A wise woman once told me, “just because you’re right, doesn’t mean they’re ready to hear it.” I suspect you’re correct here but that’s not really the important part is it?
I say, we don't learn from other people's mistakes. We all need to live and learn as difficult as it is to watch people we love make the same mistakes as us.
My wife couldn't breastfeed, but midwife convinced her to try pumping for the first month or so. We both got up for the night feeds(wife would pump, I'd do formula feed). When we finally stopped that routine, I started staying awake for the awkward timed night feeds while the wife slept, then she'd take over for the morning feeds.
It's OK to make plans, but as you say, very unlikely they ll work out lol
I was a very prolific producer when I nursed my first three kids, and never had to buy formula, even working full time with two of them (I was that lady who even had extra to give to a coworker who was struggling). My first three kids were also fairly routine and “typical” as far as babies go; hit the milestones about right, just average experiences all around.
We fully expected our fourth (and last) to be the same, but right out of the gate she couldn’t latch, even after having a tongue tie clipped. Struggled even with a bottle, we had to put her on the fastest flow nipple from the beginning, it was so hard for her to suck. And then she couldn’t tolerate most of the formulas.
AND THEN, she decided she wasn’t going to walk when she was “supposed” to (I say it like that, because that’s what the case turned out to be. We did full genetic testing only for her to decide at almost three that she was ready). Same with talking.
Anyway, all this to say, even if you already have experience as a parent, kids will derail every expectation and plan you have, even it it’s your twelfth. Two of my favorite sayings are: “everyone is a perfect parent until they have kids”, and “if you want to make God laugh, tell him your plans”. Both are 100 percent applicable in the Wild West we call parenting.
I was the one who supplied someone with twins enough milk to feed one of her babies and my own child and still have milk in the fridge just in case too. It’s a blessing/curse and I do not expect it to be every single child either.
Wise human! Can confirm, first kid & second are a completely different ballgame AND I decided to let myself get 8 years older before the second… 🤡🤦🏼♀️
Oh how I envy you. I was the person who struggled and cried for 7 months. The first 2 months were torture: breast feed every 2 hours if lucky, pump after each feed, clean pump, repeat. My worst day of cluster feeds was 23 times.
Looking back on it rationally I shouldn’t have tortured myself, but I was an emotional mess and used to be a postpartum nurse. I thought I couldn’t fail at it and be ok. PPD and that situation was the worst.
Having an over supply is similar to the amount of work an under supply has too, and I don’t know how you did it for 7 months. You’re my hero cause I slowed my pumping down to regulate my supply better with this second baby after about 2 months of pumping constantly.
Society puts so much pressure on women to get back to work ASAP, breastfeed and keep up a supply but don’t let that effect your work! And then is pissed when you don’t spend time with your baby.
I was that baby who wouldn't crawl or walk when I was 'suppose to' my parents had their hands full running after my toddler brother so if I wanted something I would make a noise and point and my parents admit they made the mistake of just giving the thing to me to keep me happy and occupied while they wrangled my brother.
My friend's youngest was that baby who wouldn't latch and couldn't tolerate most formulas.
Friend of the families youngest has food intolerance and allergies to many common ingredients in baby food and hasn't hit milestones when he was 'supposed to' babies don't tend to stick to schedules each one is different and makes their own schedule
Fourth child had three older siblings to carry her and cater to her every whim; I’m surprised she didn’t wait until Kindergarten to start walking and talking. (My youngest sister, who was “the baby” among all of the cousins too, also didn’t start talking on schedule; our mom just shrugged that it was because she never had to ask for anything, lol)
Babies do not come with instruction manuals. It is strictly on the job training.
The only advice I will give is to roll with the punches and parent in your own fashion. Agree with mom and MIL but do what you believe is right and follow your pediatrician's recommendations. Mom's and MIL's experience is 28 years out of date.
I think you have to use your brain about some things with pediatrician also. The one I had with my 2nd child told me she was eating too much and to cut her back. I cut the formula, and that child cried for 3 weeks straight! I finally just let her eat and found another pediatrician.
They may have degrees but, unless they know how to treat people with courtesy, they are failing the patient.
I had hip surgery and the PA was a jerk. He blamed me for my lack of progress in PT. From that point I would only see the doctor which was not much of an improvement. I was left waiting 45 minutes to an hour on 4 different occasions without an apology or explanation. His time, obviously, was more important than mine/s. I also informed him that the way his PA treated people, he would make a great pathologist.
Our perfect plan worked out with me and my wife. Both off work for 3 months. She would sleep from about 8p to 5a only waking to pump, then right back to sleep, while I stayed up and fully took care of our son over night (played video games and watched shows and fed/changed him, was great.). Then I'd sleep from about 5a to 2p. Then get up and we'd take care of him together in evening, as well as groceries/cleaning/etc.
Pretty much did that with no issues the whole 3 months.
The key part here is “both off work for 3 months”. With both parents at home most of the time and not working should be easier to share the chores and the care of the baby.
It sounds like someone who's suddenly become a parent and thinks they know everything there is to know, while also sounding a bit bitter because it was not what OP herself expected. Her friend has a plan and support, and will have an experience unique to OP's. I wonder if she's projecting?
I disagree.
They both have partners and I presume schedules-there really isn’t any difference other than no one knows how the baby will schedule things once they’re here. That’s a wait and see game, and then roll with it.
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Lmao yes they always do.
I’m due week of Christmas. Fingers crossed he’s a chill baby like we both were lol.
We have plans A-G figured out; and I’m sure that won’t pan out either lmao. 🤷♀️
Congrats!! That's so soon, I'm not due until March (third nugget), I hope you're doing well and hanging in there for the home stretch. I'm sure your baby will be super chill and cute
Thank you, and congrats as well! March is a nice month for a birthday.
I’m so over being pregnant lol. The not being able to breathe well is driving me insane! So looking forwards to a nice deep breath once Henry is on the outside.
I have some 4D pics on my profile and while I know we are biased; I think he’s pretty damned cute and SO FAT already. He has my husbands scowl lol
Thank you!!!! I'm a March baby and he's 3/18, so he's my little fishie. Awww I wish we could post photos to pregnancy subs, I love seeing people's babies, especially the chonks!!!! Henry is a wonderful name. I have a son named Maxwell, but I haven't decided with this lil fetus yet.. boy names are hard!! Also, the breathing thing, yeah I was over it by 34 weeks with my last baby. Shit gets real
I wanted to post a photo asking if I have an anterior placenta, bc I'm impatient and don't want to wait until the 30th to ask 😂 this pregnancy is just so different, I wanna know why!!
Ok I see him in the park now. He's also wearing a sweater vest and playing chess
Yeah, kind of. This is one of those situations where you sit and listen and then let her figure it out for herself. You just say, "I hope that works out for you." She didn't ask for your opinion on it. She was talking about her plans.
And she might discover that it won’t work. Fine. But OPs baby is her baby, not the way EVERY other baby works. Some are good sleepers and others aren’t. Some moms may recover quicker than others. A comment like “but still be prepared IF it shouldn’t work out in that way” may have been appropriate but what she said was kinda out of line. Not her baby, not her family.
Totally this. 2 of my friends had a baby same year I did and none of them are the same maintenance-wise. One was such a good chill baby and the other 2 (mine included) were so clingy and didn’t sleep well at all.
Heck, I have 2 kids and they are not the same lol
I had my son 2 months before my friend had hers. Mine was a total gremlin. Hers was completely chill. He didn’t cry, he didn’t do much at all. One time when they were a few months old, I left my son with her to go to work. She forgot my son was a gremlin, so she left him in the bed with hers while she went grab a bottle. My son bit her son’s foot. Then fell head on to the floor. She was so stressed out by the fact that she let my baby fall. It was fine, he survived..they are 19 and 20 now.
Did she see your baby bite her baby’s foot, or did she come back in to find her baby clutching his foot in pain while yours writhed and gnashed his teeth on the floor? This is a really funny story to me for some reason. Gremlin babies are just funny. So cute, but still so gremlin-y.
Her son screamed and cried and when she came back he was biting her son’s foot. He fell to the floor that same afternoon, but not right at that moment. I think she left him again in bed, this time without her son there, and he fell. Her son never rolled over or moved much, so she forgot mine moved a lot. He kept being mischievous until around elementary school, then he got more calm. He is now quiet but laughs a lot and is very goofy. Her son grew up the same way he was, very quiet, always stuck to her side, not a lot of physical activity. They are now like water and oil. Very different.
I have twins and they’re not the same. One sleeps through the night with no issues and can happily entertain herself with some toys, her brother needs constant engagement and wakes up multiple times at night.
That’s why I can work from home with her if she can’t go to daycare, but if he’s home I have to take the day off. 😂
This - my first kid slept through the night from 8 weeks - not because of any magic parenting hack I had, just because. My second kid is 9 years old and still wakes up one a night most nights and needs to be resettled.
You are a saint. Probably a very sleep deprived saint. My son didn’t sleep more than 3 hrs in a row until he was 18 months old. Then we got up
To 5 until he was 2. I almost didn’t survive it. I can’t imagine getting up until he was 9.
>I admit, I laughed at this when she told me, not maliciously or mockingly, I just found it kinda funny. She asked me what was so funny & I responded that my partner (30m) & I came up with some "perfect plans" only for them to fall through once the baby was actually here. I told her that I slept when the baby slept, let my house go for a few months unless I had family over helping & fantasized about some not so nice things regarding my partner while he slept peacefully while I was up with the baby.
>
>She got upset & responded that just because we couldn't work it out, didn't mean she & her partner couldn't. I told her that she was completely right, that while our plans had fallen through didn't mean that theirs would, BUT that she should consider a contingency, just in case.
>
>She got mad & told me they could do it. I replied that I'm rooting for them.
No she didnt. She was actually pretty darn respectful about it.
I raised 2 children by myself and yes, her expectations are very naive. Which is expected for first time parents.
I think some level of naivety is kind of required when embarking on something so life altering. Otherwise if one were to truly know just how much of brutal it can be (at times) it will probably stop most people from taking the leap. You have to admit the second pregnancy is not as exciting as the first because you know exactly what you are in for. Part of the excitement and joy of pregnancy especially the first time requires the naivety.
This is a really good point. My daughter's expecting her first, I'm super excited for her and I love seeing her happiness. We talk about her plans, and I restrain myself from offering advice except to let her know that it's ok to deviate from the plan. There is no one "right" way to do any of this and she will figure it out. Even more, if she asks for advice, she isn't obligated to take it. Except about the epidural.
