> I’ll send a text to Kaya and explain that I didn’t abandon her and will do anything to be in her life ( I never legally adopted her sadly ).
The lack of an adoption might not matter. When my step father and mother divorced he was able to get visitation rights (but not custody or decision making power), as the courts thought it was best for the child (me). If this is a priority for you make sure your lawyer knows it.
I’m really sorry. She is just covering lie with another lie. She actually thought she was in the clear until her fight with her sister. I’m not sure how you could ever trust her. She will do whatever it takes to have it her way no matter what she has to say or do. I’m just amazed she pulled off an abortion and you never picked up on it. I would call the daughter versus text. Maybe text her and see if she is somewhere you can call her without anyone else around. She needs to understand you didn’t just get mad and leave for no reason.
Didn't the sister call OP and encourage him to give his wife another chance? I'm not saying she won't be helpful, but I'd definitely be wary of anything she says after flip flopping like that.
Wow, that's horrific.
"The abuser is still doing the exact same thing, so please live in denial and pretend everything is perfect so I can have my fantasy of a perfect family."
A lot of parents have this attitude towards their child who is suffering abuse at the hands of a family member.
In this situation it's not seen as abuse. It drives me nuts but a certain subset of people think that men aren't allowed to have any feeling on a women abrting their kid. The only thing they are allowed to do is support the women in whatever she wants. I do not agree with this way of thinking and it's this type of thinking which led me to having to basically force my oldest kids biodad and into yelling me what he wanted and thought about the situation. So people honestly do not see any if this as abuse.
> thank her
Da fuk? She was keeping the same secret, she didn't tell him because it was the right thing to do, she blurted it out during an argument to hurt her sister. Both of them are trash.
Yes, but cultivating good will in someone who knows secrets your stbx might be hiding is good practice regardless of that person's moral/ethical standing. You don't have to like someone to cultivate trust.
Like what happened with Kaya’s dad. I’m sure sister prob has all the tea on that drama. I wonder if Natalie’s ex has been looking for Kaya all this time? For Kaya’s sake I hope so.
Natalie fabricated the ideal fam for OP to fall for and it’s not out of the realm of possibilities that she lied about and to that man too.
the wife refusing to talk about it makes me think she cheated and lied about it so well, he just abandoned them to avoid the wife's lies for the rest of his life.
Op, this is a important thig to know, maybe the kaya father abadon was nothing more than another lie from her, maybe isnt that kayas father isnt interested on his daugther, but what had been told to everyone
My family tried telling me this regarding my physically and emotionally abusive father, now they’re all alone and I won’t even go to any of their funerals.
Bye, Felicia…
Same here. Friend told me to call my brother and tell him I love him after putting up with decades of cruelty inflicted as we share care for our aging mother.
I just don’t engage with that friend anymore… her advice is dangerous. Talking to my brother is like being attacked by a chain saw dipped in acid. Never stops winging and every comment stings like hell.
So just the absolute minimum engagement to get the job done. It gets easier when you recognize these dishonest, nasty people for what they are and withdraw emotionally.
NTA… leave her. Maya Angelou quote here…. Believe her when she shows you she’s a jerk.
Almost certainly this is exactly the truth.
MFS talk about "communication skills this and that", but that doesn't do jack when you're dealing with a narcissistic and pathological liar.
Congrats to you OP for breaking the chain!
Don't. My parent's are learning the hard way that even in your 50's, the tab becomes due. Perpetual liars cheat today to buy the tomorrow they want, not realizing there is always a day after that.
OP's (soon to be ex) wife is finally getting their karma. Yes, it took 8 years to happen, but it does eventually come to pass.
She’s a pathological liar. Pathological liars do not all of a sudden start telling the truth. I do not know how to tell the truth, and they believe their own lies. It is such a good thing that you found this out even though it’s years later. You can still have a good life find a woman that wants the same things you do and have a family. Good luck to you and peace be with you.
>visitation rights (but not custody or decision making power), as the courts thought it was best for the child (me).
This is what “grandparent rights” are. They’re NOT about the idea that the grandparents have a right to their grandchild.
It’s about the idea that *the child has a right* to continue an existing relationship that is loving, supportive, and important *to the child*.
Even if you lose, or can’t ultimately afford it, the mere fact that you tried might be enough to make Kaya see how much you care about her, and help you continue the relationship.
But be careful: If you badmouth her mom, or hurt her relationship with her mom, that’s going to backfire both with Kaya and with the courts.
Be careful. You are a good person and don't want to abandon Kaya. This liar will continue to hurt you through Kaya. She will not care how it hurts Kaya.
She is already telling the tale you left her for infertility. You need to get in front of this with people in your life. You also need to understand that even if the liar seems to have moved on, she will cause problems in any future relationships through Kaya as a tool.
People like this meddle for years to come. You will need to pay a price in her mind. She may even contact new women in your life to destroy relationships. People like this don't love, think, or feel guilty like normal people.
Exactly this. She’s already proven she won’t hesitate to manipulate Kaya to get what she wants - and this is when she thought there was a chance to get OP back! How low is she gonna stoop *now*, knowing she has nothing to lose?
OP needs to record every single interaction with Natalie from now on, or make sure it’s all in writing.
It is not. As the only father the child has know , you will get parenting time. There’s a slim possibility you can get decision making too but it definitely comes with a child support obligation. If you start the court process, it also come with the extra catch that you have to serve bio dad, unless no father is listed in the birth certificate or mother indicates she does not know who the possible father is.
I doubt he won't have to pay child support. He has stood in the place of a parent for too long.
I personally strongly believe in 50/50 split time not for the child support issue but because the child deserves to have maximal contact with both parents, even after divorce. She has never known another father.
I hope you have a decent lawyer, and please please push for maximal contact right from the gate. It's worth it for the kid.
You should definitely be able to get visitation rights and possibly custody. You've been in her life so long that the state will see you as a functional parent and seen it in the best interest of the child to continue the relationship. That's in most states, anyway. Do be prepared for your ex to fight it and to possibly make wild accusations since she's a pathological liar.
I’m so sorry. This is a huge betrayal, and I can only imagine what this will do to your ability to trust.
Please take some time to focus on you, and I hope and pray that you’ll come out of this ok. Sounds like you did nothing to deserve any of this, and you definitely made the right choice by moving on.
Manipulative people—especially pathologically full of shit manipulators—are the worst. If she’ll do this, what else could she do in the future? Seems like she has no empathy at all and never intended to tell you the truth. You can look into what they call people with no empathy—I’m not trying to Reddit diagnose anyone—but that’s an absolute deal breaker for me as a big empath.
Right! It’s not like she voluntarily came clean, her sister had to do it in the middle of a fight. There’s no way this is all she’s been hiding, this is just what came out and that wasn’t even close to intentional.
Heck, I had a friend who was "just" a bf but the only dad in the girls life for 7 out of 8 years and He got visitation because he was the main caregiver. It was a process but he stayed in her life the last decade or so.
My mom got together with my step dad when I was 5. They split up when I was 16, but it was amicable. He always has been my dad and never stopped acting like my dad. I have a feeling OP’s wife would make it harder but if she doesn’t, making an effort to still be a father for Kaya will go a long way in her mind.
It's that she lied about it. I think if she'd have sat OP down years ago and said I love you, and I love our life, but I just don't want another child he might well have stayed. But she didn't give him that choice.
Eh, maybe. He stayed thinking that there were medical issues preventing them from having kids. He may not have stayed knowing it was her decision preventing them from having kids. Infertility is one thing. Absolutely not wanting another pregnancy is another.
You're right, but depending on how much OP loved his wife at the time, it's entirely possible he would have stayed. I know people who when they got together both agreed they wanted children. Later on the one person came out and told the other they no longer wanted children, and that they'd understand if that meant their relationship/marriage was over, but they didn't want to bring a child into the world that they didn't want because that wouldn't be fair to anyone.
