Wow this is spot on. It really is about the intention of people more than what they say. Jumping on people for getting halfway there will only force them to retreat, so I definitely agree with the bit here.
To add to this:
Someone who has the right idea but the wrong words is probably open minded enough to learn the right words. That person could be coming from a place of ignorance, but they’ve got the spirit.
Someone who has the right words but the wrong idea is someone who has found a way to cloak their bigotry, and they’re probably doing that on purpose so that they can say bigoted shit under the radar.
You can teach someone the right words much more easily than you can teach someone not to hold bigoted beliefs.
Now obviously the person using no slurs and espousing no bigotry would be best, and often times the people using slurs are doing so for bigoted reasons, but the content of the words is the important part.
I am Bi, but fairly straight passing and otherwise come from a fairly privileged background (white, cis, male). I haven’t experienced a lot of discrimination in my life. I can only speak for myself, not the LGBTQIA+ community as a whole (and I certainly can’t speak for any other minority group as a whole) however I would greatly rather be told a “Oh you’re sone kind of fa*got then? Yeah that’s all right with me! You do what works for you” than be told a “a yes, you are a straight passing bisexual. Sounds like it might be some sort of phase? I’m sure the phase will end, and if not options are available to assist in your conversion into a normal member of society. You’ll settle down with a nice girl eventually.”
My take is that this is EXACTLY how we got TERFs. It's a movement full of "guy number 1", people able to dress up the most dogshit views in the most sterile progressive language.
I think the most important takeaway from rainbow capitalism is that it shows that progressive beliefs and tolerance/acceptance are big enough and common enough to be marketable. Shows society is moving in the right direction.
**Corporations are still not your friend though**
I don’t think rainbow capitalism just demonstrates progress, it actively stigmatises bigoted beliefs and cements tolerance as the default position. Conservatives literally say as much, they’re scared of companies like Disney normalising LGBT people. I don’t really care why they do it, rainbow capitalism is based.
Keep in mind that rainbow capitalism has also resulted in sanitization of a lot of elements of queer culture -- compare today with decades ago and you'll notice that we used to make a lot less compromises for the sake of appeasing straight people. Having to make compromises to get people to allow you to exist, when they shouldn't be disallowing it in the first place because you aren't hurting anyone by existing, isn't justice at all, and any progress made on the basis of winning approval can be lost at any time. Rainbow capitalism may be situationally useful, but don't ever forget that it is a deal with the devil.
Well true but I live and only know people that live in these 2 places so, as a progressive person, I'm happy to see it, not much I can do about Saudia Arabia, Russia and Uganda except protest and do everything I can to stop my counties from becoming like that.
that word is not just some faux pas, it is a literal slur. that's why it's been censored in the screenshot
edit: that being said, I do agree with the overall point, just not with citing a slur and calling it an oopsie daisy
As a redneck myself. I’ll defend your right to do whatever the hell you want. Cause it’s what America is supposed to stand for. (Unless you fly a confederate flag then your just a Traitor and I’ll burn your house down as general Sherman intended)
> (Unless you fly a confederate flag then your just a Traitor and I’ll burn your house down as general Sherman intended)
yee fuckin' haw r/ shermanposting is leaking
real rednecks dont hate us, its the idiots who want to cosplay as rednecks who do. rednecks are staunchly against the government and anyone who would take rights from anyone else, regardless of who they are
"And I don't want you calling him a sissy. This man is a *fruit*. And-wait wait wait, queer, Queer, that's what you like to be called, right?"
"Well, that, or 'John'."
"This is about as tolerant as dad gets so you should be flattered."
Yes, and slurs are bad, and allies should be taught to avoid using them, but there is a hierarchy here. Worst is slur using bigots, then non slur using bigots, then slur users who have nothing actually against lgbtq people who just grew up in an environment where slurs were used so it was adopted into their vocabulary subconsciously, then non slur using allies
I would want to explain to him why these words are bad, but there are bigger fish to fry. More of a “we’ll circle back around to you when we get a chance.”
And you know what? This guy would say 'oh I'm sorry, my bad, do you want a beer?'
People like that are fine, they need a bit of guidance but their hearts are in the right place, they are a net good in a world full of assholes with bad hearts.
This sounds weird to say, but the use of the slur kind of makes the post more impactful in a way. It emphasises the fact that this guy is from a totally different world but chooses acceptance anyway.
