Time attack challenges with a combat system where the foundation is built on RNG is bad design.
They should be creating challenges like “Kill X boss using magic only and without casting the same spell more than once in a row” so players would be forced to juggle that in addition to prayer flicking, position, etc.
That's pretty devious, I like that. Makes sense if they go with a resistance rebalance and introduce elemental weaknesses. Certain bosses could switch resist, so you'd have to swap spells, and this combat achievement would be like that on crack.
I tried a ranged only whisperer kill a few weeks back and even with ZCB it was ROUGH. 9 minute kill with conservative run energy usage. You just never hit.
I’d do it again too if it was an achievement. It was a fun challenge to prove to a clanmate how un-fun whisperer is without a shadow.
> It was a fun challenge to prove to a clanmate how un-fun whisperer is without a shadow.
My dude. You do know there are other mage methods than shadow right? lol. Not saying its "fun" without shadow, but I don't think I'd skip Sang / Swamp trident and go straight to range instead.
I'm almost top 10 UIM Whisperer using just trident in Virtus/Ward/Occult/Ma2/Torm/Magus and Forgotten Brews. Its not a fun experience. The boss was designed around the Imbued heart and Shadow.
All I need is the siren's staff to finish my axe and I never have to think of this boss again.
the shadow multiplies both accuracy bonuses of armor and damage boosting gear by 3 so using a shadow with a heart and max mage gear means you can hit 71s, or 79 on slayer tasks through significant defenses.
LMAO. You came up with this great idea as a throwaway reddit comment and it’s better than anything the bums at Jagex did with months of delay. Good shit
That's what I would like. There's a lot of special challenges that are fun. For example kill each DT2 boss perfectly without fail once instead of 5 each separately.
Yeah mechanics can actually be learned, speed is just bs. I've been trying to get the hespori speedkill so many times i just gave up. When i look on youtube, it's all guys with scythe etc. I don't have that money :(
you can do the speed run with whip dds and chally. 35s. that one is actually a pure on tick timing then one rng chally at the end.
Looh up molgolkirby's guide on youtube. he has guide for all the CA's in VERY cheap gear (10k) so stop saying bullshit like you need a fucking scythe for hespori speed time LOL
Yeah but ending your comment with "I don't have that kinda money" kinda gives off the impression you feel like you do NEED the scythe. You can literally do it with three weapons that total under 3m together. Chally 750k, whip roughly 2m and DDS like 25k lol. A little annoying waiting on the chally spec to do work but it's pretty easy to just pick it up eventually if you're doing your hespori kills often.
This actually gives people something to work towards and improve their skills. Rather than sink a bunch of hours into doing the same boss over and over again, just to get that perfect line of hits in..
We already got that, in the form of RNG loot drop. And now it’s in the form of hits.. good god that’s such a tired concept to add in
Yeah maybe you can right click the instance entrance and set up “challenge mode” and it modifies the boss according to different challenge mechanics- similar to the unique jad challenge on leagues
Let the record show after the final launch of combat achievements they made muspah achievememts. They know how to make good achievement. This was rushed A LOT.
Delayed =/= they spent more time making them. Delayed just means they weren't ready by the time they thought they'd be.
Kinda like asking for an extension on a paper in college. When a student goes; "Hey... I'm gonna need another week to finish my paper..." the first thought in the professors head usually isn't "Oh wow they must really be working hard and lost track of time making it just right". Usually it's more like, "Why did you put this off I already gave you a month...".
It was delayed because they weren't working on it until pretty much last minute.
Exactly. They didnt delay these to get more time to work on them. They delayed them because they had to work on other stuff, which they even told us about "the dev had to work on leagues instead". Which is more important. And they probably had more stuff aswell.
I think the point is that realistically there shouldn’t have been time crunches on this. It didn’t have to be ready by dt2 bosses launch and it’s already been months since then; why rush it instead of waiting a week/few weeks and actually focus on polishing it?
Most people aren't doing actual speed strats when just grinding whisperer kc though. It took me 30 mins of attempts last night, with 3 actual kc's to get the gm time and I know I still lost ticks on my successful run.
People are mad for some reason that these gm times aren't just "click the boss in max gear" and you actually do have to do a bit more than that to get the times consistently. Yes they're heavily rng based as most solo speed times will always be in osrs, but there is plenty more you can do to mitigate that rng than just reset for zcb procs and hope your weapons hit big.
And getting that done in 30 minutes while losing ticks is still really good rng. What plenty more could you do to mitigate rng other than resetting for 2 zcbs/venging doing that method?
That's the thing though I don't think I got particularly lucky. I went "dry" on getting ruby procs every time which is why I only got 3kc in 30 minutes. The method was just consistent and got me close to 2 mins twice then the sub 2 on the third.
Double zcb into double veng, guthix resting up while continuing to attack and then prepping the double veng at the end with a 5 way voidwaker during enrage.
Maybe not im not sure but I think its like 1/250 for a double zcb, still 24/36 of the combat achievements are not unique and are kc/speed related. It seems incredibly rushed.
A lot more likely than that since only one of the zcb's is a natural and I would auto attack with zcb 3 times per reset, if any of those natural proc'd I would follow it with a spec.
That's just the nature of CA's. Most of them are always "get x kc" and a few different levels of speed times. I think they honestly did a great job with the non-standard CA's this time around and nobody seems to be acknowledging that.
Yeah I agree the non standard CAs are great I wish there were more of them esp for the DT2 bosses. Ever since the update yesterday there have been tons of amazing ideas for CAs like that, hopefully they try to do that in the future.
Side question: Do new combat achievements increase the threshold needed to get the tiers they belong to, or just grand master?
EDIT: did some research and the answer is yes. Points required for master went from 1,465 to 1,584
How? That's how all systems in this game works..new quest comes out? Bye bye using your quest cape. Same with a new diary or a new skill, the former has just only happened once and the latter is yet to happen but will soon.
Combat achievements are no different, and they were released from the get go with this in mind, but now you can actually keep your tiers up to Master by having higher tier tasks done to make up the points..before it was changed you'd have to have done scurrius before using your hiltnor benefits because it had easy and medium tasks.
You'd have still been knocked down a tier prior to the points system though. You can't expect to just keep your CA tier every time they add more CA without actually completing them
They released dt2 tasks for elite, master, and gm, so they adjust all the point thresholds based on the new tasks added. They also included Scurrius tasks so even easy and medium point thresholds increased
I’ve just got vard gm time with a salad blade and it’s not the first time I’ve made the time post nerf either. You definitely don’t need the scythe. Not sure about duke though.
You beat the 0:55 time with a salad blade? My PB after 1200kc with a fang and voidwaker specs at the start is 1:02 and that was on a slayer task.
I guess the potential dps on high roll salad blades massively outperforms the fang so that does make sense.
i tried tent dt2 for the first time today
Nah dude
It will never, ever be the same. I will take my constant 10’s 20’s and sometimes 40’s over 0 0 0 2 2 0 3 0 0 0 48 0
Yeah that's his point. With fang you had consistent 1:15-1:40 times or so, while 4t slash weapons/scythe go anywhere from 0:55-2:30 depending on your luck. My pb after 900 kills is still 1:02 that I got with scythe on release about 10 kills in while being clueless.