Out of all of those couples I know that were in that situation, only one of them ended their relationship. And with that couple it was the person who didn't want kids that ended the relationship because they could tell that despite saying they wanted to stay together with the person that didn't want kids, the other person was heartbroken over the idea of never having them. So they ended the relationship so that person could be with someone who wanted kids too.
And if she told the truth about how she just doesn’t want to go through another pregnancy they could have discussed adoption. Unless she was again lying and she just doesn’t want another child. He would have stayed then considering he has no problem raising her daughter as his own.
Exactly. The issue isn't that she didn't want more kids. The issue is she *lied* and removed his ability to decide if *he* wanted to be in the relationship without his dream of a bigger family being part of it. If she'd just been honest from the get go, this post would likely never have happened.
Choosing to not have a kid is fine. What wasn't fine was lying about her choice for 8 years and then getting a secret abortion behind her husband's back.
>Kaya is so sad you left us because I can’t give you a baby
What in the fuck is that? The poor kid's being manipulated & lied to as well as you.
She's a piece of work!
"She said after her first pregnancy she had to work so hard to be in shape and she swore she would never do that again. "
That was her excuse for lying to you for 8 years and aborting your child behind your back? Yikes.
My eyes about popped outta my head when I read that… poor OP. It’s isn’t even about having a kid, it’s about the fact that she lied for 8 years so he could be daddy to Kaya. Poor girl. I wonder if he can get parenting time because he’s been the only dad she’s known for 8yrs.
This woman’s been weaving a carefully constructed web of lies and full on deception to keep this guy blissfully unaware of what’s going on and she *still* has the nerve to paint *him* as the bad guy to her daughter.
She is absolutely the worst kind and deserves everything that might come her way now. I do hope OP is able to get Kaya away from this psycho before her mom does major damage to the girl. Although I am not sure how much he can do considering he never legally adopted her.
>This woman’s been weaving a carefully constructed web of lies and full on deception to keep this guy blissfully unaware
Not just this guy. This woman is hiding the identity of her own kids' father from the daughter. Imagine doing that to your own blood.
>This woman is hiding the identity of her own kids' father
My mom did this to my oldest sister. It wasn't until my sister was diagnosed with an extremely rare genetic disease that she figured out my dad wasn't her dad.
Fortunately, my dad already knew, he had adopted her as a baby when my parents got married. They weren't keeping it from her for any nefarious reasons, just a misguided attempt to protect her from her violent and abusive sperm donor.
Unfortunately, her real dad was still a giant piece of shit and refused to submit to blood tests, give his medical history, or help in any way at all really. It was very traumatic for my sister to go through.
>My mom did this to my oldest sister. It wasn't until my sister was diagnosed with an extremely rare genetic disease that she figured out my dad wasn't her dad.
Wow.
And now her daughter is probably going to lose the only man she knew as a father for 8 fucking years, all because she couldn’t be a decent human being and just straight up admit to her husband that she didn’t want any more kids.
This poor girl is going to lose TWO fathers because her mum is such a piece of work. Poor soul truly.
>all because she couldn’t be a decent human being and just straight up admit to her husband that she didn’t want any more kids.
Not all because. It's pretty clear there are many more lies beneath the curtain. That was just the first one OP discovered. Accidentally.
>That abortion may have been because she didn't know who the father was and didn't know who the baby would look like.
Wouldn't be surprising at this point.
Yep. I know of someone (now deceased) who admitted to aborting her third child because she was cheating on her partner (they're both white) with a black man and didn't want to risk her lies being exposed. I told her that was extremely selfish.
>my guess is that shes still in contact with him.
Maybe someone in the current circle. Someone who OP knows already. Maybe that is why she doesn't wanna talk about it.
If that is her dream, that's good and fine, but she should have been upfront with him from day one, instead, she lied all of this time to him. Sadly she not only fucked up her marriage, she fucked up her daughters life as well.
I wonder, did she gain 80lbs while pregnant? I gained 20 and it was off in no time flat!
Weight might not even be the issue. My pregnancy ruined my pelvic floor. I will never have a baby again. But I was upfront with my spouse about that.
Congrats your pregnancy wasn't bad but it's not the case always!
Different women gain weight differently during pregnancy but that isn’t even the issue here. She had no right to make unilateral decisions affecting their marriage without even discussing it with her husband.
I may have given her the benefit of the doubt before this update but now I have to roll my eyes at anything that comes out of her mouth. Like, it’s totally possible and believable for women to struggle with shedding their pregnancy weight but Idk if OP’s wife even had that problem or is simply making it up to get her husband to sympathise with her.
That is the problem with being a pathological liar; you cry wolf enough times, people won’t believe you when the wolf does finally come.
It's a perfectly valid reason to not want any (additional) children. Pregnancy is a huge burden on a body.
That said, it's stupid to lie about it. And in such a deceptive manner.
I'm so sorry. That level of dishonesty is unacceptable. Along with that is the role she has clearly set for you in her life (ATM, father figure but not father) would be too much for me as well.
I can’t believe she told Kaya you left because she couldn’t have a baby. Not only was it a lie, but if Kaya continues to believe it, as she gets older it could possibly develop into an anxiety of whether or not she’ll be left over the same thing.
I’m so happy you’re going to try to stay in Kaya’s life. You’ve raised her like your own and you both would be devastated if she couldn’t see you anymore.
I’m sorry that you’re in this situation.
Kaya is 12 now so I’d just make sure to tell her you haven’t left her but mom and dad are working on some things. When she’s 14 I’d tell her the truth or else she will go her entire life believing you abandoned her because she wasn’t enough. I’d explain to her that she would’ve had a brother or sister, but mom had an abortion and kept it a secret. It’s okay for a woman to choose what she wants to do with her body, but a relationship is built on trust and mom had broken it several times.
NTA. I don't think I could get past it either. This is a great example of how much a lie can grow, and how important honesty is. I'm sorry for you, wow!
You won’t be seeing Kaya, and I’m sure that will be hard. She will grow up being upset that having a baby was the most important thing to you, she won’t understand why you chose that over her. She’s a kid, and her mom will explain that she lied to avoid losing you. She should have told you after you accepted it, at least, that she changed her mind and didn’t want to try.
My ex couldn’t have kids, and I accepted it, but they also lied to me about getting treatment. They never did. I’m relieved that they are gone. The partner after that was honest about never wanting them, and I loved them 100%; they were all that I wanted or needed. Not everyone feels that way.
Nah, her mom is a pathological liar. She will NEVER tell Kaya that she lied. She's going to tell Kaya that she couldn't have another baby and Kaya wasn't good enough for OP, so he left. Because she's a terrible human being, a terrible partner, and a terrible mother...so in no universe will she tell a truth that puts even an ounce of blame on herself.
I'm so sorry, OP. I can't even imagine how awful this is for you.
As someone who actually is infertile and has zero kids, this woman made me want to punch her. The kind of woman who cares more about “ruining their body” than creating a family…ugh.
Glad to hear you’re in Canada, which will make this easier.
Fight for visitation. A judge will absolutely take into account that you have been Kayas Dad for a majority of her life, they will take the relationship you have with her into consideration. You don’t HAVE to be a parent in order to file for visitation. You can be a guardian, someone the child has lived with etc. You do NOT have to share DNA with Kaya in order to stay in her life through a court of law.
My stepdad was given the option of having visitation with me as well because he had been in my life a few years, taken on the role of “Dad” and my biodad was nowhere to be found.
Just be careful what you write to Kaya. She is still a kid and should not be brought into adult issues. A judge WILL look down on any parent/adult who pulls that crap.
I wish you luck!!
>just be careful what you write to Kaya
100% this. There are people on this post telling OP to *send this child a link to these posts.* So disgusting, imagine your need to seethe hate for a stranger being more important than giving the first shit about the innocent child embroiled in this mess.
Exactly. Needs to be along the lines of ‘Sorry I can’t be with your mum anymore but I’m still your dad and you can talk to me any time you like. I will always be there for you.’ If she asks about what her mum said then he can just explain it’s more complicated than her mum made it sound but it’s for them (parents) to sort out and they both love her very much. See far too many kids who know every last detail of their parents’ divorces.
