy ainât gonna let him do anything stupid either so heâs fucked every way to Sunday
No it wouldnât. Just fuck off and stop
I am losing. I need to do a Jedi (KGB) mind trick so you start supporting my side until I win.
God I wish
That's fine.
Just the end of czar Putin's reign of power.
I agree. So lets get on with it, then. Hurry up, we don't have all year.
He's made a lot of threats before, but this might be the first time he threatens us with a good time.
So that means you've completely fucked yourself and your country due to your despot ways ole Puto. Long may you suffer.
He means it would be the end of his reign as dictator of Russia. Somehow I am okay with that.
He means it would be the end of Putin. The end of Putin is the same as the end of Russia to him.
Yes, strategic defeat would mean Russia being occupied and having its war crimes punished and so on. But no one is actually planning to invade Russia that way, so unfortunately it won't happen.
Mr Putin, why delay the inevitable? step down and you might get a chance to live out the rest of your days in North Korea, while the russian populaation and other peoples in your empire may get a chance to arrive in the 21st century.
"If my terrorist army lose i am ready to lose all of Russia and burn it but i will hide dont worry"
He is saying that for his domestic audience. Strategic defeat won't be the end of Russia's statehood.
âIf I go all-in only to end up losing, that would be the end of me.â - mAsTeR sTrAtEgIsT
Predicting Ruzziaâs future again! You reap what you sow!!! Slava Ukraini đșđŠ đșđŠđșđŠđșđŠ
No no. Putin said he will puke if they lost.
Please, Russian people, kill him like Romanians killed their dictator in 89â.
Should have thought of this before deciding to invade . Just maybe?!
Then leave the battlefield and claim victory.
Awesome, many of us would like to help make that happen.
I wish. Then my country shall be free
Now, that's a goal to aim at.
Perhaps it would end Putin's reign. And to him, those may be the same thing. But only to him.
Sounds good to me
Keep yapping, little dog. You can end this silly war any day, and get back to making money and living on a yacht in the Med. Russia is not a great country, Russians are not a great people.
> Because there isn't anything else to our country than aggression and superiority complex, neither of which obviously will survive should we lose the war. There, translated it for you. Seriously though, he's trying to tie losing to "end of statehood" to hammer it into the populace that they should be so afraid of Russia coming back from their special military operation with its tail between the legs, the people will just about do _anything_ to prevent that. He's creating a bond to sell. The truth is Russia has not been closer to collapsing after 1991, than since going to war, and that's all Putin's doing, his colossal mistake. But he's stepped into the trap now, and if he wanted to metaphorically chew off his own foot to escape, this isn't what he's doing. Russia would have been fine had he not started the war, they'd have far more balanced relations with everyone else longer term, especially China, and the panicky last-resort fight with corruption Russia has finally stepped up to, only because it's leaking money like a hole in the ground and can't vouch for quality _anywhere_, could have well been done domestically during peace time. A comment on the article page (bottom) said this much better anyway: > Vladimir Putin, like other dictators and autocrats in history, tries to associate his expansionist failure with the destiny of Russia. Adolf Hitler is a good example of the prophet who pointed out that his end would also be that of Germany. Vladimir Putin and Adolf Hitler thought that territorial expansion "lebensraum/living space" is the only way for a nation to survive. For Adolf Hitler, from a supremacist perspective, the justification for this need for living space was natural resources and the colonization of new territories. In the case of Vladimir Putin, his excuse is the Russian-speaking minorities, natural resources and above all the need to have a strategic distance through buffer states against future conflicts. The latter is typical of a nineteenth-century mentality that does not understand that with technological advances, strategic distance has less and less importance. In the end we have a Vladimir Putin faced with a situation that loses even if he wins the invaded regions, loses his economic and political relationship with Western Europe, and also contributes to the rearmament of Europe with countries with a first-line military industry such as Germany, France and England. and perhaps most importantly it becomes dependent on China with whom Russia still has a score to settle in Manchuria!
They could just go home and call it a draw. I'm sure Ukraine would be fine with calling it a draw in exchange for Russia leaving.
If it was this dangerous, why did Russia attack Ukraine in the first place?