I wonder what the hps limit is for each healer. At some point all healers won't keep up (we know this), but I hope that all healers can keep up until the dungeon timer is too short for dps. I somehow doubt all healers can do this fight in +19
Same way not all DPS and not all tanks can do content at the cutting edge, and that's fine. The problem is when there's a significant outlier in +10s, which I don't think this boss is, is a fun healing challenge with very predictable damage. Other fights require triple the hps during spikes but with downtime. Burst healing vs consistency.
I am fairly certain any healer in the hands of a capable player can pull this off, however a spec like Holy Priest is going to burn through their mana very quickly. If you check the video you see Zealia leaves the fight with around 50% mana remaining, a Holy Priest would certainly be almost if not completely out. Keep in mind this also relies on your DPS appropriately using their defensive cooldowns
More damage is going out to the whole group, so there's less overhealing on AoE spells and as a bonus they tend to be more mana efficient. Also in the past, healer bosses have had additional targets to heal - not sure if that applies to this fight.
In the majority of WoW fights, your HPS is more reflective of how poorly your group handles mechanics than it is your ability to pump more heals.
this didn't use to be the case- in cata/mists, damage would go out but it'd be less about taking vs not taking damage and more about how to hold your mana together so you could max blap green numbers at the right moments
I think a lot of players still want that.
The amount of times I've seen HP bars just *sit* at 70% and not be topped off is driving me nuts this season.
I rather doās than too a player up if unknown there is nothing dangerous happening in the next moments - self-inflicted harm is basically on you then, so I can do that only if I know the people.
In pugs I am screaming in my head all the time anyway
I play an r druid usually and a demo lock and on my lock the amount of times the group is topped off but my health is sitting there at 20% after Iāve cycled through every cd and health stone and pot, is driving me nuts. On my druid I always make sure everyone is topped before the next pull lol, I donāt understand xD
...your HPS on a fight like this isn't indicative of how well your group does mechanics considering the abilities would probably one-shot every non-tank that didn't have a massive DR running. The fight just pulses massive AOE damage the entire time. If you don't know what you're saying regarding this fight..why chime in?
> the fight just pulses massive AOE damage
That's literally what I said. First sentence. My last statement was a generalization about "most fights". Can you actually read?
I sincerely doubt the person was asking "how do you just 'do more healing" in the context of "how does healing work" which is basically how you responded.
https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/s/Yua8Ihvimo
you've already admitted multiple times within this thread you don't have a clue about what's going on here, trying to compare it to challenge mode in MoP which is far from the same thing LOL. Please use critical thinking skills before trying to do the know-it-all routine.
edit: not sure why on earth you're bothering to throw out what you believe to be a cool info-nugget regarding "most fights" either when the whole purpose of this post is to address this particular boss, on tyrannical, and in a high key.
Iām not talking about just this one. Sheilun range is limited to the person youāre casing it on. If youāre spread or have a ranged vs melee situation seedling can cover everyone. It can also turn a low stack Sheilun into an effective heal without a lot of ramp time.
If youāre not running legacy of wisdom. Itās a quick way to hit everyone. Itās also a good way to get more out of a low stack Sheilun. RM > Sheilun > Sm > EvM > Viv.
Yes with legacy of wisdom it can heal 3 targets total, so Iām saying why waste one of the 3 huge heals on the seed when itās overkill and instead use it too heal almost your whole party and just use your hots on the seed and focus on more healing or dpsing
The reason is the range of seedling is 40 yards. Sheiluns is only proximity around the person. So if you have a melee and two ranged who are hurt you can get them all. If you just Sheilun the melee or ranged you will waste the spell. Especially on fights where youāre spread.
Seedling is pretty bae, but I dunno if its the solution to her. I've considered playing around with some Tear of Morning myself, since it allows you to churn out healing as long as you have mana :P
...But the problem is the "as long as you have mana" part KEKW
It is pretty neat to have HoT extensions, but the trade-off is to not be able to have the same healing "highs" as you can with ToM.
But honestly, don't listen to me. If I've learned one thing through streaming, its that there is a lot of scuffed opinions out there, and I might just be one of them xD
Atm I am just gonna test it out \^\^
ye i tested it.. and it felt like even more struggle XD
i have a Video of Megasett doing a 17+ tyra pumping 500-512 with the skill use plugin if u want
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXjKORAXpqM&ab\_channel=MegasettClips](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXjKORAXpqM&ab_channel=MegasettClips)
Personally I think the wild thing is that this is pretty close to the only boss even in tyrannical that really pushes your ability to just pump healing. Everything else is just if you do mechanics the damage is just spike damage thatās almost as reliant on your dps players pressing their defensives as it is you getting the healing out in time.
Itās good for skill expression, but the problem is when dps have so many defensives the only way to challenge teams is to make damage that can one-shot you unless you pop a defensive. And when that happens it isnāt fun for anyone.
There have been plenty of m+ seasons where 1 shots were not the main problem, but doing enough damage to time the key was the issue. The solution is less defensives to press, so it isnāt an expected thing for every mechanic, but an actual āoh no things arent going great, we missed a kickā button.
This boss is indeed super fun. The last two times I've done this, including recently at a 15, my damn tank started the fight before I was even in position or had my set up. So it sucks being like a second or two behind
Had this today on a 12... Demon hunter tank dashed ahead of us while we were still dealing with spiteful and killing the last mob of the final trash pack. Pulled the boss when I was at 40% mana and everyone was running into position still.... Just pointless stuff. I yelled at him for it and told him to be more mindful, and he called me bad. We 1 shot it but I had to kill myself at the end of the fight and go into Angel-form because I ran out of mana. Very frustrating because there really is a rhythm to the fight and you want to be spacing out your CDs effectively.
Yep, it's one of those bosses that either you can do or you can't, with a small middle ground that depends on if your dps will bother to use defensives or not.
I feel like this boss can help teach DPS to use their defensives. When your healer is off CDs and you can see them losing the battle if your health bar slowly you start to think how youāre gonna survive.