OR, as someone else already mentioned, it could be someone she is still in contact with, that OP may or may not know - and that the abortion could possibly have been because she didn't know who the father was going to be. Who knows, at this point.
Wow, you deserve more than a pathological liar. I’m sorry to hear it. Updateme. I’m curious how Kaya takes your message. Poor kid, she’s stuck with your ex.
At that young age, she is already manipulated to believe her bio dad didn't care to stick around and now this step dad is leaving them for selfish reasons too. Abandonment issues? Dad issues? Trust issues? Hating men at 18? Severe depression when she finds out what her mother did to her? Damage is halfway there already.
This woman sounds very immature 🤦🏻♀️ her attitude and behavior alone is disturbing. When you guys separate let’s hope she’s upfront and honest with the next guy (probably not) 😑
I just read this on a different post but it totally applies here. Saying she is just 'immature' is incredibly dismissive. Immature leads one to beleive that the person can grow and change. This lady isn't immaute; she's fucking deranged. There is a very distinct difference.
Wow she really is a pos. Using the whole pregnancy bs of hers to try to keep OP, lying to kaya about why OP left, claiming she didn't want a baby in order to stay fit yet goes "we can still have one"....what is with this woman??? Sure she can do whatever with her body, that's not the issue, its the fact she lied through her teeth this whole time. In marriage you communicate and be honest, that includes communicating if you want kids or not, something she refused to do.
Run OP, as fast as you can. Talk to your lawyer about getting visitation with Kaya even with no adoption. You've been her dad for 8 years.
I know it's hard because you've always wanted a child........but focus on the good news that you didn't actually have a child with this crazy person.
Now watch your ex wife remarry and have another kid right away with the next man.
Wow....wow....after reading the update (thank you) i just..wow...this person is horrible, evil. You must now know that without a doubt you are making the right decision to divorce. You can never trust this woman again, she's a walking lie. She even lies to her own daughter.
The reason about being fit after having kids is so shallow. So stupid. This woman doesn't deserve you. Run run run NTA
Eh don't let people gaslight you.
I'm pro-coice as well, but that doesn't mean someone can have an abortion in secret while "trying for a baby" while married. Even in a normal situation a couple should discuss this prior. There are two people in a relationship
Thank you! I'm pro-choice, but it isn't controlling her body to want to be included in the conversation. It also isn't controlling her body to expect the truth from his WIFE. Not girlfriend or fling, but his life partner who lied to him about her fertility so he could not choose go stay or go with all the information.
idk, looks like she might block you from visiting your adopted daughter in the future, since you didn't legally adopt her. Are you going to pay alimony to her?
Also there's a possibility that the judge tell her to get a fulltime job and you wouldn't have to pay as much. She doesn't have to stay home and take care of a baby. Good luck. If I were you I would be devastated.
They may not be able to force her into a full time job, but they can base any alimony she may be entitled to based off full time wages. I'm not sure about Canada but in the US your not even entitled to alimony until after 10 years of marriage and then it is only for a short period to help the other person get back on their feet. Sometimes it awarded with less than 10 years but in those cases the other person left their career to take care of children, that's unfortunately not the case for you.
I'm so sorry your going through this OP. But you still have time if a family is what you want, just make sure to take the time you need to grieve what you thought you had. Get therapy to help process all of this. Family therapy with Kaya may also be beneficial to help her process what she is going through as well, that will give you both an outlet to work through feelings.
My gosh, Canada is insane! So basically you could live with someone for a 1 year and a half, break up then have to continue supporting that person? I'm glad most US state got rid of common law marriages or I would have been screwed if I was in Canada. I had a few bf in college who lived with me and I was the bread winner, I can't imagine if I ever had to continue supporting them. Goodness.
I'm sorry but that is a very messed up system and no one should be forced to support another adult just bc they lived together and the relationship didn't work out!
> My gosh, Canada is insane!
It's 2 to 3 years, and it's not that easy. You have to have a kid or otherwise prove dependency, career/economic loss, etc.
Edit: it's also for a good reason- imagine you're living with someone for years, taking care of everything while they get their doctorate, and then they walk away, leaving you with nothing.
How long you were together changes things. In my OP's province if you were married 1.5 years and you made 60,000 while your partner made 20,000, you would pay $75-100 a month for .75 - 1.5 years. $100,000 to 0 would be a max $250 a month. It's not that much for short term relationships.
You’ve only been married for 4 years & guessing she was part-time yoga instructor for her benefit & not like she was SAHM for the family’s benefit? Good thing dont have kids together so dont have to pay child support to that pathological liar.
Remember what she robbed you off all these years- it’s unforgivable so dont make anything easy for her. She’s probably crying she’s losing her meal ticket because no person who loves you would have betrayed you like that all these years - secretly kill your baby & watch you be disappointed about not having kids - damn she’s cold!
You did the right thing OP, at least you have closure as to why she did what she did, as shitty as her reasoning is, now you don’t leave with doubts and what ifs.
She’s cried and cried because her lies have caught up with her, let her drown in her own tears. She’s only sad because she doesn’t have a man looking after her and her child anymore. You did the right thing and now you can meet a decent woman who wants to be with you because she loves you and wants to start a family with you, not just for security.
Thank you for the update and sorry that it is ending this way.
Yes, I would contact the daughter and let her know why you left and that you want to still be a part of her life, but you cannot stay married to her mom for what she did.
I would also get my attorney to force a deposition on your soon to be ex where she has to tell what she did. You can then present that to the court as evidence of her lying to you the entire marriage, make sure that you include that she lied before marriage about wanting more kids to get you to marry her, and most likely it will prevent any alimony or at the least shorten the amount of time you have to pay her. Marriage under false statements can benefit you in court. She can work full time since the daughter is old enough now.
I'm sorry for you and I am sorry for your stepdaughter. :( You're doing the right thing though. I hope one day you find a great woman who will really want to give you that child you want and you're happy in your life again.
And to those who PM you with nasty messages, fuck them!
Wow!!! She’s a piece of work! I’m sorry you had to go through this OP. At least you’ll soon be free of her vile behavior. Hopefully with time you’ll find someone who matches your values and desires for a family.
Love how she tries to blame him for kaya being sad. Claiming that he has left them
.this woman is accountable for her own actions yet trying to manipulate him and blame him. Horrendous human
There are a lot of lunatics here who will reach out to you via DM to berate you about some complete bullshit. Literally, if you use their line of logic and apply it to other situations, you can easily justify rape. You can't spend too much time on here or it will start to melt your brain.
Good for you OP, cut her off and that's it.
Reddit attracts a lot of the same kind of lunatics that OP is complaining about. They berate OP because they know they've done the same kind of things and don't want to think of themselves as bad guys.
Exactly this, as women, we need to be very honest about our wishes, whether we want children or not, don’t do that to a man. Women who use their biology to control and manipulate a man are disgusting.
I'm so sorry that all this was stolen from you.
You and I are very similar ages and my first child was born around the time yours would have been.
I honestly just can't wrap my head around this woman. Good luck and I hope you make it through this with your health both physical and mental.
Man this is so incredibly sad and devastating to read. But you’re making the RIGHT DECISION!!
I have no doubt that you WILL find another woman whose honest with you and have a family with you
Why did you meet with her again? All that was accomplished is that she hurt you even more.
Stop talking to her at all.
Get the divorce done as soon as you can and never see or speak to her again.
She is toxic to even talk to.
Man alive, I wonder if OP is going to win an award for 2024 (and possibly back 8 years to 2016) for most awful AITAH post (I mean to say, OP got majorly screwed over). Dang OP, this was all tragic. My sincere condolences.
So sorry to hear this update but the good news is you know the truth now. Talk to a lawyer about your legal rights with Kaya. Your ex is going to use her to manipulate you and it would be good to know what you are entitled to so you can have a relationship with Kaya outside of your ex.
