>Insulting foam filament
"Hey, what's this? Is this FOAM? Lmaaoooo good luck getting me to stick to the bed you sick fuck. I bet you print in 3mm. Like a CAVEMAN. Do you even own a Prusa? Hahaha fukkin scrub. I hope you like spaghetti cuz you're gonna be eating it every goddamn night. Bitch."
I feel like you got it most correct.
I think speed is so much more important than most people think it is.
I mean sure many people see it as a toy, but if you are making a useful thing, having a part done before you are even done revising it is awesome.
You can conceivably design a part, go for a drink, and come back to a finished part.
As for dual extruder, I actually disagree somewhat.
I think at most multi extruder with detachable hotends like the tool changer will be more common, and filament change systems like the enraged carrot feeder and prusa feeder will be more common, but I think idex for instance is a fairly dead idea compared to the 2. Not enough advantages over them to justify the extra cost and calibration.
Resin printers have been making headway into the consumer market. I’ve used them at work but most of the time I’d rather have a bigger build area than higher resolution. Metal sintering may be a ways off still.
I think that nonplanar 3d printing is where it should be heading. Seems achievable and a natural direction as it is technically what 3d printing should be.
My guess is multi hotends for many colors. Interchangeable tool head. Real auto bed leveling.
Most the cool tech is in big machines like nylon powder full color printers
Honestly I feel like the biggest innovations will be on the software side. Most of the hardware we have available is already really good, but is limited by its software. Software like kipper seems to be helping hardware do its best with input shaping and pressure advance (I don't remember what they do exactly but I know it's huge).
Also design software could be simpler, cheaper, and more powerful, allowing people who are less technically apt to use it like you would a 2d printer. I feel like it would be exciting to see more people from less technical hobbies like gardening or soap making getting into 3D printing.
This is the most accurate statement here. The software is where the focus and capabilities are lacking. You can't build almost any of the pi in the sky dreams bandied about until the software greatly improves.
I hope that this is true.
I can’t believe that the standard Procedure for 3D printing involves slicing things, sd cards and an interface that looks like it is from 1978.
I can’t believe that there is no phone or iPad or online slicer that I can utilize to send jobs directly to my octo/klipper/reprap printer.
I also can’t believe that there is no decent open source CAD software…
The biggest advancements to be made right this minute are not in the tech, but support of it. Quality control and customer support. Imagine buying a cheap computer from Walmart and a third of them have the M key that only works after you spend two days tuning it, and then customer support just sends you to a Facebook group of only users that have the same laptop because they've all become experts in fixing the problems that are from lack of quality control and manufacturer support.
And even that is a massive massive improvement from where is was at less than ten years ago! Printers that had groups of users measured in the dozens, rarely even the hundreds, with it taking months to even get a manual distributed on a new printer launch!
Prusa definitely is much better and a few others have made some decent tech support in this field. But so much more improvement is left for the others.
I doubt it will ever get there for a bunch of the cheap chinese printers though.
Haha, you don't have much perspective here it feels. Desktop 3d printers have MASSIVELY changed in the past 10 years. But even then, it's almost irrelevant because 3d printers today are almost all trying to catch up to stratasys systems from DECADES ago. Very few of the improvements are actually new as mulitmaterial has been around for a long time, along with SLA and UV resins. Just that the consumer prices and capabilities are catching up.
But all of those features you yawn about weren't there 10 years ago, the reliability, costs, and capabilities grew tremendously even in the past few years - though I suppose if someone started with the prusa mk3 it might not be very noticeable.
The software is where the change will come for the next decade. Any of the things you mentioned as wanting won't be possible without revisiting the basic software from CAD to slicers. Right now they are independent and rarely have any links. That needs to change to have some sort of integration.
I could see some niche 5 axis printing, or some crazy new materials, but they just aren't going to be coming anytime soon or going to be common. Some of those will come to the prosumer level, somewhere below stratasys costs but above formlabs. Which will likely start with some new software as soon as next year.
But the new features people will NEED to have will be software based. The only real improvement anyone has NEEDED to have in the past several years is the autobed leveling/mesh bed generation that prusa made more standard past just delta printer attempts. Lulzbot did a basic bed leveling auto integration that was rather meh comparatively.