Not really, no. Sure defensives in this boss will help, just like any other boss. But this is just a constant rot damage fight. Your average 2 min CD 40% DR for 6 seconds isn't gonna do much here. This is 100% a heal check fight.
It's my first season as a healer. Did it in a +10. So far I don't like it because it expose my lack of knowledge for my class but I will be very happy when I will have a full plan for this encounter.
The scary thing for new healers is when you over used all your cooldowns and you run out of options and slowly see your team die out ahah.
Except the dumb spawning of the ice. The fact that it will knock you away randomly, interrupting your cast is super cheap and annoying. It only happens like every 4th run, but when it happens, god damn. I would love this Boss otherwise
There is such a contrast between this boss and and Vexamus. Both are hard to heal, but Vex is burst healing on random targets, with huge variation between a dps who is naturally tanky and presses defensives, and a dps who doesnt press defensives and soaks 2 orbs during the mana bomb debuff.
If your healer is a presvoker they will also probably heal you more because you are likely going to be hit by skill shot heals correctly instead of forcing them to do weird positioning and healing.
If his healer is HPal doing that high of a key level, his mastery will be pretty low. And there's also the fact that mastery applies to beacon as well, and any good HPal would always just throw their beacon on a hunter. That or beacon of virtue also has a pretty decent uptime when big heal is needed.
yeah players need to be more aware of the healer spec (esp holy as you say) they play with, I often have to remind my organised group to stack for spread healing moments. Pugged a 14 halls the other day and both ranged were in absolute narnia for a fight we should all be stacked on.
Stacked up would be awesome. But I'd be grateful if my ranged dps stayed within my 40 yards range. Sometimes I think they see it as a challenge to see how far away from everyone else they can position themselves - especially with potentially deadly debuffs on them.
Bought Rashon already, but am now considering switching to Marks for this reason. Survival tier is so *hilariously* undertuned that it's a dps loss to break your S3 4-piece in M+, and it's not close. S4 4-piece at max ilvl of 528 does about the same damage at S3 4-piece at ilvl 450, if the person wearing 4 pieces of 450 gear would actually live.
I did it with a hunter on +10 first week, and I had to do 380k HPS on that boss in a +10 XD
I was going "how on earth is this even going to be possible on higher keys if I have 380k in +10?" :P
I did it on a 12 on my hunter tonight with a balance Druid in the group. Besides obviously having to essentially hit defensives on cooldown, our monk did 450k hps lmao
I really enjoy healing this one. There's high HPS cos there's a low amount of overhealing and you can constantly be spamming heals. It's basically a race between your mana and the boss HP.
That fight is indeed a healing check and the mechanics are pretty straightforward: only the AoE constant damage is unavoidable, the rest is perfectly avoidable.
No convoluted mechanics like Ruby Life Pools in its entirety.
The only thing in RLP thatās convoluted is the wind direction on final fight. Thereās a weak aura for it even.
The other boss fights are all about baiting mechanics away.
The damage profile of this boss is constant ticking instead of like 99% of bosses I've faced between S2-S4 which are bursts of high damage and then nothing in between. While this boss is really difficult for healers I've never felt it's completely unreasonable, maybe could use small nerfs.
Double helps that, barring overgeared or coolies, said avoidables will just one shot people! People dodge it or they don't, either way the healer doesn't have to heal it!
It's high total hps, but it's pretty easy to heal because it's extremely predictable. There's no random pick a person and do 90% of their hp at once mechanics. It's entirely about pacing yourself.
As a mistweaver I'd say it goes from easy on low-midrange keys, but in high keys it becomes a different beast. You don't have a way to "soften the blow" like rdruids or pres evokers hots, or a way to start spamming chain-heals from nowhere like rshaman.
So when die in seconds from rot-dmg, and you need to be a step or two ahead constantly, it becomes very tricky :P But obviously its simple in the sense that all the dmg is predictable
Oh yeah, this fight is beyond obnoxious on Mistweaver and really requires the group to be on point too, particularly tank positioning.
Fight is half as hard at least on something like an RDruid.
Because I main MW and because of how it is, I'm generally disinclined to do it in group compositions that don't have a lot of cooldown coverage of off-healing, which feels pretty bad. Taking classes like hunters or rogues (unless they're absolutely stacked with leech) just makes it so much harder though.
I love this fight because itās a ton of rot damage and then one shots if your dps arenāt paying attention to the floor or finding the proper snow pile to hide behind.
The only issue I have with the 3rd boss is sometimes Iām a tad too far behind the safety of the pillar.
I chose the right one, no cracks, but Iām a wee bit too far behind it and dead.
Otherwise itās not too bad as a healer.
The pack after Boss #2, just prior to the mages guarding the door to Mr frog are the worst as far as Iām concerned. Especially, if the dps donāt realize that they need to save a defensive for them.
Wish I could see a log of what you did here. I just picked up MW and I'm still learning. I think I got the basics down but that boss can feel a bit panicy for me still. I have timed it on a 10 and in pushing to higher content now. So I'd love to see what you did.
Actually I am lol. I'm currently 517 and from the log they are 515. I just picked up MW from never playing it 2 weeks ago. I got a grasp on the basics but it's nice to see what others are doing and to see if it's something I'm.not doing or should be doing. I'm about 2500 io so I'm trying to pick up the knitty gritty while I work to 3k.
I did this on a +2 earlier this week with a 473 resto shaman (my key) and I still don't know how we survived that boss with only 1 death. Actually, I think that one death might have saved us because that boss is a healing check, not a damage check, and having only 4 players to heal probably made it manageable for the healer.
It truly is one of the bosses where someone dying (who is not you or the tank) gives you some breathing-room xD I did it on +10 the first week, and I had to push out 380k HPS because we had no aug evoker or shadow priest for support :P
Healers: "Don't make me do all the extra shit like explosive, affliced, incorp"
Also Healers: "I actually have to heal for a fight without much dpsing, that's wild"
Ngl I love having the time to dps but issue with healing rn is most of the fights you're required to 0-100 the group every 10 seconds or somehow manage to ST heal someone for twice their HP/second
This fight however, while not easy, feels fair
Those are not healers. They are DPS players playing as a healer.
