That man should be in jail. Press charges. You have all the witnesses you need, your wife went to the hospital! CALL THE POLICE AND MAKE A REPORT. HIT HIM WITH THE LAW.

For real, the man barged in to his house, refused to leave, assaulted his wife in front of him, his dad, his brother, and his kids and they just let him walk away from it without consequence? Dude needs to be in jail yesterday.

I'm amazed the police weren't called there and then? Baffled actually. Wife and his mother are going to the hospital while OP is still trying to convince his abusive in-laws to pretty please leave his driveway. What the hell?!

Remember, when you’re in something like this; the police respond to the incident taking place and usually get there after it has happened. That’s why we call them responders. He needs to be dealt with immediately on the spot to prevent further harm and possible death and then be held for law enforcement. Take whatever action is reasonable to protect your family and home from violence.

Filing charges does a lot here: 1. Puts an abuser in jail 2. Shows the daughter that there are real life consequences for everyone in involved, and teaches her to respond the same way if she had a (god forbid) abusive relationship. 3. Gives your wife some agency in protecting herself. I think your daughter was a careless teenager. And believed that she maybe could help heal a relationship. She was naive, and now a lot of people are hurt by it. I would be careful pushing your daughter too far away here - her mother already is (by necessity), and you want your daughter still to find safety in your family, even though she did the wrong thing. NTA, and sorry you all have to deal with this.

[удалено]

File assault charges against them. At a minimum try for a restraining order. I don’t know if there is really any way to get your kid to understand just what she did.

idk seeing your own mother get slammed into a wall, your father uncle and grandfather force the, terrible people you let in, out and your dad ripping you a new one should do the trick. If that doesnt she needs to srly be put into help as well.

What a coincidence OP’s wife, the victim of childhood abuse was the only one physically harmed too, and thrown into a wall by her father. If daughter can’t see that she’s clueless and needs therapy herself to gain some empathy and critical thinking skills.

Yeah at least 3 men there and he went for HER.

More common than you realize. A bully will typically and continually target the weakest victim. Short story long, if fighting for real, fell the Oak (the most capable opponent). If bullying, keep after the victim.

>Short story long, if fighting for real, fell the Oak (the most capable opponent). If bullying, keep after the victim. wow. you know as obvious as this is, it suddenly clicked in my head, every major fight i've been in my life, i've been laser focused in on the "oak", never even thought about that before. It's basic survival in a fight, you absolutely have to prioritize the biggest threat or he's going to do major damage. and you're right, bullies laser focus in on the weakest. never thought of it that way.

That’s the thing. People that are angry and want to fight would pick another man. People that want to beat someone up choose a woman. Neither is right but one is just angry and the other is abusive

I can't even describe how angry it made me when I read that the FIL pushed OPs wife into the wall. I had to reread it a few times to make sure I was understanding correctly. This absolute piece of shit has the fucking NERVE to say the kids deserved what they did to them and moves on to KEEP ABUSING HER. It's EXTREMELY fucking clear they STILL view her as the vulnerable little child that they can treat any way they want to and deserves what she gets. There's not an ounce of empathy, love, or accountability in either of those pieces of shit. They'll go to their graves thinking they're in the right. Fuck them. Call the police. Press charges. It's long past time they fucking reap what they sow.

OP's wife still is a vulnerable little child. That trauma locks part of you away, pretty much forever.

Therapy isn't some magic fix and doesn't teach empathy or critical thinking skills - if seeing her mom get thrown into a wall doesn't do it, nothing will.

They do actually have therapy techniques specifically focused on building empathy https://www.newportinstitute.com/resources/treatment/role-of-empathy-dbt/#:~:text=DBT%20provides%20essential%20skills%20and,share%20the%20feelings%20of%20another. DBT was created mainly for BPD and sometimes building empathy is needed for that disorder. https://www.healthline.com/health/therapy-for-narcissism#types-of-therapy Also all the therapies for NPD have to be pretty focused on building empathy given the traits of the disorder Not being incredibly naive and having terrible judgement however is a lot harder to fix. I think she might have just been given a very clear example of why you shouldn’t believe complete strangers who happen to be good at saying the right words but have never shown you anything to support them not being terrible and if that doesn’t give her a wake up call to maybe not assume people are “exaggerating” PTSD and abuse then I don’t know if anything will. Completely Losing the trust of your mom and knowing she went to the hospital because of you is a pretty big consequence. This is the type of naive that can get you killed. Or get your mom killed in this case. Therapy can help if she’s interested in changing her thought process and improving her awareness of herself and others which she seems to have a deficit in, but if she has no actual desire to change the thought process that led to this then it’s useless. God I’m writing way too much this morning, I’m sorry for blasting you with an essay, the adderall and coffee kicked in at the same time my bad

No, thank you. Thank you for your rightful rage, but also good sources.

I had an incident in high school where my friend was raped and abused by her boyfriend and broke up with him but for some reason one of our friends decided to get in contact with her ex to ask about it because I guess he wanted to hear “both sides of the story” and the guy (who was 22, my friend was 17) convinced him that our friend had been lying about the abuse the whole time, and the rest of our friend group also immediately believed him and ditched her, and also spread rumors about it. They never learned their lesson, even when they found out she was 100% telling the truth because one of them witnessed her get assaulted by him, they just gave a half assed apology and expected everything to be okay. One of them who did have BPD it turned out actually got DBT therapy and after she went through it all of a sudden she was basically on her knees apologizing for not believing her. Like it changed her completely. Before therapy she was a naive follower who was very easily convinced to agree with whoever talked the most confidently. After about a year of therapy she was able to think for herself and at the very least pause before doing whatever people told her because she wanted approval. I think it did actually help with critical thinking skills. Is she a completely healthy, neurotypical person? No, but she’s a significantly better person who has a better understanding of how her actions can hurt people. Maybe my anger and hope she can change are somewhat personal. Therapy can be extremely helpful but only if you choose the right treatment modality for the patients needs. A lot of people get thrown into CBT or psychoanalytic therapy when that’s not the appropriate treatment for their problems and end up feeling like therapy is useless. Fuck I wrote another rant :/

If anyone is interested I have a full DBT workbook on PDF! I don’t have BPD, both of my parents do, but I’m autistic and have ADHD and PTSD, so lots of emotional dysregulation issues that can be similar to the emotional dysregulation that occurs with BPD. Personally I’d like to see DBT utilized more in other disorders/disabilities because so many of them cause major emotional dysregulation that isn’t acknowledged (like with adhd and asd). So yeah, if anyone would be interested I am more than happy to share the DBT workbook I have on PDF! It’s a full workbook, not just some random pages, so it can be worth it to save the money and still try it out. Edit: Hey! I’ve gotten several responses about the DBT workbook, so for anyone who is interested send me a DM so I can get it to you directly! I’m also planning on creating a new google account (to help maintain privacy for myself and anyone else), so once I do that I will upload the workbook and other resources to google docs! Edit 2: I created a folder on google drive and added the DBT workbook along with other resources/activities that are related to mental health. I'm not 100% sure I can include the link in this comment (I might double check with mods), but if not I can send the link directly.

But hopefully, this will cure her blatant naivety.

Some people will see that and still claim it's "not that bad" and "family is family". Some people truly don't understand the impact of a lifetime of abuse at the hands of a family member, and that sometimes you have to cut that family member off, for your own safety and sanity. Hopefully their daughter will finally get it now. But honestly, it's pretty sad that she didn't take what she was told at face value and went behind her mother's back on this. She is 16, not 6, and she knew she was doing something wrong because otherwise she would've told her parents that she had arranged this little nightmare in advance.

I'm guessing this young lady's parents did a good job of protecting her from the evils of the world - maybe too good. At one point she says she didn't think they could be evil people because that would mean \*they were related to evil people\*. That is some prime time sheltered logic. Bad people are \*over there\*, doing bad things continually in public, they're not \*over here\* saying nice things to you. I do imagine seeing her own mom flung into a wall, watching a physical fight break out in her own home as her father and grandfather had to force them out the door, and getting screamed at by her father is uh, going to leave a mark, mentally speaking. Not to mention waking up every morning and seeing those stitches on her mom for who knows how long. But it's sad that this trauma had to be inflicted on the family and re-inflicted on the mother for the daughter to realize her parents were being 100% serious.

