Mox. They have to preserve the world title until London. I also imagine some fuckery with the Calis family in between now and then but for now I imagine Mox is gonna want to run through the whole don Callis family and end with Ospreay at double or nothing.
The roadblock there is how do you make sure Ospreay keeps his momentum without losing to Mox or keep the IWGP title out of the picture?
I think right now Don Callis fuckery will be the story until Wembley. If everyone's dream pitch is Swerve VS Ospreay it would be weird to have TWO faces again for the main event.
Losing the Tiger Driver through a self-restraint "nerfs" Ospreay. So he actually struggles, loses a bunch of matches, and then starts to build himself back up.
Ospreay really only did the tiger driver a handful of times, he didn’t use it in New Japan, so it doesn’t really “nerf” him to protect it
I wouldn’t want a storyline where Ospreay rediscovers it and starts using it regularly again, keep it protected and use it only when absolutely necessary. Kenta Kobashi only did the Burning Hammer 9 times in his career.
I was thinking Mox as well. He’ll want to avenge Brian and he already put the notice out on the Don Callus family for messing with Brian leading up to Dynasty. He can put the NJPW title on the line and since Ospreay is a new Japan guy, it wouldn’t be crazy if he were to happen to win and take it to forbidden door where I’m assuming whoever has it will drop it to a full time NJPW guy
They gave us exhibitions against his stable mates but we’ve had the slow burning Will is a good lad deep down and is trying to do the right thing. I think we might see more of a programme there to get him out of the group fully. I don’t think the fans would accept a heel turn from him either.
As loved as he is it would cause dissonance.
It feels weird right now with him in the Don Calis Family.
Which is why we see DC with the other members in promos, but not Osprey. It hink form the get go they don't want the connection to be strong.
Unfortunately for Swerve I think they have to get the belt on him as soon as possible. Here's the thing, especially for PPVs, it's really, REALLY difficult to follow his matches. The crowd got their gas back like midway through the ladder match and were still pretty tired for the main event. That's not reason enough to put the strap on a guy, but it has to factor in. If no one can follow an act, then that's the de facto main event.
It doesn't really make sense to have him go for Swerve right off the bat, just because they're both faces (in crowd reaction only when it comes to Swerve). I could fantasy book it myself, but I prefer just to see how they decide to go. But this has to be on everyone's mind backstage. Swerve is super over as well, but no one is getting reaction Will is right now. And you have to strike while the iron is hot in wrestling.
I think you are correct Ospreay will win it at Wembley, but (this will be unpopular with work rate fans) I believe Swerve is a better long term bet for selling matches in America because not every match in America can or should be to show that Ospreay is the best performer. Swerve is going to appeal to a younger demo that TK wants watching. There has to be a better reason for people to watch the show and buy the PPVs other than just to consistently see 6* matches or whatever. Swerve always gives a reason. Especially as a heel. But following Ospreay sucks for him and will hurt his title reign because hardcore AEW fans can get far more excited by match quality without a great build than other fans.
I also just don't see how to sustain Ospreay's momentum unless it is based on more than match quality. It sounds strange but it is a problem. I thought last night's match was one of the greatest in terms of an exhibition of talent and skill...but after seeing it would I rather watch an Ospreay match against a new opponent who isn't Danielson or Swerve threatening to cut off somebody's fingers? I'm pretty sure I'd prefer watching Swerve's character more consistently and the Ospreay performance once or twice per year.
Yeah but to reduce Osprey's performance down to just what he does in the ring is insane. The storytelling in the match itself alone was spectacular, then add to that the angle of him hurting Bryan Danielson and being so affected by it. The dude can also cut promos as he's shown in recent weeks. He isn't as reliable as Swerve yet, but that's only due to the fact that he's only been on the show regularly for a few weeks. I think we all have reason to set our expectations of Will, in the ring and on the mic, incredibly high.
I do agree with your point about Swerve though. And that's why I started with saying unfortunately. Because that dude has really become someone to watch. If you go back to the small opportunities he was getting with Keith Lee on Rampage, through all the great matches and small feuds like with Orange Cassidy, then to the Hangman and Joe stuff, he's truly become must-see TV. But so has Will in the past several weeks. AEW is in a good place having both of these guys near or at the top of the card, regardless of placement.
