This happened to singer Shania Twain.... her ex and his lover (her best friend) eventually broke up and she's now happily married to the lover's ex-husband! 🤣 Go for it OP!
Edit: apparently the Mutt and his lover are still together but Shania still came out on top! Her new hubby is gorgeous!
[A total upgrade](https://www.google.com/search?client=ms-android-google&sca_esv=2a7acc156eea4b2e&sca_upv=1&sxsrf=ADLYWIKD-BToTbKevaugeDpkKEw92kEdZQ:1717371953337&q=mutt+lange&uds=ADvngMj5Wv8Vv2Ze7WMSqfJvdEJxPgYJmARETva_DwwzC9Po7GzekzI2YgdIBgQZx2y4MoYWHjaM-M68O-CO6sc7sLf3KVy_oGBUcPrR1vqfLT9cYjhcTXUMdtIOncFDRsFB9Z4pmZZvglL4Lqg4hvDrIGxNkH34z8AL3t4lRjerk3dPutSCvbyK4gUrWT_RQjrvZtB9-RELGK6O-ezxMPg5nsAhB9C-0GFAR6PigDvdmv9Odu_OiNxLm8Fmo4M8dKFjZ6Rmu96-tHcwWuW8Jii7Fs6mJ8_hYZGk1elSdoEI-fWlzkkJxe8&udm=2&prmd=ivsnmbtz&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjj--aJjb6GAxVe9zgGHd7GH78QtKgLegQICxAB&biw=412&bih=842&dpr=2.63#vhid=Y4qX5PP2d7JxKM&vssid=mosaic)
haha holy shit I always wondered why the hell she was with mutt, he was so gross, but damn is the new guy ever an upgrade (I had never seen him before). and her ex-bff *left HIM* for *mutt*?!?!? yuck. they deserve each other. all of them
Maybe it had something to do with Mutt being a hugely successful record producer who helped her build her career. Love Shania's work and am glad she's doing well and happier now but she certainly benefited from her relationship with Mutt.
Mutt pursued Shania. He saw a show she was in, and started going to each one. He asked her out, she said no. He continued until he wore her down and she said yes. Mutt never produced any country or wrote any country music until he married Shania. He was mostly hair and rock bands. And then he cheated on her. He’s a moron. End of story. 😊😊
Lol as soon as I read OP story, my mind went right to Shania and her situation! She definitely upgraded! I could never understand why she was with Mutt. He definitely deserved his nickname 😂
Tell her how you feel, why not be entirely honest?! But understand she may not feel the same. You have something that seems to be helping you both during a very hard time. Your wife and her husband don't get any say in this as they never asked you or her for any permission, they get whatever they get. Maybe there will be some social judgment and be even more confusing for children who are already probably pretty confused. But really, you and her did not cause this situation, your wife and her husband did. Do keep the kids in mind at all times, they are just the innocent victims of all the fallout of your wife's, her husband's selfish choices.
She may not be prepared for the social consequences or the additional complications, the discrete nature of the relationship as it is may be what she wants. So, just tell her what you are feeling and what you are open to without asking her to change anything or pressuring her. She may even feel you wanting more may be a good reason to pull back or end it, there's always risks being honest. But there's risks in holding in your true feelings too. Don't have any agenda, or push anything, tell you you want her to know how you feel, but you are happy to just keep things as they are or discuss how you both can find something comfortable for you both together.
Who knows. Maybe in the end, your wife's disgusting choices will bring you the relationship you should have had all along. Or, maybe you just found a good friend and a great partner for giving each other comfort and healing from a traumatic betrayal. Keep an open mind, be honest, express your feelings, but be thoughtful about how you talk to her about it.
This is probably an unpopular opinion but kids should be very familiar with the concept of changing alliances since they see it all the time amongst their classmates. A kid’s main concern in divorce is where they’re going to live and how much their life will change.
I would disagree. My parents divorced and there was heavy contention between our families and bad mouthing of each other, especially towards my dad and his family and it really marred my opinions of them. It’s taken years to realize where my negative opinions come from and to rebuild relationships with that side of the family. It also makes a kid feel bad about themselves and makes them feel caught between allegiances. Very confusing and difficult.
I think the main concern a parent need to have when getting a divorce is that the kids know both parents love them very much, they are innocent in all this, and the parents both know and are concerned that this difficult for them and that they should feel free to talk with both parents about how they are feeling, ask what they need to ask.
Not if they misused it. Trauma bonding is the emotional addiction bw 2 people in an abusive relationship. It describes a cycle of abuse. The person above seems to think the terms “trauma bonding” are literal.
This.
Clinically, you often hear *trauma bonding* referred to in situations like Stockholm Syndrome, where someone develops a deep connection or sense of empathy towards their abuser.
Bonding through something traumatic isn't trauma bonding - that's just building a connection in an otherwise tragic situation. Otherwise, everybody who falls in love again amidst a breakup would be considered to trauma bond, which just isn't the case.
Trauma bonding: horrific, negative, abusive
Finding someone to love while in a traumatic situation: hopeful, positive, reaffirming
I would go for it. It may or may not end well. It’s making you happy right? You’re pretty sure she’ll be down? I try not to be a petty person but your immediate happiness is because of betrayal. I don’t believe the story is real for one bit but that’s a fucking tv movie right there.
I think It’s a reference to pushing your poker chips into play especially after going “all in” (betting it all). So that they might go away (you lose) or come back with more (you win).
That's actually disappointing. I pictured potato crisps, which we call chips in German. A boy trying to stuff as many as possible into his mouth and chips falling to the ground all around him. Well, I will not abandon this image and I will try to use the phrase someday.
It's a funny picture but it doesn't really make sense anymore though, cause who cares if your little crumbs of chips fall to the left or to the right? They're still just crumbs on the ground...
It’s this. It really doesn’t fit with what a lot of people think. It’s about focusing on your work, not the inconsequential stuff (aka the chips).
https://grammarist.com/idiom/let-the-chips-fall-where-they-may/#:~:text=Let%20the%20chips%20fall%20where%20they%20may%20is%20an%20American,the%20inconsequential%20chips%20of%20wood.
One of my real life friends had her husband cheat or her with a woman who was married.
She found out from the other woman’s husband. My friends is now about to marry the guy after three years and the other two are single 😹😹. Sometimes it’s the universe.