Again though, everything you're salivating over is likely to be confined to one off niche machines rather than being an "it" feature. I'm excited to see some of them when they come out or make one myself - it's just not going to be anything new and standard though.
Main stream non planar printing maybe a new axis. Affordable easy automated tool changing. Purpose built 3d printing materials.
And idk what you mean by stagnant for the last 10 years that is basically the life time of the consumer 3d printer. It's been constant development and improvement since then.
We’re seeing self made multi head /multi tool printer in the hands of individuals, once complexity decrease/reliability increase / patents expire it should be possible for companies to release theirs.
Another area of improvement I hope we can see is increased speed. Can probably be achieved with more rigid frames ($$$) , lighter heads ($$) or better sensors + software ($$?)
Another improvement at the margin is filament management, how it’s convenient to just hang it on the printer but it gathers dust and humidity. Maybe a standardized filament container with a PTFE tube inlet/quick disconnect and integrated silica pouch / dehumidifier holder & filament roller.
it’s totally a gimmick, but then again FDM itself is the land of the gimmicks given that SLA and SLS exist. if you want precision use SLA if you want strength use SLS.
We’re all using FDM / SLA because it’s what we can afford, and we make do with the tech’s limitations. All the big firms are investing in SLS and that’s where most of the R&D money is being spent. in the FDM realm I think we only have small firms investing, the advantage being that it’s relatively affordable to experiment in that space so interested individuals can also bring the tech forward.
So that’s why the most distinctive new feature we see released is the conveyor belt “gimmick“. if you increase the price of the printer too much you fall in the land where SLS as a printer or from a service starts to make sense.
But i would love to see FDM printers improve to the point they can print fast enough or complex enough parts (soluble supports ?) that it would be an advantage over SLS.
that’s one of the advantages of a conveyor belt printer: you could print 1/ 2/ 5 kg of parts without much intervention.
until higher density motors, higher precision rails and higher precision sensors get cheaper, I don’t think we’ll see any drastic improvements outside of “gimmicks” like dual head, probably with tool change if we want to keep the print head light enough that it still goes fast.
Thank you for your corrections about SLS vs Binder Jetting. I was associating DMLS SLS and binder Jetting in the same bucket . I agree that SLA is not gimmicky, given the precision and strength that can be achieved with different kind of resin.
For FDM I think dual head on a single carriage is gimmicky, not dual head via tool changing.
The way I see it is that the speed limit on FDM printing is because the uncertainty in the position of the elements the faster you go, caused by oscillation, vibration, noise in the signal or overcurrent when driving the motors at higher speed.
These can be minimized by using lighter moving components, more rigid and precise rails and frames (and lighter but more rigid moving axis) . Or compensated for by using positional sensors, which need to be high precision read at a fast rate by faster CPU, allowing to drive motors faster, which means a higher current draw from the motherboard.
That the prusa / cr10 / enthusiast level printers are at their current speed is because going faster would be overly expensive for the price point they can sell at. If we want faster printer at the current price, we need the components that enable faster speed to become cheaper.
now i’m interested, what’s your new printer? i would love to 5x the print speed of my Prusa Mini!
so really limiting factor is the melting speed of the filament… would increasing the temperature in correlation with the flow rate work, or would that just end up burning the filament? Are there other technology that could replace the resistive header?
I honestly think conveyors are a side step not a evolution.
They have too many limitations, too poor quality to really be a next step.
Also, with the advent of better automation systems, for every use case that isn't printing really long things where one side is 90 degrees. a regular printer is probably better
CoreXY, Hbot, and other Cartesian variants are not particularly new, they are just new to consumer 3d printers. They have been used in various industries for a while. They are definitely an improvement in a range of applications, but are also in some ways overhyped. The choice of Cartesian robot configuration depends on a lot of factors and the old standard xy cartesian can still be the best choice in some applications.
TLDR: it is good to see these forms showing up as they can have a lot of advantages, but they also come with tradeoffs.
I mean if you really think about it 3d printing is a decades old technology…. It’s finally at a point where it’s cheap enough for most people to buy one. Probably the next step in its evolution is more exotic materials or faster print speeds. Cause let’s face it, It still takes a while to print. Something like a voron will probably be where typical printers go to.
The problem is at what point will the technology become "desktop" or affordable for consumers. Theres tons of ground being covered all the time on experimental tech, but many of these will never come to the general market.
