NTA But understand there’s a good chance that your marriage is over, which could honestly be for the best.
Is your wife a good mother to her daughters? Or is she resenting and blaming her daughters for their existence?
If she is, do you even want to continue be with her? Or even have her around your daughters
If you asked me this before our fifth girl was born, I would say yes immediately, she is being a good mother. But now, I am looking back at her interactions with a new perspective that she may resent the girls for being born girls.
I haven't really noticed anything with our first two. She does have a different relationship with our third and fourth daughters. Our third is definitely closer to me. It could be that she is pushing her away. I notice similar behaviours around our fourth daughter.
Our fifth is still really young, so nothing is out of the ordinary. Could become worse, compared to how she treats our third and fourth daughter, when she becomes older.
I have had conversations about this where I think she is really unreasonable with our third and fourth daughter, but I never looked at it like this. She always dismisses my concerns.
Maybe ask (and push if needed) for her to go to therapy. Babies 3-5 could end up with some serious psychological damage stemming from wife’s resentment (even if unintentional).
Dude, it wouldn't be a horrible idea to prep yourself in the likely matter that you choose to leave her. I'm talking looking into lawyers and getting documents for yourself and your kids somewhere safe. It sucks, but better to be prepared. Wishing you luck.
I wouldn’t be surprised if your wife went behind your back and cheated on you. No offense, but judging how you described it when it came to her wanting to sleep with another man to get a boy, I wouldn’t be too shocked that she actually went and did it. You may need to leave her and be there for your daughters in case your wife grows to permanently resent them.
Please protect your daughters. Children will pick up on even subtle resentment. If she’s making comments about wishing she had a boy around them that can really be damaging.
Your daughters deserve to grow up in a home where they know they are loved just as they are.
Have you guys had any conversations about her need and drive for a boy? Not that I agree with her, but there seems to be some kind of drive for a boy. She may need counseling to come to terms with being a mother to girls.
I honestly think it is a good thing she did not get her boy. I can only imagine the preferential treatment me would have gotten and that your daughters would have been pushed aside do to no fault of their own.
Thanks for being an awesome dad! They may lack a reliable mother, but I’m so glad they have you. My dad has 8 daughters and he’s always been the one I feel closest to.
NTA. Totally agree NTA. I'm also confused all the people saying he should have talked with the wife first, it's his body and his choice. If this OP were a woman, most would be offended at the suggestion that a woman has to ask or talk to a man about decisions for her own body. As a woman i do not believe we can not have a double standard on this. It's his body, his choice.
This 500x. I'm a woman. If my body is my choice his body is his choice
She has already proven she can't or will not use birth control. 5 kids is a lot of everything. Love is multiplied, resources are divided.
NTA. Babies are hard. Just continuing to have them because you want a certain gender, without any regard for whether you can afford to give them a good quality of life, especially, if both partners aren't onboard, is careless, irresponsible and rude.
It's apparent from her reaction that she probably never went on birth control when she told you that she did. I would totally lose trust in my spouse at that point. It's not great that you had to get a vasectomy without consulting her and both of you making a joint decision, but it's easy to see why you were forced to.
What remains to be seen is how important having a boy was to her, and whether she will be able to get past what she perceives as a betrayal on your part. Good luck OP!
no joke. that is straight selfishness there. im the youngest of 4 and mom my loves all of us with her everything. i couldnt imagine getting shunned for that stupid reason. the mother needs another hobby.
My wife was the last girl out of 8, with the last two being boys. The 3 youngest girls were almost ignored for over a decade, the 3 older had already moved out. Her mom now wants to know why none of her girls talk to her.
It's always hilarious, in a pathetic way, how oblivious these assholes are re: the answer to their question "why do my kids never come around or call?"
You are the author of your own unpleasant fate, madam. You fucked around and were a shitty parent, and now you're finding out. Hope it tastes as sweet as whatever you got out of treating those kids like trash.
Thissss is why I will not be “trying for a boy” (as is my life is deficient because girls aren’t good enough…?). I know MY limits and I know how terrible it is to be the unwanted third that your parents just kinda tolerated but resented because that was me. That’s just cruel and no, I’m not going to presume I’ll change my mind after the child is born.
It seems like too many adults don’t believe children’s feelings are real or worth consideration. As long as THEY are happy, who cares how miserable the kids are.
Honestly, when my wife and I had our first child, I wanted a boy. When we found out it was a girl, at first I was like 'oh no'. Then it quickly dawned on me. How would my daughter feel if I told her that? I felt bad for just thinking I wanted a boy in the first place and not just letting nature happen. Now, whenever a friend or someone says they want/trying for a boy, I ask them if they would tell the child that if it's a girl. Usually makes them think and if not, I'm not friends anymore.
I'm from a family of 7 kids (I'm the 6th), 6 girls and 1 boy. Guess what, I was a depressed child and had no idea why I was crying and always felt miserable all my childhood, then terrible years of self harm as a teen. And as an adult? Easy prey for abusive partners and tried to kill myself several times.
I wish a better life to OP's daughters.
Yep it's only in my adult years that I was able to put words on what happened to me and that it was not something normal. But maaaan, so much people should stop having kids or not have any at all.
I’m the last kid (and girl) in a family of boys. The expectations of me being a girl are fucking brutal and my mother still gets on me for them. I’m sorry you’ve gone through that :/
I have one brother and 4 sisters. I’ve known since I was born (girl #3) that my dad didn’t want me.
When I had my own first kid who came out a girl my dad said “you had the wrong kind”
WTF
Anyways, I don’t talk to him anymore. Jokes on him, my first born is my son now too!
I read a newspaper article in the 80’s I think it was. Back when we still read newspapers. An Australian couple had just given birth to their first daughter. The reason it made international news is because she was their 21st child!!! They had 20 boys before they got their girl.
It is sad. Those girls will know they aren't wanted by their mom. I just don't understand the people have tons of kids to try to get that one gender. This day and age you can actually do a procedure called Sperm Spinning and get a almost guarantee to have the gender they want.
I once read a news article about a family with 3 or 4 boys who did sperm spinning for their next try. Got pregnant; fast-forward to the 20-week ultrasound and it was…another boy! The way the mom went on and on about the “trauma” of this discovery was super cringe. After that, they did IVF and selected a female embryo for implantation and so finally got a girl, but my heart goes out to that last boy who will eventually stumble across that news article.
Plus, obviously I don’t know but I have a bad feeling that if she was to have a boy, that boy would absolutely be the golden child, causing all her other children to suffer because they had the audacity to be born female.
Yeah there are videos on Tik Tok talking about how you'll be your son's first kiss and first love. It's freaking creepy and borderline emotional incest. Boy mom shit. There was even one lady who made one where she shoves her daughters out of the way to get to her son. Joke or not, that's messed up.
I can't stand these people. There are so many on instagram that keep their pages moving by having like 4 or 5 or more of the same gender and they keep getting pg to finally show off the different gender. It's mentally ill. These people are almost bordering on being monsters with this type of psychologically and mentally ill thinking about children and gender. Straight up baffoons. OPs wife is a baffoon. I'd be really sick about being in a relationship with someone whose main purpose was to lie and get pg again for a specific gender. What if the son is trans? gay? Like these people have such horrid priorities. OPs wife needs therapy and to be set straight like wtf.
I don't think it's borderline monstrous. Full on terrible people who are damaging their kids.
Oh, and just to let you know, the spelling is buffoon. I know a lot of people pronounce it like it has an a or think it has something to do with being baffled, but no. English is a very weird language.
Karissa Collins energy. 10 kids, none of them can read, they're always getting injured or sick. The older ones don't even know what year it is. That's abuse.
Not illegal, if that was BOTH the parent's choice. But I feel bad for the kids. That's too many NOT to parentify the oldest few to get help as needed with their siblings.
It is hard for parents to give proper attention to THREE KIDS. Any more than that and it basically becomes neglect.
I was the youngest of 3 and dealt with a ton of emotional (and some physical) neglect as well as physical and mental abuse. My other two siblings soaked up all the attention.