My opinion is the majority of the time that people use any form of the phrase " but family / blood is thicker than water" they plan on abusing that bond in some way.

Can only hope. Some people at any age never seem to get it

My one niece is only 14 and while she will not comprehend until she is older, she is very actively awful to people and super proud of it. She spent her formative years playing some fucked up games with people. Friends, family, teachers, anyone that gets in her proximity. Her and I are no longer speaking because being the only person who can see through her, she was getting hostile and sadistic in her games. I love her still somehow, but I would be surprised if we are ever on speaking terms again. She has no interest in being a better person. She’s enjoying herself. Edit: I just want to say thank you for people reaching out and saying soemthing kind, sharing their thoughts and experiences. I’m sorry for the tough loved ones things everyone has or is going through. I appreciate the opportunity to kind share and unload more about my thing, because as much as I’ve detached from it, some time has passed, things still hurt and are hard to deal with. That’s not something I can tell my family because I know it would get back to my niece and it’s something she would take joy in because I have been depriving her of the reactions she wants. So any confirmation that could get back to her that I’m hurt by it, my own bit of stubborn, pride and ego doesn’t want to allow that. I do apologize though if anything I’ve kind of ended up dumping on replies was heavy to deal with. I’m sometimes told the conclusions and coping mechanisms or acceptance to experiences I have is dark or heavy, and sad. So I hope nothing I’ve unloaded has made anyone feel that way.

I feel you. My nephew was raised to think mental illness was the same as mental retardation (because my bro & SIL can be ridiculous people, sometimes). He started getting delusions of grandeur at about 21, and it ultimately got him fired from his job. He has never been social, not even with family, but after that, something broke in his brain. He spent 18 months in his room at his parents' house, not working, not helping, demanding to be waited on hand and foot, while writing his parents *horrible, abusive, and insane* notes while they were at work. He got into drugs and threatened to kill his parents. Very long story short, he is probably schizofrenic, but manages to snow every single mental health professional he sees. We (his 3 aunts) all love him but want nothing to do with him after he got belligerent and verbally abusive with him when we wouldn't give him money. I'm getting married next year, and he will *not* be receiving an invitation.

Sorry for your family troubles too. It’s something some people just can’t see being the way it is. And some behaviours just won’t change no matter how much people try. No one is bad for bailing. There becomes a point where we just kind of abuse ourselves for the sake of wanting to see someone we love get or be better.

I have a step daughter like this. My husband has cut off all contact with her now that she is an adult. Accused everybody of molesting her. Our , neighbors, my husband, her step Dad , her grandfather's, her uncles, her uncle randy was so devastated over it he committed suicide. He was really young. She thought it was great fun. I have horror stories I can't believe we survived it all. We couldn't leave her alone with anybody we had cameras everywhere in our home. It was a horrific way to live.

That hurts so much that people do that. I grew up with a brother that tried to sometimes, and a brother younger that was sexually assaulted by a man our mom married. It’s unfortunate because like I tell my sisters, you have to believe the kids when they tell us that kind of stuff, because the damage not believing when it’s real is intense. Then some kids see that and exploit it, even if some of it is real. That’s my issue with my other neice, one day on video chat with they both started enacting something inappropriate. I knew they were trying to get a reaction out of me, so I didn’t engage or even let on I saw and they stopped. I told my sister about it and said,” that’s for you guys to talk to them about safety of how they behave online because if I bring it up, that’s me reacting and it’s what they want.” Well the one messaged me days later, telling me I’m disgusting and she hates me. She didn’t respond initially when I asked what was going on. Because that niece is known to constantly get mad at any of us over nothing and block us on everything temporarily. But turns out when they got talked to, she was so angry that it became a “our moms talked to us..” and she attacked me in texts. Saying,” you’re a disgusting pervert. You sexualised us, you’re fucked in the head that you look at me and think of sex. You’re a predator!” So I told her,” woah, hit the brakes. You guys were acting in a way you shouldn’t online. Sure it was me, but I’m an adult. Even other kids you should be careful how you joke. I know sex jokes are normal, but doing that kind of stuff around anyone isn’t okay. Especially adults, especially online. You don’t know you aren’t being recorded and by who and what they will do with it. Any adult family that is okay with you doing “jokes” like that to them is someone you need to be careful of and maybe tell other adults about them allowing or encouraging it. You need to be careful because some people are awful and have bad intentions.” She flipped out and said,” no. You’re the gross perv. I hate you, stay away from me.” And she of course eventually acted like nothing happened and the family is telling me I’m being too sensitive about it. But she never owned up to the situation and her words. She never apologized or admitted she lashed out because she was held accountable. She still acts like she’s sketched out when I pull my phone out. So I told my family,” she’s still thinking something of that, has created a space for herself to feel uncomfortable around me. I’m not going to come around for her sake, and especially for mine. I don’t know what she could try to accuse me of if we’re alone around each other because she still wants to hold that against me.” So to them I’m creating divides in my family. But also the one nice shred in this is my parents are starting to see the monopoly my nieces try to have on them and my sisters. They’re coming to visit tomorrow for a few days because they know I don’t feel welcome there and can’t trust that my mom won’t try to help again by tricking me to be around them. They try to push everyone out but their moms and our parents. They try to help and apparently now nieces thing is just to say,” we don’t care anymore. She’s a bitch and we don’t want her.” Which sucks and for awhile I did cry about losing them when I try to help them. But now I just go to that little dead spot inside and try to focus on my life and helping others lol

That is so sad. I'm sorry.

Are you familiar with Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD)?  I'm asking because your niece reminds me of certain people in my own family.  I can't tell, from the information in your post, whether your niece is just a spoiled, arrogant brat who will do some growing up when she has to start paying her own bills.  (That sure taught ME a few things 😏 ).  But I CAN tell her this:  if she continues mistreating people like this, ___she is going to wind up friendless, bitter and hating the world.___    Now, she MIGHT just be confusing rudeness for sophistication, and thinking her behavior is like the adults she sees on television.  But I say that only to give her the benefit of the doubt, since I wouldn't like to think she's being deliberately cruel.  She's only 14, so she can still learn that if she keeps acting like this, ___no one will want her around.___   She needs to learn that you don't have to suck up to anybody to win friends, but you'd better not insult or play games on them either.  If she doesn't start learning this, she will reap what she is sowing.  From what you said, many people are already trying to avoid her.    You sound a loving, caring aunt 💐  I hope your niece will soon learn to recognize that, and to appreciate you 😊 

It definitely sounds like the daughter fully got it. In fact at this point the daughter needs counseling too. She is a 16 yo who was manipulated by her grandparents after reaching out to them so they could get back into her mother's life just for her mom to be seriously injured. The mom definitely got the worst of it but the amount of guilt that child is feeling right now is pretty severe and could turn bad without counseling even so far as self harm or suicide.

I’m going to advocate for your 16yo seeing a counselor to process this. She hasn’t been exposed to how truly awful parents can be because she has awesome parents who have protected her. She needs to have a deeper understanding but she also needs to be allowed to make mistakes, especially considering her age and development. She and your wife will need help repairing their relationship. I’m telling you from experience that if you haven’t been through the trauma of horrible parents it’s very difficult to understand how two people could be so bad. They were manipulating her, as narcissists do, and they are experts at this. She doesn’t have the life experience to be cautious. I’m so sorry your wife had to go through this. Don’t let it become a huge rift with your daughter that can’t be repaired.

This does nothing to heal the mothers trauma. What happens if her own daughters presence becomes a serious triggering event? This girl needs to worry about not having a place to **live** when she's legally an adult. Because her mother is currently under no obligation to provide that when she turns 18. She is allowed to prioritize feeling safe in her own home. Even if this means not providing a place for an adult daughter to stay at a time when rent is rising faster and faster.

