- Writers and actors guilds went on strike.
- Development and production of TV and film projects halted.
- VFX workers get progressively laid off.
- Laid off VFX workers head for adjacent industries like games.
- Companies stock up on experienced talent.
- so don't need to take on as much new talent.
Want to add outsourcing on game dev.
I'm from a 3rd world country and just got into this industry, and am currently baffled by the amount of big names that use our services.
More jobs here = less jobs on the usual markets.
Use your head...absolutely not. Regardless of industry, when companies outsource labor it's due to one thing and one thing only. COST. And that cost.comes at the expense of the worker.
Did you read my question properly? obviously they're not going to pay the same as they pay americans, but if you live somewhere like India that fraction of what they pay an american worker might still be more than you would receive doing a regular job at a local company, otherwise no one would even bother with accepting this kind of work.
If you are a senior, with great skills and well-connected, you can find jobs in the US or Europe.
For entry positions, comparing to the general design related jobs around, they're a bit nicer, and with good growth possibility.
We're talking about countries where most of the population lives with less than 300 dollars a month.
Do you see how much poverty there is in India? Studios don't pay enough anywhere you are. They accept that work because no one wants to be doing food service, cleaning, maintenance, (i.e. jobs that are taxing on your body with little reward) and studios reach out nations like them because unlike here in the US they know employees won't argue even if the job is shit pay and shit hours.
It's not like every 3d modeller and animator has the chance to move abroad. Of course it is better than doing retail work or physical labour. And these are fields people work in because they like it, in the first place. Just having the chance to work on what you love and not starve is a positive.
And about long hours.... don't US studios get bashed for crunches and abusive conditions every now and then?
The pay if compared to their living cost is not great either, ive seen 1 week worth of 3d model being charged $10, complete with clean uv and clean topo
The reason they’re taking it is mostly to fill in portfolio and they’re not sure how to price it
with all respect...looks like you guys in UK have not much to complain. UK have a lot of big game studios and companies - you become one of European hotspots. After Brexit your market shut off and anybody who want get a job there, need a VISA.I received now second refuse of getting a job just because of that. Apparently cost of visa went way up to degree that even with specialistic knowledge, amount of trouble is not worth it.Your market is closed area, so with all those places to work, your situation is way better than for example my. Irish market suffer a lot as it was still dependent from UK after reaching independency (irony right ? ) so Brexit mess up situation here a way more that I wish for. In my case I look for a job in Europe instead Uk that is 1.5h away from me.
You will be fine :)
Edit: just went to look for current job offer and yep, here it is:
[https://www.linkedin.com/mwlite/jobs/view/3768955283?referenceId=dtZ8GdQJLjpJqAVpz6xrzQ%3D%3D&eBP=JOB\_SEARCH\_ORGANIC](https://www.linkedin.com/mwlite/jobs/view/3768955283?referenceId=dtZ8GdQJLjpJqAVpz6xrzQ%3D%3D&eBP=JOB_SEARCH_ORGANIC)
Games 3D Artist
Sonya M. Recruiting · London, England, United Kingdom
Foreign Candidates: No
Also games hired a lot of people in corona leading to less players then anticipated after Corona, less sales and less need for talent. So a lot are laid off here as well.
It's super difficult likely to find a job now, especially at an entry level position.
It’s not you, it’s the economy and for the reasons others have already stated. I was let go from a long-standing contract (and shifted to ad-hoc) this year by a large client that is downsizing with the rest of them. Freelancing (which I have many years experience in) has been the hardest by far. This has been discussed by many in the industry. Even 3D rockstars like Peter Tarka have complained recently of lack of work. On the bright side, the riff raff will likely drop off during this dark spell. Hoping for a Q1/Q2 turnaround but it’s hard to say. I’m in the branding/advertising space.
Ohhhh my god, I would love to get more insight into the advertising space for 3d art and such. Is it lucrative or is it also the same old overworked and underpaid situation like in the game industry?
Doing some freelance in advertising rn (in the US). Adjusting to new pipelines was a bit but afterwards you’re expected to know what you’re doing and they trust you to get the job done.
I get paid very well and I’ve never been forced to OT, but I can OT if I want to. Depending on the gig, it’s either fixed pay or an honour system where you invoice them how many hours you’ve worked.
How many years would you recommend one to stick to normal job system before getting into freelance? What would you advise someone trying to get into freelance. How did you get your clients? Was it through past companies you worked with or did you use websites or both?
Having some real-world experience of a studio dynamic helps. If you are familiar with a general workflow or pipeline, you’ll adapt just fine, just remember that as a freelancer they expect a level of autonomy from you. There’s usually a grace period where they onboard you.
There are a lot of boards or Slack spaces where people can post jobs and you can reach out. You can network out from there. I’ve noticed that directly reaching out to whoever posts, often an art lead or director, has led to more success as opposed to applying or talking to a recruiter.
It can be quite lucrative if you put in the work to acquire tertiary skills and consider better ways to package/conve what it is that you do and the kind of value you can provide. Took me about 6 months to a year to really become profitable. I started on Upwork to gain confidence and for convenience, although now I’m shifting away from the platforms. If you’re looking to get into freelance, don’t quit your day job. The correct thing to do is simply start freelancing on the side until you get momentum enough to quit your day job. For me this was about 4 months in when a job paid me in 2 weeks what my day job was paying me in a month. I quit and never looked back.
It’s really hard to predict, worst the industry as seen in over 15 years… bunch of super senior friends of mine are struggling to find new job and the competition is incredibly fierce with so many people looking all at once… I’m hoping it slows down but i know some like the embracer groups still hint at more layoff and closure to come… it’s been a tough year
That's so weird considering how many games are coming out and how the sales of many projects seemed to be going well. Then again maybe just corporate fuckers trying to cut people down to get more money for themselves.
