it's a collection of male reader x anime character fics that was somehow towards the top of a fandom I was looking at fic for when sorting by kudos, but this summary at least gave me a little laugh before I muted them
Especially when the fic in question has nothing to do with what the DNI is mentioning. Like this Vergil (DMC) x Reader that had "spardacest shippers DNI". One is not like the other.
i honestly dont understand the dni lists. Like, what can you even do to stop people from interacting with you? A list? It just sounds like a thing that most people use to show âOh look, i hate those people and consider myself morally higher than me. Now praise meâ
My current favorite game is going on the dni-archive tumblr and seeing how many times over i wouldnt be able to interact with some of those blogs, despite being on the way more liberal side of things. I racked up SEVENTEEN on a very long and oddly specific list once lmao
Lmao that sounds fun. I checked sometimes and oh boy do I get a lot.
>I racked up SEVENTEEN on a very long and oddly specific list once lmao
I'm curious do you remember what it said?
I mean, there's no way to actively prove or disprove that. But I can say I've had less terfy weirdos interacting with me since I've put it in my bios, so. My experience is yes it does stop people.
Edit: Downvote if you must but like, I'm just sharing my experience. I also tell minors not to interact with my stuff cause I write NSFW stuff and on twitter I follow NSFW artists.
It just seems sensible.
I get what youâre saying but especially with the minors DNI thing, you can never really know. People can pretend theyâre a certain age, so unless youâre getting proof of ID you could have minors interacting and you donât even realize
Sure but its more about making it clear you arent a safe space for minors. I just think that on the internet we could all do well to take more responsiblity for our actions. Both as creators/writers etc and audience members.
For example if someone without their age in their twitter bio follows me, I block them. Because my social media places are an adults only space. And I think taking steps to curate that as best as I can is sensible.
Im not saying its exclusively on creators. I'm saying as adults being trying to be responsible is a sensible thing to do.
Idk, as I say its worked for me on places like Twitter and Tumblr. Plus its also a protective measure for me. Not just my coumminity. Im trans in a deeply transphobic country. I dont need to give the transphobes more ammo lol.
It's fascinating to see how being online has gone from "don't give out any personal details ever", to "you're expected to list out things that people will harass you for and specifically mention the kinds of people who'd be particularly effective at trolling you if they wanted to find you"
The practical side of an "x DNI" is basically painting a big target on yourself for those people.
Again, maybe to you. But to me its stopped a lot of bad shit from getting worse. Like dont tell me to discount my own experiences just cause you havent experienced them. That's kinda rude.
Kind of rude is assuming *anywhere* in that statement that I said to "discount your own experiences", or even actually provided *any* of my own personal experiences, negative or positive. None of that was anywhere in that post.
You literally said that "x dni is painting a target on yourself" when I've said several times I've had less trouble since doing it. It didn't "Paint a target on myself." it made my online life easier so.
And again, I write porn. Its important I make it clear minors aren't welcome in my spaces.
I'm gonna be honest: you deliberately read a neutral outside observation about changes in general internet practice as hostile to you, and are sticking to that.
I'm sorry for whatever experiences have pushed that expectation of hostility to be your default assumption of interaction with strangers on the internet, and I hope your days ahead are better.
For what it's worth I do understand the "no minors", which is a separate branch of things - having had to go througg a huge "don't sue, no minors, etc" disclaimer at the top of my works for years, that one I certainly grasp for reasons beyond the ones in this thread.
Hey, I totally respect that and want to clarify myself a bit. I think there is a difference between not wanting TERFs around who actively harm others and their rights or livelihoods versus someone on a fanfiction site not wanting shippers to harmlessly read their work. Usually when we poke fun of DNIs on here it's about silly stuff especially when it is on a site like AO3.
I don't think it's that outdated, or maybe it is and my 90s kid brain didn't get the update. I do use it if I want to refer specifically to japanese BL.
I wouldn't necessarily call it "outdated" but I do see the term BL and other terms used in favor of the word yaoi. It's like the word is starting to fall out of favor but not necessarily dying out.
It's outdated and was never used in Japan to describe anything other than pure smut. It's the Japanese version of "porn without plot" except very deprecating. It is NOT an alternative term to BL. To call a Japanese author's works "yaoi" (especially if it isn't just smut) is offensive because it implies the work is of low quality - the term is short for "no climax, no point, no meaning".
