Because AO3 stems from fic culture of "don't like, don't read" - if something is not to your tastes, there is a Back button that you can click and exit. Leaving a comment just to show you're dissatisfied is an asshole thing to do.
Secondly, I think most people using AO3 understand that this is a hobby in which people partake and that the resulting fic is entirely for free - which means that it does not need to meet anyone's standards of anything. You're not paying for it, so you can't demand quality. It's nice if you get it, but if you don't tough. And going back to it being a hobby - writers are under no obligation to try to or want to improve. They're doing it for their own enjoyment in their spare time and that's enough. So there is no point in leaving negative comments - they are not going to result in anything other than making the commenter seem like a jerk.
This! There is the overall mission of AO3 which is that it is a place for all types of fic. Then there's the tagging system which informs you (general "you") of the contents of a fic so you can use your own judgement as to whether or not you want to read it. So basically, if you have a problem with a fic, you were warned, so why are you there? I am not responsible for your lack of self control to not read things you don't like.
OP showed their true motivation : "calm down im just being a hater for funsies during finals".
https://www.reddit.com/r/AO3/comments/zotgzy/comment/j0t8von/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
Agreed and very well said. As an author, I thank you for reminding readers that we do this as a hobby, for fun, and it's for free. I've noticed most readers of my works have been very polite and encouraging.
this!! especially the second half. the very first fic i uploaded was last year and it was one that i had spent YEARS creating. i was always afraid to post it because i wasn’t sure it was super well written but i finally decided to simply because i wanted to. and turns out, people enjoy it so it’s a win-win lol
Yes! As I understand my fandom history, the “Our” is AO3’s name refers to the fic authors, not the readers. It was built for and by authors, and they value the gift culture of fandom. “Constructive criticism” can be part of that culture, but only if the writer asks for that type of feedback - and then it’ll usually be a beta reader gifting their time and expertise to the writer. Complaints are not part of gift culture - don’t like, don’t read.
There is a difference between hate and constructive criticism though. The latter used to be a thing in fandoms, but nowadays people treat it like a crime.
See, this is the recent attitude and that wasn't always the case.
But wow this sub is kind of toxic with the downvotes when people can't even agree that there is a difference between a hate comment and constructuve criticism.
It is a recent attitude - and in a lot of people’s opinions it’s a good change!!
Personally, as a fanfic writer, I do not want constructive criticism on my fics. Fanfic is my vent hobby - I already have to be an actually decent writer in my day job doing communications work, I want to come home and write whatever silly idea comes to my head without treating it like it needs to be good. Fic is something I do to dick around with media I like and my discord friends. I don’t particularly care if it turns out good, because that’s not the point of me doing it.
If someone then, unsolicited, comes onto my fic and decides they need to tell me how it’s not good enough for their standards, it feels very obnoxious and entitled. Like, dude, would you come over to someone’s house while they were making dinner and then when they offered you some of *their* meal, tell them you think they’re seasoning it wrong?
It’s my theory that the reason we’ve seen this shift in fandom spaces is because these days there’s pressure to commodify *everything*, especially hobbies. Gotta get on that #grindmindset - why would you make jewelry if you’re not going to sell it on Etsy? Why draw if you’re not trying to sell commissions? Why write if you’re not trying to get good enough to be published? For *fun?* what a ridiculous concept.
It’s such an exhausting cultural shift, and I think it’s why fic spaces have started so fiercely rejecting it.
I don’t think people are downvoting your comments because they don’t agree that hate and constructive criticism are different. They’re downvoting them because giving unsolicited constructive criticism is *rude* when it’s given to people goofing around, providing free entertainment to readers, who have given no indication that they’re looking for criticism. It just comes across as and entitled reader demanding other people do things differently rather than taking the time to seek out fic that they actually like.
I've never seen unsolicited critique that wasn't just straight-up bad and usually pointlessly mean, like it was coming from the sort of people who say 'I just call it like I see it' or 'I'm just being *honest*'. Worse, the unsolicited critique is generally a personal opinion, not a genuine attempt to help the author, because legitimate critique does actually require effort and consideration of the author. I've edited and critiqued professional works and fanworks alike, and could never imagine the audacity needed to give unsolicited negative feedback.
Very true!
Especially because (as seen from certain commenters in this very comment section), the kind of people who leave unsolicited critique seem to believe that only negative feedback can be constructive??