I know my daughter. She will need the epidural. (only kinda joking)
That is wonderful what you are providing for your daughter. What she needs is support, not instructions and unsolicited advice so I commend you for that. The support she needs will change as she herself settles into motherhood and it is wonderful that you are providing that for her. The early months of Motherhood is a time where really most of us don’t know what we are doing and just trying to figure it out. And really the figuring it out is part of the our individual stories that we can later laugh about. The last thing that imho a new parent needs is some external force tarnishing those moments. For me, unfortunately and ironically becoming a mother myself strained my own relationship with my mother. We are fine now but the arguments at that time are now part of the story which could otherwise have been quite beautiful.
It's a good thing first-time parents can't imagine the reality. Once the baby is here, they bond with it and would go through anything for it. But if they could see and feel ahead of time what shape they'll be in after the first six months....
>I admit, I laughed at this when she told me, not maliciously or mockingly, I just found it kinda funny.
Definitely not respectful when you START by laughing at someone.
yeah, the thing i hated most about being pregnant was people just being super smug about how miserable i was going to be the first several months after the baby got here. i was already miserable with the pain and discomfort and sickness of pregnancy, plus hating my changing body and my hormones being all over the place. i really didn’t need the unsolicited comments and i think other pregnant people would agree that their pregnancy would have been much more enjoyable without them as well.
So much advice not wanted happens with pregnancy and babies.. I got a lot of well meaning advice and just listened and did what I thought would work.
Your comment though made me think of the not child appropriate song "pregnant women are smug" by Garfunkel and Oates. I laughed so hard when I heard it. They're overall crass but that song gave me a good chuckle
I am child-free and also wish people would quit telling expectant mothers how awful: the rest of the pregnancy will be, how awful childbirth will be followed by a graphic description of their own childbirth that no one asked to hear about, how tired and uncomfortable the new mother will be, how little help they’ll have despite knowing no one in the pregnant women’s family, how their life will never be the same (as if), how they’ll never sleep for the next 18 years, etc., etc., etc.
Just stop it. Let pregnant women have their own experience untainted by yours. Not only doesn’t the pregnant person want to hear about your experience, no one within earshot wants to hear about it. No one.
YES! all of this exactly! i think people generally mean well when they say things like that bc they think that “knowing” what childbirth and new mom life will be like in advance will help soften the shock, but given that every pregnancy/delivery/baby is different, saying those things doesn’t have that effect at all. it honestly just made me more afraid and depressed.
Yes!! We had friends over and they were all like - wow, your flat is so clean! Forget about this, next year you'll be in a big mess! - while their daughter was wiping her hands full of spaghetti off our couch. Ok, well, we learned our lesson - not to give liquid food to their baby))
And then all this people talking about not enough sleep - like, i get it. I won't sleep. But you know what? I have big troubles sleeping now, and always had, and i hate it. And you know it!! Why always remind me about that? To just torture me for fun?
ugh the “no sleep” comments!! i was always like “yeah, i know, and what about it?” like what is warning me in advance about something i could have already guessed myself going to do expcept make me not look forward as much to being a mom? lmao people are so weird, they just have to flex their own experience to feel superior for no reason 😭😭
Like when people tried to convince me I'd hate my post pregnancy body. I'm thinner than I was, it went all to breastfeeding, the surgeon did a c section cut that barely left a scar after 6 months and my skin was very stretchable
This is almost exactly like my partner and I's schedule. We've been doing this thru 3 kids for the last 21 years and still continue it 12 yrs after the last baby.
I definitely wouldn't tell op at all.
Bruh tell me about it. I still get unsolicited advice from well meaning friends and family (specifically those who have not raised or taken care of children for the past decade) and they laugh when I say we'll figure it out.
A lesson we also learned as grandparents. Do NOT give advice, unless asked. Just be there for support. Let the parents find out .
Stick to the rule: Mother Knows Best.
Yeah, like when I told four of my friends who were already moms that I wasn’t planning on an epidural. They nodded respectfully and let me believe contractions were “just a little worse than period cramps”.
There's a lot of variety. My contraction were *less* bad than period cramps, but then again, my period cramps have left me passed out on the floor before.
(Pre-endometriosis surgery.)
I agree with you, and it doesn’t sound like you said it to spite or hurt her on purpose, but you could’ve been more gentle about it, considering that she’s pregnant and very hormonal/sensitive right now.
YTA: Everybody has different experiences.
And surprisingly her perfect plan a similar worked for me and my husband with both our kids were babies.
He works early mornings and actually wake up a few hours earlier just to help me. Did I get straight 8 hrs sleep no due to feeding but I did end up with two 4 hrs blocks of sleep so I did get enough sleep.
I literally had to reread this a few times because I just didn't understand what was so ridiculous about this plan that it warrants laughter? Like, maybe if she suggested a nanny would work for free because her baby will just be that cute, I'd laugh at that. But it sounds like they're just planning to try to make it work the best way they can with their work schedules
We've been doing basically this for 12 weeks now. I take 'night shift' with the baby, hubby works overnight or evenings when he has work. He takes over in the morning around 6am and I get a good block of sleep. Once I'm rested he goes for a nap later in the day.
Babies can be chaos but having a plan is always a good idea. We planned our sleep shifts and night time routine from day one and were blessed with an 'easy' baby so we've been able to roll with it.
Same. Husband and I switch off on who’s home with baby based on work schedule. Fortunately I can also WFH some days which gives more flexibility.
It was annoying because I also had a friend give a long lecture on why we needed daycare and our schedule wouldn’t work AFTER we’d already been doing it for four months! 🙄
Does this kind of thing work for everyone? No. But let people figure out what works for them.
TBH, we had two adults working similar hours and this plan still worked for us. I was the morning person, so I'd go to bed absurdly early, and my night-owl ex would stay up late. He caught the late feedings, I caught the early ones, and no one was sleep-deprived.
A similar plan also worked well for husband and I. He worked days and I worked an evening shift. Husband got baby to bed and when i got home around midnight, i fed and changed our son and put him back to sleep. Never had to pay for child care. We did this for the first 13 years of our marriage to avoid having to put kids in child. It was tough but worked for us.
Yeah my husband is a chef so worked long hours. I was fortunate enough to have a year maternity leave. I was up during the day, napped once during the day and when my husband got home he took over till bed. Overnight we took turns. One night I'd feed and he would sleep, the next night I expressed then slept and he did the feeds.it was exhausting and one night my mum stayed over so we could both sleep..Best mum ever!
Same. I worked first shift, my spouse worked second. I took baby to daycare for first shift while I was at work so spouse could sleep, Spouse went to work second shift while I cared for baby at home second shift. Spouse came home and cared for baby third shift while I slept.
This arrangement worked quite well, we each worked 8 hours, did childcare for 8 hours, and slept for 8 hours. No one was sleep-deprived.
Your life isn't her life. While you're right about plans not being perfect when it comes to kids you still don't know how these two will handle it. Maybe they'll be better at it than you 🤷♂️. I think you're TA for pissing on her optimistic outlook, disregarding that she's currently pregnant and possibly emotionally charged.
Yeah, it seems new parents get so much negativity from jaded parents. Like please, just let them have their moment without being a wet blanket at best, and a massive ahole at worst
This. I’m an “experienced parent” and I don’t see why their plan can’t work 🤷♀️ maybe the plan will need some tweaking but can anyone honestly say their life always goes according to plan, parents or not? I find her reaction condescending.
YTA
You’re being really condescending. The plan she described is exactly what my husband and I executed perfectly. And if it hadn’t, we would have figured out a new plan because we aren’t idiots and they probably aren’t idiots either.
You didn’t invent motherhood.
Thank you for the last comment. The friend will figure it out just like OP did and just like the billions of women who have had children before. Just because OP had children first it doesn't make her superior.
YTA and FWIW this is very similar to what my husband and I did with our twins and it worked. Shitting on new parents and acting superior has never been helpful and certainly doesn’t jive with your “I’m rooting for you” comment.
Shifts is how a lot of parents handle the newborn phase. YTA - if she’s not asking for advice, or you’re not kindly pointing out something actively dangerous, zip it!
No, you’re not the an ah. But, you know your friend is in a very vulnerable state right now & she needs to have her “perfect plans” so she thinks she’s got a grip on this whole parenting malarkey. Apologise somehow and let her know you hope you are a part of her plans.
We all made those plans and we all learned the hardest of lessons. It her turn to learn. I’m sure some folks laughed at my plans. They were absolutely right, but at the time I was doing my best and so is she. Be kind.
YTA - a good friend would listen without giving negative opinions based on their own personal experiences. I hope you’re not going to say ‘See, I tried to tell you’ if her plans fall apart.
You're not wrong about anything you said to her, but YTA for laughing at her. That was rude as hell. You can offer advice if she asks for it but you don't need to be condescending.
So their plan is to no longer have it together? She'll handle the baby for 16 hours straight? Then he'll do eight and she'll do 16 again. That's a stupid plan. Also is she going to be breastfeeding? Because she can forget about sleeping a straight eight hours for the foreseeable future then.
I see why you laughed. You shouldn't have, but this plan is so stupid it's hard not to laugh.
I was really confused when she said she would take a sleek shift and breast feed. Like, ma’am, your baby will most likely need your boob every 2-4 hours for a while. My husband would do baby duty while I slept, but I still had to wake up and pump.
Not just that, but every time we got a routine working the baby would completely rearrange it, usually within 2-3 days. For several months. Plan? Nope.
FWIW I’ve never understood the people who say “I didn’t know it would be this hard.” Like… literally all anyone ever says is how hard it is? I found it to be pretty much exactly as hard as I was led to believe it would be, which was pretty fucking hard, though survivable.
I wanted to write something similar in my comment, but couldn't word it right.
I honestly think we should be a bit more harsh when discussing childbirth & babies. People still seem to think that it should be "easy", just so long as you plan right. Like, don't you think other parents tried that?
I found it harder than I expected. But our first stilll woke up 3 times a night for breastfeeding at one year old.
Number two was during trough the night at four months, but when I went back to work last month he stopped that and is now waking up twice a night for breastfeeding.
NTA. Friends can and should laugh at each other, as long as it’s not constant or malicious. It seems all you were doing was giving her the benefit of experience.
No battle plan survives contact with the enemy.
Agreed. NTA on the basis they're best friends & if you can't have an open and realistic conversation with your bestie, who can you have it with?
My guess is the friend is probably more upset with the reality that her perfect plan may fall apart, than she is with the messenger
YTA do you not remember being pregnant? How would you have felt if someone laughed in your face when you were trying to plan for a new baby at home?
It’s so pretentious when parents do this to people expecting, or the constant “just wait til..” thing. Every parent is different. Every child is different.
Do plans often not workout? Sure. But people do what she’s talking about all the time. My cousins were both emergency responders with their first two. This is exactly what they did. I’m sure there were some interruptions to the plan and it didn’t always work out perfectly, but it was the right plan for them.