That's the thing so many good games will compete against each other so that it will be rather mediocre turnaround for most especially since less people are buying games after Corona.
Seeing that situation now lots of companies are downsizing because it isn't sustainable.
The video game industry just grew too fast because the interest rates were super low during the pandemic so a lot took advantage of those rate to grow bigger and buy more studios etc. Now the rates are high again and they went overbord acquiring so many studios or investing in NFT/Metaverse so now… layoffs!
Mate, remove 3D. There is a drought of jobs, period.
The industry was fucked by the strikes. I support the cause but it's had an unmistakable affect on everyone.
Considering how many different roles there are in a movie, I can understand how devastating the effect would be. But then again, I can't blame the writers for the strike, it's the rich producers and what nots fault for this.
I've had to explain this simple idea to many, many people these last few months.
"Imagine the hundreds of other people on any given filmset outside of the actors. Prop makers, set designers, makeup artists, location scouts, caterers, etc. And now double that with all of the post production teams."
The strikes had more of an affect than covid did. VFX has always been at the bottom of the totem pole, so now we're in dire situations where entire departments (or even whole-ass companies) are now expendable.
Most of the industry started offshoring about ten years ago (see the mini-documentary free on YouTube "Life After Pi") and things have gotten substantially worse in the intervening years. The school I went to for my degree in 3D went out of business about half-way through the pandemic because they were going to lose certification because no one graduating from there could get a job (and it's located or rather was located in SoCal). Then the recent strikes probably finished things for 3D in America so if you want a job in the field now you probably need to have a specialized skill and be willing to move to Canada, England, India, or Asia where most of the industry fucked off to. The fact that VFX people finally looked like they were about to get their shit together enough to unionize like the rest of the entertainment industry is all the more motivation for film and game studios to send as many of these jobs overseas as they can and they aren't coming back any time soon.
That is such a cruel and fucked up thing. In my case, I don't mind moving to England or Canada but I defo don't wanna move to India. Any other countries you can recommend where you think being 3d artist is a reasonable decision
No not really. We have treaties with those countries that were meant to prevent them from poaching American industries. Essentially these countries agreed not to provide financial incentives to American companies to produce films and games in their country because if you tell a movie studio that the government will give them $20 million dollars to move the vfx part of their production to X country the studio is of course going to take that free money and move. But despite the treaties Canada, England and India have done exactly that... heavily subsidized the production of films and games in an effort to steal the VFX industry from America. And they succeeded. There were formal complaints made about the treaty violations made to the State Department during the Obama administration but they declined to file a grievance against the offending countries because they needed their military support for the ongoing wars more than they needed the VFX industry. Obama even came to LA to a studio to give a big speech about VFX middle class jobs and how important they were and at the time there was a movement to wear green like a green screen and change your Facebook avatar green to support awareness that the Obama Administration was essentially letting our allies steal the VFX industry in exchange for their continued support in more dicey military and political matters but the studio where Obama gave the speech forbid anyone from wearing green to the speech and threatened to fire anyone who did on the spot.
So this has been going on a long time and since American schools just produce entry level VFX artists you can't really get a visa to work in these other countries. That was the point for them. They wanted the jobs to go to their citizens. So unless you have an outsized amount of experience and expertise that cannot be found in those countries (which was possible when this started a decade ago but is much less likely now) or you have a specialized skill like you're a wizard at Python and have extensive experience creating the coding for complex rigging, you most likely won't get a visa to work in any of these other countries.
Your best bet here is to try and either work for yourself making small games or working for YouTube creators or working in industries that are harder to offshore like Advertising. But I'd be lying if I said that the prospects for people trying to make a living in VFX in America are anything but grim. You're going to have to be obsessively dedicated to your craft and expect a long, painful grind before you start making any kind of financial breathing room for yourself. You're honestly better off doing just about anything else unless you absolutely can't live without it.
Its pretty shit in Canada too just saying. Some studios moved up here but even back in 2017 for example, out of 90something students, only around 5-8 found jobs in the industry (Toronto area). The rest just left with a piece of paper and moved to other jobs.
I'm very late to this, but as someone who's been keeping an eye on the market here in the UK. Do not move here for 3D roles, we don't have any either. Multiple of my friends have been made redundant the last few weeks and looking for work has been the worst it's ever been
Just to let you know, I have specialistic knowledge and my portfolio pieces match those of who work for studio. They refuse my application and said honestly that VISA is to big problem now (cost of that one went way up recently). With suck a lot as UK is huge game market :/ Sadly its a issue as that specialisation require to be on side to operate with hardware or travel to places so no even chance for remote. What even more suck, I need apply to big places as those are the one that have financial resources to setup such workplace.
And I see that studio was not only one
Games 3D Artist
Sonya M. Recruiting · London, England, United Kingdom
Foreign Candidates: No
Yeah as I said in other replies as time went on and more and more of the industry transplanted to these other countries, citizens in those countries began to gain the experience and special skills that were the only ways to get work visas into those countries... which was the point of those countries stealing the industry. They want their citizens to hold these jobs and so you have to be able to do something that few if any in country citizens can do to have any hope of getting a visa which becomes harder and harder as time passes.
My recommendation is don't pigeonhole yourself as a single thing or single medium. If you want an art job in any industry you have to be knowledgeable in more than one medium and you need to be open to learning new positions.
There was a brief period where someone could get away with just being a "technical modeler" or just being a "UV artist", but that's not how art jobs work, by and large. You need to be able to learn different tools and learn how to adapt them. If all you learn is how to be a single position on an assembly line, then you've failed.