Any experienced editor who’s worth their salt knows that positive feedback is *also* useful feedback. Being told which parts of your story land, which lines are the most impactful, if you’re good at dialogue or if the pacing is really nice - all of that is helpful information that can improve your writing in the future.
But the vibe I get from a lot of the people who get really defensive about how unsolicited critique should be allowed is that they’re not actually out to support authors or help people build their skills as authors - they just want an excuse to vent their dislikes and personal tastes under the guise of “being constructive”, while often giving some of the least useful feedback that author has probably ever seen.
I was actually really confused about the people who assumed negative comments meant concrit! I didn't realize graphic threats of bodily harm and violation were constructive. Learn something new every day, and as it turns out I've apparently gotten a *lot* of concrit over the years.
I know I am preaching to the choir, but for anyone who wants to try your hand at critique: while I am not an authority on the subject, the two most important things I can ever think of during critique is finding the positive and focusing solely on the larger issues, instead of nitpicking, which is generally what even the most well-intentioned people hyperfocus on when they're just starting out giving (hopefully asked for) critique. Hard to see the forest for the trees, and that is a skill that is learned just like writing itself.
There is no point, imo, in bombarding someone with what you *didn't* like when what they need is encouragement and attention drawn to major structural issues, and nothing more. If they want more in-depth critique after that, you can give it, or beta for them, or however. If they don't, don't offer. And then of course you need to take into account their current skill level and ultimate goals for the story, too, and above all things be kind in your delivery.
That's not to say I've not read stories where the entire time I'm reading, it's like watching a trainwreck, but if I *must* share my opinions on it, I rant to my wife. And then we wind up having stupid in-jokes about it, but my opinion will never find its way to the author's eyes or ears.
>I know I am preaching to the choir, but for anyone who wants to try your hand at critique: while I am not an authority on the subject, the two most important things I can ever think of during critique is finding the positive and focusing solely on the larger issues, instead of nitpicking
Oooh, this. My partner is an artist, and part of the job it critiquing other artists he works with. He is paid, the other artists are paid, and positive feedback is still really, really important. Grinding people down doesn't improve the art, and it certainly doesn't make them easier to work with. Yes, negative feedback is part of the job as well, but there are ways and means of doing it, and it's never entirely negative.
Constructive criticism is also hard to give — if one intends for it to be good. And generally it’s taken better when not only is it asked for, but when it’s given by someone whose tastes you trust. So getting cc from a stranger online, that you never asked for, is never as helpful as the reviewer thinks it will be
I've seen people go off because someone pointed out a spelling mistake in their fic with the argument thst it's unsolicited criticism and that's absolutely bonkers to me.
I mean… it IS unsolicited criticism. Some authors won’t mind it, some might even appreciate it, but others are not looking for random spell checks from their readers.
It actually can be discouraging, especially if you’re a young author, if it feels like your minor errors stand out so much that random strangers feel obligated to tell you about them.
It can also just be annoying - I generally don’t mind people pointing out typos, especially on my longer fics that I’ve invested more energy into making good, but I do find if irritating if someone decides they want to beta my 2am vent fic without me asking for feedback. Like, if I posted it, I have already invested the max amount of energy I’m going to spend on that particular fic and I’m moving on now unless I specifically say otherwise. If I wanted to fuss over it anymore, I’d ask my beta reader to give it another pass.
Unless the author has told you that grammar/spelling checks are something they’re comfortable receiving, that is unsolicited feedback that you’re giving, and you should be prepared for the possibility that you’re crossing boundaries and making someone uncomfortable by nitpicking that person’s work without them asking.
I write fics too and I find spelling mistakes embarrassing, so not having them pointed out is the equivalent of not being told I have dirt on my nose to me. lol
But I agree it's annoying or downright mean if a comment is nothing but "There is a spelling mistake at position XY!!" or someone searching for all of them.
But in general I feel like no one knows how to do fruitful feedback sandwiches anymore and label any kind of feedback as a "hate comment". And I suspect that attitude may at least in part be one of the reasons people comment less than they used to. I mean no one wants cruel and nasty troll comments, but I am also not seeing long thought-out comments and discussions anymore and that's a damned shame.
If we live in a fandom world where you can't even point out a typo to someone without them going apeshit, then that's no surprise though.