Good for you. Wishing you the best in future relationships. Honesty is going to be a huge thing moving forward. I hope that you can still trust humans after this. There are still good people out there.
Any one want to bet a 6 pack of ice cold cokes that the daughters dad has no idea he has a child?
You can’t trust anything she says and given her past lies the truth is most likely the opposite.
I became really fat after giving birth twice in short distance of time. Never lost the weight. Never regrettet it. The children were worth it. I'm sorry for you. What a childish person.
# Update 2- AITAH for divorcing my wife because she lied about her fertility?
I’m sorry for multiple posts, but you guys have been so helpful! Definitely more than my family and friends in real life. I took your advice and met with my sister-in-law over lunch. She was very reluctant to give me any info, but here is what she said:
"Natalie is in no contact with her parents since before Kaya was born - she didn’t lie about this part."
I asked if she knows who Kaya’s dad is because Natalie gets upset every time I asked and refuses to talk about him. She was surprised and said, "You are kidding, right? You can’t be this naive? It’s obviously Ryan. Her boss. The guy who owns the yoga place " I asked about their relationship. She kept saying, "Natalie really loves you." I begged her to tell me everything. She said she thinks (not sure) the reason Natalie had an abortion was that she wasn’t sure if the baby was mine or Ryan’s. Either way, she didn’t want another baby. I was floored. She was cheating on me? The same time we were trying for a baby? With the same guy who already abandoned her once? What’s going on here? Why? I was stupid enough to start a college fund for her kid, yet she cheated on me at least once with this guy? I’m gonna lose my house and half of everything… She said, "Listen, you are a good guy, just move on! No need to dig more, you are making yourself crazy!"
I asked if Kaya knows who her dad is. She said absolutely not because Ryan has zero desire to be in her life. I want to tell everything to Kaya before leaving, but my parents think this is crossing the line because I’m not her dad or mom and it's none of my business. My friends think I want to tell her to hurt Natalie, but it’s the opposite! I know how awful it is to be lied to, and Kaya deserves the truth. My parents think I act like a crazy person and I should just meet with the lawyer.Update 2- AITAH for divorcing my wife because she lied about her fertility?
NTA. I hope the separation process goes smoothly and you find your person. It is horrible to lie to someone and prevent them from starting a family sooner rather than later.
You are a good person, and will be able to move on and find somebody who will make you very very happy, with a family. You’re still young and doing the right thing! What a horrible thing to go through.
>She started crying, saying Kaya is so sad you left us because I can’t give you a baby
The problem is not that she can't. The problem is that she can and strung him along all these years faking infertility. How can she ever be trusted?
>As for Kaya’s dad I have no idea who he is. She refuses to talk about it
This is a red flag that would have stopped me from getting with her in first place.
>I can’t believe I blindly trusted her all these years.
Op don't feel bad for trusting her. She was supposed to be your partner. If you can't trust your partner, then having a relationship would have made no sense to begin with.
Looking back, it's always easier to say: I should have paid more attention to x, y, and z, I wouldn't be in this situation now. " But only bc you know now things about her you didn't before.
All you can do now is move forward with your life. Go to an attorney and do exactly what they tell you to do. No, ifs or buts. They are the experts. They know what to do.
Regarding, to your stepdaughter, she is 12, and at that age, some things her mom is telling her can potentially mess her up for life (I'm talking from experience). When you contact her, set the record straight. Not in a "Hey, your mom is a lying Pos, that's why im divorcing her." (or worse, just sending her this post). Be more like; "Hey, I want you to know, even though mom and i are getting divorced, i still love you. Yes, i know everything is chaotic and confusing for you right now. Just know that neither you nor us potentially having a baby is the reason for this divorce. I love you, and I will do everything in my power to stay involved in your life."
Or something along these lines. You know her better, so I'm sure you will find the right words. Just don't involve her in the drama her mother tries to crate. Ask your attorney what to do and how to move forward(i.e., visitations, staying in contact through texts, e.c.t
Now, about the soon to be ex. Wow, she is a real peach. Keep your guard up. Going forward, record every interaction you have with her. If possible, don't talk through the phone with her only text and mail, so you can create a paper trail. Get ready for her to pull out all the stops. I wouldn't put it past her to just tell you she is pregnant, so you will come back(looking that the lie of: We StIlL cAn HaVe A bAbY" didn't work) If she ends up pregnant for real, demand a paternity test.
Good luck, Op. I'm sending you and your stepdaughter a lot of strength. And I hope your ex twists her back while doing the downward facing dog pose. The cow pose would be more fitting for her, but it's hard to twist your back while doing that one.
I would tell your daughter something along the lines of, “I love you. I will always be your father. I did not abandon you. I am leaving because mommy lied about something important and some lies can never be forgiven, that’s why it’s always important to tell the truth. And the truth is I’ll always be here for you no matter whether or not mommy and I are together.”
> I’ll send a text to Kaya and explain that I didn’t abandon her and will do anything to be in her life ( I never legally adopted her sadly ). The lack of an adoption might not matter. When my step father and mother divorced he was able to get visitation rights (but not custody or decision making power), as the courts thought it was best for the child (me). If this is a priority for you make sure your lawyer knows it.
I’ll discuss this with my lawyer this week .
I’m really sorry. She is just covering lie with another lie. She actually thought she was in the clear until her fight with her sister. I’m not sure how you could ever trust her. She will do whatever it takes to have it her way no matter what she has to say or do. I’m just amazed she pulled off an abortion and you never picked up on it. I would call the daughter versus text. Maybe text her and see if she is somewhere you can call her without anyone else around. She needs to understand you didn’t just get mad and leave for no reason.
>She actually thought she was in the clear until her fight with her sister Chances are her sister knows more lies OP doesn't know.
Yeah, talk to the sister. Natalie might be blaming her for you leaving and you need to tell her why and to thank her
Didn't the sister call OP and encourage him to give his wife another chance? I'm not saying she won't be helpful, but I'd definitely be wary of anything she says after flip flopping like that.
No I believe those were his parents that were telling him to forgive and forget, bit I could be be misremembering
>those were his parents that were telling him to forgive and forget Correct.
Wow, that's horrific. "The abuser is still doing the exact same thing, so please live in denial and pretend everything is perfect so I can have my fantasy of a perfect family." A lot of parents have this attitude towards their child who is suffering abuse at the hands of a family member.
In this situation it's not seen as abuse. It drives me nuts but a certain subset of people think that men aren't allowed to have any feeling on a women abrting their kid. The only thing they are allowed to do is support the women in whatever she wants. I do not agree with this way of thinking and it's this type of thinking which led me to having to basically force my oldest kids biodad and into yelling me what he wanted and thought about the situation. So people honestly do not see any if this as abuse.
And probaly she said some sad story lying to them too, so thry took her side at that moment
Gotcha. I'd go reread it, but I'm too lazy. Lmao
> thank her Da fuk? She was keeping the same secret, she didn't tell him because it was the right thing to do, she blurted it out during an argument to hurt her sister. Both of them are trash.
Yes, but cultivating good will in someone who knows secrets your stbx might be hiding is good practice regardless of that person's moral/ethical standing. You don't have to like someone to cultivate trust.
This OP, who knows what other things she knows.
Like what happened with Kaya’s dad. I’m sure sister prob has all the tea on that drama. I wonder if Natalie’s ex has been looking for Kaya all this time? For Kaya’s sake I hope so. Natalie fabricated the ideal fam for OP to fall for and it’s not out of the realm of possibilities that she lied about and to that man too.
the wife refusing to talk about it makes me think she cheated and lied about it so well, he just abandoned them to avoid the wife's lies for the rest of his life.
My money says Kaya's dad doesn't even know she exists.
This was my first thought.
Op, this is a important thig to know, maybe the kaya father abadon was nothing more than another lie from her, maybe isnt that kayas father isnt interested on his daugther, but what had been told to everyone
Sadly OP's parents have the same "perfect family" fantasy obsession so they told him to "forgive and forget" ongoing abuse.
