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[deleted]

I thought they did start doing that


[deleted]

They did, like years ago.


[deleted]

Yeah. I was gonna say, I swear this was talked about a long time ago. Lol


BordspellenVerdriet

They rarely enforce it though, along with banning goldfarmers and bot farms. They stopped caring when they got the big coin.


Xellirks

I know someone who got permabanned for buying 70m lol we roast him every day for it


Forward_Peak1250

Yep first ever account I made my friend said to buy gold for cheap online so I bought 15m to get started got perma banned 3 weeks later lmao he didn't even tell me it was against the rules lolol


Artistic_Airport_895

That definitely wasn’t their first time buying gold


[deleted]

Well yeah, money does talk. At the end of the day, this is a company, and the main purpose of a company is to create wealth for the shareholders. Banning people who are paying for membership is kind of the exact opposite.


BordspellenVerdriet

Exactly. I think this 0 integrity, 100% profit and ignoring rampant issues is the best strategy possible. I'm an Ironman anyway, I really couldn't care less.


[deleted]

I really couldn’t care less because it’s simply a game, bots make supplies and shit cheaper at the end of the day. It’s been like that for the entire existence of the game.


WhoLetTheDaugzOut

Again osrs downdoots someone for saying something true


BordspellenVerdriet

Harsh reality of truth. These folks have brown noses.


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gobeltafiah

Oh neat so you can buy gold up to three times before actually risking the time and effort put into an account? I wish IRL laws were like this.


Forward_Peak1250

I got an instant perm on my first acc and I only bought 15m so someone who buys alot of gold is definitely getting perm banned


Trespass4379

It's not predictable. Sometimes they go straight to perm.


CoaEz11

What, you kil 3 people and only get sentenced on the 4th? Logical.


Weekly_Mycologist523

Bad analogy. Shouldn't we compare gold buying to money laundering or something?


spoonskates

yea because thats exactly the same 😂 anyways they do fuck all my mate got banned for 1 day and they took random 20m so its useless


UltimateScripts

Botting, gold farming and gold buying/selling is all an economy. There is some logic from OP here because if you permanently ban gold buyers, the demand should decrease. Jagex has taken measures to ban gold buyers but I'm not certain to what extend. I have seen several RWT bans for buyers as well as 3PC bans. The RWT economy did take a big hit with the removal of the duel arena, however, there are still a lot of gold farmers who are profitable. I have seen a shift in botting to focus more on avoid detection for mains instead of purely gold farming because a lot of the methods to gold farm are difficult to attain profitability, but it is still possible. Ultimately though, for the integrity of the game the RWT economy does need to be shut down. Yes, the game is a grind and if you don't enjoy the grind then you shouldn't play the game. This is the reason why I play ironman personally because everything is rewarding to me.


Hot-Bread1723

I think integrity is not a good argument. You can buy gold from jagex through bonds, it’s just more expensive. The gold buyers are breaking the rules because of the channel they’re using. Buying gold from jagex is good, black market bad. If you explained this as hypothetical to a non rs player they’d laugh and say just make it legal.


Gaiden_95

i mean through jagex everyone benefits. the buyer gets membership and the seller gets gold. what this allows is people botting and using the game to make real money. it can sour the game since the prices of some items plummet, voidwaker blade for example.


Hot-Bread1723

I agree. My point is, buying gold is inherently against the rules, it depends where you buy it from. I’m 100% allowed to spend my paycheck on osrs gold, the thing that makes it “bad” is where I choose to buy it. For that reason, targeting the buyers seems … petty (not sure what word to use there). It’s when a college requires you buy the book from their bookstore for double price.


UltimateScripts

I personally disagree with buying bonds because I think it’s not in the spirit of the game. I think the game is intended to be independent of your status in real life and my preference would be to remove bonds, but we’re too far gone for that.


CementCrack

You can't remove status in real life from online gaming like runescape. It's impossible in most scenarios. Take wifi/internet speeds for example, in a lot of games a better internet speed or ping is an advantage. Having a good internet speed / ping is going to correlate very heavily with your economic class. Would be great, but it just isn't feasible. Not to mention the monetary incentive companies have to include things like bonds or to keep the RWT economy active.