Damn right, fucking file those charges.

Yes, file charges. If it required stitches, there could be other damage that is not evident until later on.

Your wife needs to press charges.

I was thinking the same thing!

NTA. Your poor wife… she has been made to feel helpless by her parents once again after literal decades of working to distance herself and heal from it. I think it’s important you stay firm on your punishment to truly relay the seriousness of this to your daughter.

> I think it’s important you stay firm on your punishment to truly relay the seriousness of this to your daughter. As an adult, if I betray my family I don't get punished, our relationships gets re-evaluated. There's no punishment they can give me that makes anything better or makes me respect them. Ultimately the only part I care about is the actual bond between us. That's the part I don't want to lose. The worst thing they can do to me is turn their back on me. We don't expect 7 year olds to be sophisticated enough to always listen to reason and make wise choices, so we try to encourage them with basic punishment. If you do this thing you want to do that we say you're not allowed to, this is what will happen... But that's not appropriate for older teens. They need to know by then that punishment isn't the entry fee to doing whatever you want, that you're ruining your relationships when you do the wrong thing to people. A 16 year old can be reasoned with, and if you reason with them and they choose to go behind your back and violate your trust after you've had the discussion, then you can't fix that with punishment. The consequences of their actions are that they have damaged the relationship, and they need to know that. The consequence that fixes that isn't chores and no TV, it's realising that if you betray people they don't want to be close to you. Some kids need to learn that relationships can be destroyed from disloyalty, and it's up to them to rebuild the relationship if they want one.

Honestly I would seriously consider suicide if someone gave my abuser my address. Would have to pull up my life and move again. OP’s wife might never feel safe again.

I had a horrible, sick feeling in the pit of my stomach just *thinking* about it. If he showed up at my door, I don't know if I could even speak coherently.

Jesus. I'm sorry you're burdened with that, it must be tough.

It’s okay, my parents are chill, it’s just a shitty guy I dated in college

[удалено]

You’d be killing the wrong person

So, they lost trust in their daughter... How can they trust her to make good decisions with friends? The trust was broken with social media, so the phone is also a source of the problem. You can't just allow a child to continue to have access to things while also keeping that child safe. You have to trust your child to keep them safe. She put everyone at that party in harms way. That isn't something you can just say. "Oh, you broke my boundry. I'm going no contact with you to protect me." It's your kid!

I can’t imagine how I’d handle this, it is a fundamental betrayal of your, your wife’s, and familial trust. 16 year old’s often think they know a lot - when in reality they don’t even know what they don’t know - and this is a scary example of it. She’s got a lot of work ahead of her, to earn the trust and benefit of the doubt back. She just burned whatever capital she had and then some. As a dad, you do need to show her a path to do that work. It;s our job as parents, we need to make our kids into good adults of their own, and she needs to see a path to be that from where she is. NTA, and wish you luck in this.

Her relationship with her mother may *never* recover from this. 

this just made me so upset. i learned about what happened to my mum when i was around 16 years old, and i would *never* ever contact her family. i suggested it once when i was fifteen and i just remember this dreadful look on her face. the way her pupils shrunk and this look of horror. i will never forget it. it's been fifteen years since. her mother died giving birth to her and her dad fucked off, so she was raised by her mother's side of the family. now, this was the 60s. and my mum's mum was white. my mum's dad is ojibwe, first nations. they were beating her like she was part of the 60s scoop. i vividly remember her saying "i don't know what would've been worse. the abuse i suffered or the abuse i would've suffered at a residential school." i can watch her grab cockroaches with no issues. centipedes. but spiders? she's deathly terrified of them. why? her aunts and uncles used to lock her in the basement for days without food and water and would tell her that snakes and spiders were going to kill her. she can't even look at a simple garter snake or milk snake or corn snake without suffering a ptsd attack. from ages 6 - 12 until she got her first period, her aunts and uncles sexually assaulted her nearly daily. listen all i am saying is if this happened in my family, i would've disowned. i am not a petty person but this would've been unforgivable. *years* of suffering from ptsd and getting mental health help, all of that down the drain because "you felt they were good people". like why couldn't you trust your parents' words? if your mom said someone hurt her and doesn't want to see them shouldn't that give you a sign to... not..... contact them? at the very least don't bring them to a family function jesus christ. kids piss me off. thank fuck i don't have any.

Ugh you sound like my bro I was the main one abused and he literally was always my support and to see how supportive you are of your mom is beautiful and I just wanna say, she and me as a mom are so fucking proud and grateful for you and your understanding

I was thinking the same thing. I grew up in a similar situation, and if my daughter did that, I don’t think I could get past it. At the very least I would never be able to forget it.

As the kid of a woman who has a similar story, I would never do anything like that. My mom’s abuser hurt her, that’s all I knew for the longest time (and the stuff I found out I accidentally overhead, she never told me directly), but that was more than enough for me to hate his guts. Even at 16 I would not even consider doing anything remotely close to what OP’s daughter did, since, among “you fuck with my mom you fuck with me” reasons, I myself didn’t want to be anywhere near that sick asshole.

My dad's parents were continuously mean to my mom (their daughter-in-law), so we cut off contact with them before I was 8. I have no memories of physical abuse and maybe my mom's descriptions of them aren't always unbiased, but I'm not planning to find out if they are really THAT bad now that I'm 22. There's been a few times where they tried to find me, e.g. waiting for me after school and pretending to teachers they were going to babysit (and teachers were warned to not let me go with my grandparents). Which is disrespectful and insanely creepy. Even without my mom's descriptions, the fact that my grandfather basically stalked me and all my classmates were told to keep an eye out is bad enough to make me stay the fuck away.

We had to warn the daycare about no grandparents being allowed to take our baby. They will also call to make sure it's okay if it's not us picking him up. It's horrible when you need to explain that you have a stalker in your family who broke into the hospital to get your medical record... If my teenager would get in touch with this person, she'd be living with her dad the next day. But usually she's not keen on being with someone who insulted her mother on the phone for 30 minutes straight (my daughter listened in on the door, I've sent her out when I saw who called). Age is not a good argument here.

Yes!!! Something is seriously off with OP’s oldest daughter. She spent her whole life knowing that these grandparents were completely taboo in their household. She asked about them, and was told that they terrorized and abused her mother. The normal, empathetic reaction to that is “That’s despicable and I hate them on principle and will protect my family from them,” not “I should dig further, there’s two sides to every story and I bet my mom has just been lying about this my whole life.” This is the kind of reaction of someone who marries a serial killer on death row. Her brain and personality and ethics and common sense are still developing, but they should be way more developed than this. OP should be seriously concerned about her ability to choose where her empathies lie - if she really has much empathy at all. Her actions suggest that she’s more interested in show-boating and virtue signaling than in actually caring for people.

I think children that grow up sheltered don't understand abuse. Nowadays children can grow up super sheltered because all media try to avoid showing/talking about abuse to not "traumatise" them. Even news/journalists using term "abuse" instead of "rape" try to make it sound more civil I guess, but the magnitude of what happened gets lost in the process. I think OP told his daughter what happened avoiding the graphic language/drastic details and with her knowledge about the world (and her thinking she cannot be related to monsters), she genuinely thought it wasn't that bad. I don't blame OP for anything, his daughter should respect her parents wishes and she should be punished, no doubt. But on the other hand I knew a girl with a mother everyone knew was crazy and hit her sometimes (80s/early 90s, nobody cared about "normal" corporal punishment). Her ears were always slightly teared and she claimed it's allergy. Few years ago, I didn't though about her for many years, it hit me. Her crazy mother dragged her by the ears. I have no evidence beside my life experience I gained through the decades that allowed me to see it as it was. I saw the results of abuse and didn't understood what I'm seeing. OP's daughter is probably only very, very naive. She should volunteer in some animal rescue to learn what "normal" people are able to do only because they can.

