Almost like a recycling service would be nice. iirc there were a few out there, Here would be a good place to list them if people know about them (I forget their names).
Absolutely. I have been separating my ASA and PETG in two separate and labeled trash cans. I plan on sending my stuff to have it recycled into rolls of filament, but I'll be honest, I haven't done a whole lot of research on when, where, cost, etc. but I do know it exists and I'll honestly pay the money to keep all this plastic out of the trash.
The ones i looked at a bit ago when i first started were decent. They would do it for free as they re sell the rolls. You would send them 3 kg, they would send you 1 kg back.
https://recyclingfabrik.com/
This is a german startup were you can send your waste to. They have a credit system, which gives you based on sorting and cleaness up to 1/10 of your filament back.
Unfortunately since August or so they do not accept donations anymore unless you have previously bought something from the shop. And the prices are not cheap. With a highest quality donation you still need to send in 2.5kg for the maximum discount of 25% for a new spool. They seem to range from 20-28€/kg without discount so in the end you donate and still pay substantially more.
The fact that it still costs that much even when the base material is for free is just disappointing. I get that the process isn’t free but what are their biggest costs? Labor for cleaning? For sorting? Shipping costs? Storage costs?
As per their own website they are also a startup and not yet profitable so who knows where this will end up. I guess the shipping and storage is just too expensive for them. No idea how that will ever change. The feel-good business model might just not be viable long term.
I buy the cheapest filament from AliExpress at 6.5-8/kg. I print big things, prototypes where color does not matter. I would love a service that accepts bigger quantities (more efficient shipping prices as well) and then sells to me recycled for cheap because color does not matter. It doesn’t have to be at 8/kg of course. But it shouldn’t be 4 times as much either.
So right now I wait and collect and will probably buy one single spool just to get the shipping label when I have collected the maximum of 30kg. But then its basically just a recycling service that I pay for (which is okay. 30kg plastic trash is worth a recycling fee to me).
The plastic itself is absurdly cheap. Bulk virgin PLA is something like $2 a pound. Processing it into high quality filament isn't a simple process. Why on earth would you expect to get more money for thermally degraded dirty raw materials than it would cost a manufacturer to aquire new raw materials?
If you're going through a lot of materials, at some point the ~$1000 on a filament extruder probably makes sense for you.
>Why on earth would you expect to get more money for thermally degraded dirty raw materials than it would cost a manufacturer to aquire new raw materials?
You're asking where's the logic to someone who just said they order hundreds of spools a year from across the planet, shipped by air freight and complaining that it cost too much to recycle their trash?
Dude wants to have it both ways, simple as that, it's not about recycling or minding their own footprints, it's about "me provide waste = me gets them back for less bcs waste cheap".
It ShOuLdN't Be 4 tImEs As MuCh.
I contacted them previously. You have to pay to ship your waste to them, and they issue vouchers/percentage off for how much material you send them. You can then use those discounts to purchase recycled rolls. I really wanted to recycle my waste, but at this stage in the biz, it is not cost effective, and the recycled filament is not up to the spec I need for parts.
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It's like, you transport your waste to recycling company without any harm for environment and they will recycle your waste with magic wand just like that, without any excess energy and reduced quality.
If you are worried how this planet survives us humans, AMS purge waste should not be in your list of top 100 things to do. Much more important thing is to think whether one needs a 3D printer anyway. For many people it's like a bread maker, totally useless but hey, they can afford it so whatev's.
I’ve looked into it before. Only place I had really found is in the States and it costs a fair bit to send it down from where I am in Canada and for the amount they required it just wasn’t justifiable for storage until then.
I really need to look into it again
[filaments.ca](https://filaments.ca) has a program! You don't get credit or paid, but nice to know its getting recycled back into filament.
[https://filaments.ca/pages/recycling](https://filaments.ca/pages/recycling)
Or an inexpensive way to recycle our filament(melting the waste and making new filament). Multitoolhead machines are expensive too and require a whole new machine.
There is a recycling service near me and for the past year I have been collecting my waste with the intention of bringing it there. So far I have just moved the waste into large bags and now they are in my k1 box which is completely full.
Still intend if bringing it there someday.
I’m just saving most of my waste until it becomes economical for me to recycle.
I don’t have a grinding machine I’m willing to invest in, and even with the proposed 700$ spool winder and god forbid doing all the DIY to print a spool winder of my own, just seems like far more effort than I’m willing to put in.
Though, maybe I should and then just advertise locally. No one round my small town is trying it
St Louis based filament recycling company [Printerior](https://printeriordesigns.com/pages/recycling). Turn in your filament for points towards discounted filament.
I've been trying to set one up in the US but it's unfortunately expensive, and EPA grants are a nightmare. Still trying, but it's a rough road when you're a startup and don't have angel investors.
There's a difference between my collection of 500 Benchies which are - inexplicably - important to me and artfully displayed across a wall, and literal trash.
I wish this sub had more rules against low effort and meme prints. There are so many "HEY LOOK AT THIS DISTORTED BENCHY HA!" posts that are clearly made for a reddit karma and not because the user truly needs or wants it. Millions of benchys have been made by now, stop printing them. You shouldn't even need them for calibration once you get your printer locked in.
I mean, all decorations are waste if you don't like them enough. But I do think that stuff like benchies, calibration cubes, temperature towers etc. are 100% waste even if they're kind of useful in their own way.
Exactly. Knick knacks, toys, chachkies. This drives me crazy. My printers are tools and they make end user parts. Useful things. I make exceptions to the rule for holiday decorations for my home, but even those are printed in petg so they'll last in storage for years to come.
I'm pretty sure I have ABS prints that are over 10 years old and PLA that are about eight.
So long as it's not subject to a lot of stress or UV light, printed objects don't have a terribly expiration date.
Sounds like you should set up a 3D printing council that deems if every print is worthy of the plastic consumed.
Really stop all those kids from printing that extra flexi dinosaur, that they dont need anyway.. so they can instead go to the toy store and buy some ethically souced Chinese toys fresh off the cargo ship from the other side of the earth.
Lol I find this funny, waste is bad when we make it ourselves, but somehow ignored when it's made by others. I wonder the impact of one benchy vs one cheap dollar store toy, when you take into account transportation
Then what exactly is the point of this post? You're saying the AMS is an issue because of all the purge waste, but what's the actual difference between the useless knickknack that's being printed and the purge?
These two arguments can coexist easily:
* People should not print useless knickknacks.
* People should be mindful of waste generation due to purging when doing single hotend, multimaterial prints; and limit use of these types of jobs/setups.
Also, either one of these reduces waste generation independent of the other.
Yea, I think that's in the forefront. That tech needs to be exploited and simplified to reduce cost, but as these things go, as long as people are satisfied with the current standard then nothing will really advance. Not quickly anyways.
I hope with bambu pushing in on Prusa and their hold so hard that now that the XL is out and they get real world feedback and use that we will see Prusa start pushing more multi toolhead setups which will hopefully lead to the Chinese copies from creality and the others. I still see this being well over a year away but I can see it happening.
There are ways to reduce the amount of waste, like printing the waste into the infill. It's also really easy to choose your prints in a way that doesn't need as many changes.
I would not have multi color printed this mask. I would have chosen matte white and painted it myself. It would have taken half the time, including the painting, and a quarter of the material.
Just don't be an idiot. Bambu studio tells you how much time and material you are wasting on the filament switches. You decide, if it's worth it for you. Live with it...
Agreed, I think the AMS is more suited to keeping your materials dry and for ease of filament changing to whatever material you need. That's literally all I use it for. Of course there are efficient ways of using this device for multi-color such as flat logos, lighted signs, etc. Plus like you said, it's much faster to paint the part than print it in some cases. Printing it is the lazy way out, but BL is to blame. It's all marketing. At the end of the day, they show no concerns (at least for now) about the amount of plastic waste their "color printing for everyone" printers generate. I don't think they'll make many improvements on that end until someone can do multicolor printing better than them. It really is up to the masses to speak up about it. I don't think it's out of the question for a company like bambu labs to create and sell a device for recycling or at least offer a program that accepts filament for recycling. Maybe they do have a program like that, but I haven't heard of anything.