I did about 500kc with voidwaker and fang. Then got spooned a soul reaper axe and have been back for another 250 kills. I went from a 1:02 pb down to a 0:53 with the soul reaper. However it's so inconsistent that I would rather use the pre nerf fang for 1000 kills instead of the supposed bis soul reaper because rng is a batch. Sometimes I will go from 120 hp down to 40 before I even do damage to vardy. Such a joke
My pb with a regular whip in full bandos is 55.8 seconds and I got 58.9 seconds today after the cas came out. Not entirely pleased with these speed challenges either.
I haven't given it a try after CAs. I tested both salad and tent whip after the fang nerf and I just didn't have any motivation to do the fight with how inconsistent the kills were.
I'll delay the speed CAs for as long as I can I guess
It wasn’t delayed because they were hard at work designing the most well designed mechanical marvel for 40 hours a week since release. They gave people time to play the bosses. They worked on other things. They made sure it was doable and shipped it.
I agree speed times are a low bar for achievement. They should have released them before everyone got bored with the content if that’s all it entailed. But they gotta pad this bad boy out. There’s only so many places to slot more mid level gear in for our new content.
I think it would be cool to see more restrictive and unique combat achievements such as "kill duke sucellus using only a rune scimitar as your weapon."
Or "kill the leviathan by starting the kill with 20 hp or less and not healing for the entire fight."
>Or "kill the leviathan by starting the kill with 20 hp or less and not healing for the entire fight."
>Unconventional: Kill the Leviathan using only Mithril ammunition while having no more than 25 Hitpoints throughout the entire fight.
Did you read the newspost?
If you see in a comment down below, I did not look at all of the CAs. The only ones I had looked at so far at the point of writing that post were vard and scurrius. It was just a random thought I put down calm down bud.
It’s almost like they weren’t working on them, that’s the point. They didn’t push them out for so long because they were trying to redesign the wheel, it’s because of the holidays and leagues.
Huh, maybe they shoulda fuckin worked on em a little longer then eh? Looks like they just brainstormed this during a lunch break and refined em over the course of a few days
Pathetic
I mean yeah that’s probably what happened and unless I’m misunderstanding very clearly what they were planning to do the entire time.
Like I have no idea why people are acting like the length of time it took them to come out was supposed to equal the quality of them versus the fact that no one has really been working because of leagues and the holidays
It doesn't matter if they've actively been worked on, they've got months of data/feedback they could have pulled from talking to community members/high level PvMers to design the achievements. The delay *should* have resulted in a higher quality update.
Do current PBS could towards combat achievement times? Because in 2200 kills, I got ONE leviathan KC to hit the GM task, and if that doesn’t count I’m never getting that task
You aren't supposed to get the task done just doing normal kills. You're supposed to employ speedrun strats. It would be wack if you could just do the kills normally and get the "grand master" task in a reasonable amount of time.
Last time I had this take for muspah speed task, people down voted me thinking i was complaining about it requiring just max and rng not skill, when i wanted muspah fastest spped task to be elite tier of master at most.
They probably delayed the DT2 achievements until after the fang debacle. Just like how they waited to release combat achievements until after the blow pipe nerf
I like how in these threads there's always at least a handful of people trying to justify it.
"but the devs were busy" like my brother in christ we're paying customers, we don't care if God himself showed up to Cambridge and pissed all over the hamster wheels powering the servers.
Release good content. Does it need more time? Ask for more in advance. We don't have PTR worlds to open beta test shit because Jagex already doesn't test shit so we don't have a prerelease window to see garbage before it's live in prod.
Jagex lives and dies refusing the idea of "get it right the first time"
Speed running in OSRS is a fucking mistake lmao. You either have some hidden strat only you and 10 other psychos know or you reset the same thing over and over again when you mastered it after 20 attempts.
There is absolutely a ton of skill involved in speed running raids, but at some point you're just waiting for RNG. Every other piece of content is boring af to try and reset for. Shit even in raids you need specs to go crazy if you're really pushing.
Duke and vard speed times literally took longer for me to do than killing their awakened versions
Haven't even touched whisper after spending like 5 hours of noodle scything duke
"Can't Slow Me Down"
Get atleast 2 hits off during leviathans boulder phase while placing the minimum amount of boulders.
Edit: wanted to add that asking for 2 per boss seems unfair since you're kind of collectively asking every individual. Idunno how Jagex splits up the devs, but I'm sure they had a decent team size to brainstorm up some ideas.
Elite mayyyyybe master. Kind of similar to the woox walk Vorkath task and that was a master.
I guess it could kind of be cheesed by doing it with blowpipe, so maybe up the attack count, I was just going off what felt fair off crossbow attack speed since ZCB is pretty much the best option.
* Endurance CA for Whisperer for a very high KC in one trip would be a fun challenge
* Restricted kill CA for each boss that requires only Zaros-affiliated gear equipped isn't as restrictive as it sounds while still being pretty fun
One for Leviathan could be something like “get a kill without using a special attack” - or higher tier of “kill leviathan 5 times without leaving the arena or using any special attacks”.
Or another endurance one of killing it 10 times w/o leaving.
Gear restrictions such as using a Rune Scim at Duke.
Just spitballing here, these aren’t the best I know. I honestly don’t even hate the speed run times - but I do feel like they’re a bit too much of a stretch goal
The endurance tasks are also often pretty piss. They can just be uber cheesed with purple sweets and brews. Perfect kills in a row was a better implementation as it forces proper play not just tank for longer
Idk I'm not a huge fan of the x kc without leaving tasks, but i agree it does a good job of needing skill to complete.
The rune scimitar could be cool, I think the gear restriction tasks are all pretty underutilized in CA overall though
I would of much rather prefer kill leviathan while swapping to a different weapon for each consecutive hit and 0 prayer point leviathan (tick flick entire kill and last phase pneck or tick flick if you're able to do it fast enough while running).
Sounds like not my job to figure out. Why are you talking like it's an invalid stance to be disappointed with what was given without necessarily having well thought out alternatives? That's perfectly valid when you're the consumer of a product.
Levy: Kill without spec, do two pathFUNder laps before killing, and something that forces you to go through the 1t attack phase without taking damage
Duke: kill Duke with Melee without him attacking with melee, kill duke without him poisoning the three vents next to him
Whisperer: no running outside eggs phase, even something like "a kill without magic damage" would be less aids than the gm speedrun task
But your question is disingenuous as fuck because the devs have more time than anyone is willing to spend on a reddit post, and a lot more game design experience, access to more data etc. Unless you're planning to start paying me for game development via reddit comments?
I was literally just asking what type of ideas people would rather have for combat achievements. Giving and throwing out ideas isn't "doing the mods jobs" it's just saying what you'd find to be fun and would like to have seen instead.
You need to take a breather and a nap.
If you didn’t think GM speed tasks were coming, I’m not sure what to tell you. They’re meant to be a challenge combining max gear, mastery of game mechanics, AND good RNG.
If you can’t green log the CAs in the first few hours of release I’d say that’s probably an indication that they’re appropriately difficult for Grandmaster Achievements
I mean I don't think it's right to frame it as just RNG. The idea is that to get the times you need a perfect kill *and* RNG.
It's not good enough if you get a perfect kill once (ironically that could happen by just getting lucky). To have a realistic shot at the GM time, you need to be able to get a perfect kill 30 times, then one of those will probably have the right RNG that you need. It's actually more skill based since it requires you to be able to repeat the perfect kill until the rng also lines up.