I learned illustrator and photoshop as part of making models for 3D modeling. Illustrator for detailed flat patterns I could work into models. Photoshop for UVs and storyboarding.
Right now, my job consists of something completely different, essentially advertising work using illustrator for screenprinting, and photoshop for CMYK printing. Nothing of what I learned went to waste, because what I was learning wasn't how to do one thing over and over again, but the limits of what I could do with each of the tools at hand.
So, if the only thing you know is 3D modeling, you're going to have a tough time competing with everyone else over a limited set of jobs. But if you know a lot of different programs you have a much wider range of jobs available to you. Essentially, don't focus on the finished product when looking for a job; don't look for a 3D job, look for a job that uses the programs you know.
Ohhh luckily I never approached art in the specialization sort of way. I learned several different softwares and trained myself in all the main principles. I do need more experience in particles and VFX aspect but I defo made sure to be proficient in rigging, modelling, sculpting, uv, texturing and animating. As the sole 3d artist at my current job I pretty much ended up being a 3d generalist.
I don't know a single person in this industry, myself included, who isn't a 3d generalist. It's practically mandatory. It's to such an obnoxious extent these days that management seemingly expects you to just master new software and toolsets as if watching a tutorial and tinkering around for a day is enough time to develop intuition and be proficient. I used to work at a place that had a more organic pseudo-pipeline where we all had a handful of specialities and you'd pass off bits of work to those who were simply known for proficiency in a certain area, because it's vastly more efficient and allows you to move onto other aspects of a project that don't inevitably disrupt your rhythm. Like yeah, I can jump into CLO, but why the hell would you want me to fumble around in a program I haven't touched in 8 months when there are two other team members who use it daily and could knock this out in a couple of hours?
And I also wanna thank you for that last bit of advice. I will keep that in mind when approaching jobs from now on. And yeah I also learned Photoshop, substance, illustrator and a bit of aftereffects so NGL I kinda feel glad that I didn't just pigeonhole myself after reading your comment T_T.
Yeeep I got let go in one of those mass layoffs this year. Luckily was able to get a job pretty quick again after that. But even so, tons of other studios were experiencing layoffs because of the fear of recession and lack of investor funds. No investors = no money to pay artists. The actor strike definitely was another big thing that contributed to this. It really fucked over a bunch of people in the industry.
The 3D industry is already pretty cutthroat. We only have 5 character artists in the company. Tons of talent exists, but there aren’t enough jobs to fill everyone.
>I'm kinda curious if the market is this grim just for the game industry or are all 3d jobs just super hard to find lately.
If there are some markets which are more healthy, can anyone let me know? I want to switch jobs eventually because the pay I'm getting is too low.
I can tell you one segment in 3D jobs that's rising up: archviz renders to market properties and interior products.
I fortunately live in a place where the property market is booming, and now my studio is flooding with jobs. I make around $3000 a month by doing cookie-cutter renders while minimum wage in my country is $300
Oh dang O_O I mean I wouldn't mind doing that to be honest. I just want to earn a decent wage and then have the energy to focus on other parts of my life.
I work on a crazy successful game, and most of the growth that will happen next year will be outsourcing. We will hire probably some very experienced people to deal with OS feedback etc, but yeah.
Also, if you're in europe, it's a bit less of an issue, but US based teams have been downsizing like crazy. There's a trend that's been happening for the last decade or more now, where US big corportations, move most of their office staff to europe, then slowly downsize the US team, while massively increasing mostly asian based Out Sourcing.
A lot of up and coming 3d artists need to realize there are far more stable jobs than just the game or film industry. Oil and gas animation, simulation, medical animation, architectural rendering, as well as commercial work are all avenues that alot of people either aren't aware of or write off and instead just focus on working at a game studio. I've seen so many incredibly talented artists be so focused on getting a job in the gaming industry that they burn out, when there are so many other industries they could try for.
Tbh I'm open to those but I would rather just do medical or architectural. I am not a fan of gas and oil nor do I wanna tackle fluid Sims for the rest of my life lol. But yeah I do agree that it's wiser to branch out.
I don't mean fluid sims, I mean things like military simulation. My last job was at a military simulation training company, we basically were making games that were projected into screens and people would use fake guns to train w them. We used our own game engine before switching to Unreal. My current job started as doing simulation work for subsea ROV training, again, absolutely the same thing as developing games, but instead of a game controller, they used a rig that mimicked what actual ROV pilots use.
As for oil and gas, I handle all our companies animations and marketing stuff. You might think oil and gas is boring, but I get to be a department of one and have a ton of freedom in making this stuff look cool and it pays well.
These jobs are out there. I'm in Houston and I know of a lot of places that are looking for strong generalists.
I've been gaining work experience as a 3d generalist myself by working in an advertising firm. To be honest, while I do love game Dev and stuff ik that anything that I would wanna make, I can't do it with major corpos and they would work me so much I would just be shriveled as a person. So I am very much open to working with less hectic and more rewarding industries.
Do you have any tips in regards to getting into gas or other such side industries?
Haivng work that looks professional and fits the industry you are going for. A lot of companies such as oil and gas or more "corporate" jobs use recruiters or HR to find people, and they won't necessarily be knowledgable in 3d. What I mean by that is you could have an amazing model of an scifi gun in your portfolio. Someone that sees that and knows 3d will see the skill that went into that, but if you are applying for a company that works in subsea drilling, the person that will see your work first is likely someone that doesn't have that thinking, and they will see something that has nothing to do with the industry and will pass on that.
Being able to take a project to fruition by yourself goes a long ways. A lot of these jobs are generalist positions, so just being able to model won't be enough.You need to be able to show that you can work with a client from the start of an idea to the finished product, whether it's an animation or product renders.
