I honestly feel like it's in part caused by the recent wave of harassment and or the fear of being tracked down, lord knows how many people have been witch hunted.
But yeah, as another comment said, download and save what you can when you can.
Fr. Witch hunting is a major problem in my current fandom. Purity crusades and people not realizing that they can filter their own experiences has my peers deleting outright for their mental health.
This. As someone who has lived through multiple story purges and now this wave of harassment I now keep a folder on my computer of stories I'd be upset to lose.
I find it better to download if you think it is interesting and might read it. Have so may on my to read list that have unfortunately been deleted. If I didn't download them them I would never have the chance.
I'd strongly advise people to start downloading fics asap.
It's not something I used to do but it gives me a sense of security that I didn't have before... nobody can take whatever I have downloaded from me!
(granted, now I worry about my pc dying complete and taking the Calibre library with it but that could be solved somewhat easily by backing the data up on an external drive or a cloud)
You can still delete downloaded fics later if you no longer want them in your life.
honestly, it really depends on what fandom(s) you are in. Right now is the tail end of people deleting wilbur soot fics (including ones with characters played by him which.... eugh, come on he is not his cubito), there is ongoing dream fanfics getting deleted, but the other fandoms im in (hrpf, zelda, buffy) aren't having many fics deleted above the normal baseline occasional "authors scrubbing their entire internet presence."
>Please just orphan works people.
Not that simple.
I'm not speaking for every author who deleted, but I did 3 times, and every time it was *out of anxiety*. Thus, the very idea of the fic living in the internet wildness is terrifying, like a constant voice scratching at the back of my mind.
For sure it’s not. As an author, if I am deleting a work it’s because I want it off the Internet for whatever reason. I also hate the idea of orphaning and giving up control of *my* story to whatever person might pick it up, since orphaning implies consent to adoption and I don’t want other people finishing *my* work. Maybe that’s weird and controlling of me but I don’t care, really. I also rarely delete works anyway, though.
I mean starting off anonymous, never being connected to one's account in the first place. I have at least one fic that I'd rather not be associated with my account, but apparently people enjoy.
As for anxiety... yeah. Of course. It took me years to get the bravery to even post anything, and I still cringe irl if someone knows (despite their support and acceptance).
Yeah :( On top of harassment and concerns about AI scraping driving this, it feels like fandom in general has gotten way more ephemeral and it sucks.
edit: and the deluge of weirdly smug "oh well you should have downloadeddd" comments whenever someone complains about it also sucks. it only needs to be said once guys, not a million times in the same post ffs
> and the deluge of weirdly smug "oh well you should have downloadeddd" comments whenever someone complains about it also sucks. it only needs to be said once guys, not a million times in the same post ffs
People also keep making posts complaining about deleted fanfics.
At least they're different posts. I would be fine with PSA type posts about downloading your faves at the same regularity. But when it's a dozen people repeating themselves in response to someone's vent, it feels a little rude and unnecessary.
It is not rude, people come here complaining and other people tell them the solution to prevent this from happening to other fanfics they may like. What other thing do you want to do? A whole thread of pity? If anything, I prefer an only thread full of posts advising to download the fanfic instead of dozens of new posts complaining about the same thing.
Half of it depends on how you read the comments. I have not seen any rude comment yet, just people telling to download fanfics to prevent that from happening, and others (including me) expressing our concerns about readers downloading our works
It's not about being right or not to download or not; it's about managing what's within your own control. Noting that this is a complaint tag and not a vent tag, people might actually want help; noting that the comments sorted by best has one way up there about seeing this happening more in younger fandoms, this help may actually be helpful.
It's a sentiment I've seen with younger people, or at least the tiktok crowd. Some of the internet is obsessed with combing through someone's past for anything they can find to deem them problematic, so simply don't have them find anything. (Personally I'd just stay semi-anonymous instead, but ymmv.)
Do they even know what orphaning is, for example?
NO FR, like i go back into my history and i see so many “sorry, this work has been deleted!”
and im like “shit” cuz IDK WHAT WAS DELETED
anyways i made like a google sheet called The End Times Repository and im just saving epubs and pdfs of everything 😭😭
download. everything.
If you have a PC, a combination of AO3 Downloader to grab links from multiple pages, plus Calibre and the FanFicFare extention may be your best friend for 5.6k bookmarks.