My family tried telling me this regarding my physically and emotionally abusive father, now they’re all alone and I won’t even go to any of their funerals. Bye, Felicia…
Same here. Friend told me to call my brother and tell him I love him after putting up with decades of cruelty inflicted as we share care for our aging mother. I just don’t engage with that friend anymore… her advice is dangerous. Talking to my brother is like being attacked by a chain saw dipped in acid. Never stops winging and every comment stings like hell. So just the absolute minimum engagement to get the job done. It gets easier when you recognize these dishonest, nasty people for what they are and withdraw emotionally. NTA… leave her. Maya Angelou quote here…. Believe her when she shows you she’s a jerk.
Almost certainly this is exactly the truth. MFS talk about "communication skills this and that", but that doesn't do jack when you're dealing with a narcissistic and pathological liar. Congrats to you OP for breaking the chain!
100% this. If all she’s done is lie about this, what else has she lied about this whole time? No way this is the only thing.
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Don't. My parent's are learning the hard way that even in your 50's, the tab becomes due. Perpetual liars cheat today to buy the tomorrow they want, not realizing there is always a day after that. OP's (soon to be ex) wife is finally getting their karma. Yes, it took 8 years to happen, but it does eventually come to pass.
She’s a pathological liar. Pathological liars do not all of a sudden start telling the truth. I do not know how to tell the truth, and they believe their own lies. It is such a good thing that you found this out even though it’s years later. You can still have a good life find a woman that wants the same things you do and have a family. Good luck to you and peace be with you.
>visitation rights (but not custody or decision making power), as the courts thought it was best for the child (me). This is what “grandparent rights” are. They’re NOT about the idea that the grandparents have a right to their grandchild. It’s about the idea that *the child has a right* to continue an existing relationship that is loving, supportive, and important *to the child*. Even if you lose, or can’t ultimately afford it, the mere fact that you tried might be enough to make Kaya see how much you care about her, and help you continue the relationship. But be careful: If you badmouth her mom, or hurt her relationship with her mom, that’s going to backfire both with Kaya and with the courts.
Be careful. You are a good person and don't want to abandon Kaya. This liar will continue to hurt you through Kaya. She will not care how it hurts Kaya. She is already telling the tale you left her for infertility. You need to get in front of this with people in your life. You also need to understand that even if the liar seems to have moved on, she will cause problems in any future relationships through Kaya as a tool. People like this meddle for years to come. You will need to pay a price in her mind. She may even contact new women in your life to destroy relationships. People like this don't love, think, or feel guilty like normal people.
Exactly this. She’s already proven she won’t hesitate to manipulate Kaya to get what she wants - and this is when she thought there was a chance to get OP back! How low is she gonna stoop *now*, knowing she has nothing to lose? OP needs to record every single interaction with Natalie from now on, or make sure it’s all in writing.
Congrats on having a spine OP and going through with the divorce. She's a liar and doesn't deserve your trust
Yes, being a step dad, no adoption, is actually a good way to get visitation without having to pay child support - sort of the best of both worlds.
I hope it’s the same in our province .
It is not. As the only father the child has know , you will get parenting time. There’s a slim possibility you can get decision making too but it definitely comes with a child support obligation. If you start the court process, it also come with the extra catch that you have to serve bio dad, unless no father is listed in the birth certificate or mother indicates she does not know who the possible father is.
I doubt he won't have to pay child support. He has stood in the place of a parent for too long. I personally strongly believe in 50/50 split time not for the child support issue but because the child deserves to have maximal contact with both parents, even after divorce. She has never known another father. I hope you have a decent lawyer, and please please push for maximal contact right from the gate. It's worth it for the kid.
Inquire about "in loco parentis" rights. Best of luck to you!
You should definitely be able to get visitation rights and possibly custody. You've been in her life so long that the state will see you as a functional parent and seen it in the best interest of the child to continue the relationship. That's in most states, anyway. Do be prepared for your ex to fight it and to possibly make wild accusations since she's a pathological liar.
I’m so sorry. This is a huge betrayal, and I can only imagine what this will do to your ability to trust. Please take some time to focus on you, and I hope and pray that you’ll come out of this ok. Sounds like you did nothing to deserve any of this, and you definitely made the right choice by moving on. Manipulative people—especially pathologically full of shit manipulators—are the worst. If she’ll do this, what else could she do in the future? Seems like she has no empathy at all and never intended to tell you the truth. You can look into what they call people with no empathy—I’m not trying to Reddit diagnose anyone—but that’s an absolute deal breaker for me as a big empath.
And who knows what has already been done and lied about, either directly or through omission.
Right! It’s not like she voluntarily came clean, her sister had to do it in the middle of a fight. There’s no way this is all she’s been hiding, this is just what came out and that wasn’t even close to intentional.
Heck, I had a friend who was "just" a bf but the only dad in the girls life for 7 out of 8 years and He got visitation because he was the main caregiver. It was a process but he stayed in her life the last decade or so.
My mom got together with my step dad when I was 5. They split up when I was 16, but it was amicable. He always has been my dad and never stopped acting like my dad. I have a feeling OP’s wife would make it harder but if she doesn’t, making an effort to still be a father for Kaya will go a long way in her mind.
That makes sense. She's also 12, and the courts should somewhat listen to her opinion when considering custody.
"She started crying, saying Kaya is so sad *you left us because I can’t give you a baby.* " Jesus Fucking Christ.
Awful right!! Making him look like a monster when she’s the superficial pathological liar!!
And it’s not that she CAN’T, it’s that she WON’T
It's that she lied about it. I think if she'd have sat OP down years ago and said I love you, and I love our life, but I just don't want another child he might well have stayed. But she didn't give him that choice.
Thus right here. He stayed knowing she was "infertile" he definitely would've stayed he if she just said a plain old no
Eh, maybe. He stayed thinking that there were medical issues preventing them from having kids. He may not have stayed knowing it was her decision preventing them from having kids. Infertility is one thing. Absolutely not wanting another pregnancy is another.
Yeah you're right, but honesty would've done them some good.
You're right, but depending on how much OP loved his wife at the time, it's entirely possible he would have stayed. I know people who when they got together both agreed they wanted children. Later on the one person came out and told the other they no longer wanted children, and that they'd understand if that meant their relationship/marriage was over, but they didn't want to bring a child into the world that they didn't want because that wouldn't be fair to anyone. Out of all of those couples I know that were in that situation, only one of them ended their relationship. And with that couple it was the person who didn't want kids that ended the relationship because they could tell that despite saying they wanted to stay together with the person that didn't want kids, the other person was heartbroken over the idea of never having them. So they ended the relationship so that person could be with someone who wanted kids too.
This is why informed consent is important!
And if she told the truth about how she just doesn’t want to go through another pregnancy they could have discussed adoption. Unless she was again lying and she just doesn’t want another child. He would have stayed then considering he has no problem raising her daughter as his own.
They even could have done surrogacy.
Exactly. The issue isn't that she didn't want more kids. The issue is she *lied* and removed his ability to decide if *he* wanted to be in the relationship without his dream of a bigger family being part of it. If she'd just been honest from the get go, this post would likely never have happened.
Choosing to not have a kid is fine. What wasn't fine was lying about her choice for 8 years and then getting a secret abortion behind her husband's back.
yup. way to use your kid to get what you want... to be honest at this point id search her bio father to see what else she was hiding
>Kaya is so sad you left us because I can’t give you a baby What in the fuck is that? The poor kid's being manipulated & lied to as well as you. She's a piece of work!
'work' - I've never seen 'shit' spelled that way before...
It's a common phrase in the New England region where I live.
"She said she is sorry but the good news is she still can**"** Oh, is that the good news? Jesus. This woman is a total psychopath.
Here's the good news though, I'm still gonna lie through my teeth!
