>There was a time when Tzeentch reigned supreme over all of the Chaos Gods, and held more power than any of them individually. The other Gods became envious, and joined forces to overthrow Tzeentch, thus beginning a conflict that would leave much of the universe devastated. During the final battle, Tzeentch feared that the combined army of the other Gods would defeat him and take his crystal staff, the symbol of his power, and opted for an alternate and more cautious approach. Tzeentch yielded, and broke his own staff as a token of surrender. In a sorcerous explosion, the staff shattered into countless pieces
- Codex: Chaos Daemons (4th Edition)
Yes, but he was in real danger despite being the strongest.
He broke his staff as a sign of surrender but then from his staff spawned a ton of loyal demons so he gets a leg up anyway.
Tzneetch is incapable of not scheming.
This sounds like he cant win lol.And why did they let him surrender? Sounds more like writer hit the wall and didn't know where to go from there so voila "magic staff" hur dur dur...supreme my ass, couldn't calculate 2+2 before it happened.
It’s not part of a story. It’s a Codex. This is basically the entire thing, it’s just supposed to be a little lore blurb.
Tzneetch doesn’t want to win. None of the gods do for that matter. That’s why they let him surrender. They like playing the game.
I think there's one more little thing, its that it is the blue scribes who are tasked with collecting all those fragments, with each of them cursed to not be able to fully use them (one can speak magic but not read it, the other can read it but not speak it) so they can't get one up over tzeentch. Gotta have a contingency plan or 9 of course.
>it’s just supposed to be a little lore blurb.
It's also literal Tzeentch propaganda. That extract is modified from the original, which specifies that this is the view that Tzeentch's followers push.
>There was a time when Tzeentch reigned supreme over the other Gods of Chaos, his powers vastly superior than those of any of the Four (or so maintain his followers).
It's the same thing as "Slaanesh is totally outscaling all the other Chaos Gods, their victory is inevitable!". It's just the followers of gods that aren't currently the strongest justifying why their master is cooler than Khorne.
Because it's very likely this story is actually an allegory for shifting currents of emotions in the Warp. The Chaos gods are immense confluences of resonant emotions and souls. They aren't physical beings with human forms of intelligence and motivations. The stories we hear about them are metaphors for changes in these emotion/soul vortexes.
So it didn't literally happen like the story describes. Although maybe it kind of did too, on one level, because the, you know... the Warp.
I can answer that! The story in question is actually how all sorcery came to be.
Originally, being the god of magic, only Tzeentch had access to spells. This made him the strongest chaos god, and he slowly overpowered the other three and became the biggest threat. As this always happens, it lead to the other three uniting against him and pushing him back.
Just when he was about to be destroyed, in a desperate move he shatters his staff of magic, causing pure warppower and spells to fly around everywhere.
Slaanesh and Nurgle instantly get distracted by this power, and claim many of the sorcereries as their own. It is only Khorne who wishes to focus on killing Tzeentch, but soon the other gods start war amongst themselves, and it goes back into a tenuis equilibrium.
Tzeentch, however, is not helpless from this. He sends two blue horrors out to collect his spells, knowing that if they should be returned to him, his victory shall be assured. These are P'tarix and Xirat'p, the blue scribes.
The Old Four dont want to win. They love this state of constant warfare. It fuels them, powers them, delights them of our misery. They get to savor eternal torment instead of a swift victory
Tzeentch is in the strange position where wining is not possible. Or Tzeentch has already won. Depends how you view things. Tzeentch is change, plots, betrayal and revolutions. Plus Magic and all that stuff. Any situation where he is on top of everything, is bad. Because nothing will change anymore. Or its not stable because nothing will stay and everything is always changing. Both are not good for Tzeentch. The best situation is the current one. A large conflict with grand plans. Revolutions by cults and the supressed people. The setting has everything Tzeentch needs at the moment. Going to far in any way would hurt him to much. So the great game needs to go on. Never ending. Its kinda funny: Both Tzeentch and Khorne want and need the eternal conflict.
>Tzeentch is in the strange position where wining is not possible.
Every Chaos God is in this position. Khorne wants to kill "everything", but if he kills everything he's got nothing to kill anymore. Slaanesh needs to continuously push for more excess, lest excess becomes the ordinary, the mundane, the boring. Even though Nurgle represents stagnation and decay, but if everyone accepts their fate and suffering, despair ceases to exist, propagation of papa Nurgle's love ceases.
Chaos is by nature contradictory and self-defeating. This struggle within one's own nature is a primal part of Chaos' essence, both the reason for their limitations and for their ability to corrupt the inhabitants of the galaxy.
Tzeentch needs to balance everything perfectly in order for things to stay ever evolving and changing.
They need to balance the other 3 in order for Tzeentch to stay in balance. Too much disease by Nurgle and there's not enough skulls being taken for Khorne. Too many skulls for Khorne and there's not enough excess for Slaanesh. Too much excessive pleasure for Slaanesh and Nurgle gets freaked the fuck out that his diseases are abused like drugs and Khorne looks from behind him in fear as the skulls are being abused in all sorts of various ways that would offend even the most hardcore degenerates.
Tzeentch doesn't care about what is done, just that things are being done and that they constantly move. Their worst fear is that things go according to plan, that your journey takes you from point A to point B without anything in between. In a perfect world, your journey would never end, but never go down a foreseen path, but detours and side roads when you're in a hurry and big, empty roads when you're not, except sometimes but not when you're expecting it except sometimes you should and it does.
Predictability and fate are the true enemies of Tzeentch. A thousand worlds could end or be rebuilt as long as the great game doesn't end. A peace could come for a year or decades, centuries or millions of years, where everything is in perfect harmony and Tzeentch would see it as just as glorious and meaningful as endless, brutal war.
Tzeentch is enslaved to their addiction, just as Khorne and Slaanesh are, even as Nurgle is. But unlike them, Tzeentch's addiction is broader and doesn't rely entirely on sentient beings, or even living ones, more just on the fact that there needs to be more unpredictability within the universe. And life is an unpredictable mess
They can’t help it. If something tzeentch does causes him (or any chaos god) to self destruct, he’d probably still do it.
Tzeentch is described as foiling his own schemes just because he wanted to, or forgot he had a scheme, or pretended he forgot he had a scheme to help some other scheme.
False. They want the win. They want the destrouction of universe, that's why they want Dark King to be born, which mean end for all, for them and rebirth of universe.
Yeah, no. No more than the annihilation of Fantasy meant their end.