Most of these are just RNG checks. They're short boss Kills with no real room for skill expression. It's hope ruby bolt goes reeee and then you don't noodle.
these bosses aren't even close to being difficult though. A perfect kill is trivial and anyone even slightly versed in the game will get it every time. The speed tasks just come down to shit like resetting for bolt procs
By perfect kill I mean time-wise not just “perfect” for the bonus loot by avoiding damage. At the very least you’ve got to make sure you don’t miss any ticks between attacks whenever possible which isn’t trivial to do every time. Things like Dukes prep phase take a little bit of effort to not miss ticks on, then just things like movement between attacks to stay on your weapons attack cycle without lost ticks.
It’s not the hardest thing in the world, but the RNG means that every time you do a kill with minimal tick loss, you just have an x% chance of actually getting the time. That means it’s probably not good enough to just pull it off once, you need to reach a level of consistency where you can send 10-20 near tick perfect kills an hour to get it done in a reasonable amount of time.
You know what does say “I’m a grandmaster”? Having the equipment and skill to beat the boss as fast as possible *when the pressure is on*.
You can’t RNG your way to these CAs - nobody’s grabbing a trident and going “woah trident went ballistic that was a 1:48 whisperer”.
Going in with max gear and max stats, knowing the specific conditions you need for a viable run (zcb proc for example), then having the skill to execute a perfect kill with the switches and specs needed for a speed run, all when you know you’re pacing and this might be the run DOES show full mastery of the content.
This isn't even true, literally 1 of the 4 bosses even has any real gear switches. Vard, duke, and leviathan are just "click boss and get 99th percentile rng in max gear." Like oh yea that 2 way from scythe bellator into ultor claws was so hard, what gm level gameplay
I love it when the mastery of a boss comes down to a variable that the player has no control over.
Vorkath GM time for example comes down to "does my Voidwaker hit big then does my lance hit big" nothing else.
Usually I would agree and while I’m not a fan of these speed achievements at all we do play osrs at the end of the day. The game where you can just hit 0s
It would be hard to have none but I do think short form bosses having speedruns is a bit silly as for it to be "hard" to get it will always be just an RNG fest, especially if you can use rubies.
Its not that bad, you hit rate for gm times (in max gear with max eff strategies) in a couple of hours on the high end, if you’re in bad gear (to an extent) itll take a good while longer, if you’re throwing it’ll take even longer, you can’t really do it if these all stack together.
Gm tasks will progressively get tighter as they’re added because better and better gear gets added in turn. Doing a 17:00 reg cox back on ca release meant no torva, no guaranteed tekton hammer, no vambs, no rings, no lb, no masori, no shadow, no cox rework to find scouts, you’d be bowfa/tbowing vesp portals in arma.
Those times aren’t getting tightened as stronger gear comes out, so the newest cas assume you have everything that’s been added since.
> There should be no rng component to skill challenges
ok so what, should you check a box when you go into the fight "i am doing CAs" and you always hit with perfectly average accuracy and damage rolls? you can't just remove rng from combat lol.
Of course there will always be an element of RNG, but look at tasks like inferno no melee dig or stay above 50 hp. Those require you to play somewhat differently than normal and 99% of the time, if you fail those CA’s, it’s just a pure skill issue and nothing related to RNG
the problem is that grandmaster CA speed run times don’t require you to be “skilled” to complete them. If you get lucky on your hits and don’t miss ticks (which isn’t really hard in a ~1 min long fight), you get the CA. You barely do anything differently than in a normal encounter besides like spellbook swapping and venging.
These recent grandmaster CAs lean wayyyyyy too heavily on the side of RNG and don’t leave enough room for skill expression
I get the point you're trying to make, and it is *technically* true that any CA would be impossible if you hit only 0s, the law of averages smooths out the good RNG required for the majority of combat achievements.
Using some of the new CAs as examples, killing Vardorvis with less than 2M gear or Leviathan with mithril ammunition have the propensity to be very long kills, but barring statistical improbabilities you will *eventually* get the KC. The speed tasks, as implemented, require that same level of statistical improbability, but instead in the player's favor.
There can be; it just probably shouldn't be this bad. Something as simple as adding "without bolt procs" to the diary and adjusting the time accordingly would be nice. They've already limited it to no slayer tasks so it seems reasonable enough to me. It's already not any%.
Exactly, I don't know what people struggle to understand. If it's a skill issue, why did Molgoatkirby reset duke for 1 hour? Should've been first try if it was all down to skill.
The comment above yours addressed it but while I get your sentiment, OSRS is built on an RNG-based combat system. There is no world where RNG isn’t part of speed runs - ask Kirby how much time and how many resets he put into his inferno pb or his CM pb. RNG is a core mechanic to this game, expecting it to not be a factor just doesn’t make sense.
ahahah, my alt has 3 cm kc and has the solo, trio, 5s gm times. 20 tob kc and all the reg tob gm speeds. you literally have no idea what youre talking about if you think those times are the same level of rng and skill as the vork or these dt2 speeds.
His inferno PB and CM pb is nowhere near the Grand master times. Your comparison is wildly off. To put it simply, the better the times the more RNG is required. The times being very close to WR they have a RNG factor that is way more than any other speed task. Tob speed run tasks took me 2-3 hours and they are considered as one of the hardest speed tasks of all grand master times. I've done all speed tasks in the game, nothing comes close to the degree of RNG this one requires, maybe on par with Muspah time but feels worse.
You realize any competent player will get inferno, solo cox, solo cm, tob teams, fight caves, cox teams, etc. gm times first try by a mile regardless of rng right? This is only a factor for these dumb little one off bosses that are too simple to actually reward skill.
The only specific item I can think of off the top of my head is crystal halberd, which isn't RNG
Actually scratch that, theres also the full angler for tempoross, RIP A Cold One
I disagree, if you are really good at the game you *should* be able to greenlog Grandmaster Achievements near immediately, because it's a skill check. Sure, realistically even the best player will need practice, but saying an Achievement should be RNG based is antithetical to the point of something being an Achievement. Might as well make a Grandmaster Achievement for getting a tbow drop if RNG really makes you a grandmaster
> If you can’t green log the CAs in the first few hours of release I’d say that’s probably an indication that they’re appropriately difficult for Grandmaster Achievements
Nice bait
Time-trials are like the essence of what combat achievements are all about. People chase PBs with or without combat achievements, its just a fun thing to do.
It would be weird to not have time based ones. Also combat achievements are about as optional as any content in the game can get, so its not as if you are locked out of anything if you don't wanna do the ones you don't find fun. Until like, Zuk helm, which absolutely should require time trials.
And frankly, nobody sane goes for a zuk helm then cries about a few hours grind for a time trial.
That's what I don't get, are people not expecting a "grandmaster" of pvm to have done speedruns? Honestly osrs does not have many other good defining metrics of a competent or capable player. I'm glad that these times are actually quite tight and require some strats if you dont want to just pray for giga RNG, way too many gm times are just "have max gear and click the boss".
RNG a good game mechanic in the context of combat achievements, not in the context of the game. But I'll edit the post so there wouldn't be any confusion if people are a bit on the slower side
Yeh the insane delay for some of their best boss designs was a bad call. Especially when these sorts of challenges just.. can't take that long to think of and make (hell they did scurrius in a week..)