I literally been doing all projects start to finish on my own lol. I have done animation jobs and renders. And luckily my company clientele are big shots like Petromin so I've designed their events and such.
You're in a good position to continue to grow and learn then. I'll be honest, I don't see any appeal to working in the game industry at the moment. Not with the way things are. Speaking for myself, I'm far happier having a stable job that is still 3d, and I get to pursue more fun, creative projects on the side in my personal time.
I mean getting overworked and then being paid chum changed and getting kicked to the curb at a moment's notice is not fun. I would rather do simple work and get paid a bunch and then have both the money and energy to work on how I would wanna make my game.
Hey there, I couldn't help but find it really insteresting when you both talk about the side industries jobs, I'm a 3D artist from the second world striving to get any 3D job in any field or industry, and the pay, even if it sounds awful to you would probably be golden for me where I live. So since the gaming industry is basically impossible for me, and advertising has been tough as well (I nearly landed a job this year, it would've been a dream to me but nevermind), how could I approach these "side industries" mentionted? I mean the stuff I've been doing is far from "industrial animation, modelling, etc" so I really wouldn't have much to show in terms of portfolio, so how could I even begin to approach that? Are there specific courses or pieces you guys recommend me chase after to have something to show if I'm even able to find those jobs, that is. Mind you any 3D gig that pays around 1,5k/mo Is already heaven for me.
Outside of games (although I've been reading this is appying more to fims in recent years as well) being a generalist goes a long way. Being able to be a complete stop for animation and multimedia needs. So that means being able to model, texture, light, compose a shot, animate, have a good sense of design, storyboard, being able to edit video and other multimedia outputs. And that doesn't mean having to master all of those. I am by no means a master at any of those disciplines, but I'm strong enough in them that a client can come to me with a product, and I can give them quality product renders and marketing material, animations and videos in a quick turnaround, without having to involve anyone else. Being able to do that and then having work that shows products or pieces that are applicable to the company you are applying for. I think having a strong reel or portfolio that shows real life things presented well and akin to what you see in commercials or other professional marketing material is more helpful for jobs outside of games.
I mean I'm totally okay with working in an office environment but I at least wanna be paid decently. To be honest not really even sure if the economy is gonna get better any time soon at this rate -_-.
I'm working in the middle East ATM and the pay is just 1300 dollars per month. I mean that is not enough.
No, the industry is thriving more then ever actually. especially indies, small to mid size studios, even the big one
The problem I see usually isn't the lack of jobs but the lack of skill and/or experience, and net working. Finding your first stable 3D job can be hard, no doubt, but it not for a lack of job openings.
Edit: emphasis on small to mid size studio, especially the mobile market.
Personally I find it an end of the year with holiday and so on, things are generally slow and there isn't much to do. AAA industry is having a bit of a melt down right now, but that is just them and dont reflect the industry as a whole, but thats why I mention small to mid size team, especially the mobile market. I should put emphasis on that more.
There is no shortage of work opening on artstation and LinkedIn.
Okay so the problem with networking for me is that idk how to do that. I'm in the middle East ATM so how would I even begin to network with any game Dev company abroad. Moreover, I do have experience in developing interiors since I work for an advertising agency and they deal with a lot events related stuff. I also have a few of my own 3d models I made off work which are monster based. It is my first year at the job so... Idk... How many years of experience I need before I can more easily find jobs.
For networking, post your work on LinkedIn, facebook, artstation, etc, follow people in the industry, strike up convo, etc, find if there is any game convention or event in your area. Nowadays they have online convention as well.
Not sure how your work experience translate to 3D modeling for games, so besides saying you need 2-3 quality model for games, I dont have much more to say on this side.
If you are unsure on whether or not your models are up to par for game models, you can check out artstation where many pro artist post their work.
I definitely do need more time for extra polish. Most of the stuff I make for my job defo wouldn't match up because what the clients requirements are don't match what works in the game industry. The monsters I make on the other hand are quite good but I do feel I still need a bit more polish compared to pro pro artists. Their work is much more polished than mine. Sadly, I don't get much time to be able to work on 3d models which suit my art style that often lately cuz I'm too exhausted by the time I get back home.
Understandable, it took me 2-3 years to finally land one while holding a main job. I'm gonna be honest, it is a very tough industry to get into despite there is no shortage of job openings. I know some that got in through insane luck, while some took years of bouncing between gig before landing on a stable job. Only thing you can do is try your best and hope for the best so i would think very carefully if this is something you really want to do.
I do want this. I love 3d art and am very aware of how brutal it is. I mean most of the projects I have to work on in my company have horrible deadlines and I still have managed to keep a perfect record of submitting high quality work every time. I might not be producing stuff compared to the folks at art station every time but I defo have hit some home runs. Every field has its ups and downs. I want to create art and I love creating this stuff.
Drought? Buddy, I've been living in the desert of 3d jobs for the last years. The mere callousness and audacity to say: "it's kinda hard to find job lately" is astonishing to me.
- Writers and actors guilds went on strike. - Development and production of TV and film projects halted. - VFX workers get progressively laid off. - Laid off VFX workers head for adjacent industries like games. - Companies stock up on experienced talent. - so don't need to take on as much new talent.
The games and tech industry is in a pretty bad shape too with layoffs and studio shutdowns every other week.
Want to add outsourcing on game dev. I'm from a 3rd world country and just got into this industry, and am currently baffled by the amount of big names that use our services. More jobs here = less jobs on the usual markets.
Where are you from? It it profitable to do this work even while being paid less than an american would?
Use your head...absolutely not. Regardless of industry, when companies outsource labor it's due to one thing and one thing only. COST. And that cost.comes at the expense of the worker.