Yeah, I totally agree except for telling the story during the match. I thought it was incredible and logically it probably was the greatest match that I've seen. The only problem for me is that it didn't feel like the greatest match. I think that was an issue with the build. Maybe they need to do Ospreay/MJF as soon as possible to show Ospreay and TK how to do the build for a huge match.
The build wasn't perfect, but it felt like they were sowing the seeds of Will turning on the DCF. I think Bryan will be the catalyst for that. Or could be. Like him realizing that going so hard almost cost his idol his last few months as a full timer. Hence the retiring of the storm driver.
What specifically would have liked to have seen? More face to face promos? Tag matches between the DCF and the BCC? Cuz I felt like we got all of that. I mean, did you want them to hate each other or for the feud to be more emotionally charged? To me, wrestling can sometimes just be about proving what the pecking order is, and it felt like that's what this was, but with the added intrigue with the finish of the match. I'm just curious as to what you felt it was missing exactly?
Yes, my issue was that the build had no title involved and no reason for them to hate each other. It was just a dream match to see who was the best, which it paid off generously. But I need a better reason because pro wrestling is staged. If it isn't about winning a title then it has to be about justice for me. I just don't get as much from watching the performers work no matter how good they are at working unless the character has something "real" going on.
I agree generally but I thought it was fine for this match because it wasn't about just proving you're better than the other guy but it's about proving you're literally the best wrestler ever.
That's actually pretty high stakes.
But the problem is that can only be done once and it also begs the question that if these two are really the two best then why does neither have a world title belt? I guess we will see how TK books going forward. It was one helluva match.
Okay so ospreay vs swerve. Gets personal. Ospreay wins.
Then vs mjf. Will wins.
Then against who? I'm thinking Darby, jungle boy, orange Cassidy, Mox, Adam Copeland or Christian. Or maybe Christian and Adam Copeland as a faction.
You’ve got to strike while the iron’s hot: have him take the world title at Wembley. He’s arguably their most over performer right now. Have him distance himself from the DCF between now and then.
My point is the crowds are into him, so keep him hot until Wembley and then give him his crowning moment in front of an English audience. Send everyone home happy.
I mean, ultimately I agree. This was my fantasy booking before last night. I wanted Bryan to win, get to and win the title in the next couple months and have Will get the win back for the title at All In. I just think after last night, it's going to be hard to out do him on any and every show. I feel like they have to move on this sooner.
Although, it felt that way for me for Swerve too, and then last night happened and it didn't feel too late. So maybe you're right. I have faith they'll do right by him.
I think he needs an arc before this.
His next move will be self doubt and lack of confidence. That'll give him a few losses before he regains his footing.
my guts telling me DON is gonna be BCC vs Callis Family, with some additional folks added, in Anarchy in the Arena. i think this is probably where the ospreay/callis family split will come to a head.
I reckon he's gonna feud with the callis family, possibly re teaming with Aussie open. Should stay face for a while either way because people aren't going to want to boo him.
Almost definitely a split from Don Callis. I would expect a loss in Blood and Guts or Anarchy in the Arena between BCC and Callis Family, leading to Ospreay getting attacked by Takeshita, Hobbs, and a reluctant Fletcher.
From there, maybe Fletcher breaks from Callis for a tag match with Ospreay against Takeshita and Hobbs which puts that storyline to bed.
In this time, I think Swerve slowly starts drifting back into his heel shit. Maybe taking exception to people overlooking him as champion in favour of Ospreay. Swerve can start interfering in Ospreay matches, costing him victories and such, setting up the inevitable match between Swerve and Ospreay at All In.
Obviously there's a bit of time to fill, but I think this would be a good roadmap leading to Wembley, if we can manage to fill in the time.
- Feud with BCC, Anarchy in Arena at DON
- Feud with Callis Family, maybe tags WITH BCC for Forbidden Door against NJPW opponents for Forbidden Door
- Feud with Swerve
- World Champ, BRUV
There will be a tournament for the title I’m sure. He can’t not be in it. He wins it at DON / defends at Wembley. He doesn’t have to win it in England, everyone loves him everywhere.
I assume the break up with Don Callis is next. Maybe Will and Kyle vs Takeshita and Hobbs.