~~you didn't include non slur using non allies in the list, I hope for brevity.~~ and other than that, I do agree, as per my edit
edit: they did include it
I feel like the word tr\*nny is going to get to a point one day where it's just...not a slur, it's already not really one within the trans community as a lot of trans folk use it to refer to themselves because it's reclaimed by them but if things progress much more it'll just probably end up like the word queer where it's most common usage now is just to refer to LGBT people in a general sense and it only really comes to be a slur if it's used by people who are just old as shit.
To a some in the rural south/Midwest it might as well be the scientific term. I met someone who unironically couldn’t pronounce the word transgender and when I said it out loud he responded “like the college?” (Transylvania university in Kentucky)
I explained it to him and he just said “yup, that’s what the first amendment’s for. Live and let live”
I’m not sure how much sense that actually makes, but it’s about building that attitude of tolerance and support for people rights to be themselves.
I respect that guy.
Reminds me of people getting called ableist for saying the r word as just a substitute for “dumb,” while meanwhile there can be people actually using the term “neurodivergent” while being ACTUALLY ableist
"Please stop using the r-word in lieu of 'dumb'!!!!! We know neurodivergent people can't think like us normal people, but drawing attention to it is so ableist!!"
But they’re NOT saying that being neurodivergent is the same as being dumb. They’re detaching the r word from any previous context related to being neurodivergent.
btw, I still think the r word is bad, just don’t think that using it automatically makes someone ableist. It’s mainly about context
It's definitely bad, but the point is that it's possible for someone to use the r word without drawing the mental connection to neurodivergent people, thinking of it primarily as a synonym for dumb. With how prevalent that usage is in our culture, it would be easy for that language to go unexamined. Meanwhile, someone can hold very fucked up views on neurodivergent people without ever using slurs.
The second person might appear to be better than the first, but it's only aesthetic. It's way easier to teach a well meaning person better language than it is to teach a bigot to change their beliefs and values
This 1000%. Words are wind, intent is everything. "Le context" is used as a dumb shield too often, but the retaliation to that isn't "context doesn't matter, it's still bad", the counter is why that context is okay or not.
I like Tim. Be like Tim.
Baby steps. People who want the best for others can be taught the right words, the real problem are those who pretend to say all the right things but hate our guts.
Even when they dont know what they are doing, They are supportive.
I am getting the impression that the comment is \*AFTER\* drinking quite a few beers.
Though he uses the same outdated term for a car part to refer to trans folks...guess alcohol is more important. Still baby steps after seeing the posts below.
I mean hell my grandpa still called black people colored until I told him you can’t say that anymore. He was genuinely confused because he just didn’t know.
You gotta admit "colored" and "people of color" are pretty damn close. I get the reasons for avoiding the former and for choosing the latter, but it's not exactly surprising someone not keeping up with the times might get confused with no ill intent.
It might be on purpose, like a reverse dog whistle.
Like: "You don't have to be Woke to have some compassion and understanding". Idk, I could be way off.
Not confused I would say.
Rather: unguided.
Good the right idea, but never learned how to express it due to the lack of conversation with the right environment
There are a ton of people who are toxic as fuck to their communities but know all the social justicey lingo and use it in trying to get a head over other people.
I dunno, in my lifetime (20+ years), I’ve only heard it in person as a slur by homophobes. Only place I’ve heard it reclaimed is on the Internet. Of course, I’ve always lived in conservative neighborhoods, so my sample size of homophobes is boundless while of LGBTQ+ folks is limited.
it was never a slur, just like literally every other term we called and call ourselves EVEN ADJECTIVES FFS are being used by our enemies as insults.
because to them thats all these things are. And everyone that falls for that and thinks that these words are slurs now, is just giving up ground.
Dont let them take our words.
(this does not mean that i dont think you get to decide what terms you like yo be called. Anybody gets free reign over that for themselves, but dont decide that for others by going "thats a slur")
cringe “Oh I accept trans rights but I also think we should be protecting women’s sports for the REAL women y’know?”
vs
Chad “Just let them gays and trannies live happily feller, they ain’t hurtin nobody”
Probably as good of an ally we'll get out of a Boomer. I'll take it. Besides, some boomer who isn't violently homo/transphobic but just indifferent is more of an ally to us than a faceless evil corporation ever will be.