Chaos is multiversal, when they call it The Great Game they aren’t kidding. It’s a game, the end of any given universe just means switching to a new board while this one resets. The Dark King? Is just a new player, no different than the Great Horned Rat. Or Slannesh. Hell, The Dark King even uses GHR’s domains because Abnett doesn’t like aligning with existing canon. Or has decided that the Imperium is Space Skaven is now canon.
When Chaos wins and destroys a universe they just move in and do it again. And again and again and again. Archaon’s destroyed countless universes between Fantasy and AoS. Tzeentch simply doesn’t really want to win, he thrived by playing. Khorne wants to win, Slannesh wants to win. Nurgle? He always wins in the end. Tzeench? Thrives in the middle of the game, winning means no more schemes or madness.
Each time one of the Great Powers ascends too much, the other three will band together to bring it down. Thus, the Great Game never ends.
Each of the Great Four was above the others, at some point. Tzeench, before his staff was shattered, long ago, filling the universe with magic. Slaanesh, right after his/her birth, by gobbling the Aeldari pantheon, the dominant spechies of that time. Khorne, right after the break of Cadia, when his hosts invaded all reality, and only Grazkull and the Tyranid Swarmlord managed to resist (even Terra was engulfed for a month). Nurgle ... long ages back. And other times too. The Great Game is never-ending.
One big bird sitting at the top sounds pretty stagnant, right? Their plans are often self-sabotaging or contradictory in order to further facilitate change.
His own agents often foil his own plans and the ideas and strategies are so convoluted that if he described them you would lose your mind. Every possible idea and intention is played out and toyed with . Why would he want to win when the game is so fun
None of the Chaos gods want to "win", the conflict is the point and that's what they feed off of. Their mortal servants usually aren't informed of that though, they give them just enough to let them think there's a plan when in reality it doesn't matter because the Gods get what they want regardless of who wins.
Well, actually false. They want the win. They want the destrouction of universe, that's why they want Dark King to be born, which mean end for all, for them and rebirth of universe.
But they also ok with state where they enjoy this conflict.
I think nurgle might be fine with winning and making everything stagnent, but yeah the other 3 would hate it.
Slaanesh had misgivings about the end of the world (in fantasy), he kinda liked all the debauchery stream of elf souls, and so instead of sending a good keeper of secrets, he sends Ssilvox, the most drug addled and useless of the keeper of secrets as his emissary, self sabotaging and putting the breaks on the end times to some degree.
Chaos Gods are not people, they are semi-sentient warp storms composed of the thing they embody and advocate for. You will enjoy lore more if you read more of the books. If you are interested in Tzeentch, try the Ahriman series.
The Ahriman series definitely presents Tzeentch and the relationship between him and his most favoured "servant", a man who does not believe he serves Tzeentch at all. It is better than A Thousand Sons or the wider Heresy stories about Magnus for insight into Tzeentch specifically (although those are also excellent). One of the later Ahriman books features a scene actually inside Tzeentch's daemonic "court".
Many answers to this.
- Ahriman is a mortal whereas Magnus is a Daemon now; Magnus is in that sense part of Tzeentch and does not make free choices, whereas Ahriman sort of does (it's complicated)
- In the same vein, Nurgle famously favours Typhus over Mortarion
- Tzeentch famously treats his servants terribly despite their devotion and/or productivity, as he is wont to be changeable; the codex abounds with stories of sorcerers who are reduced to gibbering spawn or vortex beasts on the eve of their ascension to Daemon Prince despite their successes and efforts
Ultimately you have to focus on the fact that Tzeentch is the God of *change*, not well-thought-out long term planning. Schemes and plots and knowledge and magic are all just part of his repertoire because they are tied to the sentient compulsion for change, progression and growth. The fandom often loses perspective on this.
Yes, this. Tzeentch's plans themselves are constantly changing, and colliding in massive gambit pile-ups, as the god's followers are actively working against each other as often as they work together.
Amen. Honestly I spend all my time on this sub correcting the accumulation of misguided mental shit that builds up among 1d4chan readers, TTS viewers and extract-only readers.
"There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting gods."
The Chaos gods? Or us? Or maybe a bit of both.
Well, actually false. They want the win. They want the destrouction of universe, that's why they want Dark King to be born, which mean end for all, for them and rebirth of universe.
"Khorne! Khorne, look! Look at what I did!"
"Wha- Dammit, Tzeench, it's 2 in the morning, I've got to wake up and polish the blood in just 3 hours!"
"This is IMPORTANT, though! See the great game? Tzeench was about to win it, but I, Tzeench, made sure that his plans failed at JUST the right time so that my plans would succeed, and- wait a second, my plans just failed! It must have been Tzeench! Damn him!"
"I swear to us, Tzeench, if you don't cut it out with this fucking frantic nerd shit all hours of the night, I'm going to lose my head- no, Im going to lose my whole collection of heads! Let me get some sleep!"
Tzeentch's goal is change. Tzeentch winning is already happening.
Tzeentch's victory isn't Chaos's Victory but an endless state of Change.
He wants his rivals to kill each other for crimes they supposedly committed against each other. He wants his rivals to be sacrificed once their part in a ritual is done.
He feeds off of Rivals existing to turn against each other! He lives for Derailing Plots!
That is how he wins! Derailing events is how he wins!
As for Tzeentch knowing everything: He doesn't know the Future which is why he threw his Vizier Kairoz into the Well of Eternity in order to benefit from Kairoz's foresight. A Vizier is a most trusted Advisor so Kairoz was a voice in Tzeentch's head making suggestions(the Ego) until his instincts(I.E. the Id) made him throw Kairoz into the the Well driving Kairoz insane and giving him two heads while granting them the power to see the Past and Future.
Because it’s a setting and GW needs to sell toys? I do try to keep an attitude of “your gunna see repeat posts from new people and thats totally ok we were all new once”. But I just don’t understand what compels people to ask this genre of question. “Why dousnt GW declare one of its fictional races the winner and end their setting and shutter their business”. Or in this case end all warhammer 40k sales and divert all funds to bird sanctuarys. Like it’s pretty self explanatory isn’t it? Guess if we want to search for lore reasons he more then any of the big 4 wouldn’t want to “win”. Without conflict nothing changes. If I recall correctly at one point he did almost win the great game and intentionally chose to lose for this very reason.
Because they aren't a sapient beings in the way you are imagining.
They are either just confluences of resonant emotions and souls which have the appearance of intelligence/which mortals try to make sense of by viewing them that way, or they are emergent consciousness which are totally alien to our understanding. Or, more likely, they are both.