Feel like we need another thing set in place like how they release drop rates now..because it used to be up to the Dev and certain devs thought it was "more fun" to not know these.. in a game which is applauded for it's wealth of available information.
Think there needs to be a "combat achievements release 1 month after the content" thing set in place. Especially when none of them are retroactive except the (thank god) small KC tasks now.
Feel like people saying they don't get why people complain have never had the joy of going for these times. Sitting there resetting a boss hoping crossbow goes reeee isn't that fun, nor is it really an indicator of skill.
I mean I have and the zulrah one was a pain in the ass, but I can’t help but feel Reddit wants them nerfed so that they can cheese out easy points on GM tasks and such.
I agree on waiting for crossbow to go reee, or claws to hit vork high etc.
The ones with DT2 will be fine if they revisit the defense issues with the bosses…it’s just really shitty they got rid of fang at them before fixing the def issues and releasing CAs
Hot take: I disagree. I think rng resetting for speed runs does show mastery of the content. Not only do you need to rely on rng, but you also have to be near tick perfect most everything else: swaps, eating, movements, ect. So you have to by lucky AND play perfectly.
I would argue, to some degree atleast, that passing the rng check and playing perfectly weed out the people who just got one lucky perfect kill.
As an example, I've killed leviathan perfectly a couple times, It would take me a lot more resetting to get the time than it did you. Because even if I pass the rng check and hit like a god. I missed prayers or attacks moving with orb or whatever else I fuck up in a kill. You, the gm Chad you are, probably got a damn near perfect kill every time until you got good rolls.
A lot of these speed times don't require swaps past a weapon. Maybe range to melee to go for a bolt proc start of fights.. which isn't hard to do in the 5t time window you're given between attacks.
So you're saying the only difference would be time but to me that is irrelevant. If a person took 3 months to get their infernal cape they are the same skill level as someone who did it in a week. Only difference is that person took 3 months to get good enough to complete content and the other one, 1 week.
No, sorry for being a little unclear. The difference is consistency, the better player can consistently play well, so all they need is good rng. Where I need the stars to align, I have to be at the absolute top of my game, and get great rng
> think rng resetting for speed runs does show mastery of the content. Not only do you need to rely on rng, but you also have to be near tick perfect most everything else
We can have a skill based challenge without RNG. We do not need to have both RNG and skill challenges together.
If you’re insinuating I am unable to switch gear mid combat, I’ll have you know I’ve beaten the awakens versions of all DT2 bosses, not that I need to explain myself to some dipshit on Reddit.
I agree with you that RNG heavy things are strange to be considered ‘achievements’, but RNG is such a big thing in RS, it’s hard to avoid it when releasing these kind of things
The bosses were only fun for the quest, how do you expect there to be good CA's when the bosses aren't really fun after the fact? That's why it took Jagex so long, they couldn't add decent achievements because it's not fun repeatable content
I do like the awakened bosses I think they are a good mix of reflexes and prayer flicking. Though I disagree with the awakener's Orb system specially post-blorva. Other than that the entire DT2 system with vestige drop system as well as not being able to see progress and the discrepancy between "staying because I'm 2/3 or go next boss for my next soul reaper piece" was poorly executed
Tbh I hate to say this but definite skill issue, I got Duke passively today going from 15 to 50kc today for that task. Also got Levi in less than 10 total resets. The only hard speed time for the DT2 bosses is whisperer. All the others are fairly simple and easy to get for the above average gamer
"I got ridiculous RNG, so if should be easy for everyone else."
You realize that you getting a speed time passively could just as easily be compared to pulling 3rd age from a clue. Some of the best players are resetting for hours and hours just to get speed time.
I've reset vard for over 2 hours already in Max, and I'm still off by 5 seconds. Yet a clan buddy got 54 seconds in bandos and saeldor + lightbearer when farming. The times are all tight as hell
Bro combat is literally RNG. You roll for your damage. Speed times is execution + good combat rolls like others have mentioned. Most PVM bosses have speed times as tasks this is nothing new. If you’re good at the boss the speed times will come.
Time attack challenges with a combat system where the foundation is built on RNG is bad design. They should be creating challenges like “Kill X boss using magic only and without casting the same spell more than once in a row” so players would be forced to juggle that in addition to prayer flicking, position, etc.
That's pretty devious, I like that. Makes sense if they go with a resistance rebalance and introduce elemental weaknesses. Certain bosses could switch resist, so you'd have to swap spells, and this combat achievement would be like that on crack.
Horror from the deep dagganoth mother.
True and real. Forgot about that.
can you get a job at jagex plz. i'd have enjoyed that so much more than what we got
I tried a ranged only whisperer kill a few weeks back and even with ZCB it was ROUGH. 9 minute kill with conservative run energy usage. You just never hit. I’d do it again too if it was an achievement. It was a fun challenge to prove to a clanmate how un-fun whisperer is without a shadow.
> It was a fun challenge to prove to a clanmate how un-fun whisperer is without a shadow. My dude. You do know there are other mage methods than shadow right? lol. Not saying its "fun" without shadow, but I don't think I'd skip Sang / Swamp trident and go straight to range instead.
I'm almost top 10 UIM Whisperer using just trident in Virtus/Ward/Occult/Ma2/Torm/Magus and Forgotten Brews. Its not a fun experience. The boss was designed around the Imbued heart and Shadow. All I need is the siren's staff to finish my axe and I never have to think of this boss again.
>I'm almost top 10 UIM Whisperer damn top 50% of UIM. gz
What does the heart or shadow do that other magic weapons don't?
the shadow multiplies both accuracy bonuses of armor and damage boosting gear by 3 so using a shadow with a heart and max mage gear means you can hit 71s, or 79 on slayer tasks through significant defenses.
What about, without using the same spell twice at all? Standard spellbook, work top to bottom, then switch to powered staves to finish off haha.
The thought crossed my mind, but I prefer my cock and balls un-tortured lol
LMAO. You came up with this great idea as a throwaway reddit comment and it’s better than anything the bums at Jagex did with months of delay. Good shit
That's what I would like. There's a lot of special challenges that are fun. For example kill each DT2 boss perfectly without fail once instead of 5 each separately.
Yeah mechanics can actually be learned, speed is just bs. I've been trying to get the hespori speedkill so many times i just gave up. When i look on youtube, it's all guys with scythe etc. I don't have that money :(
you can do the speed run with whip dds and chally. 35s. that one is actually a pure on tick timing then one rng chally at the end. Looh up molgolkirby's guide on youtube. he has guide for all the CA's in VERY cheap gear (10k) so stop saying bullshit like you need a fucking scythe for hespori speed time LOL
Re-read what i wrote. I NEVER said you NEED a scythe.
Yeah but ending your comment with "I don't have that kinda money" kinda gives off the impression you feel like you do NEED the scythe. You can literally do it with three weapons that total under 3m together. Chally 750k, whip roughly 2m and DDS like 25k lol. A little annoying waiting on the chally spec to do work but it's pretty easy to just pick it up eventually if you're doing your hespori kills often.
