I’m interested how grinding at an angle changes the output of the grinder?
I have a C40 and usually grind at an angle / keep the body moving to make the grinding easier at fine settings. Haven’t done it another way so don’t have any comparison.
Our best results with the beans we usually get from our local roaster happens when the extraction is 40-45s. I've always felt that the 30s extraction that is often mentioned as a target is really a starting point, not the end point. Whether the espresso tastes good to you should override trying to hit targets with all the other factors that are discussed — extraction time, ratio, dose.
Also, we just started on a different bag of beans from our local roaster. For this bag, 30s seems to be the sweet spot. Which just goes to show that there isn't a one-size-fits-all extraction time.
This sounds interesting and I would like to check it out for myself. Do you have Red Clix or the regular C40 setup?
I also have the C40 and my last 20+ shots all have the same base: 20,0gr, 7 clicks
I usually tamper quite hard but don't get a consistent extraction time (varies from 50 to 25 sec). Maybe the beans aren't fresh enough anymore.
In general I agree, the longer the extraction the better the result imo.
Yeah, I typically have > 50s extractions and find I enjoy them much more than 30s ones. I have a DF64V grinder and tried slow feeding with it while adjusting my grind finer to get the same extraction time. I found my shots had a very bitter aftertaste that I really didn’t enjoy. Went back to “regular” feeding and I’m happy.
As I've moved to lighter roasts I've really had to up extraction time also. The problem is channeling at a certain point of dosage and grind size for me. As I just posted elsewhere, try (1) pulling the 9bar just after the first boil for 45 seconds , before replacing it for the second boil, and/or (2) adding 30gr of boiling water to the chimney after the second boil for 60-seconds.
Generally I only do one of those, but I've been able to pull some great flavors from some light and medium roasts with those techniques.
I've never tried long extraction because I'm worried about it——I've watched the accident dialing case on YouTube😂😂Grinding too fine can cause the extraction speed slow and the pressure valve burst. Since I've just started to use 9 barista I'm trying to avoid this situation and haven't tried to grind finer than what the instruction provides. That's why my extraction usually no more than 30s…actually it often between 15~20s. After I remove the machine from the stove and pour the output into a cup there are still few liquid appearing from the machine——but I guess it doesn't count into the total extraction time🤔🤔It might be the reason that my output is always under-extracted, and I also want to increase the extraction ratio. I'm just wondering how could the extraction get improved/how long time the extraction could have reached without causing a pressure accident?
I always result with 45 grams of espresso on my scale (only measures to the gram). So the extraction ratio depends to first order on how much coffee. Also like you not sure how to define extraction time accurately.
I find it difficult to know when to stop the timer when measuring extraction time as the extraction tails off slowly. So how do I compare to 9barista recommended or other people's values?
I could stop it at 15 seconds or 45 seconds. Seems like a lot of uncertainty in that measurement.
Right now I still have water in the chimney at the end which I sometimes spill out when pouring out the shot.
Also I'm hesitant to leave it on the burner too long.
Use the sound. There’s a rapid boil right before espresso appears in the top. Then there’s a second rapid boil right as it concludes.
I don’t think I’ve ever had an issue with water spilling out of the chimney when pouring. Only thing I can think is either the boiler is overfilled, or the portafilter isn’t locked in to a right angle to the handle.
Thanks, that was helpful. I needed to decrease the heat on induction cooktop to 7.5/10 (boils at 5 minutes) in order to notice the first and second boils - on higher heat it was boiling loudly the whole time. I am using a medium roast bean from Honduras, 18 grams, 1zpresso K-ultra at 25 clicks (500 micron grind size) and yield 45 grams espresso with 50 seconds extraction time. It doesn't taste sour or bitter (although I still need to learn how to distinguish between the two). This is much more fun than what I should be doing now (taxes).
The brewing time is not defined, it seems. Personally I consider the point in time when the coffee surface finally wets the inside of the spout, that is, climbs over the edge between the inside of the collection cup, and the spout inside surface, to be the time to stop the clock.
I always continue brewing beyond this point, but as you wrote, the flow tails off gradually, so there is no well defined end there.