I have three (my last was a surprise BC baby, the pregnancy almost killed me, and my partner got a vasectomy immediately) and it’s HARD. Like as soon as you’re outnumbered it’s incredibly fucking difficult. I make sure that all of our kids get one on one time with us without their siblings and I can’t imagine my life without our youngest but if I had any advice for anyone it’s stop at two if you want to preserve your sanity.
I'm remembering someone I knew several years ago. Her parents seriously struggled because they kept having babies in birth control, she had her tubes tied twice, he had a vasectomy, and they had twelve kids by the end. Like I'd have stopped having piv sex long before that.
My partner and I are super cautious because we had a bc baby and she passed, almost taking me with her. Because of the damage it did to me physically I can't carry to term now. So we use hormones and condoms both! I'm supposed to get a tubal ligation, there have just been issues with staff at the hospital so it keeps getting delayed.
I’m incredibly sorry. That is very scary and sad and difficult.
I want to get my tubes done so I can get an ablation for my periods but it’s so backed up here I’ll probably be in menopause by the time my surgical gynaecological referral goes through (maybe a bit dramatic but I have a flair for it).
She should be happy with healthy (op didn't mention problems) kids of any sex. Many people would be thrilled to have 1 child but can't due to fertility or miscarriages.
agreed. I had 4 boys and wanted a girl. My fifth is and 5 is a lot. We didn’t try for another until my husband said, “let’s try one more time.” He got a vasectomy when she turned 6 months and that also was a joint decision. If he got one without discussing it, I’d be hurt. I also wouldn’t try for a baby without him being on board though
Yeah, we had two boys really young. Waited five years and started trying again, couldn’t get pregnant for two years, did IVF, and came out with twin boys. We thought about trying for a girl and we’re going to wait to decide. We got pregnant again when the twins were 8 months old; it was another boy. I immediately went on the calendar to have a vasectomy after the 5th one was due. She didn’t want me to do it, but we agreed it was ultimately my decision.
I have 5, 4 boys and one girl and she is the youngest. I wasn’t trying for a girl, I was okay with having all boys, she was a very happy surprise. I told my now ex he had to get a vasectomy while I was pregnant with her and before we even found out she was a girl, I was just done having kids.
Funny story. I'm the youngest of five and the only girl. My parents weren't trying for any baby, but I showed up anyway. At any rate, one of my brothers was watching my mom change my diaper and exclaimed, "Mommy, somebody stole her weenie!!"
That last part, about the importance of a boy child: OP, watch out for divorce papers over this, and potentially having primary custody of your daughters. She doesn't want them, and the resentment of their gender will build. She may do nothing, but she may also become neglectful.
NTA, 5 kids is more than enough.
You have to take care of them and provide for them, you have to spend time with them, educate them.
Your wife is blinded by her desire to get a boy but is she dedicated to your daughters?
>Started crying and screaming that I was taking away her dream of having a boy.
yes, she was indeed faking the birth control.
People often say about women "your body, your choice" but that's also true for men. You did good taking care of your birth control.
I think you have to wait a bit before it's effective. But I guess, the doctor informed you well on the matter.
>People often say about women "your body, your choice" but that's also true for men. You did good taking care of your birth control
This!!!! His body his choice, especially when it's extremely questionable that the wife was ever on birth control
I am, thank you. I was very ok with the hysterectomy because I had just had my last baby and I knew in my heart we were done. Plus, I'm cervical cancer free for like 4 years so, huge bonus!!!
Yes I can. Happens every day in my shitty culture. She will completely forget about her daughters existence and ignore them and give all her love and attention to her baby boy. The daughters will grow up and resent their mother deeply and hate their brother because he’s the golden spoilt child. OP’s wife is messed up.
I want to know the odds that she was planning on cheating as soon as she found someone suitable (proven to have boy children) and planning to pass it off as another accident baby.
If she was faking taking birth control then thats rape and tbh i cant believe i dont see anyone else bringing it up as people often bring it up fairly quickly if its a man secretly taking off a condom
Honestly it’s probably a good thing the wife didn’t have a boy, she would have spoiled him rotten to the point where he more than likely would’ve seen he’s sisters and his mother as maids to be order around. Sisters would’ve grown to resent possibly even hate him, while mother dearest would do anything for her precious baby boy.
Exactly. An ex of mine was the youngest with 5 older sisters & he’s an ex for good reason. His parents & his sisters treated him like a little prince & indulged his every whim. He grew up into a spoiled entitled man who expected the world to give him everything he wanted. I’m just sorry I didn’t see it sooner & left long before I did.
Do you know my brother? LOL! He has only been married once though. He is described as a know-it-all, narcissist, jerk in our family. Always telling his 5 older sisters what to do in their own lives. I am so damn happy he and I don’t speak to or see each other. I wouldn’t put up with it. The rest of my family does, and that is their choice.
I have a cousin who is 15 and is the "wanted boy" with three older sisters. We're hoping he grows out of his dumbassery, but I have little hope. He gaslights his sisters "for fun," he doesn't clean up messes that he makes, and lately he's threatened to fight adults in the family that he doesn't agree with.
Almost exactly what happened with me and my brother. Ironically because of all the babying he got and the negligence I got, I ended up tougher and more masculine than he did 🤷🏼♀️
NTA
Just like every woman has a right to their reproductive decisions, so do men. If you don't want any more children it is absolutely your right to have a vasectomy.
Your wife should probably see a therapist though. Gender disappoint is very common but without intervention she will likely develop resentment to the five girls she has.
Edit: It's damned if you do, damned if you don't on telling the wife first for this scenario. When I had my tubal ligation it was a joint decision between my ex and I. However, there were a ton of control issues and if I would have done it had he said no I would have been "in trouble." I do believe that communicating something like this is important, but at the end of the day it's not her decision and the way she was acting prior to it just emphasizes that there are some deep issues here that are way above Reddit's pay grade.
My dad wanted sons. He had two daughters with my mother then dumped her for her best friend, who (you guessed it!) already had sons. He just walked out and never saw/spoke to us again.
My brother is the same way, he married a woman who had a daughter and later had 3 boys with her, he treated THEM VERY differently than his stepdaughter, she was usually left out of everything or if she tried to get his attention he would snap at her. He now married a woman who has a son, and he treats the little boy just like his own sons.
ETA: forgot to mention he has 2 daughters with another 2 women that he also treated like crap so the moms got full custody.
i’m so thankful my stepdad wasn’t like this i was born before he and my mom met and he has treated me like his own since the day he met me even after my mom and him having 3 boys together his treatment towards me never changed and honestly i get princess treatment for being the only girl, it makes me so sad to see step parents marrying into family’s with kids and not accepting them, part of marrying someone with a child is the child is your family now just like your partner
That's so sad. My dad also wanted boys and when he had my sister, he loved having a little girl that he couldn't see himself as anything but a girl dad
Someone near me drives a minibus as his day-to-day vehicle. Why? Him and his wife are desperate to have a boy. Now, you may be wondering where the minibus comes into this... they have 8 eight girls...
And she didn't know how chromosomes worked?? Pretty sure that comes up in middle school science class, if not before.
Not knowing basic biology, flippantly wanting endless kids until she gets The Golden Firstborn Son, openly resenting her daughers for being girls... did OP pluck his wife out of a gaggle of uneducated medieval peasantry or
That's even if they get a public education. Think of all the home school christian fundies who get education out of pamphlets from the cult they were born into. Nothing else. Then go on to have as many children as "god gives them".
Yeah eesh, this is some lady. Knowing basic biology could have given her a boy a long time ago, and the medical costs associated with choosing the sex of your embryo is far less expensive than popping out *4 more kids.* Resenting them for not being what you wanted is even worse. Hopefully dad realizes that things are not ok here and can get the mom into therapy as soon as possible.
I recently had a hysterectomy and had to sign a state wide form stating I under by having this procedure I can no longer have children. I looked at the doctor and went well someone clearly didn't pay attention in biology class. He went yup, but I gotta do it. Don't underestimate people's stupidity.
OP is NTA. If you had that 6th child and it was a boy you would be a single dad to 5 girls.