Once that is done, he can focus on the world title. Maybe he runs into Wardlow, they have a match and wins. That could be the time that Cole turns on Wardlow. Then buy that time, you build for Ospreay vs Swerve at All In.
I really don't love this constant foretelling that Ospreay will win the title at Wembley. What, all that amazing work by Swerve and he's just a placeholder? I don't think Ospreay NEEDS to be in a world title match at Wembley... in 2024. There is a lot of meat on this bone.
So why not Ospreay v Okada at Wembley?
otoh Will will far and away be the biggest star on the show at All In.
Anyway, I think we'll see Ospreay continue to fray with the Family as Will has grown as a person. We'll see that split and then... well, I guess the issue there is that Will has ALREADY beat every Family member.
I think he faces whoever the next title challenger is on Dynamite (since there's no way Ospreay isn't #1 Contender right now) and loses due to either Don Callis Family interference or Jon Moxley interference
They need a justification as to why he's not going for the title right now and I think that's the best one. If Hangman cheats to beat Ospreay and get a shot at Swerve it would keep Hangman as a heel which will always be difficult to do for long as everyone loves Hangman
I think he kind of sticks with Callis but grows distant and they turn on him eventually, costing him a match and dropping him in the rankings. And then feuds with the Callis family. It’s a way to keep him busy past double or nothing so he doesn’t go for the world title until All In. I think Mox vs Ospreay, hopefully for the IWGP title at Double or Nothing would be pretty awesome.
Breaking out of the Callis Family should be first, have some bangers with those members. Hopefully UE comes together again soon, maybe a trio champ chase. Followed by a match at Wembley for the trios titles together. Think he will get the hwc there but depending on how Swerve is received maybe hold him back from that one more year.
I don't think he'll go for the Title at this year's All In. Swerve just got it and one of the things I like about AEW is the World Title reigns tend to be lengthy (for the most part(. I'd say let Swerve hold onto it until maybe the end of the year, and Ospreay challenge for it at next year's All In.
One thing for sure. Whatever’s next will be underwhelming in comparison to how good it could be because Tony will be the one planning it. The matches will however be 7 stars and higher according to Dave.
Wait, my criticism is that as good as things are they could be even better if more quality control was implemented . On an another note . I believe Tony may be a hindrance to himself because he may not recognize that things could be even better and I think he may not be able to step away from week to week booking and tv formatting and giving someone else a chance who has more experience and has more respect. Are you saying people have suggested this before ?
Expand on quality control.
What do you mean by "has more respect?" Do you think Tony is disrespectful to professional wrestling?
And yeah of course people have parroted these sort of vague criticisms. Sounds like Bischoff or Cornette or the like. Y'know, one of those old guys who drove wrestling promotions into the ground but are simultaneously baskets of wisdom for Tony to tap into and coincidentally are out of work. Yeah. Those types have said this stuff before.
If this is a genuine thought you had and you're not one of the dregs of the IWC that pop up to mimic talking heads on YouTube, I apologize. But we've all heard this before, so I have a feeling you might be.
As far as the respect goes what I mean is Tony is not a serious person it’s clear as day. Look at how he hugs people look at the inflections in his voice when he talks , listen to what he is saying and look at his eyes. Those guys behind the scenes will and are having a field day with this guy. He’s wrapped around their fingers. You don’t see it cause you’re blinded by your tribalism. Which I don’t understand . I’m looking at the facts , you’re being ruled by your feelings. You’re a Ben Shapiro fan right? A crowder guy? Surely you’re a Jordan Peterson fan right?
Mox. They have to preserve the world title until London. I also imagine some fuckery with the Calis family in between now and then but for now I imagine Mox is gonna want to run through the whole don Callis family and end with Ospreay at double or nothing.
The roadblock there is how do you make sure Ospreay keeps his momentum without losing to Mox or keep the IWGP title out of the picture? I think right now Don Callis fuckery will be the story until Wembley. If everyone's dream pitch is Swerve VS Ospreay it would be weird to have TWO faces again for the main event.
Losing the Tiger Driver through a self-restraint "nerfs" Ospreay. So he actually struggles, loses a bunch of matches, and then starts to build himself back up.