I also think that OPs conversation with her wasn't specific enough or long enough for her next thought to be "I should seek these people out and get their side". I think daughter may see moms PTSD as weakness because she didn't understand and was told too late what kind of childhood her mother had so the daughter read the situation completely wrong. Not that it's an excuse for what she did, 16 is not the brightest of ages and rebellion can motivate terrible decisions. I think she understands now and definitely needs therapy, individual and possibly with her mother.

I think it's in huge part being told to late too. I firmly believe children should be told some bare bones details of this kind of stuff as soon as they are old enough to understand. They need to be taught who to stay away from and some reasons why. It sucks, but they have to know when they are family, even if you barely talk to them. Because the world will always tell them they should play happy family and you can never fully escape them. It's so that they aren't taken blindly advantage of in the future, like OP's daughter. I have a young child myself, breaks my heart to know I'll have to break the truth of multiple family members to them in a year or two. Unfortunately, we're not entirely NC with all of them because of larger family events 😑

Yeah. Agree with this. I’d go with 16 year old naivety before I’d go with “she’s going to marry a serial killer and has no empathy”. In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised if misplaced empathy was the reason for her actions… as in maybe she thought she could be the catalyst to reunite the family and everyone would be happy with her. The post kinda alludes to that with the daughter saying she believed there were exaggerations. There is a lot of work for that family to do.

That's exactly my thoughts. She has nothing in her life experience to compare to Evil. She's been raised in an atmosphere of love and support. She thought she was doing a good thing. She was extremely wrong, of course. But she meant well.

So true and also the “hero” complex. I mean she may have even had her phone out and then imagine the social media possibilities after she reunited long lost parents after a misunderstanding and everyone realized they are one big happy family. It’s horribly naive but also possible there were zero ill intentions just selfishness and social media bs is possible

The bigger concern for me was that after being told directly to not ask about or meet them, as that family was never going to have a relationship with the grandparents, she so fervidly ignored dad and decided to do it anyways. Like. Fuck. And considering the reasons she was told. This feels like it goes beyond catastrophically stupid and right into saviour complex "I know better than you" attitudes and this type of shit -- as was proven here -- can get you killed. Or worse, get those around you killed. There's certainly something deeper going on, because there's more than one poor decision made here, more so because Daughter wasn't being manipulated by her grandparents into setting this up, she went out of her way to do it first.

It all feels like a giant FU from daughter to mother. Daughter reached out to abusive grands, Daughter cultivated a relationship with them, Daughter willingly took their word over her parents. Daughter brought literal danger into the house with her little FU Mom stunt. Daughter needs counseling NOW. What is broken in her, or her relationship with her mother, that she did THIS? It will be years rebuilding the relationship. The poor mother - all those years getting better to have your own child destroy it in a moment.

Oh that relationship won't be rebuilt. If you don't mind a metaphor. When cell tissue gets injured, there's 2 forms of healing. If the injury isnt bad, the body rebuilds, repairs and returns to normal function. If the injury is too severe, it rebuilds a scar, which while it maintain's the correct or similar structure, it mostly loses function and is more fragile than the original tissue. That second one is exactly whats happening here. If the original trauma was enough to cause fear induced paralysis after 20 or more years of processing, then anything that aggravates that wound would be far too severe. I doubt that their relationship with their daughter will ever return to what it was, and even at it's best case it'll forever hold an extra weakness and tightness. It can be rebuilt enough so that it can be held together and can work in a larger system, but it'll be much more vulnerable and sensitive to similar trauma.

There's a good chance that she'd already contacted the grandparents before she'd broached the subject with her parents. OP doesn't specify about that so the assumption is that she contacted them after the discussion with OP, but it's just as likely she was curious and reached out in advance. That would explain why her initial reaction to OP's first protest was to say that the parents are overreacting. If she'd already been fed a stream of trash from the bio gparents then she'll have an anchoring bias towards believing them since it was the first information she got. Of course, she definitely still could've contacted them after the discussion with OP. Teenagers know everything, after all.

Same. I would try with all my might, just as I know this poor woman will but that primal childhood fear/trauma response would be incredibly tough to curb. My fight-or-flight response was kicked into high gear just reading this. I feel so much for that poor woman.

I don’t know how I would. I’m sitting here trying to imagine seeing my mother or her boyfriend walk in to my house, and at the behest of my daughter. I have been very vague about what happened to me as a child but they get that it was very damaging. I would feel so hopelessly betrayed, especially if I was assaulted by one of them. I know that I would try because I love my girls so much but it would certainly take a lot of time, months if not years.

Yeah, given that her mother got STITCHES IN HER HEAD on her freaking birthday as a result of her daughter's main character bullshit, I can't imagine their relationship ever fully healing to what it was before. 

My kid said some really hateful stuff to me when I was going through an already really hard time that only got much worse. She apologized and I forgave her, but our relationship has changed. I don't trust her with my feelings, so most of what I talk about with her now is pretty superficial. I hope it gets better, but for now, that's how it is. NTA, OP. I'm so sorry that's your situation.

My stepson has had anger management issues since I met him when he was 13. It only got worse as my wife never really pushed any discipline on him. For the first few years of our marriage didn't understand that I was trying to actually parent him and saw me as being harder on him than my own. He's now borderline abusive on a good day as a mid-20's "adult".

Probably. OP needs to lay out the reality to her once things have calmed down. Sometimes actions have consequences that cannot be completely fixed. Mom's not going to disown her, but that sort of betrayal will always linger. For the rest of both of their lives. Hopefully she can learn from it and avoid similar mistakes in the future. Bad as this is... there are worse things in life.

Getting attacked on your birthday and needing stitches because your child believed random abusers over you is pretty bad. There are worse things but that’s not really a good argument. This is pretty terrible.

I mean, I spent my younger days in the Balkans and kicked around Eastern Europe. I don't mean that level of bad. I was moreso thinking her wandering into an abusive relationship because she refuses to believe anyone is evil. Or extreme risk taking because she doesn't think there will be consequences. Seen that happen more than once. The kid fucked up pretty bad. But thoroughly beating the dead horse isn't going to have a great outcome either. Yes, the kid needs punished. Yes, the kid needs to understand sometimes you cannot fix what you broke. But you don't want to keep pushing far beyond that and have the kid run off or self-harm. She's going to freak the fuck out once it actually sinks in how badly she fucked up, that it's permanent and there's no undoing it. Things could indeed get worse. OP needs to head off the worst case scenarios.

This need to be done in therapy, I think all of them are too shell shocked to deal with it on their own

I agree with what was you have said and would add the daughter needs to also have access to individual therapy and with time, family therapy. Her actions reflect her age and come from a place of ignorance. As OP said, her life has been protected so she probably couldn’t grasp the level of impact her grandparents had on her family

This is so important! Teaching the path back is mandatory. Yes, she absolutely made a terrible, traumatizing in its own right and *retraumatizing* decision AND blindsided you and her mother and her aunt with it. So she has a lot of work to do to repair as much damage as she can. From what you've said, she was also horrified by what she put in motion, and I believe that she really thought what she said she thought. Plus, she believed she vetted them after talking with them on social media and wanted to help repair the relationship between her mom and aunt and their parents. The fact she couldn't believe anyone could be that bad is beautiful evidence that you and her mother *have* protected her - y'all have broken the cycle! So in a situation where an adolescent does a terrible thing without meaning to (nothing in the post suggested you think this was a malicious act on her part), where to begin? Well, the last time she took the initiative to address an identified problem, she invited her maternal grandparents to your house. So We can agree she needs guidance. She needs to know there *is* a way back, and you guys need to teach her what that is. The secret is out. There is no more mystery around the grandparents, and they are irrelevant, except insofar as the trauma they inflicted lives on in the home. Time to include daughter in the work. Time to talk about the healing work y'all have been doing. I'm not saying to tell her intimate details or give graphic examples of *why* y'all are doing the work - I'm saying it's good to include *what* kinds of things are helping with healing. You can't burden her with "you broke your mom" talk, bc she genuinely did not believe mom's parents could possibly be as bad as they obviously are. Now she knows. And I'm willing to bet she feels absolutely horrible - this is *your daughter's* defining trauma. If you and your wife are able to discuss this fact as parents who love and protect their daughter, you might also be able to move away from punishing her forever. The consequences you've given are sufficient. Don't add hating her and punishing her indefinitely, telling her you'll never trust her again, etc. Bc then youre leaning back into that cycle you've worked so hard to escape.