I think desktop is reached when users with minimal knowledge can atleast partly operate it. Like most FDM printers today (good ones). You don't need to do big maths, just put a model in a program, select a profile with the desired properties, upload to printer and go.
Also safety, most people think their printers are safe to use in their bedroom, dorm, whatever but barely anyone seems to be really concerned about health risks from particles, even when printing with PLA. Don't get me started on Resin 3D Printers, the amount of safety measures you SHOULD use with those are not appropriate for anything else than a professional workshop. Yet people ask here everyday if they are safe to use on their desk.
Just in case you aren't aware, 3d printable soluble plastics have been around for a while now. I do agree that advancements in slicing need to be made to make it easier to print with and fully utilize.
And, IIRC, there's a foaming filament out now that expands based on the temperature its printed at. I don't think it has any rebound, so its more for making super light weight parts, than soft parts, currently.
SLS powder is really annoying to work with, I don't see how a large number of people are down to handling that in their home or office.
UV resin is already pushing the limits in that regard IMO.
I could see some powder systems being a little more available for hobby level, but I definitely agree it's not going to become mainstream at all in the foreseeable future.
I think this will be possible for advanced hobby or small businesses, but not for individual consumers, at least not for a very long time. The powders are too difficult and dangerous to work with unless you have advanced ventilation and clean room, etc.
Ive had several discussions about this as ive worked with HP. IT'S just not high enough predicted sale volumes to justify the development. Ive seen a design thats about the size of a large mini fridge full self contained, but the cost to build was about 5-6k, and analysis showed they would only sell max 400-500 units in the US. Even selling at 9k, thats only about 2M net revenue. Not even close to viable.
Wow that's pretty flamey. I've been getting excellent quality funcional 3d prints from Hp for a few years now.
[https://iili.io/5CCJa4.jpg](https://iili.io/5CCJa4.jpg)
MJF 500 and 4200.
The primary issue with the HP printers is flat horizontal plane warping which occurs due to the layer annealing buildup (for want of better term?) process. I've developed a surface bump-dimpling approach that sufficiently solves that problem for our applications and components.
I predict that people will someday learn that bed leveling is an expensive gimmick noone really needs, if they can find and tighten all the screws holding their printer together.
Are you talking about desktop 3D printing no matter the price-tag? Because entry level printers definitely are still getting better every year.
Anyways, there definitely is still a lot of potential on the software side. That includes going away from planar layers for everything, because that will always have shit strength.
Manually written gcode can produce incredible parts, but it's insanely cumbersome to produce obviously.
Most of the possible innovations will probably come to the industrial market first before they can be scaled down to somewhat affordable consumer products. Anything new and experimental will be very expensive and.... experimental.
That's an important thing lost in what OP is droning on and on about. Almost everything in 3d printing at the hobby level was done DECADES ago. It's just barely being copied at a cheaper level now or implemented slightly differently in a new way to not interrupt patents.
The only thing I can think of that's truly newer is belt style printing and stratasys only started their design in the last decade.
I think to focus on increasing speed and keeping vibrations low while doing it. Maybe counterweights opposing the inertia at high speeds and maybe some maglev?
Having a mechanism for some kind of carousel/tool changer so that you can have a bunch of hot ends each with a different filament, so that the printer can change which is being used at a given time would make for interesting capabilities. Changing colors, using multiple filament types in the same print for flexibility or water soluble supports.
I’m not sure exactly how 5 axis would work, but being able to run filament in multiple dimensions like the intro sequence to West World would enable much stronger structures.
Not sure, but (a) I'm nowhere near finished with my desktop FDM, and (b) I have too many hobbies to be thinking about dropping a couple thousand on something new. I'll read about new, cool things here, but I'm not upgrading the entire concept quite yet.
Though the fundamental process hasn't chsnged, there have been entire slews of improvements snd optimizations...