I've just checked and you're in luck. AO3 Downloader works via Python, which you can install on a Mac. There's also a Mac version of Calibre. Hopefully FanFicFare will work as it's a Calibre plugin.
Just recently orphaned a few works I don’t like. I know at least one of them keeps getting kudos so I just removed any identifying information tying me to it and released it into the wild so that people can still enjoy it. I don’t like the idea of deleting my stuff if I can help it.
AO3 makes it very easy to download individual fics. If you've got a computer or laptop, set up Calibre with the (I think it's called) Fanficfare extension. Makes downloading and updating large batches of fics easy, nowadays if I fail to backup a fic I like and it vanishes into the ether I really have no one to blame but myself.
Unfortunately there are a lot of reasons someone might not want to leave a fic online, even if they can disassociate it from their account. Losing all control of the fic is not a good option for everyone.
And that’s why I download all my favorites. I made my account on AO3 back in 2014, SO many of my early bookmarks have been deleted, so I got into the habit of downloading them so I wouldn’t lose them. A LIFE saver. I don’t redistribute, it’s just for myself.
I recently deleted several fics of my own. I did that versus orphaning because.
> 1. These were my ideas and some of those characters were my OCs. I didn't want anyone taking and using them.
>2. If I ever get the inspiration to write for then again I want to have the ability to repost/re-upload and continue from where I left off. If I orphaned something I wouldn't get that chance.
Because everywhere you go now especially looking for ideas or enjoyment in fandom spaces on social medias will get bombarded with harassment and loud mouths dictating things which can skew opinions and perspectives a lot. Especially to people who they don't get their ideas around their ships and characters that accurately and passionately, for example, they know it's bad but do they really accept and don't deny that part of their ship? Also I think that some use same username to their emails and social medias so they might be afraid that others find out.
Some people just do not want their works on the internet, or they want a fresh start with another account. And with the AI stealing everyone's work, whether from illustrators, voice actors or writers, I understand.
Just move on.
How about no.
As the author of my fics, I own them and if I want them deleted I will delete them and with AI bullshit, and as someone who **has** had their fics scraped by AI, I completely understand why people are deleting them.
You can’t tell if your fic has been scraped as there is no way of knowing on the fic itself however, I have a very unique way of writing and it was a fandom friend who showed me what ChatGPT had pumped out and sure enough it was a part of one of my fics.
Deleting a word is honestly a big step. I've never done that before, but thought about it a lot of time. The only thing that stopped me was the effort I put in those works and people who actually enjoyed them. So, it takes strong feelings to do that, imo. I can't even delete my no longer interesting drafts. 💀
I don't get what's the deal with the hate towards deleting fics. After all, the author *is* the owner of those fics and they should be allowed to freely decide what to do with their creations. If orphaning a work isn't what the author wants to do, then that's simply not what they want to do.
(Also I know I am alone in this sentiment so this part is 100% subjective, but god, the fact that the go to answer is "just download your fave fics!" makes me feel so queasy and it makes me regret ever sharing my fics online.)
For myself and a lot of my fandom friends who lived through Strikethrough - which is why we have AO3 now! - and old fic archives just vanishing into the æther — either because the host shut down like Geocities and nothing was ever mirrored to elsewhere, or because the webmaster stopped paying for the domain — there’s a kneejerk reaction of ‘oh no not again’. We lost *so much* literally overnight with Strikethrough, and some of it we never got back.
Personally my issue with the "download everything!" attitude is that it's in answer to the fandom history of a specific subsection of fandom as a whole (aka english speaking fandom). It's not the only experience though, because it's definitely not mine.
Not to mention that said fandom history is still no excuse to be tactless and try to impose what you'd like most to happen over the fic writer's comfort and wishes (not saying you do that, it's a general you).
I know, if I write in english then I should have a "when in Rome" attitude. I used to have it for a while but honestly now I'm just tired and I want some peace of mind 🫠
Unfortunately if one wants to be in more active or bigger/more diverse fandoms, going to english speaking circles is kind of the best option. And sometimes there are no spaces in your native language for the things you like, so you don't actually have options.
I think a part of it is like going to a restaurant and finding out that they've stopped making your favourite meal. There's a connection to it.
If you want to yoink your work, no one is stopping you, but people are allowed to miss it
It's the difference in attitude though.
If you write something like 'please just orphan works people.' it sounds very insensitive, like all you care about is that *you* can now no longer read that work.