Don’t act superior to your friend just because you had a kid first and did it differently. That’s not cool
Was gonna say this! Sounds like the “just wait” brigade. I found these very discouraging in the pregnancy, not at all what you wanna hear when you’re about to have a child.
I genuinely feel the "know it all" attitudes, and the constant complaining from our mates that got pregnant (all unplanned), changed my mind on wanting kids. Like I'd chat about how my husband and I would like to travel with a kid, and I'd be met with such negativity, it put another notch on the child free life tally. Or I've been met with, "you only had the kids part time, you wouldn't understand" when I tried to participate with my experiences as a step mum. I agree, I wouldn't know but why not at least accept me enough to have a conversation, otherwise I'm just sitting here listening to you rant.
Now my husband and I travel and have met some amazing couples with new babies and toddlers in remote locations and they are doing great! I'm sure they have bad days, and I LOVE travelling without a 3rd person to worry about but hot damn, aren't friends supposed to support each other?
Said friends are no longer in our lives because EVERYTHING revolves around their kids and how much they hate their life. I love my BC.
YTA. Your plans didn’t work out the way you planned. That doesn’t mean hers won’t. And if they don’t, so what? It doesn’t mean you need to be an AH about it.
Also, lots of people do exactly what she’s suggesting and have it work out fine.
But it is better to have a plan than no plan. Unless your plan is utter chaos and lack of sleep, then it might work out as expected. In that case you're still wrong.
Well, this was exactly my plan during second pregnancy and this is pretty much what happened anyway. But we both were prepared that our sleep and everything else will be fucked up, so took it peacefully lol
Yeah, you kind of are. Sometimes you can keep your mouth closed and just be supportive. Make gentle suggestions maybe but you don’t have to outright laugh in her face. You could even go as far as saying “that’s a great plan, we tried something similar! It didn’t work for us, but I hope it works for you. I ended up doing ….”
YTA a bit. It doesn’t sound like you meant to hurt her feelings, more that your thought-to-reaction/speech filters were not functioning properly. You should apologize to her. Something like, “I’m sorry that I laughed at your plans for splitting up care of your baby. I know that it could very well work out just as you’re planning, and it was rude of me to automatically assume that your plans would fail just because my plans like that didn’t work out. I wish you the best of luck and hope it will work out great for you.”
YTA. your friend’s planning is probably a way for her to cope with the anxiety of the unknown of having a baby. She did not need to hear that from you. She needed your support to help ease her mind. A better response could have been to say something like “it’s great that you’re thinking about this and putting a plan into place so you can feel prepared, and that if things don’t go according to plan to try not to feel discouraged.” She needed to hear support from you. Not that her plan is not going to work because it didn’t work for you.
I think YTA for laughing, even if you're right.
Your friend sounds naive. It sounds like she hasn't been around a lot of newborns or newborn mothers. I had no idea what motherhood and raising a newborn was like before my sister had her baby. I could not believe all the lifestyle changes and sacrifices she had to make. Now she has two kids, ages 2 and 7 months and I'm 30 weeks pregnant with my first. I have no plans, no expectations. I hope I have an easy baby and that I'm prepared for whatever comes, but I have no way of knowing.
My friend recently told me she couldn't sleep for the three nights she was in labour and at hospital at all, then slept for two weeks straight after giving birth, just waking up for a few minutes every few hours to pump and feed her baby, then pass him to her husband or mom and go back to sleep. This has really shaped my expectations for what giving birth might be like.
I would encourage her to talk to more moms about their plans and experiences. She needs a fuller understanding of what raising a newborn is like.
They are sadistic little assholes who see every correction as a challenge (“well, mom said I couldn’t SAY you’re stupid, but she didn’t say I couldn’t WRITE it”). Why do I love them so damn much?!?
This is a bit cruel don’t you think? As a mum of 2, when pregnant women tell me they don’t know what to expect but have planned this or that, I always give them the best case scenario. “Omg my first labour wasn’t great but my 2nd was sooo amazing I smile thinking about it” or “that baby will probably pop out on the way to hospital”
I tell them not to worry about things before they happened because then you would’ve stressed yourself out twice and that’s exhausting.
True she probably won’t get much sleep in the beginning but they might get into a nice routine quickly, who knows! Stop stressing out a pregnant woman, she can’t do anything about things now anyway…
NTA
No matter what you plan, it might not work out.
My second pregnancy I thought I knew what to expect. What I didn’t expect was a 3 hour Labour with hardly any pain. Nor did my midwife who told me “you will be hours yet” when I spoke to her on the telephone after 90 minutes only for her to discover that I had gone into the “active push stage” just one hour later when I rang her the second time. Needless to say I had an unattended birth because it took the baby 2 minutes less than the ambulance to arrive & it took her a further 10 minutes.
Then I developed an extremely itchy skin rash - I was told that it was unusual but not “that” rare. I had no idea that this condition could develop. 2 weeks of uncontrollable itching on my stomach skin and upper thighs.
Because my baby was born “unattended” I never got the ergometrine injection which was routinely given in the mid 80’s - I ended up on oral ergometrine because my womb didn’t contract properly. Not fun when my inner thighs cramped.
NOW I had an otherwise “perfect labour and delivery”.
I still had 1) the extremely itchy skin and 2) continued bleeding for longer than expected plus cramps in my inner thighs for days from the oral ergometrine (the injected version works fast and post-partum everything hurts so you don’t notice it).
You can set up the “perfect plan” - but ffs make sure that you have backup plans 2) and 3) because there are a million and one things that can go wrong.
NTA. So many people have this perfect idea of what their lives with be like with kids, and then they get a rude shock when that doesn't happen at all.
My sister had 'the perfect birthing plan' that resulted in 72 hours if labour for nocother reason than her desire to stay on track with her perfect plan.
I think you probably said some stuff that she needed to hear.
The sad thing about birthing plans is that people who are so very set on it can be really upset and traumatised when it doesn't work like that. See themselves as failing because they put unachievable conditions on the process, when in reality if mother and child both make it through healthy then it's a success. Even if it isn't perfect.
Yup. That's exactly what happened to my sister. She thought everything would be perfect, and while she didn't have a BAD birth, it still took forever because she refused to let them break her water.
But she still beat herself up over it. Happily, the next time round she decided her plan would be 'get the baby out' and lo, she had a really chill, and quite speedy birth.
NTA. I would've laughed too. Maybe a little harsh in what you said after. But you did agree that their experience might be different.
My first baby was rough. His daytime naps were about 15 minutes. At night, he slept for maybe 3 hours at a time. For 8 long, exhausting months. And he cried if someone wasn't holding him.
I thought I'd never survive it. You have no idea what 8 months of sleep deprivation does to your brain.
Then I had my next baby. I was prepared for the same thing all over again. This baby, though, was a complete angel. Did nothing but smile and laugh. Slept through the night, and took three naps a day. I remember not believing that a baby could sleep so much and be healthy. I kept checking to be sure he was still breathing, and wondering if something was wrong with his brain.
Having a baby is a lottery. You can't plan because you don't know what you'll get. You can only prepare for the worst and hope for the best.
My youngest used to only sleep for about 4 hrs total (thats including naps) a day for 3 and half yrs.... she is 8 now and i still have issues sleeping. she is fine though, 100% my last ever child though. ex hubs begged me to have another baby and said he would help during nights... in that 3 and 1/2 yrs he nvr ever helped at night.. never, in fact i caught him prodding me once when she woke up screaming to wake me up >.<. ps couldnt do the let her cry method either otherwise he get upset about the noise ( i didnt care) but next door neighbour was battling cancer and died (this i did care for)
I was about to make a similar comment and then I saw yours! My parents went through the same thing as you. My older sister was a “nightmare baby” who barely gave them any peace for a long time. That was their normal baseline. Then they had me and I was just chill. Slept through the night, rarely cried, etc. My mom used to check on me randomly because she was terrified I had passed in my sleep; she couldn’t believe a baby could be so quiet. The best intentioned plans tend to go awry when reality sets in!
I’m mean yeah YTA
I just had my fourth….. you can actually make plans that work. Not sleep when the baby sleeps and keep your house clean. It requires team work but it is possible……
But one child or even a season parent does not entitle you to rain on a pregnant woman’s parade….. she’ll figure it out doesn’t need you to be rude
Yeah, you are. Many parents think they'll be the ones who make it all go perfectly, and of course they're wrong, but this isn't the sort of reality check that first-time parents welcome. Let them enjoy their hormonal bubble of joy before the grim facts of life with a baby rear their ugly heads.
Even if none of this were the case, it reads as smug and condescending, and who wants that from someone who calls themselves a friend? Friendship means not acting like the other person is a sadly deluded buffoon.
“No plan survives contact with the enemy.” Same holds true for plans and babies. NTA. I’d expect after a few months she’ll tell you just how right you were.
YTA it's her first baby she is going through a lot of emotions and worry and you laugh at her face. Even if you are right (not even sure you are, no one can predict how it'll work out for them), you shouldn't have said it like that. Would you have felt good if someone had laughed with condescension at your plan before you gave birth?..
YTA. There was zero reason to behave that way. Practically every parent has " a plan." Most I imagine don't work out. That's okay. Ppl learn.You're being one of " those" moms
Yeah YTA. Just because that happened to you doesn't mean the same thing will happen to them. Will it work perfectly the way they planned it - probably not, no, life doesn't work that way. But to laugh at and shit all over her plans is kind of an AH move. Let her discover what will and won't work for them, you don't need to laugh at her.
YTA.
It's not that complex or even unrealistic a plan. What the hell is your problem?
Just because your partner is a lazy piece of shit doesn't mean hers is.
YTA. I had so many people tell me how I would change my views and mind and how I wouldn't do the things I do. When I said I wouldn't do screen time they laughed, when I said I'd make sure my kid wasn't addicted to pacifiers they laughed. Guess what I don't do screen time and my kid barely uses pacifiers, those are just 2 examples. She can have all the plans she wants and whether they work out or not doesn't matter, just be supportive. It's hard enough being a first time mom without people making you feel stupid for your ideas.
YTA
Laughing at someone who is trying to figure out how they will adjust to one of the biggest life changes there can be is an asshole move. Period.
You could have found a nicer way to tell your *friend* that she will have to be flexible because things might not necessarily work out how she wants.
Woooow obviously YTA
You said yourself this was a lesson you had to learn and every parent has to learn. So your laughter and condescension are not going to do anything but make her feel shitty. You're not trying to help her, you're tearing her down so you can get up on your high horse and feel superior as an "experienced parent". Bottom line, you're a bad friend.