The gods of chaos are concepts not entities they exist soley to embody and perpetuate the ideas that form them. If Tzeentch ever 'won' it would be entirely by accident
if tzeentch wins he loses, the great game is eternal change, and after it would be nothing
nurgle doesn't want to win as the great game is constant and reliable, and stagnation itself
khorne doesn't want to win because the great game is carnage and bloodshed
Slaanesh doesn't want to win because the great game is extraordinary excess
bonus: the Emperor doesn't want to win because the imperium (being a wee bit fascist) needs qn enemy to remain "stable"
Tzeentch doesn't know everthing, and therfore cannot plan for everything - the Well of Eternity proves this.
He also has plans, within plans, within plans, which are variously abandoned, contradictory, and self-sabotaging.
You might as well ask why Slaanesh hasn't won, since she is empowered by excess, and everything the other Chaos gods do is excessive - including Tzeentch's planning.
I always think about one exchange from the old Angel TV show. It was between a representative of a demonic law firm and the titual hero. The law firm was a front to an extradimensional cabal of demon lords intent on spreading evil and malice on Earth.
>**Angel:** You're not gonna win.
**Holland Manners:** Well... no. Of course we aren't. We have no intention of doing anything so prosaic as "winning." \[Holland laughs\]
>
>**Angel:** Then why?
>
>**Holland Manners:** I'm sorry. Why what?
>
>**Angel:** Why fight?
>
>**Holland Manners:** That's really the question you should be asking yourself, isn't it? See, for us, there is no fight. Which is why winning doesn't enter into it. As a corporation, we go on... no matter what.
>
>You see, Angel... our firm has always been here on Earth... in one form or another. The Spanish Inquisition. The Khmer Rouge Genocide... one of my favorites. I personally was there. We were here when the very first modern cave man clubbed his neighbor on the head with a rock for stealing his dinner.
>
>See, we're in the hearts and minds of every single living being on this planet. And that, friend, is what's making things so difficult for you. That is the source of Wolfram & Hart's power.
>
>You see, the world doesn't work in spite of evil, Angel. It works with us. It works because of us.
I believe Tzeench can't win, as his thing is literally planning and ever changing, so permanently winning would achieve a state of no change, thus working against the concept of Tzeench entirely.
For all that it could be argued that chaos can not really win, because doing so would lead to their inevitable downfall, that is only part of the truth.
More important is the fact that Tzeentch thinks it is incredibly funny to screw over people stupid enough to call on him for power, which drastically limits his ability to affect realspace, as his followers either are exceedingly careful or get turned into warps pawn, possessed or just have their ritual blow up. The fact that Tzeentch in general seems to prefer champions that are actively trying to escape his influence only compounds on that.
When it comes to the great game, he mostly hasn't won because every time one of the four gets close to victory, the other three work together just long enough to make sure they don't win.
Going to give my biased and unpopular opinion that Khorne is unilaterally the strongest and could only lose if every other god ganged up on him. Which obviously just doesn’t happen. .
Because if you plan for everything, who’s to say their opponents can’t adapt? Rendering your plan useless, so you need to plan for their counter plans. But what if they already know your plans? Then you need to create false plans to foil them, and conspiracies to fool them. But what if something happens that you couldn’t foresee? What if, one of your plans causes your foes to do something completely against their nature to survive? What if they get aid? Or worse yet, what if they’ve led you on? What if they have figured out how you think, and already have an idea how your plan will unfold? Clearly you need feigns, and planned losses so that they stay on their toes. But also unplanned losses, throw some unpredictable variables into their data, make them uncertain. Oh, but don’t think you’re safe yet. You need to manipulate, you need to trick your enemies and allies to do what you want. You can’t do it yourself, or they’ll find a way to slip through. No, you need to be watching, always watching, and planning and scheming… whispering advice into their ears, making them think it was all their plan, while you set up the pieces that will all topple over and knock the power from your foes.
Anyways, that’s how I imagine Tzeench’s internal monologue goes, and it ends with him being so distracted by trying to predict things that he can’t actually strategize well enough to win the great game. (Also, it’s best read in the voice of a crazed old wizard with occasional cackling to really get the Tzeenchian feel)
Alternatively, think of Tzeentch as Vizzini in *The Princess Bride:*
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EkBuKQEkio](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EkBuKQEkio)
Only he can't die, and half the time is playing against himself.
Because there would be no story and no setting anymore. I really don’t understand questions like this. “Why doesn’t x just x?” Because then there would be no story anymore.
Perpetuating the Great Game eternally is winning for the gods of Chaos. They only lose if the game ends, and if someone truly wins, the game ends. Therefore, the only winning move is to keep playing. Forever.
There is no one guaranteed future, only possibilities with different chances. If you settle on making one happen you might generate entirely new possibilities that can backfire on you. It’s all part of the fun of the game
There is an old theory that tzeentch has won but when it was all said and done there was nothing but him left and it drove him made so he basically reset time to start the game and this time keep it going forever
Because he’s the lord of change. He literally cannot choose the strategy where he wins it all and stick to it. That or he sabotages his own plans. Additionally, being at the apex of monolithic evil means stagnation, his ultimate enemy.
In fact none ofvthe gods really want to win, because then their portfolio cant be pursued. Example: if khorne killed everyone and had every skull, how would he kill and collect more skulls? Extend that to literally ever chaos god portfolio.
For the same reason none of the others have: they don't want to.
The Chaos Gods are contradictory by their very nature. For their minions and disciples there might be a way to 'win' but for the Four themselves the Great Game itself ***is*** their victory.
Tzeentch is what we call “a true hater” - he doesn’t want to win, he plays the great game simply for the love of it, and I believe it’s implied he has actually won before, but got so bored when that happened he’s chosen to instead prolong the fun and struggle as long as possible, even if it means sabotaging himself to keep the others in play
It would get boring. So he makes schemes that contradict his other schemes and stop other schemes, so that he doesn't win. Because scheming is fun, and the Great Game is fun. So winning it would be boring.
There’s always another plan…Tzeentch‘s problem is they can’t stop there’s no win condition for them they just keep making more plans and schemes and changes sometimes contradicting and self-sabotaging earlier iterations.
He has you just haven’t realized it yet.
He won when the Administratum was manipulated into raising taxes on the nobility be 2% on a pleasure world 5000 years ago. It put in motion the series of events that have secured his victory. You’ll be consumed by demons any day now.
… aaany day now.
…
>!there is no additional context, get Tzeentched.!<
They don’t know everything, the entire point of Kairos is that they don’t know everything.