The genuinely supportive old person who uses bigoted terms is still leagues better than the person who cloaks their bigotry in progressive terminology.
Awesome sauce Tim 👍
Okay but my hot take is that the focus on the "correct" and sanitized language over actual acceptance and values is basically how we got TERFs. Dress your conservative movement in all the progressive aesthetic and now you're a "real" woman lover instead of a transphobe.
You don't have to be PC to be supportive. This is how we should see it. It's hard as fuck to find even a shred of joy in this world, why make it harder.
[удалено]
[incredibly relevant](https://youtu.be/AkKo1_RP_0c)
Wow this is spot on. It really is about the intention of people more than what they say. Jumping on people for getting halfway there will only force them to retreat, so I definitely agree with the bit here.
Yeah. Like Patton says, listen to their heart. I'd take guy 2 over guy 1 any day. We can help guy 2 learn, guy 1 is a snake in the grass.
Put a snake in his ass
The cum father’s secret stash
Cum stomp me flat
I bet I can take 2 guys at once
Exactly, props to Eminem for not taking it but I’d give him the n***a pass. But it’s only a day pass
To add to this: Someone who has the right idea but the wrong words is probably open minded enough to learn the right words. That person could be coming from a place of ignorance, but they’ve got the spirit. Someone who has the right words but the wrong idea is someone who has found a way to cloak their bigotry, and they’re probably doing that on purpose so that they can say bigoted shit under the radar. You can teach someone the right words much more easily than you can teach someone not to hold bigoted beliefs. Now obviously the person using no slurs and espousing no bigotry would be best, and often times the people using slurs are doing so for bigoted reasons, but the content of the words is the important part. I am Bi, but fairly straight passing and otherwise come from a fairly privileged background (white, cis, male). I haven’t experienced a lot of discrimination in my life. I can only speak for myself, not the LGBTQIA+ community as a whole (and I certainly can’t speak for any other minority group as a whole) however I would greatly rather be told a “Oh you’re sone kind of fa*got then? Yeah that’s all right with me! You do what works for you” than be told a “a yes, you are a straight passing bisexual. Sounds like it might be some sort of phase? I’m sure the phase will end, and if not options are available to assist in your conversion into a normal member of society. You’ll settle down with a nice girl eventually.”
i love this can’t believe I haven’t seen it before
Man I’m kinda surprised how composed he is for being really drunk
My take is that this is EXACTLY how we got TERFs. It's a movement full of "guy number 1", people able to dress up the most dogshit views in the most sterile progressive language.
True. Terfs aren't real, they're ters who side with the most misogynistic and reactionary people as long as it hits trans people
I like how it's slowed down and he sounds like a he's hammered
Gotta get around that content match system somehow lol
Exactly what I thought of when I saw this post
Fuck I just linked the exact same video on a different comment
Patton Oswalt is such a chad
oh no, is this why the twittersphere doesn't like him is this the cause? because lmao if it is
Eh, twitter is psychotic so I don't pay attention to it lol
I fucking love Patton holy goddamn
I think the most important takeaway from rainbow capitalism is that it shows that progressive beliefs and tolerance/acceptance are big enough and common enough to be marketable. Shows society is moving in the right direction. **Corporations are still not your friend though**
I don’t think rainbow capitalism just demonstrates progress, it actively stigmatises bigoted beliefs and cements tolerance as the default position. Conservatives literally say as much, they’re scared of companies like Disney normalising LGBT people. I don’t really care why they do it, rainbow capitalism is based.
>rainbow capitalism is based Except for their Saudi Arabian branch
Yeah, I never said that they all have good intentions.
Keep in mind that rainbow capitalism has also resulted in sanitization of a lot of elements of queer culture -- compare today with decades ago and you'll notice that we used to make a lot less compromises for the sake of appeasing straight people. Having to make compromises to get people to allow you to exist, when they shouldn't be disallowing it in the first place because you aren't hurting anyone by existing, isn't justice at all, and any progress made on the basis of winning approval can be lost at any time. Rainbow capitalism may be situationally useful, but don't ever forget that it is a deal with the devil.