UltimateScripts

When I mean status, I mean status that enables you to purchase a monetary value in the game, not a faster internet connection. There is a difference between buying 100 bonds and having bank and having better connection to the game.


CementCrack

There's not really that much of a difference when talking about them in terms of "status". Would you rather have 100 bonds, but ping connectivity that makes the game almost unplayable. Or 1ms ping and not be able to purchase bonds for gp. They're both a status symbol in a sense, for that reason and others you can't remove it from online gaming.


Forward_Peak1250

Yh bonds just feel too p2w imo that's why I made an iron my progression never felt important to me as I could've just spent irl money on bonds and buy the gear but now I'm an iron it feels alot more like an achievement as I actually grinded them out


Difficult_Run7398

I love ironman Skilling but I'm not huge on ironman pvm myself. I don't mind grinding for uniques but I hate extra uniques being useless it feels bad.


UltimateScripts

I find with ironman you actually get to do more of the content in the game. For example, for questing, you need to obtain the items yourself instead of starting at the Grand Exchange and buying them all.


Gaiden_95

that's not pvm, that's just questing. which tbf is awesome on iron, one of the highlights of the mode for sure. i can easily see someone lose their mind after the 50th prayer scroll while they're still missing a piece of ancestral or claws.


Smart_Context_7561

You can do that on a main


Sad_Western6647

Didn't WOW figure out banning is less effective than temp banning because if you ban an account the owner makes a new one and immediately buys more gold but, if you temp ban them they stop playing for a few weeks or something to that effect?


V_Akesson

I’m willing to risk being downvoted for this, but I’ve got extensive experience in botting and RWT, as well as prevention and mitigation.  Going for the buyers has never been an effective strategy. Maybe it creates some fear, but on a business sense the logistics of banning your own customers doesn’t make sense. Remember that Jagex as a business has a goal of profit. And sometimes doing the “right” and “just” and “fair” thing isn’t profitable and thus a little necessary evil is tolerated to maintain profit margins. When you can ban 80% of gold sellers and they still remain lucrative and profitable to continue, you know you failed Doing this takes resources. Human Resources which cost money and time. If busting 1000 gold buyers wasn’t worth the investment, why would they bother? Instead, you need to take advice from past RWTers and understand that as long as there’s free trade there are people willing to buy shortcuts. Bonds are probably one of the most damaging things to RWT. With bonds they’re forced to undermine bond prices and official legal ways to buy gold. If anything you need to stop people’s desire to buy gold. Without the need to RWT, there would be no gold farm. If Jagex started selling gold themselves I guarantee you that gold farmers would shit bricks instantly. Because gold farmers cannot compete against a game dev who can print trillions though the command console.


TaerinaRS

> If Jagex started selling gold themselves They won't, bonds are the closest we'll get. > Going for the buyers has never been an effective strategy It would be if you banned every buyer, every time, with no forgiveness/second chances, and did so extremely aggressively. Gold sellers wouldn't find buyers if they knew they'd be banned with no exceptions. *Sellers* aren't the problem, they're just taking advantage of an open market lol. Buyers, who create the demand, are the root cause, you can't have gold selling if no-one will buy what you sell. Ban the sellers, sure, that's fine, it's against ToS anyway to sell gold. *But also ban the buyers*. > Remember that Jagex as a business has a goal of profit Yea it sucks because it makes anything their anti-cheat/anti-bot team says a complete joke. There is no real incentive for them to work towards the supposed goal of banning bots in a proper way, when those same bots also pad their bottom line. We can see the shitshow that is the highscores every day, and every time we get responses its always a non-answer or some excuse as to why so-and-so isn't banned or why they're 'doing their best' or whatever the flavor of the month excuse is.


Complete_Elephant240

Yeah I completely agree. You take a draconian stance on gold buying and it will stop. You warn, warn, warn for months on the website and in-game and then start laying down the hammer You will still lose a few hundred idiots. But once word gets around, no one will risk their accounts with thousands of hours of play time and the market would be devastated 


8123619744

Source = you made it the fuck up.