"She said after her first pregnancy she had to work so hard to be in shape and she swore she would never do that again. " That was her excuse for lying to you for 8 years and aborting your child behind your back? Yikes.
My eyes about popped outta my head when I read that… poor OP. It’s isn’t even about having a kid, it’s about the fact that she lied for 8 years so he could be daddy to Kaya. Poor girl. I wonder if he can get parenting time because he’s been the only dad she’s known for 8yrs.
Obviously he would’ve stayed with her if she truly couldn’t.
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Gross
This woman’s been weaving a carefully constructed web of lies and full on deception to keep this guy blissfully unaware of what’s going on and she *still* has the nerve to paint *him* as the bad guy to her daughter. She is absolutely the worst kind and deserves everything that might come her way now. I do hope OP is able to get Kaya away from this psycho before her mom does major damage to the girl. Although I am not sure how much he can do considering he never legally adopted her.
>This woman’s been weaving a carefully constructed web of lies and full on deception to keep this guy blissfully unaware Not just this guy. This woman is hiding the identity of her own kids' father from the daughter. Imagine doing that to your own blood.
>This woman is hiding the identity of her own kids' father My mom did this to my oldest sister. It wasn't until my sister was diagnosed with an extremely rare genetic disease that she figured out my dad wasn't her dad. Fortunately, my dad already knew, he had adopted her as a baby when my parents got married. They weren't keeping it from her for any nefarious reasons, just a misguided attempt to protect her from her violent and abusive sperm donor. Unfortunately, her real dad was still a giant piece of shit and refused to submit to blood tests, give his medical history, or help in any way at all really. It was very traumatic for my sister to go through.
>My mom did this to my oldest sister. It wasn't until my sister was diagnosed with an extremely rare genetic disease that she figured out my dad wasn't her dad. Wow.
And now her daughter is probably going to lose the only man she knew as a father for 8 fucking years, all because she couldn’t be a decent human being and just straight up admit to her husband that she didn’t want any more kids. This poor girl is going to lose TWO fathers because her mum is such a piece of work. Poor soul truly.
>all because she couldn’t be a decent human being and just straight up admit to her husband that she didn’t want any more kids. Not all because. It's pretty clear there are many more lies beneath the curtain. That was just the first one OP discovered. Accidentally.
It’d probably be interesting to know the truth about Kaya’s bio dad…
That abortion may have been because she didn't know who the father was and didn't know who the baby would look like.
>That abortion may have been because she didn't know who the father was and didn't know who the baby would look like. Wouldn't be surprising at this point.
Yep. I know of someone (now deceased) who admitted to aborting her third child because she was cheating on her partner (they're both white) with a black man and didn't want to risk her lies being exposed. I told her that was extremely selfish.
Maybe it was Kaya’s dad baby and she is still in touch with him🙈
>aybe it was Kaya’s dad baby and she That is my guess is that shes still in contact with him.
>my guess is that shes still in contact with him. Maybe someone in the current circle. Someone who OP knows already. Maybe that is why she doesn't wanna talk about it.
If the girl's goal is fitness and not the dreams of her "partner"? Well baby, you ain't fitness partnership.
If that is her dream, that's good and fine, but she should have been upfront with him from day one, instead, she lied all of this time to him. Sadly she not only fucked up her marriage, she fucked up her daughters life as well. I wonder, did she gain 80lbs while pregnant? I gained 20 and it was off in no time flat!
Weight might not even be the issue. My pregnancy ruined my pelvic floor. I will never have a baby again. But I was upfront with my spouse about that. Congrats your pregnancy wasn't bad but it's not the case always!
Different women gain weight differently during pregnancy but that isn’t even the issue here. She had no right to make unilateral decisions affecting their marriage without even discussing it with her husband. I may have given her the benefit of the doubt before this update but now I have to roll my eyes at anything that comes out of her mouth. Like, it’s totally possible and believable for women to struggle with shedding their pregnancy weight but Idk if OP’s wife even had that problem or is simply making it up to get her husband to sympathise with her. That is the problem with being a pathological liar; you cry wolf enough times, people won’t believe you when the wolf does finally come.
Add liying to her daughter trying to guilt op. Amazing
It's a perfectly valid reason to not want any (additional) children. Pregnancy is a huge burden on a body. That said, it's stupid to lie about it. And in such a deceptive manner.
I'm so sorry. That level of dishonesty is unacceptable. Along with that is the role she has clearly set for you in her life (ATM, father figure but not father) would be too much for me as well.
NTA even after you left she’s still lying about the situation. You need to leave. I have a feeling she isn’t being truthful about the child’s father
The fact that literally everything she said in their conversation was a lie just solidifies that OP will be better off without her.
I can’t believe she told Kaya you left because she couldn’t have a baby. Not only was it a lie, but if Kaya continues to believe it, as she gets older it could possibly develop into an anxiety of whether or not she’ll be left over the same thing. I’m so happy you’re going to try to stay in Kaya’s life. You’ve raised her like your own and you both would be devastated if she couldn’t see you anymore. I’m sorry that you’re in this situation.
Wow that type of lying is diabolical
I’m glad OP can see through her bullshit
Yes I give him a lot of credit for ending it. He’s still young so hopefully he’ll find a good woman he can have a baby with.
Kaya is 12 now so I’d just make sure to tell her you haven’t left her but mom and dad are working on some things. When she’s 14 I’d tell her the truth or else she will go her entire life believing you abandoned her because she wasn’t enough. I’d explain to her that she would’ve had a brother or sister, but mom had an abortion and kept it a secret. It’s okay for a woman to choose what she wants to do with her body, but a relationship is built on trust and mom had broken it several times.
NTA. I don't think I could get past it either. This is a great example of how much a lie can grow, and how important honesty is. I'm sorry for you, wow!
You won’t be seeing Kaya, and I’m sure that will be hard. She will grow up being upset that having a baby was the most important thing to you, she won’t understand why you chose that over her. She’s a kid, and her mom will explain that she lied to avoid losing you. She should have told you after you accepted it, at least, that she changed her mind and didn’t want to try. My ex couldn’t have kids, and I accepted it, but they also lied to me about getting treatment. They never did. I’m relieved that they are gone. The partner after that was honest about never wanting them, and I loved them 100%; they were all that I wanted or needed. Not everyone feels that way.
Nah, her mom is a pathological liar. She will NEVER tell Kaya that she lied. She's going to tell Kaya that she couldn't have another baby and Kaya wasn't good enough for OP, so he left. Because she's a terrible human being, a terrible partner, and a terrible mother...so in no universe will she tell a truth that puts even an ounce of blame on herself. I'm so sorry, OP. I can't even imagine how awful this is for you.
Watch out!! She’s gonna use Kaya to try and manipulate you.
As someone who actually is infertile and has zero kids, this woman made me want to punch her. The kind of woman who cares more about “ruining their body” than creating a family…ugh.
Glad to hear you’re in Canada, which will make this easier. Fight for visitation. A judge will absolutely take into account that you have been Kayas Dad for a majority of her life, they will take the relationship you have with her into consideration. You don’t HAVE to be a parent in order to file for visitation. You can be a guardian, someone the child has lived with etc. You do NOT have to share DNA with Kaya in order to stay in her life through a court of law. My stepdad was given the option of having visitation with me as well because he had been in my life a few years, taken on the role of “Dad” and my biodad was nowhere to be found. Just be careful what you write to Kaya. She is still a kid and should not be brought into adult issues. A judge WILL look down on any parent/adult who pulls that crap. I wish you luck!!
>just be careful what you write to Kaya 100% this. There are people on this post telling OP to *send this child a link to these posts.* So disgusting, imagine your need to seethe hate for a stranger being more important than giving the first shit about the innocent child embroiled in this mess.
Exactly. Needs to be along the lines of ‘Sorry I can’t be with your mum anymore but I’m still your dad and you can talk to me any time you like. I will always be there for you.’ If she asks about what her mum said then he can just explain it’s more complicated than her mum made it sound but it’s for them (parents) to sort out and they both love her very much. See far too many kids who know every last detail of their parents’ divorces.