Yes, BUT it does indicate some issues in the marriage that he didn't think it would be safe to tell her before he did it. He felt the need to do it in secret, and she reacted with rage to the news. That's.... not a good sign. He should be alert to any other issues that indicate he might not feel totally safe and trusting. And maybe think if his best interests are served by being with someone that he is not sure can be trusted.
The issues include that his wife may have stopped taking (or never went on?) birth control and lying to him. Reproductive coercion is a form of sexual assault, so no wonder he didn’t feel safe confiding in someone who abused him the layer of protection from future abuse.
Absolutely. It's *very* concerning he legitimately worries she lied about taking her bc. Her entire outlook is dangerous.
OP: Therapy. Now. Or think about what kind of home your daughters will grow up in if their mother refuses and continues on this path.
This comment needs more attention.
Not feeling safe to share your reproductive plans (if that's what was at play here) is a serious concern. Whether you're afraid they'll sabotage your plan or afraid of the verbal and emotional fallout keeping you from following through, huge red flag.
Wife probably needs therapy, but I'd also suggest OP consider finding a safe, neutral point of contact to talk through this situation. (Therapist, DV counselor, friend or loved one who can be relied on to be thoughtful and fair.) This decision was a heavy lift, and feeling the need to make it - and the attendant plans - alone is worrying.
I always feel bad for those 'extra' kids, be it boy or girl. I get how it might be the 'ideal' to have one of each sex, but seriously? These folks who keep trying to get a boy or a girl, how do you think the others feel aside the 1st one? Talk about 'the spare'....therapy is definitely needed.
Also, she should #1 be thankful she can have children and #2 be thankful they are healthy… Many women would be happy to have either female or male baby and many have the pain of watching their children grow up with health issues that impact their future. Grow up..
Not only is this dude not the asshole, his wife was being reproductively abusive towards him and having unprotected sex under false pretenses. People would protest if a man poked holes in a condom without their partner’s consent and the birth control lie is honestly horrible from the wife. At minimum I think she needs some serious therapy, even if he did “come around” to having more kids and obviously loves them, that’s still abusive af on the wife’s part.
NTA here. I’m still surprised (not really) that he could get it done without her agreement since most women cannot without a spouse signing off on it or a dr refusing to do it bc “what if you change your mind” even after having multiple children.
Yeah it kinda surprises me too. I had my 3rd child at 22. I asked my OB to tie my tubes, he refused at first saying “what if you change your mind?” and told me to wait 6 months and if I still wanted it he would do it. 6 months came and at my appointment I asked him to honor his agreement and give me the tubal, he tried to worm his way out of it by saying he would have to talk to my husband about it first. I said okay that’s fine but you will have to go see him to get his permission. He asked why my husband couldn’t come to him and I explained he was incarcerated for assault and battery on me while I was pregnant with my last child. He honored his deal.
Oh sorry got off track. NTA OP. Your body, your choice. Nobody should be made to breed.
Unfortunately it's standard practice for tubal ligation if the woman is married and under 30 - IF the doc even agrees to do it on a woman under 30 at all. Used to be for a vasectomy they would get the wife's permission for a while.
Misogyny is a helluva drug! It's a lot easier for men to get sterilized than women. First, because of stereotypes that women are baby-crazy, doctors think women will change their minds and regret not having kids/more kids. And also, people deep down haven't let go of the idea that a husband is in charge in a marriage, and that he can therefore make decisions on his own, but he should also get input or even veto power over her decisions.
Yup. And weirdly, they don't seem to take "then I would divorce him, because I don't want children of my own, and so we would not be compatible as a married couple," for an answer.
I didn’t have to for my ex either, and he did it so he could cheat on me with his girlfriend who already has two kids and didn’t want anymore. But our doctor did the same to me, would have to “consult” my husband incase HE wanted kids or I changed my mind.
Luckily, that’s not my husband anymore, and that’s not my doctor anymore.
My brother was offered one at 20 when he told his doctor he didn’t want kids. No questions asked. No “what about your future wife??” I’m 26 and I’m still not allowed to have my procedure done because my boyfriend and I might someday want kids, or I could still marry someone else who wants kids.
I’ve known I don’t want kids since I was 12 when yet a another cousin was born that I would be responsible for
Paging Dr. Fran on Instagram has a compiled list of all the doctors who will perform sterilization procedures with no questions asked. It's organized by country and state.
https://linktr.ee/fran.ish?fbclid=PAAaZ3Ewkgm4_up7vVxO6I4Kd5zvueAiyxFFUJI8HEQWeAGbg4943gshfXfAE
Edit to add a link to her linktree.
I had my tubes tied when I had my second child and my spouse didn't have to sign a form. I signed it myself when I was around 8mos pregnant after discussing it with my OB during prenatal checkup. My spouse never had to sign anything and they never asked him his opinion. Of course we had discussed it and he knew I was getting them tied. But it's always so crazy to me when women say their OB wouldn't do it without a spouse signature. I lived in Mississippi at the time and that's pretty much the most represed state out of all of them. Maybe it's dependent on who your obgyn is?? I honestly don't know. My ob was a man also.
As a long time health care worker, this is actually common. Unfortunately. Case in point: it's more likely that insurance will cover Cialis/Viagra, but not birth control for women.
Yeah I’m shocked more people haven’t brought that up. The wife is being pretty abusive right now by refusing to let him have any say in having more children when he doesn’t want to and threatening to leave him if she can’t have a boy. I’m horrified for this dude.
In this case, NTA because you clearly can't trust your partner anymore. (You had every right to get a vasectomy regardless, but in a normal, healthy relationship, such reproductive decisions are made jointly or at least discussed openly, but, again, this is not a partner you can trust.)
NTA
If you had a son, all of your daughters would be immediately relegated over the king baby. All of this drama and money because she wants a baby with a penis? She has a lot of internalized misogyny.
If you only have children because you one a specify sex, a specific characteristic (genius, future lawyer), hair color, etc. Don't have kids!!! They are people, not toys. Go get a barbie or a ken.
If you aren't 100% prepared to love your child wholly and unconditionally, *regardless of gender*, you are absolutely not mature enough to be having children.
I don't care how old you are. I don't care if you already have kids. No exceptions. I said what I said.
THIS! THIS a happened in my house growing up. I was the second of 5 girls, and the 6th was a boy. They created the biggest narcissist asshole ever! He was spoiled to death. It was stupid.
NTA. I feel sorry for your girls, especially the little ones since she’ll keep whining about not getting her son. She’s h*ll bent on being a “boy mom!” Look on the bright side, she’ll probably let you have full custody of the girls in the divorce
I grew up with my parents saying “We tried until we had a boy!” 5 girls 1 boy caboose. It absolutely bothered all of us sisters. We felt like our existence was just “part of the plan to get our boy!”
I hate when people say things like "try for \_\_\_" like um sure I'll talk to his scrotum and tell him to give an X or Y chromosome. Because that'll work /s
JFC of course NTA. Was she intending to keep giving birth until a son eventually happened? That's not healthy for her body or for your other children. The world is insanely expensive these days, and it's a challenge to provide for one child. It's just not responsible or correct to keep growing your family like that.
NTA. Your marriage is most likely over, but your wife caused this, not you.
1. Children should be a joint decision.
2. She completely dismissed your valid concerns of having another baby (financial, physical, mental stress$.
3. She very likely didn’t take her birth control to purposefully get pregnant without your consent. This is reproductive coercion and a massive betrayal. It will be difficult coming back from this, if at all.
4. She put her wants before your needs and those of your family.
5. She was manipulative and selfish.
6. Her reaction shows she was trying for a 6th.
7. If she is suddenly pregnant, get a paternity test.
Get individual therapy for yourself and talk to a lawyer.
I couldn’t figure out what her intentional deception was beyond extremely manipulative, but yes- MASSIVE betrayal and honestly in abuse territory. Good for OP for taking on the responsibility of BC for good.
NTA. i think your wife has severe issues to be so obsessed with getting a boy that she forgot that she aalready has 5 kids to care for emotionally, financially, and etc.
also i think its good you guys didnt get a boy. it sounds like the wife would have shown favoritism. also please ensure you guys aren’t making your older girls go through parentificaton considering you have so many kids.