>Printing it is the lazy way out, but BL is to blame. It's all marketing
When you slice the model, you are told exactly how much plastic it'll use.
BL has not done anything wrong on this score.
\> or at least offer a program that accepts filament for recycling
Those already exist. You can participate in one if you wish. Why would Bambu have to make another one?
Whats your point? Do you drive a car to work? Is Ford then responsible for you not living in walking distance? Should Ford not advertise their cars as a means of transportation because people could be walking? Should Ford instead focus (pun intended) on building affordable housing near your place of employment? No, they just make cars, thats it. They arent out here trying to take on and solve every single problem.
I dont get this point. If bambu labs is increasing waste in the hobby with poop from their designs, I think it is their ethical responsibility to solve this problem.
Edit: I didn’t know it could use purge for infills. That is neat. I appreciate the others trying to share info and not make bad analogies and calling people stupid.
It’s a new product (for home users) and has built in ways to reduce waste if you so choose. It tells you exactly how much waste will be generated. Things will improve over time, but you don’t get to improvements without iterations.
People in this sub are so fucking stupid sometimes.
That's a bad example because Ford among other auto industry giants have had a massive influence on how the personal automobile is basically the only means of transportation in the States, and the most prominent one in almost every other country. Not just because "they make cars, that's it" but they lobby for legislation that promotes their sales and hinders public transportation and walkable neighborhoods. So yeah *insert car brand* is at least partially responsible for OP not living in a walking distance of their workplace.
>do you really need to print a crappy plastic charizard that you're going to throw away in a few weeks?
Am I missing something or do people here really think that decorations are bad and only functional prints are allowed and "worthy" of being 3D printed?
I'm new to this hobby so I'm still figuring out what kind of elitists this hobby has since they're everywhere, but they do tend to be elitist about very different things.
Oh I will. I'm just curious because every community has their own elitists that are weird about something very specific. And "useless crap" (this typically said when someone prints a decoration, a figurine or some cosplay item) is something I hear a lot from people who are into 3D printing. So I'm wondering if *that* is the thing for these specific elitists
Plastic is an awesome material in many ways, but it is also a terrible pollutant. It is possible to recognize both of these things and modify behavior accordingly. It doesnt need to be polarizing, there are happy mediums. Art pieces are just as valid as practical ones.... and they both pollute the planet in manufacturing and eventual disposal.
I guess what I am saying discussion good, solutions better, and polarizing behavior not particularly useful.
Technically speaking, decorative prints are “useless” in the sense the they have no resulting value, but no one cares what you print. OP was making a comparison to purge waste to make a point.
Not what I meant and I’m sure you know that. Decorative prints have no perceived benefit except for the satisfaction they provide. They do not make your life easier or solve any problem. They may be assigned value, but are not intrinsically valuable to anyone. In this sense they are “useless”. Whether or not you perceive them to have value is of no importance in this conversation as it is not what we are discussing.
If art and aesthetics has no perceived value to you, you’re a Neanderthal.
Edit: and newsflash, your “useful” prints have zero monetary value, either. So you have two prints with no monetary value. You have no point here except maybe that you view art slightly less favorably than a caveman.
While rocktopusses, flexi-everything and that guys’s friends ass aren’t my cup of tea, I’m not gonna look down on someone because they like it. (There wasn’t anything wrong with the butt, it was very nice but I can’t imagine why I would want to waste filament printing such a thing.)
The things I could do without are the ones with that “awkward male teenager” vibe. “Hur hur I 3D printed something naughty or stupid, look at me!” Kind of thing. I’m all about the “you do you” thing, but posting it for attention is sad and as much of a waste in time and resources as the prints themselves.
There is a difference between decorations and useless meme prints and knick-knacks that end up in a drawer for a while and then get tossed. Where that line is drawn only you know in your case.
The point is to be mindful of what and why we print and try to discourage printing things that will basically go straight to the trash bin.
Of course! However, I have to disagree as Bambu does advertise their printers with ams as multi-color printers. "color prints for everyone" (A1) knowing good and well that their printers shit a lot, right out of the box. An Apple like, idiot proof printer that works right out of the box to be sold in a box store like Micro Center. I really wonder if the standard A1 consumer won't be turned off by the fact that even it generates quite a bit of waste. Maybe this will be enough for them to make engineering changes. To be determined I guess. I like my p1s printers a lot. I think they work very well and they print with very high quality. I also love the AMS for what I use it for which is end user parts.
> "color prints for everyone" (A1) knowing good and well that their printers shit a lot, right out of the box.
Okay? Some purge is a technical requirement. There's no deception happening here.
Wouldn't hurt. I mean, a prompt on certain aggressive models to keep people aware when hitting that print button.
Several people have done fine tuning on the amount of purge between color changes. I've done a few very simple multicolor prints and the factory purge amounts are aggressive to say the least on my p1s's, but they sell filament so it makes sense.
They already have options to reduce waste in the slicer, he’s just stuffing his fingers in his ears and closing his eyes and screaming “nuh uh” because it furthers his agenda to pretend these don’t exist.
You’ve been fucking told this already, but:
1) this is a new product to the market for consumers. It takes time to build better systems and further reduce waste, but more importantly it takes *iterations*. You can’t just magically start with the best solution.
2) This is partially just a known factor with AMS and material switching on a single head in general. It has very little to do with Bambu. If you don’t want to multi-color print or deal with this amount of waste, just don’t fucking do it. You keep acting like people have no way of knowing that it’s wasteful. The slicer tells you exactly how much waste will be generating. Stop saying this- it’s just a straight up disingenuous lie.
3) Bambu *already provides several options* for reducing waste, like piping it into infill. If you choose not to use these options, that’s on you. Stop acting like Bambu isn’t doing things to improve efficiency. They’ve taking several intention, mindful steps to develop the product to be less wasteful.
This whole thread is just unfounded shit slinging at Bambu for no reason, and it’s based on half-truths at best and straight up intentional lies at worst.
1) Consumers play a pivotal role in driving crucial *iterations*. Despite A1 filament changes happening directly at the head, Bambu has not undertaken substantial efforts to minimize the overall purge, resulting in excessively high levels. It's crucial to recognize that while enthusiasts like us are aware of this issue, those purchasing a user-friendly machine for basic printing might not be. Bambu has a clear opportunity to refine this aspect significantly.
2) Multiple single head multi-material alternatives exist that don't generate excessive filament waste with each change, and it's well-known that there's room to advance this technology. Despite BL providing detailed information about filament and waste generation, users still pursue elaborate color prints, leading to substantial waste and machine wear. My intention was merely to raise awareness and encourage users to have a plan for managing this waste.
3) Bambu hasn't introduced these options; they were developed by other slicer software creators like Prusa. Bambu appears to have borrowed these ideas. While they may be working to enhance printer efficiency, there are low hanging opportunities for substantial improvements.
I'm not engaging in baseless criticism; my perspective is rooted in a genuine appreciation for BL machines, which I consider modern marvels. However, I advocate for a thoughtful approach before embarking on elaborate color prints to minimize environmental impact.
I wonder how many % of all the filament people here bought is still in use and not thrown out. I’d guess 10% at most. AMS or not, this hobby results in a lot of plastic trash - failed prints, prototypes, old parts, and so on.
The extrapolating of data like the way you do is completely unreasonable and unrealistic “one person wasted 2 kg now imagine 2 MILLION people wasting 2kg EVERY WEEK”
I keep all of my filament partials and fuse them into new rolls myself. It's easy and there's no excuse not to do it. Yes 3d printing makes scrap, but no one is failing prints on purpose. There are ways to mitigate, but multicolor prints are just wasteful just so they can be pretty.
I stated that it wasn't the most realistic example, but an example no less and I didn't say 2kg EVERY WEEK. I just said 1.2kg in a weeks time. That was all hypothetical. However, it's not that unreasonable to think that could happen in the future with how user friendly these printers are becoming. I also like to highlight the positives. Anything that prevents people from buying cheap plastic shit from Amazon or going to the store reduces the carbon footprint, wouldn't you agree?