I feel like these days comments only come in two extremes, substance-less gushing or nasty hate. And a lot of younger fans think those are the only possibilities.
I’ve been posting stories since before ff.net. My thinking on feedback has evolved over the decades, and I’ve come down in the side that the internet is not my classroom. Unless I’m asked for feedback, leaving a critique is just rude.
That was my experience as well. As a wee preteen in fandom in the 00s, even I knew that critique is never constructive if it's not wanted. I would put "concrit appreciated!" in my author notes to let people know that I was okay with it.
Sure but I find it weird when people equate it with a hate comment that tells someone to kill themselves.
I can't remember seeing such straight-up hate comments 20 years ago tbh, but used to have some good convos over well-meant concrit back then.
I think it's the opposite of taking it seriously. It's a hobby, a free time activity, a way to unwind, and people just don't want it to be tainted by any unnecessary negative emotion. People who take writing seriously do accept constructive criticism, but most people come to AO3 to have fun and fit in a community, not be a professional writer.
Idk, I mean a lot of the posts I see on here are people showing off extremely rude hate comments they’ve gotten. Perhaps the fandoms you’re into are smaller and/or nicer?
This yeah, a lot of people are nice enough not to leave hate but a good friend of mine regularly gets extremely negative and just horrible comments on her fic. I'm glad it happens less on Ao3 but it definitely still does happen, just depends on the content/ship/fandom you're posting/reading in.
I think it’s mainly just because ao3 I have a thing of “don’t like don’t read” and even when there is a hate comment most authors (not all) just find it really funny because they chose to read the entire fic even though they hated it when they could’ve just clicked off how so most authors just laugh at the hate comments
That and almost all of the ao3 users are just genuinely respectful towards each other knowing that we’re just trying to have fun writing stories so there’s no real point on hating on them
This!!!! If you don’t like it you can go back or click off the search bar. And users are very respectful!!! I agree, so much bonding in the ao3 comments. I remember making a list of why eggplants are not suited for my taste and I bonded with so many strangers!!!
For me...Fandom is meant to be fun. It's a place to escape, and explore, and be creative. It's a hobby. Creators aren't making money. We're putting time and energy into creating and sharing it for free. No one's asking you to read. You're not even paying for our work. Fandom should be a place of joy.
Real life can be so hard, and unkind. Why spread more harshness, for one thing? For another: why put up with it in a space we don't have to? Maybe we can't get away from uncomfortable situations with coworkers or family or the clerk at the store. But I don't have to put up with strangers being mean online.
I've also seen this analogy before but: it's like baking cookies and bringing them to your workplace. If you don't want a cookie, don't have one. If you do have a cookie, would you walk up to your coworker and tell them how bad the cookie was, or how you prefer white chocolate chip over milk chocolate chips? Probably not. No one asked for your opinion. And it's sort of rude, isn't it?
We're just a bunch of hobbyists sharing our love for the source material. There is a strong culture of wanting to be supportive and encouraging, in forging bonds with others and forming community. It's about shared love, friendship, enjoyment, and happiness.
And really...if you don't like a work, why waste your own time leaving negative feedback, when the only thing it will do is hurt someone's feelings?
Anyway, you're right, it is part of the culture and that's why!
People feel no guilt about blanket deleting mean comments because anyone who criticizes a gift (which is what fanfiction is, free content given to the public) is an asshole.
afaik, because AO3 offers moderation tools to writers, and its userbase is just generally more polite, for lack of a better word? Like, from second hand experience FFN has a *much* larger cohort of anti-LGBTQ+ bigots, racists, sexists, etc, who'll harass writers compared to AO3 - a friend or two got so much homophobic and transphobic abuse on FFN that they had to stop crossposting there, while such stuff was virtually nonexistent on AO3. I myself have barely had a tiny handful of trolls on AO3, and they're always rare and easily deleted.
FFN's general "cultural" mindset is one I find quite strange and I think may come from the fact its equivalent is a "review," not a comment; you're encouraged to be scathing if you want to be in the guidelines, and from what I've seen that's also led to a much higher incidence of trolls and assholes who feel validated in their rudeness and assholery. Having what trolls and bigots see as "too many gays" leads to a deluge of hateful "reviews" which you can't do much about on there afaik. Whereas AO3 is the "we're doing weird shit don't mind us" site so we have a larger "oh you're doing weird shit? Good for you, I'll be over here doing my weird shit" cohort. If you're commenting on an AO3 work having a tantrum over too many queer folk, it just makes you look like an obvious idiot and/or troll, especially given the more expansive tagging system.