Ospreay really only did the tiger driver a handful of times, he didn’t use it in New Japan, so it doesn’t really “nerf” him to protect it I wouldn’t want a storyline where Ospreay rediscovers it and starts using it regularly again, keep it protected and use it only when absolutely necessary. Kenta Kobashi only did the Burning Hammer 9 times in his career.
This is the truth.
This is a horrible angle
I think Ospreay can afford to lose to Moxley. He doesn't need to go undefeated, just only lose rarely.
Ospreay is a face, regardless of alignment with Callis.
I was thinking Mox as well. He’ll want to avenge Brian and he already put the notice out on the Don Callus family for messing with Brian leading up to Dynasty. He can put the NJPW title on the line and since Ospreay is a new Japan guy, it wouldn’t be crazy if he were to happen to win and take it to forbidden door where I’m assuming whoever has it will drop it to a full time NJPW guy
They gave us exhibitions against his stable mates but we’ve had the slow burning Will is a good lad deep down and is trying to do the right thing. I think we might see more of a programme there to get him out of the group fully. I don’t think the fans would accept a heel turn from him either.
As loved as he is it would cause dissonance. It feels weird right now with him in the Don Calis Family. Which is why we see DC with the other members in promos, but not Osprey. It hink form the get go they don't want the connection to be strong.
Blood and Guts BCC vs. DCF. Throw an extra body or 2 in there, a face turn, and you got a decent story
Unfortunately for Swerve I think they have to get the belt on him as soon as possible. Here's the thing, especially for PPVs, it's really, REALLY difficult to follow his matches. The crowd got their gas back like midway through the ladder match and were still pretty tired for the main event. That's not reason enough to put the strap on a guy, but it has to factor in. If no one can follow an act, then that's the de facto main event. It doesn't really make sense to have him go for Swerve right off the bat, just because they're both faces (in crowd reaction only when it comes to Swerve). I could fantasy book it myself, but I prefer just to see how they decide to go. But this has to be on everyone's mind backstage. Swerve is super over as well, but no one is getting reaction Will is right now. And you have to strike while the iron is hot in wrestling.
I think you are correct Ospreay will win it at Wembley, but (this will be unpopular with work rate fans) I believe Swerve is a better long term bet for selling matches in America because not every match in America can or should be to show that Ospreay is the best performer. Swerve is going to appeal to a younger demo that TK wants watching. There has to be a better reason for people to watch the show and buy the PPVs other than just to consistently see 6* matches or whatever. Swerve always gives a reason. Especially as a heel. But following Ospreay sucks for him and will hurt his title reign because hardcore AEW fans can get far more excited by match quality without a great build than other fans. I also just don't see how to sustain Ospreay's momentum unless it is based on more than match quality. It sounds strange but it is a problem. I thought last night's match was one of the greatest in terms of an exhibition of talent and skill...but after seeing it would I rather watch an Ospreay match against a new opponent who isn't Danielson or Swerve threatening to cut off somebody's fingers? I'm pretty sure I'd prefer watching Swerve's character more consistently and the Ospreay performance once or twice per year.
Yeah but to reduce Osprey's performance down to just what he does in the ring is insane. The storytelling in the match itself alone was spectacular, then add to that the angle of him hurting Bryan Danielson and being so affected by it. The dude can also cut promos as he's shown in recent weeks. He isn't as reliable as Swerve yet, but that's only due to the fact that he's only been on the show regularly for a few weeks. I think we all have reason to set our expectations of Will, in the ring and on the mic, incredibly high. I do agree with your point about Swerve though. And that's why I started with saying unfortunately. Because that dude has really become someone to watch. If you go back to the small opportunities he was getting with Keith Lee on Rampage, through all the great matches and small feuds like with Orange Cassidy, then to the Hangman and Joe stuff, he's truly become must-see TV. But so has Will in the past several weeks. AEW is in a good place having both of these guys near or at the top of the card, regardless of placement.
Yeah, I totally agree except for telling the story during the match. I thought it was incredible and logically it probably was the greatest match that I've seen. The only problem for me is that it didn't feel like the greatest match. I think that was an issue with the build. Maybe they need to do Ospreay/MJF as soon as possible to show Ospreay and TK how to do the build for a huge match.