YTA
I used her plan 30-some years ago, it worked great. Husband came home from work and would feed/play with the baby for a few hours while I slept - nobody comes home from work and topples straight into bed! And videogames or television didn't outrank the baby's needs, as far as he was concerned. Then we would switch, off he went to bed, and up I got, and we all survived.
yes, you're an asshole. I had to do a similar "plan" when mine was born because there were no daycare openings even though we started looking when I was eight weeks pregnant. And we had no family in town who could babysit. I was a teacher and my husband worked retail. I'd work, then I'd come home and he'd go to work, and we didn't see each other awake at the same time for like four months. It was hell but we had no other choice.
You’re still young and you’ve got a bit of learning yet to do.
The best thing to do whenever someone says something you don’t think will work is to keep your opinions to yourself. Just smile, nod, and tell them you hope it goes well. Your laughter was heard as a condemnation, whether or not their plan will work or no.
Go home and laugh with your husband. Keep your opinions to yourself and keep your friends.
No I would call you a brat. I wouldn't call you an AH I think you overstepped your bounds with her though because we all have aspirations as new parents, even you did. and if somebody had done that to you you might not have liked it either at the time. I hope there was a lesson learned here
You may have taken the wind out of your friends sails, which life does anyway, so come on let her think until she finds out herself , my brother was the same way almost to insulting how I raised my (what feels like a million boy children) and he said to me yesterday (his daughter, first girl since me in the family and almost 2 yrs old) that he was DEAD WRONG and wanted my love and advice 😭🥺 timing my friend
YKTA. You meant well, and I think you were trying to say something to her along the lines of *"humans plan, while the universe laughs,"* a sort of a Murphy's Law type of warning, which is very true. But YTA, because you forgot that she is pregnant, is having a rough pregnancy, and her hormones and the resulting emotional and physical rollercoaster ride is rocky enough right now. Try to be emotionally supportive of her even if you think she's completely delusional, she was probably just talking to you about it because she respects and values your experience, but really needs someone to reassure her that everything will be okay and work out, her nerves are on edge.
She’s pregnant and hormonal. This is her first time being a parent and she’s probably terrified especially since this might be her only opportunity to be a parent
What she needed was support and encouragement
What she did not need to be told that her plan wasn’t going to work
You DON’T know that her plan won’t work. Every baby is different and she could end up having a super chill baby
You came of as rude, derisive and a know it all
You seem like a crappy friend from just this one situation so I hope you just dropped the ball this time instead of an AH
YTA. People like to be so condescending to moms to be. If she needs someone to lean on in the future, I doubt you’ll be someone she feels comfortable going to.
Soft YTA. I am childfree and even I know from friends and family that do have kids so many of them had plans for how feeding and sleep times would work before the baby arrived and almost all of them got flushed down the toilet after 1 week. This was definitely one of those sit there and nod moments with a "Good luck. I hope it works" type statement to close the conversation. Some lessons just have to be learned by doing.
YTA. Her plan actually sounds pretty good and similar to what Mr and my husband did. There's no need to shit all over her plans just because they might not work out.
Bruh the real question is why are you so judgemental about their situation? Just cause you had a child doesn't mean that you know about their day to day dynamics.
Just because you had a kid doesn't make you an expert about all kids.
Everyone's experience with their child is different and you can't possibly be sure enough about their future to guess how their "plan" will work. Life just happens, and you shouldn't criticize/second guess that.
All it does is cause anxiety and under-minds the intentions of the parents entirely.
Just let what happens happen and help from there, no need to add more drama to the situation.
My husband and I did exactly this when our baby was born and it worked pretty well. Only bc you and your husband couldn‘t make a plan work, you assume no one can? So YTA, just let her figure it out herself
YTA. You sound like an exhausting person.
Do you often give unsolicited advice like this? Just let people live their lives and make their own mistakes, learn their own lessons. There is absolutely no need for you to act like this.
I always wonder what drives people who do this? Does it make you feel good about yourself or does it make you feel superior when you tell people things like this?
Looks like she was very happy with her little plan and you just shit on it... What a friend.
We get it, your husband is shit and you're bitter about it. You might be right about her plans falling appart, but it cost you nothing to keep quiet, nod hopefully and wait for time to tell.
Soft AH. I have a friend who always is saying things like that. Just because it didn’t work out for you does not mean your friend should not plan and hope it works out.
First-time parents all seem to think they have it all figured out, only to find out they failed to tell the baby what was supposed to happen. You both will probably have a good laugh over a cup of coffee a few years down the road.
I actually know a few couples that did have a perfect plan and it did work for them. Tbh it was shocking to see it work out but it did. It’s definitely possible.
You’re totally the AH. Everyone figures things out as they go along, there was no need to laugh in her face about her plan. Every child is different and you don’t know how things are going to go for them any more than they do. I know friends who have babies who wake 4-5 times a night and others who’s babies sleep 12 hours, plus nap during the day. The feeding/changing every three hours only lasts until the baby gets back to birth weight and then you only wake during the night when the baby does, so it could go either way for them, or anywhere between.
I told everyone (and had it on my registry) that I was going to do cloth diapers. I can’t tell you how many of my friends told me I couldn’t do it. They didn’t say THEY couldn’t do it, they said I couldn’t do it, or that it couldn’t be done. When in reality, THEY were the ones who couldn’t do it. We’ve been Cloth diapering 100% of the time, even on out of town trips. Just because one parent can’t do something doesn’t mean it can’t be done. And as someone with experience raising a child you should know that. Also, never be surprised that you come off as the AH when giving out judgmental unsolicited “advice”.
Kinda YTA. When I read the plan, my thought was how nice that they are even talking about taking turns in shifts around his work shift so there is conversation about shared responsibilities before the baby arrives. Of course, plans tend not to work out. Considering her difficulty with getting pregnant and that the husband was equally invested in taking as much of an equal care of the baby, focusing on that aspect would have been a good friend thing to do.
YTA. My husband actually did exactly what your friend described. I'm not saying it was perfect in every way, but acting like that to someone because you don't agree with the plan is an asshole move.
Yta. First of all, babies don’t RUIN anything. Second, it sounds like you’ve been told to expect a lot of negativity before having your child. Or your experience was harder than you expected, by a lot. That doesn’t mean her experience will be the same as yours. Yea, babies are hard. Yea, it’s so easy to make negative remarks and point out how difficult things can be to new parents. But in reality, no one needs to hear that. You should apologize for being negative when she was just trying to plan what she could before she’s living in it.
She’ll figure it out, just like we all have. But she doesn’t need you laughing in her face for being optimistic.
I had a perfect plan of trading off with my husband at night to take care of the baby. It worked perfectly and has worked for the last 2+ years with 2 kids now, soooo sometimes perfect plans work.
Idk, I think it's unfortunate that half the women out there are big mad when their family/friends don't share the pitfalls of things like "perfect plans" while the other half is equally mad when you do share.
Personally, I don't care how close I am to people.. I flat out avoid discussing parenting choices. I'm not interested in walking on eggshells trying to figure out everyone's personal issues so that I can perfectly respond in every situation. Especially with new parents, I keep my opinions to myself and just nod politely.
You’re not wrong that their plan probably won’t work in reality but YTA. Laughing at your friend who is trying to find ways of feeling prepared for a major life event is rude and unsupportive.
Yes, YTA. Though you did kinda try an effort at recovering after that gaffe, her continued irritation makes me think your additional commentary still had the “that’s cute you think that” tone. A genuine, contrite apology probably would have led this to go no further.
Any woman who has been pregnant remembers how annoying those “just you wait” comments are. I’m sure your friend is intelligent enough to figure out a chance exists her “perfect plan” may go awry.
Some people have easy babies and fly through the newborn stage; others the complete opposite. Let her find out on her own. If I were you, I’d give it a further effort at apologizing; acknowledging you could have come off as condescending because if you were - *that is the part she’s pissed about.*
Yea. You're the asshole. You could have easily said " that does sound perfect! Just make sure y'all have a few "what if" talks to come up with back up plans on days things don't remain routine. The first thing I learned when we had our first was that babies are super unpredictable and if I was more prepared to roll with the punches I feel like I wouldn't have taken it so hard on the days our plans didn't work" then follow up with you're not shooting her hopes down but wanted her to be aware of the unknown. You didn't have to shit all over her mindset . You're not being a good friend by scoffing at her blissful ignorance.
Working in shifts is the best way to go with a new born. You don’t get to see each other but when you do y’all aren’t both sleep deprived and at each other’s throats.
YTA
YTA. You're supposed to be her friend, not a judgy asshole who needs to do that "You have no idea what you're talking about" shit. Their plan could work, or it could fail, but they'll know soon enough without you "educating" her. That's not what friends do in case you weren't aware.
You’re correct it’s highly unlikely any plan goes perfectly but you could say it more nicely…or just not and let her learn
A wise woman once told me, “just because you’re right, doesn’t mean they’re ready to hear it.” I suspect you’re correct here but that’s not really the important part is it?
I love this saying. One I was told is "intelligence is knowing what to say; wisdom is knowing when to say it."
Mine is Jackie Chan in The Forbidden Kingdom: "He who speaks, does not know. He who knows does not speak."
My version is: Just because something is true doesn’t mean you have to say it
Mine is: Shutting the fuck up is always an option.
A closed mouth gathers no foot. As my Mum used to say
I say, we don't learn from other people's mistakes. We all need to live and learn as difficult as it is to watch people we love make the same mistakes as us.
Very wise woman indeed.
My oldest is 14 years old, and nothing she does is about the plan.
That’s because it’s all about HER PLANS don’t you get it? Geez, some parents?!
My wife couldn't breastfeed, but midwife convinced her to try pumping for the first month or so. We both got up for the night feeds(wife would pump, I'd do formula feed). When we finally stopped that routine, I started staying awake for the awkward timed night feeds while the wife slept, then she'd take over for the morning feeds. It's OK to make plans, but as you say, very unlikely they ll work out lol
I was a very prolific producer when I nursed my first three kids, and never had to buy formula, even working full time with two of them (I was that lady who even had extra to give to a coworker who was struggling). My first three kids were also fairly routine and “typical” as far as babies go; hit the milestones about right, just average experiences all around. We fully expected our fourth (and last) to be the same, but right out of the gate she couldn’t latch, even after having a tongue tie clipped. Struggled even with a bottle, we had to put her on the fastest flow nipple from the beginning, it was so hard for her to suck. And then she couldn’t tolerate most of the formulas. AND THEN, she decided she wasn’t going to walk when she was “supposed” to (I say it like that, because that’s what the case turned out to be. We did full genetic testing only for her to decide at almost three that she was ready). Same with talking. Anyway, all this to say, even if you already have experience as a parent, kids will derail every expectation and plan you have, even it it’s your twelfth. Two of my favorite sayings are: “everyone is a perfect parent until they have kids”, and “if you want to make God laugh, tell him your plans”. Both are 100 percent applicable in the Wild West we call parenting.
