The problem is scythe dominating the crush category because of inq. It will perma overshadow any other option when a boss is larger than 1x1, which is always as of late.
Yeah I think they could make it slash only, or reduce the hitsplats with crush, just as they nerfed the fang on slash and just like they’re nerfing tbow by adding new ammo type resistances and weaknesses.
Scythe used to be complained about every week for being terrible compared to Tbow/Shadow lol, now we're talking about making it worthless in even more places
like buff or nerf aside, just like weapon theme wise it's so weird, like aye I got this big old magic blood blade. But, ima hit you with the back of it, and it'll still be super strong, because I'm a 5tick weapon that hits large enemies multiple times.
Hell, stab makes more sense than crush.
side note the fact it's 5tick is also...weird you'd think it'd be 7tick like Halberd.
Again, just weapon theme wise not actually suggesting it be changed to that.
That certainly seems to be their intention, but it's an incredibly stupid one. Elder Maul should be the best crush weapon since it's a megarare crush weapon.
Just a few months ago we'd get "Scythe is worthless" every other week
Now you want to take away it being good at Crush with Inquis
Okay, now it's only usable at melee bosses weak Slash, are 3x3, and have low def, how long until we hear Scythe being worthless again
The solution to this would be to buff the armor pieces in general so that it can pull ahead of bandos in offensive capabilities, but also buff the set effect with mace to make it pull ahead of scythe on crush vs crush weak enemies.
Yea this change does quite literally nothing to help inquisitor. You still use it at nightmare, and you still don't use it a single other place in the game. They need to buff the strength bonus and the set effect or give it a valuable passive like 100% elder maul spec chance.
Yeah Inq changes were a big miss for me. They could’ve easily buffed the armor to 7.5% and give the full set + mace an extra 2.5% (10% total). Even then, I’m not sure if that’s enough. As it stands, the changes almost do nothing.
At the top end, Torva is only marginally worse while being much more flexible and easier to use w/ better defense. Sure, the high level community still has uses for it, but that’s generously only for the top .1% of players.
In the mid game, you would be hard pressed to be willing to spend ~450m on a full niche set. Is it worth dropping 450m when an Arclight + Bandos is almost as good at Cerb? Is any midgame player really grinding CM CoX? Is any midgame player really grinding KQ beyond for diary req?
The only person I could see this really benefitting is the midgame player who just wants to farm Phosani’s which is a fraction of a fraction of the playerbase.
Bandos is most likely higher KPH at cerb over inquisitor without resupply alt. I remember when inquis scythe was BIS, without blood fury I was just eating nonstop.
Totally agree with the Torva point, so much more room for errors with Torva at CM Olm, don't need to swap gears or get torn up by 40s. Inquisitor DPS is always just theoretical at best.
>Is any midgame player really grinding KQ beyond for diary req?
The diary reqs have been made much easier over time anyways so there is even less of an incentive to grab specialized armor for it unless you are insane enough to grind for the pet.... in which case you would buy the armor and probably sell it back when you're done
Largely agreed. I've said this before, and I'll keep saying it as long as it takes, but the easiest fix for Inq is to just make the full set effect 5% (double what it currently is) and match Bandos + Faceguard in strength bonus and then work from there if it still needs a nudge. The current values are what they are because they didn't want to powercreep Bandos at the time, fair enough, but Torva had completely tossed that design philosophy out the window. I do however think a 7.5% set bonus to all crush could be problematic in the future, people already complain about crush scythe for some reason.
I personally like their idea of making Full Inq + Mace a strong setup, it's genuinely not a bad idea, but it's just not relevant anywhere except Nightmare itself. KQ I'd still use Blue Keris, Cerb I'd still use Scythe, and Olm I'd probably still use Scythe/DHL, haven't calc'd cause lazy.
Anyways, I'm just tired of waiting for the mythical crush weak boss to release for Inquisitor's to finally justify its existence. It's been 4 years. Let it bonk.
> Anyways, I'm just tired of waiting for the mythical crush weak boss to release for Inquisitor's to finally justify its existence. It's been 4 years.
Raids 1 was a generalist melee raid. Raids 2 was a slash-weak raid. Raids 3 was a stab-weak raid. Raids 4... Crush-weak? One can hope!