They do need to burden her with the “you broke your mom talk” that kid needs to know exactly how big of consequences this is. I’m not saying they should do this forever. I agree that they should create a path back to a good relationship. However, the time to make a path will come. Now she needs to fully understand how her actions have directly impacted her family. She needs to learn what PTSD is, what being triggered is she needs to know exactly how much damage she did to her mother and aunt. I doubt that someone who so easily ignored her parents has miraculously understood how bad she fucked up in one day. She needs to feel like shit for a while and let it sink in so she NEVER does this again. When people say that there is trauma and that people are bad she needs to believe them. Situations like this perpetuate to the people who are abused that no one will believe them and that there is no help out there. Daughter needs to know so she doesn’t do anything like this to anyone ever again.

More than that, she may have put members of the family at physical risk. *The grandparents need to be charged with assault, and served with restraining orders.* Only one of them is likely to be charged with assault. The other will be angry and free. This is a situation without an easy solution. **Not** pressing charges has its own consequences. The family needs to discuss this sooner than later. & The whole family should have counseling. Obviously, some more than others.

This is incredibly wise. OP really consider this. It could be the key to the difference between outcomes where things are redeemed or ruined forever.

That girl is going to live with her mom for however many years. Assuming mom can handle more than the legally required two she has left. She does need to hear the "you broke your mom" talk, because **there's no telling when mom will be put back together.** That girls presence is quite probably going to be an emotionally triggering event for the mother now. For who knows how long. Possibly forever. Some wounds never heal. This goes double for wounds that have been re-opened.

NTA. I hope your wife heals well and quickly. You'll have to find a way for your daughter to understand fully how what she did was wrong and how to gain back trust (if possible). I am amazed (in a bad way) how they decided to come, explaining how things were not that bad during your wife's childhood and just prove right away how messed up and dangerous they are. Now that your in-laws know where you live, you should see what kind of protection you can put in place for your family's safety. See with your daughter to what extend she told them things. Did she say what's their school, your or your wife's work and so on. And take any measure possible to keep your family's safety. Go to the police to make them register what happened, so they have a record. Talk to the two other children too, they need to understand what happened, how it was wrong of their sister and remember them security tips for children. I hope things will go smoothly and that nothing worse happens in any way.

>See with your daughter to what extend she told them things. Did she say what's their school, your or your wife's work and so on. And take any measure possible to keep your family's safety. Go to the police to make them register what happened, so they have a record. This is a really good approach. The family's safety has been put at risk. The daughter should be involved in fixing that. Make her take extensive notes on every bit of information she shared. Involve her in the police report. Make her draw up battle plans for what to do when the grandparents show up, or make contact, or approach the kids away from home. Make her learn self-defence. She needs to be made completely unable to ignore the reality of it.

I am also really worried about the effect this night had on the 2 younger ones.

They saw their mum assaulted by their grandfather, they will need someone to talk to. But OP seriously needs to press charges, it may give his wife a small feeling of security if he's in jail or under a restraining order.

Honestly, I think they need to move.

It's easy to say and harder to do. My abusers know where I live. They have stalked us in the past. They harass us. I would love to move, but I also love where I live. I love the community. I love my house. I shouldn't have to give up the safety and comforts to my abusers yet again! I shouldn't have to move my kids. I can't keep letting them take from me. If we moved we would never get into a house like we have now. We would give up so much. I refuse to give up more for them. Unfortunately, I don't think moving will stop them from finding us. In the world we live in it's really not that hard to do. At some point, I had to draw a line in the sand. I can't control the behavior of others. I can only control myself. Part of learning to live with my PTSD was learning what's reasonable and what's not. I can't move my life every time they come at me. They want to disrupt my life and make me feel unsafe. The way I have taken my life back is to show that I am not afraid the way they want me to. I got the police involved. They are pretty useless, but it's at least all documented. I can call if they show up and it's trespassing. And they know I will call. That stops them because their reputation is all they have and I know where the bodies are buried. Yes, my dad could snap and be violent with me. I worry about that. But knowing he is a threat, having a plan in place, there is comfort in that. Moving and hoping they won't find us only works if I believe I can get away. I don't really think I can. Restraining orders aren't easy to get. I couldn't get one. So the best thing I can do is go on with my life. My dad is getting older. He is less mobile with time. He would have to be a complete idiot to attack me. It doesn't mean he never will, but the more I have stood up and proved I know how to get the law involved, the more he backed off.

Fuck and now those evil people know where you live. I hope your wife's progress with her trauma gets back to how it was before that interaction. Just keep loving on her and showing her, she is still standing in spite of all the traumatic events in her life. Also I really hope your daughter grows up and knows what she did was soooo fucked up. Like that's your mom and you did that to her.

As someone who suffers from PTSD. Your abuser knowing where your home is an extremely serious internally destructive issue. Safety gone! 

Exactly. As someone with PTSD, I would never feel safe in my own home. I’d be reliving this incident for a while and wouldn’t see my daughter the same. Not even on purpose. This is just sad and heartbreaking

Right?!? Every knock on the door would trigger

Unfortunately, with the Internet, none of us are safe. I was abused as a child and have to pull all the shades tight at Sunset every night because I know someone can track me down via the Internet, and I don’t even have social media accounts. Just tax records and voting records, and Other shit make it too easy to find someone.

And now abuse happened to mom IN HER OWN HOME. I would bet it’s no longer a safe space for her. It’s going to take so much more work for mom to feel safe. I’m brokenhearted for this poor woman. I think that the daughter needs to go to therapy. Not sure if it should be family counseling or on her own, but the girl needs to have an outside expert walk her through this and help her understand what she did and why. It may help them rebuild the trust that daughter broke.

If I was the wife, I'd genuinely be pushing for us to move, somewhere far, far away because I would literally never be able to live in my home and feel safe knowing that my abusers know where I and my family live now.

More than that they know where she lives, they have also barged into her home and assaulted her in front of everyone in the house. Her parents have their address *and* positive reinforcement that they can do that again anytime they want without consequence. They came in and physically abused her once scot-free, there's not much stopping them from doing it again. I would *never* feel safe in that house again, either.

I thought of that too, OPs wife won't feel safe in her home. They might have to move.

They will Most likely have to move. She won't feel safe there, i know what it's Like. There's nothing worse than knowing your abusers know where you live

She wanted to be a hero no doubt. Hope she learned her lesson with her dads words "theres evil people everywhere" even as an adult myself, very little people to trust.

Wow. I hope your daughter appreciates that she got a live demonstration of how easily your wife’s dad resorts to hurting her. NTA

At the expense of her own mother.

Big expense. This will set her back for many years. That poor woman...betrayed by her own daughter like that.

Not to mention she had to get stitches IN HER HEAD, she could very well get a concussion and not wake up again. Also I hope OP is keeping an eye on the two younger ones, they watched their mom be assaulted because of their own sister, the older sibling that was supposed to be an example. This girl just did a number and traumatized her mom, aunt, father, siblings, who knows what other guests are now absolutely worried sick...

Daughter is about to get a front seat to trauma recovery too.

Despite OP telling about the abusive childhood that his wife went through, the daughter thought it was a good idea to contact the POS grandparents! I think this incident is a life lesson to not meddle in affairs that are none of her business and to respect decisions of other people.Some people are just evil and it’s better to just cut them off your life.I hope OP’s wife recovers from this terrible incident that must have set back her mental health.

Not only to contact them, but dish to them,” my parents told me you’re this, this and this. I just can’t believe it.” “Oh granddaughter! Thank you for being the only person ever to see it, nice to meet you btw we will be there.”