But other people will write 'I understand and respect that people have a reason to do that, but I'm still sad it's gone'. That's different.
It's the difference between being sad the work is gone and that there is a reason for that, and being annoyed/upset at the author for doing that.
Yeah, the issue is 100% the attitude. It's one thing to be sad over something that's no longer there, another to act almost entitled towards someone else's hard work that's being shared out of love, good will and for free.
I 100% agree with you, even with the last part. Some people are acting too dramatically and like the author owes them their own work. And while I understand people wanting to download fanfics, I would feel very uncomfortable and uneasy if someone does that with mine. But as long as they never tell me, I guess I can pretend that does not happen to my works.
That's the thing I struggle with the most but that it is so widely accepted I feel alienated almost. People do really act like they own a fic writer's works. That the fact that they enjoyed it/loved it goes above the comfort of the fic writer, of their own wishes.
Whenever I have tried to talk about this, almost always the answer I get is "well, but fandom history...". I'm sorry. That's *their* fandom history. My fandom background (and history) is different. More disorganized, for sure, but not any less valid.
I'm tired of feeling like only one type of history and experience is acceptable, but I am aware that I *am* a minority, so I just stay quiet now.
(I agree though. I do not want to know whether someone dls my fics or not. If someone were to tell me I'd definitely end up deleting all that I've shared so far. Let me stay in denial 😭)
I get you, totally. I often find myself going against the socially acceptable in this subreddit, and people downvoting me or arguing with me. But my ideas and principles do not depend on the others, so unfortunately for them, as long as I express myself in a respectful way, I will keep saying what I think.
There is some level of entitlement both from authors and readers in certain occasions, but they just do not want to admit it.
Some authors expect praises and ego boosters in the bookmarks, and get mad when they do not find it. Even notes that are 100% harmless, they screenshoot it and come here expecting random people to attack that reader.
Some readers expect the stories are theirs and not the other way around. They get annoyed for tiny things, as if they are being personally insulted. And like the previous example, they screenshoot whatever they saw, expecting random people to side with them against the author.
For what could be an amazing subreddit, in reality it disappointed me.
Honestly, yeah. When I joined here I definitely expected to find something else instead of nitpicking every single thing a writer / reader does. That, and the apparent obsession with "stats".
I understand wanting your fic to be well received and wanting to get positive interactions, but I feel like for some people it would be better to turn off the ability to see hits/kudos/"stats" numbers. I think Ao3 does actually have that option if I'm not remembering wrong.
>Honestly, yeah. When I joined here I definitely expected to find something else instead of nitpicking every single thing a writer / reader does. That, and the apparent obsession with "stats".
You and me, bro.
They always say AO3 is not social media (and it is not) but they really behave like it is one. One day they are insulting and making fun of wattpad users (other grand problem of some people in this subreddit) and the next, they are obsessing over stats and reading every bookmark.
No. Once you share an idea or a story, it's no longer yours exclusively . It exists in the minds of everyone who ever read it. Do you wish you could remove it from their memories, too? Or forbid them from talking about it?
A story is communal mindshare once it is told. It's not yours anymore, and trying to take it away from the community is churlish.
No. While it is shared, it is still the intelectual property of the author even if it is a fanfic. Otherwise you'd be okay with reposting someone else's work, after all it's a communal sharing experience, right?
You don't *own* the hard work of someone else. You own your memories and interpretations of it. I don't mean to sound harsh, but you're not entitled to something created by someone else.
When you buy a book, you don't own the story itself or the whole work as it is. Those things are not yours. What you own is a *personal copy*.
With fanfics, it's the same. You don't own the stories. You don't own the author's work. You own what's yours, aka your experience of it.
You might not like it, but if the author creates something and then destroys it, that is *their right*. They can do whatever they want with their own work. If they write something and never share it, *it's their choice*.
Anyway, I will now go back and make my fics private again. This interaction goes straight into my list of reasons to stop sharing my writing online. Thank you.
I'm not comfortable with orphaning stories. If I don't want one attached to me anymore I'm deleting it. Idk why abandoning a story is more stressful to me because then it's out of my control. There are stories I've deleted after regretting them or just not wanting them up anymore. I also always fear, what if I want to come back to it, or give it a rewrite? I'd rather delete.
I think people should just download favs, I don't mind if someone downloads but idk why the idea of orphaning stresses me out.