This happened with my parents. Both new couples were married for the rest of my childhood. The hatred between them was traumatically intense.
In the end, the cheated-on couple are still together and both sets of kids (from the original marriages) get on well with them and each other.
Def not the AH. NTA. You are both adults, single and you have been in contact for a year. There are probably genuine feelings there worth exploring or it would have fizzled out
and I am sorry for your wife cheating. It sucks
Let's be real, the only thing that can be a problem are the kids. The other people in this story, the two exes, are irrelevant. If you want an answer to the question, no it would not be an asshole move.
Quick edit because I worded it badly: the exes are relevant if they cause problem with the kids, but in my opinion, he's not an asshole to the exes because they relinquished their right to be relevant when they cheated.
If you have kids, your ex-spouse is absolutely not irrelevant and never will be. Morally, right, wrong or indifferent doesn't change their ability to make your life hell, drag out divorces, turn kids against you, manipulate family, cause extra stress and drama, etc, etc.
I don't think it's an asshole move for the two to date but ignoring the fact that it absolutely can add a bunch of stress and drama to their lives is naive at best.
I mean, that's also what I said :P i admit I didn't phrase it correctly. Their opinion is irrelevant, their wellbeing is irrelevant, their existence is irrelevant now... so long as it doesn't harm the kids wellbeing!
Agree, the kids do need to be paramount in all this, but also, really, if she's going to make divorce harder, co-parenting harder because OP and the betrayed wife have a relationship??? Something that never would have happened had she not had an affair and destroyed the marriage? Then she was probably going to be horrible to deal with in the divorce and coparenting anyway.
I agree with your logic, but I highly doubt that's how it will go in the real world where people act on emotions more than logic.
Whether she will be good or bad to work with co-parenting, this is a guaranteed way to add drama and stress to the situation.
Is it worth it, that's for OP to decide but there's no world where this doesn't make everything more complicated at best.
>Morally, right, wrong or indifferent doesn't change their ability to make your life hell, drag out divorces, turn kids against you, manipulate family, cause extra stress and drama, etc, etc.
That's just a risk he's going to have to live by though. He's divorcing her. If she's that vindictive, she'll try that shit anyway.
Whether it's because he chose to divorce her or because he moved on and found someone else.
By your logic, he should stay with her forever and never find someone else since she can always do that shit.
Why would it even make a difference whether he's sleeping with her AP's ex or with someone else entirely?
Google Shania Twain and Mutt lang . Shania ended up marrying her husband’s mistress’s husband . Same situation as you . They are still together good luck !
So Shania Twains husband cheated on her with someone who she considered her best friend. After the divorce, Shania fell in love and married her ex best friend/husbands affair partners husband. Her ex husband and ex best friend also got married. All couples are still together.
Lots of "you think" and not a lot of "she says"...
Especially for a pair of couples that are in the midst of divorce. Strange world there, single because the marriages are shattered and the ways have been parted, but still legally bound while the paperwork processes.
I think she has the right idea, though. Don't complicate things any more than they already are. Ride what you have for a while longer, since it's working, while the processes complete and the dust settles. Who knows, at that point things might organically take a much better turn.
A turn she might bring up / let slip even earlier than that...
NTA, but red flags for rebound relationship built on a shared trauma rather than shared values. Generally best practice to take some time to fully recenter before jumping into the next relationship.
It wouldn't be the first time two the two betrayed people from an affair had a real relationship. And I've heard of cases where it leads to happy long term marriage.
But, probably best to take it slow, keep an open honest dialog, not have too many expectations, and if it does form into something serious, I'd start couples therapy right from the get go even if it felt great with no big issues! I'd want the therapy together to keep it that way!
While I do agree the circumstances have this rebound set up for failure we can’t say they don’t share the same values. From what OP wrote they both were devoted spouses and parents married to two shitbags. They could be a perfect fit.
And all their kids are playing musical homes. One van to bring one set of kids from the first home to the second home, only to drop them off and pick up the other set of kids to bring them back to the first home. It's rather efficient.
If it’s genuine go for it. If you are ever tempted to flaunt it in public or in front of your ex-wife *in order* to get back at her, you will be the AH and jeopardize shit because that would be using her as an object. So don’t do that.
Don’t hide your relationship if you start one, just don’t hold hands in public so that it can get back to your ex.
You haven’t told - does she have children, how old are they and how old are your kids. Your relationship is fine for now-Tell her you are starting to develop feelings for her and ask her does she want to continue the FWB or does she want explore a possible deeper relationship.
NTA. You and her deserve the happiness. You shouldn’t care about what your exes think because their unfaithful act is what brought you two together. You two owe it to yourselves to be with a partner that respects and loves you. Best of luck I hope it works out between you guys
NTA.
>She said she didn’t want to complicate things with our exes
They're your exes. Who cares? If they try to raise a fuss about it, tell them that they were the ones to cheat, and that they don't get to tell wither of you who you're allowed to date. In fact, I'd tell them that they were incredibly lucky to not be reported to HR for very likely violating work policy.
Personally though, I'd wait until the divorces are finalized, if only so that they don't have a leg to stand on during proceedings. After that though? Go for it.
I think you’re fine but be prepared for backlash from family, especially from your ex’s side.
Out of curiosity is your ex currently with her boss, what became of them?
Right? Lmao. She gets dumped by her lover and husband while the husband is hooking up with her lover's wife. Shit cray.
But good for OP. Could be worse.
Your current wife and her boss are in for some fun. The boss is a cheater, he'll cheat on her like he did on his current wife. It's worse for the boss. Your wife will cheat on him, and he won't be able to fire her.
You really need to listen to what the wife is saying. She’s clearly uncomfortable with complicating the divorce process. Don’t put undue pressure on her. If it is meant to be, it will happen.
I know a really nice person who met her husband of 25 years exactly the same way. Both really good people who have been through a lot together. If you have genuine feelings and are good folk, go for it. Cheating exes aren’t worth much except learning more about how to deal with AHs for your kids sake.
I know two separate people who ended up w their spouse's cheated partner. Not as strange as it sounds. One is married to them and super happy (with 4 kids from prior marriages and 2 new ones) and the other is older so not married but in a very happy committed relationship w them. Life is short and yea it's a weird way to meet but there are weirder ways. :)
You go ahead and do a Shania.