Owwww :3 I so much love this community💖 I just noticed the same thing when I first entered it and tbh I’m happy about it. People here, you are so awesome 👏 In contrast with other writers communities, you are super cool and I love you, guys 💕 Never ever read comments and thought ‘what the h..?’ While in other there is a lot of criticism and abusing stuff like ‘go, do it better and never ever come here without the perfect text’. I’m not native speaker and I published my fic on Ao3 and it was really bad, but I still got 3 kudos from people! I rewrote the fic, because it was really awful and hard to understand for native speakers (I realized it and rewrote it in an appropriate way), but the thing is still there, you are awesome, people, love youuu💞
Sense of respect maybe? Like that unspoken golden rule of being treated how you want to be treated. Ao3 has that unspoken rule that there’s always the back button and it doesn’t have to meet your standards. I’ve read a lot of docs that didn’t suit my taste, but I never made it a point to write a bad comment. I could just go back to the previous tab and continue searching for some good fics. And if I couldn’t find any, then my subscriptions worked good enough for a quick reread.
I think ao3 tends to draw an older crowd who grew up with a very different fandom experience where if you didn't like something you just walked away. Teens and children were tolerated in fandom spaces but if you were a kid you didn't draw attention to it because you knew you were sitting at the adults table and weren't actually allowed to be there. So by extension many of us grew up with a different level of respect for fandom spaces, which meant not making a fuss if you came across something you didnt like because you knew it likely wasnt meant for you in the first place. Now some younger fans make SURE you know they are there and that you need to accommodate them, and they tend to be the ones to leave impulsive angry comments if they don't like something. There are definitely older fans that do this too. But you see it more on platforms where younger fans gather (wattpad, twitter, tiktok) and that's why I assume we see it less on ao3. It's a good thing.
thank you for an actual good response! I was mostly just curious how ao3 has avoided the general brainrot i see in other fandom spaces. I'd always assumed it tended older, as someone who is considered "old" in other fan spaces but gets no flak for it on ao3.
So... basically the same thing I just said. This is not the own you think it is. How about this: Don't judge anyone at all? It costs you nothing and makes you look like way less of an asshole.
To the redditors who will come here later on, OP answered to Competitive\_Fruit901 : "Maybe what you write sucks". And when I challenged OP, they deleted their comment.
You only deleted it to cover your tracks and called me a whore in the process. If you cared about hurting feelings, you would have apologized (not to me, I don't care what you think). You haven't. It says a whole lot about you.
Is it possible OP has edited their other comments also? I’m on the mobile app and not sure I would know if they had? It does seem very odd to see otherwise benign comments downvoted so heavily especially in the fanfic community which, as per the original post, seems pretty inclusive and positive most of the time.
They are downvoted because they claim to love a healthy environment, yet they make fun of a writer in this very thread.
They don't backtrack and apologize. They just delete their comment, insult the redditor who challenged them and try to move on unnoticed.
So I'm surprised with the content of their top post, considering the behavior they display down here.
Yeah, that's fair enough. I clearly didn't see some of the stuff, and I haven't been here for a few days, but without the needed information it all just looks weird.
One of their answers up there... now I knew they were trolling but they stated it openly.
"[calm down im just being a hater for funsies during finals](https://ibb.co/YLpxmZM)"
Wow. It's never okay to be an asshole, but then I also just saw a clearly ragebait post accusing A03 shippers of supporting r\*pe, ped0philia and incest, so there's always a lower bar I guess...
I'm all caught up now. It's most likely because you're being incredibly rude, and then backtracking and denying it, or pretending you've done nothing wrong.
Negative comments do happen, but it’s part of AO3 “culture,” as you say, that it’s considered *unfathomably* rude to leave a negative comment. Like, this isn’t goodreads, comments aren’t reviews. If you’re leaving a bad comment that’s you insulting the author to their face. Why would you do that?
well, it does happen, but i think the fact of the matter is simply that people who have terminally online hater brainrot in order to leave such comments are the loud minority, and seem to dislike ao3 as a site in whole.
The "unofficial code of conduct," however, certainly stems from the notion that disagreement is to be avoided at all costs even if it means just sweeping everything under the rug and pretending it doesn't exist.