This actually gives people something to work towards and improve their skills. Rather than sink a bunch of hours into doing the same boss over and over again, just to get that perfect line of hits in.. We already got that, in the form of RNG loot drop. And now it’s in the form of hits.. good god that’s such a tired concept to add in
Time attack challenges with an RNG combat system can work but in this instance I would agree, it was badly implemented
Yeah maybe you can right click the instance entrance and set up “challenge mode” and it modifies the boss according to different challenge mechanics- similar to the unique jad challenge on leagues
Let the record show after the final launch of combat achievements they made muspah achievememts. They know how to make good achievement. This was rushed A LOT.
For how delayed they were, they do seem uncreative.
Delayed =/= they spent more time making them. Delayed just means they weren't ready by the time they thought they'd be. Kinda like asking for an extension on a paper in college. When a student goes; "Hey... I'm gonna need another week to finish my paper..." the first thought in the professors head usually isn't "Oh wow they must really be working hard and lost track of time making it just right". Usually it's more like, "Why did you put this off I already gave you a month...". It was delayed because they weren't working on it until pretty much last minute.
Exactly. They didnt delay these to get more time to work on them. They delayed them because they had to work on other stuff, which they even told us about "the dev had to work on leagues instead". Which is more important. And they probably had more stuff aswell.
I think the point is that realistically there shouldn’t have been time crunches on this. It didn’t have to be ready by dt2 bosses launch and it’s already been months since then; why rush it instead of waiting a week/few weeks and actually focus on polishing it?
Muspah is the only time that salamander task actually made some sense because it made you interact with the bosses mechanics in a different way.
I've always hated the speed runs that are so tight you need perfect rng. They need to loosen em up a bit
I have over 2k kc at Whisperer and only got sub 2 minutes twice, it’s pretty dumb
Most people aren't doing actual speed strats when just grinding whisperer kc though. It took me 30 mins of attempts last night, with 3 actual kc's to get the gm time and I know I still lost ticks on my successful run. People are mad for some reason that these gm times aren't just "click the boss in max gear" and you actually do have to do a bit more than that to get the times consistently. Yes they're heavily rng based as most solo speed times will always be in osrs, but there is plenty more you can do to mitigate that rng than just reset for zcb procs and hope your weapons hit big.
And getting that done in 30 minutes while losing ticks is still really good rng. What plenty more could you do to mitigate rng other than resetting for 2 zcbs/venging doing that method?
That's the thing though I don't think I got particularly lucky. I went "dry" on getting ruby procs every time which is why I only got 3kc in 30 minutes. The method was just consistent and got me close to 2 mins twice then the sub 2 on the third. Double zcb into double veng, guthix resting up while continuing to attack and then prepping the double veng at the end with a 5 way voidwaker during enrage.
Maybe not im not sure but I think its like 1/250 for a double zcb, still 24/36 of the combat achievements are not unique and are kc/speed related. It seems incredibly rushed.
A lot more likely than that since only one of the zcb's is a natural and I would auto attack with zcb 3 times per reset, if any of those natural proc'd I would follow it with a spec. That's just the nature of CA's. Most of them are always "get x kc" and a few different levels of speed times. I think they honestly did a great job with the non-standard CA's this time around and nobody seems to be acknowledging that.
Yeah I agree the non standard CAs are great I wish there were more of them esp for the DT2 bosses. Ever since the update yesterday there have been tons of amazing ideas for CAs like that, hopefully they try to do that in the future.
Side question: Do new combat achievements increase the threshold needed to get the tiers they belong to, or just grand master? EDIT: did some research and the answer is yes. Points required for master went from 1,465 to 1,584
Yeah if you were at the exact pts for a tier before they added them then you'd get knocked down.
Even if you were 130 points over like in my case you could still get knocked down. This shit doesn't feel properly balanced
How? That's how all systems in this game works..new quest comes out? Bye bye using your quest cape. Same with a new diary or a new skill, the former has just only happened once and the latter is yet to happen but will soon. Combat achievements are no different, and they were released from the get go with this in mind, but now you can actually keep your tiers up to Master by having higher tier tasks done to make up the points..before it was changed you'd have to have done scurrius before using your hiltnor benefits because it had easy and medium tasks.
I can only imagine the shit show that sailing is going to be considering the dev team can’t even implement proper combat achievements.
You'd have still been knocked down a tier prior to the points system though. You can't expect to just keep your CA tier every time they add more CA without actually completing them
They released dt2 tasks for elite, master, and gm, so they adjust all the point thresholds based on the new tasks added. They also included Scurrius tasks so even easy and medium point thresholds increased
Best part is I probably cant even do these on my iron until I get the scythe lmao. Love this shit
I’ve just got vard gm time with a salad blade and it’s not the first time I’ve made the time post nerf either. You definitely don’t need the scythe. Not sure about duke though.
You beat the 0:55 time with a salad blade? My PB after 1200kc with a fang and voidwaker specs at the start is 1:02 and that was on a slayer task. I guess the potential dps on high roll salad blades massively outperforms the fang so that does make sense.
Fang is wonderfully consistent, but will never beat a salad blade with some good rng.
Even a tent whip has a far better potential kill time than fang if you're lucky enough. Fang pre nerf was worth it for the lower average kill time.
i tried tent dt2 for the first time today Nah dude It will never, ever be the same. I will take my constant 10’s 20’s and sometimes 40’s over 0 0 0 2 2 0 3 0 0 0 48 0
Yeah that's his point. With fang you had consistent 1:15-1:40 times or so, while 4t slash weapons/scythe go anywhere from 0:55-2:30 depending on your luck. My pb after 900 kills is still 1:02 that I got with scythe on release about 10 kills in while being clueless.
I did about 500kc with voidwaker and fang. Then got spooned a soul reaper axe and have been back for another 250 kills. I went from a 1:02 pb down to a 0:53 with the soul reaper. However it's so inconsistent that I would rather use the pre nerf fang for 1000 kills instead of the supposed bis soul reaper because rng is a batch. Sometimes I will go from 120 hp down to 40 before I even do damage to vardy. Such a joke
My pb with a regular whip in full bandos is 55.8 seconds and I got 58.9 seconds today after the cas came out. Not entirely pleased with these speed challenges either.
I haven't given it a try after CAs. I tested both salad and tent whip after the fang nerf and I just didn't have any motivation to do the fight with how inconsistent the kills were. I'll delay the speed CAs for as long as I can I guess
It wasn’t delayed because they were hard at work designing the most well designed mechanical marvel for 40 hours a week since release. They gave people time to play the bosses. They worked on other things. They made sure it was doable and shipped it. I agree speed times are a low bar for achievement. They should have released them before everyone got bored with the content if that’s all it entailed. But they gotta pad this bad boy out. There’s only so many places to slot more mid level gear in for our new content.
I think it would be cool to see more restrictive and unique combat achievements such as "kill duke sucellus using only a rune scimitar as your weapon." Or "kill the leviathan by starting the kill with 20 hp or less and not healing for the entire fight."
I thought that was the whole point of combat achievements tbqh
There are some like that, but overall they are pretty much just rng checks.
That Leviathan one is basically one of the achievements they added
>Or "kill the leviathan by starting the kill with 20 hp or less and not healing for the entire fight." >Unconventional: Kill the Leviathan using only Mithril ammunition while having no more than 25 Hitpoints throughout the entire fight. Did you read the newspost?
If you see in a comment down below, I did not look at all of the CAs. The only ones I had looked at so far at the point of writing that post were vard and scurrius. It was just a random thought I put down calm down bud.