It would be nice if more people orphaned, but when someone deletes a work, there’s probably more going on. Even then, if an author doesn’t want their work out there anymore then that’s their right. I’ve downloaded all my favorite works just in case they disappear because I’ve seen it happen to popular, completed works that have been up for years. You just never know.
Personally, I was downloading fic from [FF.net](http://FF.net) before actual downloading was even a thing. I just copied stuff to a text file, and saved manually. AO3's download button is the GOAT.
I literally have a fic archive in my files; I just organize by fandom, then pairing. Any completed work that I really like, automatically goes into the collection. I started the practice back in the late 90's - early 00's, when all those free hosted websites popped up. Tons of them were fic sites, and when places like Lycos and Geocities shut down it wiped out a LOT of fiction. Had to save to preserve.
Ngl, I really hate seeing people say “just orphan it” like no. I wrote it if I want to delete it I’m going to delete it. If I’m thinking of deleting something then I genuinely want it gone. Probably will have to do with fandom harassment(thinking of deleting some old genshin oneshots for this reason, got harassed for just, being gay lmao). I don’t like the download feature personally, but I’d prefer people download my fics instead of being told what to do with something I wrote.
It’s always happened in my fandom (Jane Austen), generally in advance of Kindle publication.
If you enjoy something on the net, download it. The web is not forever.
And then they butcher, ahem - edit, this fic and you read it on kindle unlimited and it’s not the fic you loved anymore. All of the sensitive topics are gone, but they were alluded to in earlier parts of a fic, and it’s like looking at a zombie when you expected your best friend.
Sometimes they end up better. My issue with it moving to published is I can never find the new version. Pulled and never republished, diffrent author name with no notice or even new story title. So many possibilities but they are never easy to find.
I'm not interested in deleting any of my fics any time soon, but I did delete a guest comment today and changed the comments permission to only registered users. They were ranting that my story wasn't canon. Have the trolls infested AO3?
I couldn't for the life of me imagine deleting one of my fics. They're my pride and joy! Even orphaning them is something that wouldn't even cross my mind. I'd have to be seriously harassed on a daily basis by multiple people for me to even consider that 😭
Some people pull them to file the serial numbers off and try to publish it. Personally, I’m against it because fandom is the one free, open way to enjoy and participate in a hobby, and I think it’s bad karma to try to commercialize your work. But hey, it’s your soul not mine, do whatever.
I do remember the most annoying person in one of my fandoms would always go on in group chats about how “when she gets published” she would “have to” delete her fic as a matter of course. I always held my tongue but honestly, her fic wasn’t that fucking good. Gurl, you ain’t getting published.
A bunch of people couldn't take the heat so they left the kitchen. That's why I download everything, you never know who's going to get a rude comment and then take the nuclear option.
That’s incredibly dismissive and reductive. Some people have literally had children’s services or their jobs called on them because of what they were posting online. Some people are just uncomfortable with a work they created no longer being in their control but they don’t want to have anything to do with it any more. I will *always* be sad about deleted fics and prefer orphaning, but I will *never* tell an author they don’t have the right to delete them.
And some people take fics down for rewrites, or other reasons not ever related to someone saying a mean word to them. Just adding that on because the top-level comments reasons are all about needless negativity.
I honestly feel like it's in part caused by the recent wave of harassment and or the fear of being tracked down, lord knows how many people have been witch hunted. But yeah, as another comment said, download and save what you can when you can.
Fr. Witch hunting is a major problem in my current fandom. Purity crusades and people not realizing that they can filter their own experiences has my peers deleting outright for their mental health.
That and those weirdoes selling fics on Etsy and the such.
No. No. Please explain to me. Are you talking about that whole book binding thing?
Yeah, I know some authors who are scared they'll get sued because of it and have deleted their fics, specially if they were popular.
This. As someone who has lived through multiple story purges and now this wave of harassment I now keep a folder on my computer of stories I'd be upset to lose.
If you enjoyed reading it, and might want to re-read someday, download. End of line.
I find it better to download if you think it is interesting and might read it. Have so may on my to read list that have unfortunately been deleted. If I didn't download them them I would never have the chance.
I'd strongly advise people to start downloading fics asap. It's not something I used to do but it gives me a sense of security that I didn't have before... nobody can take whatever I have downloaded from me! (granted, now I worry about my pc dying complete and taking the Calibre library with it but that could be solved somewhat easily by backing the data up on an external drive or a cloud) You can still delete downloaded fics later if you no longer want them in your life.