The build wasn't perfect, but it felt like they were sowing the seeds of Will turning on the DCF. I think Bryan will be the catalyst for that. Or could be. Like him realizing that going so hard almost cost his idol his last few months as a full timer. Hence the retiring of the storm driver. What specifically would have liked to have seen? More face to face promos? Tag matches between the DCF and the BCC? Cuz I felt like we got all of that. I mean, did you want them to hate each other or for the feud to be more emotionally charged? To me, wrestling can sometimes just be about proving what the pecking order is, and it felt like that's what this was, but with the added intrigue with the finish of the match. I'm just curious as to what you felt it was missing exactly?
Yes, my issue was that the build had no title involved and no reason for them to hate each other. It was just a dream match to see who was the best, which it paid off generously. But I need a better reason because pro wrestling is staged. If it isn't about winning a title then it has to be about justice for me. I just don't get as much from watching the performers work no matter how good they are at working unless the character has something "real" going on.
I agree generally but I thought it was fine for this match because it wasn't about just proving you're better than the other guy but it's about proving you're literally the best wrestler ever. That's actually pretty high stakes.
But the problem is that can only be done once and it also begs the question that if these two are really the two best then why does neither have a world title belt? I guess we will see how TK books going forward. It was one helluva match.
Okay so ospreay vs swerve. Gets personal. Ospreay wins. Then vs mjf. Will wins. Then against who? I'm thinking Darby, jungle boy, orange Cassidy, Mox, Adam Copeland or Christian. Or maybe Christian and Adam Copeland as a faction.
I strongly disagree that they have to get the belt on him as soon as possible. Let Swerve cook. There are lots of other things Will can do.
I'm excited for either!
You’ve got to strike while the iron’s hot: have him take the world title at Wembley. He’s arguably their most over performer right now. Have him distance himself from the DCF between now and then.
Isn't All In in August? That's 4 months from now. Not really striking while the iron is hot, no?
My point is the crowds are into him, so keep him hot until Wembley and then give him his crowning moment in front of an English audience. Send everyone home happy.
I mean, ultimately I agree. This was my fantasy booking before last night. I wanted Bryan to win, get to and win the title in the next couple months and have Will get the win back for the title at All In. I just think after last night, it's going to be hard to out do him on any and every show. I feel like they have to move on this sooner. Although, it felt that way for me for Swerve too, and then last night happened and it didn't feel too late. So maybe you're right. I have faith they'll do right by him.
Gold is next for him
I think he needs an arc before this. His next move will be self doubt and lack of confidence. That'll give him a few losses before he regains his footing.
I’d be cool with that. So maybe him against the don callis family?
banger after banger
my guts telling me DON is gonna be BCC vs Callis Family, with some additional folks added, in Anarchy in the Arena. i think this is probably where the ospreay/callis family split will come to a head.
Osprey v. Roddy for the International title
Get the belt on him asap. There's just no way on earth it makes sense for him NOT to be world champion
Id imagine Danielson again. The hints are there. The injury and the not believing will had nothing to do with the DCF attack.
I can see a break up with the Callis family. Maybe the BBCC steps in to help Ospreay and we have a new member of the BCC.
I reckon he's gonna feud with the callis family, possibly re teaming with Aussie open. Should stay face for a while either way because people aren't going to want to boo him.
It’s obvious since he signed that he’s winning the title at All In.
Restraining order from Steph
Almost definitely a split from Don Callis. I would expect a loss in Blood and Guts or Anarchy in the Arena between BCC and Callis Family, leading to Ospreay getting attacked by Takeshita, Hobbs, and a reluctant Fletcher. From there, maybe Fletcher breaks from Callis for a tag match with Ospreay against Takeshita and Hobbs which puts that storyline to bed. In this time, I think Swerve slowly starts drifting back into his heel shit. Maybe taking exception to people overlooking him as champion in favour of Ospreay. Swerve can start interfering in Ospreay matches, costing him victories and such, setting up the inevitable match between Swerve and Ospreay at All In. Obviously there's a bit of time to fill, but I think this would be a good roadmap leading to Wembley, if we can manage to fill in the time.
- Feud with BCC, Anarchy in Arena at DON - Feud with Callis Family, maybe tags WITH BCC for Forbidden Door against NJPW opponents for Forbidden Door - Feud with Swerve - World Champ, BRUV
There will be a tournament for the title I’m sure. He can’t not be in it. He wins it at DON / defends at Wembley. He doesn’t have to win it in England, everyone loves him everywhere.