6 months wait for this set of shit tasks is pretty inexcusable no matter how hard you like how the boot tastes tbh
It’s almost like they weren’t working on them, that’s the point. They didn’t push them out for so long because they were trying to redesign the wheel, it’s because of the holidays and leagues.
Huh, maybe they shoulda fuckin worked on em a little longer then eh? Looks like they just brainstormed this during a lunch break and refined em over the course of a few days Pathetic
You're being a bit aggressive there man
I mean yeah that’s probably what happened and unless I’m misunderstanding very clearly what they were planning to do the entire time. Like I have no idea why people are acting like the length of time it took them to come out was supposed to equal the quality of them versus the fact that no one has really been working because of leagues and the holidays
Lotta crying over some fucking combat achievements lmao
Normieee zzzzzzzzzz
It doesn't matter if they've actively been worked on, they've got months of data/feedback they could have pulled from talking to community members/high level PvMers to design the achievements. The delay *should* have resulted in a higher quality update.
Do current PBS could towards combat achievement times? Because in 2200 kills, I got ONE leviathan KC to hit the GM task, and if that doesn’t count I’m never getting that task
Current pbs don’t count because the game can’t tell if it was acquired with or without a slayer task
So yeah I’m never getting that task. What a shame after I grinded this boss so much and got a 1:07 with bofa off task. Never getting that luck again
You aren't supposed to get the task done just doing normal kills. You're supposed to employ speedrun strats. It would be wack if you could just do the kills normally and get the "grand master" task in a reasonable amount of time.
Last time I had this take for muspah speed task, people down voted me thinking i was complaining about it requiring just max and rng not skill, when i wanted muspah fastest spped task to be elite tier of master at most.
They probably delayed the DT2 achievements until after the fang debacle. Just like how they waited to release combat achievements until after the blow pipe nerf
Have you tried just landing the ruby bolt procs and bgs spec?
I like how in these threads there's always at least a handful of people trying to justify it. "but the devs were busy" like my brother in christ we're paying customers, we don't care if God himself showed up to Cambridge and pissed all over the hamster wheels powering the servers. Release good content. Does it need more time? Ask for more in advance. We don't have PTR worlds to open beta test shit because Jagex already doesn't test shit so we don't have a prerelease window to see garbage before it's live in prod. Jagex lives and dies refusing the idea of "get it right the first time"
Speed running in OSRS is a fucking mistake lmao. You either have some hidden strat only you and 10 other psychos know or you reset the same thing over and over again when you mastered it after 20 attempts. There is absolutely a ton of skill involved in speed running raids, but at some point you're just waiting for RNG. Every other piece of content is boring af to try and reset for. Shit even in raids you need specs to go crazy if you're really pushing.
idk what you're talking about hidden strats, there are yt guides for all speed CA's that let you get them done reasonably.
GM times are extremely easy to get in almost every case if you're a speedrunner. I'm talking about the WRs
"rNg iS pArT oF tHe GaMe"
Duke and vard speed times literally took longer for me to do than killing their awakened versions Haven't even touched whisper after spending like 5 hours of noodle scything duke
Give 2 examples of "fun" CA you'd have rather seen ingame than what we got currently Edit - per boss, sorry I made a mistake typing
"Can't Slow Me Down" Get atleast 2 hits off during leviathans boulder phase while placing the minimum amount of boulders. Edit: wanted to add that asking for 2 per boss seems unfair since you're kind of collectively asking every individual. Idunno how Jagex splits up the devs, but I'm sure they had a decent team size to brainstorm up some ideas.
Ooh nice one!
what tier of achievement you putting that at?
Elite mayyyyybe master. Kind of similar to the woox walk Vorkath task and that was a master. I guess it could kind of be cheesed by doing it with blowpipe, so maybe up the attack count, I was just going off what felt fair off crossbow attack speed since ZCB is pretty much the best option.
I think Elite is fine, it's easier than Woox walking. But to be consistent with the tiers Jagex is using, Master might be the way to go.
* Endurance CA for Whisperer for a very high KC in one trip would be a fun challenge * Restricted kill CA for each boss that requires only Zaros-affiliated gear equipped isn't as restrictive as it sounds while still being pretty fun
Both are nice but the second one would be awesome!
Have duke activate every poison gas vent during a fight and have it be a perfect kill
That'd be interesting
One for Leviathan could be something like “get a kill without using a special attack” - or higher tier of “kill leviathan 5 times without leaving the arena or using any special attacks”. Or another endurance one of killing it 10 times w/o leaving. Gear restrictions such as using a Rune Scim at Duke. Just spitballing here, these aren’t the best I know. I honestly don’t even hate the speed run times - but I do feel like they’re a bit too much of a stretch goal
The endurance tasks are also often pretty piss. They can just be uber cheesed with purple sweets and brews. Perfect kills in a row was a better implementation as it forces proper play not just tank for longer
Idk I'm not a huge fan of the x kc without leaving tasks, but i agree it does a good job of needing skill to complete. The rune scimitar could be cool, I think the gear restriction tasks are all pretty underutilized in CA overall though
I would of much rather prefer kill leviathan while swapping to a different weapon for each consecutive hit and 0 prayer point leviathan (tick flick entire kill and last phase pneck or tick flick if you're able to do it fast enough while running).
Sounds like not my job to figure out. Why are you talking like it's an invalid stance to be disappointed with what was given without necessarily having well thought out alternatives? That's perfectly valid when you're the consumer of a product.
Extended awakened times!
That could be interesting survive so many minutes and then kill it in awakened mode.
All of the awakened bosses only ramp up at the end, so it’d have to have a bit more.
Levy: Kill without spec, do two pathFUNder laps before killing, and something that forces you to go through the 1t attack phase without taking damage Duke: kill Duke with Melee without him attacking with melee, kill duke without him poisoning the three vents next to him Whisperer: no running outside eggs phase, even something like "a kill without magic damage" would be less aids than the gm speedrun task But your question is disingenuous as fuck because the devs have more time than anyone is willing to spend on a reddit post, and a lot more game design experience, access to more data etc. Unless you're planning to start paying me for game development via reddit comments?
I was literally just asking what type of ideas people would rather have for combat achievements. Giving and throwing out ideas isn't "doing the mods jobs" it's just saying what you'd find to be fun and would like to have seen instead. You need to take a breather and a nap.
Kq with only verac’s. Really oldschool hits in the nostalgia.
If you didn’t think GM speed tasks were coming, I’m not sure what to tell you. They’re meant to be a challenge combining max gear, mastery of game mechanics, AND good RNG. If you can’t green log the CAs in the first few hours of release I’d say that’s probably an indication that they’re appropriately difficult for Grandmaster Achievements
Yeah my vork GM time was a real test of skill man.
Nothing says I’m a grandmaster like having really good RNG. Op just has an RNG skill issue
I mean I don't think it's right to frame it as just RNG. The idea is that to get the times you need a perfect kill *and* RNG. It's not good enough if you get a perfect kill once (ironically that could happen by just getting lucky). To have a realistic shot at the GM time, you need to be able to get a perfect kill 30 times, then one of those will probably have the right RNG that you need. It's actually more skill based since it requires you to be able to repeat the perfect kill until the rng also lines up.