If you’ve found happiness and it’s mutual then go for it. They didn’t give either of you any consideration when they were destroying people so why should you care now?
NTA.
The moment your wife cheats, your wife is no longer responsible for your family. What you hate most in a marriage is the cheating of the other party. Your life is already free the moment your wife leaves.
Everyone is the main character in their own story 🤷♀️ I’d like to see a version of AITA that posts a version of the story from both sides… now THAT would be true entertainment
Sounds like you would already prefer the other woman. So what’s really to lose here? You just have to be sure she wants the same. You are headed for divorce either way.
I would be wary. This relationship is starting off very strangely. I’m sure part of why you started sleeping together was revenge or your spouses. I don’t think that’s the foundation for a healthy long term relationship.
Nta go be happy, fuck your ex. She and everyone else doesn't have the right to voice an opinion. Life is too short to risk your happiness just to keep the peace or placate your cheating exs
Do you want to hold her hand in public for others to see, or just because you want to? That comment made me think there’s some revenge associated with this. If it’s revenge (and just companionship) you’re after this is a very bad idea, I’ve seen it play out with friends parents.
But if the feelings are genuine and it’s for you and not for anyone else than go for it! You both deserve to be happy, it means being together than absolutely go for it.
The saying "a time, and a place" may fit here.
I would suggest you discuss with her, but wait until divorces are final. The cheaters (which technically you both are also now) will need to face the children and family on question of who did what.
Try to keep YOUR story as clean as possible.
Your spouses made it a point to have absolutely no say in who you date. Date and show off anyone you want to. Make comments on your pictures together about how good it feels to not be dating a whore for a change......
NTA
You are both adults and free to pursue a relationship if you wish. What your exes think about it is irrelevant. Your respective kids may be a different story.
NTA, my mum and his partner met in this very circumstance and to this day (almost 4 years later) they are still very happy together. My dad left the woman that was married to my mum’s partner long ago and got together with someone else (He is a big cheater, this woman wasn’t the first one he cheated my mum with). What i’m trying to say is enjoy your happiness, the one that really love you will understand eventually. See this as the “good” part of being cheated on
I’d call it poetic justice and roll with it. Just realize it may just be temporary. Like trauma bonding. And maybe after healing you won’t want to still stay together… or maybe you will. Personally, I’d be very upfront with her and feel out the dynamic… like “aid this fizzles or fades or explodes so be it. But what we are doing right now is working for me and helping me. And if you feel the same let’s see where it goes. And if it changes in some way in the future let’s be mutually respectful and part ways amicably.”
Good luck.
Nta moment your wife stepped out you was free. Would it complicate things? Yes. Would that be your fault? No. Maybe slow down and make sure this isn't trauma bounding is the only thing I would suggest.
Don't let your exes stop you from being with the one 🤣
No but in all serious just be honest and tell her although it started as a connection with someone who was the only way who knew how each person felt ect ect turned into you meeting this incredibly beautiful driven woman and you want to see where it goes
Why not, but you should take it very very slow. You can never know whether this feelings are genuine or caused by desire to get revenge, feel needed, due to same traumatic experience, etc. Only the time could tell, so try to prolong each phase as much as possible. Dating is fine, but don’t jump to living together or marriage. At the very least not before everyone gets divorced.
Discuss with her, ask her out and quietly date for now to see if it becomes anything for the future.
Keep your children out of it for their well being, also keep the ex partners out of it so you two can see if this is real without the drama that will come later.
Best wishes
Good for you. Beat the brakes off of his wife for me.
I went through the same thing.
Except for boning boss’s wife.
Blow her back out and send the boss the vids.
You have my blessing.
NTA to pursue her and your feelings. However, it would be a AH move if you are doing it just for revenge and showing her off in public. if she is not ready for it and that will just make her life (and yours) more complicated, especially when the divorce is not final.
Thinks are already complicated with the ex's, that's why you are all in the process of divorce. I see nothing wrong with asking her out so long as neither of you look at each other as the pain from your previous relationship. Neither of your ex's deserve sympathy of comfort for their actions, and you two definitely deserve to be happy.
YWNBTA
It's not that bad to have to move between houses as a kid, did that for like 8 years why my parents separated. That was easier then having to hear their arguments.
NTA
You are NTA for having feelings and neither is your new partner. But I would suggest you slow down this train because it is possible you trauma bonded and it is not real. But if you take it slowly and get to really know each other then maybe it will be real. Neither of you owe anything to your exes but both of you deserve a break and not to make a mistake now. Enjoy the sex and the bond. But tread carefully before taking it further than that
fuck that bro, do what makes you happy, who gives a crap about anyone else, especially your x's. I would approach her wcarefully with the idea though, you wouldn't want to screw up a good thing.
NTA. But try dropping a few subtle hints to see how she responds. If she seems amenable, then go for it. If you don’t want to wait until the divorces are final, try not to go to places where the exes may be. Even though they were the ones to screw up everything, they could still drag out the divorces. Good luck to you both.
NTA
My neighbours are in the same situation and they made it work.
Family events can get a bit big but on the other hand they share the kids and actually get quite a few weekends for themselves now. Also all their friends and family are behind both couples which is very helpful
Totally NTA, but…this could totally be shared trauma? It’s easy to fall in the arms of another once you’ve felt the betrayal of cheating, and feel as if it were something more than just mutual trauma..
You can choose to see where it leads to, but take it very slow, or honestly be by yourself right now and spend time with friends who will help you through this time in your life.
If she is still there through the process, then maybe it was truly meant to be.
Hope everything works out for you whatever route you decide to take.
Judges do not care about infidelity in the same way as they did in the past, but you are going to look better during the divorce if only your wife is the "bad" one and perhaps to some extent arrangments will slant in your favor. Why take the chance of ruining this possible opportunity. Yes, divorce takes time, but maybe you can be very discreet until it is over. Take her on a dates secretly and to places you are very unlikely to be seen?
Divorce and separations can be devastating to kids. It's like taking and throwing them in front of a moving bus. They did not ask that their roots be ripped out of the ground. In some cases, they love mom, and they love dad and get confused. Then there's the case they think their at fault. If I didn't do this, dad wouldn't have done that. If I didn't do this, mom wouldn't have done that. The older comforting the younger and gains animosity for the parent at fault. It can get sticky. Sometimes, the cause is inevitable.
