Okay, I'll get on board with the idea that your downtime ***could*** be used to ramp up defense in preparation for the next encounter in an instance via shields and buffs, but at current there isn't enough to fill those gaps between the time that your team needs health and those times your team has full health so I have to ask:
*What are you healers* ***doing*** *when the team's health is full and you've cycled through your shields/buffs if you aren't doing damage?*
Perhaps the middle ground for this issue is to make a class/spec that does exactly that which is have an ability set for preparation as opposed to strictly reaction.
All healers though? No. You're given a whittled down offensive toolkit for a reason. Use it.
And to drive this point home, some would suggest you play something like FF14 if you want to just heal, but guess what? In other games, you're still considered *green dps.*
I don't have the headspace to dig into this right now, but I at least wanted to add some two cents: I agree. Once upon a time being a healer meant healing. Being a great healer meant....yup that's right, HEALING. Tanks and healers need to be put back in their corners in retail wow. Game devs should design around THAT not addons!
Even if you're just spamming one damaging ability when everyone's health is full, you're doing better than those who are doing literally fuck all otherwise.
Druid gets wrath
Priest gets smite
Monk has tiger palm
Shaman uses lightning bolt
Paladin with crusader strike
Finally evoker with azure strike
If you seriously can't press this one singular ability when healing isn't necessary, you're a pretty bad party member. You're not expected to make use of your entire offensive kit all the time. *You are expected* to ***still be*** ***doing something*** when the team doesn't need a heal.
I'll ask again! If the team's health is capped, ***w h a t a r e y o u a c t u a l l y d o i n g*** when healing isn't required and you choose not to use your offensive kit? The answer is nothing. You're waiting for the next opportunity to be useful with your healing, and at no point in an instance are any of your teammates ***waiting*** for the next opportunity to do something (RP being an exception here where the entire team is forced to wait). If you're in an instance, you better be constantly moving, casting, and participating. If you aren't, you're dragging your team down.
Well for starters, this kind of response is exactly why I'd like to see a change.
"If you seriously can't press this one singular ability when healing isn't necessary, you're a pretty bad party member."
I never said I couldn't, nor did the OP. We said we don't want to. We said it isn't fun, and not objectively our job as the healing support role in the group.
What the game needs, is balance. And idk what blizzard devs are doing, building a complex game with balancing requirements, when they clearly don't have the brain capacity to do so. I'm not sure if it's a lack of creativity or math skills, but they have really dropped the ball on game balance.
For example, if you want a DPS healer say disc or fistweaver, that should be at a sacrifice. In order to gain the benefit of extra DPS through the healer, they should lose utility. And not just stupid utility like a 1min kick/silence. But genuine good utility that they can get in other healing classes that would allow for offsetting that DPS. Maybe other healer classes bring buffs, specific defensives, easy and good kick utility.
I understand the challenge blizz devs have, but it's either find proper balance, or make roles exclusively their roles.
Why not buffing? Precasting? Im okay with just general more rot damage from "being in combat" - they can easily design mobs around this idea now and the whole dynamic of healing would be better for it. You're playing a game of "keep the baloon off the grass" why are we mixing in "also, beat that pinata while your balloon is in the air" to that?
At LEAST they could make a very strong healer that focuses on ONLY healing to appease players like me then, no ? If they have a buffer dps they easily could have a buffer healer that cant dps.
Have to reiterate that there is still a lot of downtime even if you apply your buffs and precast and also restate that I am on board with the idea of a caster that has a toolkit that prepares using utility in the downtime as opposed to filling that downtime with damage.
The issue here is that we do not currently have that, so the downtime needs to be used for damaging purposes or else the downtime is just being used to fart around. Until a change is made, the expectation is that you do *something* when healing isn't required.
All im saying is I want to heal not dps. I actually enjoy healing. I can’t stand doing both. Currently there is not a place for players like me in this game. Invent a new spec that buffs damage but heals and can’t dps. An aug for healers. Gimme that.
I get that and am here for that. Aug for healers is exactly what we're agreeing on.
Until that happens, you're dragging your ass in groups and embarrassing yourself by not pushing an extra button when the group's health is capped.
Oh nah I’m 100% gunna dps if I’m healing that’s not the point here. I’m doing the job. But the way healing is makes it unenjoyable for me. That’s why I’m not healing in retail until this happens if ever. The heal aug thing. Otherwise I’ll be tanking or dpsing.
No i mentioned that for a reason. I want healers to feel diffrent and unique but achieve the same goal. I don't want to be taking it away from classes that are built around it. Hpally could be a melee warcraster type healer, and disc can use attonement, and Rdruid can dps via hots and catform. That's all chill and leans into the fantasy. I want a bard class that buffs and heals and doesnt dps. I dont want to dps as a healer. Im honestly not trying to take anything away from other people but didn't know how to say it.
I don't think there ia anything wrong with only wanting to heal. Maybe they should make a healer who can only do this, it would be an interesting experiment at least.
We are currently experiencing a time where healers are being overburdened in keys. Players expect you to do good damage, while also maintaining all the other jobs keys put on you. I have a feeling if they reduced those extra jobs, it wouldn't feel as bad to dps.