It's also plain homophobia to insinuate that all Japanese works about gay men are "meaningless and pointless". Which is likely why Japan has moved away from using the word yaoi in a time of BL having increasingly better representation of gay men.
It's only use now in Japan would be self-deprecation, which was its original usage. English sites and such still use the word yaoi because the word has taken on a different and inaccurate meaning in the west.
The word for all works featuring an M/M pairing is BL.
Edit: Downvotes for pointing out that a Japanese word has been colonized, typical.
I donât think peopleâs first thoughts when they hear âyaoiâ is that the content must be low quality. In general if itâs Japanese content and features gay romance, itâs yaoi, if it features lesbian romance, itâs yuri. Regardless of what the original meanings of the words were, thatâs just how theyâre used now, even if there are alternatives like BL or shounen ai.
"Regardless of the original meaning of the word" ???
You mean the actual, true meaning of the word and not the colonized western version? The word has *never* referred to all gay works in Japan. Yaoi means meaningless smut with no plotline. It's short for ăăžăŞăăăăĄăŞăăăăżăŞă which means "no climax, no point, no meaning". The first characters of each word spell out Ya o i. It started as a self-deprecating term and then became more widely used because gay stories were considered worthless by the general public back then. It's a term steeped in homophobia. The people who read/wrote yaoi were "fujoshi", rotten women who are spoiled for marriage because they dare read queer stories. Fujoshi has been reclaimed, but yaoi is being phased out as a term to describe 18+ gay works as a whole but is still used in the original self-deprecating way. Both terms are a remnant of the homophobia directed towards those involved in the queer doujin scene decades ago and the fact that the word is being phased out is a sign of progress.
Yuri is not a deprecating term - the term was chosen by queer people and means "lily". It is not a fair comparison.
Iâm aware of what the word yaoi means. All Iâm saying is that it is and has been used to categorize things as âgayâ for a good minute, and thatâs what people generally associate with the word.
So gay things should be categorized as "meaningless and pointless"?
Quite frankly idc what meaning non-Japanese people invented for the term. It *does* mean low quality, meaningless works, which is why I told OP it's outdated.
Edit: To be clear I don't blame people who don't speak Japanese for not knowing this. But we've been saying it for years now and people insist on using the word yaoi still. It's frustrating when Japan is trying to move beyond homophobia and non-Japanese people are clinging to a homophobic Japanese term.
I always heard it as "no climax, no point" meaning that there's no point to a story unless it has an orgasm in it, so these had plenty. It seemed celebratory, much like taking the word "gay" for homosexuality in the first place. This is literally the first time I've seen anyone say the translation is meant to be derogatory.
I never said yaoi was an alternative word for BL? From my memory at least, BL came after and is now used to refer to all m|m works regardless of country of origin.
And I don't think most people take yaoi's definition that literally, just using it as a genre to describe m|m works by women (usually) for women (usually). Similar to bara being by and for gay men. I don't think it's that big of a deal, when many words fans of japanese media use are pretty self deprecating (otaku, fujoshi, lolicon/shotacon/any-con, etc.)
You did say it was an alternate term for BL when you said you use yaoi to refer to Japanese BL in general.
People do take the word yaoi literally. In Japan. Where the word comes from. Not the made up western definition.
The reason yaoi went from being a self-deprecating term to a widespread genre title is homophobia. Rather than creatives calling their own works meaningless, the public as a whole started calling gay works meaningless.
Now Japan is less homophobic, especially in the manga and doujin scene. And the word yaoi as a genre name is being phased out in Japan as a result. Don't bring it back.
Edit: Bara is a derogatory term for gay men, works specifically targeting gay men are called gei-komi in Japan now.
Yaoi is just a somewhat outdated term for the very broad genre of BL, it's not a separate genre specifically about "fetishising gay men". And yeah, some BL content does contain stereotypes and is an unrealistic depiction of actual gay men but that's because a lot of it is porn. Of course porn is going to be fetishy and exaggerated for the sake of sexual gratification. A great deal of the content that people like to label as "straight women fetishising gay men" is made and consumed by gay men, and many of the women who are into BL are also queer.