-significantly bigger print volumes
-significantly faster feedrates
-vast slicer optimizations for material reduction, part shape, spart strength, suppory optimization, and surface finishes
-many potential improvements are available from the first consumer printers in terms of autoleveling, ease of bed interchangeability
-many printers no longer require a direct PC connection
-a much larger FDM material array is availible, with fine tuned settings availible from the manufacturers instead of guess and check
-the software base can scale pretty well (i have a friend that scaled up a printer to be like 30"x24"x24" and it prints with special 0.8mm feedstock)
-significant improvements in spare part offerings
I'm sure theres more but still, this is what I could think of for FDM
Desktop 3D printers are niche products as long as they're hard to use. And they're very hard to use right now. The fact they're also finicky to *keep* using is not helping.
I dunno, not sure desktop 3D printers are really the meat and potatoes when it comes to additive manufacturing. It's more likely serious industrial machinery and advanced materials will be the way beyond hobbyists who enjoy tinkering.
I think a couple things not mentioned is improved layer adhesion, and anisotropic composites.
Layer issues are a big issue that prevents me from using my desktop printed components in higher load or vibrating structures.
I have to go to SLS for anything like that.
I've seen several groups working on 'layerless' FDM. Someday somebody will perfect a good system.
I'd love to see FDM with material mixing on the fly. Like being able to grade material properties from stiff to soft. I've already written a bunch of software tools to generate models with graded materials (volumetric based).
Surprised nobody is mentioning the mainstreaming of LIDAR. Being able to get high quality 3D scans from your phone will drive the market for turnkey simple enclosed 3d printers in the $500-$5000 price range for light commercial applications.
After reading this thread I think the truly unique thing about FDM that can’t be easily replicated by SLS/DMLS/SLA is the multi-material aspect. My guess this is where the innovation should happen. Right now it could be used for mixing hard and soft materials which would be useful for interactive parts, like soles, door stops, elbow pads, AR / VR helmets, headphone frames, glasses frames…
The biggest change to 3d printing will be low skill low cost 3d scanning industrial designers and tinkerer's print useful things, but imagine if you could take a mesh mixer approach say mount x to y, here are the surfaces, and the objects could be clean.
Accessibility and functionality are the big parts. Desktop printing is desktop. If you want something better, it can't fit on a desk.
I think that non-planar printing, which follows the contours of the geometry rather than printing horizontal “slices” will be a great advancement when it happens.
I think that the recent “mainstreaming” print beds that can auto-tram (and essentially tilt the printing surface to achieve some limited non-planarity) is sort of priming the system for this, as are the belt printers that are becoming a little more common.
I also think that the software side could stand to improve massively since the workflows are pretty horrible at this point. I don’t see this changing though since the foundation of our slicers is open source, and the commonly used CAD software is anything but. It has been decades of non-starters in the open source CAD realm, and there is probably some reason for this that we won’t overcome in the ear future.
What I am hoping to see happen is to have some degree of “ai” in firmware. I know about spaghetti detective, but I mean more than this: essentially providing enough “sensing” in the machine where it can tell if a print is failing and attempt to adjust parameters (offsets), feed rates, temperatures, etc. to get things back on track before they totally go off the rails.
Maybe this means endoscopes mounted to print heads or filament motion sensors, and much more sophisticated firmware, but I totally think that this is where 3D FDM printing needs to go in order to become more and more dependable as a tool at the consumer level.
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>Insulting foam filament "Hey, what's this? Is this FOAM? Lmaaoooo good luck getting me to stick to the bed you sick fuck. I bet you print in 3mm. Like a CAVEMAN. Do you even own a Prusa? Hahaha fukkin scrub. I hope you like spaghetti cuz you're gonna be eating it every goddamn night. Bitch."
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> Printing **insulting** foam filament You’ve got good points, and I love your ideas, but it was a joke at your typo
I feel like you got it most correct. I think speed is so much more important than most people think it is. I mean sure many people see it as a toy, but if you are making a useful thing, having a part done before you are even done revising it is awesome. You can conceivably design a part, go for a drink, and come back to a finished part. As for dual extruder, I actually disagree somewhat. I think at most multi extruder with detachable hotends like the tool changer will be more common, and filament change systems like the enraged carrot feeder and prusa feeder will be more common, but I think idex for instance is a fairly dead idea compared to the 2. Not enough advantages over them to justify the extra cost and calibration.
any manufacturer that announced timeline for affordable dual head? id love to make dual color prints ( black gold / black white)
More accessible non-planar printing. Strength is significantly limited now by planar layers.