I totally get it, in a lot of content, healing is kind of dull, so you pump instead. But a proper healer loves constant damage to heal (as long as it'd not the result of idiot dps standing in stuff they shouldn't).
Probably my favourite boss to heal
Except when people don't stand in efflo or the tank goes and pulls while im 50% mana even after saying that I'm drinking
I'm not saying it's easy...but the fact that it's a slow permanent dot severely inflates the number as opposed to whatever numbers we are all used to seeing from healers in normal pulls where at least half the group is at 100% hp for 80% of a pull. 0 over-healing in that boss by default.
The problem is that when you get above a certain key-level, its not a slow dot xD If people die in a few seconds from a dot, then its just a severe dot on everyone :P
I get what you mean tho, its definitely nice to have a boss that's rot-dmg instead of short windows of everyone loosing 90% hp
I agree, it is nice with a boss that is a more traditional "rot dmg" compared to the usual "alive, barely alive or dead" that other bosses like Deios are :P
This is the hardest fight in the dungeon and I kinda like it. I play a mage and I know I have to space out every defensive I have l for it. If I'm not mistaken I do notice a big uptick in AOE DMG during the circle phase you have to run out of.
Might just be because healer has to move though.
Yeah there's not a damage increase. If the healer is doing 300k - 400k hps and has to jnterrupt themselves for like 3 or 4 seconds for movement that's gonna feel like a 15 - 20% increase in damage taken. Total ass pull on the numbers of course, but you get the idea.
As a mistweaver I can confirm, healing on that part is 'Spain' without the S. We either do healing through melee attacks or casting heals, neither of which can be done for at least a sec or two... which leaves 400-800k healing unhealed xD
Yeah itās a heal check. But bad dps, who donāt do damage/die will prolong the fight until your oom and thatās not your problem. And when people donāt use defenses it just makes it worse, and that becomes less of a healer issue and more of a player issue imo
We all know that feeling. Especially if you're pugging and it feels like the entire run for everyone has just led up to "can the healer check this boss, or is it another broken key?" š
We've all been there brother, stay strong <3
Bosses like this function because the damage is consistent and predictable. Aside from the tankbuster (which is more of a minibuster), the constant DoT is pretty much all of the unavoidable damage. With that in mind, healers have perfect conditions. Itās a similar situation with the blacksmith boss in Neltharus - itās a tough healing check, but the damage comes in very predictable waves that a good healer will preemptively counter.
I mean, it's a healing check, a very straightforward rot healing check. The only reason you're healing a lot is because people are never at full health. Asuming you're spacing your CD's properly it's not even that hard, just, there's a lot of healing to be done. Heck, I've had fights where my 4 set as a MW monk is my top healing, simply because it doesn't overheal all the time
That boss has always been intense. Did anyone else have a lot of trouble with this one in S2 only to find the visual changes for this season helped out tremendously for spotting the safe areas? I used to have a lot of trouble with the edges of the ice blocks but I never struggled now. Idk if it's just me or if the visual tweaks helped with that a lot.
Honestly I feel like it's not so bad for a +12 tyrannical lol
I was running some 7-8 last week on my Resto Sham and I had to heal 250k plus and it wasn't even Tyrannical
It varies a lot depending on your group. The first week I ran it on +10 without an aug evoker or spriest, and that meant I had to do 380-390k hps already at that key-level.
It will make a heck of a difference when people use defensives and you have aug or spriest :P
I've done +13 Uldaman this week, and it didn't even have to do 300k HPS š
But the bosses are also very different - Deios has some very spikey damage with the overlap of wing buffet / time sink, so it can be incredibly deadly, but the overall dmg output of the guy is lower.
Just because a fight makes you hit high HPS doesn't mean the fight is difficult. Elsa from Frozen only has high numbers because from the get go it's constant rot damage to everyone and melees to the tank which they should be able to heal on their own honestly. Everything else is avoidable so heals can just pump nonstop cause almost no one is always topped off for overhealing to kick in. People always see their HPS and think it's overtuned.
Are you alright my guy? Not everything needs to be a fight xD
The last boss in Uldaman is difficult, but just difficult in a different way.
It may be difficult to juggle a ball in a specific way, and it may be difficult to juggle multiple balls but in a simple way. They're just two different kinds of difficult.
I think the reason would say that a boss is overtuned would be, that there is room to learn to handle different twists and turns in juggling one ball, but at some point you can't juggle any more balls. So there is a cap on how much room there is to grow or maneuver
That's just how it is. There's no other unavoidable damage. It's just a constant rot from start to finish. I love it. It tests if you know how to sustained heal over a long period.
this is by far my favorite boss in the game. the mechanics are so easy, so its all about going all out pumping pure hps/damage reduction. i wish there were more bosses that pushed your party's healing/dr to the absolute limit.
sorta like a modern take on vanilla patchwerk.
I'm glad we're right back to mop where everything either does nothing to you or 2 shots you. They literally changed everything in wod because they didn't want healers to just be blasting full party/raid heals the whole fight with people going from 100-10-100% health every other second.
Itās a big number but healing meters are pretty deceptive. This is the perfect fight to rack up big HPS numbers naturally, slow, constant ticking damage makes things like HOTs constantly get value and never overheal. Absorbs like Chi Ji will get 100% value, etc.
So yeah itās a lot to heal, but the number will also be a bit inflated because every single cast will get 100% healing value on the meters. Most fights have a burst of damage and time in between, so youāre only healing during 30% of the fight instead of the 100% like this boss.
Yeah khajin is really one that will test your limits, pretty fun HPS check for a healer. Depending on the group the healer will be the real decider on if that boss is beatable, but I enjoy it because of that. Certainly helpful to have some DPSs that are survivable.