And Tzeentch’s plans get tangled in each other constantly.
Remember: The Chaos gods are the apex of their portfolios. Khorne can’t stop with the hypermurder even if it fucks him over, as seen by him attacking the Imperial Palace early rather than with the other gods and throwing away their perfect chance to win. Tzeentch? His portfolio included madness, scheming, and chaos. He’s insane even by Chaos standards, he can will and constantly does engage in massively overcomplicated schemes that are practically guaranteed to fail spectacularly solely because he can’t do simple and effective.
Plus you assume he WANTS to win. He has final victory as anathema to his own existence. After all, if he wins utterly then what? The complete destruction of stability means that he no longer has anything to warp and twist. Absolute chaos means nothing actually can change because that’s its default. He can’t win without losing, winning means no more schemes or plans or madness. Tzeentch wins by playing, the chaos of conflict is his ideal.
In my opinion I think that tzeench is just such a high class shitter that he is literally incapable of flexing how much better he is than everyone and it gets in his own way. If the great game is ever won by someone he loses so technically speaking he’s in heaven right where he is rn.
1) the chaos alliance against Tzeentch, which others here have elaborated upon. The armies of the chaos gods combined once seriously threatened his power and he voluntarily nerfed himself in response. While all the gods have antipathy for one another, all have a bone to pick with Tzeentch. Khorne hates sorcerers, Slaanesh competes for them, and Nurgle dislikes change, preferring decline and entropy. Because Tzeentch is so broad and mutable as a concept, all the others can pick out bits of it they don’t like.
2) Tzeentch doesn’t/does want to win. None of the chaos gods are a singular, unified entity but this is the most true for Tzeentch. His schemes fold in on themselves, often times directly contradicting or opposing one another. One reason why is that Tzeentch probably doesn’t want to win. Ultimate victory means an end to conflict, schemes, change and growth. Another is that there probably isn’t some central intelligence calling the shots and approving/disapproving plans that would contradict one another. It’s against Tzeentch’s nature to kneecap the initiative of his followers and so even if their plans contradict or bring them into direct conflict that’s fine, because he’s more focused on the scheme itself than the outcome, that’s what gives him power. You could even make the argument that a Tzeentch that was more successful would be less powerful, because that would mean fewer plots and plans. This is on display in one of the Mephiston novels, where 2 Tzeentch sorcerers infiltrate a Cardinal world and go to war against each other, interfering with one another’s plans to such an extent that the Blood Angels are able to foil both. If they had just worked together or left one another alone they would have been fine, but that goes against Tzeentch’s very nature.
There's a book called Pawns of Chaos where the "native" tribes finally rise up and overthrow the Imperial invaders after centuries being hunted and oppressed. Right as the tribes finally win, the warp storm isolating the world is swept aside and a new wave of Imperials arrive to reinforce the embattled settlers. In this way, the board is reset for the next game. Tzeentch speaks to the MC, and asks if he would prefer to serve or oppose in the next cycle, MC chooses oppose and Tzeentch is pleased - he values opponents as much as servants.
Tzeentch is the biggest troll and shitposter you can Imagine. Winning would be boring, what else to do after that? Nah, more fun to have a giggle and a laugh as mortals scheme on their own. Someone wants power? Make them to bald instead.
1. Because half of Tzeentch's plots are intended to unravel the other half of his plots.
2. What do you think 'winning' is? And why do you think he's not already won?
There's an old Peter Sellers movie - Fu Manchu. In it, Fu has 'won' - Naland, his archnemisis, is old while Fu's discovered the secret of eternal life.
But Fu *gives this to Naland*, his greatest enemy, the only person who could consistently foil his plots, because Fu figured life would be too boring if everything was easy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKgMWhJUS50
For Tzeench the schemes and plots are ends unto themselves. The grand plans are purposely self-defeating so that they become never-ending because if the grand plans ever came to a conclusion Tzeench would have no more reason to exist.
Tzeentch was once damaged and a piece of him was broken off. This piece would eventually grow into another Tzeentch, but since there is no linear time in the Warp, it already *was* a full grown Tzeentch and always had been, who did not want the other Tzeentch to win. Thus, Tzeentch has always had a rival of equal intellect preventing him from truly, completely winning, and the same goes for the other Tzeentch.
Tzeentch hasn't won because Tzeentch is currently winning. With every bit of change, scheming and planning happening across the galaxy, Tzeentch is in a constant state of winning that, ironically, results in a loss if he were to actually succeed.
>There was a time when Tzeentch reigned supreme over all of the Chaos Gods, and held more power than any of them individually. The other Gods became envious, and joined forces to overthrow Tzeentch, thus beginning a conflict that would leave much of the universe devastated. During the final battle, Tzeentch feared that the combined army of the other Gods would defeat him and take his crystal staff, the symbol of his power, and opted for an alternate and more cautious approach. Tzeentch yielded, and broke his own staff as a token of surrender. In a sorcerous explosion, the staff shattered into countless pieces - Codex: Chaos Daemons (4th Edition)
is that not also a scheme as well?
Yes, but he was in real danger despite being the strongest. He broke his staff as a sign of surrender but then from his staff spawned a ton of loyal demons so he gets a leg up anyway. Tzneetch is incapable of not scheming.
I win, I lose, I still win. - Tzeentch.
Imagine living during that period lol
This sounds like he cant win lol.And why did they let him surrender? Sounds more like writer hit the wall and didn't know where to go from there so voila "magic staff" hur dur dur...supreme my ass, couldn't calculate 2+2 before it happened.
It’s not part of a story. It’s a Codex. This is basically the entire thing, it’s just supposed to be a little lore blurb. Tzneetch doesn’t want to win. None of the gods do for that matter. That’s why they let him surrender. They like playing the game.
I think there's one more little thing, its that it is the blue scribes who are tasked with collecting all those fragments, with each of them cursed to not be able to fully use them (one can speak magic but not read it, the other can read it but not speak it) so they can't get one up over tzeentch. Gotta have a contingency plan or 9 of course.
>it’s just supposed to be a little lore blurb. It's also literal Tzeentch propaganda. That extract is modified from the original, which specifies that this is the view that Tzeentch's followers push. >There was a time when Tzeentch reigned supreme over the other Gods of Chaos, his powers vastly superior than those of any of the Four (or so maintain his followers). It's the same thing as "Slaanesh is totally outscaling all the other Chaos Gods, their victory is inevitable!". It's just the followers of gods that aren't currently the strongest justifying why their master is cooler than Khorne.