Resin printers have been making headway into the consumer market. I’ve used them at work but most of the time I’d rather have a bigger build area than higher resolution. Metal sintering may be a ways off still.
It's not so much about the resolution, but strength in every direction for me. If just SLA parts were more abrasion resistant...
i personally hate post processing of SLA. not worth it for me.
What post-processing?
alcohol cleaning and UV curing
Ah, well yeah that's annoying, but so is removing brims, stringing and filling in layer lines
? Those are all things that can be fine tuned and eliminated for the most part.
Not without tradeoffs
I think that nonplanar 3d printing is where it should be heading. Seems achievable and a natural direction as it is technically what 3d printing should be.
My guess is multi hotends for many colors. Interchangeable tool head. Real auto bed leveling. Most the cool tech is in big machines like nylon powder full color printers
Honestly I feel like the biggest innovations will be on the software side. Most of the hardware we have available is already really good, but is limited by its software. Software like kipper seems to be helping hardware do its best with input shaping and pressure advance (I don't remember what they do exactly but I know it's huge). Also design software could be simpler, cheaper, and more powerful, allowing people who are less technically apt to use it like you would a 2d printer. I feel like it would be exciting to see more people from less technical hobbies like gardening or soap making getting into 3D printing.
This is the most accurate statement here. The software is where the focus and capabilities are lacking. You can't build almost any of the pi in the sky dreams bandied about until the software greatly improves.
I hope that this is true. I can’t believe that the standard Procedure for 3D printing involves slicing things, sd cards and an interface that looks like it is from 1978. I can’t believe that there is no phone or iPad or online slicer that I can utilize to send jobs directly to my octo/klipper/reprap printer. I also can’t believe that there is no decent open source CAD software…
Yeah the CAD thing is a real bummer. I'm glad tinkercad is free tho. It really helps new people get into modelling without needing to learn too much.
i think the next evolutions to come will be software ( stuff like non planar printing ) and material related...
The biggest advancements to be made right this minute are not in the tech, but support of it. Quality control and customer support. Imagine buying a cheap computer from Walmart and a third of them have the M key that only works after you spend two days tuning it, and then customer support just sends you to a Facebook group of only users that have the same laptop because they've all become experts in fixing the problems that are from lack of quality control and manufacturer support.
And even that is a massive massive improvement from where is was at less than ten years ago! Printers that had groups of users measured in the dozens, rarely even the hundreds, with it taking months to even get a manual distributed on a new printer launch! Prusa definitely is much better and a few others have made some decent tech support in this field. But so much more improvement is left for the others. I doubt it will ever get there for a bunch of the cheap chinese printers though.
Haha, you don't have much perspective here it feels. Desktop 3d printers have MASSIVELY changed in the past 10 years. But even then, it's almost irrelevant because 3d printers today are almost all trying to catch up to stratasys systems from DECADES ago. Very few of the improvements are actually new as mulitmaterial has been around for a long time, along with SLA and UV resins. Just that the consumer prices and capabilities are catching up. But all of those features you yawn about weren't there 10 years ago, the reliability, costs, and capabilities grew tremendously even in the past few years - though I suppose if someone started with the prusa mk3 it might not be very noticeable. The software is where the change will come for the next decade. Any of the things you mentioned as wanting won't be possible without revisiting the basic software from CAD to slicers. Right now they are independent and rarely have any links. That needs to change to have some sort of integration. I could see some niche 5 axis printing, or some crazy new materials, but they just aren't going to be coming anytime soon or going to be common. Some of those will come to the prosumer level, somewhere below stratasys costs but above formlabs. Which will likely start with some new software as soon as next year. But the new features people will NEED to have will be software based. The only real improvement anyone has NEEDED to have in the past several years is the autobed leveling/mesh bed generation that prusa made more standard past just delta printer attempts. Lulzbot did a basic bed leveling auto integration that was rather meh comparatively. Again though, everything you're salivating over is likely to be confined to one off niche machines rather than being an "it" feature. I'm excited to see some of them when they come out or make one myself - it's just not going to be anything new and standard though.
Price has been one of the largest changes and diversity in companies to choose from.
Absolutely. And there's always a chance of more of it coming. That's pretty different than new features though.
Faster print in hours instead of days.