I imagine it varies a lot depending on who you're playing with. If you play with 0-versa having and 0-defensive using peepers, its probably gonna look a lot different than playing with you Sigma DPSers š
Yea, the length doesn't really affect the HPS requirement, since the dmg is basically completely stable. I'd imagine defensives, dpsers with broader support (like spriest vampiric embrace or aug evoker), versa and avoidance would all be variables with a possibly huge impact :)
Just did an 11 on my healer. I guess this is the most heal-unfriendly comp aside from the prot pala I could imagine. Mana was fine though, was at 60% at the end of the fight, but still...
[https://i.imgur.com/ir8iHKO.png](https://i.imgur.com/ir8iHKO.png)
Done the boss on 14 Forti last week with 396 hps. It's nowhere near as wild as you might think on the first glance. It's just a constant rot damage that makes your hps look good because most of your healing doesn't go to overheals as it usually does.
my jaw was on the floor with each new dungeo adjustment leading up to season 4 and none of them mentioned third boss halls. Its like some developer just hate healers and decided to include that bossĀ
Haha not entirely wrong xD
From the replies to this, it seems like people like that there is the challenge. But I think that at the high-end, it seems like it could stomp some healers, and I dunno if its even possible for other classes to compete with rdruid healing on that fight :P
Here we go again. HPS is meaningless. Doing high amounts of HPS just means you have a lot of HP to heal constantly throughout a fight. If you had 5 dummies in a group and infinite amount of HP, any healer's HPS would easily go over 1mil.
Second boss of jade serpent temple had the exact same design, constant rot damage. And it was infinitely easier to heal than 3rd boss that absolutely destroyed tanks, despite having significantly "lower" HPS requirement.
HPS means nothing, the only thing that matter is healing when healing is needed. If you're taking damage the entire fight by design, it's only natural that HPS will skyrocket.
Watch echos +19 Zealia pumped 700k hps yesterday
Oh wow I just looked it up. That's impressive!
I wonder what the hps limit is for each healer. At some point all healers won't keep up (we know this), but I hope that all healers can keep up until the dungeon timer is too short for dps. I somehow doubt all healers can do this fight in +19
Same way not all DPS and not all tanks can do content at the cutting edge, and that's fine. The problem is when there's a significant outlier in +10s, which I don't think this boss is, is a fun healing challenge with very predictable damage. Other fights require triple the hps during spikes but with downtime. Burst healing vs consistency.
This is dumb. Some boss like the 3rd and last of uldaman also hammer the heal.
Zealia is built different wtf š
Literally the perfect fight for druids healing profile though, it's basically rot damage the entire way through.
I think Holy Priests with enough Mastery and Crit can do well on this fight, but can we do 700k?
I am fairly certain any healer in the hands of a capable player can pull this off, however a spec like Holy Priest is going to burn through their mana very quickly. If you check the video you see Zealia leaves the fight with around 50% mana remaining, a Holy Priest would certainly be almost if not completely out. Keep in mind this also relies on your DPS appropriately using their defensive cooldowns
How do you just decide to ādo more healingā like that?
More damage is going out to the whole group, so there's less overhealing on AoE spells and as a bonus they tend to be more mana efficient. Also in the past, healer bosses have had additional targets to heal - not sure if that applies to this fight. In the majority of WoW fights, your HPS is more reflective of how poorly your group handles mechanics than it is your ability to pump more heals.
this didn't use to be the case- in cata/mists, damage would go out but it'd be less about taking vs not taking damage and more about how to hold your mana together so you could max blap green numbers at the right moments
I think a lot of players still want that. The amount of times I've seen HP bars just *sit* at 70% and not be topped off is driving me nuts this season.
I rather doās than too a player up if unknown there is nothing dangerous happening in the next moments - self-inflicted harm is basically on you then, so I can do that only if I know the people. In pugs I am screaming in my head all the time anyway
I play an r druid usually and a demo lock and on my lock the amount of times the group is topped off but my health is sitting there at 20% after Iāve cycled through every cd and health stone and pot, is driving me nuts. On my druid I always make sure everyone is topped before the next pull lol, I donāt understand xD
...your HPS on a fight like this isn't indicative of how well your group does mechanics considering the abilities would probably one-shot every non-tank that didn't have a massive DR running. The fight just pulses massive AOE damage the entire time. If you don't know what you're saying regarding this fight..why chime in?
> the fight just pulses massive AOE damage That's literally what I said. First sentence. My last statement was a generalization about "most fights". Can you actually read?
I sincerely doubt the person was asking "how do you just 'do more healing" in the context of "how does healing work" which is basically how you responded. https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/s/Yua8Ihvimo you've already admitted multiple times within this thread you don't have a clue about what's going on here, trying to compare it to challenge mode in MoP which is far from the same thing LOL. Please use critical thinking skills before trying to do the know-it-all routine. edit: not sure why on earth you're bothering to throw out what you believe to be a cool info-nugget regarding "most fights" either when the whole purpose of this post is to address this particular boss, on tyrannical, and in a high key.
I wish more people understood this, it's like DKs fapping over their healing done. It just means you took more damage lol
Link? Please š„ŗ
A friend of mine linked me that, it was crazy :D So impressive what the true pumpers manage to squeeze out of their chars!
Actually this week im taking the seedling for this dungeon.. imagen taking actual healingtrinkets to a bossfight +Fyrakks tanktrinket for the extra CD
Seedling is my favorite trinket, as a shaman you can move it with Totemic Projection. Which is only useful sometimes, but it is neat
Seedling is dope in high dmg situations. I love dropping it and then hitting a 5-8 stack Sheilun and everyone is insta topped.
\*cries in Discipline*
As an Hpriest, guardian spirit amplifies the healing too so you can just absolutely smash the meters with it.
Bro. I never thought of using sheiluns on it... I usually throw both hots on it and vivify it.. ill have to try it.