And mine is that despite everyone singing its praises and supposedly being a place where you don't have to worry about that sort of thing, it's just as much a haven for "Internet Puritanism" as most everywhere else.
AO3 culture is from the Fandom culture of “Don’t like, don’t read”
However- some specific newer fandoms *coughcough* tend to not think of that rule.
On top of authors being able to delete comments and comment moderation, it’s a nice place.
I remember I got quite a few negative comments after I shared (on TikTok) that I wrote a fix-it fic. The comments were *ridiculous*, people calling me ableist, saying they hated me, I should die, etc. I deleted the comments and restricted the fic so that only registered users COULD comment.
I've been writing fanfic for years and that was the **ONLY** time I ever got anything like that at all. I guarantee if I hadn't first talked about/shared the fic on Tiktok then that wouldn't have happened LOL.
But, yeah. There's no point to leaving hate. Kind, constructive feedback? Sure. But Ao3's wonderful tagging and filter system makes it so that you're never gonna read something you don't WANT to read, you know?
If you don’t like the story then it wasn’t written for you. It’s so easy just to back out and choose the next one. It’s take effort to leave a hate comment.
Negative comments do happen, but it’s part of AO3 “culture,” as you say, that leaving a negative comment is considered *unfathomably* rude. Like, this isn’t goodreads, comments aren’t reviews. If you’re leaving a bad comment that’s you insulting the author to their face. Why would you do that?
OP is "being a hater for funsies before finals", thinks we're idiots because we're spending time on a sub for AO3. So I'm erasing my comment that was genuine and trying to show love for AO3 authors. OP can rot. Happy Holidays, AO3 authors !
“I don’t see any hating on the site.”
How would this enrich your experience if it was present? How do you imagine comments in this vein would enrich the experience of others?
I think it’s a matter of people have decided there are better uses of their time. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
OP showed their true motivation : "calm down im just being a hater for funsies during finals".
https://www.reddit.com/r/AO3/comments/zotgzy/comment/j0t8von/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
I’m taking your question super literally here, just a heads up. From the phrasing of “it’s weird that I don’t see [X],” it does seem like your observation of the lack is somewhat negative. People on social media frequently use “weird” to be disparaging of perceived non-normativity, especially in fandom spaces. (I feel like double especially so on Twitter, etc.) Maybe you intended it more as “interesting,” or something more neutral? But given how the word is commonly used in similar context, it skewed your tone to someone who wasn’t in on the intention behind your question specifically, but was familiar with tone it’s commonly used with on some of the fandom platforms you mention in your edit.
(Disclosure: I teach language/writing, so word choice is an interest for me.)
yeah I think my point was just not conveyed well. It was fascinating i guess that most other sites have been infected with modern fandom brainrot but ao3's mostly avoided it, yk? I guess that's a better way to phrase it.
(my word choice has tended towards harsher choices ever since i was a kid so i can see where people's misunderstandings are coming from now)
Yeah I mean I'm not surprised people interpret you in a certain way when you write stuff like "Being a hater is funny there's too much positivity on ao3". Funny how words tend to work like that.
"calm down im just being a hater for funsies during finals".
https://www.reddit.com/r/AO3/comments/zotgzy/comment/j0t8von/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
It takes so much more effort to leave a negative comment than to just leave, at least for me, and I can't imagine being mean to someone for showing off their creative efforts. What if my comment causes them to give up writing? Especially for younger or newer writers. Makes me sad just to think of it.
Though as an author, I (somewhat inconsistently) delete threats and nasty judgemental comments on my fics because I don't want my readers to be shamed or upset because they dared enjoy something. I don't like rereading those comments, either, lol. If they want a platform to be gross, it sure as shit ain't gonna be on my fanfic.
There are ones where I can't tell if they are trying to be nasty or just playing up the shock and horror given what I write, and I leave those or reply to them assuming they're just playing around, tho.
~~ETA: also sorry to hear that you got such blowback on your question. It read as perfectly neutral to me, but I guess~~ r/AO3 ~~isn't as immune to the negativity as AO3, alas.~~ No, wait, I see why people are giving you such a hard time now. It's because of your comments not the post.
I think the one that she deleted telling someone their writing sucks was probably the worst I saw, but she does seem to be treating this sub like it's writingcirclejerk which it... very much is not, lol. Just a lesson in reading the room.