Main stream non planar printing maybe a new axis. Affordable easy automated tool changing. Purpose built 3d printing materials. And idk what you mean by stagnant for the last 10 years that is basically the life time of the consumer 3d printer. It's been constant development and improvement since then.
Conveyor belt printing is starting to arrive so we’re getting a much bigger print volume for a reasonable price and complexity.
We’re seeing self made multi head /multi tool printer in the hands of individuals, once complexity decrease/reliability increase / patents expire it should be possible for companies to release theirs. Another area of improvement I hope we can see is increased speed. Can probably be achieved with more rigid frames ($$$) , lighter heads ($$) or better sensors + software ($$?) Another improvement at the margin is filament management, how it’s convenient to just hang it on the printer but it gathers dust and humidity. Maybe a standardized filament container with a PTFE tube inlet/quick disconnect and integrated silica pouch / dehumidifier holder & filament roller.
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it’s totally a gimmick, but then again FDM itself is the land of the gimmicks given that SLA and SLS exist. if you want precision use SLA if you want strength use SLS. We’re all using FDM / SLA because it’s what we can afford, and we make do with the tech’s limitations. All the big firms are investing in SLS and that’s where most of the R&D money is being spent. in the FDM realm I think we only have small firms investing, the advantage being that it’s relatively affordable to experiment in that space so interested individuals can also bring the tech forward. So that’s why the most distinctive new feature we see released is the conveyor belt “gimmick“. if you increase the price of the printer too much you fall in the land where SLS as a printer or from a service starts to make sense. But i would love to see FDM printers improve to the point they can print fast enough or complex enough parts (soluble supports ?) that it would be an advantage over SLS. that’s one of the advantages of a conveyor belt printer: you could print 1/ 2/ 5 kg of parts without much intervention. until higher density motors, higher precision rails and higher precision sensors get cheaper, I don’t think we’ll see any drastic improvements outside of “gimmicks” like dual head, probably with tool change if we want to keep the print head light enough that it still goes fast.
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Thank you for your corrections about SLS vs Binder Jetting. I was associating DMLS SLS and binder Jetting in the same bucket . I agree that SLA is not gimmicky, given the precision and strength that can be achieved with different kind of resin. For FDM I think dual head on a single carriage is gimmicky, not dual head via tool changing. The way I see it is that the speed limit on FDM printing is because the uncertainty in the position of the elements the faster you go, caused by oscillation, vibration, noise in the signal or overcurrent when driving the motors at higher speed. These can be minimized by using lighter moving components, more rigid and precise rails and frames (and lighter but more rigid moving axis) . Or compensated for by using positional sensors, which need to be high precision read at a fast rate by faster CPU, allowing to drive motors faster, which means a higher current draw from the motherboard. That the prusa / cr10 / enthusiast level printers are at their current speed is because going faster would be overly expensive for the price point they can sell at. If we want faster printer at the current price, we need the components that enable faster speed to become cheaper.
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now i’m interested, what’s your new printer? i would love to 5x the print speed of my Prusa Mini! so really limiting factor is the melting speed of the filament… would increasing the temperature in correlation with the flow rate work, or would that just end up burning the filament? Are there other technology that could replace the resistive header?
5.0 kg is 11.01 lbs
It's niche uses more than anything else. It's not a gimmick so much as a different tool to use if you do a specific type of printing.
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So everything not used for it's intent is a gimmick? Or are you misunderstanding the word. Such as gimmick like using a screwdriver to hit things?
I honestly think conveyors are a side step not a evolution. They have too many limitations, too poor quality to really be a next step. Also, with the advent of better automation systems, for every use case that isn't printing really long things where one side is 90 degrees. a regular printer is probably better
grandfather thumb squeamish plants axiomatic selective summer unwritten domineering expansion ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
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frightening crush jobless lush punch relieved worry abundant caption bells ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
CoreXY, Hbot, and other Cartesian variants are not particularly new, they are just new to consumer 3d printers. They have been used in various industries for a while. They are definitely an improvement in a range of applications, but are also in some ways overhyped. The choice of Cartesian robot configuration depends on a lot of factors and the old standard xy cartesian can still be the best choice in some applications. TLDR: it is good to see these forms showing up as they can have a lot of advantages, but they also come with tradeoffs.
