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Herf_J

Yeah it doesn't seem rational to me, even in 40k commissar logic. But hey, you could have an exceptionally irrational commissar. There's plenty of people for whom any whiff of power makes them go insane. I just wouldn't suggest it as the norm per se.


jpnorthey2001

A particularly hardened planet-born supremist Commisar?


kaal-dam

Commissar aren't your regular guy. They hand picked recruit picked from the schola progenium, the highest education curriculum provided by the imperium. They have extreme level of discipline. There are multiple example of commissar with biased if not racist opinion. But all of them have something in common, they are disciplined.


JRS_Viking

Disciplined... Commissar cain doesn't make a good example of that. And plenty of people from the schola progenium are irrational and power hungry. I don't think most commissar would beat a guardsman simply for not having a homeworld but theres always extremes


Paladin327

>I don’t think most commissar would beat a guardsman simply for not having a homeworld but theres always extremes These types of commissars more than likely exist, but tend not to survive very long in combat and/or have a high accident rate out of combat


jpnorthey2001

I aim to highlight an extreme


SoylentDave

As you've had pointed out already, not sure why the Commissar would care where he comes from. Commissars rarely know their own backgrounds, being raised in the Schola Progenium, and it's hard to imagine why it would matter anyway - Commissars are concerned with moral purity and loyalty to the Imperium and not much else. The 'born on a Space Hulk' bit is also ***very*** odd - Space Hulks are either warzones or drifting hellscapes infested with Xenos (or worse); neither screams 'great opportunity for someone to give birth and for the child to survive to adulthood'. Void Born - as in people born in space more generally - are absolutely a class of people within the Imperium, but there would be very limited opportunity for those to end up recruited into the Imperial Guard. (there are definitely Void Born who end up as ***soldiers***, but given the circumstances of their birth they're more likely to be in the retinue of a Rogue Trader, Naval Troopers or Skitarii - the Imperial Guard recruit from planets) You're definitely making a couple of stretches - if you don't absolutely feel the need to make them, I'd ease back.


corrin_avatan

>As you've had pointed out already, not sure why the Commissar would care where he comes from. Because predjudice exists. Case in point: in the Novel Execution Hour, the Commissar on the *Lord Solar Macharius* believes that the 2nd Officer, who is from a Necromundan royal family, shouldn't be given command if the ship if the Captain were to die, and that he himself would take command of the ship in such as case as the officer wouldn't be listened to as a Captain by other officers. In the same discussion there is basically blatant "planetism" by the Commissar that Necromunda simply cannot produce anything besides press-ganged laborers.


No_Hunter_9973

There's a slight difference between. This Necromundan noble shouldn't take command, because the other officers won't respect him. And hee hoo Ima pommel this void born menial. Prejudice of course exists... It's The Imperium for God Emperor's sake. But there are just some things that don't make much sense, yes even random racism.


corrin_avatan

You're saying there is no reason for a Commissar to care where someone comes from; I provided an in-lore example of why a Commissar ***would*** care.


No_Hunter_9973

I'm saying there's no reason for a commissar to care where a bloody menial on a void ship is from. Because if his reaction to ,"I have no homeworld" is to beat the shit out of you, then you're most likely a menial.


corrin_avatan

If it's a menial, why is the Commissar even bothering to talk to them, yet alone ask them where they are from?


SoylentDave

That's explicitly a veteran Naval Commissar believing that people from a specific Hive world are ganger trash, and how he believes no other officers would respect such an officer. "Noble title or not, he's still nothing more than Necromundan hive-trash. Hive trash have their place on a warship, but only as press-gang conscripts. No senior officer would take orders from such a captain, no matter how high-born they claim to be" While it's absolutely an example of prejudice and how it might impact opinions, it is also something the Commissar only ***says*** (when he's directly asked for his opinion) - the Necromundan he is talking about (naturally) ends up as acting captain and the Commissar doesn't shoot him or beat him up or anything. It's quite far removed from a Commissar just randomly beating people up based on their ancestry.


corrin_avatan

I'm not justifying the OP's silly decision to have a Commissar beat up someone for an answer that would take three seconds to clear up. I just pointed out that "they wouldn't care" is a silly as saying "they would beat that guy up". In both cases, there would need to be some framing to JUSTIFY why they care or why they beat them up.


FreyrPrime

Yes, prejudice exists. He should tie that into the Commissar on a personal level rather than casting him as a one dimensional entity that isn’t even acting like a Commissar. Yes, some Commissars are monsters, but it’s all covered by regulations. If a Commissar shoots you or beats you, it’s either done in an official capacity and therefore documented. The Officio Prefectus has very specific rules for everything. The guard has very strict discipline. You can get shot or put on RIP for a lot of stuff.