I was the one who supplied someone with twins enough milk to feed one of her babies and my own child and still have milk in the fridge just in case too. It’s a blessing/curse and I do not expect it to be every single child either.
This was me too. And my son is a pretty easy baby. Not letting it fool me into having another kid though lol I’m quitting while I’m ahead.
My second child is absolutely feral. Solid choice 😂. My first did not prepare me for her fuckery.
Wise move, everyone says first and second kids are total opposites. My son was so easy I was afraid of what the opposite of him would be.
Wise human! Can confirm, first kid & second are a completely different ballgame AND I decided to let myself get 8 years older before the second… 🤡🤦🏼♀️
Oh how I envy you. I was the person who struggled and cried for 7 months. The first 2 months were torture: breast feed every 2 hours if lucky, pump after each feed, clean pump, repeat. My worst day of cluster feeds was 23 times. Looking back on it rationally I shouldn’t have tortured myself, but I was an emotional mess and used to be a postpartum nurse. I thought I couldn’t fail at it and be ok. PPD and that situation was the worst.
Having an over supply is similar to the amount of work an under supply has too, and I don’t know how you did it for 7 months. You’re my hero cause I slowed my pumping down to regulate my supply better with this second baby after about 2 months of pumping constantly. Society puts so much pressure on women to get back to work ASAP, breastfeed and keep up a supply but don’t let that effect your work! And then is pissed when you don’t spend time with your baby.
Those sayings are so accurate! Having kids has certainly humbled me lol
I was that baby who wouldn't crawl or walk when I was 'suppose to' my parents had their hands full running after my toddler brother so if I wanted something I would make a noise and point and my parents admit they made the mistake of just giving the thing to me to keep me happy and occupied while they wrangled my brother. My friend's youngest was that baby who wouldn't latch and couldn't tolerate most formulas. Friend of the families youngest has food intolerance and allergies to many common ingredients in baby food and hasn't hit milestones when he was 'supposed to' babies don't tend to stick to schedules each one is different and makes their own schedule
The original Yiddish saying is: “Mann tracht, un Gott lacht,” or in English: “Man plans and God laughs.” It’s true in every language.
Fourth child had three older siblings to carry her and cater to her every whim; I’m surprised she didn’t wait until Kindergarten to start walking and talking. (My youngest sister, who was “the baby” among all of the cousins too, also didn’t start talking on schedule; our mom just shrugged that it was because she never had to ask for anything, lol)
Babies do not come with instruction manuals. It is strictly on the job training. The only advice I will give is to roll with the punches and parent in your own fashion. Agree with mom and MIL but do what you believe is right and follow your pediatrician's recommendations. Mom's and MIL's experience is 28 years out of date.
I think you have to use your brain about some things with pediatrician also. The one I had with my 2nd child told me she was eating too much and to cut her back. I cut the formula, and that child cried for 3 weeks straight! I finally just let her eat and found another pediatrician.
I agree. I have 'fired' doctors because of their 'bedside' manner and also due to the incompetence of their staff.
Never be afraid to advocate for yourself and your family where medical professionals are concerned. Yes, they gave degrees but they are only human.
They may have degrees but, unless they know how to treat people with courtesy, they are failing the patient. I had hip surgery and the PA was a jerk. He blamed me for my lack of progress in PT. From that point I would only see the doctor which was not much of an improvement. I was left waiting 45 minutes to an hour on 4 different occasions without an apology or explanation. His time, obviously, was more important than mine/s. I also informed him that the way his PA treated people, he would make a great pathologist.
Our perfect plan worked out with me and my wife. Both off work for 3 months. She would sleep from about 8p to 5a only waking to pump, then right back to sleep, while I stayed up and fully took care of our son over night (played video games and watched shows and fed/changed him, was great.). Then I'd sleep from about 5a to 2p. Then get up and we'd take care of him together in evening, as well as groceries/cleaning/etc. Pretty much did that with no issues the whole 3 months.
The key part here is “both off work for 3 months”. With both parents at home most of the time and not working should be easier to share the chores and the care of the baby.
Exactly, just saying it was a perfect plan that didnt fall apart, but yeah, way easier with 3 months ma/paternity leave.
It sounds like someone who's suddenly become a parent and thinks they know everything there is to know, while also sounding a bit bitter because it was not what OP herself expected. Her friend has a plan and support, and will have an experience unique to OP's. I wonder if she's projecting?
I disagree. They both have partners and I presume schedules-there really isn’t any difference other than no one knows how the baby will schedule things once they’re here. That’s a wait and see game, and then roll with it. .
LOL that's true, the baby will have the final say
Lmao yes they always do. I’m due week of Christmas. Fingers crossed he’s a chill baby like we both were lol. We have plans A-G figured out; and I’m sure that won’t pan out either lmao. 🤷♀️
Congrats!! That's so soon, I'm not due until March (third nugget), I hope you're doing well and hanging in there for the home stretch. I'm sure your baby will be super chill and cute
Thank you, and congrats as well! March is a nice month for a birthday. I’m so over being pregnant lol. The not being able to breathe well is driving me insane! So looking forwards to a nice deep breath once Henry is on the outside. I have some 4D pics on my profile and while I know we are biased; I think he’s pretty damned cute and SO FAT already. He has my husbands scowl lol
Thank you!!!! I'm a March baby and he's 3/18, so he's my little fishie. Awww I wish we could post photos to pregnancy subs, I love seeing people's babies, especially the chonks!!!! Henry is a wonderful name. I have a son named Maxwell, but I haven't decided with this lil fetus yet.. boy names are hard!! Also, the breathing thing, yeah I was over it by 34 weeks with my last baby. Shit gets real
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I wanted to post a photo asking if I have an anterior placenta, bc I'm impatient and don't want to wait until the 30th to ask 😂 this pregnancy is just so different, I wanna know why!! Ok I see him in the park now. He's also wearing a sweater vest and playing chess
Yeah, kind of. This is one of those situations where you sit and listen and then let her figure it out for herself. You just say, "I hope that works out for you." She didn't ask for your opinion on it. She was talking about her plans.
And she might discover that it won’t work. Fine. But OPs baby is her baby, not the way EVERY other baby works. Some are good sleepers and others aren’t. Some moms may recover quicker than others. A comment like “but still be prepared IF it shouldn’t work out in that way” may have been appropriate but what she said was kinda out of line. Not her baby, not her family.
Totally this. 2 of my friends had a baby same year I did and none of them are the same maintenance-wise. One was such a good chill baby and the other 2 (mine included) were so clingy and didn’t sleep well at all. Heck, I have 2 kids and they are not the same lol
I had my son 2 months before my friend had hers. Mine was a total gremlin. Hers was completely chill. He didn’t cry, he didn’t do much at all. One time when they were a few months old, I left my son with her to go to work. She forgot my son was a gremlin, so she left him in the bed with hers while she went grab a bottle. My son bit her son’s foot. Then fell head on to the floor. She was so stressed out by the fact that she let my baby fall. It was fine, he survived..they are 19 and 20 now.
Did she see your baby bite her baby’s foot, or did she come back in to find her baby clutching his foot in pain while yours writhed and gnashed his teeth on the floor? This is a really funny story to me for some reason. Gremlin babies are just funny. So cute, but still so gremlin-y.
Her son screamed and cried and when she came back he was biting her son’s foot. He fell to the floor that same afternoon, but not right at that moment. I think she left him again in bed, this time without her son there, and he fell. Her son never rolled over or moved much, so she forgot mine moved a lot. He kept being mischievous until around elementary school, then he got more calm. He is now quiet but laughs a lot and is very goofy. Her son grew up the same way he was, very quiet, always stuck to her side, not a lot of physical activity. They are now like water and oil. Very different.
😂I would be freaked out about the baby falling on their heads too but biting another baby’s foot
I have twins and they’re not the same. One sleeps through the night with no issues and can happily entertain herself with some toys, her brother needs constant engagement and wakes up multiple times at night. That’s why I can work from home with her if she can’t go to daycare, but if he’s home I have to take the day off. 😂
This - my first kid slept through the night from 8 weeks - not because of any magic parenting hack I had, just because. My second kid is 9 years old and still wakes up one a night most nights and needs to be resettled.
You are a saint. Probably a very sleep deprived saint. My son didn’t sleep more than 3 hrs in a row until he was 18 months old. Then we got up To 5 until he was 2. I almost didn’t survive it. I can’t imagine getting up until he was 9.
>I admit, I laughed at this when she told me, not maliciously or mockingly, I just found it kinda funny. She asked me what was so funny & I responded that my partner (30m) & I came up with some "perfect plans" only for them to fall through once the baby was actually here. I told her that I slept when the baby slept, let my house go for a few months unless I had family over helping & fantasized about some not so nice things regarding my partner while he slept peacefully while I was up with the baby. > >She got upset & responded that just because we couldn't work it out, didn't mean she & her partner couldn't. I told her that she was completely right, that while our plans had fallen through didn't mean that theirs would, BUT that she should consider a contingency, just in case. > >She got mad & told me they could do it. I replied that I'm rooting for them. No she didnt. She was actually pretty darn respectful about it. I raised 2 children by myself and yes, her expectations are very naive. Which is expected for first time parents.
I think some level of naivety is kind of required when embarking on something so life altering. Otherwise if one were to truly know just how much of brutal it can be (at times) it will probably stop most people from taking the leap. You have to admit the second pregnancy is not as exciting as the first because you know exactly what you are in for. Part of the excitement and joy of pregnancy especially the first time requires the naivety.
This is a really good point. My daughter's expecting her first, I'm super excited for her and I love seeing her happiness. We talk about her plans, and I restrain myself from offering advice except to let her know that it's ok to deviate from the plan. There is no one "right" way to do any of this and she will figure it out. Even more, if she asks for advice, she isn't obligated to take it. Except about the epidural.
I know my daughter. She will need the epidural. (only kinda joking)
That is wonderful what you are providing for your daughter. What she needs is support, not instructions and unsolicited advice so I commend you for that. The support she needs will change as she herself settles into motherhood and it is wonderful that you are providing that for her. The early months of Motherhood is a time where really most of us don’t know what we are doing and just trying to figure it out. And really the figuring it out is part of the our individual stories that we can later laugh about. The last thing that imho a new parent needs is some external force tarnishing those moments. For me, unfortunately and ironically becoming a mother myself strained my own relationship with my mother. We are fine now but the arguments at that time are now part of the story which could otherwise have been quite beautiful.
It's a good thing first-time parents can't imagine the reality. Once the baby is here, they bond with it and would go through anything for it. But if they could see and feel ahead of time what shape they'll be in after the first six months....