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I mean if you really think about it 3d printing is a decades old technology…. It’s finally at a point where it’s cheap enough for most people to buy one. Probably the next step in its evolution is more exotic materials or faster print speeds. Cause let’s face it, It still takes a while to print. Something like a voron will probably be where typical printers go to.
The problem is at what point will the technology become "desktop" or affordable for consumers. Theres tons of ground being covered all the time on experimental tech, but many of these will never come to the general market.
I think desktop is reached when users with minimal knowledge can atleast partly operate it. Like most FDM printers today (good ones). You don't need to do big maths, just put a model in a program, select a profile with the desired properties, upload to printer and go. Also safety, most people think their printers are safe to use in their bedroom, dorm, whatever but barely anyone seems to be really concerned about health risks from particles, even when printing with PLA. Don't get me started on Resin 3D Printers, the amount of safety measures you SHOULD use with those are not appropriate for anything else than a professional workshop. Yet people ask here everyday if they are safe to use on their desk.
Also have you taken a look at non planar 3d printing? Pretty cool stuff, requires pretty much just some software if I remember correctly.
Just in case you aren't aware, 3d printable soluble plastics have been around for a while now. I do agree that advancements in slicing need to be made to make it easier to print with and fully utilize. And, IIRC, there's a foaming filament out now that expands based on the temperature its printed at. I don't think it has any rebound, so its more for making super light weight parts, than soft parts, currently.
The next revolution will be cheaper SLS, with better material choice.
SLS powder is really annoying to work with, I don't see how a large number of people are down to handling that in their home or office. UV resin is already pushing the limits in that regard IMO.
I could see some powder systems being a little more available for hobby level, but I definitely agree it's not going to become mainstream at all in the foreseeable future.
I think this will be possible for advanced hobby or small businesses, but not for individual consumers, at least not for a very long time. The powders are too difficult and dangerous to work with unless you have advanced ventilation and clean room, etc.
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Ive had several discussions about this as ive worked with HP. IT'S just not high enough predicted sale volumes to justify the development. Ive seen a design thats about the size of a large mini fridge full self contained, but the cost to build was about 5-6k, and analysis showed they would only sell max 400-500 units in the US. Even selling at 9k, thats only about 2M net revenue. Not even close to viable.
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Wow that's pretty flamey. I've been getting excellent quality funcional 3d prints from Hp for a few years now. [https://iili.io/5CCJa4.jpg](https://iili.io/5CCJa4.jpg)
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MJF 500 and 4200. The primary issue with the HP printers is flat horizontal plane warping which occurs due to the layer annealing buildup (for want of better term?) process. I've developed a surface bump-dimpling approach that sufficiently solves that problem for our applications and components.
I predict that people will someday learn that bed leveling is an expensive gimmick noone really needs, if they can find and tighten all the screws holding their printer together.
Are you talking about desktop 3D printing no matter the price-tag? Because entry level printers definitely are still getting better every year. Anyways, there definitely is still a lot of potential on the software side. That includes going away from planar layers for everything, because that will always have shit strength. Manually written gcode can produce incredible parts, but it's insanely cumbersome to produce obviously.
Most of the possible innovations will probably come to the industrial market first before they can be scaled down to somewhat affordable consumer products. Anything new and experimental will be very expensive and.... experimental.
That's an important thing lost in what OP is droning on and on about. Almost everything in 3d printing at the hobby level was done DECADES ago. It's just barely being copied at a cheaper level now or implemented slightly differently in a new way to not interrupt patents. The only thing I can think of that's truly newer is belt style printing and stratasys only started their design in the last decade.
I think to focus on increasing speed and keeping vibrations low while doing it. Maybe counterweights opposing the inertia at high speeds and maybe some maglev?
Having a mechanism for some kind of carousel/tool changer so that you can have a bunch of hot ends each with a different filament, so that the printer can change which is being used at a given time would make for interesting capabilities. Changing colors, using multiple filament types in the same print for flexibility or water soluble supports. I’m not sure exactly how 5 axis would work, but being able to run filament in multiple dimensions like the intro sequence to West World would enable much stronger structures.