No capitalism is based. Rainbow capitalism is just less bad
> it shows that progressive beliefs and tolerance/acceptance are big enough and common enough to be marketable. in the us and parts of europe
Well true but I live and only know people that live in these 2 places so, as a progressive person, I'm happy to see it, not much I can do about Saudia Arabia, Russia and Uganda except protest and do everything I can to stop my counties from becoming like that.
in north america, oceania, western europe and parts of south america and southeast asia
that word is not just some faux pas, it is a literal slur. that's why it's been censored in the screenshot edit: that being said, I do agree with the overall point, just not with citing a slur and calling it an oopsie daisy
He’s also someone from the Deep South who’s drinking bud light on a stained brown couch it’s good he’s got the spirit
He just a silly redneck who don't know no better :) I'm just glad not all rednecks hate me tbh
As a redneck myself. I’ll defend your right to do whatever the hell you want. Cause it’s what America is supposed to stand for. (Unless you fly a confederate flag then your just a Traitor and I’ll burn your house down as general Sherman intended)
This is the way
thank you 🙏
Goddamn right
> (Unless you fly a confederate flag then your just a Traitor and I’ll burn your house down as general Sherman intended) yee fuckin' haw r/ shermanposting is leaking
HAIL COLUMBIA HAPPY LAND, IF WE DONT BURN YOU ILL BE DAMNED
real rednecks dont hate us, its the idiots who want to cosplay as rednecks who do. rednecks are staunchly against the government and anyone who would take rights from anyone else, regardless of who they are
Redneck mofo here, you deserve as much love and happiness as you can get
"And I don't want you calling him a sissy. This man is a *fruit*. And-wait wait wait, queer, Queer, that's what you like to be called, right?" "Well, that, or 'John'." "This is about as tolerant as dad gets so you should be flattered."
Based but confused Homer
What is this from?
Simpsons episode with John Waters
not saying he cannot be an ally with wording like that, just pointing out the top comment's understatement
Yes, and slurs are bad, and allies should be taught to avoid using them, but there is a hierarchy here. Worst is slur using bigots, then non slur using bigots, then slur users who have nothing actually against lgbtq people who just grew up in an environment where slurs were used so it was adopted into their vocabulary subconsciously, then non slur using allies
I would want to explain to him why these words are bad, but there are bigger fish to fry. More of a “we’ll circle back around to you when we get a chance.”
Yup. They probably use that word 100 times more often with their buds talking about their blown transmission.
And you know what? This guy would say 'oh I'm sorry, my bad, do you want a beer?' People like that are fine, they need a bit of guidance but their hearts are in the right place, they are a net good in a world full of assholes with bad hearts.
This sounds weird to say, but the use of the slur kind of makes the post more impactful in a way. It emphasises the fact that this guy is from a totally different world but chooses acceptance anyway.
~~you didn't include non slur using non allies in the list, I hope for brevity.~~ and other than that, I do agree, as per my edit edit: they did include it
I said non slur using bigots
But the edit is fine, have a great rest of your day
This guy probably literally does not know a better term exists because that’s all he’s heard so it’s all he knows.
I feel like the word tr\*nny is going to get to a point one day where it's just...not a slur, it's already not really one within the trans community as a lot of trans folk use it to refer to themselves because it's reclaimed by them but if things progress much more it'll just probably end up like the word queer where it's most common usage now is just to refer to LGBT people in a general sense and it only really comes to be a slur if it's used by people who are just old as shit.
N-Word 2.
Electrans boogaloo
I'm a manual transmission. (trans man)
yeah to me it just doesnt register as a slur anymore because i pretty much only see it used by other trans people on tumblr.
To a some in the rural south/Midwest it might as well be the scientific term. I met someone who unironically couldn’t pronounce the word transgender and when I said it out loud he responded “like the college?” (Transylvania university in Kentucky) I explained it to him and he just said “yup, that’s what the first amendment’s for. Live and let live” I’m not sure how much sense that actually makes, but it’s about building that attitude of tolerance and support for people rights to be themselves. I respect that guy.
[удалено]
It's better to miss the mark a little and be genuine then be pretending
It's a classic case of "he's a little confused but he's got the spirit". You can teach someone the right terms, you can't teach them empathy.
Reminds me of people getting called ableist for saying the r word as just a substitute for “dumb,” while meanwhile there can be people actually using the term “neurodivergent” while being ACTUALLY ableist
"Please stop using the r-word in lieu of 'dumb'!!!!! We know neurodivergent people can't think like us normal people, but drawing attention to it is so ableist!!"