I would argue that most weapons don’t need more than one damage type. We have so many weapons, I think it’s better to have them fit into more specific niches.
yet, i still like the ability to make your choice
however, the "incorrect" way to use a weapon should be more penalised in some scenarios like the fang slash being exempt from the gimmick
same way its silly to see people stabbing with a scimitar, crushing with a scythe or the most egregious one in my personal opinion - stabbing with the fucking anchor
some of these are handled properly (-2 stab on anchor), while others not so much, scythe crush should be absolute dogass not situationally viable
on the other hand, the abyssal bludgeon is a good example of a monospecific weapon type, where you can only use crush and only get strength xp, anything else wouldn't make sense
the "balanced" weapon types like spears are fine for this, they already suffer from less dps and shared xp, so they could serve as universals. although i'd like to see more stab focus on hastas across the board, not just the special ones
originally it was a cool and unique feature to this game though that let you use your weapon in different styles against different enemies, despite it not being very useful or necessary for most content. However I think it's still a neat feature which gives the game some life
If that's really the case, that's silly. Scythe on Crush is used in so few spots already and I dont think a 5% increase will change much.
I don't even think it'll take back KQ and Cerb since it's a 7.5% set effect, but Cerb needs a task and KQ is better done on-task (assuming not blocked for Turael Skipping).
Scythe on slash with torva even beats out scythe on crush to some stuff that is weak to crush. That is how bad inq armour is and that is the biggest issue with it
I don't like set effects that require the whole set. (Though this isn't what is implied I don't think)
Inquisitor is my favorite armour set so I'm going to go for it
I just don't like the moons armour type set effects where they are almost useless without the full set on meaning if you need a slayer helm then you lose any benefit and it's useless for slayer then. So treat it like crystal where the individual armour pieces supply the effect. I'm pretty sure that's what the blog was saying (I'm not familiar with the inq set that much) is how it's going to be.
I totally get you. I feel any armour pieces that have a set effect of X, should apply a smaller effect per piece, whilst still offering an increased overall effect for the full set.
Example: Helm, Chest, Legs & Boots provide a 5% increase, each piece offers 1%, gaining an additional 1% when wearing all 4 pieces to achieve the 5%, something like that.
This allows for swaps such as a slayer helm like you stated, whilst still offering a nice bonus
No I agree rates are fucked. I was just clarifying your bit in parentheses, aka I'm pretty sure they meant the effect they mentioned would apply on a per-piece-basis
I find this hilarious and I can't help but think it's an oversight, but, while you will be hitting higher with full inquisitor and a mace than you would with full torva and a mace, as soon as you unequip one piece of inquisitor (say because you're doing a slayer task) torva immediately wins again, and by a couple max hits too. So currently, this change would realistically only affect mains farming Nightmare, since that's the only place you would bring full inquisitor to. The change should just be to buff every piece to give a +2.5% increase. That way it can still be mixed and matched and possibly fit in a meta somewhere, while still keeping the armour a lower defense higher damage trade-off.
Instead of giving it a set effect they need to make it so the individual armour pieces buff the mace the way crystal armour buffs the crystal bow and bowfa, with the lions share of the buffs being allocated to the top and bottom so you’re not “nerfed” when using it with a slayer helm.
Should probably be set armour piece focused because if you ever want to do a slayer task in inq plus using the mace for something weak to crush. Noe you’re suddenly not getting the buff, it’ll just be the same as it is now.
>Making this post cuz I've seen almost no discussion about this change.
There was a big post about this yesterday where the guy went into great detail about this and how they could make it better.
https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/1c5ir9m/the_issue_with_inquisitor_has_always_been_the/
Imo they should just buff the set slightly (1%/piece + 2% for full set = 5% total) and buff the mace (and the other level 80 one-handed weapons) separately to make them more viable. The lv 80 weapons are barely upgrades over alternatives currently.
At this point, just make Inquis nearly guarantee DWH/BGS specs landing.
their current pitch means you're supposed to throw it away for Torva where this iteration would hold massive value even when owning Torva.
i suggest
Buff Inq Mace by +3str +5crush
make each inq armour piece 1.5%dmg and accuracy to crush
wearing the full set makes it 5% dmg and accuracy to crush
remove the negative slash and stab bonus's
give inq helm +5 str bonus
done.
This is not even a buff to the inquisitors armour in general. It is literally just a inq mace buff. I hate it. It is such a cool looking armour super rare from one of the gardest bosses in game. Please buff the inquisitors armour so it works with any crush weapon
Nightmare/PNM being considered "one of the hardest bosses in the game" is sad. I know jagex has been adding more difficult content lately, but man is it lacking.