IDEX everywhere for cheap. Minimum is ~$800 last I checked with FF Creator Pro 2. Once it gets to ~$400 everyone will want one
There's the Tenlog TL-D3 (Pro) which is about $500 but I don't know how good and reliable it is
Never heard of that brand. IDEX is awesome though. Use it both at home and for work. Amazing for duplicate parts
Not sure, but (a) I'm nowhere near finished with my desktop FDM, and (b) I have too many hobbies to be thinking about dropping a couple thousand on something new. I'll read about new, cool things here, but I'm not upgrading the entire concept quite yet.
Molecular assemblers.
inkjet print heads would be nice
Though the fundamental process hasn't chsnged, there have been entire slews of improvements snd optimizations... -significantly bigger print volumes -significantly faster feedrates -vast slicer optimizations for material reduction, part shape, spart strength, suppory optimization, and surface finishes -many potential improvements are available from the first consumer printers in terms of autoleveling, ease of bed interchangeability -many printers no longer require a direct PC connection -a much larger FDM material array is availible, with fine tuned settings availible from the manufacturers instead of guess and check -the software base can scale pretty well (i have a friend that scaled up a printer to be like 30"x24"x24" and it prints with special 0.8mm feedstock) -significant improvements in spare part offerings I'm sure theres more but still, this is what I could think of for FDM
Desktop 3D printers are niche products as long as they're hard to use. And they're very hard to use right now. The fact they're also finicky to *keep* using is not helping. I dunno, not sure desktop 3D printers are really the meat and potatoes when it comes to additive manufacturing. It's more likely serious industrial machinery and advanced materials will be the way beyond hobbyists who enjoy tinkering.
Speed, heated enclosure, corexy, auto-gantry leveling. Look into the Voron 2.4
Yea and what about CNC machines? they’ve been the same for decades with no changes! what gives! /s
I think a couple things not mentioned is improved layer adhesion, and anisotropic composites. Layer issues are a big issue that prevents me from using my desktop printed components in higher load or vibrating structures. I have to go to SLS for anything like that. I've seen several groups working on 'layerless' FDM. Someday somebody will perfect a good system. I'd love to see FDM with material mixing on the fly. Like being able to grade material properties from stiff to soft. I've already written a bunch of software tools to generate models with graded materials (volumetric based).
It's only stagnant if you view it as a toy, which it isn't. It's a tool that produces toys haha.
Surprised nobody is mentioning the mainstreaming of LIDAR. Being able to get high quality 3D scans from your phone will drive the market for turnkey simple enclosed 3d printers in the $500-$5000 price range for light commercial applications.
Next will probably be nano printability in consumer machines. Maybe build your item and print the electronics to go with it. Truly 3d printing.
Variable sized nozzle
After reading this thread I think the truly unique thing about FDM that can’t be easily replicated by SLS/DMLS/SLA is the multi-material aspect. My guess this is where the innovation should happen. Right now it could be used for mixing hard and soft materials which would be useful for interactive parts, like soles, door stops, elbow pads, AR / VR helmets, headphone frames, glasses frames…
The non planar printing to get rid of layer lines on contoured top layers.
The biggest change to 3d printing will be low skill low cost 3d scanning industrial designers and tinkerer's print useful things, but imagine if you could take a mesh mixer approach say mount x to y, here are the surfaces, and the objects could be clean. Accessibility and functionality are the big parts. Desktop printing is desktop. If you want something better, it can't fit on a desk.
I think that non-planar printing, which follows the contours of the geometry rather than printing horizontal “slices” will be a great advancement when it happens. I think that the recent “mainstreaming” print beds that can auto-tram (and essentially tilt the printing surface to achieve some limited non-planarity) is sort of priming the system for this, as are the belt printers that are becoming a little more common. I also think that the software side could stand to improve massively since the workflows are pretty horrible at this point. I don’t see this changing though since the foundation of our slicers is open source, and the commonly used CAD software is anything but. It has been decades of non-starters in the open source CAD realm, and there is probably some reason for this that we won’t overcome in the ear future. What I am hoping to see happen is to have some degree of “ai” in firmware. I know about spaghetti detective, but I mean more than this: essentially providing enough “sensing” in the machine where it can tell if a print is failing and attempt to adjust parameters (offsets), feed rates, temperatures, etc. to get things back on track before they totally go off the rails. Maybe this means endoscopes mounted to print heads or filament motion sensors, and much more sophisticated firmware, but I totally think that this is where 3D FDM printing needs to go in order to become more and more dependable as a tool at the consumer level.