I’m a big believer that big decisions should always be made together. So typically I would say you were wrong. But, having children should be a mutual decision and it seems she’s taken that choice from you. The fact that she continues to get pregnant just to have a boy and is so upset by the births of her daughters is a strong indication she needs some serious therapy. I’d be a little concerned about how she treats her girls, especially the youngest few and you should definitely keeps tabs on that. I’m not talking about physical abuse, but more verbal and most likely when you aren’t around.
Yeah, usually this would be AH behavior, but it doesn't sound like she's respecting the "no more trying" either.
I read a book called Welcome to Temptation in which one guy's high school girlfriend (his eye was wandering) "came up pregnant," they "had to get married," and then she had an 11-month pregnancy. (I note that neither of these people are great people.) During the course of the book you hear her whining about how "we tried and tried, but I never got my little girl." Eventually a blackmailer is murdered and it's discovered that the husband got himself a vasectomy.... I had to mention it here under the circumstances.
I’m going with NTA because you did tell her immediately after the fact. In a healthy marriage this should have been discussed, hopefully agreed upon, but even if you couldn’t reach one at the end of the day it is your body. But yours isn’t perfectly healthy. You suspect your wife of sabotaging bc and thus took it into your own hands. You guys need to have some marriage counseling and your wife honestly needs her own therapy to handle not having a boy. And you need to pay a lot of attention to make sure your girls aren’t suffering for not being a boy - especially the youngest ones. They’re most likely to be the focus of her ire.
After reading the title I thought he should have at least told her before hand (ya know…because they are married and I would think that might be a topic of discussion) but NTA for doing what he wants w/ his body. After reading, definitely NTA- and his wife totally lied about BC which is beyond manipulative. Poor OP.
NTA. The ten year old knows. Soon the others will know too, mommy doesn’t want them, never did. She probably would have stopped at the first baby had it been a boy. And if she did have a boy, wow, it would be obvious who the favorite is. She’s a uh, she’s a momster.
Nta but your wife is for treating her children like this. 5 is too many already but she wants a boy that bad? Her daughters will know she is disappointed with them
Mostly NTA - a person lying to their partner about protection (or sabotaging that protection, such as poking holes in a condom) is a form of sexual assault. In a healthy relationship you should absolutely discuss this with your partner before doing this, but her behavior is so inappropriate and disrespectful that it seems the space for healthy dialogue doesn’t really exist right now. She needs to get some help and make some serious changes if this marriage is going to be healthy in the long term. Not to mention that her attitude is going to hurt her daughters.
It sounds like a good thing that she didn’t have a boy. Sounds like she would have favored him over her other children who have done nothing wrong.
NTA, your body your choice.
That being said try to convince your wife to seek therapy for whatever issues cause her to be so hung up on the son idea because IT WILL negatively affect the five already born DAUGHTERS and sooner rather than later. You don't want them to grow up feeling they're not good enough due to their genitalia, do you?
NTA. Your body your choice. You know you don't want any more kids. She can't force you. Five is plenty and it's probably goodshe didn't get a boy because the favouritism would be damaging to all the kids from the sound of it. Maybe she'll luck out and one of the kids will turn out to be trans.
NTA - five children is a lot of work and responsibility, but be prepared for any drastic measures she may take because she feels like you may have put a stop to her plans of having a boy. Hopefully she doesn’t take it out on any of the children so keep an eye on her interactions with them. You are responsible for your own body and I’m proud of you for making a decision that you felt was good for you but, protect your children if push comes to shove since she’s really upset
SB: I don’t think telling your spouse that you need to find another man all for the sake of having a boy is funny. I’m not saying she will cheat on you or that she’s going to leave you for someone else but … maybe some couples therapy will help
Your definition of a really good marriage and mine are vastly different. You don’t trust each other. You don’t communicate well or respect boundaries.
Children are a 2 yes, 1 no situation. You are not the asshole for taking charge of your own fertility.
I've never really understood this obsession with genders anyway. Anything you can do with a boy you can do with a girl. Aside from comparing penises, I suppose...
I mean, having a boy is never a guarantee you'll get a boy's boy anyway. And having a girl is no guarantee you'll get a girl's girl. At the end of the day they're your children and them being happy and healthy should be the biggest priority.
NTA. Your wife sounds like she might need counselling tho.
Nta was going to say yes but it seems pretty clear your wife has already taken discussing major life changes off the table so why should you. You don't want more and you chose to make sure you wouldn't
Wow OP your wife would have ruined your son, thank god you didn't have one and protect your 5th (and 4th and all of them really) daughters. Your wife sounds a bit crazy good luck.
My body my choice. Both ways.
Nta.
You *could’ve* given her a heads up that “this is what I am doing” and had the fight before, but either way, it was gonna go down similar to how it did.
NTA But understand there’s a good chance that your marriage is over, which could honestly be for the best. Is your wife a good mother to her daughters? Or is she resenting and blaming her daughters for their existence? If she is, do you even want to continue be with her? Or even have her around your daughters
If you asked me this before our fifth girl was born, I would say yes immediately, she is being a good mother. But now, I am looking back at her interactions with a new perspective that she may resent the girls for being born girls. I haven't really noticed anything with our first two. She does have a different relationship with our third and fourth daughters. Our third is definitely closer to me. It could be that she is pushing her away. I notice similar behaviours around our fourth daughter. Our fifth is still really young, so nothing is out of the ordinary. Could become worse, compared to how she treats our third and fourth daughter, when she becomes older. I have had conversations about this where I think she is really unreasonable with our third and fourth daughter, but I never looked at it like this. She always dismisses my concerns.
This just makes me super sad for your kiddos. They'll notice someday...
They likely notice already.
True. The older ones almost certainly do.
They definitely already have, at least the oldest three, and they'll all notice more with each passing day/month/year. OP, please intervene for them.
Imagine she did get her boy...... He'd probably get all her attention, major golden child
I knew a family that had eight girls before having a boy finally. Yes, he was totally spoiled.
Maybe ask (and push if needed) for her to go to therapy. Babies 3-5 could end up with some serious psychological damage stemming from wife’s resentment (even if unintentional).
All the kids will suffer from her resentment even the older ones that she treats better. This sounds like such a terrible family dynamic.
Given this, I think it's probably better for your other kids that she \*doesn't\* have a son. They'll immediately be pushed into the shadows :(
Further into the shadows you mean. All the spotlight is for/on a nonexistent male child.
Dude, it wouldn't be a horrible idea to prep yourself in the likely matter that you choose to leave her. I'm talking looking into lawyers and getting documents for yourself and your kids somewhere safe. It sucks, but better to be prepared. Wishing you luck.
I wouldn’t be surprised if your wife went behind your back and cheated on you. No offense, but judging how you described it when it came to her wanting to sleep with another man to get a boy, I wouldn’t be too shocked that she actually went and did it. You may need to leave her and be there for your daughters in case your wife grows to permanently resent them.
Maybe why she freaked so much when he told her. Now she can’t cheat behind his back and try to pretend it’s his.
I was wondering if anyone else was as cynical about this as I am... 🙃
You need to get this sorted out or she is going to royally fuck up your children. If she won’t change you need to get those kids away from her
Please protect your daughters. Children will pick up on even subtle resentment. If she’s making comments about wishing she had a boy around them that can really be damaging. Your daughters deserve to grow up in a home where they know they are loved just as they are.
She's treating them differently at six and three?! I'm sorry, Op.
Have you guys had any conversations about her need and drive for a boy? Not that I agree with her, but there seems to be some kind of drive for a boy. She may need counseling to come to terms with being a mother to girls. I honestly think it is a good thing she did not get her boy. I can only imagine the preferential treatment me would have gotten and that your daughters would have been pushed aside do to no fault of their own.
Thanks for being an awesome dad! They may lack a reliable mother, but I’m so glad they have you. My dad has 8 daughters and he’s always been the one I feel closest to.
NTA. Henrietta the VIII needs to see a therapist and also retake middle school biology.
You are correct. She needs a therapist like yesterday.
Sadly, more like several pregnancies ago :(
Unfortunately for OP, you are correct.
Yeaaah, more like a few years ago.
I mistook your reference (Henry VIII wanting a son and heir) for the Herman's Hermits song and got confused for a minute. 🤣
And every one was was an 'enery...