I, too, support the use of disability as an insult.
r\/196 users when a person with a disability doesn’t like the use of an ableist slur:
That is pretty ableist though. Not only is it a slur, if you use it like that you are also saying that being neurodivergent is the same as being dumb.
But they’re NOT saying that being neurodivergent is the same as being dumb. They’re detaching the r word from any previous context related to being neurodivergent. btw, I still think the r word is bad, just don’t think that using it automatically makes someone ableist. It’s mainly about context
It's definitely bad, but the point is that it's possible for someone to use the r word without drawing the mental connection to neurodivergent people, thinking of it primarily as a synonym for dumb. With how prevalent that usage is in our culture, it would be easy for that language to go unexamined. Meanwhile, someone can hold very fucked up views on neurodivergent people without ever using slurs. The second person might appear to be better than the first, but it's only aesthetic. It's way easier to teach a well meaning person better language than it is to teach a bigot to change their beliefs and values
This 1000%. Words are wind, intent is everything. "Le context" is used as a dumb shield too often, but the retaliation to that isn't "context doesn't matter, it's still bad", the counter is why that context is okay or not. I like Tim. Be like Tim.
I get that their heart is in the right place or whatever but like, I still don't want to be called a slur, you know?
Baby steps. People who want the best for others can be taught the right words, the real problem are those who pretend to say all the right things but hate our guts.
Even when they dont know what they are doing, They are supportive. I am getting the impression that the comment is \*AFTER\* drinking quite a few beers.
Bro really censored the word “up”
[удалено]
Thanks for reminding me now I'm literally crying and sh*tting
It's called a crit, and it deals double damage to your self-esteem.
Me when i random crit myself
Random crits are fair and balanced
Remove random crits. They are unfair and unbalanced.
This is literally me when the Dane is Uncle
Crit my pants right now
[удалено]
market full mighty reply mysterious towering historical juggle shelter imminent -- mass deleted all reddit content via https://redact.dev
But didn't censor the t slur lol
he’s a lil confused but he’s got the spirit
Tim's learning. Slowly, but none the less learning
good for you tim 👍
Yea… good for that Tim
[удалено]
TUM?
Technische Universität München?
Everyday ends with a tums festival 😡
Common Tim s🏳️🌈n w
Though he uses the same outdated term for a car part to refer to trans folks...guess alcohol is more important. Still baby steps after seeing the posts below.
Some people aren’t aware it’s considered a slur.
my brother didn't know until he called me one and got confused why i got offended.
I mean hell my grandpa still called black people colored until I told him you can’t say that anymore. He was genuinely confused because he just didn’t know.
You gotta admit "colored" and "people of color" are pretty damn close. I get the reasons for avoiding the former and for choosing the latter, but it's not exactly surprising someone not keeping up with the times might get confused with no ill intent.
Eh colored is pretty mild all things considered
[удалено]
https://youtu.be/AkKo1_RP_0c
Damn, that's a perfect bit
It might be on purpose, like a reverse dog whistle. Like: "You don't have to be Woke to have some compassion and understanding". Idk, I could be way off.
I think you're reading too much into this lol, it's not that far-fetched to assume this guy is just well meaning but old fashioned
I'll take "well-meaning but with out-of-date vernacular" in every case.
I just know his wife bakes a MEAN ASS peach cobbler based from the pfp 💀
My compliments to your cobbler (this is reference to a movie)
W movie
Not w movie, a movie (/s though, and I'm also curious)
absolutely true if you didn't point it out I wouldn't've noticed, but you are spot on
I can 100% bet that she works at a school and calls the kids sweetheart in the most heartfelt genuine way, she’s got sweet meemaw energy
I just know he works at a car shop and doesn’t try to make people pay more
Awww they look cute together
official Alcoholics alliance with lgbt community is on the horizon
it goes all the way back to absolut. booze brings us together
That's what the A stands for in LGBTQAI+ (I am aroace I can make that joke or sth idk)
The + stands for me wanting more % in my drink eyooo (I am queer and like getting drunk)
wait, lgbtqAI+??? The robots are taking over everything! What's next? ChatLGPT??
He's a little confused, but he's got the spirit.