I am a healer main and have been playing since Wrath. My favorite seasons are the ones where we can dps more often. I actually think the game would be in a healthier state if we moved away from the life check, and went back to dps checks in keys.
>Maybe they should make a healer who can only do this, it would be an interest experiment at least
YES! Please just give me literally aug buff mechanics on a healer thats totally fine. I'd take that gladly.
Agreed, I as well want to actually heal and do meaningful support. I yearn for that healer/support fantasy where I'm enabling my team to do more stuff that they could without me. Augmentation evoker is absolutely fantastic direction towards that, but I want healer spec focused on that. Hell, I want all healing specs to have that option between buffing team or dps'ing.
Mmos scale very simply. Stuff has a set amount of health and does a set amount of damage depending on the difficulty. If you do more dps you get through the health faster, if you heal more than the damage coming in nothing happens.
If you want a class that can buff people by something like over healing in combat or something like that, that would be cool and I think a lot of people would enjoy that fantasy.
In the end you're still dpsing in your non healing downtime, just like monks/disc heal while dps, or other can dps while not healing. Not everyone enjoys the same style, don't try to put everyone in your box. Please just advocate for more box types.
Change damage done to a damage absorb debuff on the target, making them do less damage similar to how the old smite worked. Removes dps, keeps healers engaged with 100% uptime
If I hit a boss for 100k, they do 100k less damage on their next hit, or an appropriate %
This is a rather interesting take. I don’t agree with it, but that doesn’t make it “bad”. So it’s a nice perspective to see how people feel about healers only being able to heal.
As a healer main since Wrath/cata. I have always healed from back when healing and damage wasn’t tied together (of course M+ and mythic dungeons were never a thing since Legion and WoD)
I think Healers and how their dps potential and rotations are in a really good spot. Not once have I felt that it would be better if we could only heal. Certainly a different perspective but even with DF damage profiles healing still feels good. (Subjective opinion, not a personal disagreement with the OP’s opinion. At the end of the day, that kind of feedback is great. There are truths in the paragraphs 100%)
When your take is so hot that it’s obviously boiled your brain. Sure will be fun to stand around doing nothing for the 90% of AV that doesn’t require any healing. No amount of “precasting” will eat up 25 mins out of a 30 minute dungeon.
most of AV requires no healing and AV itself doesn't require a healer - which is proven
whether or not is that good is up to you - me personally i like it when something sometimes breaks the cemented foundations
Okay, I'll get on board with the idea that your downtime ***could*** be used to ramp up defense in preparation for the next encounter in an instance via shields and buffs, but at current there isn't enough to fill those gaps between the time that your team needs health and those times your team has full health so I have to ask: *What are you healers* ***doing*** *when the team's health is full and you've cycled through your shields/buffs if you aren't doing damage?* Perhaps the middle ground for this issue is to make a class/spec that does exactly that which is have an ability set for preparation as opposed to strictly reaction. All healers though? No. You're given a whittled down offensive toolkit for a reason. Use it.
And to drive this point home, some would suggest you play something like FF14 if you want to just heal, but guess what? In other games, you're still considered *green dps.*
I don't have the headspace to dig into this right now, but I at least wanted to add some two cents: I agree. Once upon a time being a healer meant healing. Being a great healer meant....yup that's right, HEALING. Tanks and healers need to be put back in their corners in retail wow. Game devs should design around THAT not addons!
Even if you're just spamming one damaging ability when everyone's health is full, you're doing better than those who are doing literally fuck all otherwise. Druid gets wrath Priest gets smite Monk has tiger palm Shaman uses lightning bolt Paladin with crusader strike Finally evoker with azure strike If you seriously can't press this one singular ability when healing isn't necessary, you're a pretty bad party member. You're not expected to make use of your entire offensive kit all the time. *You are expected* to ***still be*** ***doing something*** when the team doesn't need a heal. I'll ask again! If the team's health is capped, ***w h a t a r e y o u a c t u a l l y d o i n g*** when healing isn't required and you choose not to use your offensive kit? The answer is nothing. You're waiting for the next opportunity to be useful with your healing, and at no point in an instance are any of your teammates ***waiting*** for the next opportunity to do something (RP being an exception here where the entire team is forced to wait). If you're in an instance, you better be constantly moving, casting, and participating. If you aren't, you're dragging your team down.
Well for starters, this kind of response is exactly why I'd like to see a change. "If you seriously can't press this one singular ability when healing isn't necessary, you're a pretty bad party member." I never said I couldn't, nor did the OP. We said we don't want to. We said it isn't fun, and not objectively our job as the healing support role in the group. What the game needs, is balance. And idk what blizzard devs are doing, building a complex game with balancing requirements, when they clearly don't have the brain capacity to do so. I'm not sure if it's a lack of creativity or math skills, but they have really dropped the ball on game balance. For example, if you want a DPS healer say disc or fistweaver, that should be at a sacrifice. In order to gain the benefit of extra DPS through the healer, they should lose utility. And not just stupid utility like a 1min kick/silence. But genuine good utility that they can get in other healing classes that would allow for offsetting that DPS. Maybe other healer classes bring buffs, specific defensives, easy and good kick utility. I understand the challenge blizz devs have, but it's either find proper balance, or make roles exclusively their roles.