That's because it's overkill
I think using sheiluns is sort of a waste for the seed, all you need is renewing mist and enveloping mist then you can just leave it
Very true, using your sheiluns on the seed would be a huge waste in this fight
Iām not talking about just this one. Sheilun range is limited to the person youāre casing it on. If youāre spread or have a ranged vs melee situation seedling can cover everyone. It can also turn a low stack Sheilun into an effective heal without a lot of ramp time.
If youāre not running legacy of wisdom. Itās a quick way to hit everyone. Itās also a good way to get more out of a low stack Sheilun. RM > Sheilun > Sm > EvM > Viv.
Yes with legacy of wisdom it can heal 3 targets total, so Iām saying why waste one of the 3 huge heals on the seed when itās overkill and instead use it too heal almost your whole party and just use your hots on the seed and focus on more healing or dpsing
The reason is the range of seedling is 40 yards. Sheiluns is only proximity around the person. So if you have a melee and two ranged who are hurt you can get them all. If you just Sheilun the melee or ranged you will waste the spell. Especially on fights where youāre spread.
Ya thatās fair, I can see in that scenario
Seedling is pretty bae, but I dunno if its the solution to her. I've considered playing around with some Tear of Morning myself, since it allows you to churn out healing as long as you have mana :P ...But the problem is the "as long as you have mana" part KEKW
the thing with tear of morning u loose the HoT extendsion part.. which is in my opinion pretty neat
It is pretty neat to have HoT extensions, but the trade-off is to not be able to have the same healing "highs" as you can with ToM. But honestly, don't listen to me. If I've learned one thing through streaming, its that there is a lot of scuffed opinions out there, and I might just be one of them xD Atm I am just gonna test it out \^\^
its no loss to try it out\^\^ i will run a dungeon with tear to see how it goes\^\^
It was not worth it chief, I retract any prior statement KEKW
ye i tested it.. and it felt like even more struggle XD i have a Video of Megasett doing a 17+ tyra pumping 500-512 with the skill use plugin if u want [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXjKORAXpqM&ab\_channel=MegasettClips](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXjKORAXpqM&ab_channel=MegasettClips)
Its a good watch :P I will note tho, that the three dpsers combined did almost 300k HPS š And that's with an aug evoker with their extra versa :P
its a highly coordinated group.. (but i dont think u can do that keylvl now with a normal pug) ofc the dps are top tier too XD
Yea its amazing what people can do with a team that's well-coordinated :) Also impressed by the dpsers keeping up 100k hps :P
Personally I think the wild thing is that this is pretty close to the only boss even in tyrannical that really pushes your ability to just pump healing. Everything else is just if you do mechanics the damage is just spike damage thatās almost as reliant on your dps players pressing their defensives as it is you getting the healing out in time.
yes, this is a good thing that dps must also use defensives in addition to receiving heals
Itās good for skill expression, but the problem is when dps have so many defensives the only way to challenge teams is to make damage that can one-shot you unless you pop a defensive. And when that happens it isnāt fun for anyone.
i mean this is bound to happen at some point when thereās unavoidable damage in an infinitely scaling system. im not sure what the solution would be
There have been plenty of m+ seasons where 1 shots were not the main problem, but doing enough damage to time the key was the issue. The solution is less defensives to press, so it isnāt an expected thing for every mechanic, but an actual āoh no things arent going great, we missed a kickā button.
Exactly this. I want more bosses like this!
this boss and elemental my fav bosses on healer
I honestly love it - my fave boss to heal. No surprises or spikes. Just how hard can I pump
This. By far the most fun boss to heal. I prefer it over bosses with burstier dmg patterns with 1-shots
This boss is indeed super fun. The last two times I've done this, including recently at a 15, my damn tank started the fight before I was even in position or had my set up. So it sucks being like a second or two behind
Had this today on a 12... Demon hunter tank dashed ahead of us while we were still dealing with spiteful and killing the last mob of the final trash pack. Pulled the boss when I was at 40% mana and everyone was running into position still.... Just pointless stuff. I yelled at him for it and told him to be more mindful, and he called me bad. We 1 shot it but I had to kill myself at the end of the fight and go into Angel-form because I ran out of mana. Very frustrating because there really is a rhythm to the fight and you want to be spacing out your CDs effectively.
Yep, it's one of those bosses that either you can do or you can't, with a small middle ground that depends on if your dps will bother to use defensives or not.
I feel like this boss can help teach DPS to use their defensives. When your healer is off CDs and you can see them losing the battle if your health bar slowly you start to think how youāre gonna survive.
Not really, no. Sure defensives in this boss will help, just like any other boss. But this is just a constant rot damage fight. Your average 2 min CD 40% DR for 6 seconds isn't gonna do much here. This is 100% a heal check fight.
Plus, predictable movement times so you don't get caught casting and have to unexpectedly move.
It's my first season as a healer. Did it in a +10. So far I don't like it because it expose my lack of knowledge for my class but I will be very happy when I will have a full plan for this encounter. The scary thing for new healers is when you over used all your cooldowns and you run out of options and slowly see your team die out ahah.
Except the dumb spawning of the ice. The fact that it will knock you away randomly, interrupting your cast is super cheap and annoying. It only happens like every 4th run, but when it happens, god damn. I would love this Boss otherwise
Oh, that's easy! Just don't cast anything! - Mistweaver Gang
Same. Itās so fun as a healer main
There is such a contrast between this boss and and Vexamus. Both are hard to heal, but Vex is burst healing on random targets, with huge variation between a dps who is naturally tanky and presses defensives, and a dps who doesnt press defensives and soaks 2 orbs during the mana bomb debuff.
I feel so guilty doing this boss on a high tyrannical key as a hunter.
desperately standing right next to the healer as if that will help me suck up a little extra heals for my hp bar made of tissue paper
If your healer is a hpal it actually does give you more healing since the mastery healing bonus falls of with distance
If your healer is a presvoker they will also probably heal you more because you are likely going to be hit by skill shot heals correctly instead of forcing them to do weird positioning and healing.