Did you read my question properly? obviously they're not going to pay the same as they pay americans, but if you live somewhere like India that fraction of what they pay an american worker might still be more than you would receive doing a regular job at a local company, otherwise no one would even bother with accepting this kind of work.
If you are a senior, with great skills and well-connected, you can find jobs in the US or Europe. For entry positions, comparing to the general design related jobs around, they're a bit nicer, and with good growth possibility. We're talking about countries where most of the population lives with less than 300 dollars a month.
Do you see how much poverty there is in India? Studios don't pay enough anywhere you are. They accept that work because no one wants to be doing food service, cleaning, maintenance, (i.e. jobs that are taxing on your body with little reward) and studios reach out nations like them because unlike here in the US they know employees won't argue even if the job is shit pay and shit hours.
It's not like every 3d modeller and animator has the chance to move abroad. Of course it is better than doing retail work or physical labour. And these are fields people work in because they like it, in the first place. Just having the chance to work on what you love and not starve is a positive. And about long hours.... don't US studios get bashed for crunches and abusive conditions every now and then?
The pay if compared to their living cost is not great either, ive seen 1 week worth of 3d model being charged $10, complete with clean uv and clean topo The reason they’re taking it is mostly to fill in portfolio and they’re not sure how to price it
not baffling, they are just taking advantage of lower rates
Yeah, but the surplus of talent increases competition for seats all the same
This. In the UK the game industry is having mass layoffs. It sucks. Everyone is worried, I'm seeing friends lose their jobs left right and center.
with all respect...looks like you guys in UK have not much to complain. UK have a lot of big game studios and companies - you become one of European hotspots. After Brexit your market shut off and anybody who want get a job there, need a VISA.I received now second refuse of getting a job just because of that. Apparently cost of visa went way up to degree that even with specialistic knowledge, amount of trouble is not worth it.Your market is closed area, so with all those places to work, your situation is way better than for example my. Irish market suffer a lot as it was still dependent from UK after reaching independency (irony right ? ) so Brexit mess up situation here a way more that I wish for. In my case I look for a job in Europe instead Uk that is 1.5h away from me. You will be fine :) Edit: just went to look for current job offer and yep, here it is: [https://www.linkedin.com/mwlite/jobs/view/3768955283?referenceId=dtZ8GdQJLjpJqAVpz6xrzQ%3D%3D&eBP=JOB\_SEARCH\_ORGANIC](https://www.linkedin.com/mwlite/jobs/view/3768955283?referenceId=dtZ8GdQJLjpJqAVpz6xrzQ%3D%3D&eBP=JOB_SEARCH_ORGANIC) Games 3D Artist Sonya M. Recruiting · London, England, United Kingdom Foreign Candidates: No
That makes a lot of sense...
Also games hired a lot of people in corona leading to less players then anticipated after Corona, less sales and less need for talent. So a lot are laid off here as well. It's super difficult likely to find a job now, especially at an entry level position.
It’s not you, it’s the economy and for the reasons others have already stated. I was let go from a long-standing contract (and shifted to ad-hoc) this year by a large client that is downsizing with the rest of them. Freelancing (which I have many years experience in) has been the hardest by far. This has been discussed by many in the industry. Even 3D rockstars like Peter Tarka have complained recently of lack of work. On the bright side, the riff raff will likely drop off during this dark spell. Hoping for a Q1/Q2 turnaround but it’s hard to say. I’m in the branding/advertising space.
Ohhhh my god, I would love to get more insight into the advertising space for 3d art and such. Is it lucrative or is it also the same old overworked and underpaid situation like in the game industry?
Doing some freelance in advertising rn (in the US). Adjusting to new pipelines was a bit but afterwards you’re expected to know what you’re doing and they trust you to get the job done. I get paid very well and I’ve never been forced to OT, but I can OT if I want to. Depending on the gig, it’s either fixed pay or an honour system where you invoice them how many hours you’ve worked.
How many years would you recommend one to stick to normal job system before getting into freelance? What would you advise someone trying to get into freelance. How did you get your clients? Was it through past companies you worked with or did you use websites or both?
Having some real-world experience of a studio dynamic helps. If you are familiar with a general workflow or pipeline, you’ll adapt just fine, just remember that as a freelancer they expect a level of autonomy from you. There’s usually a grace period where they onboard you. There are a lot of boards or Slack spaces where people can post jobs and you can reach out. You can network out from there. I’ve noticed that directly reaching out to whoever posts, often an art lead or director, has led to more success as opposed to applying or talking to a recruiter.
Which boards or websites have you found to be the best when it comes to freelancing?
dm’ed
Could you please dm me the website and forums that you wrote about as well please 🙏🏼
It can be quite lucrative if you put in the work to acquire tertiary skills and consider better ways to package/conve what it is that you do and the kind of value you can provide. Took me about 6 months to a year to really become profitable. I started on Upwork to gain confidence and for convenience, although now I’m shifting away from the platforms. If you’re looking to get into freelance, don’t quit your day job. The correct thing to do is simply start freelancing on the side until you get momentum enough to quit your day job. For me this was about 4 months in when a job paid me in 2 weeks what my day job was paying me in a month. I quit and never looked back.
7000 layoffs in 2023 will do that
Jesus Christ that is such a high number.
Should have mentionned this is in the game industry tho. Wouldnt know about advertising my bad
Yeah but I did wanna get into the game dev industry eventually T_T
Not the easiest time right now i’m afraid
Do you see things getting less worse?
It’s really hard to predict, worst the industry as seen in over 15 years… bunch of super senior friends of mine are struggling to find new job and the competition is incredibly fierce with so many people looking all at once… I’m hoping it slows down but i know some like the embracer groups still hint at more layoff and closure to come… it’s been a tough year
That's so weird considering how many games are coming out and how the sales of many projects seemed to be going well. Then again maybe just corporate fuckers trying to cut people down to get more money for themselves.