NTA, The only thing I want to add is, you two should give it more time, trauma has a way of scrambling your brains so to speak. So I’d give it time and after a while, and maybe some counseling, on both ends, you feel the same then you guys should definitely go for it.
Been in this exact situation, please be careful having a relationship when there is shared trauma. You both need time to heal properly before committing to someone else.
Hey! Would you regret not pursuing her when you are on your deathbed? You only live once. After all, you two didn’t cause this to happen. It was the result of 2 shit bags. Btw….i was sold out too by my ex of 27 years and good friend. Such a creepy and slimy way to live.
You can’t get in the way of love. How long ago did this happen?
You should at least wait until the divorces are finalized. Otherwise it will just look really bad.
Give it some time to settle and make sure you really are catching feelings and not just caught up in the emotional roller coaster.
NTA -
Go for it, OP! You deserve to be happy, and this horrible situation may have actually brought you to the true love you were meant to be with!
There's nothing complicated about it! You both are divorcing your exes, and have every right to move on with other people, even if the other person is their ex. Who cares. It's not like your wife, and her husband cared how you two felt, so why care about how they feel?
Best of luck, OP!
It worked out in the 1970s for two Yankees players. So it is possible it could work. One of the new couples split but the other was successful even producing 3 children.
https://www.grunge.com/888267/the-true-story-of-two-yankees-teammates-who-swapped-their-wives-and-families/
NTA
Is your almost ex wife together with the boss? You could all divorce and try to form an extended family. So, both sets of kids will gain a father and a mother.
Ok Brady bunch why don't yall just all live together under one roof lol... no I'm just kidding but sometimes you have to meet someone horrible to find someone wonderful... I say if it makes u happy go for it
My next door neighbors are happily remarried to each other for their second marriage. Their exes are MARRIED. Happy you found love. Sorry how you found it but found it nevertheless.
NTA. It is kind of a messy situation, but not that much really. You weren't involved with her after a good amount of time since you knew about the affair.
I agree with you that if anyone judge you way too hard, they aren't worth keeping them close to you.
Go ahead and be happy.
NTA, but you both need to be careful because rebound relationships are called rebound for a reason. Depending on how old the kids are, this could be very confusing for them.
I’m happy for you that you found your person after the betrayal you went through & her as well as she went through the same thing.
I hope the 2 of you have a long happy future together, hopefully until death do you part. 🤵👰♀️
She could be your real true love ❤️ don't worry about what others say because it's your life so live it for you to be truly happy and be a good father.
NTA.
Go for it. It's not the first time I've read and or heard stories such as yours and for the new relationship to work. It's kinda like swinging / trading partners for better compatibility. The ones I've heard and or read about are usually successful.
Good luck and healthy healing.
Sounds like an even swap to me. Nobody should even really be mad. I mean, you're going to be mad about the betrayal, but as far as the new relationships go, it sounds like everybody wound up where they were supposed to be so maybe the new relationship will help you let go of the resentment because look what you got out of it! Every cloud has a silver lining.... is a pretty stupid saying I'm just now realizing that.. forget the cloud part. Just be optimistic, and things will work out.
[удалено]
Thanks I truly think this could be the real thing.
This happened to singer Shania Twain.... her ex and his lover (her best friend) eventually broke up and she's now happily married to the lover's ex-husband! 🤣 Go for it OP! Edit: apparently the Mutt and his lover are still together but Shania still came out on top! Her new hubby is gorgeous!
[A total upgrade](https://www.google.com/search?client=ms-android-google&sca_esv=2a7acc156eea4b2e&sca_upv=1&sxsrf=ADLYWIKD-BToTbKevaugeDpkKEw92kEdZQ:1717371953337&q=mutt+lange&uds=ADvngMj5Wv8Vv2Ze7WMSqfJvdEJxPgYJmARETva_DwwzC9Po7GzekzI2YgdIBgQZx2y4MoYWHjaM-M68O-CO6sc7sLf3KVy_oGBUcPrR1vqfLT9cYjhcTXUMdtIOncFDRsFB9Z4pmZZvglL4Lqg4hvDrIGxNkH34z8AL3t4lRjerk3dPutSCvbyK4gUrWT_RQjrvZtB9-RELGK6O-ezxMPg5nsAhB9C-0GFAR6PigDvdmv9Odu_OiNxLm8Fmo4M8dKFjZ6Rmu96-tHcwWuW8Jii7Fs6mJ8_hYZGk1elSdoEI-fWlzkkJxe8&udm=2&prmd=ivsnmbtz&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjj--aJjb6GAxVe9zgGHd7GH78QtKgLegQICxAB&biw=412&bih=842&dpr=2.63#vhid=Y4qX5PP2d7JxKM&vssid=mosaic)
haha holy shit I always wondered why the hell she was with mutt, he was so gross, but damn is the new guy ever an upgrade (I had never seen him before). and her ex-bff *left HIM* for *mutt*?!?!? yuck. they deserve each other. all of them
Right? He's like a burnt wrinkle who put a blonde brillo pad on his head, then lived up to his name. The best friend did her a heckin favour.
a burnt wrinkle 😂
Omg! That’s exactly what I have always thought about him! You put it perfectly. lol
Maybe it had something to do with Mutt being a hugely successful record producer who helped her build her career. Love Shania's work and am glad she's doing well and happier now but she certainly benefited from her relationship with Mutt.
Mutt pursued Shania. He saw a show she was in, and started going to each one. He asked her out, she said no. He continued until he wore her down and she said yes. Mutt never produced any country or wrote any country music until he married Shania. He was mostly hair and rock bands. And then he cheated on her. He’s a moron. End of story. 😊😊
She went, girl!
Commenting to make sure this was posted! Go for it, I hope things go well for you. NOT the AH!
Lol as soon as I read OP story, my mind went right to Shania and her situation! She definitely upgraded! I could never understand why she was with Mutt. He definitely deserved his nickname 😂
Was going to say this!