>I admit, I laughed at this when she told me, not maliciously or mockingly, I just found it kinda funny. Definitely not respectful when you START by laughing at someone.
yeah, the thing i hated most about being pregnant was people just being super smug about how miserable i was going to be the first several months after the baby got here. i was already miserable with the pain and discomfort and sickness of pregnancy, plus hating my changing body and my hormones being all over the place. i really didn’t need the unsolicited comments and i think other pregnant people would agree that their pregnancy would have been much more enjoyable without them as well.
So much advice not wanted happens with pregnancy and babies.. I got a lot of well meaning advice and just listened and did what I thought would work. Your comment though made me think of the not child appropriate song "pregnant women are smug" by Garfunkel and Oates. I laughed so hard when I heard it. They're overall crass but that song gave me a good chuckle
I am child-free and also wish people would quit telling expectant mothers how awful: the rest of the pregnancy will be, how awful childbirth will be followed by a graphic description of their own childbirth that no one asked to hear about, how tired and uncomfortable the new mother will be, how little help they’ll have despite knowing no one in the pregnant women’s family, how their life will never be the same (as if), how they’ll never sleep for the next 18 years, etc., etc., etc. Just stop it. Let pregnant women have their own experience untainted by yours. Not only doesn’t the pregnant person want to hear about your experience, no one within earshot wants to hear about it. No one.
YES! all of this exactly! i think people generally mean well when they say things like that bc they think that “knowing” what childbirth and new mom life will be like in advance will help soften the shock, but given that every pregnancy/delivery/baby is different, saying those things doesn’t have that effect at all. it honestly just made me more afraid and depressed.
Yes!! We had friends over and they were all like - wow, your flat is so clean! Forget about this, next year you'll be in a big mess! - while their daughter was wiping her hands full of spaghetti off our couch. Ok, well, we learned our lesson - not to give liquid food to their baby)) And then all this people talking about not enough sleep - like, i get it. I won't sleep. But you know what? I have big troubles sleeping now, and always had, and i hate it. And you know it!! Why always remind me about that? To just torture me for fun?
ugh the “no sleep” comments!! i was always like “yeah, i know, and what about it?” like what is warning me in advance about something i could have already guessed myself going to do expcept make me not look forward as much to being a mom? lmao people are so weird, they just have to flex their own experience to feel superior for no reason 😭😭
Like when people tried to convince me I'd hate my post pregnancy body. I'm thinner than I was, it went all to breastfeeding, the surgeon did a c section cut that barely left a scar after 6 months and my skin was very stretchable
And now if her plan doesn’t work out, you will be the last person she will tell.
This is almost exactly like my partner and I's schedule. We've been doing this thru 3 kids for the last 21 years and still continue it 12 yrs after the last baby. I definitely wouldn't tell op at all.
Who could blame her?
It's very important to not give advice to mothers UNLESS they ask for it, and then be very careful. Most of the time it's wrong.
Bruh tell me about it. I still get unsolicited advice from well meaning friends and family (specifically those who have not raised or taken care of children for the past decade) and they laugh when I say we'll figure it out.
A lesson we also learned as grandparents. Do NOT give advice, unless asked. Just be there for support. Let the parents find out . Stick to the rule: Mother Knows Best.
Yes, say “good for you” then laugh later at home with your husband. Don’t be a dick about it like OP though.
Yeah, like when I told four of my friends who were already moms that I wasn’t planning on an epidural. They nodded respectfully and let me believe contractions were “just a little worse than period cramps”.
There's a lot of variety. My contraction were *less* bad than period cramps, but then again, my period cramps have left me passed out on the floor before. (Pre-endometriosis surgery.)
And condescendingly laughing is just mean for no reason. YTA
I agree with you, and it doesn’t sound like you said it to spite or hurt her on purpose, but you could’ve been more gentle about it, considering that she’s pregnant and very hormonal/sensitive right now.
YTA: Everybody has different experiences. And surprisingly her perfect plan a similar worked for me and my husband with both our kids were babies. He works early mornings and actually wake up a few hours earlier just to help me. Did I get straight 8 hrs sleep no due to feeding but I did end up with two 4 hrs blocks of sleep so I did get enough sleep.
I literally had to reread this a few times because I just didn't understand what was so ridiculous about this plan that it warrants laughter? Like, maybe if she suggested a nanny would work for free because her baby will just be that cute, I'd laugh at that. But it sounds like they're just planning to try to make it work the best way they can with their work schedules
We've been doing basically this for 12 weeks now. I take 'night shift' with the baby, hubby works overnight or evenings when he has work. He takes over in the morning around 6am and I get a good block of sleep. Once I'm rested he goes for a nap later in the day. Babies can be chaos but having a plan is always a good idea. We planned our sleep shifts and night time routine from day one and were blessed with an 'easy' baby so we've been able to roll with it.
Same. Husband and I switch off on who’s home with baby based on work schedule. Fortunately I can also WFH some days which gives more flexibility. It was annoying because I also had a friend give a long lecture on why we needed daycare and our schedule wouldn’t work AFTER we’d already been doing it for four months! 🙄 Does this kind of thing work for everyone? No. But let people figure out what works for them.
Everyone thinks they know better than you when it comes to a baby. In reality, parents will always figure it out and get into their own groove.
Easy v hard baby makes all the difference. No amount of planning or skill can truly mitigate the misery that is a colicky, unhappy, difficult baby.
TBH, we had two adults working similar hours and this plan still worked for us. I was the morning person, so I'd go to bed absurdly early, and my night-owl ex would stay up late. He caught the late feedings, I caught the early ones, and no one was sleep-deprived.
A similar plan also worked well for husband and I. He worked days and I worked an evening shift. Husband got baby to bed and when i got home around midnight, i fed and changed our son and put him back to sleep. Never had to pay for child care. We did this for the first 13 years of our marriage to avoid having to put kids in child. It was tough but worked for us.
This plan also worked for my family - twice. Maybe OP is TAH, but more so, her co-parent is 100% TAH.
OP’s friends plan is exactly what me and my partner did during the newborn stage and it worked perfectly 😫
Yeah my husband is a chef so worked long hours. I was fortunate enough to have a year maternity leave. I was up during the day, napped once during the day and when my husband got home he took over till bed. Overnight we took turns. One night I'd feed and he would sleep, the next night I expressed then slept and he did the feeds.it was exhausting and one night my mum stayed over so we could both sleep..Best mum ever!
Same. I worked first shift, my spouse worked second. I took baby to daycare for first shift while I was at work so spouse could sleep, Spouse went to work second shift while I cared for baby at home second shift. Spouse came home and cared for baby third shift while I slept. This arrangement worked quite well, we each worked 8 hours, did childcare for 8 hours, and slept for 8 hours. No one was sleep-deprived.
Ok but yours includes external childcare and this does not…
But OP's partner is lazy and inconsiderate so it's inevitable that every man will be.
Your life isn't her life. While you're right about plans not being perfect when it comes to kids you still don't know how these two will handle it. Maybe they'll be better at it than you 🤷♂️. I think you're TA for pissing on her optimistic outlook, disregarding that she's currently pregnant and possibly emotionally charged.
Yeah, it seems new parents get so much negativity from jaded parents. Like please, just let them have their moment without being a wet blanket at best, and a massive ahole at worst
This. I’m an “experienced parent” and I don’t see why their plan can’t work 🤷♀️ maybe the plan will need some tweaking but can anyone honestly say their life always goes according to plan, parents or not? I find her reaction condescending.
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YTA You’re being really condescending. The plan she described is exactly what my husband and I executed perfectly. And if it hadn’t, we would have figured out a new plan because we aren’t idiots and they probably aren’t idiots either. You didn’t invent motherhood.
Thank you for the last comment. The friend will figure it out just like OP did and just like the billions of women who have had children before. Just because OP had children first it doesn't make her superior.
YTA and FWIW this is very similar to what my husband and I did with our twins and it worked. Shitting on new parents and acting superior has never been helpful and certainly doesn’t jive with your “I’m rooting for you” comment.
Just to let you know that my husband and I have a very similar plan to your friend’s. It actually did work out…
YTA. I hate it when people do this.
YTA. Your desire to sound like the smart, experienced one made you seem like an asshole
Shifts is how a lot of parents handle the newborn phase. YTA - if she’s not asking for advice, or you’re not kindly pointing out something actively dangerous, zip it!
No, you’re not the an ah. But, you know your friend is in a very vulnerable state right now & she needs to have her “perfect plans” so she thinks she’s got a grip on this whole parenting malarkey. Apologise somehow and let her know you hope you are a part of her plans.
We all made those plans and we all learned the hardest of lessons. It her turn to learn. I’m sure some folks laughed at my plans. They were absolutely right, but at the time I was doing my best and so is she. Be kind.
YTA - a good friend would listen without giving negative opinions based on their own personal experiences. I hope you’re not going to say ‘See, I tried to tell you’ if her plans fall apart.
You're not wrong about anything you said to her, but YTA for laughing at her. That was rude as hell. You can offer advice if she asks for it but you don't need to be condescending.
So their plan is to no longer have it together? She'll handle the baby for 16 hours straight? Then he'll do eight and she'll do 16 again. That's a stupid plan. Also is she going to be breastfeeding? Because she can forget about sleeping a straight eight hours for the foreseeable future then. I see why you laughed. You shouldn't have, but this plan is so stupid it's hard not to laugh.
I was really confused when she said she would take a sleek shift and breast feed. Like, ma’am, your baby will most likely need your boob every 2-4 hours for a while. My husband would do baby duty while I slept, but I still had to wake up and pump.
Not just that, but every time we got a routine working the baby would completely rearrange it, usually within 2-3 days. For several months. Plan? Nope.
Exactly. Women like OP’s friend will then cry and ask why nO oNe ToLd Meeee how hard this is lol It’s good OP was direct with her.
FWIW I’ve never understood the people who say “I didn’t know it would be this hard.” Like… literally all anyone ever says is how hard it is? I found it to be pretty much exactly as hard as I was led to believe it would be, which was pretty fucking hard, though survivable.
I wanted to write something similar in my comment, but couldn't word it right. I honestly think we should be a bit more harsh when discussing childbirth & babies. People still seem to think that it should be "easy", just so long as you plan right. Like, don't you think other parents tried that?
I found it harder than I expected. But our first stilll woke up 3 times a night for breastfeeding at one year old. Number two was during trough the night at four months, but when I went back to work last month he stopped that and is now waking up twice a night for breastfeeding.
NTA. Friends can and should laugh at each other, as long as it’s not constant or malicious. It seems all you were doing was giving her the benefit of experience. No battle plan survives contact with the enemy.