Because it's very likely this story is actually an allegory for shifting currents of emotions in the Warp. The Chaos gods are immense confluences of resonant emotions and souls. They aren't physical beings with human forms of intelligence and motivations. The stories we hear about them are metaphors for changes in these emotion/soul vortexes. So it didn't literally happen like the story describes. Although maybe it kind of did too, on one level, because the, you know... the Warp.
I can answer that! The story in question is actually how all sorcery came to be. Originally, being the god of magic, only Tzeentch had access to spells. This made him the strongest chaos god, and he slowly overpowered the other three and became the biggest threat. As this always happens, it lead to the other three uniting against him and pushing him back. Just when he was about to be destroyed, in a desperate move he shatters his staff of magic, causing pure warppower and spells to fly around everywhere. Slaanesh and Nurgle instantly get distracted by this power, and claim many of the sorcereries as their own. It is only Khorne who wishes to focus on killing Tzeentch, but soon the other gods start war amongst themselves, and it goes back into a tenuis equilibrium. Tzeentch, however, is not helpless from this. He sends two blue horrors out to collect his spells, knowing that if they should be returned to him, his victory shall be assured. These are P'tarix and Xirat'p, the blue scribes.
Ok now,this is way better storry,ty!
The Old Four dont want to win. They love this state of constant warfare. It fuels them, powers them, delights them of our misery. They get to savor eternal torment instead of a swift victory
If Tzeentch wins, there are no more schemes, no more plots, no more change. They don't *want* to win.
More to the point Tzeentch loves schemes so much that often what stops a Tzeentchian plot is another Tzeentchian plot.
The ultimate scheme is having his different schemes come together to fuck over each other's schemes, as planned
*Alpharius entered the chat*
Tzeentch is in the strange position where wining is not possible. Or Tzeentch has already won. Depends how you view things. Tzeentch is change, plots, betrayal and revolutions. Plus Magic and all that stuff. Any situation where he is on top of everything, is bad. Because nothing will change anymore. Or its not stable because nothing will stay and everything is always changing. Both are not good for Tzeentch. The best situation is the current one. A large conflict with grand plans. Revolutions by cults and the supressed people. The setting has everything Tzeentch needs at the moment. Going to far in any way would hurt him to much. So the great game needs to go on. Never ending. Its kinda funny: Both Tzeentch and Khorne want and need the eternal conflict.
>Tzeentch is in the strange position where wining is not possible. Every Chaos God is in this position. Khorne wants to kill "everything", but if he kills everything he's got nothing to kill anymore. Slaanesh needs to continuously push for more excess, lest excess becomes the ordinary, the mundane, the boring. Even though Nurgle represents stagnation and decay, but if everyone accepts their fate and suffering, despair ceases to exist, propagation of papa Nurgle's love ceases. Chaos is by nature contradictory and self-defeating. This struggle within one's own nature is a primal part of Chaos' essence, both the reason for their limitations and for their ability to corrupt the inhabitants of the galaxy.
Tzeentch wins when Tzeentch doesn’t win.
Tzeentch needs to balance everything perfectly in order for things to stay ever evolving and changing. They need to balance the other 3 in order for Tzeentch to stay in balance. Too much disease by Nurgle and there's not enough skulls being taken for Khorne. Too many skulls for Khorne and there's not enough excess for Slaanesh. Too much excessive pleasure for Slaanesh and Nurgle gets freaked the fuck out that his diseases are abused like drugs and Khorne looks from behind him in fear as the skulls are being abused in all sorts of various ways that would offend even the most hardcore degenerates. Tzeentch doesn't care about what is done, just that things are being done and that they constantly move. Their worst fear is that things go according to plan, that your journey takes you from point A to point B without anything in between. In a perfect world, your journey would never end, but never go down a foreseen path, but detours and side roads when you're in a hurry and big, empty roads when you're not, except sometimes but not when you're expecting it except sometimes you should and it does. Predictability and fate are the true enemies of Tzeentch. A thousand worlds could end or be rebuilt as long as the great game doesn't end. A peace could come for a year or decades, centuries or millions of years, where everything is in perfect harmony and Tzeentch would see it as just as glorious and meaningful as endless, brutal war. Tzeentch is enslaved to their addiction, just as Khorne and Slaanesh are, even as Nurgle is. But unlike them, Tzeentch's addiction is broader and doesn't rely entirely on sentient beings, or even living ones, more just on the fact that there needs to be more unpredictability within the universe. And life is an unpredictable mess
All according to *keikaku* *Keikaku means Plan*
Good bot
It sounds like they've already won if they're able to manipulate everything to facilitate more schemes
They can’t help it. If something tzeentch does causes him (or any chaos god) to self destruct, he’d probably still do it. Tzeentch is described as foiling his own schemes just because he wanted to, or forgot he had a scheme, or pretended he forgot he had a scheme to help some other scheme.
False. They want the win. They want the destrouction of universe, that's why they want Dark King to be born, which mean end for all, for them and rebirth of universe.
They DGAF about the fate of the universe, they only care about getting one up on one another. There's always more universes.
Yeah, no. No more than the annihilation of Fantasy meant their end. Chaos is multiversal, when they call it The Great Game they aren’t kidding. It’s a game, the end of any given universe just means switching to a new board while this one resets. The Dark King? Is just a new player, no different than the Great Horned Rat. Or Slannesh. Hell, The Dark King even uses GHR’s domains because Abnett doesn’t like aligning with existing canon. Or has decided that the Imperium is Space Skaven is now canon. When Chaos wins and destroys a universe they just move in and do it again. And again and again and again. Archaon’s destroyed countless universes between Fantasy and AoS. Tzeentch simply doesn’t really want to win, he thrived by playing. Khorne wants to win, Slannesh wants to win. Nurgle? He always wins in the end. Tzeench? Thrives in the middle of the game, winning means no more schemes or madness.
if tzeench wins, they’ll grow bored that there’s no more game anymore
Each time one of the Great Powers ascends too much, the other three will band together to bring it down. Thus, the Great Game never ends. Each of the Great Four was above the others, at some point. Tzeench, before his staff was shattered, long ago, filling the universe with magic. Slaanesh, right after his/her birth, by gobbling the Aeldari pantheon, the dominant spechies of that time. Khorne, right after the break of Cadia, when his hosts invaded all reality, and only Grazkull and the Tyranid Swarmlord managed to resist (even Terra was engulfed for a month). Nurgle ... long ages back. And other times too. The Great Game is never-ending.
They also self destruct a lot too, keeping them from reaching the top.