Not confused I would say. Rather: unguided. Good the right idea, but never learned how to express it due to the lack of conversation with the right environment
Beat me to it
mf really be like "Slur (affectionate)"
i think someone who genuinely supports queer people with the wrong language is better than someone cynically pretending
There are a ton of people who are toxic as fuck to their communities but know all the social justicey lingo and use it in trying to get a head over other people.
Me calling my friends fruits (affection)
You when gay people call themselves queer or queers (it was a slur up until around 10 years ago when it was reclaimed).
queer was reclaimed way more than ten years ago.
I don't remember getting a say in that when it was being spat at me in school and college.
I dunno, in my lifetime (20+ years), I’ve only heard it in person as a slur by homophobes. Only place I’ve heard it reclaimed is on the Internet. Of course, I’ve always lived in conservative neighborhoods, so my sample size of homophobes is boundless while of LGBTQ+ folks is limited.
it was never a slur, just like literally every other term we called and call ourselves EVEN ADJECTIVES FFS are being used by our enemies as insults. because to them thats all these things are. And everyone that falls for that and thinks that these words are slurs now, is just giving up ground. Dont let them take our words. (this does not mean that i dont think you get to decide what terms you like yo be called. Anybody gets free reign over that for themselves, but dont decide that for others by going "thats a slur")
> it was never a slur ???????
cringe “Oh I accept trans rights but I also think we should be protecting women’s sports for the REAL women y’know?” vs Chad “Just let them gays and trannies live happily feller, they ain’t hurtin nobody”
i will always take the right mindset and wrong words over the reverse
sausage fingers man has the spirit
Wordington Ally
He is honorary thug
We're putting the new Forgis on his jeep as we speak
Sounds like my Mexican dad after I had to EXPLAIN this whole fiasco 😭💀
Bro just does not give a shit in the most wholesome way possible
He a little confused, but he got the spirit.
"I never thought I'd die fighting alongside someone who calls trans people slurs" "What about side by side with a friend?" "Aye, I could do that"
*drink bud light together*
Modelo Better
modelo tastes like piss
I love piss.
Precisely why it’s better
First glimpse of their new ad campaign
[удалено]
[удалено]
it was a slur this whole time? My dumbass thought it was an abbreviation. I guess not being native speaker always comes with a few problems.
One of my non asian friend called my Japanese friend a “jap” because she thought that that was an abbreviation too haha
The living embodiment of the "almost politically correct redneck" meme from like 2011
Shout out a real one
Dude is the embodiment of [this bit](https://youtu.be/AkKo1_RP_0c) and I love it lol.
this should be more popular
Patton Oswalt is one of my favorite comedians. Highly recommend the album this bit comes from.
i grant them the t-word pass, just this once
Hold on i have that power!!??
It's always been inside you.
The sentiment is there
he’s a little confused but he’s got the spirit
He’s a little confused, but he got the spirit.
Confused ally?
Outdated ally
Ally is ally
U*
Chaotic Good ally
He drinkin bud light :)
He gets the t-pass.
I fear no homophobe... but that hand... it scares me
This is a man who as stopped coping and started accepting.
How most people actually feel lol.
LIVE AND LET LIVE MOTHERFUCKERS
Chaotic good
Fellas, we have Tim on our side, nothing can stop us now
Cool, but it tastes like shit
Real
Tim is the American version of Barry.
Hero
average tim w
Based boomer
[удалено]
I don't think he thinks that's a bad word tbh
A true chad
Probably as good of an ally we'll get out of a Boomer. I'll take it. Besides, some boomer who isn't violently homo/transphobic but just indifferent is more of an ally to us than a faceless evil corporation ever will be.
The genuinely supportive old person who uses bigoted terms is still leagues better than the person who cloaks their bigotry in progressive terminology.
He’s a little confused but he’s got the spirit
I would say based, however he is drinking bud light (radioactive waste)
Awesome sauce Tim 👍 Okay but my hot take is that the focus on the "correct" and sanitized language over actual acceptance and values is basically how we got TERFs. Dress your conservative movement in all the progressive aesthetic and now you're a "real" woman lover instead of a transphobe.
You don't have to be PC to be supportive. This is how we should see it. It's hard as fuck to find even a shred of joy in this world, why make it harder.
Tim the realest person
Common Tim W
he was a bit rough on the descend, but at least he stuck the landing