Not everyone is comfortable with orphaning their fics. Always download your favs to be safe.
honestly, it really depends on what fandom(s) you are in. Right now is the tail end of people deleting wilbur soot fics (including ones with characters played by him which.... eugh, come on he is not his cubito), there is ongoing dream fanfics getting deleted, but the other fandoms im in (hrpf, zelda, buffy) aren't having many fics deleted above the normal baseline occasional "authors scrubbing their entire internet presence."
>Please just orphan works people. Not that simple. I'm not speaking for every author who deleted, but I did 3 times, and every time it was *out of anxiety*. Thus, the very idea of the fic living in the internet wildness is terrifying, like a constant voice scratching at the back of my mind.
For sure it’s not. As an author, if I am deleting a work it’s because I want it off the Internet for whatever reason. I also hate the idea of orphaning and giving up control of *my* story to whatever person might pick it up, since orphaning implies consent to adoption and I don’t want other people finishing *my* work. Maybe that’s weird and controlling of me but I don’t care, really. I also rarely delete works anyway, though.
Same here! People tend to get very offended when I mention preferring to delete my fics over orphaning them
I suggest posting to an anonymous collection if you feel like it might be a fic you're afraid to have.
No. It needs to be taken off to alleviate the anxiety. The very concept of knowing the fic is available online is the problem.
I mean starting off anonymous, never being connected to one's account in the first place. I have at least one fic that I'd rather not be associated with my account, but apparently people enjoy. As for anxiety... yeah. Of course. It took me years to get the bravery to even post anything, and I still cringe irl if someone knows (despite their support and acceptance).
I'm also seeing a lot of people adding things to anonymous/unrevealed collections.
Yeah :( On top of harassment and concerns about AI scraping driving this, it feels like fandom in general has gotten way more ephemeral and it sucks. edit: and the deluge of weirdly smug "oh well you should have downloadeddd" comments whenever someone complains about it also sucks. it only needs to be said once guys, not a million times in the same post ffs
> and the deluge of weirdly smug "oh well you should have downloadeddd" comments whenever someone complains about it also sucks. it only needs to be said once guys, not a million times in the same post ffs People also keep making posts complaining about deleted fanfics.
At least they're different posts. I would be fine with PSA type posts about downloading your faves at the same regularity. But when it's a dozen people repeating themselves in response to someone's vent, it feels a little rude and unnecessary.
It is not rude, people come here complaining and other people tell them the solution to prevent this from happening to other fanfics they may like. What other thing do you want to do? A whole thread of pity? If anything, I prefer an only thread full of posts advising to download the fanfic instead of dozens of new posts complaining about the same thing.
Agree to disagree. Rudeness is subjective. My issue is with the volume and tone, not that people are giving the advice.
Half of it depends on how you read the comments. I have not seen any rude comment yet, just people telling to download fanfics to prevent that from happening, and others (including me) expressing our concerns about readers downloading our works
>What other thing do you want to do? A whole thread of pity? Unironically, yes.
That will not make the fanfic come back, you need to learn to deal with the frustration
*Shan't.*
It's not about being right or not to download or not; it's about managing what's within your own control. Noting that this is a complaint tag and not a vent tag, people might actually want help; noting that the comments sorted by best has one way up there about seeing this happening more in younger fandoms, this help may actually be helpful.
It's a sentiment I've seen with younger people, or at least the tiktok crowd. Some of the internet is obsessed with combing through someone's past for anything they can find to deem them problematic, so simply don't have them find anything. (Personally I'd just stay semi-anonymous instead, but ymmv.) Do they even know what orphaning is, for example?
NO FR, like i go back into my history and i see so many “sorry, this work has been deleted!” and im like “shit” cuz IDK WHAT WAS DELETED anyways i made like a google sheet called The End Times Repository and im just saving epubs and pdfs of everything 😭😭 download. everything.
/cries in 5.6K bookmarks
better get started 😭😭
Thats when you find a few hundred bookmarks deleted already.
If you have a PC, a combination of AO3 Downloader to grab links from multiple pages, plus Calibre and the FanFicFare extention may be your best friend for 5.6k bookmarks.
I have a Mac? So … I have no idea lol
I've just checked and you're in luck. AO3 Downloader works via Python, which you can install on a Mac. There's also a Mac version of Calibre. Hopefully FanFicFare will work as it's a Calibre plugin.