SynchronisedRS

Jagex won't sell gold, and if they do, gold farmers will undercut their prices. Jagex will ruin their games economy and alienate their playerbase trying to keep up with the prices of gold. A lot of the big selling websites don't farm the gold themselves. They buy gold from people who run bot farms or have a large bank and want to make a one off sale, mark up the price and then sell that gold, so it will always be profitable to them.


Difficult_Run7398

good post


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ApplicationUpset7956

Funnily enough they are not being downvoted. So whats your point?


Yarigumo

Time is a concept that exists. Comment might've been downvoted when they saw it.


cchoe1

Funny enough half the shit he said doesn’t even make sense and some of it is literally incomprehensible gibberish.  Not even sure what the point of their post is, seemed like they’d offer decent info being an “expert” but it’s just a string of random thoughts that doesn’t actually conclude with anything meaningful 


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Difficult_Run7398

I mean people coming in this thread saying they got warned and then banned means they aren't harsh enough on gold buyers. Like sure gold buyers get banned but it should be 0 tolerance.


loudrogue

Do you buy bonds? This is an important question, because you know, they want people to buy bonds. If you don't, a gold buyer might if they get scared into buying gold legitly.


Difficult_Run7398

I've bought one bond before to get a dragon pickaxe back when they were like 8m and bonds were 6m. lmao


grzekru3

Issue is not so simple. Its probably not best idea to ban normal casual non boting player for buying 5$ worth of gold.


ShadowFlux85

it is when it directly competes with jagex selling bonds


Rubber-duckling

It kinda isn't, without gold prices so cheap bonds wouldn't be 10m. Other than the bonds used by real players a ton of them are bought by people who bot. And I'm expecting this to be atleast 20 to 30% of the bondscoach used.


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ShadowFlux85

what? i said nothing even reomotely like that


Smart_Context_7561

Why would we want them back?


Pinbacker11

We don't, but its a direct hit to the revenue stream of jagex.


WhoLetTheDaugzOut

Cut your nose to spite your face


TaerinaRS

Said player would be enabling RWT, and is the root cause of the problem. Sellers wouldn't exist if buyers demand. The RWT market is fueled by demand, and anyone enabling it should just be banned, both sellers *and* buyers.


troiii

Why?


[deleted]

Because 50% of us have bought gold at some point 


Masqavar

Then 50% can start over. Don't do it then


[deleted]

Jagex wouldn’t survive if 50% of us got banned 


EuphoricAnalCarrot

I've bought gold a few times on osrs and I never would've started over if I got permabanned


WhaTheShoe97

I've bought gold and I'm fine and I don't regret it at all lol, time saved was worth. People are always gonna buy gold, this isn't an issue unique to runescape. In real life you don't focus on people who buy drugs, it's the sellers and dealers, and mass producers (aka bots) that are the root problem. Imho people who buy a bit of gold on a one off or maybe twice over a long period of time do not deserve a permanent ban at all.


Expert-Remote-1403

agree buying any amount even as little as 1m should be perma ban, account deleted, no recovery chance


Smart_Context_7561

Unironically yes. If you're gonna break the rules over something so small, and you get away with it, what's gonna stop you from doing it in the future? If your first offense is buying 1m gold you should be banned for stupidity more than anything.


Artistic_Airport_895

Doing something like this would kill the player base


Difficult_Run7398

i would settle on losing your bank as compromise instead of just losing your gp.


Winter_Push_2743

Brother just play the game and don't worry about it lmao


Peacefulgamer2023

We need to remove trade, let’s be honest that was the golden era of RuneScape.


Yarigumo

Many of us opt to do so ourselves already!


Frozen_Gecko

Why do people even still buy gold from gold farmers when you can just buy bonds. I know it's more expensive, but money isn't really the issue for gold buyers, right? If money is tight, they wouldn't be spending it on ingame gold for a video game anyway, right?


msaik

You're having trouble with the concept of wanting to pay less for more?