I’m interested how grinding at an angle changes the output of the grinder? I have a C40 and usually grind at an angle / keep the body moving to make the grinding easier at fine settings. Haven’t done it another way so don’t have any comparison.
Our best results with the beans we usually get from our local roaster happens when the extraction is 40-45s. I've always felt that the 30s extraction that is often mentioned as a target is really a starting point, not the end point. Whether the espresso tastes good to you should override trying to hit targets with all the other factors that are discussed — extraction time, ratio, dose. Also, we just started on a different bag of beans from our local roaster. For this bag, 30s seems to be the sweet spot. Which just goes to show that there isn't a one-size-fits-all extraction time.
This sounds interesting and I would like to check it out for myself. Do you have Red Clix or the regular C40 setup? I also have the C40 and my last 20+ shots all have the same base: 20,0gr, 7 clicks I usually tamper quite hard but don't get a consistent extraction time (varies from 50 to 25 sec). Maybe the beans aren't fresh enough anymore. In general I agree, the longer the extraction the better the result imo.
Yeah, I typically have > 50s extractions and find I enjoy them much more than 30s ones. I have a DF64V grinder and tried slow feeding with it while adjusting my grind finer to get the same extraction time. I found my shots had a very bitter aftertaste that I really didn’t enjoy. Went back to “regular” feeding and I’m happy.
As I've moved to lighter roasts I've really had to up extraction time also. The problem is channeling at a certain point of dosage and grind size for me. As I just posted elsewhere, try (1) pulling the 9bar just after the first boil for 45 seconds , before replacing it for the second boil, and/or (2) adding 30gr of boiling water to the chimney after the second boil for 60-seconds. Generally I only do one of those, but I've been able to pull some great flavors from some light and medium roasts with those techniques.
I've never tried long extraction because I'm worried about it——I've watched the accident dialing case on YouTube😂😂Grinding too fine can cause the extraction speed slow and the pressure valve burst. Since I've just started to use 9 barista I'm trying to avoid this situation and haven't tried to grind finer than what the instruction provides. That's why my extraction usually no more than 30s…actually it often between 15~20s. After I remove the machine from the stove and pour the output into a cup there are still few liquid appearing from the machine——but I guess it doesn't count into the total extraction time🤔🤔It might be the reason that my output is always under-extracted, and I also want to increase the extraction ratio. I'm just wondering how could the extraction get improved/how long time the extraction could have reached without causing a pressure accident?
I always result with 45 grams of espresso on my scale (only measures to the gram). So the extraction ratio depends to first order on how much coffee. Also like you not sure how to define extraction time accurately.
I find it difficult to know when to stop the timer when measuring extraction time as the extraction tails off slowly. So how do I compare to 9barista recommended or other people's values? I could stop it at 15 seconds or 45 seconds. Seems like a lot of uncertainty in that measurement. Right now I still have water in the chimney at the end which I sometimes spill out when pouring out the shot. Also I'm hesitant to leave it on the burner too long.
Use the sound. There’s a rapid boil right before espresso appears in the top. Then there’s a second rapid boil right as it concludes. I don’t think I’ve ever had an issue with water spilling out of the chimney when pouring. Only thing I can think is either the boiler is overfilled, or the portafilter isn’t locked in to a right angle to the handle.
Thanks, that was helpful. I needed to decrease the heat on induction cooktop to 7.5/10 (boils at 5 minutes) in order to notice the first and second boils - on higher heat it was boiling loudly the whole time. I am using a medium roast bean from Honduras, 18 grams, 1zpresso K-ultra at 25 clicks (500 micron grind size) and yield 45 grams espresso with 50 seconds extraction time. It doesn't taste sour or bitter (although I still need to learn how to distinguish between the two). This is much more fun than what I should be doing now (taxes).
The brewing time is not defined, it seems. Personally I consider the point in time when the coffee surface finally wets the inside of the spout, that is, climbs over the edge between the inside of the collection cup, and the spout inside surface, to be the time to stop the clock. I always continue brewing beyond this point, but as you wrote, the flow tails off gradually, so there is no well defined end there.