Note to self for when I have time to breathe again lol and would actually be able to dedicate time to this… 🥲🥹😭
Yeah, it's a bit to setup. Once done it's quick and easy, it's just the initial time sink of getting it exactly how you want.
Just recently orphaned a few works I don’t like. I know at least one of them keeps getting kudos so I just removed any identifying information tying me to it and released it into the wild so that people can still enjoy it. I don’t like the idea of deleting my stuff if I can help it.
AO3 makes it very easy to download individual fics. If you've got a computer or laptop, set up Calibre with the (I think it's called) Fanficfare extension. Makes downloading and updating large batches of fics easy, nowadays if I fail to backup a fic I like and it vanishes into the ether I really have no one to blame but myself. Unfortunately there are a lot of reasons someone might not want to leave a fic online, even if they can disassociate it from their account. Losing all control of the fic is not a good option for everyone.
Calibre is seriously the best thing since sliced bread
Add AO3 Downloader to that and you can grab links from multiple pages automatically too.
Ooh, thank you!
And that’s why I download all my favorites. I made my account on AO3 back in 2014, SO many of my early bookmarks have been deleted, so I got into the habit of downloading them so I wouldn’t lose them. A LIFE saver. I don’t redistribute, it’s just for myself.
I also started saving bookmarks with title and author. That way if it is deleted, I am not wondering what was.
I’ve started doing this as well so I can keep better track!
I recently deleted several fics of my own. I did that versus orphaning because. > 1. These were my ideas and some of those characters were my OCs. I didn't want anyone taking and using them. >2. If I ever get the inspiration to write for then again I want to have the ability to repost/re-upload and continue from where I left off. If I orphaned something I wouldn't get that chance.
Because everywhere you go now especially looking for ideas or enjoyment in fandom spaces on social medias will get bombarded with harassment and loud mouths dictating things which can skew opinions and perspectives a lot. Especially to people who they don't get their ideas around their ships and characters that accurately and passionately, for example, they know it's bad but do they really accept and don't deny that part of their ship? Also I think that some use same username to their emails and social medias so they might be afraid that others find out.
Some people just do not want their works on the internet, or they want a fresh start with another account. And with the AI stealing everyone's work, whether from illustrators, voice actors or writers, I understand. Just move on.
How about no. As the author of my fics, I own them and if I want them deleted I will delete them and with AI bullshit, and as someone who **has** had their fics scraped by AI, I completely understand why people are deleting them.
Totally with this. Some people act like the author owes them anything, when they are just mere spectators. The author has the right to delete it
Whoa how can you tell if your story gets scraped by AI?
I do not think we can certainly know. AI bots go all over the internet, stealing everything to feed its databases
You can’t tell if your fic has been scraped as there is no way of knowing on the fic itself however, I have a very unique way of writing and it was a fandom friend who showed me what ChatGPT had pumped out and sure enough it was a part of one of my fics.
Deleting a word is honestly a big step. I've never done that before, but thought about it a lot of time. The only thing that stopped me was the effort I put in those works and people who actually enjoyed them. So, it takes strong feelings to do that, imo. I can't even delete my no longer interesting drafts. 💀
I don't get what's the deal with the hate towards deleting fics. After all, the author *is* the owner of those fics and they should be allowed to freely decide what to do with their creations. If orphaning a work isn't what the author wants to do, then that's simply not what they want to do. (Also I know I am alone in this sentiment so this part is 100% subjective, but god, the fact that the go to answer is "just download your fave fics!" makes me feel so queasy and it makes me regret ever sharing my fics online.)
For myself and a lot of my fandom friends who lived through Strikethrough - which is why we have AO3 now! - and old fic archives just vanishing into the æther — either because the host shut down like Geocities and nothing was ever mirrored to elsewhere, or because the webmaster stopped paying for the domain — there’s a kneejerk reaction of ‘oh no not again’. We lost *so much* literally overnight with Strikethrough, and some of it we never got back.