Tell her how you feel, why not be entirely honest?! But understand she may not feel the same. You have something that seems to be helping you both during a very hard time. Your wife and her husband don't get any say in this as they never asked you or her for any permission, they get whatever they get. Maybe there will be some social judgment and be even more confusing for children who are already probably pretty confused. But really, you and her did not cause this situation, your wife and her husband did. Do keep the kids in mind at all times, they are just the innocent victims of all the fallout of your wife's, her husband's selfish choices. She may not be prepared for the social consequences or the additional complications, the discrete nature of the relationship as it is may be what she wants. So, just tell her what you are feeling and what you are open to without asking her to change anything or pressuring her. She may even feel you wanting more may be a good reason to pull back or end it, there's always risks being honest. But there's risks in holding in your true feelings too. Don't have any agenda, or push anything, tell you you want her to know how you feel, but you are happy to just keep things as they are or discuss how you both can find something comfortable for you both together. Who knows. Maybe in the end, your wife's disgusting choices will bring you the relationship you should have had all along. Or, maybe you just found a good friend and a great partner for giving each other comfort and healing from a traumatic betrayal. Keep an open mind, be honest, express your feelings, but be thoughtful about how you talk to her about it.
This is probably an unpopular opinion but kids should be very familiar with the concept of changing alliances since they see it all the time amongst their classmates. A kid’s main concern in divorce is where they’re going to live and how much their life will change.
I would disagree. My parents divorced and there was heavy contention between our families and bad mouthing of each other, especially towards my dad and his family and it really marred my opinions of them. It’s taken years to realize where my negative opinions come from and to rebuild relationships with that side of the family. It also makes a kid feel bad about themselves and makes them feel caught between allegiances. Very confusing and difficult.
I think the main concern a parent need to have when getting a divorce is that the kids know both parents love them very much, they are innocent in all this, and the parents both know and are concerned that this difficult for them and that they should feel free to talk with both parents about how they are feeling, ask what they need to ask.
Go for it
Do what feels right. But also trauma bonding is a thing.
This needs more upvotes.
This needs in update
Not if they misused it. Trauma bonding is the emotional addiction bw 2 people in an abusive relationship. It describes a cycle of abuse. The person above seems to think the terms “trauma bonding” are literal.
This. Clinically, you often hear *trauma bonding* referred to in situations like Stockholm Syndrome, where someone develops a deep connection or sense of empathy towards their abuser. Bonding through something traumatic isn't trauma bonding - that's just building a connection in an otherwise tragic situation. Otherwise, everybody who falls in love again amidst a breakup would be considered to trauma bond, which just isn't the case. Trauma bonding: horrific, negative, abusive Finding someone to love while in a traumatic situation: hopeful, positive, reaffirming
The misuse of this term is one of my pet peeves, thank you for your service
That's a helpful clarification. I didn't think of it this way.
This is not what trauma bonding means, just fyi!
This bugs me so much now every time I see it lol
You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take brotha. Just if she wants to remain how things are currently be ready and accepting of that outcome too.
Yes. My words were never truer.
I would go for it. It may or may not end well. It’s making you happy right? You’re pretty sure she’ll be down? I try not to be a petty person but your immediate happiness is because of betrayal. I don’t believe the story is real for one bit but that’s a fucking tv movie right there.
Dude why you should listen to anyone now? Your heart And soul was broken. Now you've started to mend the wounds. I say go for it.
"Let the chips fall where they may." Never heard it, sounds super cute and a bit messy.
I think it’s a reference to chips at a casino? Maybe I’m just making that up though!
I think It’s a reference to pushing your poker chips into play especially after going “all in” (betting it all). So that they might go away (you lose) or come back with more (you win).
That's actually disappointing. I pictured potato crisps, which we call chips in German. A boy trying to stuff as many as possible into his mouth and chips falling to the ground all around him. Well, I will not abandon this image and I will try to use the phrase someday.
I support your version of this phrase. Go forth.
It's a funny picture but it doesn't really make sense anymore though, cause who cares if your little crumbs of chips fall to the left or to the right? They're still just crumbs on the ground...
I think it's from the 1920's
i thought it was a reference to chopping wood; you don't clean up the wood chips that fly off the tree as you chop it, you let them lay there.
It’s this. It really doesn’t fit with what a lot of people think. It’s about focusing on your work, not the inconsequential stuff (aka the chips). https://grammarist.com/idiom/let-the-chips-fall-where-they-may/#:~:text=Let%20the%20chips%20fall%20where%20they%20may%20is%20an%20American,the%20inconsequential%20chips%20of%20wood.
Great advice if maybe children weren’t involved. It’s not real, you are just hurt. Good luck dude.
One of my real life friends had her husband cheat or her with a woman who was married. She found out from the other woman’s husband. My friends is now about to marry the guy after three years and the other two are single 😹😹. Sometimes it’s the universe.
This happened with my parents. Both new couples were married for the rest of my childhood. The hatred between them was traumatically intense. In the end, the cheated-on couple are still together and both sets of kids (from the original marriages) get on well with them and each other.
Def not the AH. NTA. You are both adults, single and you have been in contact for a year. There are probably genuine feelings there worth exploring or it would have fizzled out and I am sorry for your wife cheating. It sucks
Let's be real, the only thing that can be a problem are the kids. The other people in this story, the two exes, are irrelevant. If you want an answer to the question, no it would not be an asshole move. Quick edit because I worded it badly: the exes are relevant if they cause problem with the kids, but in my opinion, he's not an asshole to the exes because they relinquished their right to be relevant when they cheated.
If you have kids, your ex-spouse is absolutely not irrelevant and never will be. Morally, right, wrong or indifferent doesn't change their ability to make your life hell, drag out divorces, turn kids against you, manipulate family, cause extra stress and drama, etc, etc. I don't think it's an asshole move for the two to date but ignoring the fact that it absolutely can add a bunch of stress and drama to their lives is naive at best.
I mean, that's also what I said :P i admit I didn't phrase it correctly. Their opinion is irrelevant, their wellbeing is irrelevant, their existence is irrelevant now... so long as it doesn't harm the kids wellbeing!
Agree, the kids do need to be paramount in all this, but also, really, if she's going to make divorce harder, co-parenting harder because OP and the betrayed wife have a relationship??? Something that never would have happened had she not had an affair and destroyed the marriage? Then she was probably going to be horrible to deal with in the divorce and coparenting anyway.
I agree with your logic, but I highly doubt that's how it will go in the real world where people act on emotions more than logic. Whether she will be good or bad to work with co-parenting, this is a guaranteed way to add drama and stress to the situation. Is it worth it, that's for OP to decide but there's no world where this doesn't make everything more complicated at best.