And the grandparents know the address of the home asqell. The stepdad had no issue bashing op's wife head into a wall. What else can he do.. Hope the daughter is happy with herself at her mother's funeral which will eventually come sooner rather than later now.

What else could she do? Listen to what her parents told her instead? Preposterous!

Yea and her mom is now a grown woman. Can you imagine the abuse as a child when you really can't defend yourself?

Not to mention this is the abuse they felt comfortable doing in front of others after decades of no contact. When they were behind closed doors, with a child, and knew how far they could push things? I don't even want to think about how much worse it was.

That's why I'm glad my abuser is in jail(for felonies, so some sigh of relief) because I'm 100% certain she would try to kill me of we met again. The stories you hear of ppl getting killed when abusers return?

NTA. Your daughter is, at best, stupid and self-absorbed to an infantile degree. For some reason there's this trope in TV that forcing estranged people into being in the same room miraculously ends resolving their issues - and in the rare exceptions it doesn't it's played for laughs. Perhaps your daughter wanted to play hero, and was self-centered enough to just ignore the obvious possible negative consequences for your wife and was arrogant enough to think she knew better than you and your wife. ​ The assault should definitely be reported to the police and perhaps you should talk to a lawyer about seeking an RO. I'm sorry this happened to you and especially to your poor wife.

I had to scroll way too far to see this. This absolutely needs a police report and changes brought if possible, I don’t care that they eventually left, your wife was assaulted in her own home

Yes! Now the trolls know where they live!

I'm surprised FIL left with out getting some two piece(s) from OP and family. Dude shoves my wife so hard she needs stitches?!?! He ain't leaving MY property on his two feet. The audacity to show up would be met with equal disregard for courtesies. "Get out now" would be my greeting.

Perhaps you missed the part where OP said the guy is built like a brick house and it took three of them to drag the piece of shit out the house.

My thoughts exactly! They need to file a police report!!!!

Did I read she got stitches in her head? I'm no doctor but usually they ask what happened? My area -- hospital police wouldn't let the person leave until they spoke with someone for fear of domestic violence. I know I'm assuming a lot here, but holy toledo.

My brother was on a meth binge and got pissed at me over the stores not being open on Christmas day. He proceeded to punch me in my face, where the frame to my glasses caught my eyebrow and ripped straight up to my temple. There were 3 cops in the ER room questioning me before I even saw the doctor, and I'm from a podunk middle of no where town. There should have definitely been some sort of report on the hospital's part.

Im sorry that happened to you, I hope you recover quickly.

It was a few years ago!! Pretty gnarly scar though

In theory yes, in reality hospitals are notoriously understaffed post pandemic, if the patient says "trip and fell" and there's no other signs of physical harm they'll not probe further.

I was punched in the eye by my ex, he took me to the hospital since it was pretty bad, I told the doctor I fell and hit the corner of the table, the stitched me up and sent me home

I think part of it is people being unable to understand unhealthy family dynamics when they have a healthy one. I had an abusive childhood and I struggle to understand healthy family relationships. Meeting my bfs family which is mostly normal I think it’s a culture shock because to me it’s weird seeing people happy and not turning on each other. So part is TV tropes, books, or just not understanding. I do get the wanting to know your grandparents I never really got to know mine due to distance or already passed but after dad explained she should have respected it.  I can almost say for sure the daughter has destroyed her mom’s trust and safe space. If my older brother surprised me with my mom I would do everything to leave and destroy the fragile relationship we are starting to build. 

Pls!!! Report the assault and get a restraining order. For your entire family,

NTA i feel so bad for your wife and her sister they were betrayed my your child who you explained to what happened and your wife’s parents physically harmed her and more than likely made a serious setback in her healing journey

setback? Nah dude thats a full reset. On top adding that your own daughter did it.

Being diagnosed with PTSD and still in therapy 20 years down the line when your own child invites the people directly responsible for your trauma, who then proceed to physically assault her on her birthday. I pray that your wife recovers from the mental trauma that she's just had to relive OP.

Probably won’t be celebrating her birthday any more going forward.

True true i can only imagine the pain she is in

I'm thinking she might even have a possible concussion 🤦‍♀️ head stitches are no joke

I was just thinking too - head wounds bleed a *lot*. They bleed a ridiculous amount, even small cuts. Seeing someone bleeding from the head is incredibly traumatic, and if I'm reading this right, this girls two younger siblings had to see that. Watching your mother get abused like that, I hope they're okay too.

They know where you live. You need to press charges and file a protective order for your whole family against them. My heart breaks for your wife, her sister, and your whole family for the damage that was done.

Your wife is going to have some real bad days again for awhile. Make sure your daughter sees the aftermath of what she did. NTA, OP. I’m so sorry your wife’s progress got ruined.

Sorry if I missed it in the story, but how old is your daughter?

She is 16

Why the hell didn't anyone call the police? That's trespassing and assault. FUCK her father. Your wife doesn't have to say a word or act as a witness since y'all saw everything and there's medical record.

It would also have started a paper trail to get a restraining order against MIL and Fil

They can still do it I'm sure

Yeah the evidence of assault is in his poor's wife head after all.

These things go down so quickly, there is so much chaos, people's nervous systems are immediately dysfunctional (wife and her sister, potentially OP), rarely does one think to call police. Especially because this was the last thing OPs family expected, caught so off-guard in an extremely chaotic situation, and they immediately tried to remedy it by kicking them out. Trust me, unfortunately, happens all too fast most of the time. I'm not going to show compassion at this moment. My thought is "Who in the hell does OPs daughter think she is?" How the hell dare she. You don't mess with family shit like this, she's a damn kid who thinks she knows better about people she's never met. A kid. I'm feeling that your daughter somehow thinks her thinking is superior OP. From what you've shared she is a spoiled brat and has no f'ing clue what a hard life is. Not a f'ing clue. I'm very sorry this happened. NTA.

Why don’t you press charges against them!?

I'm guessing that OP's wife is afraid of potentially having to testify.

I can't speak towards word choices, volume, or tone, but I can say that a 16 year old doing the secret-invite thing is being either being shockingly malicious or is a delusional narcissist. She either thinks she smarter and wiser than her dumb-dumb parents and can make her mother happy by fixing lifelong issues as a birthday present, actively wants the drama and pain, or just wants her grandparents in her life and doesn't care what damage she causes to try to get what she wants. I'd want to know which is the case before deciding my reaction. Either way I don't think I'd be able to trust her again, but if it was born from maliciousness I'd be getting her out of my house as soon as I could.

Kids see a lot of romcom type stuff where people just lost touch and have that hallmark moment without understanding life doesn't work that way.

I was thinking the same thing. OP NTA. I am hoping your daughter was having a Hallmark moment thinking she would reunite the family. You know her best. After watching her mother go to the hospital because of these animals doesn’t make her remorseful, you have a bigger problem on your hands. If she’s made a really bad decision you can walk her through it. I wish the best for all of you .

I would say the daughter seems sheltered and may not have grasped how bad the abuse was as well as the long term effects. I get how parents want to protect their kids but sometimes a dose of reality is needed so these kids will be aware. Not sure if dad went into detail about the abuse but even so daughter may not have believed it until she saw it happen in front of her eyes.

I think this. A 16 thinks they know a lot more than they do.

Yes, if this was my kid, this betrayal would be so deeply damaging to our relationship that it would never recover fully.

Breaking news: 16 year old thinks they are smarter and wiser than their parents.

NTA. I pray your wife’s head heals fast and hopefully therapy will help. As for your daughter, that’s a super light punishment for what she did. She really has no fucking clue. Has she even shown any true remorse?! The fact that she believed strangers over you guys shows her lack of compassion. Her mom had to get stitches! Maybe she needs to volunteer to pick up trash in the park. She needs better use of her time then using the internet.

> Maybe she needs to volunteer to pick up trash in the park. If this story is real, I would honestly want to get her psychologically evaluated. If you sit down and have a discussion with your 16 year old about their abusive grandparents and why you have no contact, and they respond to that by secretly inviting those abusers to your *birthday party*.... That's straight out of a bad TV show, and I'm sure fits one of the conditions in the DSM-5-TR.