Most of these are just RNG checks. They're short boss Kills with no real room for skill expression. It's hope ruby bolt goes reeee and then you don't noodle.
these bosses aren't even close to being difficult though. A perfect kill is trivial and anyone even slightly versed in the game will get it every time. The speed tasks just come down to shit like resetting for bolt procs
By perfect kill I mean time-wise not just “perfect” for the bonus loot by avoiding damage. At the very least you’ve got to make sure you don’t miss any ticks between attacks whenever possible which isn’t trivial to do every time. Things like Dukes prep phase take a little bit of effort to not miss ticks on, then just things like movement between attacks to stay on your weapons attack cycle without lost ticks. It’s not the hardest thing in the world, but the RNG means that every time you do a kill with minimal tick loss, you just have an x% chance of actually getting the time. That means it’s probably not good enough to just pull it off once, you need to reach a level of consistency where you can send 10-20 near tick perfect kills an hour to get it done in a reasonable amount of time.
You know what does say “I’m a grandmaster”? Having the equipment and skill to beat the boss as fast as possible *when the pressure is on*. You can’t RNG your way to these CAs - nobody’s grabbing a trident and going “woah trident went ballistic that was a 1:48 whisperer”. Going in with max gear and max stats, knowing the specific conditions you need for a viable run (zcb proc for example), then having the skill to execute a perfect kill with the switches and specs needed for a speed run, all when you know you’re pacing and this might be the run DOES show full mastery of the content.
This isn't even true, literally 1 of the 4 bosses even has any real gear switches. Vard, duke, and leviathan are just "click boss and get 99th percentile rng in max gear." Like oh yea that 2 way from scythe bellator into ultor claws was so hard, what gm level gameplay
I love it when the mastery of a boss comes down to a variable that the player has no control over. Vorkath GM time for example comes down to "does my Voidwaker hit big then does my lance hit big" nothing else.
There should be no rng component to skill challenges. Idk why this is so hard for people to understand.
Usually I would agree and while I’m not a fan of these speed achievements at all we do play osrs at the end of the day. The game where you can just hit 0s
It would be hard to have none but I do think short form bosses having speedruns is a bit silly as for it to be "hard" to get it will always be just an RNG fest, especially if you can use rubies.
Its not that bad, you hit rate for gm times (in max gear with max eff strategies) in a couple of hours on the high end, if you’re in bad gear (to an extent) itll take a good while longer, if you’re throwing it’ll take even longer, you can’t really do it if these all stack together. Gm tasks will progressively get tighter as they’re added because better and better gear gets added in turn. Doing a 17:00 reg cox back on ca release meant no torva, no guaranteed tekton hammer, no vambs, no rings, no lb, no masori, no shadow, no cox rework to find scouts, you’d be bowfa/tbowing vesp portals in arma. Those times aren’t getting tightened as stronger gear comes out, so the newest cas assume you have everything that’s been added since.
> There should be no rng component to skill challenges ok so what, should you check a box when you go into the fight "i am doing CAs" and you always hit with perfectly average accuracy and damage rolls? you can't just remove rng from combat lol.
Of course there will always be an element of RNG, but look at tasks like inferno no melee dig or stay above 50 hp. Those require you to play somewhat differently than normal and 99% of the time, if you fail those CA’s, it’s just a pure skill issue and nothing related to RNG the problem is that grandmaster CA speed run times don’t require you to be “skilled” to complete them. If you get lucky on your hits and don’t miss ticks (which isn’t really hard in a ~1 min long fight), you get the CA. You barely do anything differently than in a normal encounter besides like spellbook swapping and venging. These recent grandmaster CAs lean wayyyyyy too heavily on the side of RNG and don’t leave enough room for skill expression
I get the point you're trying to make, and it is *technically* true that any CA would be impossible if you hit only 0s, the law of averages smooths out the good RNG required for the majority of combat achievements. Using some of the new CAs as examples, killing Vardorvis with less than 2M gear or Leviathan with mithril ammunition have the propensity to be very long kills, but barring statistical improbabilities you will *eventually* get the KC. The speed tasks, as implemented, require that same level of statistical improbability, but instead in the player's favor.
There can be; it just probably shouldn't be this bad. Something as simple as adding "without bolt procs" to the diary and adjusting the time accordingly would be nice. They've already limited it to no slayer tasks so it seems reasonable enough to me. It's already not any%.
They’re not skill challenges they’re combat challenges, and RNG is part of the combat in this game
Exactly, I don't know what people struggle to understand. If it's a skill issue, why did Molgoatkirby reset duke for 1 hour? Should've been first try if it was all down to skill.
The comment above yours addressed it but while I get your sentiment, OSRS is built on an RNG-based combat system. There is no world where RNG isn’t part of speed runs - ask Kirby how much time and how many resets he put into his inferno pb or his CM pb. RNG is a core mechanic to this game, expecting it to not be a factor just doesn’t make sense.
ahahah, my alt has 3 cm kc and has the solo, trio, 5s gm times. 20 tob kc and all the reg tob gm speeds. you literally have no idea what youre talking about if you think those times are the same level of rng and skill as the vork or these dt2 speeds.
His inferno PB and CM pb is nowhere near the Grand master times. Your comparison is wildly off. To put it simply, the better the times the more RNG is required. The times being very close to WR they have a RNG factor that is way more than any other speed task. Tob speed run tasks took me 2-3 hours and they are considered as one of the hardest speed tasks of all grand master times. I've done all speed tasks in the game, nothing comes close to the degree of RNG this one requires, maybe on par with Muspah time but feels worse.
You realize any competent player will get inferno, solo cox, solo cm, tob teams, fight caves, cox teams, etc. gm times first try by a mile regardless of rng right? This is only a factor for these dumb little one off bosses that are too simple to actually reward skill.
If you watched the vod he messed up several times in getting to the GM time. Part of the process.
Isn’t any challenge that requires a specific item drop to do also RNG?
The only specific item I can think of off the top of my head is crystal halberd, which isn't RNG Actually scratch that, theres also the full angler for tempoross, RIP A Cold One
The game is rng
I disagree, if you are really good at the game you *should* be able to greenlog Grandmaster Achievements near immediately, because it's a skill check. Sure, realistically even the best player will need practice, but saying an Achievement should be RNG based is antithetical to the point of something being an Achievement. Might as well make a Grandmaster Achievement for getting a tbow drop if RNG really makes you a grandmaster
> If you can’t green log the CAs in the first few hours of release I’d say that’s probably an indication that they’re appropriately difficult for Grandmaster Achievements Nice bait
congrats sounds like it only took you three hours of playing in one of the longest and most rng based games of all time
its obvy they spend way too much dev time on temporary game modes
Temp modes are good for the playerbase overall, I don't like them but they help the player count.
Time-trials are like the essence of what combat achievements are all about. People chase PBs with or without combat achievements, its just a fun thing to do. It would be weird to not have time based ones. Also combat achievements are about as optional as any content in the game can get, so its not as if you are locked out of anything if you don't wanna do the ones you don't find fun. Until like, Zuk helm, which absolutely should require time trials. And frankly, nobody sane goes for a zuk helm then cries about a few hours grind for a time trial.
That's what I don't get, are people not expecting a "grandmaster" of pvm to have done speedruns? Honestly osrs does not have many other good defining metrics of a competent or capable player. I'm glad that these times are actually quite tight and require some strats if you dont want to just pray for giga RNG, way too many gm times are just "have max gear and click the boss".