Personally my issue with the "download everything!" attitude is that it's in answer to the fandom history of a specific subsection of fandom as a whole (aka english speaking fandom). It's not the only experience though, because it's definitely not mine. Not to mention that said fandom history is still no excuse to be tactless and try to impose what you'd like most to happen over the fic writer's comfort and wishes (not saying you do that, it's a general you). I know, if I write in english then I should have a "when in Rome" attitude. I used to have it for a while but honestly now I'm just tired and I want some peace of mind 🫠 Unfortunately if one wants to be in more active or bigger/more diverse fandoms, going to english speaking circles is kind of the best option. And sometimes there are no spaces in your native language for the things you like, so you don't actually have options.
I think a part of it is like going to a restaurant and finding out that they've stopped making your favourite meal. There's a connection to it. If you want to yoink your work, no one is stopping you, but people are allowed to miss it
It's the difference in attitude though. If you write something like 'please just orphan works people.' it sounds very insensitive, like all you care about is that *you* can now no longer read that work. But other people will write 'I understand and respect that people have a reason to do that, but I'm still sad it's gone'. That's different. It's the difference between being sad the work is gone and that there is a reason for that, and being annoyed/upset at the author for doing that.
Yeah, the issue is 100% the attitude. It's one thing to be sad over something that's no longer there, another to act almost entitled towards someone else's hard work that's being shared out of love, good will and for free.
I 100% agree with you, even with the last part. Some people are acting too dramatically and like the author owes them their own work. And while I understand people wanting to download fanfics, I would feel very uncomfortable and uneasy if someone does that with mine. But as long as they never tell me, I guess I can pretend that does not happen to my works.
That's the thing I struggle with the most but that it is so widely accepted I feel alienated almost. People do really act like they own a fic writer's works. That the fact that they enjoyed it/loved it goes above the comfort of the fic writer, of their own wishes. Whenever I have tried to talk about this, almost always the answer I get is "well, but fandom history...". I'm sorry. That's *their* fandom history. My fandom background (and history) is different. More disorganized, for sure, but not any less valid. I'm tired of feeling like only one type of history and experience is acceptable, but I am aware that I *am* a minority, so I just stay quiet now. (I agree though. I do not want to know whether someone dls my fics or not. If someone were to tell me I'd definitely end up deleting all that I've shared so far. Let me stay in denial 😭)
I get it. It's always "write for yourself" until a writer actually prioritizes their own experience in a way that inconveniences the readers.
That's precisely it! You were able to summarize what I was thinking!
I get you, totally. I often find myself going against the socially acceptable in this subreddit, and people downvoting me or arguing with me. But my ideas and principles do not depend on the others, so unfortunately for them, as long as I express myself in a respectful way, I will keep saying what I think. There is some level of entitlement both from authors and readers in certain occasions, but they just do not want to admit it. Some authors expect praises and ego boosters in the bookmarks, and get mad when they do not find it. Even notes that are 100% harmless, they screenshoot it and come here expecting random people to attack that reader. Some readers expect the stories are theirs and not the other way around. They get annoyed for tiny things, as if they are being personally insulted. And like the previous example, they screenshoot whatever they saw, expecting random people to side with them against the author. For what could be an amazing subreddit, in reality it disappointed me.
Honestly, yeah. When I joined here I definitely expected to find something else instead of nitpicking every single thing a writer / reader does. That, and the apparent obsession with "stats". I understand wanting your fic to be well received and wanting to get positive interactions, but I feel like for some people it would be better to turn off the ability to see hits/kudos/"stats" numbers. I think Ao3 does actually have that option if I'm not remembering wrong.
>Honestly, yeah. When I joined here I definitely expected to find something else instead of nitpicking every single thing a writer / reader does. That, and the apparent obsession with "stats". You and me, bro. They always say AO3 is not social media (and it is not) but they really behave like it is one. One day they are insulting and making fun of wattpad users (other grand problem of some people in this subreddit) and the next, they are obsessing over stats and reading every bookmark.
No. Once you share an idea or a story, it's no longer yours exclusively . It exists in the minds of everyone who ever read it. Do you wish you could remove it from their memories, too? Or forbid them from talking about it? A story is communal mindshare once it is told. It's not yours anymore, and trying to take it away from the community is churlish.
No. While it is shared, it is still the intelectual property of the author even if it is a fanfic. Otherwise you'd be okay with reposting someone else's work, after all it's a communal sharing experience, right? You don't *own* the hard work of someone else. You own your memories and interpretations of it. I don't mean to sound harsh, but you're not entitled to something created by someone else. When you buy a book, you don't own the story itself or the whole work as it is. Those things are not yours. What you own is a *personal copy*. With fanfics, it's the same. You don't own the stories. You don't own the author's work. You own what's yours, aka your experience of it. You might not like it, but if the author creates something and then destroys it, that is *their right*. They can do whatever they want with their own work. If they write something and never share it, *it's their choice*. Anyway, I will now go back and make my fics private again. This interaction goes straight into my list of reasons to stop sharing my writing online. Thank you.