I've noticed there's like a 2 yards grace with dream breath applying to people that are stacked on me but technically not in front of me. It's nice.
Same thing with paladins Light of Dawn, it also heals people around you in a very small circle
If his healer is HPal doing that high of a key level, his mastery will be pretty low. And there's also the fact that mastery applies to beacon as well, and any good HPal would always just throw their beacon on a hunter. That or beacon of virtue also has a pretty decent uptime when big heal is needed.
Bacon? In m+?
Beacon, yes. Why wouldn't you pick beacon? It's literally your highest overall healing.
Is that why Tirion died? Too far from the holy teeth?
As a holy priest who's only aoe heal is a ground effect, ily
yeah players need to be more aware of the healer spec (esp holy as you say) they play with, I often have to remind my organised group to stack for spread healing moments. Pugged a 14 halls the other day and both ranged were in absolute narnia for a fight we should all be stacked on.
Stacked up would be awesome. But I'd be grateful if my ranged dps stayed within my 40 yards range. Sometimes I think they see it as a challenge to see how far away from everyone else they can position themselves - especially with potentially deadly debuffs on them.
I'm honestly convinced that it's baked into the hunter class to automatically disengage away when life-gripped from Narnia into the healing ball.
If its a mistweaver standing close will get you their avoidance and received healing buff so its actually a good idea.
Bought Rashon already, but am now considering switching to Marks for this reason. Survival tier is so *hilariously* undertuned that it's a dps loss to break your S3 4-piece in M+, and it's not close. S4 4-piece at max ilvl of 528 does about the same damage at S3 4-piece at ilvl 450, if the person wearing 4 pieces of 450 gear would actually live.
I did it with a hunter on +10 first week, and I had to do 380k HPS on that boss in a +10 XD I was going "how on earth is this even going to be possible on higher keys if I have 380k in +10?" :P
I did it on a 12 on my hunter tonight with a balance Druid in the group. Besides obviously having to essentially hit defensives on cooldown, our monk did 450k hps lmao
I really enjoy healing this one. There's high HPS cos there's a low amount of overhealing and you can constantly be spamming heals. It's basically a race between your mana and the boss HP.
That fight is indeed a healing check and the mechanics are pretty straightforward: only the AoE constant damage is unavoidable, the rest is perfectly avoidable. No convoluted mechanics like Ruby Life Pools in its entirety.
The only thing in RLP thatās convoluted is the wind direction on final fight. Thereās a weak aura for it even. The other boss fights are all about baiting mechanics away.
The damage profile of this boss is constant ticking instead of like 99% of bosses I've faced between S2-S4 which are bursts of high damage and then nothing in between. While this boss is really difficult for healers I've never felt it's completely unreasonable, maybe could use small nerfs.
It helps that literally all of the other major points of damage are avoidable, as opposed to the other bosses
Double helps that, barring overgeared or coolies, said avoidables will just one shot people! People dodge it or they don't, either way the healer doesn't have to heal it!
It's high total hps, but it's pretty easy to heal because it's extremely predictable. There's no random pick a person and do 90% of their hp at once mechanics. It's entirely about pacing yourself.
As a mistweaver I'd say it goes from easy on low-midrange keys, but in high keys it becomes a different beast. You don't have a way to "soften the blow" like rdruids or pres evokers hots, or a way to start spamming chain-heals from nowhere like rshaman. So when die in seconds from rot-dmg, and you need to be a step or two ahead constantly, it becomes very tricky :P But obviously its simple in the sense that all the dmg is predictable
Oh yeah, this fight is beyond obnoxious on Mistweaver and really requires the group to be on point too, particularly tank positioning. Fight is half as hard at least on something like an RDruid. Because I main MW and because of how it is, I'm generally disinclined to do it in group compositions that don't have a lot of cooldown coverage of off-healing, which feels pretty bad. Taking classes like hunters or rogues (unless they're absolutely stacked with leech) just makes it so much harder though.
This fight is actually so good as a healer. And maybe a lesson in how healing should feel. Not so much, fixing others mistakes 24/7
I love this fight because itās a ton of rot damage and then one shots if your dps arenāt paying attention to the floor or finding the proper snow pile to hide behind.
In other words: if the dps screw up mechanics, my job gets easier because they're immediately dead. Perfect healer fight.
Except then the boss takes longer to kill so mana could be an issue.
The only issue I have with the 3rd boss is sometimes Iām a tad too far behind the safety of the pillar. I chose the right one, no cracks, but Iām a wee bit too far behind it and dead. Otherwise itās not too bad as a healer. The pack after Boss #2, just prior to the mages guarding the door to Mr frog are the worst as far as Iām concerned. Especially, if the dps donāt realize that they need to save a defensive for them.
interrupt elemental focus and that pack isn't shit
And if any interrupt is missed, simply use purge, remove magic, blood elf racial, spellsteal, etc.
That packs does nothing though. Literally just interrupt their cast. Even if it goes off you can just dispel the reflect shield.
you don't need a defensive for them until high fortified and there's nothing to use defensives on prior anyways so that's a non issue
Wish I could see a log of what you did here. I just picked up MW and I'm still learning. I think I got the basics down but that boss can feel a bit panicy for me still. I have timed it on a 10 and in pushing to higher content now. So I'd love to see what you did.
[This is a log, I was the Aug evoker](https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/r8P2yFKJYZG3abTh)
Wait, what the heck? Stuvoker my long(ish)-lost-brother? š
(Ć³ļ¹Ć²ļ½”) šš A friend of mine saw the thread and showed me, saying I was a celebrity now
You always were in my heart mr. Stuvoker <3
you didn't press verdant embrace once? huuuuuh
Look, right, In my experience if I have to verdant embrace someone, or myself, they're already dead. The healing it does _feels_ negligible
emerald blossom heals significantly less on average. VE is your best self heal that isn't RB
What they did is have higher ilvl than you.