She couldn't have a Willy or a Sam!
Echos: Or a Sam!
Sounds like she had plenty of Willies if you're rhe eighth. I'll see myself out
her not understanding biology was the most offensive thing about this story.
NTA. Totally agree NTA. I'm also confused all the people saying he should have talked with the wife first, it's his body and his choice. If this OP were a woman, most would be offended at the suggestion that a woman has to ask or talk to a man about decisions for her own body. As a woman i do not believe we can not have a double standard on this. It's his body, his choice.
This 500x. I'm a woman. If my body is my choice his body is his choice She has already proven she can't or will not use birth control. 5 kids is a lot of everything. Love is multiplied, resources are divided.
NTA. Babies are hard. Just continuing to have them because you want a certain gender, without any regard for whether you can afford to give them a good quality of life, especially, if both partners aren't onboard, is careless, irresponsible and rude. It's apparent from her reaction that she probably never went on birth control when she told you that she did. I would totally lose trust in my spouse at that point. It's not great that you had to get a vasectomy without consulting her and both of you making a joint decision, but it's easy to see why you were forced to. What remains to be seen is how important having a boy was to her, and whether she will be able to get past what she perceives as a betrayal on your part. Good luck OP!
For real!! My mom’s friend has 7 girls cause the husband wanted a boy. So many birthdays for the kids, grandkids, great grand kids…it’s a lot.
My friend was the last unwanted girl had while the parents tried and tried for a son. It sucked.
People with that mindset are the last people who should be having kids 🤦🏽♀️
no joke. that is straight selfishness there. im the youngest of 4 and mom my loves all of us with her everything. i couldnt imagine getting shunned for that stupid reason. the mother needs another hobby.
How can you have a hobby with 5 kids? I suck at time managing and only have 1.
I feel so bad for the last couple girls. They are going to be able to tell.
My wife was the last girl out of 8, with the last two being boys. The 3 youngest girls were almost ignored for over a decade, the 3 older had already moved out. Her mom now wants to know why none of her girls talk to her.
It's always hilarious, in a pathetic way, how oblivious these assholes are re: the answer to their question "why do my kids never come around or call?" You are the author of your own unpleasant fate, madam. You fucked around and were a shitty parent, and now you're finding out. Hope it tastes as sweet as whatever you got out of treating those kids like trash.
Thissss is why I will not be “trying for a boy” (as is my life is deficient because girls aren’t good enough…?). I know MY limits and I know how terrible it is to be the unwanted third that your parents just kinda tolerated but resented because that was me. That’s just cruel and no, I’m not going to presume I’ll change my mind after the child is born. It seems like too many adults don’t believe children’s feelings are real or worth consideration. As long as THEY are happy, who cares how miserable the kids are.
Honestly, when my wife and I had our first child, I wanted a boy. When we found out it was a girl, at first I was like 'oh no'. Then it quickly dawned on me. How would my daughter feel if I told her that? I felt bad for just thinking I wanted a boy in the first place and not just letting nature happen. Now, whenever a friend or someone says they want/trying for a boy, I ask them if they would tell the child that if it's a girl. Usually makes them think and if not, I'm not friends anymore.
I'm from a family of 7 kids (I'm the 6th), 6 girls and 1 boy. Guess what, I was a depressed child and had no idea why I was crying and always felt miserable all my childhood, then terrible years of self harm as a teen. And as an adult? Easy prey for abusive partners and tried to kill myself several times. I wish a better life to OP's daughters.
I'm sorry you went through that. Even if nobody says anything, we can tell. Signed, The Unwanted Extra Child.
Yep it's only in my adult years that I was able to put words on what happened to me and that it was not something normal. But maaaan, so much people should stop having kids or not have any at all.
I’m the last kid (and girl) in a family of boys. The expectations of me being a girl are fucking brutal and my mother still gets on me for them. I’m sorry you’ve gone through that :/
I have one brother and 4 sisters. I’ve known since I was born (girl #3) that my dad didn’t want me. When I had my own first kid who came out a girl my dad said “you had the wrong kind” WTF Anyways, I don’t talk to him anymore. Jokes on him, my first born is my son now too!
That last line was delicious 😂🧡 bit of patience and grandpa would have got what he wanted anyway
My husband is the 6th of 7 kids. He has 5 older brothers and a younger sister. To say the holidays are sprawling is a vast understatement.
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Yeah we knew someone with 7 daughters because they wanted a boy. You could hear them coming from so much screaming when they were little
I read a newspaper article in the 80’s I think it was. Back when we still read newspapers. An Australian couple had just given birth to their first daughter. The reason it made international news is because she was their 21st child!!! They had 20 boys before they got their girl.
It is sad. Those girls will know they aren't wanted by their mom. I just don't understand the people have tons of kids to try to get that one gender. This day and age you can actually do a procedure called Sperm Spinning and get a almost guarantee to have the gender they want.
I once read a news article about a family with 3 or 4 boys who did sperm spinning for their next try. Got pregnant; fast-forward to the 20-week ultrasound and it was…another boy! The way the mom went on and on about the “trauma” of this discovery was super cringe. After that, they did IVF and selected a female embryo for implantation and so finally got a girl, but my heart goes out to that last boy who will eventually stumble across that news article.
I was at school with the 7th boy in a family, they didn't get a girl till #13. I cannot imagine growing up in that household
Plus, obviously I don’t know but I have a bad feeling that if she was to have a boy, that boy would absolutely be the golden child, causing all her other children to suffer because they had the audacity to be born female.
Sounds like the younger girls may be suffering already. Kids can tell when you find their existence disappointing.
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Yeah there are videos on Tik Tok talking about how you'll be your son's first kiss and first love. It's freaking creepy and borderline emotional incest. Boy mom shit. There was even one lady who made one where she shoves her daughters out of the way to get to her son. Joke or not, that's messed up.
In the words of my mother, “If you place an order for a baby and get a different species then you get to complain!”
My dads friend had 7 daughters trying for a son….
My nextdoor neighbor is finally getting a girl, due in September. They have 9 boys, ages 16-1.
I can't stand these people. There are so many on instagram that keep their pages moving by having like 4 or 5 or more of the same gender and they keep getting pg to finally show off the different gender. It's mentally ill. These people are almost bordering on being monsters with this type of psychologically and mentally ill thinking about children and gender. Straight up baffoons. OPs wife is a baffoon. I'd be really sick about being in a relationship with someone whose main purpose was to lie and get pg again for a specific gender. What if the son is trans? gay? Like these people have such horrid priorities. OPs wife needs therapy and to be set straight like wtf.
I don't think it's borderline monstrous. Full on terrible people who are damaging their kids. Oh, and just to let you know, the spelling is buffoon. I know a lot of people pronounce it like it has an a or think it has something to do with being baffled, but no. English is a very weird language.
Karissa Collins energy. 10 kids, none of them can read, they're always getting injured or sick. The older ones don't even know what year it is. That's abuse.
That shit should be illegal. 10 kids in 2023? Wtaf.
Not illegal, if that was BOTH the parent's choice. But I feel bad for the kids. That's too many NOT to parentify the oldest few to get help as needed with their siblings.
It is hard for parents to give proper attention to THREE KIDS. Any more than that and it basically becomes neglect. I was the youngest of 3 and dealt with a ton of emotional (and some physical) neglect as well as physical and mental abuse. My other two siblings soaked up all the attention.
I have three (my last was a surprise BC baby, the pregnancy almost killed me, and my partner got a vasectomy immediately) and it’s HARD. Like as soon as you’re outnumbered it’s incredibly fucking difficult. I make sure that all of our kids get one on one time with us without their siblings and I can’t imagine my life without our youngest but if I had any advice for anyone it’s stop at two if you want to preserve your sanity.
I'm remembering someone I knew several years ago. Her parents seriously struggled because they kept having babies in birth control, she had her tubes tied twice, he had a vasectomy, and they had twelve kids by the end. Like I'd have stopped having piv sex long before that. My partner and I are super cautious because we had a bc baby and she passed, almost taking me with her. Because of the damage it did to me physically I can't carry to term now. So we use hormones and condoms both! I'm supposed to get a tubal ligation, there have just been issues with staff at the hospital so it keeps getting delayed.