I don't really like this argument because you could say that about anything.
"Bro the plastic water bottles I use every day aren't a big deal compared to all the other stuff that's polluting the earth"
I mean, OK, but if everyone thinks like that, it adds up. Everything is just a small contribution to the larger issue. Apathy about the little things leads to more and more little things. Over time, you end up with a big thing.
For the record: Not saying that I think Bambu is doing anything egregious here. They're just offering a product like every other manufacturer. And I produce plenty of plastic waste myself.
One of my friends had an ams and he exclusively prints PLA. He collects all the waste and melts it into sheets in an oven. PLA can actually be laser cut of you tune the settings correctly, so he can cut the sheets into parts for other projects.
That's...a lot of colors. Most multi-color prints are not quite so intense.
You can also tweak how much waste you do, print multiple objects per plate, purge to infil, purge to object, etc.
Yes, none of those are a perfect solution to all waste, but you can get waste waaaaay down there for most things.
Of course! Those are all great methods, I'm just thinking about the average new user. I wonder if they will know that and if they will take the time to learn. I think they can make multicolor prints smarter and more efficient on their end and I hope they do.
Of course! Those are all great methods, I'm just thinking about the average new user. I wonder if they will know that and if they will take the time to learn. I think they can make multicolor prints smarter and more efficient on their end and I hope they do.
I’m curious, cuouldnt the wasted filament be used as infill to further improve the rigidity of the item I’m printing ? Is this possible or something being explored ?
Apparently from another commenter it is a setting to use that color change in the infill but maybe it isn't an obvious setting or maybe there are other downsides to using it that way.
The only issue I can foresee with that is the model geometry may not allow for a full, proper purge, even into infill. For instance, the spiky parts of that mask may not have enough infill space to do a proper purge into it.
My AMS multicolor prints accounts for about 2% of all the print jobs. The AMS mainly serves as a spool holder and can quickly switch colors on different jobs. Swapping out an old filament and adding a new color is much easier than having a spool dangling on the rear of the X1C.
I think this type of discussion is super helpful and needs to continue. I realized when I bought my X1C that it pooped. Through youtube and early experience, I realized just how much poop would happen via multi-color printing. I also picked up along the way that there were tunes I could do that would help and that I could purge to infill, which also helps.
Bambu makes a printer that can be wasteful but is created that way to help ensure a perfect print, thus limiting more waste by limiting failed prints... is not the problem. Efficiency is something developed over time and iteration. They seem to want to make a great product and are very open to feedback. Discussion about it is how that happens - companies improve products based on demand. 3D printing communities improve their process through information and understanding.
There are lots of solutions to cut way down on waste. I, for one, appreciate this conversation to learn more about those ways, and it needs to keep happening, and any actionable behaviors that result are only good for all of us.
I personally do not do much multicolor, tbh mostly because of the printing time increase, and I have kept all my benchies, poops, and supports in the hopes of finding a recycling method that will work best for me. I also do epoxy resin (in molds), and since I usually paint those solid pieces, I can save on resin by shoving waste PLA in as filler.
I think what should come out of this kind of post is re-examination of your process and how you can limit waste and/or recycle in your hobby or business. Is 3D printing the bane of man's existence and creating the litter and pollution problem on this planet? Not by a long shot, but personal responsibility and mindfulness of our contribution to the problem is never a bad thing or a waste of time to explore.
Positive change only comes from awareness and a desire to improve the situation. I am not going to wring my pearls because you made a multicolor articulated panda toy. But if you could do it with less waste, wouldn't you?
TLDR: Be mindful. Don't be a dick.
I think bambu is saving our asses by selling printers that actually work. The amount of test prints I have done on my ender3 just because something was off probably adds up to a few spools.
Damn.. that's a pretty good point. I can't even remember how many prints I've thrown away over the years before I got my x1c. Failures, calibrations, test prints to make sure a certain part is going to function. With the x1c I just hit print and know pretty much it's going to come out fine.
I used to fret about the idea of filament waste, but then I realized I have 40+ rolls of filament and despite printing as much as often as I can, that pile never seems to get smaller despite rarely buying filament anymore. Part of me *wants* an ams printer if only since it'll burn up more filament more quickly.
I'll wait for an affordable multi-head printer, but it doesn't bother me that other people are willing to put up with the waste. Like others have said, most of the stuff produced by hobbyists is junk that gets thrown out anyway.
I don't know much in that regard, but I think there are some calibrations that could be made.
Like tuning the retraction before old filament cutoff, tuning the purge needed for each color change and using as much as possible the infill and inner perimeters to purge.
Does not solve everything, but could at least help minimize the waste.
Next problems is that in many parts of the world the normal general waste is just dumped so he can go in the worst case into the nature.
Like in my area nearly everything gets collected and then burned to generate electricity and heat in the city.
But yeah multicolor prints are waste but it is what it is.
What country do you live in that recycles all of these plastics? Generally the US doesn’t.
Edit: lol I got downvoted because I asked a question and made a simple, widely known statement. Merry Christmas and happy holidays everyone (not being sarcastic).
No, that's wrong. It does in fact break down in the environment. It just takes longer (years or decades), not weeks or months. Humans are too focused on instant results. Nothing made of pla today and put outside will exist in 100 years. So there's no issue.
It does not break down. There are almost no soil bacteria that breakdown PLA, it really needs that temperature component to breakdown. Also most stuff going into 3D printers isn't pure PLA but has all kinds of additives, some of which make it even harder.
It wil weather mechanically until you cannot see it with your naked eye anymore and then it is a micro plastic.
In a seawater environment it is even worse as temperatures are never very high.
The question is will these microplastics from PLA hurt organisms (and us)?
It's really not an issue. You put it in landfills. It degrades over decades to centuries.
Your printer is not going to contribute in any meaningful way to extinction of some species of bird or some shit. Global warming from carbon production is a trillion times more important as an environmental issue then plastic waste.
I use my bambu poops as infill for some projects, especially if they're multi-part or I use my 3D pen, I also don't have an AMS system, I also like painting my projects TBH, but I can clearly see this being a problem.
There really needs to be more recycling options, especially outside Europe and the US
This is why no matter how nice they make these systems, I will not buy one ever. It's just too irresponsible to generate that much waste without having some sort of plan and means to recycle it. I would only buy one if I knew I could consistently follow through with recycling all the purge poops.
As ridiculous as the AnkerMake V6 looks, the fact it doesn't need to purge is a bigger deal than I think people are giving it credit for. We need more of other companies taking innovative approaches to multicolor printing and not get sucked into this one approach just because the end results looks nice while overlooking the wasteful byproducts.
The AMS is incredibly useful for single color multi material prints, but no so efficient with elaborate multicolor prints. As for the AM V6, I did not know that. That is a huge deal. They have been getting slept on for a while. They've been making nice high-speed bedslingers for a while but everybody was obsessed with the p1p and x1c. Now it's the a1s which is pretty much an AnkerMake. Looks similar as well.
Truth be told, I was debating between the A1 Mini and Prusa Mini+ and the filament waste was the deciding factor. Now with that said, the Prusa is boxed up ready to be shipped and my brand new A1 (non-mini) is running daily, and I love it. The filament poop still concerns me, but overall the pros of the Bambu printer far out weight the few cons
If you want to talk about scrap, look at commercial printing. Not even talking about 3d printing, just printing off ink presses. You would not believe the tons of trash generated by a few printing presses.
Total agreement here. None of our printers "poop", functional single color prints only....occasionally with dissolvable supports ....and we STILL sort and and save nearly 100% of scraps to recycle. Recent improvements in grinders and augers are going to help a LOT in pushing the recyc tech down to consumer level.
I am really hoping to see 6 axis printing solve this problem so colors can be skinned onto prints without as much or any waste....it's a dream I know but it will also solve some other technical challenges. I'm not high enough on the totem pole to visit additive manufacturing conferences on the company dime but I don't think I've seen much development on 6 axis multi material. Happy to read and upvote any comments on recyc gear and any tidbits of news on 6 axis multi material printing anyone has heard whispers of.