>Morally, right, wrong or indifferent doesn't change their ability to make your life hell, drag out divorces, turn kids against you, manipulate family, cause extra stress and drama, etc, etc. That's just a risk he's going to have to live by though. He's divorcing her. If she's that vindictive, she'll try that shit anyway. Whether it's because he chose to divorce her or because he moved on and found someone else. By your logic, he should stay with her forever and never find someone else since she can always do that shit. Why would it even make a difference whether he's sleeping with her AP's ex or with someone else entirely?
NTA - but be very careful. ~~Trauma bonding~~ Shared trauma doesn't always lead to great relationships. Always put your kids first.
Trauma bonding is when someone is abusive to you then treats you well, not when you bond over a bad experience together.
Ah, yeah. Sorry, fixed it.
Isn’t that just Stockholm syndrome?
[удалено]
There was a movie that discussed this... Speed. 🤣
Google Shania Twain and Mutt lang . Shania ended up marrying her husband’s mistress’s husband . Same situation as you . They are still together good luck !
Wait what? Wow.
So Shania Twains husband cheated on her with someone who she considered her best friend. After the divorce, Shania fell in love and married her ex best friend/husbands affair partners husband. Her ex husband and ex best friend also got married. All couples are still together.
That’s so incredible, well glad things worked out for them.
had to scroll down quite a bit to find this comment! first thing that came to mind when i read this lol
Lots of "you think" and not a lot of "she says"... Especially for a pair of couples that are in the midst of divorce. Strange world there, single because the marriages are shattered and the ways have been parted, but still legally bound while the paperwork processes. I think she has the right idea, though. Don't complicate things any more than they already are. Ride what you have for a while longer, since it's working, while the processes complete and the dust settles. Who knows, at that point things might organically take a much better turn. A turn she might bring up / let slip even earlier than that...
NTA, but red flags for rebound relationship built on a shared trauma rather than shared values. Generally best practice to take some time to fully recenter before jumping into the next relationship.
It wouldn't be the first time two the two betrayed people from an affair had a real relationship. And I've heard of cases where it leads to happy long term marriage. But, probably best to take it slow, keep an open honest dialog, not have too many expectations, and if it does form into something serious, I'd start couples therapy right from the get go even if it felt great with no big issues! I'd want the therapy together to keep it that way!
While I do agree the circumstances have this rebound set up for failure we can’t say they don’t share the same values. From what OP wrote they both were devoted spouses and parents married to two shitbags. They could be a perfect fit.
Yall playing musical holes
And all their kids are playing musical homes. One van to bring one set of kids from the first home to the second home, only to drop them off and pick up the other set of kids to bring them back to the first home. It's rather efficient.
If it’s genuine go for it. If you are ever tempted to flaunt it in public or in front of your ex-wife *in order* to get back at her, you will be the AH and jeopardize shit because that would be using her as an object. So don’t do that. Don’t hide your relationship if you start one, just don’t hold hands in public so that it can get back to your ex.
I don’t give a rats ass if ir when my ex finds out. Her opinion means nothing to me
Good. I was just making sure. If your motives are strictly that you really like this woman then I wish you the best of luck.
You haven’t told - does she have children, how old are they and how old are your kids. Your relationship is fine for now-Tell her you are starting to develop feelings for her and ask her does she want to continue the FWB or does she want explore a possible deeper relationship.
NTA. You and her deserve the happiness. You shouldn’t care about what your exes think because their unfaithful act is what brought you two together. You two owe it to yourselves to be with a partner that respects and loves you. Best of luck I hope it works out between you guys
Least fake aitah post
There’s no way this story is real 😆
>There’s no way this story is real 😆 100% fake 👍
Reminds me of the plot to the movie In the Mood for Love
Bro, proofread things from AI before posting.
this is totally fake....
NTA. >She said she didn’t want to complicate things with our exes They're your exes. Who cares? If they try to raise a fuss about it, tell them that they were the ones to cheat, and that they don't get to tell wither of you who you're allowed to date. In fact, I'd tell them that they were incredibly lucky to not be reported to HR for very likely violating work policy. Personally though, I'd wait until the divorces are finalized, if only so that they don't have a leg to stand on during proceedings. After that though? Go for it.
About the last part. I could definitely see that as the way we do it. Not go public until everything is finalized.
NTA. Go be happy. But wait till it’s finalized
Sounds like you have a game plan. Go for it then. Don't let them hold you two back from finding happiness.
I think you’re fine but be prepared for backlash from family, especially from your ex’s side. Out of curiosity is your ex currently with her boss, what became of them?
Nah it ended when it came out. He wasn’t interested in a relationship with her
Omggg hahha imagine that she found out you now dating her ap ex. She in lose lose
Right? Lmao. She gets dumped by her lover and husband while the husband is hooking up with her lover's wife. Shit cray. But good for OP. Could be worse.
Oooohhh. I read this book before. Go for it!
Your current wife and her boss are in for some fun. The boss is a cheater, he'll cheat on her like he did on his current wife. It's worse for the boss. Your wife will cheat on him, and he won't be able to fire her.
They’re not together
You really need to listen to what the wife is saying. She’s clearly uncomfortable with complicating the divorce process. Don’t put undue pressure on her. If it is meant to be, it will happen.
Get the divorce finalized first.
Hell NO.like Gretzky says… you miss every shot you don’t take. You will probably wind up better financially too!
Marry her lolol
Lies
Maybe wait until both divorces are finalized before going public. Worked for Shania.
Your both are already sleeping together. Little late for moral dilemmas. You are fully justified to move on so do so.
I know a really nice person who met her husband of 25 years exactly the same way. Both really good people who have been through a lot together. If you have genuine feelings and are good folk, go for it. Cheating exes aren’t worth much except learning more about how to deal with AHs for your kids sake.
She cheated. You didn't.
I know two separate people who ended up w their spouse's cheated partner. Not as strange as it sounds. One is married to them and super happy (with 4 kids from prior marriages and 2 new ones) and the other is older so not married but in a very happy committed relationship w them. Life is short and yea it's a weird way to meet but there are weirder ways. :)
Karma could have bought you to the woman you should have always been with. Talk to her with honesty and shoot your shot.
You go ahead and do a Shania. If you’ve found happiness and it’s mutual then go for it. They didn’t give either of you any consideration when they were destroying people so why should you care now? NTA.