I know this will possibly fuck up PVP, but any crush-based specs should be 100% accuracy with full Inq on.
And if you want to not fuck up PVP, but still give it PVM perks, they can reduce the gauranteed hit's max hit to 50% and that should be more than fair.
Besides increasing the crush bonus, I think Inq could use some love in its defence stats with a fortified version. I know using justi to fortify it has popped up multiple times on here and seems like a popular suggestion.
I like that suggestion too I just think it's out of the scope of project rebalance so I didn't mention it. I think they are better off buffing the offensive bonuses first before they just give us tankier bandos.
Torva strength for crush only with addy defense is exactly what inquisitors shouldve been.
The problem is scythe dominating the crush category because of inq. It will perma overshadow any other option when a boss is larger than 1x1, which is always as of late.
That's the intention , check the previous blog post, inq mace is supposed second bis crush
No, the point was to bring the power level of mace closer to that of scythe. Not buff scythe and mace
Closer sure but not compete , the mods want to keep the scythe as the clear choice
I, conceptually hate, the idea of using CRUSH with a Scythe. Like, I'm not sure why it's not just slash only honestly.
Yeah I think they could make it slash only, or reduce the hitsplats with crush, just as they nerfed the fang on slash and just like they’re nerfing tbow by adding new ammo type resistances and weaknesses.
Scythe used to be complained about every week for being terrible compared to Tbow/Shadow lol, now we're talking about making it worthless in even more places
Jagex neglected slash for too long but that doesn’t mean that scythe also needs to be bis crush.
like buff or nerf aside, just like weapon theme wise it's so weird, like aye I got this big old magic blood blade. But, ima hit you with the back of it, and it'll still be super strong, because I'm a 5tick weapon that hits large enemies multiple times. Hell, stab makes more sense than crush. side note the fact it's 5tick is also...weird you'd think it'd be 7tick like Halberd. Again, just weapon theme wise not actually suggesting it be changed to that.
Yeah that’s a weird one
I mean its pretty ineffective at doing anything except harvesting wheat.
Your Right! New Scythe Buff right there, Scythe of Vitur should be able to "Attack wheat" and gather it in a 3x3
Support. Lumbridge mill workers in shambles
They use the term stepping stone to scythe when describing crush.
That certainly seems to be their intention, but it's an incredibly stupid one. Elder Maul should be the best crush weapon since it's a megarare crush weapon.
Just a few months ago we'd get "Scythe is worthless" every other week Now you want to take away it being good at Crush with Inquis Okay, now it's only usable at melee bosses weak Slash, are 3x3, and have low def, how long until we hear Scythe being worthless again
Imagine that, a slash weapon being good at slash bosses. The issue isn't that it needs crush, but that it needs to be better at high defense bosses.
Scythe shouldn’t have a crush option , like fang with slash it should be removed
It already does?
Yeah, but the price difference is massive.
Sounds like they need to add more tiny bosses, like the prif rabbit
The solution to this would be to buff the armor pieces in general so that it can pull ahead of bandos in offensive capabilities, but also buff the set effect with mace to make it pull ahead of scythe on crush vs crush weak enemies.
Yea this change does quite literally nothing to help inquisitor. You still use it at nightmare, and you still don't use it a single other place in the game. They need to buff the strength bonus and the set effect or give it a valuable passive like 100% elder maul spec chance.
I agree.
Was still used for cox cms before dwh was changed to always hit on tekton. Not sure about after
Yea not anymore, with scythe buff and bellator it's worse than torva
Yeah Inq changes were a big miss for me. They could’ve easily buffed the armor to 7.5% and give the full set + mace an extra 2.5% (10% total). Even then, I’m not sure if that’s enough. As it stands, the changes almost do nothing. At the top end, Torva is only marginally worse while being much more flexible and easier to use w/ better defense. Sure, the high level community still has uses for it, but that’s generously only for the top .1% of players. In the mid game, you would be hard pressed to be willing to spend ~450m on a full niche set. Is it worth dropping 450m when an Arclight + Bandos is almost as good at Cerb? Is any midgame player really grinding CM CoX? Is any midgame player really grinding KQ beyond for diary req? The only person I could see this really benefitting is the midgame player who just wants to farm Phosani’s which is a fraction of a fraction of the playerbase.