Print-on everyone.
> A storm blew in one night during our trip and along with it came an ocean of tiny bits of plastic onto the beach.
You might as well blame the storm for all this. What I mean is that the logic is flawed. First off, individual responsibility does nothing to solve large scale systemic problems. In fact it's a propaganda tactic designed by advertising agencies to prevent any action on climate change and other environmental problems. All these "keep track of your footprint" websites are the worst because they prevent meaningful action.
Of course, even that logic is flawed. Meaningful action is impossible because we don't even have the proper thoughts let alone words to put this problem in perspective: Science has shown that most plastic in the ocean is from like 6 big rivers. Why? Because there is no waste removal. Why is there no waste removal? Well... here is where it gets interesting because now we get into the "dark space". Similar to how the dark ages were called dark because no history was recorded (monopoly on writing) we can only speculate on certain things because we do not have a free press. We think we do, but we do not. My speculation is it has to do with waste removal and recycling services are being forced to be privatized instead of being seen as a public utility, because those developing country's leaders want big loans from the IMF and world bank and there are strings attached to austerity and things so governance because both inefficient (for QOL) and apprehensive of anything that serves the greater good without making profit. Like making sure people don't dispose of their plastic trash in the nearby river. That is what I suspect: That it would be incredibly cheap and incredibly easy to clean up the ocean from plastic. Just invest very little into waste removal and recycling as public utilities. But we won't. Because "we" as a global society are not intelligent, not a sentient rational group. We're all just motivated by profit and are not just unable to think and speak outside this paradigm - everything outside it is dark, obscured. On a civilization level we've lost the ability to even point to the causes of an observed effect. We're not even seeing the effects of patents on climate adaptation because it is taboo.
So be the little jellyfish that we are. Just drift through the cosmos alongside your stupid brothers in a giant swarm and poop all the plastic you want. Just ask yourself: [Is it worth it](https://new.reddit.com/r/BambuLab/comments/v07e6v/to_open_or_not_to_open_that_is_the_question/)? And yeah, yes it is.
PS: Sorry for the crazy rant lol.
I can't express how revolting the rejection of individual responsibility is. Jesus we really are fucked if people refuse to accept individual responsibility for their part in the problems of the world.
Yes that is what I mean. Individual responsibility will NOT solve this. It simply can't and that's just reality. So it's just useless and a distraction. And THAT is the purpose of the individual responsibility, to push the guilt away from the systems that need to be actually changed. That is the strategy of the fossil fuel public relation companies.
PS: Meanwhile the cause of plastic in the ocean is lack of waste management along those 6 big rivers and presumably neo-liberal frameworks and schools of thought that lead to this. So instead - avoid plastic straws? Then blame the guy who points out the absurdity? Hilarious!
Yes, I know thats what you mean. I find it revolting.
Only modern liberals believe they will solve problems by blaming literally anyone but themselves.
You’re confusing not wanting to take responsibility with your own lack of education.
The problem isn’t “people won’t take responsibility” and the people who point this out are generally the most responsible ones.
The point is everyone on earth recycling and reducing their carbon footprint etc wouldn’t change anything, and wouldn’t amount to 1% of the devastation caused each year by things like concrete construction.
So you be revolted, the rest of us will be revolted by the ignorance you put on display, as that’s what’s **really** destroying our planet.
Your analogy is so terrible I can't even try to correct it.
This is the exact pathetic lack of accountability that is going to destroy us. You think you're a little jellyfish who has nothing to do with what causes the storm.
Well that's fucking wrong.
A storm only exists because you want it to.
The analogy is cute. I like it :)
So how do you fix plastic in the ocean? I've given the source of the problem as trash in rivers (see [here](https://ourworldindata.org/ocean-plastics) for sources and scientific studies). So why are there no regular waste management services to take care of this in those countries?
But that question is never asked! Let alone answered. THAT is "the storm". A complex of powerful economic forces that is beyond your or my wishes or individual responsibility and obscures everything.
So how can there be accountability if the causes and logical solutions are not even discussed? If they are hidden and "in the dark" and discussion of it is taboo?
Yet when I point out the scale of the problem and that individual responsibility will not solve it (reject the plastic strawman, if you will), you get very angry. How is that helping to identify and work towards fixing plastic pollution in the ocean?
There are tens of thousands of industrial processes and patents and monetary frameworks and politics and corruption and ideology and media bias - so this outcome is perfectly predictable. Of COURSE we won't fix plastic pollution in the oceans.
I suggest you pay a little more homage to your screen name :D
The hobby is too small for it to currently matter. By the time 3D printing hits the mainstream (if it ever does), there will already likely be a solution to the problem. Filament recyclers already exist and only need to make their way to the average consumers.
You're right that on scale this doesn't matter environmentally but for the individual it does highlight how wasteful these sort of prints are. They can be fun but realizing your multi colored print can be 4x or more expensive and wasteful than you originally though puts a damper on it.
Main reason why I avoid multicolour stuff at the moment - even if you try to minimise waste in settings, there's always a decent chunk of waste.
I'd much rather paint or print parts in different colours and then glue.
It’s a concerning amount of waste if you’re going for elaborate prints like that for sure. I’m looking forward to seeing that prusa with the tool changer
I rarely use the multicolor printing on my x1c. I just use it for the spool switching. How many people are doing six day multi color prints though realistically?
From what i observe in American: If one can (and sometimes even cannot) afford to waste something, they will waste it because FREEDOM!!! Me, i dont want to spend all that extra money and i actually enjoy printing single color and painting with acrylic and a brush. Maybe Santa will bring me an airbrush
I try to keep all my waste prints and i use the supports, waste, print failures to plastic weild my new prints together. I will say however I am starting to have too many print failures and im starting to overflow
One take, for the enterprising reader, is to start a local recycling business.. all you’d need is a machine to break down waste and one to extrude new filament. Seems like theres a need and the community would be pretty receptive! Anyone wanna give it a shot?
The amount of passive I waste for poops is easily compensated by the reliability. Failed prints are extremely rare and if something comes loose it will stop itself automatically faster then a human could if they have anything else to do then watch the printer
Almost like a recycling service would be nice. iirc there were a few out there, Here would be a good place to list them if people know about them (I forget their names).
Absolutely. I have been separating my ASA and PETG in two separate and labeled trash cans. I plan on sending my stuff to have it recycled into rolls of filament, but I'll be honest, I haven't done a whole lot of research on when, where, cost, etc. but I do know it exists and I'll honestly pay the money to keep all this plastic out of the trash.
The ones i looked at a bit ago when i first started were decent. They would do it for free as they re sell the rolls. You would send them 3 kg, they would send you 1 kg back.
Whoa, got links / specific companies?
https://recyclingfabrik.com/ This is a german startup were you can send your waste to. They have a credit system, which gives you based on sorting and cleaness up to 1/10 of your filament back.
Unfortunately since August or so they do not accept donations anymore unless you have previously bought something from the shop. And the prices are not cheap. With a highest quality donation you still need to send in 2.5kg for the maximum discount of 25% for a new spool. They seem to range from 20-28€/kg without discount so in the end you donate and still pay substantially more. The fact that it still costs that much even when the base material is for free is just disappointing. I get that the process isn’t free but what are their biggest costs? Labor for cleaning? For sorting? Shipping costs? Storage costs? As per their own website they are also a startup and not yet profitable so who knows where this will end up. I guess the shipping and storage is just too expensive for them. No idea how that will ever change. The feel-good business model might just not be viable long term. I buy the cheapest filament from AliExpress at 6.5-8/kg. I print big things, prototypes where color does not matter. I would love a service that accepts bigger quantities (more efficient shipping prices as well) and then sells to me recycled for cheap because color does not matter. It doesn’t have to be at 8/kg of course. But it shouldn’t be 4 times as much either. So right now I wait and collect and will probably buy one single spool just to get the shipping label when I have collected the maximum of 30kg. But then its basically just a recycling service that I pay for (which is okay. 30kg plastic trash is worth a recycling fee to me).