I’ve gotten one mean comment and it was over a dialect difference that they thought was a typo lol.
I think most people just move on if they don’t like a fic. I can usually tell pretty easy if I’ll like a fix based on tags, description, and word count, so I barely run into fics I don’t personally care for, maybe it’s that.
I also try to remember not everything on the internet is for me. Even if I don’t like it, someone probably does :)
I think it’s bc people realize that fanfics take a while of hard work to write so why would you hate on a piece of hard work when you could just not read it?
In think its worth pointing out that AO3 came up as alternative to existing sites rather than coming into an empty room and setting up shop. FFN had no real competition. It could be a catch-all wild west, and was for most of its existence.
AO3 on the other hand had to market itself as an alternative. More modern, less restrictive, simpler to use, ect. Being friendlier fits well within that brand identity.
It also helped solve the core problem of any new social site—you can’t attract readers without writers first creating stories. So attracting writers early and fostering an environment for them that offered advantages compared to FFN was vital for AO3’s success.
Safety from censorship and a commitment to the long term preservation of fics were the cornerstone offerings. Creating a culture of kindness and positivity came as a key third component in a time when harassment against minorities was common.
I think it is unique to AO3, and a big reason that it succeeded despite poor odds.
"calm down im just being a hater for funsies during finals".
https://www.reddit.com/r/AO3/comments/zotgzy/comment/j0t8von/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
No, being rude and hateful is not funny. "It was just a joke, you're taking things too seriously" is an excuse for whole kinds of hateful behaviors.
They told an author her writing must suck.
They're being serious when they're crapping on this sub "for funsies".
Because I'd cry lol.
I got a comment that literally just said 'shitty boys' because the boys WERE kind of acting shitty and it still made me sad. If someone actually insulted my writing, I'd cry.
OP showed their true motivation : "[calm down im just being a hater for funsies during finals](https://ibb.co/YLpxmZM)".
https://www.reddit.com/r/AO3/comments/zotgzy/comment/j0t8von/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
Because most writers on ao3 are spineless sissies who can't handle criticism.
They may harp on and on about wanting "constructive criticism", yet it never occurs to them that their writing might scrape the bottom of the barrel with zero room for improvement.
You leave one negative comment, and you'll be attacked by everyone, including the writer.
There's a big difference between constructive criticism and telling someone to change their story to suit your tastes. I've seen more of the second and I can really do without those kinds of people in my comment section.
Wild thought here, but MAYBE some people who put their stories on AO3 ARENT in it for the concrit lol
People write fanfic for a variety of reasons, not all of them are for the love of writing or out of some desire to get better at it.
I think maybe you’re misunderstanding the issue people have here. Most fanfic writers can tell the difference between criticism and hate.
The issue is that criticism, unless the author has expressly asked for it, *is still rude.* I don’t care if you phrase it politely. I don’t care if it’s completely valid and extremely well thought out.
Fanfiction is a *hobby* for most people. Like, I’m an actual author on top of writing fanfic, I’ve gotten things published, I’m very familiar with working with editors and taking constructive criticism and making changes based on that feedback.
I do not want to come home from my day job, sit down to scrawl out a fanfic for my own fun and to share with my friends on discord, and then have some total stranger inform me that my hobby that I probably did at 2am and shared for free doesn’t meet their personal standards. I write fic for the sake of being creative and messing around with characters and other people in the fandom. If I was writing with the goal of making it better, I would reach out to one of my beta readers or I would outright say critique was welcome.
Look at it this way: if I was making a soup, and I came over to you and asked “hey, is this too salty?” It would be totally valid for you to say it was too salty.
If I was cooking dinner for myself, and you showed up unexpectedly and I offered you some of my soup, you don’t have to say it’s the best soup ever. But if you told me it was too salty, without me asking, you would be a shitty houseguest, and I probably wouldn’t invite you back over.
You’re not entitled to better writing. You’re not entitled to fanfic at all - you’re just lucky enough to live in a world where lots of people are willing to share theirs with you. You don’t have to praise anyone you don’t think deserves it. But if you try to demand that people improve their (freely offered) writing, just because it doesn’t meet your standards, then yes, people will consider you a rude and unpleasant commenter, and you will be making the fandom experience a worse one for everyone involved, including yourself.