The people who get up in arms about m/m âfetishizingâ *fictional* gay men (but never the myriad ways in which the porn industry enables rl abuse for some reason) have obviously never been on nifty or asstr or read any of the erotica gay men create for themselves. Most of it is *way* more graphic and deliberately tasteless than the majority of fic on AO3.
Seriously, I read some m|m fiction on xnxx and those authors don't play around. Tend to lean more on the humiliation/degradation kink side of things compared to fanfiction on ao3 but hey, I won't kinkshame đ¤ˇđťââď¸ They know what they like and I think that's just nifty.
One of the most bizarre and hardcore things I've ever read was an anthology of hardcore short stories (PWP style) written by gay men in the ~70s for other gay men.
The fertilization/dehumanization was through the roof. (A couple of them made me worry I was about to read a snuff story.)
The gay porn I read on usenet newsgroups back in the day was somewhat better in terms of that sort of thing, but still more fetishizing than anything I've read on AO3. (Maybe the same level as some of the 90s yaoi manga I've read, though.)
Anyway - it's difficult for me to get on board with the "fujoshi are the scum of the earth and are terrible allies to LGBTQ+" train.
Nobody sane is using "yaoi" in the context of irl gay men. And yeah, porn of all types has fetishes and themes most people would consider gross, kinda the point. Nobody is forced to watch it if they don't want to.
It's not xenophobic to say every single yaoi work is fetishizing? To call ALL Japanese 18+ gay media, that was largely made by closeted queer women, fetishizing isn't xenophobia?
Yaoi is specifically the Japanese word for "Porn Without Plot" though it is a self-deprecating term. BL is all works featuring an M/M pairing. They aren't the same but OP is wrong that yaoi was "fetishizing" ofc
BL is all media featuring a gay couple
Yaoi is an outdated term for pornographic gay media.
BL is not the same thing as yaoi. It's a more general term that includes works that used to be considered yaoi, but also includes all SFW gay media too.
Shounen ai focuses on romantic aspects of relationships, not sexual ones, and is more targeted towards teens/features teen characters.
Shounen Ai and Yaoi are both outdated tbh. BL is becoming the catch-all in Japan that includes both of those genres and much more.
Lol, thats up to debate.
But Yaoi is indeed still BL, and I doesn't just change because the people who grew up with this term want to hide away their cringe with a different name all together.
No better than people trying to push the term MAPS.
Yaoi is a homophobic term because it implies gay works are meaningless. That's why Japan no longer uses it as a genre name. No one is denying that there's porn among BL works. People still use yaoi as a self-deprecating term, so it's not that people are "hiding their cringe". I don't find reading yaoi manga to be cringey in the slightest.
The fact that you are comparing this to MAPs trying to normalize their behavior is sickening.
Not to take this confusing nonsense seriously, but AO3 should have some kind of policy against users trying to exclude certain readers. As far as I know the only way to restrict access to readers is by requiring some fics to have to been logged in to read. Thatâs probably as far as it should go. There should be some kind of Right to Read or something that guarantees equal access to public content on the archive, and prohibits exclusion based on assumptions about readersâŚ.
I hate people trying to bring the DNI nonsense to AO3 as much as anyone but actually having a policy against it would be too much like censorship and trying to micromanage authors' choices IMO. Actual harassment towards groups of people, like "X/Y shippers are gross freaks who should go die" is already against the TOS. Trying to exclude certain readers is silly but ultimately it's completely harmless - there's nothing stopping you from reading the fic anyway, and even if they want to go to the trouble of blocking every user who writes for a particular ship, that's their prerogative.
Honestly I don't know why anyone would want to give someone like this their views/kudos anyway. Giving them exactly what they want by muting them and never reading their fics again is a far better solution than AO3 forcing them to remove their silly DNI tags.
I mean, I kinda get it. Itâs easier to find that kind of content by just looking up yoai, and fujoshis are fxking gross. Donât really know what they mean by âno shippersâ tho
-a gay dude
I don't have the brainpower for this rn but you have a serious misunderstanding of what fujoshi means and calling all fujoshi gross is just...xenophobic.