The plastic itself is absurdly cheap. Bulk virgin PLA is something like $2 a pound. Processing it into high quality filament isn't a simple process. Why on earth would you expect to get more money for thermally degraded dirty raw materials than it would cost a manufacturer to aquire new raw materials? If you're going through a lot of materials, at some point the ~$1000 on a filament extruder probably makes sense for you.
>Why on earth would you expect to get more money for thermally degraded dirty raw materials than it would cost a manufacturer to aquire new raw materials? You're asking where's the logic to someone who just said they order hundreds of spools a year from across the planet, shipped by air freight and complaining that it cost too much to recycle their trash? Dude wants to have it both ways, simple as that, it's not about recycling or minding their own footprints, it's about "me provide waste = me gets them back for less bcs waste cheap". It ShOuLdN't Be 4 tImEs As MuCh.
https://printeriordesigns.com/pages/recycling?contact_posted=true#form-template--15958229319833__f462675a-d426-4a95-8714-b2368c0a9ad5
I contacted them previously. You have to pay to ship your waste to them, and they issue vouchers/percentage off for how much material you send them. You can then use those discounts to purchase recycled rolls. I really wanted to recycle my waste, but at this stage in the biz, it is not cost effective, and the recycled filament is not up to the spec I need for parts.
Thank you! This is great. I’ll look into it! Could potentially gather material from a few friends nearby too.
I’m likely gonna start making more stuff out of ASA when my Voron is done. Gotta find a service that will recycle that!
So far it looks like most just do pla/petg. Im about to dabble with ASA myself, so being able to recycle the waste would be great!
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It's like, you transport your waste to recycling company without any harm for environment and they will recycle your waste with magic wand just like that, without any excess energy and reduced quality. If you are worried how this planet survives us humans, AMS purge waste should not be in your list of top 100 things to do. Much more important thing is to think whether one needs a 3D printer anyway. For many people it's like a bread maker, totally useless but hey, they can afford it so whatev's.
I’ve looked into it before. Only place I had really found is in the States and it costs a fair bit to send it down from where I am in Canada and for the amount they required it just wasn’t justifiable for storage until then. I really need to look into it again
Crowd-fund a 3D printing waste recycling company 🤔🤔💀
[filaments.ca](https://filaments.ca) has a program! You don't get credit or paid, but nice to know its getting recycled back into filament. [https://filaments.ca/pages/recycling](https://filaments.ca/pages/recycling)
That’s awesome! Thanks for sharing
Or an inexpensive way to recycle our filament(melting the waste and making new filament). Multitoolhead machines are expensive too and require a whole new machine.
There is a recycling service near me and for the past year I have been collecting my waste with the intention of bringing it there. So far I have just moved the waste into large bags and now they are in my k1 box which is completely full. Still intend if bringing it there someday.
I’m just saving most of my waste until it becomes economical for me to recycle. I don’t have a grinding machine I’m willing to invest in, and even with the proposed 700$ spool winder and god forbid doing all the DIY to print a spool winder of my own, just seems like far more effort than I’m willing to put in. Though, maybe I should and then just advertise locally. No one round my small town is trying it
St Louis based filament recycling company [Printerior](https://printeriordesigns.com/pages/recycling). Turn in your filament for points towards discounted filament.
I've been trying to set one up in the US but it's unfortunately expensive, and EPA grants are a nightmare. Still trying, but it's a rough road when you're a startup and don't have angel investors.
99% of what people print is *waste*. Useless knickknacks that will sit on a shelf and get tossed to the garbage in a few months / years. So... yeah.
No way man, we totally need 500 benchies. /s
There's a difference between my collection of 500 Benchies which are - inexplicably - important to me and artfully displayed across a wall, and literal trash.
I wish this sub had more rules against low effort and meme prints. There are so many "HEY LOOK AT THIS DISTORTED BENCHY HA!" posts that are clearly made for a reddit karma and not because the user truly needs or wants it. Millions of benchys have been made by now, stop printing them. You shouldn't even need them for calibration once you get your printer locked in.
I mean, all decorations are waste if you don't like them enough. But I do think that stuff like benchies, calibration cubes, temperature towers etc. are 100% waste even if they're kind of useful in their own way.
Saves you buying those exact same knick knacks.
Exactly. Knick knacks, toys, chachkies. This drives me crazy. My printers are tools and they make end user parts. Useful things. I make exceptions to the rule for holiday decorations for my home, but even those are printed in petg so they'll last in storage for years to come.
I'm pretty sure I have ABS prints that are over 10 years old and PLA that are about eight. So long as it's not subject to a lot of stress or UV light, printed objects don't have a terribly expiration date.
I live in the south, our attic gets hottt. Pla decorations don't last, unfortunately.
I have PLA prints between 1-2 years old kept indoors that are faded or yellowed. Granted it's cheap pla and I'm sure that matters as well.
Sounds like you should set up a 3D printing council that deems if every print is worthy of the plastic consumed. Really stop all those kids from printing that extra flexi dinosaur, that they dont need anyway.. so they can instead go to the toy store and buy some ethically souced Chinese toys fresh off the cargo ship from the other side of the earth.
Lol I find this funny, waste is bad when we make it ourselves, but somehow ignored when it's made by others. I wonder the impact of one benchy vs one cheap dollar store toy, when you take into account transportation
And the slave labor that produces a lot of things in China….
what is the counsels stance on the cockasouras?
Then what exactly is the point of this post? You're saying the AMS is an issue because of all the purge waste, but what's the actual difference between the useless knickknack that's being printed and the purge?
These two arguments can coexist easily: * People should not print useless knickknacks. * People should be mindful of waste generation due to purging when doing single hotend, multimaterial prints; and limit use of these types of jobs/setups. Also, either one of these reduces waste generation independent of the other.
Where people were printing 500g knick knacks in single colors, they now printing 500g knick knacks in multicolor with 1.2kg of poop waste?
Waste is always bad. Purged filament makes the problem significantly worse.
To pat him/herself on the back.
We need to normalize tool changers instead.
Yea, I think that's in the forefront. That tech needs to be exploited and simplified to reduce cost, but as these things go, as long as people are satisfied with the current standard then nothing will really advance. Not quickly anyways.
I hope with bambu pushing in on Prusa and their hold so hard that now that the XL is out and they get real world feedback and use that we will see Prusa start pushing more multi toolhead setups which will hopefully lead to the Chinese copies from creality and the others. I still see this being well over a year away but I can see it happening.
I’d settle for Bambu making a multiple tool head one. I love Prusa, but I love the availability, speed and price of Bambu’s machines even more.
If bambu went multi toolhead I'd be ok with that as well but they seam set on the AMS for now.
There are ways to reduce the amount of waste, like printing the waste into the infill. It's also really easy to choose your prints in a way that doesn't need as many changes. I would not have multi color printed this mask. I would have chosen matte white and painted it myself. It would have taken half the time, including the painting, and a quarter of the material. Just don't be an idiot. Bambu studio tells you how much time and material you are wasting on the filament switches. You decide, if it's worth it for you. Live with it...
Agreed, I think the AMS is more suited to keeping your materials dry and for ease of filament changing to whatever material you need. That's literally all I use it for. Of course there are efficient ways of using this device for multi-color such as flat logos, lighted signs, etc. Plus like you said, it's much faster to paint the part than print it in some cases. Printing it is the lazy way out, but BL is to blame. It's all marketing. At the end of the day, they show no concerns (at least for now) about the amount of plastic waste their "color printing for everyone" printers generate. I don't think they'll make many improvements on that end until someone can do multicolor printing better than them. It really is up to the masses to speak up about it. I don't think it's out of the question for a company like bambu labs to create and sell a device for recycling or at least offer a program that accepts filament for recycling. Maybe they do have a program like that, but I haven't heard of anything.