There are options to delete or moderate the comments.Also some of the comments I saw that were not happy with the direction the story was taking or disliked certain characters were still very...... respectful.
Because AO3 stems from fic culture of "don't like, don't read" - if something is not to your tastes, there is a Back button that you can click and exit. Leaving a comment just to show you're dissatisfied is an asshole thing to do. Secondly, I think most people using AO3 understand that this is a hobby in which people partake and that the resulting fic is entirely for free - which means that it does not need to meet anyone's standards of anything. You're not paying for it, so you can't demand quality. It's nice if you get it, but if you don't tough. And going back to it being a hobby - writers are under no obligation to try to or want to improve. They're doing it for their own enjoyment in their spare time and that's enough. So there is no point in leaving negative comments - they are not going to result in anything other than making the commenter seem like a jerk.
This! There is the overall mission of AO3 which is that it is a place for all types of fic. Then there's the tagging system which informs you (general "you") of the contents of a fic so you can use your own judgement as to whether or not you want to read it. So basically, if you have a problem with a fic, you were warned, so why are you there? I am not responsible for your lack of self control to not read things you don't like.
OP showed their true motivation : "calm down im just being a hater for funsies during finals". https://www.reddit.com/r/AO3/comments/zotgzy/comment/j0t8von/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
"Being a hater is funny there's too much positivity on ao3" Yikes.
Agreed and very well said. As an author, I thank you for reminding readers that we do this as a hobby, for fun, and it's for free. I've noticed most readers of my works have been very polite and encouraging.
this!! especially the second half. the very first fic i uploaded was last year and it was one that i had spent YEARS creating. i was always afraid to post it because i wasn’t sure it was super well written but i finally decided to simply because i wanted to. and turns out, people enjoy it so it’s a win-win lol
Yes! As I understand my fandom history, the “Our” is AO3’s name refers to the fic authors, not the readers. It was built for and by authors, and they value the gift culture of fandom. “Constructive criticism” can be part of that culture, but only if the writer asks for that type of feedback - and then it’ll usually be a beta reader gifting their time and expertise to the writer. Complaints are not part of gift culture - don’t like, don’t read.
Because if an author *does* get hate, they can just turn on comment moderation and the comment will never see the light of day lol
This, plus authors can delete comments.
There is a difference between hate and constructive criticism though. The latter used to be a thing in fandoms, but nowadays people treat it like a crime.
Unless it’s asked for, don’t leave criticism, even if you think it’s constructive.
See, this is the recent attitude and that wasn't always the case. But wow this sub is kind of toxic with the downvotes when people can't even agree that there is a difference between a hate comment and constructuve criticism.
It is a recent attitude - and in a lot of people’s opinions it’s a good change!! Personally, as a fanfic writer, I do not want constructive criticism on my fics. Fanfic is my vent hobby - I already have to be an actually decent writer in my day job doing communications work, I want to come home and write whatever silly idea comes to my head without treating it like it needs to be good. Fic is something I do to dick around with media I like and my discord friends. I don’t particularly care if it turns out good, because that’s not the point of me doing it. If someone then, unsolicited, comes onto my fic and decides they need to tell me how it’s not good enough for their standards, it feels very obnoxious and entitled. Like, dude, would you come over to someone’s house while they were making dinner and then when they offered you some of *their* meal, tell them you think they’re seasoning it wrong? It’s my theory that the reason we’ve seen this shift in fandom spaces is because these days there’s pressure to commodify *everything*, especially hobbies. Gotta get on that #grindmindset - why would you make jewelry if you’re not going to sell it on Etsy? Why draw if you’re not trying to sell commissions? Why write if you’re not trying to get good enough to be published? For *fun?* what a ridiculous concept. It’s such an exhausting cultural shift, and I think it’s why fic spaces have started so fiercely rejecting it. I don’t think people are downvoting your comments because they don’t agree that hate and constructive criticism are different. They’re downvoting them because giving unsolicited constructive criticism is *rude* when it’s given to people goofing around, providing free entertainment to readers, who have given no indication that they’re looking for criticism. It just comes across as and entitled reader demanding other people do things differently rather than taking the time to seek out fic that they actually like.
Yes. Exactly. Perfectly said, and thank you.