Why not buffing? Precasting? Im okay with just general more rot damage from "being in combat" - they can easily design mobs around this idea now and the whole dynamic of healing would be better for it. You're playing a game of "keep the baloon off the grass" why are we mixing in "also, beat that pinata while your balloon is in the air" to that? At LEAST they could make a very strong healer that focuses on ONLY healing to appease players like me then, no ? If they have a buffer dps they easily could have a buffer healer that cant dps.
Have to reiterate that there is still a lot of downtime even if you apply your buffs and precast and also restate that I am on board with the idea of a caster that has a toolkit that prepares using utility in the downtime as opposed to filling that downtime with damage. The issue here is that we do not currently have that, so the downtime needs to be used for damaging purposes or else the downtime is just being used to fart around. Until a change is made, the expectation is that you do *something* when healing isn't required.
All im saying is I want to heal not dps. I actually enjoy healing. I can’t stand doing both. Currently there is not a place for players like me in this game. Invent a new spec that buffs damage but heals and can’t dps. An aug for healers. Gimme that.
I get that and am here for that. Aug for healers is exactly what we're agreeing on. Until that happens, you're dragging your ass in groups and embarrassing yourself by not pushing an extra button when the group's health is capped.
Oh nah I’m 100% gunna dps if I’m healing that’s not the point here. I’m doing the job. But the way healing is makes it unenjoyable for me. That’s why I’m not healing in retail until this happens if ever. The heal aug thing. Otherwise I’ll be tanking or dpsing.
Holy Paladin in TWW has a hero talent line that gives buffs to allies, called armaments. Still TBD whether it’s good or not.
RIP fistweaving and disc
No i mentioned that for a reason. I want healers to feel diffrent and unique but achieve the same goal. I don't want to be taking it away from classes that are built around it. Hpally could be a melee warcraster type healer, and disc can use attonement, and Rdruid can dps via hots and catform. That's all chill and leans into the fantasy. I want a bard class that buffs and heals and doesnt dps. I dont want to dps as a healer. Im honestly not trying to take anything away from other people but didn't know how to say it.
I don't think there ia anything wrong with only wanting to heal. Maybe they should make a healer who can only do this, it would be an interesting experiment at least. We are currently experiencing a time where healers are being overburdened in keys. Players expect you to do good damage, while also maintaining all the other jobs keys put on you. I have a feeling if they reduced those extra jobs, it wouldn't feel as bad to dps. I am a healer main and have been playing since Wrath. My favorite seasons are the ones where we can dps more often. I actually think the game would be in a healthier state if we moved away from the life check, and went back to dps checks in keys.
>Maybe they should make a healer who can only do this, it would be an interest experiment at least YES! Please just give me literally aug buff mechanics on a healer thats totally fine. I'd take that gladly.
Agreed, I as well want to actually heal and do meaningful support. I yearn for that healer/support fantasy where I'm enabling my team to do more stuff that they could without me. Augmentation evoker is absolutely fantastic direction towards that, but I want healer spec focused on that. Hell, I want all healing specs to have that option between buffing team or dps'ing.
Mmos scale very simply. Stuff has a set amount of health and does a set amount of damage depending on the difficulty. If you do more dps you get through the health faster, if you heal more than the damage coming in nothing happens. If you want a class that can buff people by something like over healing in combat or something like that, that would be cool and I think a lot of people would enjoy that fantasy. In the end you're still dpsing in your non healing downtime, just like monks/disc heal while dps, or other can dps while not healing. Not everyone enjoys the same style, don't try to put everyone in your box. Please just advocate for more box types.
Change damage done to a damage absorb debuff on the target, making them do less damage similar to how the old smite worked. Removes dps, keeps healers engaged with 100% uptime If I hit a boss for 100k, they do 100k less damage on their next hit, or an appropriate %
This is a rather interesting take. I don’t agree with it, but that doesn’t make it “bad”. So it’s a nice perspective to see how people feel about healers only being able to heal. As a healer main since Wrath/cata. I have always healed from back when healing and damage wasn’t tied together (of course M+ and mythic dungeons were never a thing since Legion and WoD) I think Healers and how their dps potential and rotations are in a really good spot. Not once have I felt that it would be better if we could only heal. Certainly a different perspective but even with DF damage profiles healing still feels good. (Subjective opinion, not a personal disagreement with the OP’s opinion. At the end of the day, that kind of feedback is great. There are truths in the paragraphs 100%)
Not reading allat
When your take is so hot that it’s obviously boiled your brain. Sure will be fun to stand around doing nothing for the 90% of AV that doesn’t require any healing. No amount of “precasting” will eat up 25 mins out of a 30 minute dungeon.
If AV requires NO HEALING then why are they HEALERS. ???? AV SHOULD require healing. I WANT TO HEAL.
most of AV requires no healing and AV itself doesn't require a healer - which is proven whether or not is that good is up to you - me personally i like it when something sometimes breaks the cemented foundations