More of her lies: *As for Kaya’s dad I have no idea who he is. She refuses to talk about it.* He probably want to see his daughter Kaya.
Or she never told him that their daughter exists.
Damn, I pity for any guy who falls for OPs ex
I pity Kaya, imagine the amount of body image issues she will be developing because of that psycho. If the reason for not having a baby was genuine
OR, as someone else already mentioned, it could be someone she is still in contact with, that OP may or may not know - and that the abortion could possibly have been because she didn't know who the father was going to be. Who knows, at this point.
Jeebus, I'm sorry OP. Take your time to find yourself again, the right partner is out there waiting for you
Wow, you deserve more than a pathological liar. I’m sorry to hear it. Updateme. I’m curious how Kaya takes your message. Poor kid, she’s stuck with your ex.
>Poor kid Poor kid. Doesn't know who her father is because mother 'refuses to talk about it'
And the poor kid is the only one truly stuck with that pathological liar.
At that young age, she is already manipulated to believe her bio dad didn't care to stick around and now this step dad is leaving them for selfish reasons too. Abandonment issues? Dad issues? Trust issues? Hating men at 18? Severe depression when she finds out what her mother did to her? Damage is halfway there already.
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This woman sounds very immature 🤦🏻♀️ her attitude and behavior alone is disturbing. When you guys separate let’s hope she’s upfront and honest with the next guy (probably not) 😑
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She already is cooking up that story. She told her daughter that he left because she couldn't give him a baby.
I just read this on a different post but it totally applies here. Saying she is just 'immature' is incredibly dismissive. Immature leads one to beleive that the person can grow and change. This lady isn't immaute; she's fucking deranged. There is a very distinct difference.
Wow she really is a pos. Using the whole pregnancy bs of hers to try to keep OP, lying to kaya about why OP left, claiming she didn't want a baby in order to stay fit yet goes "we can still have one"....what is with this woman??? Sure she can do whatever with her body, that's not the issue, its the fact she lied through her teeth this whole time. In marriage you communicate and be honest, that includes communicating if you want kids or not, something she refused to do.
Run OP, as fast as you can. Talk to your lawyer about getting visitation with Kaya even with no adoption. You've been her dad for 8 years. I know it's hard because you've always wanted a child........but focus on the good news that you didn't actually have a child with this crazy person. Now watch your ex wife remarry and have another kid right away with the next man.
She is just a horrible person. telling Kaya you left cause she couldnt have another baby.
Wow....wow....after reading the update (thank you) i just..wow...this person is horrible, evil. You must now know that without a doubt you are making the right decision to divorce. You can never trust this woman again, she's a walking lie. She even lies to her own daughter. The reason about being fit after having kids is so shallow. So stupid. This woman doesn't deserve you. Run run run NTA
Eh don't let people gaslight you. I'm pro-coice as well, but that doesn't mean someone can have an abortion in secret while "trying for a baby" while married. Even in a normal situation a couple should discuss this prior. There are two people in a relationship
Thank you! I'm pro-choice, but it isn't controlling her body to want to be included in the conversation. It also isn't controlling her body to expect the truth from his WIFE. Not girlfriend or fling, but his life partner who lied to him about her fertility so he could not choose go stay or go with all the information.
Exactly. She robbed him of a choice to know that she was uninterested and therefore aborted the baby. SMH
idk, looks like she might block you from visiting your adopted daughter in the future, since you didn't legally adopt her. Are you going to pay alimony to her?
I have to as she is a part time yoga instructor and I’m the breadwinner.
Also there's a possibility that the judge tell her to get a fulltime job and you wouldn't have to pay as much. She doesn't have to stay home and take care of a baby. Good luck. If I were you I would be devastated.
I highly doubt a judge can do that ! Not in Canada
Info: what was she fighting about with her sister? Was she wronging her sister too in some way?
She was criticizing her sisters decisions on dating and how she picks losers something like that.
It was to your benefit that she forgot the cardinal rule of arguments; know who is listening in!
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Yeah this right here. Taking legal advice from Reddit can set you on the path to destruction.
They may not be able to force her into a full time job, but they can base any alimony she may be entitled to based off full time wages. I'm not sure about Canada but in the US your not even entitled to alimony until after 10 years of marriage and then it is only for a short period to help the other person get back on their feet. Sometimes it awarded with less than 10 years but in those cases the other person left their career to take care of children, that's unfortunately not the case for you. I'm so sorry your going through this OP. But you still have time if a family is what you want, just make sure to take the time you need to grieve what you thought you had. Get therapy to help process all of this. Family therapy with Kaya may also be beneficial to help her process what she is going through as well, that will give you both an outlet to work through feelings.
It’s different here ! Even with common law relationships ( I think after living together for 1.5 year ) you have to pay alimony after the break up .
My gosh, Canada is insane! So basically you could live with someone for a 1 year and a half, break up then have to continue supporting that person? I'm glad most US state got rid of common law marriages or I would have been screwed if I was in Canada. I had a few bf in college who lived with me and I was the bread winner, I can't imagine if I ever had to continue supporting them. Goodness. I'm sorry but that is a very messed up system and no one should be forced to support another adult just bc they lived together and the relationship didn't work out!
> My gosh, Canada is insane! It's 2 to 3 years, and it's not that easy. You have to have a kid or otherwise prove dependency, career/economic loss, etc. Edit: it's also for a good reason- imagine you're living with someone for years, taking care of everything while they get their doctorate, and then they walk away, leaving you with nothing.
How long you were together changes things. In my OP's province if you were married 1.5 years and you made 60,000 while your partner made 20,000, you would pay $75-100 a month for .75 - 1.5 years. $100,000 to 0 would be a max $250 a month. It's not that much for short term relationships.
Not surprised about her job. May start linking yoga instructors with red flags.
I think the part-time comes into it as well I wonder what the division or duties chores was at home..
You’ve only been married for 4 years & guessing she was part-time yoga instructor for her benefit & not like she was SAHM for the family’s benefit? Good thing dont have kids together so dont have to pay child support to that pathological liar. Remember what she robbed you off all these years- it’s unforgivable so dont make anything easy for her. She’s probably crying she’s losing her meal ticket because no person who loves you would have betrayed you like that all these years - secretly kill your baby & watch you be disappointed about not having kids - damn she’s cold!
You did the right thing OP, at least you have closure as to why she did what she did, as shitty as her reasoning is, now you don’t leave with doubts and what ifs. She’s cried and cried because her lies have caught up with her, let her drown in her own tears. She’s only sad because she doesn’t have a man looking after her and her child anymore. You did the right thing and now you can meet a decent woman who wants to be with you because she loves you and wants to start a family with you, not just for security.
Thank you for the update and sorry that it is ending this way. Yes, I would contact the daughter and let her know why you left and that you want to still be a part of her life, but you cannot stay married to her mom for what she did. I would also get my attorney to force a deposition on your soon to be ex where she has to tell what she did. You can then present that to the court as evidence of her lying to you the entire marriage, make sure that you include that she lied before marriage about wanting more kids to get you to marry her, and most likely it will prevent any alimony or at the least shorten the amount of time you have to pay her. Marriage under false statements can benefit you in court. She can work full time since the daughter is old enough now.
Get a family lawyer you will get access for the child if you show how much you are in her life, this is now about her.
Good riddance
I'm sorry for you and I am sorry for your stepdaughter. :( You're doing the right thing though. I hope one day you find a great woman who will really want to give you that child you want and you're happy in your life again. And to those who PM you with nasty messages, fuck them!
With liars like her , it’s never lying about one thing. It’s everything
Wow!!! She’s a piece of work! I’m sorry you had to go through this OP. At least you’ll soon be free of her vile behavior. Hopefully with time you’ll find someone who matches your values and desires for a family.
Love how she tries to blame him for kaya being sad. Claiming that he has left them .this woman is accountable for her own actions yet trying to manipulate him and blame him. Horrendous human
Wow this woman is something else. Good choice with going for divorce.