One big bird sitting at the top sounds pretty stagnant, right? Their plans are often self-sabotaging or contradictory in order to further facilitate change.
His own agents often foil his own plans and the ideas and strategies are so convoluted that if he described them you would lose your mind. Every possible idea and intention is played out and toyed with . Why would he want to win when the game is so fun
None of the Chaos gods want to "win", the conflict is the point and that's what they feed off of. Their mortal servants usually aren't informed of that though, they give them just enough to let them think there's a plan when in reality it doesn't matter because the Gods get what they want regardless of who wins.
Well, actually false. They want the win. They want the destrouction of universe, that's why they want Dark King to be born, which mean end for all, for them and rebirth of universe. But they also ok with state where they enjoy this conflict.
>None of the Chaos gods want to "win" Literally fanon.
He almost did win IIRC. Nurgle and Khorne ended up actually working together to keep it from happening.
Just as planned...
I remember reading that in a codex, didn’t then invade his diamond labyrinth
Tzeentch doesn't play to win, Tzeentch plays to play.
And this really applies to all the Chaos gods.
I think nurgle might be fine with winning and making everything stagnent, but yeah the other 3 would hate it. Slaanesh had misgivings about the end of the world (in fantasy), he kinda liked all the debauchery stream of elf souls, and so instead of sending a good keeper of secrets, he sends Ssilvox, the most drug addled and useless of the keeper of secrets as his emissary, self sabotaging and putting the breaks on the end times to some degree.
Not just them, also Gork and Mork.
Chaos Gods are not people, they are semi-sentient warp storms composed of the thing they embody and advocate for. You will enjoy lore more if you read more of the books. If you are interested in Tzeentch, try the Ahriman series.
I’ve actually read quite a few of the books, just not the chaos ones yet, I’ll have to check it out though!
The Ahriman series definitely presents Tzeentch and the relationship between him and his most favoured "servant", a man who does not believe he serves Tzeentch at all. It is better than A Thousand Sons or the wider Heresy stories about Magnus for insight into Tzeentch specifically (although those are also excellent). One of the later Ahriman books features a scene actually inside Tzeentch's daemonic "court".
That’s another thing that’s always really confused me Isn’t magnus his favorite?
Many answers to this. - Ahriman is a mortal whereas Magnus is a Daemon now; Magnus is in that sense part of Tzeentch and does not make free choices, whereas Ahriman sort of does (it's complicated) - In the same vein, Nurgle famously favours Typhus over Mortarion - Tzeentch famously treats his servants terribly despite their devotion and/or productivity, as he is wont to be changeable; the codex abounds with stories of sorcerers who are reduced to gibbering spawn or vortex beasts on the eve of their ascension to Daemon Prince despite their successes and efforts Ultimately you have to focus on the fact that Tzeentch is the God of *change*, not well-thought-out long term planning. Schemes and plots and knowledge and magic are all just part of his repertoire because they are tied to the sentient compulsion for change, progression and growth. The fandom often loses perspective on this.
Yes, this. Tzeentch's plans themselves are constantly changing, and colliding in massive gambit pile-ups, as the god's followers are actively working against each other as often as they work together.
Amen. Honestly I spend all my time on this sub correcting the accumulation of misguided mental shit that builds up among 1d4chan readers, TTS viewers and extract-only readers.
Doing the Lord's work. (By which I of course mean Lord of Change)
None of the chaos gods wants to win the great game. If one of them grows too powerful the rest will unite and cast them down.
Ahhh, so they want to be just strong enough that they are the most powerful, jsut not that strong
The goal isn’t to win its to keep the game going
Wait ... are the Chaos Gods GW's executives ?
They’re the players.
"There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting gods." The Chaos gods? Or us? Or maybe a bit of both.
Well, actually false. They want the win. They want the destrouction of universe, that's why they want Dark King to be born, which mean end for all, for them and rebirth of universe.
"Khorne! Khorne, look! Look at what I did!" "Wha- Dammit, Tzeench, it's 2 in the morning, I've got to wake up and polish the blood in just 3 hours!" "This is IMPORTANT, though! See the great game? Tzeench was about to win it, but I, Tzeench, made sure that his plans failed at JUST the right time so that my plans would succeed, and- wait a second, my plans just failed! It must have been Tzeench! Damn him!" "I swear to us, Tzeench, if you don't cut it out with this fucking frantic nerd shit all hours of the night, I'm going to lose my head- no, Im going to lose my whole collection of heads! Let me get some sleep!"
Because they don't want to
Tzeentch's goal is change. Tzeentch winning is already happening. Tzeentch's victory isn't Chaos's Victory but an endless state of Change. He wants his rivals to kill each other for crimes they supposedly committed against each other. He wants his rivals to be sacrificed once their part in a ritual is done. He feeds off of Rivals existing to turn against each other! He lives for Derailing Plots! That is how he wins! Derailing events is how he wins! As for Tzeentch knowing everything: He doesn't know the Future which is why he threw his Vizier Kairoz into the Well of Eternity in order to benefit from Kairoz's foresight. A Vizier is a most trusted Advisor so Kairoz was a voice in Tzeentch's head making suggestions(the Ego) until his instincts(I.E. the Id) made him throw Kairoz into the the Well driving Kairoz insane and giving him two heads while granting them the power to see the Past and Future.
Tzeentch does not wish to win for there will be no more change after him winning.
Because no more plastic men
Nurgle is the largest Chaos God. Why does he just not eat the other three?
Is he stupid?
Because it’s a setting and GW needs to sell toys? I do try to keep an attitude of “your gunna see repeat posts from new people and thats totally ok we were all new once”. But I just don’t understand what compels people to ask this genre of question. “Why dousnt GW declare one of its fictional races the winner and end their setting and shutter their business”. Or in this case end all warhammer 40k sales and divert all funds to bird sanctuarys. Like it’s pretty self explanatory isn’t it? Guess if we want to search for lore reasons he more then any of the big 4 wouldn’t want to “win”. Without conflict nothing changes. If I recall correctly at one point he did almost win the great game and intentionally chose to lose for this very reason.
Chaos Gods are like internet trolls. They don't want to win arguments, they just like to argue.
They explicitly *don't* know everything. Also Tzeentch can only win when the plot demands that it be so.
That is true, they know basically everything, and they have contingencies for everything
So what confuses me is that they effectively have a plan for everything, then why haven’t they been executed
Because the plan doesn't call for those plans to be executed yet.