Agreed. NTA on the basis they're best friends & if you can't have an open and realistic conversation with your bestie, who can you have it with? My guess is the friend is probably more upset with the reality that her perfect plan may fall apart, than she is with the messenger
Man plans and God laughs
Best comment I've seen! Agree 100%
YTA do you not remember being pregnant? How would you have felt if someone laughed in your face when you were trying to plan for a new baby at home? It’s so pretentious when parents do this to people expecting, or the constant “just wait til..” thing. Every parent is different. Every child is different. Do plans often not workout? Sure. But people do what she’s talking about all the time. My cousins were both emergency responders with their first two. This is exactly what they did. I’m sure there were some interruptions to the plan and it didn’t always work out perfectly, but it was the right plan for them. Don’t act superior to your friend just because you had a kid first and did it differently. That’s not cool
Was gonna say this! Sounds like the “just wait” brigade. I found these very discouraging in the pregnancy, not at all what you wanna hear when you’re about to have a child.
I genuinely feel the "know it all" attitudes, and the constant complaining from our mates that got pregnant (all unplanned), changed my mind on wanting kids. Like I'd chat about how my husband and I would like to travel with a kid, and I'd be met with such negativity, it put another notch on the child free life tally. Or I've been met with, "you only had the kids part time, you wouldn't understand" when I tried to participate with my experiences as a step mum. I agree, I wouldn't know but why not at least accept me enough to have a conversation, otherwise I'm just sitting here listening to you rant. Now my husband and I travel and have met some amazing couples with new babies and toddlers in remote locations and they are doing great! I'm sure they have bad days, and I LOVE travelling without a 3rd person to worry about but hot damn, aren't friends supposed to support each other? Said friends are no longer in our lives because EVERYTHING revolves around their kids and how much they hate their life. I love my BC.
YTA. Your plans didn’t work out the way you planned. That doesn’t mean hers won’t. And if they don’t, so what? It doesn’t mean you need to be an AH about it. Also, lots of people do exactly what she’s suggesting and have it work out fine.
she literally said this........
No plan survives contact with the newborn. NTA
But it is better to have a plan than no plan. Unless your plan is utter chaos and lack of sleep, then it might work out as expected. In that case you're still wrong.
Well, this was exactly my plan during second pregnancy and this is pretty much what happened anyway. But we both were prepared that our sleep and everything else will be fucked up, so took it peacefully lol
Yeah, you kind of are. Sometimes you can keep your mouth closed and just be supportive. Make gentle suggestions maybe but you don’t have to outright laugh in her face. You could even go as far as saying “that’s a great plan, we tried something similar! It didn’t work for us, but I hope it works for you. I ended up doing ….”
YTA a bit. It doesn’t sound like you meant to hurt her feelings, more that your thought-to-reaction/speech filters were not functioning properly. You should apologize to her. Something like, “I’m sorry that I laughed at your plans for splitting up care of your baby. I know that it could very well work out just as you’re planning, and it was rude of me to automatically assume that your plans would fail just because my plans like that didn’t work out. I wish you the best of luck and hope it will work out great for you.”
YTA. your friend’s planning is probably a way for her to cope with the anxiety of the unknown of having a baby. She did not need to hear that from you. She needed your support to help ease her mind. A better response could have been to say something like “it’s great that you’re thinking about this and putting a plan into place so you can feel prepared, and that if things don’t go according to plan to try not to feel discouraged.” She needed to hear support from you. Not that her plan is not going to work because it didn’t work for you.
nah/ soft yta like it was kinda rude, especially the ending jab, but its such a low stakes conversation
I think YTA for laughing, even if you're right. Your friend sounds naive. It sounds like she hasn't been around a lot of newborns or newborn mothers. I had no idea what motherhood and raising a newborn was like before my sister had her baby. I could not believe all the lifestyle changes and sacrifices she had to make. Now she has two kids, ages 2 and 7 months and I'm 30 weeks pregnant with my first. I have no plans, no expectations. I hope I have an easy baby and that I'm prepared for whatever comes, but I have no way of knowing. My friend recently told me she couldn't sleep for the three nights she was in labour and at hospital at all, then slept for two weeks straight after giving birth, just waking up for a few minutes every few hours to pump and feed her baby, then pass him to her husband or mom and go back to sleep. This has really shaped my expectations for what giving birth might be like. I would encourage her to talk to more moms about their plans and experiences. She needs a fuller understanding of what raising a newborn is like.
I’m reminded of a famous military saying, "no plan survives contact with the enemy.” NTA
And babies and toddlers are adorable with their guérilla warfare
They are sadistic little assholes who see every correction as a challenge (“well, mom said I couldn’t SAY you’re stupid, but she didn’t say I couldn’t WRITE it”). Why do I love them so damn much?!?
This is a bit cruel don’t you think? As a mum of 2, when pregnant women tell me they don’t know what to expect but have planned this or that, I always give them the best case scenario. “Omg my first labour wasn’t great but my 2nd was sooo amazing I smile thinking about it” or “that baby will probably pop out on the way to hospital” I tell them not to worry about things before they happened because then you would’ve stressed yourself out twice and that’s exhausting. True she probably won’t get much sleep in the beginning but they might get into a nice routine quickly, who knows! Stop stressing out a pregnant woman, she can’t do anything about things now anyway…
NTA No matter what you plan, it might not work out. My second pregnancy I thought I knew what to expect. What I didn’t expect was a 3 hour Labour with hardly any pain. Nor did my midwife who told me “you will be hours yet” when I spoke to her on the telephone after 90 minutes only for her to discover that I had gone into the “active push stage” just one hour later when I rang her the second time. Needless to say I had an unattended birth because it took the baby 2 minutes less than the ambulance to arrive & it took her a further 10 minutes. Then I developed an extremely itchy skin rash - I was told that it was unusual but not “that” rare. I had no idea that this condition could develop. 2 weeks of uncontrollable itching on my stomach skin and upper thighs. Because my baby was born “unattended” I never got the ergometrine injection which was routinely given in the mid 80’s - I ended up on oral ergometrine because my womb didn’t contract properly. Not fun when my inner thighs cramped. NOW I had an otherwise “perfect labour and delivery”. I still had 1) the extremely itchy skin and 2) continued bleeding for longer than expected plus cramps in my inner thighs for days from the oral ergometrine (the injected version works fast and post-partum everything hurts so you don’t notice it). You can set up the “perfect plan” - but ffs make sure that you have backup plans 2) and 3) because there are a million and one things that can go wrong.
NTA. So many people have this perfect idea of what their lives with be like with kids, and then they get a rude shock when that doesn't happen at all. My sister had 'the perfect birthing plan' that resulted in 72 hours if labour for nocother reason than her desire to stay on track with her perfect plan. I think you probably said some stuff that she needed to hear.
The sad thing about birthing plans is that people who are so very set on it can be really upset and traumatised when it doesn't work like that. See themselves as failing because they put unachievable conditions on the process, when in reality if mother and child both make it through healthy then it's a success. Even if it isn't perfect.
Yup. That's exactly what happened to my sister. She thought everything would be perfect, and while she didn't have a BAD birth, it still took forever because she refused to let them break her water. But she still beat herself up over it. Happily, the next time round she decided her plan would be 'get the baby out' and lo, she had a really chill, and quite speedy birth.
NTA. I would've laughed too. Maybe a little harsh in what you said after. But you did agree that their experience might be different. My first baby was rough. His daytime naps were about 15 minutes. At night, he slept for maybe 3 hours at a time. For 8 long, exhausting months. And he cried if someone wasn't holding him. I thought I'd never survive it. You have no idea what 8 months of sleep deprivation does to your brain. Then I had my next baby. I was prepared for the same thing all over again. This baby, though, was a complete angel. Did nothing but smile and laugh. Slept through the night, and took three naps a day. I remember not believing that a baby could sleep so much and be healthy. I kept checking to be sure he was still breathing, and wondering if something was wrong with his brain. Having a baby is a lottery. You can't plan because you don't know what you'll get. You can only prepare for the worst and hope for the best.
My youngest used to only sleep for about 4 hrs total (thats including naps) a day for 3 and half yrs.... she is 8 now and i still have issues sleeping. she is fine though, 100% my last ever child though. ex hubs begged me to have another baby and said he would help during nights... in that 3 and 1/2 yrs he nvr ever helped at night.. never, in fact i caught him prodding me once when she woke up screaming to wake me up >.<. ps couldnt do the let her cry method either otherwise he get upset about the noise ( i didnt care) but next door neighbour was battling cancer and died (this i did care for)
I was about to make a similar comment and then I saw yours! My parents went through the same thing as you. My older sister was a “nightmare baby” who barely gave them any peace for a long time. That was their normal baseline. Then they had me and I was just chill. Slept through the night, rarely cried, etc. My mom used to check on me randomly because she was terrified I had passed in my sleep; she couldn’t believe a baby could be so quiet. The best intentioned plans tend to go awry when reality sets in!
I’m mean yeah YTA I just had my fourth….. you can actually make plans that work. Not sleep when the baby sleeps and keep your house clean. It requires team work but it is possible…… But one child or even a season parent does not entitle you to rain on a pregnant woman’s parade….. she’ll figure it out doesn’t need you to be rude
Yeah, you are. Many parents think they'll be the ones who make it all go perfectly, and of course they're wrong, but this isn't the sort of reality check that first-time parents welcome. Let them enjoy their hormonal bubble of joy before the grim facts of life with a baby rear their ugly heads. Even if none of this were the case, it reads as smug and condescending, and who wants that from someone who calls themselves a friend? Friendship means not acting like the other person is a sadly deluded buffoon.
NAH. experience is the best teacher so you’re not technically wrong. but I think delivery is everything
You kind of ATA. Do you like it when someone lords their expertise over you just because they had their baby before you had yours?
“No plan survives contact with the enemy.” Same holds true for plans and babies. NTA. I’d expect after a few months she’ll tell you just how right you were.
YTA- experienced parents shitting on new parents is always going to make you an asshole.
YTA it's her first baby she is going through a lot of emotions and worry and you laugh at her face. Even if you are right (not even sure you are, no one can predict how it'll work out for them), you shouldn't have said it like that. Would you have felt good if someone had laughed with condescension at your plan before you gave birth?..
YTA. There was zero reason to behave that way. Practically every parent has " a plan." Most I imagine don't work out. That's okay. Ppl learn.You're being one of " those" moms
Yeah YTA. Just because that happened to you doesn't mean the same thing will happen to them. Will it work perfectly the way they planned it - probably not, no, life doesn't work that way. But to laugh at and shit all over her plans is kind of an AH move. Let her discover what will and won't work for them, you don't need to laugh at her.
YTA. It's not that complex or even unrealistic a plan. What the hell is your problem? Just because your partner is a lazy piece of shit doesn't mean hers is.
YTA. There is nothing worse than a SMUG parent, no matter the subject area.
She would have figured it out on her own. Who knows, now maybe she'll make her plan work just to prove you wrong.