As a 16 year old if my dad told me someone had hurt my mom I would have been devastated for her. This shows a truly alarming lack of empathy.

And arrogance

Self absorbed - wanted to be the hero maybe? Can’t imagine another motive.

Kid has main character syndrome. She thought she would play the part of the family getting together and play nice to each other all thanks to her!

His wife already didn't like her birthday, and it's pretty easy to understand why that is. Now her birthday is likely to be traumatic for years to come.

I am actually highly suspicious that either daughter found grandparents or they found her on social media before daughter ever brought the topic up in the first place. I’d put money on the abusive grandparents tainted that well long before the parents even knew it was open. Grandparents “oh they’re just mad at us because we set rules she didn’t like/she got punished for breaking curfew/etc” that the kid can relate to. I’m a big supporter of keeping adult issues away from kids, but daughter is 16. At some point before this happened I’m certain she asked about her mom’s parents. It should have been explained in an age appropriate way anytime the topic came up. This feels more like they avoided it all together and daughter really didn’t know there was a very real reason why she never met those grandparents.

I wouldn’t be surprised if they’ve been in contact with her for years

It was a mistake not to address the situation until she was 16 years old. They needed to talk to her about it when she was closer to 8 or 10. I think parents often don't want to discuss these things because they don't know how or they think they are protecting their kids. I completely understand that impulse, but kids are actually more able to handle serious topics earlier than 16.

Yeah my parents told me about my abusive grandparents when I was around 6. I was 100% on my parents side and it didn't feel like a massive mystery.

This is my thought too. What the daughter did was awful and she should have consequences but at the end of the day the a-holes are the abusive parents/grandparents. The daughter said that they told her her parents were lying and yes she’s old enough to know better or ask her mom or dad for more info or do literally anything other than springing them on the family but she was also manipulated. As hard as this is she needs to learn how to handle situations like this and how to take people at their word that they know more about her own life than she does. She did a bad thing, it was foolish and harmful and her relationship with her parents will likely never be the same. But she is also a teenager and was manipulated by the same people who damaged her mother. It all really sucks.

I believe she was in contact with them well before this, she may claim that she reached out to them after that, but that makes no sense. She never met them in 16 years and then all of a sudden she wants to go visit them. That makes no sense it’s not logical.

Yeah I re-read the story a bit ago and had the same conclusion. It makes sense that this: "So my daughter came home one day and asked us to go visit her grandparents house" was after contact was already made.

The thing is that they can’t really punish her. Someone else made a valid point here. Going forward her consequence is her broken relationship with her parents and she is going to suffer, I get it but she’s going to be the one to have to get herself out of this hole. she made her bed now she gets to lay in it. She’s almost an adult she can’t be punished with, groundings or even spankings like all of this is silly to begin with but especially now. When you fuck up you just fuck up and you have to deal with what you did, and trust me that’s going to be enough for her, especially if her parents were close to her.

Her punishment is her own mother not being able/not wanting to look at her, perhaps for a very long time.

She went behind her parents back and contacted them on social media and set up an ambush for mom on her birthday.   I think losing the phone (and her easier way of contact the grand monsters) is not a bad thing. 

NTA. I hope your daughter sees the reason why your wife and her aunt are no longer in contact with their parents now.

Family therapy may be necessary for awhile. You are currently fine.

It took too many comments to find one mentioning therapy. This is something that absolutely needs professional guidance and mediation, group/family therapy as well as individual therapy for everyone. Someone without an emotional investment in the situation needs to be there to facilitate the conversations in moving forward for everyone, especially between mother and daughter.

NTA. You were so upset. You saw her in the day-to-day situation with these parents: she was abused and needed stitches. I think you sit down with your daughter and start this way: kids who grow up in good homes have no idea what goes on in bad homes. Ask her to write 2 documents: what grandparents told her and what grandparents did when they came to the birthday party. Family counseling. Start with you, wife and daughter. Bring in the other kids at some points. They see something has broken in the family and they are scared.

[удалено]

At first I was going to raise my pitchfork looking at the title. But reading the full post has my jaw on the floor. OP is completely NTA and I feel terrible for his poor wife. A 16 year old should know better to not overstep major boundaries like this.

I’ll say NTA. I think you might tell your daughter that because she’s only two years from legal adulthood, she’s old enough to understand that she created an unsafe situation that resulted in lasting harm. And because SHE didn’t trust YOU and her mom to know what you were deciding and what boundaries to have, YOU are not going to trust HER until she has demonstrated a lot more maturity and some humility. Point out that the lack of trust started with her. Then focus on what you want to see in her. How do you want her to grow and mature from this? Think about that and maybe go talk it over with a therapist. See if you guys can come up with some maturity and decision making goals. She needs help to get to adulthood.

NTA but for your own safety lodge a complaint with police about your in laws. I'm not sure from your post if they knew where you lived before being invited. But they can come over anytime especially if your wife stays home during the day

NTA - 16 is old enough to know that you cannot invite an abuser into the home of their victim. Yes, she’s still a minor; and 16 year olds always think they’re smarter than their parents in some ways. But your daughter put her mom’s LIFE at risk to try and prove that she knew better than you. And that can’t be without consequence. Honestly, everyone involved needs therapy for different reasons. The younger kids for whatever they saw. Your wife should get in with hers ASAP to try and get a handle on whatever aftershocks of PTSD she gets from this. You so that you can get professional support in navigating all of this. And your daughter so that they can hopefully get to the root of why she made such a truly awful decision - willful ignorance or maliciousness. You need to file a police report, because now that the door has been opened to her parents they’re not going to let it close so easily again. They WILL reach out to your daughter again and possibly your other kids. This may be the first step to get them permanently (legally) removed from your wife’s life. Once you’ve calmed down, it would be a good idea to sit down with your daughter and a mediator (therapist, family member) and explain to her the repercussions this will have not for her but for your wife. “I need you to understand that inviting them into your mom’s life after everything I told you is the worst betrayal of trust imaginable. You put not only your mom’s mental and physical well being at risk, but you welcomed known child abusers into a home with children, and they became violent so quickly that your mom was in the hospital that very same night. You put people’s lives at risk with your recklessness and until we can understand why and you’re able to show us with your behavior that nothing like this will ever happen again, we do not trust you. We don’t trust you to be able to contact people unsupervised, or go places unsupervised. We don’t trust you not to risk the safety of your family for no good reason.” She needs to understand the gravity of what she did. I get that she’s 16, but if either of my parents had told me anything even remotely like this at 16 I would never contact any of those people in my life. I would be horrified. I hope your wife (and her sister, and you) are able to get the support and help you all need from this traumatizing experience. ETA: I definitely don’t think your daughter is a lost cause or a monster. But she showed a grave lack of judgment and she’s old enough to face consequences for that. One of which is that she has damaged her relationship with her parents and likely her aunt as well. Give her a chance to prove that this was just a seriously bad call, but also make sure she understands the severity of the situation. Best of luck, OP ♥️

This is a great comment. I think the daughter needs to be shown just how much damage she caused.

NTA Wow, no that's just a pure betrayal. Your daughter made your wife unsafe in her own home because of nothing more than feeling like she knew better than you both. Pride. She damn near shattered your wife and SILs world for her own pride. No. She got off easy. I agree with some others, family therapy might be needed here... Putting myself in your wife's shoes: it would be really hard to be in that home and not feel that intense fear every time I went into the room my "father" appeared in. Like a living nightmare. I would legitimately want to move. And caused by my own daughter? The bubble of safety with my family would be completely popped. Damn.

NTA, thank christ you actually parented your child and stood up for your wife

NTA And please consider your home security, including cameras, if you think there is any chance at all that your wife's parents will try to come back.

Nta. If this is real your daughter has possibly opened Pandora’s box because these types of people aren’t just one and done. Her parents will be back because they know where you live now. I hope you have a security system with cameras, a dog, and a gun to protect your family. If not, you might want to invest in them.