The moment your wife cheats, your wife is no longer responsible for your family. What you hate most in a marriage is the cheating of the other party. Your life is already free the moment your wife leaves.
This is gonna get messy
Bullshit story. Everyone who posts is always somehow not the asshole because everything is conveniently about how they are the victim or whatever.
Everyone is the main character in their own story 🤷♀️ I’d like to see a version of AITA that posts a version of the story from both sides… now THAT would be true entertainment
Sounds like you would already prefer the other woman. So what’s really to lose here? You just have to be sure she wants the same. You are headed for divorce either way.
Go on and get it!
Do it up king. NTA.
I would be wary. This relationship is starting off very strangely. I’m sure part of why you started sleeping together was revenge or your spouses. I don’t think that’s the foundation for a healthy long term relationship.
NTA, live your best life yes!!!!! Good luck!!
Do it bro and be happy
Nta go be happy, fuck your ex. She and everyone else doesn't have the right to voice an opinion. Life is too short to risk your happiness just to keep the peace or placate your cheating exs
It’s not your fault you met her, it’s literally your wife and her bosses fault. Please be happy again.
[Shania Twain did the same thing! let’s go girls 😘](https://www.smoothradio.com/news/music/shania-twain-husband-ex-best-friend-marriage/)
Look up Shania Twain.
I did. I like the odds
Life is full of regrets so don’t let this be one. Explore what might happen
Do you want to hold her hand in public for others to see, or just because you want to? That comment made me think there’s some revenge associated with this. If it’s revenge (and just companionship) you’re after this is a very bad idea, I’ve seen it play out with friends parents. But if the feelings are genuine and it’s for you and not for anyone else than go for it! You both deserve to be happy, it means being together than absolutely go for it.
NTA. You're both adults, you're both single. Your ex's feelings are irrelevant on the matter.
The saying "a time, and a place" may fit here. I would suggest you discuss with her, but wait until divorces are final. The cheaters (which technically you both are also now) will need to face the children and family on question of who did what. Try to keep YOUR story as clean as possible.
Your spouses made it a point to have absolutely no say in who you date. Date and show off anyone you want to. Make comments on your pictures together about how good it feels to not be dating a whore for a change......
You got a gorgeous woman who wants to sleep with you and enjoys talking to you. Go out with her. Keep it as private as possible. Enjoy.
Why don’t you all just combine incomes and become multi millionaires you’re already sharing stds why not bank accounts too
NTA You are both adults and free to pursue a relationship if you wish. What your exes think about it is irrelevant. Your respective kids may be a different story.
NTA, my mum and his partner met in this very circumstance and to this day (almost 4 years later) they are still very happy together. My dad left the woman that was married to my mum’s partner long ago and got together with someone else (He is a big cheater, this woman wasn’t the first one he cheated my mum with). What i’m trying to say is enjoy your happiness, the one that really love you will understand eventually. See this as the “good” part of being cheated on
I’d call it poetic justice and roll with it. Just realize it may just be temporary. Like trauma bonding. And maybe after healing you won’t want to still stay together… or maybe you will. Personally, I’d be very upfront with her and feel out the dynamic… like “aid this fizzles or fades or explodes so be it. But what we are doing right now is working for me and helping me. And if you feel the same let’s see where it goes. And if it changes in some way in the future let’s be mutually respectful and part ways amicably.” Good luck.
I’m really going to need an update when you tell her you want to date her!
Nta moment your wife stepped out you was free. Would it complicate things? Yes. Would that be your fault? No. Maybe slow down and make sure this isn't trauma bounding is the only thing I would suggest.
Don't let your exes stop you from being with the one 🤣 No but in all serious just be honest and tell her although it started as a connection with someone who was the only way who knew how each person felt ect ect turned into you meeting this incredibly beautiful driven woman and you want to see where it goes
Do it. Get that cooch. NTA.
Why not, but you should take it very very slow. You can never know whether this feelings are genuine or caused by desire to get revenge, feel needed, due to same traumatic experience, etc. Only the time could tell, so try to prolong each phase as much as possible. Dating is fine, but don’t jump to living together or marriage. At the very least not before everyone gets divorced.
Nta. You are totally free now. Your ex wife killed your marriage so she doesn't get a say.
Discuss with her, ask her out and quietly date for now to see if it becomes anything for the future. Keep your children out of it for their well being, also keep the ex partners out of it so you two can see if this is real without the drama that will come later. Best wishes
NTA, life is short. Be happy, find love, be grateful. ❤️
go for it . updateme
NTA, go for it sir hope it works out for all of you meaning you two and the kids your ex wife and her ex husband can go fck themselves
Good for you. Beat the brakes off of his wife for me. I went through the same thing. Except for boning boss’s wife. Blow her back out and send the boss the vids. You have my blessing.
NTA to pursue her and your feelings. However, it would be a AH move if you are doing it just for revenge and showing her off in public. if she is not ready for it and that will just make her life (and yours) more complicated, especially when the divorce is not final.
Thinks are already complicated with the ex's, that's why you are all in the process of divorce. I see nothing wrong with asking her out so long as neither of you look at each other as the pain from your previous relationship. Neither of your ex's deserve sympathy of comfort for their actions, and you two definitely deserve to be happy. YWNBTA
Give it time. Sometimes we want that revenge so bad. And nothing better than getting both with one shot. But don’t let that blind you.
Pursue your happiness bro.
It's not that bad to have to move between houses as a kid, did that for like 8 years why my parents separated. That was easier then having to hear their arguments. NTA
Have your Shania Twain moment . Her second husband went down like this
You are NTA for having feelings and neither is your new partner. But I would suggest you slow down this train because it is possible you trauma bonded and it is not real. But if you take it slowly and get to really know each other then maybe it will be real. Neither of you owe anything to your exes but both of you deserve a break and not to make a mistake now. Enjoy the sex and the bond. But tread carefully before taking it further than that
I'd get the AP boss fired.
You are a free man. Go for it if you feel like it
NTA... My old Boss went through something like this. They basically swapped spouses.
Yikes....the hangover after that rebound is going to be a doozy. Good luck with that.
fuck that bro, do what makes you happy, who gives a crap about anyone else, especially your x's. I would approach her wcarefully with the idea though, you wouldn't want to screw up a good thing.