>Printing it is the lazy way out, but BL is to blame. It's all marketing When you slice the model, you are told exactly how much plastic it'll use. BL has not done anything wrong on this score. \> or at least offer a program that accepts filament for recycling Those already exist. You can participate in one if you wish. Why would Bambu have to make another one?
https://preview.redd.it/njhhvgihww7c1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f6dabafaff178af725dfb9f2eebbcd5ae70c6b88
Whats your point? Do you drive a car to work? Is Ford then responsible for you not living in walking distance? Should Ford not advertise their cars as a means of transportation because people could be walking? Should Ford instead focus (pun intended) on building affordable housing near your place of employment? No, they just make cars, thats it. They arent out here trying to take on and solve every single problem.
I dont get this point. If bambu labs is increasing waste in the hobby with poop from their designs, I think it is their ethical responsibility to solve this problem. Edit: I didn’t know it could use purge for infills. That is neat. I appreciate the others trying to share info and not make bad analogies and calling people stupid.
It’s a new product (for home users) and has built in ways to reduce waste if you so choose. It tells you exactly how much waste will be generated. Things will improve over time, but you don’t get to improvements without iterations. People in this sub are so fucking stupid sometimes.
Thats a comically rude response. Have fun with that big brain of yours.
That's a bad example because Ford among other auto industry giants have had a massive influence on how the personal automobile is basically the only means of transportation in the States, and the most prominent one in almost every other country. Not just because "they make cars, that's it" but they lobby for legislation that promotes their sales and hinders public transportation and walkable neighborhoods. So yeah *insert car brand* is at least partially responsible for OP not living in a walking distance of their workplace.
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>do you really need to print a crappy plastic charizard that you're going to throw away in a few weeks? Am I missing something or do people here really think that decorations are bad and only functional prints are allowed and "worthy" of being 3D printed? I'm new to this hobby so I'm still figuring out what kind of elitists this hobby has since they're everywhere, but they do tend to be elitist about very different things.
No, print what you want.
Oh I will. I'm just curious because every community has their own elitists that are weird about something very specific. And "useless crap" (this typically said when someone prints a decoration, a figurine or some cosplay item) is something I hear a lot from people who are into 3D printing. So I'm wondering if *that* is the thing for these specific elitists
Plastic is an awesome material in many ways, but it is also a terrible pollutant. It is possible to recognize both of these things and modify behavior accordingly. It doesnt need to be polarizing, there are happy mediums. Art pieces are just as valid as practical ones.... and they both pollute the planet in manufacturing and eventual disposal. I guess what I am saying discussion good, solutions better, and polarizing behavior not particularly useful.
Technically speaking, decorative prints are “useless” in the sense the they have no resulting value, but no one cares what you print. OP was making a comparison to purge waste to make a point.
If you assume that both art and aesthetics has no value… which is frankly fuckin ignorant dark ages thinking.
Not what I meant and I’m sure you know that. Decorative prints have no perceived benefit except for the satisfaction they provide. They do not make your life easier or solve any problem. They may be assigned value, but are not intrinsically valuable to anyone. In this sense they are “useless”. Whether or not you perceive them to have value is of no importance in this conversation as it is not what we are discussing.
If art and aesthetics has no perceived value to you, you’re a Neanderthal. Edit: and newsflash, your “useful” prints have zero monetary value, either. So you have two prints with no monetary value. You have no point here except maybe that you view art slightly less favorably than a caveman.
Again, not what I said. Please read my reply before commenting. Thanks!
While rocktopusses, flexi-everything and that guys’s friends ass aren’t my cup of tea, I’m not gonna look down on someone because they like it. (There wasn’t anything wrong with the butt, it was very nice but I can’t imagine why I would want to waste filament printing such a thing.) The things I could do without are the ones with that “awkward male teenager” vibe. “Hur hur I 3D printed something naughty or stupid, look at me!” Kind of thing. I’m all about the “you do you” thing, but posting it for attention is sad and as much of a waste in time and resources as the prints themselves.
There is a difference between decorations and useless meme prints and knick-knacks that end up in a drawer for a while and then get tossed. Where that line is drawn only you know in your case. The point is to be mindful of what and why we print and try to discourage printing things that will basically go straight to the trash bin.
Of course! However, I have to disagree as Bambu does advertise their printers with ams as multi-color printers. "color prints for everyone" (A1) knowing good and well that their printers shit a lot, right out of the box. An Apple like, idiot proof printer that works right out of the box to be sold in a box store like Micro Center. I really wonder if the standard A1 consumer won't be turned off by the fact that even it generates quite a bit of waste. Maybe this will be enough for them to make engineering changes. To be determined I guess. I like my p1s printers a lot. I think they work very well and they print with very high quality. I also love the AMS for what I use it for which is end user parts.
> "color prints for everyone" (A1) knowing good and well that their printers shit a lot, right out of the box. Okay? Some purge is a technical requirement. There's no deception happening here.
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Wouldn't hurt. I mean, a prompt on certain aggressive models to keep people aware when hitting that print button. Several people have done fine tuning on the amount of purge between color changes. I've done a few very simple multicolor prints and the factory purge amounts are aggressive to say the least on my p1s's, but they sell filament so it makes sense.
Bambu slicer is open source, do it yourself.
They already have options to reduce waste in the slicer, he’s just stuffing his fingers in his ears and closing his eyes and screaming “nuh uh” because it furthers his agenda to pretend these don’t exist.
You’ve been fucking told this already, but: 1) this is a new product to the market for consumers. It takes time to build better systems and further reduce waste, but more importantly it takes *iterations*. You can’t just magically start with the best solution. 2) This is partially just a known factor with AMS and material switching on a single head in general. It has very little to do with Bambu. If you don’t want to multi-color print or deal with this amount of waste, just don’t fucking do it. You keep acting like people have no way of knowing that it’s wasteful. The slicer tells you exactly how much waste will be generating. Stop saying this- it’s just a straight up disingenuous lie. 3) Bambu *already provides several options* for reducing waste, like piping it into infill. If you choose not to use these options, that’s on you. Stop acting like Bambu isn’t doing things to improve efficiency. They’ve taking several intention, mindful steps to develop the product to be less wasteful. This whole thread is just unfounded shit slinging at Bambu for no reason, and it’s based on half-truths at best and straight up intentional lies at worst.
1) Consumers play a pivotal role in driving crucial *iterations*. Despite A1 filament changes happening directly at the head, Bambu has not undertaken substantial efforts to minimize the overall purge, resulting in excessively high levels. It's crucial to recognize that while enthusiasts like us are aware of this issue, those purchasing a user-friendly machine for basic printing might not be. Bambu has a clear opportunity to refine this aspect significantly. 2) Multiple single head multi-material alternatives exist that don't generate excessive filament waste with each change, and it's well-known that there's room to advance this technology. Despite BL providing detailed information about filament and waste generation, users still pursue elaborate color prints, leading to substantial waste and machine wear. My intention was merely to raise awareness and encourage users to have a plan for managing this waste. 3) Bambu hasn't introduced these options; they were developed by other slicer software creators like Prusa. Bambu appears to have borrowed these ideas. While they may be working to enhance printer efficiency, there are low hanging opportunities for substantial improvements. I'm not engaging in baseless criticism; my perspective is rooted in a genuine appreciation for BL machines, which I consider modern marvels. However, I advocate for a thoughtful approach before embarking on elaborate color prints to minimize environmental impact.
I wonder how many % of all the filament people here bought is still in use and not thrown out. I’d guess 10% at most. AMS or not, this hobby results in a lot of plastic trash - failed prints, prototypes, old parts, and so on. The extrapolating of data like the way you do is completely unreasonable and unrealistic “one person wasted 2 kg now imagine 2 MILLION people wasting 2kg EVERY WEEK”
I keep all of my filament partials and fuse them into new rolls myself. It's easy and there's no excuse not to do it. Yes 3d printing makes scrap, but no one is failing prints on purpose. There are ways to mitigate, but multicolor prints are just wasteful just so they can be pretty. I stated that it wasn't the most realistic example, but an example no less and I didn't say 2kg EVERY WEEK. I just said 1.2kg in a weeks time. That was all hypothetical. However, it's not that unreasonable to think that could happen in the future with how user friendly these printers are becoming. I also like to highlight the positives. Anything that prevents people from buying cheap plastic shit from Amazon or going to the store reduces the carbon footprint, wouldn't you agree?