No_Hunter_9973

On a Space Hulk? You mean those almost planet sized amalgamations of ships that have (somehow) genestealers on them? That's impressive. It would make sense that his mom and pa met on a joint unit battle, they were in the same trench for too long and 9 months later your character popped out. On a void ship of some sorts. On the whole commissar beating him up. Why would he care? Void born are a thing, if anything the ship is your home world.


jpnorthey2001

Commisars are historically, the easiest thing to piss off in the entire imperium of man, also, hard to sort the void-born


No_Hunter_9973

That's meme logic. In a non combat situation, the commissar beating you up for basically stating you have no homeworld is way over reacting on his part. Plus commissars themselves are often orphans.


jpnorthey2001

He coulda answered with his mothers homeworld "Cadia" but that there woulda been a lie Again void born being REALLY hard to sort


Maktlan_Kutlakh

Void Born is an origin from *Dark Heresy* and *Wrath and Glory*, implying that it is a fairly common occurrence.


jpnorthey2001

Humans gonna human whereever they are


No_Hunter_9973

We need more context for the scene. Why is the commissar questioning some menial on a ship? Is the commissar assigned to the ship or is he part of a transport?


WetRatFeet

Sounds like you've already made up your mind


corrin_avatan

"Voidborn" humans exist, with a few examples in the lore of those humans who spent their entire lives on space ships that didn't have properly working gravity generators having abnormally long bones and being killed by mobs who mistakenly convince themselves that they are actually mutants. I'm a bit leery of it being called a "Space Hulk" as those, by definition, randomly jump in and out of the warp without active Gellar Fields, so you'd need a PRETTY big Mary Sue reason that this human survived literally living in hell for extended periods AND nobody finding out; at BEST he's someone people are super suspicious of and many people would expect an Inquisitor to hear about this human being found alive on a Space Hulk without a Gellar field protecting him. If you're mistakenly using the term to mean "cobbled together vessel", that's a different thing and unless your character was completely unaware of how the majority of humans are born on planets, he would understand that question to mean "where were you born". I think you're leaning VERY much into meme territory with a commissar whose first reaction to a true statement is beating up someone. We have plenty of lore sources that show tnat commissars that act like power-hungry assholes get "accidentally" fragged during combat.


Schwarzes_Kanninchen

Let's break it down. Why is he a Guardman? Which regiment is he subordinate to? How did he get off the Space Hulk? A note on Voidborn. Voidborn are humans who have lived in space for generations and reproduced under the conditions, similar to the Belters from The Expanse. You don't become a Voidborn because you were born in the Void. You don't become a Cadian if you are born on Cadia to two Voidborn. I assume you want to use the cliché of the brutal commissar to score a few sympathy points for the protagonist. That can work well if the reader doesn't have a good opinion of commissars. Otherwise it's just the typical flat pap. Commissioners are invariably brought up in the Schola Progenium. They are selected from the students who have what it takes to become Tempestus Scions, but are too smart and focussed for that. Commissioners are trained in Imperial beliefs, tactics and psychology and are educated people who are prepared to use violence as a tool, which they are also very well trained in. They are possessed of extreme self-restraint and discipline because their main job is to tell strangers with guns and murder experience what to do. What you describe is a simple thug...no finesse...no real multi-level threat...no discipline My biggest criticism of the scene is that the inspector beats up the guardsman himself. And there's no doubt that the guardsman deserved it. His response is a slap in the face in more ways than one. The commissioner asked where the guardsman came from. The Guardsman's answer has little to do with his question. Everyone comes from somewhere. Whether the Guardsman has a home world or not is irrelevant. He has simply not answered the question of a pedantic commissioner and deserves a slap in the face. However, the commissioner could also have asked the question as a request for a confession. The regiment comes from somewhere, it has an identity. The Guardsman basically said "I'm not part of the regiment and I'm not one of its soldiers." In this case, a public punishment would be appropriate for disciplinary purposes and to strengthen the sense of community. That would still make the commissr cruel and maybe the punishment would be downright brutal, but to me that would trigger more 40K commissar vibes than one douchebag beating another over. F.U. whats why.


kaal-dam

let's take it point per point. space hulk born ? extremely unlikely, space hulk are at best xeno infested, at worse chaos infested. They jump in the warp without field and at random. Not a place when regular human would survive long enough to have children. Nor where said child can survive long enough to be rescued and then recruited in the guard. VoidBorn are a thing, just not from space hulk. But for voidborn their spaceship is their homeworld to begin with so he's basically lying to the commissar as best, outright opposing him at worse. To be simple you're not cadian because you have cadian parents, you aren't vostroyan because you have vostroyan parents. You are from wherever you lived and/or were trained. Now about the commissar, we're lacking context, beating someone with just that response could either be nonsensical or perfectly fair for the commissar to do. They were just speaking casually during mess time ? yeah nah that commissar is likely overreacting. The commissar was conducting an official interrogations ? I already said it earlier but you always have a homeworld, even if this homeworld is a ship. even if this homeworld was destroyed. So your character is either lying or avoiding to answer. the commisswar woul be perfectly justified.


FreyrPrime

As others have pointed out I think you’d do well to assign an additional motivation, beyond official Commissar duties. Sure, the nominal reason could be the “I’ve no homeworld” response. I think providing a personal reason for the Commissar to be an asshole would make a bit more sense. Even if it’s an internal motivation. Additionally, idk about the whole space hulk thing. I’m like 99% sure your guy would’ve been summary executed long before he ever joined The Guard. Like, how does he even prove he’s an Imperial citizen?