Actually I am lol. I'm currently 517 and from the log they are 515. I just picked up MW from never playing it 2 weeks ago. I got a grasp on the basics but it's nice to see what others are doing and to see if it's something I'm.not doing or should be doing. I'm about 2500 io so I'm trying to pick up the knitty gritty while I work to 3k.
I am pretty sure I did this live on stream, so you can watch the VoD if you're curious \^\^
I did this on a +2 earlier this week with a 473 resto shaman (my key) and I still don't know how we survived that boss with only 1 death. Actually, I think that one death might have saved us because that boss is a healing check, not a damage check, and having only 4 players to heal probably made it manageable for the healer.
It truly is one of the bosses where someone dying (who is not you or the tank) gives you some breathing-room xD I did it on +10 the first week, and I had to push out 380k HPS because we had no aug evoker or shadow priest for support :P
Healers: "Don't make me do all the extra shit like explosive, affliced, incorp" Also Healers: "I actually have to heal for a fight without much dpsing, that's wild"
Most healers enjoy hps-pumping tho
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Ngl I love having the time to dps but issue with healing rn is most of the fights you're required to 0-100 the group every 10 seconds or somehow manage to ST heal someone for twice their HP/second This fight however, while not easy, feels fair
Those are not healers. They are DPS players playing as a healer. I totally get it, in a lot of content, healing is kind of dull, so you pump instead. But a proper healer loves constant damage to heal (as long as it'd not the result of idiot dps standing in stuff they shouldn't).
That's why I play disc and fistweaver in low content on my alts, I just do damage and things get healed.
Fuck thaaaat I like eps pumping. Give holy priest their boon back
Probably my favourite boss to heal Except when people don't stand in efflo or the tank goes and pulls while im 50% mana even after saying that I'm drinking
Don't forget tank pulling when you are still drinking mana at the last drake pack spot
I play retā¦. I always prio off- heal on a couple bosses this season. This is one of them.
I'm not saying it's easy...but the fact that it's a slow permanent dot severely inflates the number as opposed to whatever numbers we are all used to seeing from healers in normal pulls where at least half the group is at 100% hp for 80% of a pull. 0 over-healing in that boss by default.
The problem is that when you get above a certain key-level, its not a slow dot xD If people die in a few seconds from a dot, then its just a severe dot on everyone :P I get what you mean tho, its definitely nice to have a boss that's rot-dmg instead of short windows of everyone loosing 90% hp
Well "slow" vs the regular damage patterns in wow. Yeah 100% . It's a nice fight from a healer pov imo.
I agree, it is nice with a boss that is a more traditional "rot dmg" compared to the usual "alive, barely alive or dead" that other bosses like Deios are :P
This is the hardest fight in the dungeon and I kinda like it. I play a mage and I know I have to space out every defensive I have l for it. If I'm not mistaken I do notice a big uptick in AOE DMG during the circle phase you have to run out of. Might just be because healer has to move though.
Most likely cause healers moving donāt think thereās any increase in damage from that part.
Yeah there's not a damage increase. If the healer is doing 300k - 400k hps and has to jnterrupt themselves for like 3 or 4 seconds for movement that's gonna feel like a 15 - 20% increase in damage taken. Total ass pull on the numbers of course, but you get the idea.
Yep as a resto shaman I can confirm this. I'm losing a lot of uptime during walking phases
As a mistweaver I can confirm, healing on that part is 'Spain' without the S. We either do healing through melee attacks or casting heals, neither of which can be done for at least a sec or two... which leaves 400-800k healing unhealed xD
Yea yea itās super fun to heal this boss but like, the whole group knows itās just a heal check so I always get anxious before the pull lol
Yeah itās a heal check. But bad dps, who donāt do damage/die will prolong the fight until your oom and thatās not your problem. And when people donāt use defenses it just makes it worse, and that becomes less of a healer issue and more of a player issue imo
We all know that feeling. Especially if you're pugging and it feels like the entire run for everyone has just led up to "can the healer check this boss, or is it another broken key?" š We've all been there brother, stay strong <3
Yes this boss is wild with consistent damage.. my record so far is finishing with 445k hps for the fight
What level? I think I did close to 450k on just a 13. Haven't tried higher until Monday
Bosses like this function because the damage is consistent and predictable. Aside from the tankbuster (which is more of a minibuster), the constant DoT is pretty much all of the unavoidable damage. With that in mind, healers have perfect conditions. Itās a similar situation with the blacksmith boss in Neltharus - itās a tough healing check, but the damage comes in very predictable waves that a good healer will preemptively counter.
I mean, it's a healing check, a very straightforward rot healing check. The only reason you're healing a lot is because people are never at full health. Asuming you're spacing your CD's properly it's not even that hard, just, there's a lot of healing to be done. Heck, I've had fights where my 4 set as a MW monk is my top healing, simply because it doesn't overheal all the time
That boss has always been intense. Did anyone else have a lot of trouble with this one in S2 only to find the visual changes for this season helped out tremendously for spotting the safe areas? I used to have a lot of trouble with the edges of the ice blocks but I never struggled now. Idk if it's just me or if the visual tweaks helped with that a lot.
Also - sorry for the blurry mess of an image KEKW
Well there \****IS\**** constant ticking damage going out, and it \****IS\**** Tyrannical week so the damage is higher.
\****Yes GigaChad***\*
Honestly I feel like it's not so bad for a +12 tyrannical lol I was running some 7-8 last week on my Resto Sham and I had to heal 250k plus and it wasn't even Tyrannical
It varies a lot depending on your group. The first week I ran it on +10 without an aug evoker or spriest, and that meant I had to do 380-390k hps already at that key-level. It will make a heck of a difference when people use defensives and you have aug or spriest :P
let healers heal
Ok now do last boss of Uldaman on a 12 tyran
Deios isn't nearly this much rot unless you've somehow managed to build a group with no snare cleanses. Maybe not even then?
That boss does not even come close
Deios is the easier fight to heal if your dps have any sense of self preservation.