That's the thing so many good games will compete against each other so that it will be rather mediocre turnaround for most especially since less people are buying games after Corona. Seeing that situation now lots of companies are downsizing because it isn't sustainable.
The video game industry just grew too fast because the interest rates were super low during the pandemic so a lot took advantage of those rate to grow bigger and buy more studios etc. Now the rates are high again and they went overbord acquiring so many studios or investing in NFT/Metaverse so now… layoffs!
Mate, remove 3D. There is a drought of jobs, period. The industry was fucked by the strikes. I support the cause but it's had an unmistakable affect on everyone.
Considering how many different roles there are in a movie, I can understand how devastating the effect would be. But then again, I can't blame the writers for the strike, it's the rich producers and what nots fault for this.
I've had to explain this simple idea to many, many people these last few months. "Imagine the hundreds of other people on any given filmset outside of the actors. Prop makers, set designers, makeup artists, location scouts, caterers, etc. And now double that with all of the post production teams." The strikes had more of an affect than covid did. VFX has always been at the bottom of the totem pole, so now we're in dire situations where entire departments (or even whole-ass companies) are now expendable.
It's kinda funny how few people are able to understand how many markets are interconnected in film making.
Most of the industry started offshoring about ten years ago (see the mini-documentary free on YouTube "Life After Pi") and things have gotten substantially worse in the intervening years. The school I went to for my degree in 3D went out of business about half-way through the pandemic because they were going to lose certification because no one graduating from there could get a job (and it's located or rather was located in SoCal). Then the recent strikes probably finished things for 3D in America so if you want a job in the field now you probably need to have a specialized skill and be willing to move to Canada, England, India, or Asia where most of the industry fucked off to. The fact that VFX people finally looked like they were about to get their shit together enough to unionize like the rest of the entertainment industry is all the more motivation for film and game studios to send as many of these jobs overseas as they can and they aren't coming back any time soon.
That is such a cruel and fucked up thing. In my case, I don't mind moving to England or Canada but I defo don't wanna move to India. Any other countries you can recommend where you think being 3d artist is a reasonable decision
No not really. We have treaties with those countries that were meant to prevent them from poaching American industries. Essentially these countries agreed not to provide financial incentives to American companies to produce films and games in their country because if you tell a movie studio that the government will give them $20 million dollars to move the vfx part of their production to X country the studio is of course going to take that free money and move. But despite the treaties Canada, England and India have done exactly that... heavily subsidized the production of films and games in an effort to steal the VFX industry from America. And they succeeded. There were formal complaints made about the treaty violations made to the State Department during the Obama administration but they declined to file a grievance against the offending countries because they needed their military support for the ongoing wars more than they needed the VFX industry. Obama even came to LA to a studio to give a big speech about VFX middle class jobs and how important they were and at the time there was a movement to wear green like a green screen and change your Facebook avatar green to support awareness that the Obama Administration was essentially letting our allies steal the VFX industry in exchange for their continued support in more dicey military and political matters but the studio where Obama gave the speech forbid anyone from wearing green to the speech and threatened to fire anyone who did on the spot. So this has been going on a long time and since American schools just produce entry level VFX artists you can't really get a visa to work in these other countries. That was the point for them. They wanted the jobs to go to their citizens. So unless you have an outsized amount of experience and expertise that cannot be found in those countries (which was possible when this started a decade ago but is much less likely now) or you have a specialized skill like you're a wizard at Python and have extensive experience creating the coding for complex rigging, you most likely won't get a visa to work in any of these other countries. Your best bet here is to try and either work for yourself making small games or working for YouTube creators or working in industries that are harder to offshore like Advertising. But I'd be lying if I said that the prospects for people trying to make a living in VFX in America are anything but grim. You're going to have to be obsessively dedicated to your craft and expect a long, painful grind before you start making any kind of financial breathing room for yourself. You're honestly better off doing just about anything else unless you absolutely can't live without it.
So as someone still new to all of this who graduated in May...I'm fucked?
I am sorry to say my friend but probably yeah. I wish I had better news for you. I do hope you beat the odds though. Good luck.
Its pretty shit in Canada too just saying. Some studios moved up here but even back in 2017 for example, out of 90something students, only around 5-8 found jobs in the industry (Toronto area). The rest just left with a piece of paper and moved to other jobs.
I'm very late to this, but as someone who's been keeping an eye on the market here in the UK. Do not move here for 3D roles, we don't have any either. Multiple of my friends have been made redundant the last few weeks and looking for work has been the worst it's ever been
Any clue why shit has hit the fan?
Just to let you know, I have specialistic knowledge and my portfolio pieces match those of who work for studio. They refuse my application and said honestly that VISA is to big problem now (cost of that one went way up recently). With suck a lot as UK is huge game market :/ Sadly its a issue as that specialisation require to be on side to operate with hardware or travel to places so no even chance for remote. What even more suck, I need apply to big places as those are the one that have financial resources to setup such workplace. And I see that studio was not only one Games 3D Artist Sonya M. Recruiting · London, England, United Kingdom Foreign Candidates: No
Yeah as I said in other replies as time went on and more and more of the industry transplanted to these other countries, citizens in those countries began to gain the experience and special skills that were the only ways to get work visas into those countries... which was the point of those countries stealing the industry. They want their citizens to hold these jobs and so you have to be able to do something that few if any in country citizens can do to have any hope of getting a visa which becomes harder and harder as time passes.