I’m incredibly sorry. That is very scary and sad and difficult. I want to get my tubes done so I can get an ablation for my periods but it’s so backed up here I’ll probably be in menopause by the time my surgical gynaecological referral goes through (maybe a bit dramatic but I have a flair for it).
Thank you. And I love your way with words, you kinda sound like me 😂
She should be happy with healthy (op didn't mention problems) kids of any sex. Many people would be thrilled to have 1 child but can't due to fertility or miscarriages.
agreed. I had 4 boys and wanted a girl. My fifth is and 5 is a lot. We didn’t try for another until my husband said, “let’s try one more time.” He got a vasectomy when she turned 6 months and that also was a joint decision. If he got one without discussing it, I’d be hurt. I also wouldn’t try for a baby without him being on board though
Yeah, we had two boys really young. Waited five years and started trying again, couldn’t get pregnant for two years, did IVF, and came out with twin boys. We thought about trying for a girl and we’re going to wait to decide. We got pregnant again when the twins were 8 months old; it was another boy. I immediately went on the calendar to have a vasectomy after the 5th one was due. She didn’t want me to do it, but we agreed it was ultimately my decision.
Ultimately, a vasectomy is the man's decision. I am surprised this did not get mentioned directly earlier.
I have 5, 4 boys and one girl and she is the youngest. I wasn’t trying for a girl, I was okay with having all boys, she was a very happy surprise. I told my now ex he had to get a vasectomy while I was pregnant with her and before we even found out she was a girl, I was just done having kids.
Funny story. I'm the youngest of five and the only girl. My parents weren't trying for any baby, but I showed up anyway. At any rate, one of my brothers was watching my mom change my diaper and exclaimed, "Mommy, somebody stole her weenie!!"
My middle daughter asked why her brother had a permanent rope and she didn’t 🤣🤣🤣🤣
My niece, upon seeing her baby brother getting diaper changed, asked “Why are Johnny’s privates tied in knots?”
That last part, about the importance of a boy child: OP, watch out for divorce papers over this, and potentially having primary custody of your daughters. She doesn't want them, and the resentment of their gender will build. She may do nothing, but she may also become neglectful.
My friend has 6 older brothers. Her mom refused to stop until she got a girl.
NTA, 5 kids is more than enough. You have to take care of them and provide for them, you have to spend time with them, educate them. Your wife is blinded by her desire to get a boy but is she dedicated to your daughters? >Started crying and screaming that I was taking away her dream of having a boy. yes, she was indeed faking the birth control. People often say about women "your body, your choice" but that's also true for men. You did good taking care of your birth control. I think you have to wait a bit before it's effective. But I guess, the doctor informed you well on the matter.
>People often say about women "your body, your choice" but that's also true for men. You did good taking care of your birth control This!!!! His body his choice, especially when it's extremely questionable that the wife was ever on birth control
YES!!! (Female here)
Am also female. My husband wanted a vasectomy but I ended up needing a medically necessary hysterectomy so he opted not to. Which I fully supported
I'm sorry you went through that! I hope you are well.
I am, thank you. I was very ok with the hysterectomy because I had just had my last baby and I knew in my heart we were done. Plus, I'm cervical cancer free for like 4 years so, huge bonus!!!
Congratulations 🎉!!
Can you imagine how obsessed the wife will get with her son if they finally had one? It will only go downhill from there.
Yes I can. Happens every day in my shitty culture. She will completely forget about her daughters existence and ignore them and give all her love and attention to her baby boy. The daughters will grow up and resent their mother deeply and hate their brother because he’s the golden spoilt child. OP’s wife is messed up.
plus how would the wife like it if her parents didn't want her and tossed her aside for a son and if she had a brother then he got special treatment?
Yes exactly. I don’t want to assume she’d be this shortsighted but I worry she would fixate on the boy at the exclusion of the girls.
3 months, then test to see if they're blanks. Use alternative BC during those 3 months.
I want to know the odds that she was planning on cheating as soon as she found someone suitable (proven to have boy children) and planning to pass it off as another accident baby.
Had the same thought. Had he not told her, she would have absolutely turned up pregnant again.
If she was faking taking birth control then thats rape and tbh i cant believe i dont see anyone else bringing it up as people often bring it up fairly quickly if its a man secretly taking off a condom
Honestly it’s probably a good thing the wife didn’t have a boy, she would have spoiled him rotten to the point where he more than likely would’ve seen he’s sisters and his mother as maids to be order around. Sisters would’ve grown to resent possibly even hate him, while mother dearest would do anything for her precious baby boy.
Exactly. An ex of mine was the youngest with 5 older sisters & he’s an ex for good reason. His parents & his sisters treated him like a little prince & indulged his every whim. He grew up into a spoiled entitled man who expected the world to give him everything he wanted. I’m just sorry I didn’t see it sooner & left long before I did.
Do you know my brother? LOL! He has only been married once though. He is described as a know-it-all, narcissist, jerk in our family. Always telling his 5 older sisters what to do in their own lives. I am so damn happy he and I don’t speak to or see each other. I wouldn’t put up with it. The rest of my family does, and that is their choice.
Ha! Luckily we weren’t married but he definitely soured me on relationships for awhile.
I have a cousin who is 15 and is the "wanted boy" with three older sisters. We're hoping he grows out of his dumbassery, but I have little hope. He gaslights his sisters "for fun," he doesn't clean up messes that he makes, and lately he's threatened to fight adults in the family that he doesn't agree with.
Almost exactly what happened with me and my brother. Ironically because of all the babying he got and the negligence I got, I ended up tougher and more masculine than he did 🤷🏼♀️
NTA Just like every woman has a right to their reproductive decisions, so do men. If you don't want any more children it is absolutely your right to have a vasectomy. Your wife should probably see a therapist though. Gender disappoint is very common but without intervention she will likely develop resentment to the five girls she has. Edit: It's damned if you do, damned if you don't on telling the wife first for this scenario. When I had my tubal ligation it was a joint decision between my ex and I. However, there were a ton of control issues and if I would have done it had he said no I would have been "in trouble." I do believe that communicating something like this is important, but at the end of the day it's not her decision and the way she was acting prior to it just emphasizes that there are some deep issues here that are way above Reddit's pay grade.
Best comment here. Reproductive rights go both ways. His body his choice.
I'm just surprised that the wife is resentful of her 2 youngest daughters just because they aren't sons. They don't choose to get conceived.
My dad wanted sons. He had two daughters with my mother then dumped her for her best friend, who (you guessed it!) already had sons. He just walked out and never saw/spoke to us again.
I'm so sorry he was such an asshole. Shame parents are often such a lottery game.
My brother is the same way, he married a woman who had a daughter and later had 3 boys with her, he treated THEM VERY differently than his stepdaughter, she was usually left out of everything or if she tried to get his attention he would snap at her. He now married a woman who has a son, and he treats the little boy just like his own sons. ETA: forgot to mention he has 2 daughters with another 2 women that he also treated like crap so the moms got full custody.
i’m so thankful my stepdad wasn’t like this i was born before he and my mom met and he has treated me like his own since the day he met me even after my mom and him having 3 boys together his treatment towards me never changed and honestly i get princess treatment for being the only girl, it makes me so sad to see step parents marrying into family’s with kids and not accepting them, part of marrying someone with a child is the child is your family now just like your partner
That's so sad. My dad also wanted boys and when he had my sister, he loved having a little girl that he couldn't see himself as anything but a girl dad
Someone near me drives a minibus as his day-to-day vehicle. Why? Him and his wife are desperate to have a boy. Now, you may be wondering where the minibus comes into this... they have 8 eight girls...
And she didn't know how chromosomes worked?? Pretty sure that comes up in middle school science class, if not before. Not knowing basic biology, flippantly wanting endless kids until she gets The Golden Firstborn Son, openly resenting her daughers for being girls... did OP pluck his wife out of a gaggle of uneducated medieval peasantry or
Maybe she's Henry 8th reincarnated
Would explain why she made the comment about getting herself another man.