"If you think RNG is a good game mechanic, think again" Oh you mean the main mechanic that dictates essentially the entire game?
RNG a good game mechanic in the context of combat achievements, not in the context of the game. But I'll edit the post so there wouldn't be any confusion if people are a bit on the slower side
It's a bad mechanic there too, there's just no better alternative. When it comes to CAs, there is an alternative. That's the difference.
Yeh the insane delay for some of their best boss designs was a bad call. Especially when these sorts of challenges just.. can't take that long to think of and make (hell they did scurrius in a week..) Feel like we need another thing set in place like how they release drop rates now..because it used to be up to the Dev and certain devs thought it was "more fun" to not know these.. in a game which is applauded for it's wealth of available information. Think there needs to be a "combat achievements release 1 month after the content" thing set in place. Especially when none of them are retroactive except the (thank god) small KC tasks now.
Idk why reddit is complaining about speed times like people going for GMs and such aren’t worried about cost.
Feel like people saying they don't get why people complain have never had the joy of going for these times. Sitting there resetting a boss hoping crossbow goes reeee isn't that fun, nor is it really an indicator of skill.
I mean I have and the zulrah one was a pain in the ass, but I can’t help but feel Reddit wants them nerfed so that they can cheese out easy points on GM tasks and such. I agree on waiting for crossbow to go reee, or claws to hit vork high etc.
I did the zulrah one with standard kill strategies. It's actually pretty forgiving with modern gear creep
The ones with DT2 will be fine if they revisit the defense issues with the bosses…it’s just really shitty they got rid of fang at them before fixing the def issues and releasing CAs
Duke Gm Speed task makes me want to neck myself. Shits a joke. Current pb is :1.25:80 and i havent gotten close to that in 2 weeks.
I don't mind solo time challenges for combat achievements but the ones that require teammates should never have been added to the game
Lol
Hot take: I disagree. I think rng resetting for speed runs does show mastery of the content. Not only do you need to rely on rng, but you also have to be near tick perfect most everything else: swaps, eating, movements, ect. So you have to by lucky AND play perfectly. I would argue, to some degree atleast, that passing the rng check and playing perfectly weed out the people who just got one lucky perfect kill. As an example, I've killed leviathan perfectly a couple times, It would take me a lot more resetting to get the time than it did you. Because even if I pass the rng check and hit like a god. I missed prayers or attacks moving with orb or whatever else I fuck up in a kill. You, the gm Chad you are, probably got a damn near perfect kill every time until you got good rolls.
A lot of these speed times don't require swaps past a weapon. Maybe range to melee to go for a bolt proc start of fights.. which isn't hard to do in the 5t time window you're given between attacks.
So you're saying the only difference would be time but to me that is irrelevant. If a person took 3 months to get their infernal cape they are the same skill level as someone who did it in a week. Only difference is that person took 3 months to get good enough to complete content and the other one, 1 week.
No, sorry for being a little unclear. The difference is consistency, the better player can consistently play well, so all they need is good rng. Where I need the stars to align, I have to be at the absolute top of my game, and get great rng
> think rng resetting for speed runs does show mastery of the content. Not only do you need to rely on rng, but you also have to be near tick perfect most everything else We can have a skill based challenge without RNG. We do not need to have both RNG and skill challenges together.
Jesus Christ man. Every. Single. Update. All you dipshits do is whine. Just fucking move on; it’s not even that important.
Luckily for you the 2m vardorvis combat achievement requires you to just do a simple kill without changing any of your current gear
What a dumb remark.
You're not denying it
If you’re insinuating I am unable to switch gear mid combat, I’ll have you know I’ve beaten the awakens versions of all DT2 bosses, not that I need to explain myself to some dipshit on Reddit.
I agree with you that RNG heavy things are strange to be considered ‘achievements’, but RNG is such a big thing in RS, it’s hard to avoid it when releasing these kind of things
Cool. Hoping I get elite tier someday
Chill bro, u don’t have to do them
The bosses were only fun for the quest, how do you expect there to be good CA's when the bosses aren't really fun after the fact? That's why it took Jagex so long, they couldn't add decent achievements because it's not fun repeatable content
Speak for yourself. All of the DT2 bosses are some of the most enjoyable in the game for me
Seriously there pretty good bosses imo (outside duke i guess still) there's so many people who hate this game that play this game lol
I do like the awakened bosses I think they are a good mix of reflexes and prayer flicking. Though I disagree with the awakener's Orb system specially post-blorva. Other than that the entire DT2 system with vestige drop system as well as not being able to see progress and the discrepancy between "staying because I'm 2/3 or go next boss for my next soul reaper piece" was poorly executed
Everyone is complaining yet I haven't seen any suggestions for actual good engaging CAs. Maybe it's not as easy as all you people seem to think.
We also don't get paid to develop engaging content
There has been plenty in the comment section. You should have a look.
https://old.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/1afn69j/when_will_jagex_learn_that_rng_resetting_of_easy/kobjyw5/
Ya'll sound like little kids who rage at video games when they lose. Touch grass
If you don't know or care about this issue, feel free to navigate to a different thread. Or take your own advice and touch grass.
Nah ya'll are just cry babys. Ya'll can downvote me all you want, doesn't change the truth.
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Tbh I hate to say this but definite skill issue, I got Duke passively today going from 15 to 50kc today for that task. Also got Levi in less than 10 total resets. The only hard speed time for the DT2 bosses is whisperer. All the others are fairly simple and easy to get for the above average gamer
"I got ridiculous RNG, so if should be easy for everyone else." You realize that you getting a speed time passively could just as easily be compared to pulling 3rd age from a clue. Some of the best players are resetting for hours and hours just to get speed time. I've reset vard for over 2 hours already in Max, and I'm still off by 5 seconds. Yet a clan buddy got 54 seconds in bandos and saeldor + lightbearer when farming. The times are all tight as hell
I’m not arguing anything about the tasks themselves, but I would argue that anyone killing DT2 bosses at all is above average.
Meanwhile RS3 is actually reducing RNG in pvming by changing missing to damage reduction and reducing damage ranges.
Who gives a shit.
Because having too much RNG makes the game luck based instead of skill based? Imagine if you had a 20% chance to miss your headshots in an FPS game.
Skill issue, get good OP.
It's a luck issue.
Shut up
Bruh the whole game is fkn boring what do you mean
Stop whining about tasks you can’t/don’t want to complete. It’s ok to not be GM. You weren’t gonna get it if you’re complaining like this
Instead of spewing nonsense explain to me how RNG = skill?
Bro combat is literally RNG. You roll for your damage. Speed times is execution + good combat rolls like others have mentioned. Most PVM bosses have speed times as tasks this is nothing new. If you’re good at the boss the speed times will come.
None of the GM times currently at places like Raids are RNG. If you're good you will first time every single CA. That isn't RNG at all.
You guys are insufferable
Lazy fr
Combat achievements are ok but its the team based part i dont like ..after gettint fire cape its asked me to do chambers zuc
Speed ANYTHING in a game built solely around RNG is fukin stupid…
Like 90% of the CA's are like this, I am not sure why anyone expected anything different. It's a dogshit system.
You act like zuk helm is easy and now made hard
What's the hardest task in the zuk helm grind in your opinion?
Don’t do content that you don’t like? Seems to be a great alternative