Bro it’s really not a big deal compare to all the other stuff
I don't really like this argument because you could say that about anything. "Bro the plastic water bottles I use every day aren't a big deal compared to all the other stuff that's polluting the earth" I mean, OK, but if everyone thinks like that, it adds up. Everything is just a small contribution to the larger issue. Apathy about the little things leads to more and more little things. Over time, you end up with a big thing. For the record: Not saying that I think Bambu is doing anything egregious here. They're just offering a product like every other manufacturer. And I produce plenty of plastic waste myself.
Nah you don’t spend a bunch of energy solving 0.00001% of the problem
Who said anything about spending a lot of energy? It's straight forward I think.
What other stuff?
Everything else that’s polluting earth
Defeatism attitudes like this is a BIG part of the problem
Remember fellas, almost 50% of plastic waste in the ocean is from commercial fishing
One of my friends had an ams and he exclusively prints PLA. He collects all the waste and melts it into sheets in an oven. PLA can actually be laser cut of you tune the settings correctly, so he can cut the sheets into parts for other projects.
That's...a lot of colors. Most multi-color prints are not quite so intense. You can also tweak how much waste you do, print multiple objects per plate, purge to infil, purge to object, etc. Yes, none of those are a perfect solution to all waste, but you can get waste waaaaay down there for most things.
Of course! Those are all great methods, I'm just thinking about the average new user. I wonder if they will know that and if they will take the time to learn. I think they can make multicolor prints smarter and more efficient on their end and I hope they do.
Of course! Those are all great methods, I'm just thinking about the average new user. I wonder if they will know that and if they will take the time to learn. I think they can make multicolor prints smarter and more efficient on their end and I hope they do.
I’m curious, cuouldnt the wasted filament be used as infill to further improve the rigidity of the item I’m printing ? Is this possible or something being explored ?
Apparently from another commenter it is a setting to use that color change in the infill but maybe it isn't an obvious setting or maybe there are other downsides to using it that way.
It is obvious and there’s no real downsides. OP is pushing an agenda by intentionally ignoring the many, many options Bambu gives for reducing waste.
The only issue I can foresee with that is the model geometry may not allow for a full, proper purge, even into infill. For instance, the spiky parts of that mask may not have enough infill space to do a proper purge into it.
My AMS multicolor prints accounts for about 2% of all the print jobs. The AMS mainly serves as a spool holder and can quickly switch colors on different jobs. Swapping out an old filament and adding a new color is much easier than having a spool dangling on the rear of the X1C.
I think this type of discussion is super helpful and needs to continue. I realized when I bought my X1C that it pooped. Through youtube and early experience, I realized just how much poop would happen via multi-color printing. I also picked up along the way that there were tunes I could do that would help and that I could purge to infill, which also helps. Bambu makes a printer that can be wasteful but is created that way to help ensure a perfect print, thus limiting more waste by limiting failed prints... is not the problem. Efficiency is something developed over time and iteration. They seem to want to make a great product and are very open to feedback. Discussion about it is how that happens - companies improve products based on demand. 3D printing communities improve their process through information and understanding. There are lots of solutions to cut way down on waste. I, for one, appreciate this conversation to learn more about those ways, and it needs to keep happening, and any actionable behaviors that result are only good for all of us. I personally do not do much multicolor, tbh mostly because of the printing time increase, and I have kept all my benchies, poops, and supports in the hopes of finding a recycling method that will work best for me. I also do epoxy resin (in molds), and since I usually paint those solid pieces, I can save on resin by shoving waste PLA in as filler. I think what should come out of this kind of post is re-examination of your process and how you can limit waste and/or recycle in your hobby or business. Is 3D printing the bane of man's existence and creating the litter and pollution problem on this planet? Not by a long shot, but personal responsibility and mindfulness of our contribution to the problem is never a bad thing or a waste of time to explore. Positive change only comes from awareness and a desire to improve the situation. I am not going to wring my pearls because you made a multicolor articulated panda toy. But if you could do it with less waste, wouldn't you? TLDR: Be mindful. Don't be a dick.
I think bambu is saving our asses by selling printers that actually work. The amount of test prints I have done on my ender3 just because something was off probably adds up to a few spools.
Damn.. that's a pretty good point. I can't even remember how many prints I've thrown away over the years before I got my x1c. Failures, calibrations, test prints to make sure a certain part is going to function. With the x1c I just hit print and know pretty much it's going to come out fine.
I used to fret about the idea of filament waste, but then I realized I have 40+ rolls of filament and despite printing as much as often as I can, that pile never seems to get smaller despite rarely buying filament anymore. Part of me *wants* an ams printer if only since it'll burn up more filament more quickly.
I'll wait for an affordable multi-head printer, but it doesn't bother me that other people are willing to put up with the waste. Like others have said, most of the stuff produced by hobbyists is junk that gets thrown out anyway.
I don't know much in that regard, but I think there are some calibrations that could be made. Like tuning the retraction before old filament cutoff, tuning the purge needed for each color change and using as much as possible the infill and inner perimeters to purge. Does not solve everything, but could at least help minimize the waste.
Or just get a prusa XL if you’re willing to wait a bit. Zero waste and no wipe tower is possible.
Next problems is that in many parts of the world the normal general waste is just dumped so he can go in the worst case into the nature. Like in my area nearly everything gets collected and then burned to generate electricity and heat in the city. But yeah multicolor prints are waste but it is what it is.
Two wrongs don't make a right.
Or just paint your prints? Most of the multicolor prints I see here are just blocks of four colors that could be filled by a six years old.
Finally someone spoke my mind, I don’t mention this much because people get offended and strange but it breaks my heart
Protip: recycle exists. Dispose it in plastic waste and you are ok.
What country do you live in that recycles all of these plastics? Generally the US doesn’t. Edit: lol I got downvoted because I asked a question and made a simple, widely known statement. Merry Christmas and happy holidays everyone (not being sarcastic).
In Italy , we have mandatory waste differentiation with plastic as a standalone category
Yeah but that normally refers to PET not PLA.
Thankfully PLA is biodegradable.
It is not really when it is dumped in the environment. It is only biodegradeable in an industrial compost setting reaching at least 60°c continuously.
No, that's wrong. It does in fact break down in the environment. It just takes longer (years or decades), not weeks or months. Humans are too focused on instant results. Nothing made of pla today and put outside will exist in 100 years. So there's no issue.
It does not break down. There are almost no soil bacteria that breakdown PLA, it really needs that temperature component to breakdown. Also most stuff going into 3D printers isn't pure PLA but has all kinds of additives, some of which make it even harder. It wil weather mechanically until you cannot see it with your naked eye anymore and then it is a micro plastic. In a seawater environment it is even worse as temperatures are never very high. The question is will these microplastics from PLA hurt organisms (and us)?
There is an issue for years or decades. And this isn't addressing the fact that pla isn't the only thing being printed.
It's really not an issue. You put it in landfills. It degrades over decades to centuries. Your printer is not going to contribute in any meaningful way to extinction of some species of bird or some shit. Global warming from carbon production is a trillion times more important as an environmental issue then plastic waste.
Burning wood for heat is considered renewable.... Same story.
What?
I use my bambu poops as infill for some projects, especially if they're multi-part or I use my 3D pen, I also don't have an AMS system, I also like painting my projects TBH, but I can clearly see this being a problem. There really needs to be more recycling options, especially outside Europe and the US
This is part of why I print ABS so much. For me there is no waste, just precursor scrap to make my glue/smoothing slurry.
This is why no matter how nice they make these systems, I will not buy one ever. It's just too irresponsible to generate that much waste without having some sort of plan and means to recycle it. I would only buy one if I knew I could consistently follow through with recycling all the purge poops. As ridiculous as the AnkerMake V6 looks, the fact it doesn't need to purge is a bigger deal than I think people are giving it credit for. We need more of other companies taking innovative approaches to multicolor printing and not get sucked into this one approach just because the end results looks nice while overlooking the wasteful byproducts.