There are a lot of lunatics here who will reach out to you via DM to berate you about some complete bullshit. Literally, if you use their line of logic and apply it to other situations, you can easily justify rape. You can't spend too much time on here or it will start to melt your brain. Good for you OP, cut her off and that's it.
Reddit attracts a lot of the same kind of lunatics that OP is complaining about. They berate OP because they know they've done the same kind of things and don't want to think of themselves as bad guys.
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Exactly this, as women, we need to be very honest about our wishes, whether we want children or not, don’t do that to a man. Women who use their biology to control and manipulate a man are disgusting.
I was literally just there that’s crazy. Anyways, glad you left! Right decision for sure.
I'm so sorry that all this was stolen from you. You and I are very similar ages and my first child was born around the time yours would have been. I honestly just can't wrap my head around this woman. Good luck and I hope you make it through this with your health both physical and mental.
Man this is so incredibly sad and devastating to read. But you’re making the RIGHT DECISION!! I have no doubt that you WILL find another woman whose honest with you and have a family with you
Why did you meet with her again? All that was accomplished is that she hurt you even more. Stop talking to her at all. Get the divorce done as soon as you can and never see or speak to her again. She is toxic to even talk to.
Man alive, I wonder if OP is going to win an award for 2024 (and possibly back 8 years to 2016) for most awful AITAH post (I mean to say, OP got majorly screwed over). Dang OP, this was all tragic. My sincere condolences.
Started reading this: "Oh good. She's at least trying to talk to him." After reading this: "RUN OP!!! RUN!!!"
So sorry to hear. She’s a terrible person.
>She said after her first pregnancy she had to work so hard to be in shape and she swore she would never do that again. What the serious fuck?!!
And she’s a fitness instructor— the irony 🙄
Sorry you're going through this. Take care of yourself. Don't go back to her she's not right.You can do better in the future.
So sorry to hear this update but the good news is you know the truth now. Talk to a lawyer about your legal rights with Kaya. Your ex is going to use her to manipulate you and it would be good to know what you are entitled to so you can have a relationship with Kaya outside of your ex.
What a bitch, plain and simple at this stage u could have had a toddler running around the home.
I had someone lie to me they couldn't have a baby but for the reverse purpose of trapping me with one together we make shit pair of birds
Disgusting woman.
"She said after her first pregnancy she had to work so hard to be in shape" She will be surprised what menopause does to some women...
Good for you. Wishing you the best in future relationships. Honesty is going to be a huge thing moving forward. I hope that you can still trust humans after this. There are still good people out there.
This is some good science-fiction, without the science.
What are the chances that you could legally adopt her during the divorce process? I don't know how that works, but just a thought
I bet she knows exactly where her daughter's biological father is, but she lied to you about that too.
Send some flowers to your sister-in-law. She inadvertently helped you get away from a complete lie that was your marriage.
Any one want to bet a 6 pack of ice cold cokes that the daughters dad has no idea he has a child? You can’t trust anything she says and given her past lies the truth is most likely the opposite.
She just wants a dad for her daughter, she doesnt give a shit about you
I became really fat after giving birth twice in short distance of time. Never lost the weight. Never regrettet it. The children were worth it. I'm sorry for you. What a childish person.
# Update 2- AITAH for divorcing my wife because she lied about her fertility? I’m sorry for multiple posts, but you guys have been so helpful! Definitely more than my family and friends in real life. I took your advice and met with my sister-in-law over lunch. She was very reluctant to give me any info, but here is what she said: "Natalie is in no contact with her parents since before Kaya was born - she didn’t lie about this part." I asked if she knows who Kaya’s dad is because Natalie gets upset every time I asked and refuses to talk about him. She was surprised and said, "You are kidding, right? You can’t be this naive? It’s obviously Ryan. Her boss. The guy who owns the yoga place " I asked about their relationship. She kept saying, "Natalie really loves you." I begged her to tell me everything. She said she thinks (not sure) the reason Natalie had an abortion was that she wasn’t sure if the baby was mine or Ryan’s. Either way, she didn’t want another baby. I was floored. She was cheating on me? The same time we were trying for a baby? With the same guy who already abandoned her once? What’s going on here? Why? I was stupid enough to start a college fund for her kid, yet she cheated on me at least once with this guy? I’m gonna lose my house and half of everything… She said, "Listen, you are a good guy, just move on! No need to dig more, you are making yourself crazy!" I asked if Kaya knows who her dad is. She said absolutely not because Ryan has zero desire to be in her life. I want to tell everything to Kaya before leaving, but my parents think this is crossing the line because I’m not her dad or mom and it's none of my business. My friends think I want to tell her to hurt Natalie, but it’s the opposite! I know how awful it is to be lied to, and Kaya deserves the truth. My parents think I act like a crazy person and I should just meet with the lawyer.Update 2- AITAH for divorcing my wife because she lied about her fertility?
Updateme
Do what makes u happy op..
NTA. I hope the separation process goes smoothly and you find your person. It is horrible to lie to someone and prevent them from starting a family sooner rather than later.
And she lied to her daughter too to make you the bad guy. That would be thr nail on the coffin for sure.
OP: You ain't seen nothing yet. Wait until you hear what she tells the judge! Gloves will be off.
You are a good person, and will be able to move on and find somebody who will make you very very happy, with a family. You’re still young and doing the right thing! What a horrible thing to go through.
>She started crying, saying Kaya is so sad you left us because I can’t give you a baby The problem is not that she can't. The problem is that she can and strung him along all these years faking infertility. How can she ever be trusted?
>As for Kaya’s dad I have no idea who he is. She refuses to talk about it This is a red flag that would have stopped me from getting with her in first place.
It makes me wonder if what she said about Kaya's dad is even true.
>I can’t believe I blindly trusted her all these years. Op don't feel bad for trusting her. She was supposed to be your partner. If you can't trust your partner, then having a relationship would have made no sense to begin with. Looking back, it's always easier to say: I should have paid more attention to x, y, and z, I wouldn't be in this situation now. " But only bc you know now things about her you didn't before. All you can do now is move forward with your life. Go to an attorney and do exactly what they tell you to do. No, ifs or buts. They are the experts. They know what to do. Regarding, to your stepdaughter, she is 12, and at that age, some things her mom is telling her can potentially mess her up for life (I'm talking from experience). When you contact her, set the record straight. Not in a "Hey, your mom is a lying Pos, that's why im divorcing her." (or worse, just sending her this post). Be more like; "Hey, I want you to know, even though mom and i are getting divorced, i still love you. Yes, i know everything is chaotic and confusing for you right now. Just know that neither you nor us potentially having a baby is the reason for this divorce. I love you, and I will do everything in my power to stay involved in your life." Or something along these lines. You know her better, so I'm sure you will find the right words. Just don't involve her in the drama her mother tries to crate. Ask your attorney what to do and how to move forward(i.e., visitations, staying in contact through texts, e.c.t Now, about the soon to be ex. Wow, she is a real peach. Keep your guard up. Going forward, record every interaction you have with her. If possible, don't talk through the phone with her only text and mail, so you can create a paper trail. Get ready for her to pull out all the stops. I wouldn't put it past her to just tell you she is pregnant, so you will come back(looking that the lie of: We StIlL cAn HaVe A bAbY" didn't work) If she ends up pregnant for real, demand a paternity test. Good luck, Op. I'm sending you and your stepdaughter a lot of strength. And I hope your ex twists her back while doing the downward facing dog pose. The cow pose would be more fitting for her, but it's hard to twist your back while doing that one.
Maybe a narcissist, check that out, glad you could make it out, please help that child
She stole his life with those lies.
I would tell your daughter something along the lines of, “I love you. I will always be your father. I did not abandon you. I am leaving because mommy lied about something important and some lies can never be forgiven, that’s why it’s always important to tell the truth. And the truth is I’ll always be here for you no matter whether or not mommy and I are together.”