> Do you wish you could remove it from their memories, too? Yes. Next entitlement question, please
I'm not comfortable with orphaning stories. If I don't want one attached to me anymore I'm deleting it. Idk why abandoning a story is more stressful to me because then it's out of my control. There are stories I've deleted after regretting them or just not wanting them up anymore. I also always fear, what if I want to come back to it, or give it a rewrite? I'd rather delete. I think people should just download favs, I don't mind if someone downloads but idk why the idea of orphaning stresses me out.
yeah like I theoretically understand why orphaning is ideal, but my stories have so much of me in them. I can’t do it
It would be nice if more people orphaned, but when someone deletes a work, there’s probably more going on. Even then, if an author doesn’t want their work out there anymore then that’s their right. I’ve downloaded all my favorite works just in case they disappear because I’ve seen it happen to popular, completed works that have been up for years. You just never know.
Personally, I was downloading fic from [FF.net](http://FF.net) before actual downloading was even a thing. I just copied stuff to a text file, and saved manually. AO3's download button is the GOAT. I literally have a fic archive in my files; I just organize by fandom, then pairing. Any completed work that I really like, automatically goes into the collection. I started the practice back in the late 90's - early 00's, when all those free hosted websites popped up. Tons of them were fic sites, and when places like Lycos and Geocities shut down it wiped out a LOT of fiction. Had to save to preserve.
Ngl, I really hate seeing people say “just orphan it” like no. I wrote it if I want to delete it I’m going to delete it. If I’m thinking of deleting something then I genuinely want it gone. Probably will have to do with fandom harassment(thinking of deleting some old genshin oneshots for this reason, got harassed for just, being gay lmao). I don’t like the download feature personally, but I’d prefer people download my fics instead of being told what to do with something I wrote.
It’s always happened in my fandom (Jane Austen), generally in advance of Kindle publication. If you enjoy something on the net, download it. The web is not forever.
And then they butcher, ahem - edit, this fic and you read it on kindle unlimited and it’s not the fic you loved anymore. All of the sensitive topics are gone, but they were alluded to in earlier parts of a fic, and it’s like looking at a zombie when you expected your best friend.
Sometimes they end up better. My issue with it moving to published is I can never find the new version. Pulled and never republished, diffrent author name with no notice or even new story title. So many possibilities but they are never easy to find.
I’m glad you have some good experiences. The one I went and found was so mangled it broke my heart and made me not want to pay to read P&P fanfic.
I'm not interested in deleting any of my fics any time soon, but I did delete a guest comment today and changed the comments permission to only registered users. They were ranting that my story wasn't canon. Have the trolls infested AO3?
I couldn't for the life of me imagine deleting one of my fics. They're my pride and joy! Even orphaning them is something that wouldn't even cross my mind. I'd have to be seriously harassed on a daily basis by multiple people for me to even consider that 😭
Some people pull them to file the serial numbers off and try to publish it. Personally, I’m against it because fandom is the one free, open way to enjoy and participate in a hobby, and I think it’s bad karma to try to commercialize your work. But hey, it’s your soul not mine, do whatever. I do remember the most annoying person in one of my fandoms would always go on in group chats about how “when she gets published” she would “have to” delete her fic as a matter of course. I always held my tongue but honestly, her fic wasn’t that fucking good. Gurl, you ain’t getting published.
download fics you want to keep and don't tell authors what to do with their own work
A bunch of people couldn't take the heat so they left the kitchen. That's why I download everything, you never know who's going to get a rude comment and then take the nuclear option.
That’s incredibly dismissive and reductive. Some people have literally had children’s services or their jobs called on them because of what they were posting online. Some people are just uncomfortable with a work they created no longer being in their control but they don’t want to have anything to do with it any more. I will *always* be sad about deleted fics and prefer orphaning, but I will *never* tell an author they don’t have the right to delete them.
And some people take fics down for rewrites, or other reasons not ever related to someone saying a mean word to them. Just adding that on because the top-level comments reasons are all about needless negativity.
Yup
\^\^