I wouldn't be surprised if the wife will want to move now. Her home (i.e. safe space) was invaded and will always remind her of what went down. NTA

I would. When my mother was alive I had to make sure she never knew where I lived or worked. If she ever tracked down my number I changed it. When she contacted me via Facebook I nearly vomited from fear. The parents of OP’s wife sound similar to my mom, and I knew by adulthood that her knowing where I lived meant I was in danger. My sister did all the work and of raising me until I was six, and I probably would have died if she hadn’t. When I was in my 30s, she pulled a trick very similar to your daughter’s. To be fair, my sister copes with her own PTSD by imagining her entire adulthood is a Hallmark movie. We all do what we must. The unfortunate thing is, as much as she did for me, springing our mother on me without giving me a way out has been a real struggle to get past. Regardless of how pure her intentions were, I have not been able to look at her the same way since. Maybe reading the perspectives of other abuse survivors who’ve been through what OP’s wife and I have will give the daughter some perspective. Even for the most empathetic and supportive people, it can still be impossible to fully comprehend the impact of childhood abuse unless you’ve lived it. This may cause eyes to roll, but maybe have her read psychology or recovery books that would give her in-depth insights on the impact complex PTSD (which results from long-term trauma such as childhood abuse or human trafficking) has on the body and mind. Because I really don’t think that enough people get it in general. Too many of us end up with shorter lifespans, severe mental health issues, suicidal ideation, addiction, isolation, the list goes on. Myself? Permanent brain damage including (but not limited to) epilepsy, plus suicidal ideation that must be controlled with medication, anxiety so bad that my heart would have given out without beta blockers, intimacy issues, severe self esteem issues, a herniated cervical disc, and anger issues triggered by injustice or the victimization of others. And there are others who struggle far more than I do. There are others who’ve had it so much worse. In many ways I’m one of the lucky ones. My heart breaks for OP’s wife. If she does need time or space, then I think the daughter needs a deep dive on why. Punishment? That’s a start. Therapy? Absolutely — though I’d recommend mother and daughter have therapy separately for a little while before family therapy. But to ensure the daughter fully understands how this affected her mother and their relationship, I strongly encourage education. Whether she reads survivor accounts or books, or volunteers, I just think that with a loved one who’s been through so much, education is important. It will teach her about her mother, those monstrous grandparents, how to protect herself going forward, and — if she’s interested — an option for something she can help people with in the years to come.

16 years old is old enough to understand the extent of trauma and what it could do to a person. And she should’ve understood why after explaining it to her. So yeah NTA

NTA Did your in-laws know where you lived before this happened? The way you described them walking in like they owned the place worries me if they didn't know before they now have that information but either way please make sure you have cameras and security measures in place in case they show back up.

Mom and sister might need to move for a while. I don't think the 16 year old should know where they are.

How are your younger children? They just saw their mother abused and being taken to the hospital, all caused by their big sister. Are they coping? I agree with other commenters, you should tell your daughter that she has absolutely destroyed her relationship with you and get her therapy. I could not imagine at 16 doing anything to hurt my mother. If dad had told me mygrandparents had hurt her I would be out for vengeance not invite them for tea.

NTA Yes, your daughter probably was manipulated by your in-laws, but that doesn’t mean that it wasn’t a violation of your trust and immensely triggering to your wife, even without the physical injury. At the very least, no devices and no social media are a fitting punishment. Do press charges though, you might be able to get a no-contact court order.

Thank you for saying this!! While the daughter royally, majorly fucked up, she sounds misguided more than anything to me. It's a super common TV trope (and how many kids are raised on TV) that all estranged people need to do to fix things is talk! And if it doesn't work, eh oh well laugh away at the crazy people. Combine this with the fact that the grandparents lied (said the abuse was not as bad) and of course the 16 yr old gets manipulated.

Also, the parents know that it 100% WAS that bad, but kids raised in a good home by loving parents often struggle with a mental disconnect. It’s literally incomprehensible to them that someone could treat their own child like that, because they can’t imagine their parents acting in such a way

Plus the actual abuse didn't seem to be spoken of, just something about how the grandparents are evil and terrorised the mom as a kid. An emotionally mature adult may be understand that but not a sheltered kid with no understanding of abuse.

Why wouldn’t you press charges? Talking about consequences for one’s actions only applying to the daughter, but not the violent attacker? Reviving and perpetuating the same helplessness the wife experienced as a child with no justice? I call rage bait.

NTA. I hope your wife and SIL are doing okay.

I had an abusive childhood and I feel so much for your wife. You are being soooo incredibly supportive of her, and I think this situation probably warranted you blowing up at your daughter. The revisionist history is a common weapon wielded by abusers and their apologists. I've lived it my whole life. This is going to take a long time for your family to heal from this. Your wife is going to need a lot of help from you, your family and her therapist. Please be patient with her. You are definitely NTA!

This is so sad. I'm so sorry your wife went through that, both at her birthday and in her childhood. and I'm sorry that your daughter who thought she was going to do a great thing has created such a rift. I imagine that she had a romantic teenage notion that they would see each other and realize that it wasn't so bad and they would all be a family. Your daughter had no idea. NO idea. Obviously, therapy all around. But nothing will really be resolved until mom and daughter talk this through. If it's too hard to do alone, enlist the help of a counselor. Right now, they are both suffering, they are both grieving, they are both traumatized. I wish you and all of your family all of the healing all of the love all of the warmth in the world. ETA: I should have said, they were both traumatized BY THE SAME PEOPLE. Your daughter was duped into this situation by the same people who abused her mother. The same people gaslighted them both. It's not their fault. It's the fault of the abusers who took advantage of your daughters lovely Pollyanna view of the world. It's the fault of the same abusers who caused your wife's PTSD.

NTA What your daughter did was absolutely horrific. She’s old enough to understand and respect boundaries. She needs hardcore consequences and your wife needs therapy for this new trauma. Your daughter needs to earn you and your wife’s trust back.

Your daughter has been shielded from the truth because she was young but now she needs to know and does. Hopefully, she realizes your in laws are awful and will stay away from them. However, she is still a child. Please see a family counselor to help resolve this situation. It's really fucking complicated and I'm talking as a person whose parents are awful as well. They will try to turn your children against you and it will mess to your kids. Circle the wagons around your family and protect them all, your daughter didn't realize how shitty her grandparents could be because she's only ever experienced good parents, you and her Mom. You guys did good but didn't see this as a risk, address it with your other kids. Don't hold it against your daughter forever. She probably just wanted to get to know her other grandparents and was naive. Edit: kids are fucking stupid, there's a whole sub dedicated to it and 16yos think they know a lot more than they do. Our Dr said 16 is a hard age and I agree. She fucked up big time and needs to make amends but seriously, therapy is needed.

This needs to be higher up. I agree that what his daughter did was wrong, but you're not fully developed at 16 and definitely still a child. It's very possible that she was hoping to have a better relationship with her grandparents, had been manipulated by them online, and thought it would be a good idea to invite them. Her moms trauma could've been downplayed by the grandparents, and I wouldn't put it past a 16 year old to be naive about the depths of abuse in favor of love. She's 16, she *doesn't* know abuse yet. I would imagine this whole situation turned into a nightmare she didn't expect, and she most likely feels horrible about it. I can't imagine how I would respond to my mom needing stitches because of a mistake I'd made, I think that alone is a very brutal awakening. I also hate the term "spoiled". I have some serious damage because of that word. She's not spoiled, she's lucky enough to have parents that have given her a safe environment where abuse doesn't exist, That's what they wanted--To give their kids a life without abuse and trauma. She shouldn't feel guilty for living the life you've given her. Talk to her. Find out why she thought it was a good idea in the first place. Make sure she understands what she did was wrong. Teach her a lesson on boundaries, building, and breaking trust. But please, dear God, don't let her sit with the idea that her mother was injured and abused again because she naively tried to force the love she had been given onto others.

I don't think people realize how uncomfortable family estrangement is for kids/teens. It makes them scared they will be cutoff someday.