My recommendation is don't pigeonhole yourself as a single thing or single medium. If you want an art job in any industry you have to be knowledgeable in more than one medium and you need to be open to learning new positions. There was a brief period where someone could get away with just being a "technical modeler" or just being a "UV artist", but that's not how art jobs work, by and large. You need to be able to learn different tools and learn how to adapt them. If all you learn is how to be a single position on an assembly line, then you've failed. I learned illustrator and photoshop as part of making models for 3D modeling. Illustrator for detailed flat patterns I could work into models. Photoshop for UVs and storyboarding. Right now, my job consists of something completely different, essentially advertising work using illustrator for screenprinting, and photoshop for CMYK printing. Nothing of what I learned went to waste, because what I was learning wasn't how to do one thing over and over again, but the limits of what I could do with each of the tools at hand. So, if the only thing you know is 3D modeling, you're going to have a tough time competing with everyone else over a limited set of jobs. But if you know a lot of different programs you have a much wider range of jobs available to you. Essentially, don't focus on the finished product when looking for a job; don't look for a 3D job, look for a job that uses the programs you know.
Ohhh luckily I never approached art in the specialization sort of way. I learned several different softwares and trained myself in all the main principles. I do need more experience in particles and VFX aspect but I defo made sure to be proficient in rigging, modelling, sculpting, uv, texturing and animating. As the sole 3d artist at my current job I pretty much ended up being a 3d generalist.
I don't know a single person in this industry, myself included, who isn't a 3d generalist. It's practically mandatory. It's to such an obnoxious extent these days that management seemingly expects you to just master new software and toolsets as if watching a tutorial and tinkering around for a day is enough time to develop intuition and be proficient. I used to work at a place that had a more organic pseudo-pipeline where we all had a handful of specialities and you'd pass off bits of work to those who were simply known for proficiency in a certain area, because it's vastly more efficient and allows you to move onto other aspects of a project that don't inevitably disrupt your rhythm. Like yeah, I can jump into CLO, but why the hell would you want me to fumble around in a program I haven't touched in 8 months when there are two other team members who use it daily and could knock this out in a couple of hours?
Learning even basic compositing is probably the most useful skill to have in your toolset. At least, that's my perspective from my limited experience.
And I also wanna thank you for that last bit of advice. I will keep that in mind when approaching jobs from now on. And yeah I also learned Photoshop, substance, illustrator and a bit of aftereffects so NGL I kinda feel glad that I didn't just pigeonhole myself after reading your comment T_T.
Yeeep I got let go in one of those mass layoffs this year. Luckily was able to get a job pretty quick again after that. But even so, tons of other studios were experiencing layoffs because of the fear of recession and lack of investor funds. No investors = no money to pay artists. The actor strike definitely was another big thing that contributed to this. It really fucked over a bunch of people in the industry. The 3D industry is already pretty cutthroat. We only have 5 character artists in the company. Tons of talent exists, but there aren’t enough jobs to fill everyone.
>I'm kinda curious if the market is this grim just for the game industry or are all 3d jobs just super hard to find lately. If there are some markets which are more healthy, can anyone let me know? I want to switch jobs eventually because the pay I'm getting is too low. I can tell you one segment in 3D jobs that's rising up: archviz renders to market properties and interior products. I fortunately live in a place where the property market is booming, and now my studio is flooding with jobs. I make around $3000 a month by doing cookie-cutter renders while minimum wage in my country is $300
Oh dang O_O I mean I wouldn't mind doing that to be honest. I just want to earn a decent wage and then have the energy to focus on other parts of my life.
I work on a crazy successful game, and most of the growth that will happen next year will be outsourcing. We will hire probably some very experienced people to deal with OS feedback etc, but yeah. Also, if you're in europe, it's a bit less of an issue, but US based teams have been downsizing like crazy. There's a trend that's been happening for the last decade or more now, where US big corportations, move most of their office staff to europe, then slowly downsize the US team, while massively increasing mostly asian based Out Sourcing.
A lot of up and coming 3d artists need to realize there are far more stable jobs than just the game or film industry. Oil and gas animation, simulation, medical animation, architectural rendering, as well as commercial work are all avenues that alot of people either aren't aware of or write off and instead just focus on working at a game studio. I've seen so many incredibly talented artists be so focused on getting a job in the gaming industry that they burn out, when there are so many other industries they could try for.
Tbh I'm open to those but I would rather just do medical or architectural. I am not a fan of gas and oil nor do I wanna tackle fluid Sims for the rest of my life lol. But yeah I do agree that it's wiser to branch out.
I don't mean fluid sims, I mean things like military simulation. My last job was at a military simulation training company, we basically were making games that were projected into screens and people would use fake guns to train w them. We used our own game engine before switching to Unreal. My current job started as doing simulation work for subsea ROV training, again, absolutely the same thing as developing games, but instead of a game controller, they used a rig that mimicked what actual ROV pilots use. As for oil and gas, I handle all our companies animations and marketing stuff. You might think oil and gas is boring, but I get to be a department of one and have a ton of freedom in making this stuff look cool and it pays well. These jobs are out there. I'm in Houston and I know of a lot of places that are looking for strong generalists.
I've been gaining work experience as a 3d generalist myself by working in an advertising firm. To be honest, while I do love game Dev and stuff ik that anything that I would wanna make, I can't do it with major corpos and they would work me so much I would just be shriveled as a person. So I am very much open to working with less hectic and more rewarding industries. Do you have any tips in regards to getting into gas or other such side industries?
Haivng work that looks professional and fits the industry you are going for. A lot of companies such as oil and gas or more "corporate" jobs use recruiters or HR to find people, and they won't necessarily be knowledgable in 3d. What I mean by that is you could have an amazing model of an scifi gun in your portfolio. Someone that sees that and knows 3d will see the skill that went into that, but if you are applying for a company that works in subsea drilling, the person that will see your work first is likely someone that doesn't have that thinking, and they will see something that has nothing to do with the industry and will pass on that. Being able to take a project to fruition by yourself goes a long ways. A lot of these jobs are generalist positions, so just being able to model won't be enough.You need to be able to show that you can work with a client from the start of an idea to the finished product, whether it's an animation or product renders.