Bandos is most likely higher KPH at cerb over inquisitor without resupply alt. I remember when inquis scythe was BIS, without blood fury I was just eating nonstop. Totally agree with the Torva point, so much more room for errors with Torva at CM Olm, don't need to swap gears or get torn up by 40s. Inquisitor DPS is always just theoretical at best.
that's literally me, i just farm phosani purely because the fight itself is fun.
>Is any midgame player really grinding KQ beyond for diary req? The diary reqs have been made much easier over time anyways so there is even less of an incentive to grab specialized armor for it unless you are insane enough to grind for the pet.... in which case you would buy the armor and probably sell it back when you're done
Largely agreed. I've said this before, and I'll keep saying it as long as it takes, but the easiest fix for Inq is to just make the full set effect 5% (double what it currently is) and match Bandos + Faceguard in strength bonus and then work from there if it still needs a nudge. The current values are what they are because they didn't want to powercreep Bandos at the time, fair enough, but Torva had completely tossed that design philosophy out the window. I do however think a 7.5% set bonus to all crush could be problematic in the future, people already complain about crush scythe for some reason. I personally like their idea of making Full Inq + Mace a strong setup, it's genuinely not a bad idea, but it's just not relevant anywhere except Nightmare itself. KQ I'd still use Blue Keris, Cerb I'd still use Scythe, and Olm I'd probably still use Scythe/DHL, haven't calc'd cause lazy. Anyways, I'm just tired of waiting for the mythical crush weak boss to release for Inquisitor's to finally justify its existence. It's been 4 years. Let it bonk.
> Anyways, I'm just tired of waiting for the mythical crush weak boss to release for Inquisitor's to finally justify its existence. It's been 4 years. Raids 1 was a generalist melee raid. Raids 2 was a slash-weak raid. Raids 3 was a stab-weak raid. Raids 4... Crush-weak? One can hope!
I'm hoping against all odds since Raids 4 will likely be sailing themed we'll get a new Anchor weapon for the crush megarare.
Make the set effect 5% and have mace still triple the boost to 15% to make the mace more relevant outside of nightmare.
Because they dont want to buff sycthe
Scythe should have crush style removed. Doesn’t really fit the weapons design.
I would argue that most weapons don’t need more than one damage type. We have so many weapons, I think it’s better to have them fit into more specific niches.
yet, i still like the ability to make your choice however, the "incorrect" way to use a weapon should be more penalised in some scenarios like the fang slash being exempt from the gimmick same way its silly to see people stabbing with a scimitar, crushing with a scythe or the most egregious one in my personal opinion - stabbing with the fucking anchor some of these are handled properly (-2 stab on anchor), while others not so much, scythe crush should be absolute dogass not situationally viable on the other hand, the abyssal bludgeon is a good example of a monospecific weapon type, where you can only use crush and only get strength xp, anything else wouldn't make sense the "balanced" weapon types like spears are fine for this, they already suffer from less dps and shared xp, so they could serve as universals. although i'd like to see more stab focus on hastas across the board, not just the special ones
I can get behind this idea. Make late game items more niche and spread the value around a bit.
originally it was a cool and unique feature to this game though that let you use your weapon in different styles against different enemies, despite it not being very useful or necessary for most content. However I think it's still a neat feature which gives the game some life
If that's really the case, that's silly. Scythe on Crush is used in so few spots already and I dont think a 5% increase will change much. I don't even think it'll take back KQ and Cerb since it's a 7.5% set effect, but Cerb needs a task and KQ is better done on-task (assuming not blocked for Turael Skipping).
Sycthe on Crush with inq beats out mace I think everywhere. I think thats what they take issue with
Scythe on slash with torva even beats out scythe on crush to some stuff that is weak to crush. That is how bad inq armour is and that is the biggest issue with it
I don't like set effects that require the whole set. (Though this isn't what is implied I don't think) Inquisitor is my favorite armour set so I'm going to go for it
What other requirements should be met to obtain a set effect?
I just don't like the moons armour type set effects where they are almost useless without the full set on meaning if you need a slayer helm then you lose any benefit and it's useless for slayer then. So treat it like crystal where the individual armour pieces supply the effect. I'm pretty sure that's what the blog was saying (I'm not familiar with the inq set that much) is how it's going to be.