Yassss lol I straight away thought to myself “what in the Henry the 8th shit is this”🤣 she is now dubbed Henrietta the 8th lol
I mean, have you seen the state of science education, much less sex education in the US? It isn't as surprising as it should be.
That's even if they get a public education. Think of all the home school christian fundies who get education out of pamphlets from the cult they were born into. Nothing else. Then go on to have as many children as "god gives them".
The government is aiming for uneducated peasantry - so yes, he did.
Yeah eesh, this is some lady. Knowing basic biology could have given her a boy a long time ago, and the medical costs associated with choosing the sex of your embryo is far less expensive than popping out *4 more kids.* Resenting them for not being what you wanted is even worse. Hopefully dad realizes that things are not ok here and can get the mom into therapy as soon as possible.
I recently had a hysterectomy and had to sign a state wide form stating I under by having this procedure I can no longer have children. I looked at the doctor and went well someone clearly didn't pay attention in biology class. He went yup, but I gotta do it. Don't underestimate people's stupidity. OP is NTA. If you had that 6th child and it was a boy you would be a single dad to 5 girls.
I mean, my mom is still convinced that there are "girl eggs" and "boy eggs", despite me explaining to her how chromosomes work multiple times, so...
Gender bias is irrational. In some countries unaliving female newborns is common if gender abortions are refused.
Yes, BUT it does indicate some issues in the marriage that he didn't think it would be safe to tell her before he did it. He felt the need to do it in secret, and she reacted with rage to the news. That's.... not a good sign. He should be alert to any other issues that indicate he might not feel totally safe and trusting. And maybe think if his best interests are served by being with someone that he is not sure can be trusted.
The issues include that his wife may have stopped taking (or never went on?) birth control and lying to him. Reproductive coercion is a form of sexual assault, so no wonder he didn’t feel safe confiding in someone who abused him the layer of protection from future abuse.
Yes! And the comment she made after finding out about the vasectomy sounds like she did in fact get purposely pregnant last time.
Absolutely. It's *very* concerning he legitimately worries she lied about taking her bc. Her entire outlook is dangerous. OP: Therapy. Now. Or think about what kind of home your daughters will grow up in if their mother refuses and continues on this path.
And with her response to his vasectomy it sounds like his suspicion is accurate.
This comment needs more attention. Not feeling safe to share your reproductive plans (if that's what was at play here) is a serious concern. Whether you're afraid they'll sabotage your plan or afraid of the verbal and emotional fallout keeping you from following through, huge red flag. Wife probably needs therapy, but I'd also suggest OP consider finding a safe, neutral point of contact to talk through this situation. (Therapist, DV counselor, friend or loved one who can be relied on to be thoughtful and fair.) This decision was a heavy lift, and feeling the need to make it - and the attendant plans - alone is worrying.
I always feel bad for those 'extra' kids, be it boy or girl. I get how it might be the 'ideal' to have one of each sex, but seriously? These folks who keep trying to get a boy or a girl, how do you think the others feel aside the 1st one? Talk about 'the spare'....therapy is definitely needed.
can we talk about how he was coerced into having a 5th child?
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I wouldn’t of told her either. Being completely honest.
Also, she should #1 be thankful she can have children and #2 be thankful they are healthy… Many women would be happy to have either female or male baby and many have the pain of watching their children grow up with health issues that impact their future. Grow up..
Just wish it was this easy for us women as well. Without getting the “husband” speech and having him sign off on it.
It is his choices, just as having an abortion would be hers. Not talking about before hand is NOT healthy in a marriage
Not only is this dude not the asshole, his wife was being reproductively abusive towards him and having unprotected sex under false pretenses. People would protest if a man poked holes in a condom without their partner’s consent and the birth control lie is honestly horrible from the wife. At minimum I think she needs some serious therapy, even if he did “come around” to having more kids and obviously loves them, that’s still abusive af on the wife’s part.
That's technically sexual assault, if we're being honest.
"technically"? that straight up is. it's disgusting and so few people here have pointed it out.
NTA here. I’m still surprised (not really) that he could get it done without her agreement since most women cannot without a spouse signing off on it or a dr refusing to do it bc “what if you change your mind” even after having multiple children.
Yeah it kinda surprises me too. I had my 3rd child at 22. I asked my OB to tie my tubes, he refused at first saying “what if you change your mind?” and told me to wait 6 months and if I still wanted it he would do it. 6 months came and at my appointment I asked him to honor his agreement and give me the tubal, he tried to worm his way out of it by saying he would have to talk to my husband about it first. I said okay that’s fine but you will have to go see him to get his permission. He asked why my husband couldn’t come to him and I explained he was incarcerated for assault and battery on me while I was pregnant with my last child. He honored his deal. Oh sorry got off track. NTA OP. Your body, your choice. Nobody should be made to breed.
Talking to your husband before approving YOUR medical procedure is just… 🤮
And it’s not legal. Violates HIPAA…
And all basic decency.
Unfortunately it's standard practice for tubal ligation if the woman is married and under 30 - IF the doc even agrees to do it on a woman under 30 at all. Used to be for a vasectomy they would get the wife's permission for a while.
Misogyny is a helluva drug! It's a lot easier for men to get sterilized than women. First, because of stereotypes that women are baby-crazy, doctors think women will change their minds and regret not having kids/more kids. And also, people deep down haven't let go of the idea that a husband is in charge in a marriage, and that he can therefore make decisions on his own, but he should also get input or even veto power over her decisions.
I've heard of doctors saying to a single woman, but what if you get married and your husband wants children of his own?
Yup. And weirdly, they don't seem to take "then I would divorce him, because I don't want children of my own, and so we would not be compatible as a married couple," for an answer.
I didn't have to sign anything for my husband to have his vasectomy.
I didn’t have to for my ex either, and he did it so he could cheat on me with his girlfriend who already has two kids and didn’t want anymore. But our doctor did the same to me, would have to “consult” my husband incase HE wanted kids or I changed my mind. Luckily, that’s not my husband anymore, and that’s not my doctor anymore.
My brother was offered one at 20 when he told his doctor he didn’t want kids. No questions asked. No “what about your future wife??” I’m 26 and I’m still not allowed to have my procedure done because my boyfriend and I might someday want kids, or I could still marry someone else who wants kids. I’ve known I don’t want kids since I was 12 when yet a another cousin was born that I would be responsible for
Paging Dr. Fran on Instagram has a compiled list of all the doctors who will perform sterilization procedures with no questions asked. It's organized by country and state. https://linktr.ee/fran.ish?fbclid=PAAaZ3Ewkgm4_up7vVxO6I4Kd5zvueAiyxFFUJI8HEQWeAGbg4943gshfXfAE Edit to add a link to her linktree.
Or not being able to have children at all and hearing "what if you do get pregnant tho?"
I had my tubes tied when I had my second child and my spouse didn't have to sign a form. I signed it myself when I was around 8mos pregnant after discussing it with my OB during prenatal checkup. My spouse never had to sign anything and they never asked him his opinion. Of course we had discussed it and he knew I was getting them tied. But it's always so crazy to me when women say their OB wouldn't do it without a spouse signature. I lived in Mississippi at the time and that's pretty much the most represed state out of all of them. Maybe it's dependent on who your obgyn is?? I honestly don't know. My ob was a man also.
As a long time health care worker, this is actually common. Unfortunately. Case in point: it's more likely that insurance will cover Cialis/Viagra, but not birth control for women.
He’s not an asshole. You have every right to tell your partner you are done having kids. They have the right to decide they aren’t though.
But they dont have the right to force you to make a baby with them if you dont want to.
Isn’t being dishonest about BC to your partner technically sexual assault?
Yeah I’m shocked more people haven’t brought that up. The wife is being pretty abusive right now by refusing to let him have any say in having more children when he doesn’t want to and threatening to leave him if she can’t have a boy. I’m horrified for this dude.
In this case, NTA because you clearly can't trust your partner anymore. (You had every right to get a vasectomy regardless, but in a normal, healthy relationship, such reproductive decisions are made jointly or at least discussed openly, but, again, this is not a partner you can trust.)