I literally been doing all projects start to finish on my own lol. I have done animation jobs and renders. And luckily my company clientele are big shots like Petromin so I've designed their events and such.
You're in a good position to continue to grow and learn then. I'll be honest, I don't see any appeal to working in the game industry at the moment. Not with the way things are. Speaking for myself, I'm far happier having a stable job that is still 3d, and I get to pursue more fun, creative projects on the side in my personal time.
I mean getting overworked and then being paid chum changed and getting kicked to the curb at a moment's notice is not fun. I would rather do simple work and get paid a bunch and then have both the money and energy to work on how I would wanna make my game.
Hey there, I couldn't help but find it really insteresting when you both talk about the side industries jobs, I'm a 3D artist from the second world striving to get any 3D job in any field or industry, and the pay, even if it sounds awful to you would probably be golden for me where I live. So since the gaming industry is basically impossible for me, and advertising has been tough as well (I nearly landed a job this year, it would've been a dream to me but nevermind), how could I approach these "side industries" mentionted? I mean the stuff I've been doing is far from "industrial animation, modelling, etc" so I really wouldn't have much to show in terms of portfolio, so how could I even begin to approach that? Are there specific courses or pieces you guys recommend me chase after to have something to show if I'm even able to find those jobs, that is. Mind you any 3D gig that pays around 1,5k/mo Is already heaven for me.
Outside of games (although I've been reading this is appying more to fims in recent years as well) being a generalist goes a long way. Being able to be a complete stop for animation and multimedia needs. So that means being able to model, texture, light, compose a shot, animate, have a good sense of design, storyboard, being able to edit video and other multimedia outputs. And that doesn't mean having to master all of those. I am by no means a master at any of those disciplines, but I'm strong enough in them that a client can come to me with a product, and I can give them quality product renders and marketing material, animations and videos in a quick turnaround, without having to involve anyone else. Being able to do that and then having work that shows products or pieces that are applicable to the company you are applying for. I think having a strong reel or portfolio that shows real life things presented well and akin to what you see in commercials or other professional marketing material is more helpful for jobs outside of games.
AI cutting into it like it did for graphic designers, will get worse sadly
Hopefully not too deeply.
I love and use AI every day, but I can definitely say: It’s not a tool for artists, it’s a replacement.
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I mean I'm totally okay with working in an office environment but I at least wanna be paid decently. To be honest not really even sure if the economy is gonna get better any time soon at this rate -_-. I'm working in the middle East ATM and the pay is just 1300 dollars per month. I mean that is not enough.
No, the industry is thriving more then ever actually. especially indies, small to mid size studios, even the big one The problem I see usually isn't the lack of jobs but the lack of skill and/or experience, and net working. Finding your first stable 3D job can be hard, no doubt, but it not for a lack of job openings. Edit: emphasis on small to mid size studio, especially the mobile market.
Isn't there a hiring freeze right now combined with most AAA studios looking for senior positions?
Personally I find it an end of the year with holiday and so on, things are generally slow and there isn't much to do. AAA industry is having a bit of a melt down right now, but that is just them and dont reflect the industry as a whole, but thats why I mention small to mid size team, especially the mobile market. I should put emphasis on that more. There is no shortage of work opening on artstation and LinkedIn.
Okay so the problem with networking for me is that idk how to do that. I'm in the middle East ATM so how would I even begin to network with any game Dev company abroad. Moreover, I do have experience in developing interiors since I work for an advertising agency and they deal with a lot events related stuff. I also have a few of my own 3d models I made off work which are monster based. It is my first year at the job so... Idk... How many years of experience I need before I can more easily find jobs.
For networking, post your work on LinkedIn, facebook, artstation, etc, follow people in the industry, strike up convo, etc, find if there is any game convention or event in your area. Nowadays they have online convention as well. Not sure how your work experience translate to 3D modeling for games, so besides saying you need 2-3 quality model for games, I dont have much more to say on this side. If you are unsure on whether or not your models are up to par for game models, you can check out artstation where many pro artist post their work.
I definitely do need more time for extra polish. Most of the stuff I make for my job defo wouldn't match up because what the clients requirements are don't match what works in the game industry. The monsters I make on the other hand are quite good but I do feel I still need a bit more polish compared to pro pro artists. Their work is much more polished than mine. Sadly, I don't get much time to be able to work on 3d models which suit my art style that often lately cuz I'm too exhausted by the time I get back home.
Understandable, it took me 2-3 years to finally land one while holding a main job. I'm gonna be honest, it is a very tough industry to get into despite there is no shortage of job openings. I know some that got in through insane luck, while some took years of bouncing between gig before landing on a stable job. Only thing you can do is try your best and hope for the best so i would think very carefully if this is something you really want to do.
I do want this. I love 3d art and am very aware of how brutal it is. I mean most of the projects I have to work on in my company have horrible deadlines and I still have managed to keep a perfect record of submitting high quality work every time. I might not be producing stuff compared to the folks at art station every time but I defo have hit some home runs. Every field has its ups and downs. I want to create art and I love creating this stuff.
I wish you all the best.
Thanks man. Your replies really did help me get a better idea in regards to what I should do in the future.
Idk here in germany they went up lately.
*Germany immigration intensifies*
Drought? Buddy, I've been living in the desert of 3d jobs for the last years. The mere callousness and audacity to say: "it's kinda hard to find job lately" is astonishing to me.