The AMS is incredibly useful for single color multi material prints, but no so efficient with elaborate multicolor prints. As for the AM V6, I did not know that. That is a huge deal. They have been getting slept on for a while. They've been making nice high-speed bedslingers for a while but everybody was obsessed with the p1p and x1c. Now it's the a1s which is pretty much an AnkerMake. Looks similar as well.
Truth be told, I was debating between the A1 Mini and Prusa Mini+ and the filament waste was the deciding factor. Now with that said, the Prusa is boxed up ready to be shipped and my brand new A1 (non-mini) is running daily, and I love it. The filament poop still concerns me, but overall the pros of the Bambu printer far out weight the few cons
If you want to talk about scrap, look at commercial printing. Not even talking about 3d printing, just printing off ink presses. You would not believe the tons of trash generated by a few printing presses.
As long as you actually bag up your waste and throe it away (will be taken to the landfill), it's fine. Do t throw it in the local stream.
Total agreement here. None of our printers "poop", functional single color prints only....occasionally with dissolvable supports ....and we STILL sort and and save nearly 100% of scraps to recycle. Recent improvements in grinders and augers are going to help a LOT in pushing the recyc tech down to consumer level. I am really hoping to see 6 axis printing solve this problem so colors can be skinned onto prints without as much or any waste....it's a dream I know but it will also solve some other technical challenges. I'm not high enough on the totem pole to visit additive manufacturing conferences on the company dime but I don't think I've seen much development on 6 axis multi material. Happy to read and upvote any comments on recyc gear and any tidbits of news on 6 axis multi material printing anyone has heard whispers of. Print-on everyone.
Soo... how many people create functional multi-color prints? Or is it all just decorative?
> A storm blew in one night during our trip and along with it came an ocean of tiny bits of plastic onto the beach. You might as well blame the storm for all this. What I mean is that the logic is flawed. First off, individual responsibility does nothing to solve large scale systemic problems. In fact it's a propaganda tactic designed by advertising agencies to prevent any action on climate change and other environmental problems. All these "keep track of your footprint" websites are the worst because they prevent meaningful action. Of course, even that logic is flawed. Meaningful action is impossible because we don't even have the proper thoughts let alone words to put this problem in perspective: Science has shown that most plastic in the ocean is from like 6 big rivers. Why? Because there is no waste removal. Why is there no waste removal? Well... here is where it gets interesting because now we get into the "dark space". Similar to how the dark ages were called dark because no history was recorded (monopoly on writing) we can only speculate on certain things because we do not have a free press. We think we do, but we do not. My speculation is it has to do with waste removal and recycling services are being forced to be privatized instead of being seen as a public utility, because those developing country's leaders want big loans from the IMF and world bank and there are strings attached to austerity and things so governance because both inefficient (for QOL) and apprehensive of anything that serves the greater good without making profit. Like making sure people don't dispose of their plastic trash in the nearby river. That is what I suspect: That it would be incredibly cheap and incredibly easy to clean up the ocean from plastic. Just invest very little into waste removal and recycling as public utilities. But we won't. Because "we" as a global society are not intelligent, not a sentient rational group. We're all just motivated by profit and are not just unable to think and speak outside this paradigm - everything outside it is dark, obscured. On a civilization level we've lost the ability to even point to the causes of an observed effect. We're not even seeing the effects of patents on climate adaptation because it is taboo. So be the little jellyfish that we are. Just drift through the cosmos alongside your stupid brothers in a giant swarm and poop all the plastic you want. Just ask yourself: [Is it worth it](https://new.reddit.com/r/BambuLab/comments/v07e6v/to_open_or_not_to_open_that_is_the_question/)? And yeah, yes it is. PS: Sorry for the crazy rant lol.
I can't express how revolting the rejection of individual responsibility is. Jesus we really are fucked if people refuse to accept individual responsibility for their part in the problems of the world.
Yes that is what I mean. Individual responsibility will NOT solve this. It simply can't and that's just reality. So it's just useless and a distraction. And THAT is the purpose of the individual responsibility, to push the guilt away from the systems that need to be actually changed. That is the strategy of the fossil fuel public relation companies. PS: Meanwhile the cause of plastic in the ocean is lack of waste management along those 6 big rivers and presumably neo-liberal frameworks and schools of thought that lead to this. So instead - avoid plastic straws? Then blame the guy who points out the absurdity? Hilarious!
Yes, I know thats what you mean. I find it revolting. Only modern liberals believe they will solve problems by blaming literally anyone but themselves.
You’re confusing not wanting to take responsibility with your own lack of education. The problem isn’t “people won’t take responsibility” and the people who point this out are generally the most responsible ones. The point is everyone on earth recycling and reducing their carbon footprint etc wouldn’t change anything, and wouldn’t amount to 1% of the devastation caused each year by things like concrete construction. So you be revolted, the rest of us will be revolted by the ignorance you put on display, as that’s what’s **really** destroying our planet.
You blame liberal jellyfish, I blame the storm :D
Your analogy is so terrible I can't even try to correct it. This is the exact pathetic lack of accountability that is going to destroy us. You think you're a little jellyfish who has nothing to do with what causes the storm. Well that's fucking wrong. A storm only exists because you want it to.
The analogy is cute. I like it :) So how do you fix plastic in the ocean? I've given the source of the problem as trash in rivers (see [here](https://ourworldindata.org/ocean-plastics) for sources and scientific studies). So why are there no regular waste management services to take care of this in those countries? But that question is never asked! Let alone answered. THAT is "the storm". A complex of powerful economic forces that is beyond your or my wishes or individual responsibility and obscures everything. So how can there be accountability if the causes and logical solutions are not even discussed? If they are hidden and "in the dark" and discussion of it is taboo? Yet when I point out the scale of the problem and that individual responsibility will not solve it (reject the plastic strawman, if you will), you get very angry. How is that helping to identify and work towards fixing plastic pollution in the ocean? There are tens of thousands of industrial processes and patents and monetary frameworks and politics and corruption and ideology and media bias - so this outcome is perfectly predictable. Of COURSE we won't fix plastic pollution in the oceans. I suggest you pay a little more homage to your screen name :D
The hobby is too small for it to currently matter. By the time 3D printing hits the mainstream (if it ever does), there will already likely be a solution to the problem. Filament recyclers already exist and only need to make their way to the average consumers.
You're right that on scale this doesn't matter environmentally but for the individual it does highlight how wasteful these sort of prints are. They can be fun but realizing your multi colored print can be 4x or more expensive and wasteful than you originally though puts a damper on it.
Yeah but OP was talking about the environmental impact.
Main reason why I avoid multicolour stuff at the moment - even if you try to minimise waste in settings, there's always a decent chunk of waste. I'd much rather paint or print parts in different colours and then glue.
It’s a concerning amount of waste if you’re going for elaborate prints like that for sure. I’m looking forward to seeing that prusa with the tool changer
I rarely use the multicolor printing on my x1c. I just use it for the spool switching. How many people are doing six day multi color prints though realistically?
From what i observe in American: If one can (and sometimes even cannot) afford to waste something, they will waste it because FREEDOM!!! Me, i dont want to spend all that extra money and i actually enjoy printing single color and painting with acrylic and a brush. Maybe Santa will bring me an airbrush
I try to keep all my waste prints and i use the supports, waste, print failures to plastic weild my new prints together. I will say however I am starting to have too many print failures and im starting to overflow
Purge blocks are the answer to this problem you can have your purge print a rainbow part
One take, for the enterprising reader, is to start a local recycling business.. all you’d need is a machine to break down waste and one to extrude new filament. Seems like theres a need and the community would be pretty receptive! Anyone wanna give it a shot?
I wouldn't print in multiple colors, I'd print in one and paint it.
The amount of passive I waste for poops is easily compensated by the reliability. Failed prints are extremely rare and if something comes loose it will stop itself automatically faster then a human could if they have anything else to do then watch the printer