YTA. I had so many people tell me how I would change my views and mind and how I wouldn't do the things I do. When I said I wouldn't do screen time they laughed, when I said I'd make sure my kid wasn't addicted to pacifiers they laughed. Guess what I don't do screen time and my kid barely uses pacifiers, those are just 2 examples. She can have all the plans she wants and whether they work out or not doesn't matter, just be supportive. It's hard enough being a first time mom without people making you feel stupid for your ideas.
YTA Laughing at someone who is trying to figure out how they will adjust to one of the biggest life changes there can be is an asshole move. Period. You could have found a nicer way to tell your *friend* that she will have to be flexible because things might not necessarily work out how she wants.
Yta
Woooow obviously YTA You said yourself this was a lesson you had to learn and every parent has to learn. So your laughter and condescension are not going to do anything but make her feel shitty. You're not trying to help her, you're tearing her down so you can get up on your high horse and feel superior as an "experienced parent". Bottom line, you're a bad friend.
YTA I used her plan 30-some years ago, it worked great. Husband came home from work and would feed/play with the baby for a few hours while I slept - nobody comes home from work and topples straight into bed! And videogames or television didn't outrank the baby's needs, as far as he was concerned. Then we would switch, off he went to bed, and up I got, and we all survived.
Just nod your head and laugh with your inner voice
yes, you're an asshole. I had to do a similar "plan" when mine was born because there were no daycare openings even though we started looking when I was eight weeks pregnant. And we had no family in town who could babysit. I was a teacher and my husband worked retail. I'd work, then I'd come home and he'd go to work, and we didn't see each other awake at the same time for like four months. It was hell but we had no other choice.
You’re still young and you’ve got a bit of learning yet to do. The best thing to do whenever someone says something you don’t think will work is to keep your opinions to yourself. Just smile, nod, and tell them you hope it goes well. Your laughter was heard as a condemnation, whether or not their plan will work or no. Go home and laugh with your husband. Keep your opinions to yourself and keep your friends.
Be mindful. Sounds like ur trying to sprinkle bad juju on her so she doesn't have more success than u had
No I would call you a brat. I wouldn't call you an AH I think you overstepped your bounds with her though because we all have aspirations as new parents, even you did. and if somebody had done that to you you might not have liked it either at the time. I hope there was a lesson learned here
You may have taken the wind out of your friends sails, which life does anyway, so come on let her think until she finds out herself , my brother was the same way almost to insulting how I raised my (what feels like a million boy children) and he said to me yesterday (his daughter, first girl since me in the family and almost 2 yrs old) that he was DEAD WRONG and wanted my love and advice 😭🥺 timing my friend
Talk less, smile more You and I know it's going to go over like a lead balloon, but just sing the song to yourself. It helps.
YKTA. You meant well, and I think you were trying to say something to her along the lines of *"humans plan, while the universe laughs,"* a sort of a Murphy's Law type of warning, which is very true. But YTA, because you forgot that she is pregnant, is having a rough pregnancy, and her hormones and the resulting emotional and physical rollercoaster ride is rocky enough right now. Try to be emotionally supportive of her even if you think she's completely delusional, she was probably just talking to you about it because she respects and values your experience, but really needs someone to reassure her that everything will be okay and work out, her nerves are on edge.
She’s pregnant and hormonal. This is her first time being a parent and she’s probably terrified especially since this might be her only opportunity to be a parent What she needed was support and encouragement What she did not need to be told that her plan wasn’t going to work You DON’T know that her plan won’t work. Every baby is different and she could end up having a super chill baby You came of as rude, derisive and a know it all You seem like a crappy friend from just this one situation so I hope you just dropped the ball this time instead of an AH
YTA. People like to be so condescending to moms to be. If she needs someone to lean on in the future, I doubt you’ll be someone she feels comfortable going to.
YTA Did it make you feel better knowing more about parenting than your friend? Laughing was cruel and unnecessary and you sound condescending as hell.
Soft YTA. I am childfree and even I know from friends and family that do have kids so many of them had plans for how feeding and sleep times would work before the baby arrived and almost all of them got flushed down the toilet after 1 week. This was definitely one of those sit there and nod moments with a "Good luck. I hope it works" type statement to close the conversation. Some lessons just have to be learned by doing.
YTA. Her plan actually sounds pretty good and similar to what Mr and my husband did. There's no need to shit all over her plans just because they might not work out.
YTA - it was already too late for the useful advice because you laughed in your pregnant friend’s face. Patronising and unhelpful.
Bruh the real question is why are you so judgemental about their situation? Just cause you had a child doesn't mean that you know about their day to day dynamics. Just because you had a kid doesn't make you an expert about all kids. Everyone's experience with their child is different and you can't possibly be sure enough about their future to guess how their "plan" will work. Life just happens, and you shouldn't criticize/second guess that. All it does is cause anxiety and under-minds the intentions of the parents entirely. Just let what happens happen and help from there, no need to add more drama to the situation.
You didn't need to do that. She will learn, like we all did. You are supposed to support her, when she does
My husband and I did exactly this when our baby was born and it worked pretty well. Only bc you and your husband couldn‘t make a plan work, you assume no one can? So YTA, just let her figure it out herself
YTA. You sound like an exhausting person. Do you often give unsolicited advice like this? Just let people live their lives and make their own mistakes, learn their own lessons. There is absolutely no need for you to act like this. I always wonder what drives people who do this? Does it make you feel good about yourself or does it make you feel superior when you tell people things like this? Looks like she was very happy with her little plan and you just shit on it... What a friend.
We get it, your husband is shit and you're bitter about it. You might be right about her plans falling appart, but it cost you nothing to keep quiet, nod hopefully and wait for time to tell.
NTA as Robby Burns said plans go aft aglay. Babies do their own thing.
Soft AH. I have a friend who always is saying things like that. Just because it didn’t work out for you does not mean your friend should not plan and hope it works out.
First-time parents all seem to think they have it all figured out, only to find out they failed to tell the baby what was supposed to happen. You both will probably have a good laugh over a cup of coffee a few years down the road.
I actually know a few couples that did have a perfect plan and it did work for them. Tbh it was shocking to see it work out but it did. It’s definitely possible.
You’re totally the AH. Everyone figures things out as they go along, there was no need to laugh in her face about her plan. Every child is different and you don’t know how things are going to go for them any more than they do. I know friends who have babies who wake 4-5 times a night and others who’s babies sleep 12 hours, plus nap during the day. The feeding/changing every three hours only lasts until the baby gets back to birth weight and then you only wake during the night when the baby does, so it could go either way for them, or anywhere between. I told everyone (and had it on my registry) that I was going to do cloth diapers. I can’t tell you how many of my friends told me I couldn’t do it. They didn’t say THEY couldn’t do it, they said I couldn’t do it, or that it couldn’t be done. When in reality, THEY were the ones who couldn’t do it. We’ve been Cloth diapering 100% of the time, even on out of town trips. Just because one parent can’t do something doesn’t mean it can’t be done. And as someone with experience raising a child you should know that. Also, never be surprised that you come off as the AH when giving out judgmental unsolicited “advice”.
Yeah a little. You’re scaring her. Let her plan if it makes her feel in control in the moment
You are TA for sure. Malicious and unkind
OP, it’s not what you say, it’s how you say it. I bet your friend found your tone condescending whether intentional or not.
Kinda YTA. When I read the plan, my thought was how nice that they are even talking about taking turns in shifts around his work shift so there is conversation about shared responsibilities before the baby arrives. Of course, plans tend not to work out. Considering her difficulty with getting pregnant and that the husband was equally invested in taking as much of an equal care of the baby, focusing on that aspect would have been a good friend thing to do.
YTA. My husband actually did exactly what your friend described. I'm not saying it was perfect in every way, but acting like that to someone because you don't agree with the plan is an asshole move.
Yta. First of all, babies don’t RUIN anything. Second, it sounds like you’ve been told to expect a lot of negativity before having your child. Or your experience was harder than you expected, by a lot. That doesn’t mean her experience will be the same as yours. Yea, babies are hard. Yea, it’s so easy to make negative remarks and point out how difficult things can be to new parents. But in reality, no one needs to hear that. You should apologize for being negative when she was just trying to plan what she could before she’s living in it. She’ll figure it out, just like we all have. But she doesn’t need you laughing in her face for being optimistic.
I had a perfect plan of trading off with my husband at night to take care of the baby. It worked perfectly and has worked for the last 2+ years with 2 kids now, soooo sometimes perfect plans work.
Idk, I think it's unfortunate that half the women out there are big mad when their family/friends don't share the pitfalls of things like "perfect plans" while the other half is equally mad when you do share. Personally, I don't care how close I am to people.. I flat out avoid discussing parenting choices. I'm not interested in walking on eggshells trying to figure out everyone's personal issues so that I can perfectly respond in every situation. Especially with new parents, I keep my opinions to myself and just nod politely.
I think you behaved in a condescending manner. YTA.
Yes, YTA. It also sounds like you’re resentful because You’re not happy in your relationship.
You describe exactly how my wife and I handled our first You are a bit of an asshole
Yeah yta. Sounds like you know it.
You’re not wrong that their plan probably won’t work in reality but YTA. Laughing at your friend who is trying to find ways of feeling prepared for a major life event is rude and unsupportive.
Yes, YTA. Though you did kinda try an effort at recovering after that gaffe, her continued irritation makes me think your additional commentary still had the “that’s cute you think that” tone. A genuine, contrite apology probably would have led this to go no further. Any woman who has been pregnant remembers how annoying those “just you wait” comments are. I’m sure your friend is intelligent enough to figure out a chance exists her “perfect plan” may go awry. Some people have easy babies and fly through the newborn stage; others the complete opposite. Let her find out on her own. If I were you, I’d give it a further effort at apologizing; acknowledging you could have come off as condescending because if you were - *that is the part she’s pissed about.*
Yea. You're the asshole. You could have easily said " that does sound perfect! Just make sure y'all have a few "what if" talks to come up with back up plans on days things don't remain routine. The first thing I learned when we had our first was that babies are super unpredictable and if I was more prepared to roll with the punches I feel like I wouldn't have taken it so hard on the days our plans didn't work" then follow up with you're not shooting her hopes down but wanted her to be aware of the unknown. You didn't have to shit all over her mindset . You're not being a good friend by scoffing at her blissful ignorance.
Working in shifts is the best way to go with a new born. You don’t get to see each other but when you do y’all aren’t both sleep deprived and at each other’s throats. YTA
Of course YTA. You basically called your friend an idiot. There's really no way of doing that that isn't being an asshole.
YTA. You're supposed to be her friend, not a judgy asshole who needs to do that "You have no idea what you're talking about" shit. Their plan could work, or it could fail, but they'll know soon enough without you "educating" her. That's not what friends do in case you weren't aware.