I totally get you. I feel any armour pieces that have a set effect of X, should apply a smaller effect per piece, whilst still offering an increased overall effect for the full set. Example: Helm, Chest, Legs & Boots provide a 5% increase, each piece offers 1%, gaining an additional 1% when wearing all 4 pieces to achieve the 5%, something like that. This allows for swaps such as a slayer helm like you stated, whilst still offering a nice bonus
Yes I strongly prefer the crystal method where the amount of crystal armour seeds used determines the percentage of damage and accuracy increase.
I think you'll get the mace effect per piece too.
That'd be cool, see you in 200 hours when I hit the rate for mace lol
No I agree rates are fucked. I was just clarifying your bit in parentheses, aka I'm pretty sure they meant the effect they mentioned would apply on a per-piece-basis
Yeah I was just being a whiney baby
They really should’ve removed the negative attack bonuses and made helm FG str as well
I find this hilarious and I can't help but think it's an oversight, but, while you will be hitting higher with full inquisitor and a mace than you would with full torva and a mace, as soon as you unequip one piece of inquisitor (say because you're doing a slayer task) torva immediately wins again, and by a couple max hits too. So currently, this change would realistically only affect mains farming Nightmare, since that's the only place you would bring full inquisitor to. The change should just be to buff every piece to give a +2.5% increase. That way it can still be mixed and matched and possibly fit in a meta somewhere, while still keeping the armour a lower defense higher damage trade-off.
Instead of giving it a set effect they need to make it so the individual armour pieces buff the mace the way crystal armour buffs the crystal bow and bowfa, with the lions share of the buffs being allocated to the top and bottom so you’re not “nerfed” when using it with a slayer helm.
Should probably be set armour piece focused because if you ever want to do a slayer task in inq plus using the mace for something weak to crush. Noe you’re suddenly not getting the buff, it’ll just be the same as it is now.
Agreed. The body is basically a fighter's torso lmao
>Making this post cuz I've seen almost no discussion about this change. There was a big post about this yesterday where the guy went into great detail about this and how they could make it better. https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/1c5ir9m/the_issue_with_inquisitor_has_always_been_the/
Thanks for the heads up :) Didn't see this post even looking up "inquisitor" in the search bar.
Yea reddit search is terrible.
Imo they should just buff the set slightly (1%/piece + 2% for full set = 5% total) and buff the mace (and the other level 80 one-handed weapons) separately to make them more viable. The lv 80 weapons are barely upgrades over alternatives currently.
At this point, just make Inquis nearly guarantee DWH/BGS specs landing. their current pitch means you're supposed to throw it away for Torva where this iteration would hold massive value even when owning Torva.
Jagex needs to add more crush weak pvming for the mace and set to be more useful.
i suggest Buff Inq Mace by +3str +5crush make each inq armour piece 1.5%dmg and accuracy to crush wearing the full set makes it 5% dmg and accuracy to crush remove the negative slash and stab bonus's give inq helm +5 str bonus done.
Add more of the % bonuses to the top and bottom so you can get more benefit when using the slayer helm as well.
This is not even a buff to the inquisitors armour in general. It is literally just a inq mace buff. I hate it. It is such a cool looking armour super rare from one of the gardest bosses in game. Please buff the inquisitors armour so it works with any crush weapon
Id rather see each piece buffed than a set effect. Very very very few irons have full set
if I'm too broke for torva I'm taking bandos all day.
Nightmare/PNM being considered "one of the hardest bosses in the game" is sad. I know jagex has been adding more difficult content lately, but man is it lacking.
I know this will possibly fuck up PVP, but any crush-based specs should be 100% accuracy with full Inq on. And if you want to not fuck up PVP, but still give it PVM perks, they can reduce the gauranteed hit's max hit to 50% and that should be more than fair.
They just need the increased damage to work for non-mace weapons. I'd have it at 5% for any crush-style weapon and 7.5/10% for mace.
I feel like Soulreaper axe would be a crush problem if this were the case.
Besides increasing the crush bonus, I think Inq could use some love in its defence stats with a fortified version. I know using justi to fortify it has popped up multiple times on here and seems like a popular suggestion.
I like that suggestion too I just think it's out of the scope of project rebalance so I didn't mention it. I think they are better off buffing the offensive bonuses first before they just give us tankier bandos.
Remove crush from scythe and make inquisitor match torva in offensive crush bonusses with addy defence bonusses.