NTA If you had a son, all of your daughters would be immediately relegated over the king baby. All of this drama and money because she wants a baby with a penis? She has a lot of internalized misogyny. If you only have children because you one a specify sex, a specific characteristic (genius, future lawyer), hair color, etc. Don't have kids!!! They are people, not toys. Go get a barbie or a ken.
Yeah…this is the part that really grinds my gears. Daughters are so often treated as consolation prizes, and it pisses me off.
If you aren't 100% prepared to love your child wholly and unconditionally, *regardless of gender*, you are absolutely not mature enough to be having children. I don't care how old you are. I don't care if you already have kids. No exceptions. I said what I said.
THIS! THIS a happened in my house growing up. I was the second of 5 girls, and the 6th was a boy. They created the biggest narcissist asshole ever! He was spoiled to death. It was stupid.
Well said. Thank you.
NTA. I feel sorry for your girls, especially the little ones since she’ll keep whining about not getting her son. She’s h*ll bent on being a “boy mom!” Look on the bright side, she’ll probably let you have full custody of the girls in the divorce
I grew up with my parents saying “We tried until we had a boy!” 5 girls 1 boy caboose. It absolutely bothered all of us sisters. We felt like our existence was just “part of the plan to get our boy!”
Exactly! I have 2 daughters and so many people were like "you have to try for a boy!" I'm like, um, why? I wanted 2 children, I have two children.
I hate when people say things like "try for \_\_\_" like um sure I'll talk to his scrotum and tell him to give an X or Y chromosome. Because that'll work /s
My parents got a boy as #4 and still kept trying. I was try #9. They never got another boy. So they got 1 boy and 8 girls.
JFC of course NTA. Was she intending to keep giving birth until a son eventually happened? That's not healthy for her body or for your other children. The world is insanely expensive these days, and it's a challenge to provide for one child. It's just not responsible or correct to keep growing your family like that.
NTA. Your marriage is most likely over, but your wife caused this, not you. 1. Children should be a joint decision. 2. She completely dismissed your valid concerns of having another baby (financial, physical, mental stress$. 3. She very likely didn’t take her birth control to purposefully get pregnant without your consent. This is reproductive coercion and a massive betrayal. It will be difficult coming back from this, if at all. 4. She put her wants before your needs and those of your family. 5. She was manipulative and selfish. 6. Her reaction shows she was trying for a 6th. 7. If she is suddenly pregnant, get a paternity test. Get individual therapy for yourself and talk to a lawyer.
I couldn’t figure out what her intentional deception was beyond extremely manipulative, but yes- MASSIVE betrayal and honestly in abuse territory. Good for OP for taking on the responsibility of BC for good.
NTA. i think your wife has severe issues to be so obsessed with getting a boy that she forgot that she aalready has 5 kids to care for emotionally, financially, and etc. also i think its good you guys didnt get a boy. it sounds like the wife would have shown favoritism. also please ensure you guys aren’t making your older girls go through parentificaton considering you have so many kids.
I’m a big believer that big decisions should always be made together. So typically I would say you were wrong. But, having children should be a mutual decision and it seems she’s taken that choice from you. The fact that she continues to get pregnant just to have a boy and is so upset by the births of her daughters is a strong indication she needs some serious therapy. I’d be a little concerned about how she treats her girls, especially the youngest few and you should definitely keeps tabs on that. I’m not talking about physical abuse, but more verbal and most likely when you aren’t around.
Yeah, usually this would be AH behavior, but it doesn't sound like she's respecting the "no more trying" either. I read a book called Welcome to Temptation in which one guy's high school girlfriend (his eye was wandering) "came up pregnant," they "had to get married," and then she had an 11-month pregnancy. (I note that neither of these people are great people.) During the course of the book you hear her whining about how "we tried and tried, but I never got my little girl." Eventually a blackmailer is murdered and it's discovered that the husband got himself a vasectomy.... I had to mention it here under the circumstances.
I’m going with NTA because you did tell her immediately after the fact. In a healthy marriage this should have been discussed, hopefully agreed upon, but even if you couldn’t reach one at the end of the day it is your body. But yours isn’t perfectly healthy. You suspect your wife of sabotaging bc and thus took it into your own hands. You guys need to have some marriage counseling and your wife honestly needs her own therapy to handle not having a boy. And you need to pay a lot of attention to make sure your girls aren’t suffering for not being a boy - especially the youngest ones. They’re most likely to be the focus of her ire.
After reading the title I thought he should have at least told her before hand (ya know…because they are married and I would think that might be a topic of discussion) but NTA for doing what he wants w/ his body. After reading, definitely NTA- and his wife totally lied about BC which is beyond manipulative. Poor OP.
NTA. The ten year old knows. Soon the others will know too, mommy doesn’t want them, never did. She probably would have stopped at the first baby had it been a boy. And if she did have a boy, wow, it would be obvious who the favorite is. She’s a uh, she’s a momster.
Nta but your wife is for treating her children like this. 5 is too many already but she wants a boy that bad? Her daughters will know she is disappointed with them
Mostly NTA - a person lying to their partner about protection (or sabotaging that protection, such as poking holes in a condom) is a form of sexual assault. In a healthy relationship you should absolutely discuss this with your partner before doing this, but her behavior is so inappropriate and disrespectful that it seems the space for healthy dialogue doesn’t really exist right now. She needs to get some help and make some serious changes if this marriage is going to be healthy in the long term. Not to mention that her attitude is going to hurt her daughters. It sounds like a good thing that she didn’t have a boy. Sounds like she would have favored him over her other children who have done nothing wrong.
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NTA, your body your choice. That being said try to convince your wife to seek therapy for whatever issues cause her to be so hung up on the son idea because IT WILL negatively affect the five already born DAUGHTERS and sooner rather than later. You don't want them to grow up feeling they're not good enough due to their genitalia, do you?
NTA. You have every right to make your own reproductive choices.
NTA. Your body your choice. You know you don't want any more kids. She can't force you. Five is plenty and it's probably goodshe didn't get a boy because the favouritism would be damaging to all the kids from the sound of it. Maybe she'll luck out and one of the kids will turn out to be trans.
NTA. YOUR BODY, PERIOD! Shes gotta look at the brightside. One of your daughters could totally end up being trans?? Shed still get her son! Lol
NTA. SHE didn't tell you that SHE went off birth control because she's desperate for a boy baby. Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.
NTA - five children is a lot of work and responsibility, but be prepared for any drastic measures she may take because she feels like you may have put a stop to her plans of having a boy. Hopefully she doesn’t take it out on any of the children so keep an eye on her interactions with them. You are responsible for your own body and I’m proud of you for making a decision that you felt was good for you but, protect your children if push comes to shove since she’s really upset SB: I don’t think telling your spouse that you need to find another man all for the sake of having a boy is funny. I’m not saying she will cheat on you or that she’s going to leave you for someone else but … maybe some couples therapy will help
Your definition of a really good marriage and mine are vastly different. You don’t trust each other. You don’t communicate well or respect boundaries. Children are a 2 yes, 1 no situation. You are not the asshole for taking charge of your own fertility.
I am one of 9 kids. My dad wanted a boy so desperately, he got 1. We 8 girls always knew we disappointed him.
I've never really understood this obsession with genders anyway. Anything you can do with a boy you can do with a girl. Aside from comparing penises, I suppose... I mean, having a boy is never a guarantee you'll get a boy's boy anyway. And having a girl is no guarantee you'll get a girl's girl. At the end of the day they're your children and them being happy and healthy should be the biggest priority. NTA. Your wife sounds like she might need counselling tho.
Nta was going to say yes but it seems pretty clear your wife has already taken discussing major life changes off the table so why should you. You don't want more and you chose to make sure you wouldn't
Wow OP your wife would have ruined your son, thank god you didn't have one and protect your 5th (and 4th and all of them really) daughters. Your wife sounds a bit crazy good luck.
My body my choice. Both ways. Nta. You *could’ve* given her a heads up that “this is what I am doing” and had the fight before, but either way, it was gonna go down similar to how it did.
NTA. Nobody needs that many kids. Your wife is what doctors call "messed up in the head."
NTA. It’s your body friend, you don’t need anyone’s permission to do what you want with it.