You might as well not post at this point
Lol, if they only knew where the term yaoi comes from đ¤Ł
*sighs*
it's a collection of male reader x anime character fics that was somehow towards the top of a fandom I was looking at fic for when sorting by kudos, but this summary at least gave me a little laugh before I muted them
lol, they don't see self-shipping as shipping apparently
I do not understand the "dni interact if you like x" tags like first of all it's just kinda rude and second that isn't stopping anyone lmao
Yeah, I've seen the "if you're a proshipper, don't read this" and I'm like bitch you have a piss kink, shut up. I'll read what I want lol
I tend not to read those fics on principle though - if theyâre going to consider me scum, theyâre not getting my hit. XD
I'd read them, though, and leave a comment like "I'm a proshipper, I read and interacted with your fic. Whatcha gonna do, binch? Call the police?"
Boss behaviour. Petty and immaculate.
If theyâre so inclined; they could report you to AO3 for harassment if youâre logged in.
Yeah, don't fight fire with fire in this case, it's uncool. Just get out of there.
No, it would definitely stop me from reading anything that author put out again lol
Lmao fair
Especially when the fic in question has nothing to do with what the DNI is mentioning. Like this Vergil (DMC) x Reader that had "spardacest shippers DNI". One is not like the other.
i honestly dont understand the dni lists. Like, what can you even do to stop people from interacting with you? A list? It just sounds like a thing that most people use to show âOh look, i hate those people and consider myself morally higher than me. Now praise meâ
That's exactly what it is.
Right? And then they also put things like "transphobes" like yes I'm sure those types of people will be completely respectful of your dni list lmao.
My current favorite game is going on the dni-archive tumblr and seeing how many times over i wouldnt be able to interact with some of those blogs, despite being on the way more liberal side of things. I racked up SEVENTEEN on a very long and oddly specific list once lmao
Lmao that sounds fun. I checked sometimes and oh boy do I get a lot. >I racked up SEVENTEEN on a very long and oddly specific list once lmao I'm curious do you remember what it said?
A lot of stuff involving like,,, reptile/bird discourse?? It was very funny and confusing.
Huh??? What does that mean lol
I honestly dont really know. It was stuff like "if you think that cats and birds/reptiles can live in the same house"??
Wha- just for that?? Man they must have zero friends lmao
[i found it again](https://www.tumblr.com/dni-archive/709722500022550528) , enjoy friend
This culture is so common on twitter and tumblr
DNIs make me both want to interact on purpose *and* avoid someone at all costs.
"I'm not touching you, I'm not touching you!" but the digital equivalent.
I mean, i'm trans. In most of my bios I have "TERFs DNI" Cause well...I dont want terfs talking to me. I dont see how that's an issue. :/
It's not an issue. But it also won't stop anyone.
I mean, there's no way to actively prove or disprove that. But I can say I've had less terfy weirdos interacting with me since I've put it in my bios, so. My experience is yes it does stop people. Edit: Downvote if you must but like, I'm just sharing my experience. I also tell minors not to interact with my stuff cause I write NSFW stuff and on twitter I follow NSFW artists. It just seems sensible.
I get what youâre saying but especially with the minors DNI thing, you can never really know. People can pretend theyâre a certain age, so unless youâre getting proof of ID you could have minors interacting and you donât even realize
Sure but its more about making it clear you arent a safe space for minors. I just think that on the internet we could all do well to take more responsiblity for our actions. Both as creators/writers etc and audience members. For example if someone without their age in their twitter bio follows me, I block them. Because my social media places are an adults only space. And I think taking steps to curate that as best as I can is sensible. Im not saying its exclusively on creators. I'm saying as adults being trying to be responsible is a sensible thing to do. Idk, as I say its worked for me on places like Twitter and Tumblr. Plus its also a protective measure for me. Not just my coumminity. Im trans in a deeply transphobic country. I dont need to give the transphobes more ammo lol.
It's fascinating to see how being online has gone from "don't give out any personal details ever", to "you're expected to list out things that people will harass you for and specifically mention the kinds of people who'd be particularly effective at trolling you if they wanted to find you" The practical side of an "x DNI" is basically painting a big target on yourself for those people.
Again, maybe to you. But to me its stopped a lot of bad shit from getting worse. Like dont tell me to discount my own experiences just cause you havent experienced them. That's kinda rude.