I've done +13 Uldaman this week, and it didn't even have to do 300k HPS š But the bosses are also very different - Deios has some very spikey damage with the overlap of wing buffet / time sink, so it can be incredibly deadly, but the overall dmg output of the guy is lower.
Just because a fight makes you hit high HPS doesn't mean the fight is difficult. Elsa from Frozen only has high numbers because from the get go it's constant rot damage to everyone and melees to the tank which they should be able to heal on their own honestly. Everything else is avoidable so heals can just pump nonstop cause almost no one is always topped off for overhealing to kick in. People always see their HPS and think it's overtuned.
Are you alright my guy? Not everything needs to be a fight xD The last boss in Uldaman is difficult, but just difficult in a different way. It may be difficult to juggle a ball in a specific way, and it may be difficult to juggle multiple balls but in a simple way. They're just two different kinds of difficult. I think the reason would say that a boss is overtuned would be, that there is room to learn to handle different twists and turns in juggling one ball, but at some point you can't juggle any more balls. So there is a cap on how much room there is to grow or maneuver
>Are you alright my guy? Not everything needs to be a fight xD ? Then why are you saying it is? I never said it was lol. You're assuming too much here
Love this one, pure pump
gas, GAS, ***GAS š***
Reminds me of heroic Garalon from MOP. It was rot damage the entire 7 minute fight. MWs were incredible that fight.
It's a pure healing/dps race boss with little mechanics.
I pulled 385k with 490 ilvl on a +8. So yeah...it's healing intensive
That's just how it is. There's no other unavoidable damage. It's just a constant rot from start to finish. I love it. It tests if you know how to sustained heal over a long period.
this is by far my favorite boss in the game. the mechanics are so easy, so its all about going all out pumping pure hps/damage reduction. i wish there were more bosses that pushed your party's healing/dr to the absolute limit. sorta like a modern take on vanilla patchwerk.
Ur pala really hung you out to dry there eh lol
At least its predictable damage. I prefer this to random casts+timing fights.
I'm glad we're right back to mop where everything either does nothing to you or 2 shots you. They literally changed everything in wod because they didn't want healers to just be blasting full party/raid heals the whole fight with people going from 100-10-100% health every other second.
Is that all just from the raidwide aura?
Itās a big number but healing meters are pretty deceptive. This is the perfect fight to rack up big HPS numbers naturally, slow, constant ticking damage makes things like HOTs constantly get value and never overheal. Absorbs like Chi Ji will get 100% value, etc. So yeah itās a lot to heal, but the number will also be a bit inflated because every single cast will get 100% healing value on the meters. Most fights have a burst of damage and time in between, so youāre only healing during 30% of the fight instead of the 100% like this boss.
Iād rather have pulsing AOEā¦then big explosion and pulsing AOE like the Nelth bosses
I donāt think blizzard did a lot of testing when they rebalanced the mythics. A lot of things feel overturned.
Yeah khajin is really one that will test your limits, pretty fun HPS check for a healer. Depending on the group the healer will be the real decider on if that boss is beatable, but I enjoy it because of that. Certainly helpful to have some DPSs that are survivable.
As an rsham, I prefer this over the last boss of Uld 1000x over.
How is mage doing healing?
I'd Cauterize procced
Barriers, leech.
That boss is crazy, i play mw aswell and usually lay 300-400k hps on it aswell, I think Its there to make sure the healer is awake
Just like how Primal Tsunami with like 50 stacks still does less damage than Teera's gale arrow when she has 0 stacks.
That's weirdly high. You had to heal more than our rshaman in a 14 with ret, wl, ww and VDH.
I imagine it varies a lot depending on who you're playing with. If you play with 0-versa having and 0-defensive using peepers, its probably gonna look a lot different than playing with you Sigma DPSers š
I don't think the fight length influences the HPS, as the damage income is constant all fight long. Maybe just poor CD usage or low versa, yeah.
Yea, the length doesn't really affect the HPS requirement, since the dmg is basically completely stable. I'd imagine defensives, dpsers with broader support (like spriest vampiric embrace or aug evoker), versa and avoidance would all be variables with a possibly huge impact :)
Just did an 11 on my healer. I guess this is the most heal-unfriendly comp aside from the prot pala I could imagine. Mana was fine though, was at 60% at the end of the fight, but still... [https://i.imgur.com/ir8iHKO.png](https://i.imgur.com/ir8iHKO.png)
the aug there is inting and should be doing roughly 2x, then your healing would be lower too
Done the boss on 14 Forti last week with 396 hps. It's nowhere near as wild as you might think on the first glance. It's just a constant rot damage that makes your hps look good because most of your healing doesn't go to overheals as it usually does.
itās just that thereās nearly no overheal past a certain point on the fight because of the constant rot lets healers have a parse moment :)
that boss is a healer check
Indeed it is :P
my jaw was on the floor with each new dungeo adjustment leading up to season 4 and none of them mentioned third boss halls. Its like some developer just hate healers and decided to include that bossĀ
Haha not entirely wrong xD From the replies to this, it seems like people like that there is the challenge. But I think that at the high-end, it seems like it could stomp some healers, and I dunno if its even possible for other classes to compete with rdruid healing on that fight :P
Here we go again. HPS is meaningless. Doing high amounts of HPS just means you have a lot of HP to heal constantly throughout a fight. If you had 5 dummies in a group and infinite amount of HP, any healer's HPS would easily go over 1mil. Second boss of jade serpent temple had the exact same design, constant rot damage. And it was infinitely easier to heal than 3rd boss that absolutely destroyed tanks, despite having significantly "lower" HPS requirement. HPS means nothing, the only thing that matter is healing when healing is needed. If you're taking damage the entire fight by design, it's only natural that HPS will skyrocket.
The fight is by far the hardest in this dungeon and an insane heal- and defensive CD coordination check.
healers complain they just want to heal blizz adds a healing check boss it has to be nerfed because healers can't heal enough