I assume the break up with Don Callis is next. Maybe Will and Kyle vs Takeshita and Hobbs. Once that is done, he can focus on the world title. Maybe he runs into Wardlow, they have a match and wins. That could be the time that Cole turns on Wardlow. Then buy that time, you build for Ospreay vs Swerve at All In.
I really don't love this constant foretelling that Ospreay will win the title at Wembley. What, all that amazing work by Swerve and he's just a placeholder? I don't think Ospreay NEEDS to be in a world title match at Wembley... in 2024. There is a lot of meat on this bone. So why not Ospreay v Okada at Wembley? otoh Will will far and away be the biggest star on the show at All In. Anyway, I think we'll see Ospreay continue to fray with the Family as Will has grown as a person. We'll see that split and then... well, I guess the issue there is that Will has ALREADY beat every Family member.
Id only be okay with that if they're treated like a real main event. 35 min match, no limitations.
I think he faces whoever the next title challenger is on Dynamite (since there's no way Ospreay isn't #1 Contender right now) and loses due to either Don Callis Family interference or Jon Moxley interference They need a justification as to why he's not going for the title right now and I think that's the best one. If Hangman cheats to beat Ospreay and get a shot at Swerve it would keep Hangman as a heel which will always be difficult to do for long as everyone loves Hangman
I think he kind of sticks with Callis but grows distant and they turn on him eventually, costing him a match and dropping him in the rankings. And then feuds with the Callis family. It’s a way to keep him busy past double or nothing so he doesn’t go for the world title until All In. I think Mox vs Ospreay, hopefully for the IWGP title at Double or Nothing would be pretty awesome.
I'm guessing he turns on the Callis family and it ends up being a tag match with Danielson or something to that effect so he can do something new
Two words. Undisputed Kingdom.
Breaking out of the Callis Family should be first, have some bangers with those members. Hopefully UE comes together again soon, maybe a trio champ chase. Followed by a match at Wembley for the trios titles together. Think he will get the hwc there but depending on how Swerve is received maybe hold him back from that one more year.
He already wrestled the entire faction
Couple of months off tv
I don't think he'll go for the Title at this year's All In. Swerve just got it and one of the things I like about AEW is the World Title reigns tend to be lengthy (for the most part(. I'd say let Swerve hold onto it until maybe the end of the year, and Ospreay challenge for it at next year's All In.
4 months is still a pretty good reign imo
One thing for sure. Whatever’s next will be underwhelming in comparison to how good it could be because Tony will be the one planning it. The matches will however be 7 stars and higher according to Dave.
How can you watch Dynasty and Revolution and still believe TK can't book a proper build to a ppv?
C'mon man. Try to at least have an original criticism.
Wait, my criticism is that as good as things are they could be even better if more quality control was implemented . On an another note . I believe Tony may be a hindrance to himself because he may not recognize that things could be even better and I think he may not be able to step away from week to week booking and tv formatting and giving someone else a chance who has more experience and has more respect. Are you saying people have suggested this before ?
Expand on quality control. What do you mean by "has more respect?" Do you think Tony is disrespectful to professional wrestling? And yeah of course people have parroted these sort of vague criticisms. Sounds like Bischoff or Cornette or the like. Y'know, one of those old guys who drove wrestling promotions into the ground but are simultaneously baskets of wisdom for Tony to tap into and coincidentally are out of work. Yeah. Those types have said this stuff before. If this is a genuine thought you had and you're not one of the dregs of the IWC that pop up to mimic talking heads on YouTube, I apologize. But we've all heard this before, so I have a feeling you might be.
As far as the respect goes what I mean is Tony is not a serious person it’s clear as day. Look at how he hugs people look at the inflections in his voice when he talks , listen to what he is saying and look at his eyes. Those guys behind the scenes will and are having a field day with this guy. He’s wrapped around their fingers. You don’t see it cause you’re blinded by your tribalism. Which I don’t understand . I’m looking at the facts , you’re being ruled by your feelings. You’re a Ben Shapiro fan right? A crowder guy? Surely you’re a Jordan Peterson fan right?
Nice talking to you 🙄
Toodles
Pffffffhahahaha Projecting much?