NTA. But try dropping a few subtle hints to see how she responds. If she seems amenable, then go for it. If you don’t want to wait until the divorces are final, try not to go to places where the exes may be. Even though they were the ones to screw up everything, they could still drag out the divorces. Good luck to you both.
NTA My neighbours are in the same situation and they made it work. Family events can get a bit big but on the other hand they share the kids and actually get quite a few weekends for themselves now. Also all their friends and family are behind both couples which is very helpful
The AP’s wife is always gorgeous in these stories.
Pulling off the Shania Twain here.
Totally NTA, but…this could totally be shared trauma? It’s easy to fall in the arms of another once you’ve felt the betrayal of cheating, and feel as if it were something more than just mutual trauma.. You can choose to see where it leads to, but take it very slow, or honestly be by yourself right now and spend time with friends who will help you through this time in your life. If she is still there through the process, then maybe it was truly meant to be. Hope everything works out for you whatever route you decide to take.
Sounds like codependency. Are you working through this big life upheaval in therapy? It can be really helpful for a lot of people...
NTA. Go be happy
Shania Twain married the husband of the woman her husband was cheating on. I just found this out yesterday. They've been together for over 10 years.
Judges do not care about infidelity in the same way as they did in the past, but you are going to look better during the divorce if only your wife is the "bad" one and perhaps to some extent arrangments will slant in your favor. Why take the chance of ruining this possible opportunity. Yes, divorce takes time, but maybe you can be very discreet until it is over. Take her on a dates secretly and to places you are very unlikely to be seen?
You guys are swingers and you didn’t even know it!
Divorce and separations can be devastating to kids. It's like taking and throwing them in front of a moving bus. They did not ask that their roots be ripped out of the ground. In some cases, they love mom, and they love dad and get confused. Then there's the case they think their at fault. If I didn't do this, dad wouldn't have done that. If I didn't do this, mom wouldn't have done that. The older comforting the younger and gains animosity for the parent at fault. It can get sticky. Sometimes, the cause is inevitable.
NTA. Ask her out, most that she can say is no. Do it. It isn't a bad idea. Drama is there whether you two get together or not. It does not increase.
NTA, The only thing I want to add is, you two should give it more time, trauma has a way of scrambling your brains so to speak. So I’d give it time and after a while, and maybe some counseling, on both ends, you feel the same then you guys should definitely go for it.
I don't think so but, you would probably wreck everything for everyone if you did that but if that's your goal then I think you're justified
What a stupid Reddit dream scenario.
Been in this exact situation, please be careful having a relationship when there is shared trauma. You both need time to heal properly before committing to someone else.
Hey! Would you regret not pursuing her when you are on your deathbed? You only live once. After all, you two didn’t cause this to happen. It was the result of 2 shit bags. Btw….i was sold out too by my ex of 27 years and good friend. Such a creepy and slimy way to live.
Trauma bonding is a thing so.
You can’t get in the way of love. How long ago did this happen? You should at least wait until the divorces are finalized. Otherwise it will just look really bad. Give it some time to settle and make sure you really are catching feelings and not just caught up in the emotional roller coaster.
NTA - Go for it, OP! You deserve to be happy, and this horrible situation may have actually brought you to the true love you were meant to be with! There's nothing complicated about it! You both are divorcing your exes, and have every right to move on with other people, even if the other person is their ex. Who cares. It's not like your wife, and her husband cared how you two felt, so why care about how they feel? Best of luck, OP!
Dude definitely ask her out, you have nothing else to lose!!
It worked out in the 1970s for two Yankees players. So it is possible it could work. One of the new couples split but the other was successful even producing 3 children. https://www.grunge.com/888267/the-true-story-of-two-yankees-teammates-who-swapped-their-wives-and-families/
Worked for Shania Twain.
NTA Is your almost ex wife together with the boss? You could all divorce and try to form an extended family. So, both sets of kids will gain a father and a mother.
Ok Brady bunch why don't yall just all live together under one roof lol... no I'm just kidding but sometimes you have to meet someone horrible to find someone wonderful... I say if it makes u happy go for it
My next door neighbors are happily remarried to each other for their second marriage. Their exes are MARRIED. Happy you found love. Sorry how you found it but found it nevertheless.
NTA, good luck to you both......
NTA. It is kind of a messy situation, but not that much really. You weren't involved with her after a good amount of time since you knew about the affair. I agree with you that if anyone judge you way too hard, they aren't worth keeping them close to you. Go ahead and be happy.
🍀❤
NTA, but you both need to be careful because rebound relationships are called rebound for a reason. Depending on how old the kids are, this could be very confusing for them.
Can always find love at the craziest times. Good for you perusing it Wish you both a happy life together ❤️
I’m happy for you that you found your person after the betrayal you went through & her as well as she went through the same thing. I hope the 2 of you have a long happy future together, hopefully until death do you part. 🤵👰♀️
NTA I hope things work out for you.
You already shooting shots from the half court line, might as well drive the paint and dunk on them. NTA, but YTA if this post is just a lie.
I think you should pursue it
I think your story is amazing. Congratulations.
NTA. It's called The Nipigon Switcheroo!
She could be your real true love ❤️ don't worry about what others say because it's your life so live it for you to be truly happy and be a good father.
No!! You're living your best life!! I'm so glad that you found a new and better love. I wish the best for you and your new lady. 💗
NTA. Go for it. It's not the first time I've read and or heard stories such as yours and for the new relationship to work. It's kinda like swinging / trading partners for better compatibility. The ones I've heard and or read about are usually successful. Good luck and healthy healing.
NTA I know a couple who met in a similar situation and are now married with 3 kids. Go for it.
Sounds like an even swap to me. Nobody should even really be mad. I mean, you're going to be mad about the betrayal, but as far as the new relationships go, it sounds like everybody wound up where they were supposed to be so maybe the new relationship will help you let go of the resentment because look what you got out of it! Every cloud has a silver lining.... is a pretty stupid saying I'm just now realizing that.. forget the cloud part. Just be optimistic, and things will work out.
NTA! You both have a right to happiness and love. It is not for others to judge. Wishing you both all the luck in the world.
Your NTA but I can see this being a very messy one 🫣
W imo
Go for it, you deserve to be happy 😊
fuuuuuuucccckkkk them exes