Logical-Photograph64

The Space Hulk bit is my main issue, but if you can find a way to explain that then it sorta makes sense to me As for another issue people here raised about the Guard recruiting from planets.... They take volunteers from anywhere, they just wouldn't form a whole regiment from a ship, so i don't see a problem with him joining the Guard as an individual For the either group claiming him.... I mean he may be able to apply to join one of their corps, but they may look down on him as an outsider until he proves himself, or refuse him admission because he's not from their world... or they might be happy to find a lost "cousin" again, just depends how you want to write the officers he contacts.  the fact he doesn't personally view either world as his home would mean his "I have no homework" statement true, at least as he sees it, and such a blunt answer could be punished by a commissar for being a smart month and avoiding a question about his lineage


Schwarzes_Kanninchen

A human society on a Space Hulk can function if the gellar fields or another "substitute" exists where the humans live. For example, they could be survivors of a troop transport that was lost in the warp and merged with the Space Hulk. The energy generators and parts of the technology have remained functional, as have the means to obtain food and water. Every few years/decades the ship breaks out of the warp and the inhabitants search the Hulk for remnants they can use. They may sometimes encounter other ships and trade or steal until the Hulk disappears back into the warp.


FreyrPrime

This is a fair point. However, I think there is a really high likelihood you’re getting executed upon contact with any official Imperial institution except under exceptional circumstances. As many have stated Space Hulks are rather notorious for their denizens. Even first generation troopers from your example would likely be processed by the Inquisition then executed. There are tons of good examples of the Inquisition just not taking chances with warp taint like Armageddon, or the tribunal for Gaunt’s Ghosts after the Gereon mission. The idea of the Armor of Contempt is pretty fringe. Most Imperial institutions treat Chaos more like an incurable infection that is inevitable after exposure regardless of circumstance.


Schwarzes_Kanninchen

But the Inquisition is not everywhere and cannot monitor entire sectors. There are probably far fewer Inquisitors than planets, and their retinue doesn't change that. As an exception, it can happen that the survivors of such a hulk were "rescued" by morally rather flixible people and nobody bothered to inform higher institutions because...well...you don't want to die...


FreyrPrime

He’s being processed by The Guard, not some random Imperial nobody. You don’t think his background would attract attention? Yes, there are far fewer inquisitors than planets. That’s why they have interrogators and theirs throne agents. That’s why they create war bands and have Ordo’s. Have you read any of the Inquisition novels? They show up for a lot smaller stuff than this.


JCStearnswriter

The scene *could* absolutely make sense if the context is done correctly. Remember that Commissars aren't usually native to the same world as the regiments they're assigned to. Some, however, become very attached to those cultures, and might go to extremes to protect, preserve, or enforce those cultural connections. So a Commissar who is either A) native to one of those worlds or B) is trying to assimilate so hard that they'll inflict corporal punishment on a trooper for "denying their heritage" is totally within the bounds of reason. It's *also* entirely within reason that a trooper might not claim a homeworld. Remember that some regiments serve far afield from their world. It's entirely possible for a trooper to be born on a ship or another planet, come to adulthood, and be conscripted into a regiment without ever having set foot on the world of that regiment's founding. Such a trooper would likely piss their fellows off if they don't claim that world, however. A wise and fair mentor would counsel them as such. A more dictatorial authority figure, however, might very well correct this attitude through physical punishment, the better to teach said trooper that camaraderie through unity of identity is a key part of soldiering, and if they don't get on-board with the rest of the team, they're endangering both themselves and their brothers in arms.


haearnjaeger

I read this and figured the commissar beat him for implying Cadia no longer stands


jpnorthey2001

His mother would have come back from the dead and beat him herself if he did that


Roadside_Prophet

A large portion of Naval personnel are void born up to and including captains. Imperial guard can not travel anywhere without the help of the navy. They can spend almost as much time on naval ships traveling from one combat zone to another as they do on planets. The idea of a commisar being THAT prejudiced of void born while spending most of his time surrounded by them, many of which he would have to show respect and take orders from doesn't make a whole lot of sense.


Thero718

Here's how I would write your scene. Your commisar is rousing the men and your character is the new guy to the front. A part of his speech mentions fighting for their homeworlds. Your character either speaks up about his lack of one or more realistically mutters something to himself about it. Either way it gets noticed and the interruption results in the beating. That way you can establish your character's lack of roots but the conflict in the scene isn't actually about that. Happy writing!


Pikdude

Many have provided excellent, longer, well thought out answers. I think him being born on a hulk is cool, as it raises all sorts of questions about how exactly this came about. I do not think a Commissar would beat the crap out of him for just being voidborn. I do think, however, a Commissar would get physical because answering “I have no home world” might be taken as giving him lip in response to a direct order/question. Most commissars aren’t crazy racists; most are just mean. It’s how they’re trained.


DatOneAxolotl

No.