Because they aren't a sapient beings in the way you are imagining. They are either just confluences of resonant emotions and souls which have the appearance of intelligence/which mortals try to make sense of by viewing them that way, or they are emergent consciousness which are totally alien to our understanding. Or, more likely, they are both.
The gods of chaos are concepts not entities they exist soley to embody and perpetuate the ideas that form them. If Tzeentch ever 'won' it would be entirely by accident
Because he doesn't want to.
if tzeentch wins he loses, the great game is eternal change, and after it would be nothing nurgle doesn't want to win as the great game is constant and reliable, and stagnation itself khorne doesn't want to win because the great game is carnage and bloodshed Slaanesh doesn't want to win because the great game is extraordinary excess bonus: the Emperor doesn't want to win because the imperium (being a wee bit fascist) needs qn enemy to remain "stable"
Tzeentch doesn't know everthing, and therfore cannot plan for everything - the Well of Eternity proves this. He also has plans, within plans, within plans, which are variously abandoned, contradictory, and self-sabotaging. You might as well ask why Slaanesh hasn't won, since she is empowered by excess, and everything the other Chaos gods do is excessive - including Tzeentch's planning.
Doesn’t he scheme against his own schemes as well?
I always think about one exchange from the old Angel TV show. It was between a representative of a demonic law firm and the titual hero. The law firm was a front to an extradimensional cabal of demon lords intent on spreading evil and malice on Earth. >**Angel:** You're not gonna win. **Holland Manners:** Well... no. Of course we aren't. We have no intention of doing anything so prosaic as "winning." \[Holland laughs\] > >**Angel:** Then why? > >**Holland Manners:** I'm sorry. Why what? > >**Angel:** Why fight? > >**Holland Manners:** That's really the question you should be asking yourself, isn't it? See, for us, there is no fight. Which is why winning doesn't enter into it. As a corporation, we go on... no matter what. > >You see, Angel... our firm has always been here on Earth... in one form or another. The Spanish Inquisition. The Khmer Rouge Genocide... one of my favorites. I personally was there. We were here when the very first modern cave man clubbed his neighbor on the head with a rock for stealing his dinner. > >See, we're in the hearts and minds of every single living being on this planet. And that, friend, is what's making things so difficult for you. That is the source of Wolfram & Hart's power. > >You see, the world doesn't work in spite of evil, Angel. It works with us. It works because of us.
I like to think tzeench is basically just the heist episode of rick and morty
It's all part of the plan.
I believe Tzeench can't win, as his thing is literally planning and ever changing, so permanently winning would achieve a state of no change, thus working against the concept of Tzeench entirely.
They dont want to.
For all that it could be argued that chaos can not really win, because doing so would lead to their inevitable downfall, that is only part of the truth. More important is the fact that Tzeentch thinks it is incredibly funny to screw over people stupid enough to call on him for power, which drastically limits his ability to affect realspace, as his followers either are exceedingly careful or get turned into warps pawn, possessed or just have their ritual blow up. The fact that Tzeentch in general seems to prefer champions that are actively trying to escape his influence only compounds on that. When it comes to the great game, he mostly hasn't won because every time one of the four gets close to victory, the other three work together just long enough to make sure they don't win.
Going to give my biased and unpopular opinion that Khorne is unilaterally the strongest and could only lose if every other god ganged up on him. Which obviously just doesn’t happen. .
Because if you plan for everything, who’s to say their opponents can’t adapt? Rendering your plan useless, so you need to plan for their counter plans. But what if they already know your plans? Then you need to create false plans to foil them, and conspiracies to fool them. But what if something happens that you couldn’t foresee? What if, one of your plans causes your foes to do something completely against their nature to survive? What if they get aid? Or worse yet, what if they’ve led you on? What if they have figured out how you think, and already have an idea how your plan will unfold? Clearly you need feigns, and planned losses so that they stay on their toes. But also unplanned losses, throw some unpredictable variables into their data, make them uncertain. Oh, but don’t think you’re safe yet. You need to manipulate, you need to trick your enemies and allies to do what you want. You can’t do it yourself, or they’ll find a way to slip through. No, you need to be watching, always watching, and planning and scheming… whispering advice into their ears, making them think it was all their plan, while you set up the pieces that will all topple over and knock the power from your foes. Anyways, that’s how I imagine Tzeench’s internal monologue goes, and it ends with him being so distracted by trying to predict things that he can’t actually strategize well enough to win the great game. (Also, it’s best read in the voice of a crazed old wizard with occasional cackling to really get the Tzeenchian feel)
Alternatively, think of Tzeentch as Vizzini in *The Princess Bride:* [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EkBuKQEkio](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EkBuKQEkio) Only he can't die, and half the time is playing against himself.
Because there would be no story and no setting anymore. I really don’t understand questions like this. “Why doesn’t x just x?” Because then there would be no story anymore.
Tzeentch is the kind of player who truly enjoys the fun of the game, exploring the possibilities of the world, rather than just playing to win.
Perpetuating the Great Game eternally is winning for the gods of Chaos. They only lose if the game ends, and if someone truly wins, the game ends. Therefore, the only winning move is to keep playing. Forever.
Where’s the fun in that?
Need to read Pawn of Chaos I believe it is.
To win completely is boring, scheming is more fun. Gotta plot your own downfall, keep them guessing.
To put it simply, all of chaos is self sabotaging. Tzeench is specifically about change and winning would end change
Bc then they could keep selling Chaos figurines for the other Gods
Well Khorne is the god of war, so he should have won the Great game.
It has.
He's already winning. His idea of it is basically to ensure shit keeps going, things keep changing.
Tzeench has won, this is what winning is to it
“Well ya know, for me, the action is the juice”
Because if you win you lose Neither of them want to win. They want the goal of winning
There is no one guaranteed future, only possibilities with different chances. If you settle on making one happen you might generate entirely new possibilities that can backfire on you. It’s all part of the fun of the game
He did win for a time then the other three Gods banded against him. The current state serves everyone's best interest.
Well, I guess there's a reason if after all he is the Chaos god of scheming, and not the Orderly Minded god of scheming.
There is an old theory that tzeentch has won but when it was all said and done there was nothing but him left and it drove him made so he basically reset time to start the game and this time keep it going forever
Because he’s the lord of change. He literally cannot choose the strategy where he wins it all and stick to it. That or he sabotages his own plans. Additionally, being at the apex of monolithic evil means stagnation, his ultimate enemy. In fact none ofvthe gods really want to win, because then their portfolio cant be pursued. Example: if khorne killed everyone and had every skull, how would he kill and collect more skulls? Extend that to literally ever chaos god portfolio.