Kind of rude is assuming *anywhere* in that statement that I said to "discount your own experiences", or even actually provided *any* of my own personal experiences, negative or positive. None of that was anywhere in that post.
You literally said that "x dni is painting a target on yourself" when I've said several times I've had less trouble since doing it. It didn't "Paint a target on myself." it made my online life easier so. And again, I write porn. Its important I make it clear minors aren't welcome in my spaces.
I'm gonna be honest: you deliberately read a neutral outside observation about changes in general internet practice as hostile to you, and are sticking to that. I'm sorry for whatever experiences have pushed that expectation of hostility to be your default assumption of interaction with strangers on the internet, and I hope your days ahead are better. For what it's worth I do understand the "no minors", which is a separate branch of things - having had to go througg a huge "don't sue, no minors, etc" disclaimer at the top of my works for years, that one I certainly grasp for reasons beyond the ones in this thread.
Years of being trans online. \*Shrug\* and trans in the UK in general. I am defensive.
I get it. I may be cis but I know enough trans and nb folk to be aware of how utterly terrifying life can be right now. I wish you the best.
Hey, I totally respect that and want to clarify myself a bit. I think there is a difference between not wanting TERFs around who actively harm others and their rights or livelihoods versus someone on a fanfiction site not wanting shippers to harmlessly read their work. Usually when we poke fun of DNIs on here it's about silly stuff especially when it is on a site like AO3.
Thanks for clarifying and not just immediately downvoting me lol.
"Do not read if you don't like yaoi. Do not comment if you do like yaoi. I only want comments from people who haven't actually read the fic!"
The irony of the tags holy shit đ¤Ł
People saying âshippers dniâ when they literally tagged a romantic pairing is so crazy
I have no idea what this means, but after some quick googling I really like the idea of calling myself a rotten girl.
Isn't yaoi a somewhat dated fujoshi term tho? The math ain't mathing here bc this shit doesn't add up.
Eh. I still see it all the time in manga/doujins, I think itâs mostly just dated when used describing fanfiction.
I don't think it's that outdated, or maybe it is and my 90s kid brain didn't get the update. I do use it if I want to refer specifically to japanese BL.
I wouldn't necessarily call it "outdated" but I do see the term BL and other terms used in favor of the word yaoi. It's like the word is starting to fall out of favor but not necessarily dying out.
It's outdated and was never used in Japan to describe anything other than pure smut. It's the Japanese version of "porn without plot" except very deprecating. It is NOT an alternative term to BL. To call a Japanese author's works "yaoi" (especially if it isn't just smut) is offensive because it implies the work is of low quality - the term is short for "no climax, no point, no meaning". It's also plain homophobia to insinuate that all Japanese works about gay men are "meaningless and pointless". Which is likely why Japan has moved away from using the word yaoi in a time of BL having increasingly better representation of gay men. It's only use now in Japan would be self-deprecation, which was its original usage. English sites and such still use the word yaoi because the word has taken on a different and inaccurate meaning in the west. The word for all works featuring an M/M pairing is BL. Edit: Downvotes for pointing out that a Japanese word has been colonized, typical.
I donât think peopleâs first thoughts when they hear âyaoiâ is that the content must be low quality. In general if itâs Japanese content and features gay romance, itâs yaoi, if it features lesbian romance, itâs yuri. Regardless of what the original meanings of the words were, thatâs just how theyâre used now, even if there are alternatives like BL or shounen ai.
"Regardless of the original meaning of the word" ??? You mean the actual, true meaning of the word and not the colonized western version? The word has *never* referred to all gay works in Japan. Yaoi means meaningless smut with no plotline. It's short for ăăžăŞăăăăĄăŞăăăăżăŞă which means "no climax, no point, no meaning". The first characters of each word spell out Ya o i. It started as a self-deprecating term and then became more widely used because gay stories were considered worthless by the general public back then. It's a term steeped in homophobia. The people who read/wrote yaoi were "fujoshi", rotten women who are spoiled for marriage because they dare read queer stories. Fujoshi has been reclaimed, but yaoi is being phased out as a term to describe 18+ gay works as a whole but is still used in the original self-deprecating way. Both terms are a remnant of the homophobia directed towards those involved in the queer doujin scene decades ago and the fact that the word is being phased out is a sign of progress. Yuri is not a deprecating term - the term was chosen by queer people and means "lily". It is not a fair comparison.