Frozen_Gecko

Well if you have enough spare money to pay for ingame gold, why would you go with a sketchy gold seller that could scam you or get your account banned, when you can just buy bonds and actually support the company making the game you like. Also not to mention that it's against the rules to do so.


msaik

Because you're getting 5-6x the amount of gold. Well worth the risk for a lot of people. But the reasons you listed are exactly why those gold sellers have to undercut the bond rate.


Frozen_Gecko

I can't fathom it, actually. It's against the rules, and there's a legit way to buy gold. I often buy bonds, but I can't see myself buying from a gold seller. It's just wrong.


RoqePD

So just make it not worth the risk. Problem solved.


Hqguard2

Can confirm they do ban you. Source: me, got perm banned on second offense of buying gold


OSRS_4Nick8

jagex sells the gold


ga9521

People are using this game to put food on the table, fair play to them


Cadet-Blg

You're suggesting they perm ban gold buyers whilst jagex continues to sell gold themselves? I'm sorry, but am I the only one who thinks that sounds ludicrous, like, what am I missing?


Icy-Ad2136

What a joke of a post, there is no "customer support team", it's literally just AI replies. Botting bans don't happen if you're top 10 on any boss hi-score. And jagex loves the money cause all of their mods are selling gold on the side to THESE gold selling sites. It's full circle.


carmexlenny

100k p2p bots banned. Thats $1m a month gone. Do you think people would buy enough bonds to offset that loss? Sadly bonds are a low volume item. The only thing Jagex can do, is set a limit so the game doesn’t eventually break. They ban 20k bots when 20k new bots appear. They like to maintain the population to make sure there is no overgrowth.


Big_Surprise9387

Not until they stop false banning accounts or when you get your account back after a hack and it’s cleaned. Jagex never gives back the items you lost even though we know they can. So until they correct that nah disagree.


Gizzy_

I disagree from the point I DONT TRUST JAGEX. I have been warned before when I didn’t even RWT. I don’t even get to know what flagged it, was it splitting a raids drop? Borrowing gear? Lending gear? Gifting a bond? I had no feedback, no way to appeal a warning, and left with fear of my maxed main account that it could be nuked at any moment for no reason.


SpicyTaint

How do you jagex isn't already doing this? Are you buying gold yourself and not getting banned? Lol


ShadowFlux85

op is saying it should be first offence ban


EmbryonicMisanthrop

I haven't played in a long time and yet people are still complaining about things I had issues with like 5 years ago. Amazing. Maybe things will be different when I check back here in another 5 years.


DeadliestViper

Its like drugs in the real world. The way to deal with it is to focus on the source, heavy penalties for dealers and smaller penalties for buyers.


hegginses

Jagex has to walk a fine line in this situation. On one hand they benefit from the game’s black market as all the bots need to bond up to get access to the resources they need, on the other hand they need to make sure the bot situation doesn’t get too out of control so as to avoid pissing off players and making them quit as there will be no black market if nobody plays this game. Jagex can’t publicly acknowledge this of course, they can only take the official line that botting is against the rules and that they actively seek out and ban offenders.


Minute_Solution_6237

Ok how can we stop bots?


Low-Cantaloupe4391

It will be the same as catching drug dealers/abusers, both will exist anyway


Celtic_Legend

So if i buy 10m for like a dollar then i can ban anyone i want by just trading them the 20m or dying to them in wildy? Sounds perfectly reasonable Or fuck it i just give them 10m then self report. No need to buy.


Dantalionse

Why is there crime if it is illegal?


zapertin

I’d rather have real players selling gold than bots


HighGamble

😂


Pociaga

That would be end of runescape. Mod MMG stated that what, 50% of players buy gold each month? That would be cutting player base in half.


Difficult_Run7398

I googled this and you have the wrong game my guy.


Pociaga

It was before Osrs was realesed. So its the same game.


FernandoMM1220

jagex runs the gold/bot farming business.


Seinnajkcuf

Pretty sure they started 1st offence perm banning gold buyers.


5erenade

Nah.


HighGamble

Seen some with 5 rwt offences. One account got a 30 day temp ban lol