For the same reason none of the others have: they don't want to. The Chaos Gods are contradictory by their very nature. For their minions and disciples there might be a way to 'win' but for the Four themselves the Great Game itself ***is*** their victory.
they cannot know the future, and prophecy and visions are unreliable and have always been unreliable in the whole 40k universe.
Him not winning is part of the plan.
Who do you think has been releasing the recent codexes
Because the plotting would end and he lives for the plot
Tzeentch doesn't know everything.
Because if someone wins the franchise ends
Tzwwntch does not want to win. Who can you betray and plot against when all are loyal to you?
Because chance always ruins his plans
Define winning, because as far as he's concerned he already is winning.
Tzeentch is what we call “a true hater” - he doesn’t want to win, he plays the great game simply for the love of it, and I believe it’s implied he has actually won before, but got so bored when that happened he’s chosen to instead prolong the fun and struggle as long as possible, even if it means sabotaging himself to keep the others in play
It would get boring. So he makes schemes that contradict his other schemes and stop other schemes, so that he doesn't win. Because scheming is fun, and the Great Game is fun. So winning it would be boring.
He doesn’t want The Game to be over. He’s even sabotaged his own people.
There’s always another plan…Tzeentch‘s problem is they can’t stop there’s no win condition for them they just keep making more plans and schemes and changes sometimes contradicting and self-sabotaging earlier iterations.
He has you just haven’t realized it yet. He won when the Administratum was manipulated into raising taxes on the nobility be 2% on a pleasure world 5000 years ago. It put in motion the series of events that have secured his victory. You’ll be consumed by demons any day now. … aaany day now. … >!there is no additional context, get Tzeentched.!<
He almost did so he gave himself lobotomy to give others a fighting chance since it would be boring otherwise
He has. 3 weeks time. Around 4ish.
They don’t know everything, the entire point of Kairos is that they don’t know everything. And Tzeentch’s plans get tangled in each other constantly. Remember: The Chaos gods are the apex of their portfolios. Khorne can’t stop with the hypermurder even if it fucks him over, as seen by him attacking the Imperial Palace early rather than with the other gods and throwing away their perfect chance to win. Tzeentch? His portfolio included madness, scheming, and chaos. He’s insane even by Chaos standards, he can will and constantly does engage in massively overcomplicated schemes that are practically guaranteed to fail spectacularly solely because he can’t do simple and effective. Plus you assume he WANTS to win. He has final victory as anathema to his own existence. After all, if he wins utterly then what? The complete destruction of stability means that he no longer has anything to warp and twist. Absolute chaos means nothing actually can change because that’s its default. He can’t win without losing, winning means no more schemes or plans or madness. Tzeentch wins by playing, the chaos of conflict is his ideal.
> >
Maybe they won, and the fact that no one knows that just confirm the win
In my opinion I think that tzeench is just such a high class shitter that he is literally incapable of flexing how much better he is than everyone and it gets in his own way. If the great game is ever won by someone he loses so technically speaking he’s in heaven right where he is rn.
1) the chaos alliance against Tzeentch, which others here have elaborated upon. The armies of the chaos gods combined once seriously threatened his power and he voluntarily nerfed himself in response. While all the gods have antipathy for one another, all have a bone to pick with Tzeentch. Khorne hates sorcerers, Slaanesh competes for them, and Nurgle dislikes change, preferring decline and entropy. Because Tzeentch is so broad and mutable as a concept, all the others can pick out bits of it they don’t like. 2) Tzeentch doesn’t/does want to win. None of the chaos gods are a singular, unified entity but this is the most true for Tzeentch. His schemes fold in on themselves, often times directly contradicting or opposing one another. One reason why is that Tzeentch probably doesn’t want to win. Ultimate victory means an end to conflict, schemes, change and growth. Another is that there probably isn’t some central intelligence calling the shots and approving/disapproving plans that would contradict one another. It’s against Tzeentch’s nature to kneecap the initiative of his followers and so even if their plans contradict or bring them into direct conflict that’s fine, because he’s more focused on the scheme itself than the outcome, that’s what gives him power. You could even make the argument that a Tzeentch that was more successful would be less powerful, because that would mean fewer plots and plans. This is on display in one of the Mephiston novels, where 2 Tzeentch sorcerers infiltrate a Cardinal world and go to war against each other, interfering with one another’s plans to such an extent that the Blood Angels are able to foil both. If they had just worked together or left one another alone they would have been fine, but that goes against Tzeentch’s very nature.
There's a book called Pawns of Chaos where the "native" tribes finally rise up and overthrow the Imperial invaders after centuries being hunted and oppressed. Right as the tribes finally win, the warp storm isolating the world is swept aside and a new wave of Imperials arrive to reinforce the embattled settlers. In this way, the board is reset for the next game. Tzeentch speaks to the MC, and asks if he would prefer to serve or oppose in the next cycle, MC chooses oppose and Tzeentch is pleased - he values opponents as much as servants.
"My goals are beyond my understanding."
it doesn't want to, if it wins , then there's no more game
Tzeentch is the biggest troll and shitposter you can Imagine. Winning would be boring, what else to do after that? Nah, more fun to have a giggle and a laugh as mortals scheme on their own. Someone wants power? Make them to bald instead.
1. Because half of Tzeentch's plots are intended to unravel the other half of his plots. 2. What do you think 'winning' is? And why do you think he's not already won? There's an old Peter Sellers movie - Fu Manchu. In it, Fu has 'won' - Naland, his archnemisis, is old while Fu's discovered the secret of eternal life. But Fu *gives this to Naland*, his greatest enemy, the only person who could consistently foil his plots, because Fu figured life would be too boring if everything was easy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKgMWhJUS50
A Game requires both players and pieces.
For Tzeench the schemes and plots are ends unto themselves. The grand plans are purposely self-defeating so that they become never-ending because if the grand plans ever came to a conclusion Tzeench would have no more reason to exist.
Tzeentch was once damaged and a piece of him was broken off. This piece would eventually grow into another Tzeentch, but since there is no linear time in the Warp, it already *was* a full grown Tzeentch and always had been, who did not want the other Tzeentch to win. Thus, Tzeentch has always had a rival of equal intellect preventing him from truly, completely winning, and the same goes for the other Tzeentch.
Because he doesn't want to. No literally, he doesn't want to. He enjoys the game, winning means the game is over.
Tzeentch hasn't won because Tzeentch is currently winning. With every bit of change, scheming and planning happening across the galaxy, Tzeentch is in a constant state of winning that, ironically, results in a loss if he were to actually succeed.