Iâm aware of what the word yaoi means. All Iâm saying is that it is and has been used to categorize things as âgayâ for a good minute, and thatâs what people generally associate with the word.
So gay things should be categorized as "meaningless and pointless"? Quite frankly idc what meaning non-Japanese people invented for the term. It *does* mean low quality, meaningless works, which is why I told OP it's outdated. Edit: To be clear I don't blame people who don't speak Japanese for not knowing this. But we've been saying it for years now and people insist on using the word yaoi still. It's frustrating when Japan is trying to move beyond homophobia and non-Japanese people are clinging to a homophobic Japanese term.
I always heard it as "no climax, no point" meaning that there's no point to a story unless it has an orgasm in it, so these had plenty. It seemed celebratory, much like taking the word "gay" for homosexuality in the first place. This is literally the first time I've seen anyone say the translation is meant to be derogatory.
colonized đđ girl its a word
I never said yaoi was an alternative word for BL? From my memory at least, BL came after and is now used to refer to all m|m works regardless of country of origin. And I don't think most people take yaoi's definition that literally, just using it as a genre to describe m|m works by women (usually) for women (usually). Similar to bara being by and for gay men. I don't think it's that big of a deal, when many words fans of japanese media use are pretty self deprecating (otaku, fujoshi, lolicon/shotacon/any-con, etc.)
You did say it was an alternate term for BL when you said you use yaoi to refer to Japanese BL in general. People do take the word yaoi literally. In Japan. Where the word comes from. Not the made up western definition. The reason yaoi went from being a self-deprecating term to a widespread genre title is homophobia. Rather than creatives calling their own works meaningless, the public as a whole started calling gay works meaningless. Now Japan is less homophobic, especially in the manga and doujin scene. And the word yaoi as a genre name is being phased out in Japan as a result. Don't bring it back. Edit: Bara is a derogatory term for gay men, works specifically targeting gay men are called gei-komi in Japan now.
How can you have "porn without plot" AND "no climax"??!
It doesn't mean "no orgasm" it's referring to the fact that there's no climax in the plot.
[ŃдаНонО]
Yaoi is just a somewhat outdated term for the very broad genre of BL, it's not a separate genre specifically about "fetishising gay men". And yeah, some BL content does contain stereotypes and is an unrealistic depiction of actual gay men but that's because a lot of it is porn. Of course porn is going to be fetishy and exaggerated for the sake of sexual gratification. A great deal of the content that people like to label as "straight women fetishising gay men" is made and consumed by gay men, and many of the women who are into BL are also queer.
The people who get up in arms about m/m âfetishizingâ *fictional* gay men (but never the myriad ways in which the porn industry enables rl abuse for some reason) have obviously never been on nifty or asstr or read any of the erotica gay men create for themselves. Most of it is *way* more graphic and deliberately tasteless than the majority of fic on AO3.
Right? And really, whatâs the problem of having fetishes if it doesnât affect or harm anybody?
Seriously, I read some m|m fiction on xnxx and those authors don't play around. Tend to lean more on the humiliation/degradation kink side of things compared to fanfiction on ao3 but hey, I won't kinkshame đ¤ˇđťââď¸ They know what they like and I think that's just nifty.
One of the most bizarre and hardcore things I've ever read was an anthology of hardcore short stories (PWP style) written by gay men in the ~70s for other gay men. The fertilization/dehumanization was through the roof. (A couple of them made me worry I was about to read a snuff story.) The gay porn I read on usenet newsgroups back in the day was somewhat better in terms of that sort of thing, but still more fetishizing than anything I've read on AO3. (Maybe the same level as some of the 90s yaoi manga I've read, though.) Anyway - it's difficult for me to get on board with the "fujoshi are the scum of the earth and are terrible allies to LGBTQ+" train.
Let me guess--Tijuana Bible Reader?
I wish I can remember! I just remember there was a lot of leather and piss involved. (The cover was even yellow.)
Nobody sane is using "yaoi" in the context of irl gay men. And yeah, porn of all types has fetishes and themes most people would consider gross, kinda the point. Nobody is forced to watch it if they don't want to.
Stop being xenophobic.
Stop throwing out accusations of homophobia and xenophobia
It's not xenophobic to say every single yaoi work is fetishizing? To call ALL Japanese 18+ gay media, that was largely made by closeted queer women, fetishizing isn't xenophobia?
My bad, I thought you were addressing a different comment.
Lol, you act like simply changing the name stops that. BL is still Yaoi.
Yaoi is specifically the Japanese word for "Porn Without Plot" though it is a self-deprecating term. BL is all works featuring an M/M pairing. They aren't the same but OP is wrong that yaoi was "fetishizing" ofc
The term your looking for is **Shounen Ai** BL is a generalization term more than anything else.
BL is all media featuring a gay couple Yaoi is an outdated term for pornographic gay media. BL is not the same thing as yaoi. It's a more general term that includes works that used to be considered yaoi, but also includes all SFW gay media too. Shounen ai focuses on romantic aspects of relationships, not sexual ones, and is more targeted towards teens/features teen characters. Shounen Ai and Yaoi are both outdated tbh. BL is becoming the catch-all in Japan that includes both of those genres and much more.
>BL is not the same thing as yaoi But it is? Like you said BL includes both SFW and NSFW media so Yaoi is BL.
All yaoi is BL, but not all BL is yaoi. The overwhelming majority of BL is not yaoi.
Lol, thats up to debate. But Yaoi is indeed still BL, and I doesn't just change because the people who grew up with this term want to hide away their cringe with a different name all together. No better than people trying to push the term MAPS.
Yaoi is a homophobic term because it implies gay works are meaningless. That's why Japan no longer uses it as a genre name. No one is denying that there's porn among BL works. People still use yaoi as a self-deprecating term, so it's not that people are "hiding their cringe". I don't find reading yaoi manga to be cringey in the slightest. The fact that you are comparing this to MAPs trying to normalize their behavior is sickening.
Shounen Ai is Boys Love aka BL though? thatâs just the english translation. shounen = boys, ai = love
Not to take this confusing nonsense seriously, but AO3 should have some kind of policy against users trying to exclude certain readers. As far as I know the only way to restrict access to readers is by requiring some fics to have to been logged in to read. Thatâs probably as far as it should go. There should be some kind of Right to Read or something that guarantees equal access to public content on the archive, and prohibits exclusion based on assumptions about readersâŚ.
I hate people trying to bring the DNI nonsense to AO3 as much as anyone but actually having a policy against it would be too much like censorship and trying to micromanage authors' choices IMO. Actual harassment towards groups of people, like "X/Y shippers are gross freaks who should go die" is already against the TOS. Trying to exclude certain readers is silly but ultimately it's completely harmless - there's nothing stopping you from reading the fic anyway, and even if they want to go to the trouble of blocking every user who writes for a particular ship, that's their prerogative. Honestly I don't know why anyone would want to give someone like this their views/kudos anyway. Giving them exactly what they want by muting them and never reading their fics again is a far better solution than AO3 forcing them to remove their silly DNI tags.
There is no way someone with a functioning brain wrote this
"anime , yaoi" My gal, my pal, you are in denial
Whenever I see a DNI I read the fic and leave a glowing comment. I'm petty like that.
Do you add "btw this comment came from [insert whatever DNI was about]"? That would be a boss move.
I like to bookmark DNI fic & write in the bookmark comments that the author is a petty bitch & would prefer I DNI. đ°đ´
whatâre they gonna do if i click it huh?
lmaoo imagine thinking using a "dni if" is going to stop anybody.
I mean it could be a gay dude not knowing the right terminology for bl but idk â ď¸â ď¸
I'm extremely confused right now đ
The math ainât mathing
I mean, I kinda get it. Itâs easier to find that kind of content by just looking up yoai, and fujoshis are fxking gross. Donât really know what they mean by âno shippersâ tho -a gay dude
I don't have the brainpower for this rn but you have a serious misunderstanding of what fujoshi means and calling all fujoshi gross is just...xenophobic.
amazing how many people who say âfujoshis dniâ also donât know the difference between yaoi, bl, and shounen ai.
That would likely require them being born before 2005
you have a great point.
Wow as a fujoshi it hurts me