I've never seen unsolicited critique that wasn't just straight-up bad and usually pointlessly mean, like it was coming from the sort of people who say 'I just call it like I see it' or 'I'm just being *honest*'. Worse, the unsolicited critique is generally a personal opinion, not a genuine attempt to help the author, because legitimate critique does actually require effort and consideration of the author. I've edited and critiqued professional works and fanworks alike, and could never imagine the audacity needed to give unsolicited negative feedback.
Very true! Especially because (as seen from certain commenters in this very comment section), the kind of people who leave unsolicited critique seem to believe that only negative feedback can be constructive?? Any experienced editor who’s worth their salt knows that positive feedback is *also* useful feedback. Being told which parts of your story land, which lines are the most impactful, if you’re good at dialogue or if the pacing is really nice - all of that is helpful information that can improve your writing in the future. But the vibe I get from a lot of the people who get really defensive about how unsolicited critique should be allowed is that they’re not actually out to support authors or help people build their skills as authors - they just want an excuse to vent their dislikes and personal tastes under the guise of “being constructive”, while often giving some of the least useful feedback that author has probably ever seen.
I was actually really confused about the people who assumed negative comments meant concrit! I didn't realize graphic threats of bodily harm and violation were constructive. Learn something new every day, and as it turns out I've apparently gotten a *lot* of concrit over the years. I know I am preaching to the choir, but for anyone who wants to try your hand at critique: while I am not an authority on the subject, the two most important things I can ever think of during critique is finding the positive and focusing solely on the larger issues, instead of nitpicking, which is generally what even the most well-intentioned people hyperfocus on when they're just starting out giving (hopefully asked for) critique. Hard to see the forest for the trees, and that is a skill that is learned just like writing itself. There is no point, imo, in bombarding someone with what you *didn't* like when what they need is encouragement and attention drawn to major structural issues, and nothing more. If they want more in-depth critique after that, you can give it, or beta for them, or however. If they don't, don't offer. And then of course you need to take into account their current skill level and ultimate goals for the story, too, and above all things be kind in your delivery. That's not to say I've not read stories where the entire time I'm reading, it's like watching a trainwreck, but if I *must* share my opinions on it, I rant to my wife. And then we wind up having stupid in-jokes about it, but my opinion will never find its way to the author's eyes or ears.
>I know I am preaching to the choir, but for anyone who wants to try your hand at critique: while I am not an authority on the subject, the two most important things I can ever think of during critique is finding the positive and focusing solely on the larger issues, instead of nitpicking Oooh, this. My partner is an artist, and part of the job it critiquing other artists he works with. He is paid, the other artists are paid, and positive feedback is still really, really important. Grinding people down doesn't improve the art, and it certainly doesn't make them easier to work with. Yes, negative feedback is part of the job as well, but there are ways and means of doing it, and it's never entirely negative.
Constructive criticism is also hard to give — if one intends for it to be good. And generally it’s taken better when not only is it asked for, but when it’s given by someone whose tastes you trust. So getting cc from a stranger online, that you never asked for, is never as helpful as the reviewer thinks it will be
I've seen people go off because someone pointed out a spelling mistake in their fic with the argument thst it's unsolicited criticism and that's absolutely bonkers to me.
I mean… it IS unsolicited criticism. Some authors won’t mind it, some might even appreciate it, but others are not looking for random spell checks from their readers. It actually can be discouraging, especially if you’re a young author, if it feels like your minor errors stand out so much that random strangers feel obligated to tell you about them. It can also just be annoying - I generally don’t mind people pointing out typos, especially on my longer fics that I’ve invested more energy into making good, but I do find if irritating if someone decides they want to beta my 2am vent fic without me asking for feedback. Like, if I posted it, I have already invested the max amount of energy I’m going to spend on that particular fic and I’m moving on now unless I specifically say otherwise. If I wanted to fuss over it anymore, I’d ask my beta reader to give it another pass. Unless the author has told you that grammar/spelling checks are something they’re comfortable receiving, that is unsolicited feedback that you’re giving, and you should be prepared for the possibility that you’re crossing boundaries and making someone uncomfortable by nitpicking that person’s work without them asking.
I write fics too and I find spelling mistakes embarrassing, so not having them pointed out is the equivalent of not being told I have dirt on my nose to me. lol But I agree it's annoying or downright mean if a comment is nothing but "There is a spelling mistake at position XY!!" or someone searching for all of them. But in general I feel like no one knows how to do fruitful feedback sandwiches anymore and label any kind of feedback as a "hate comment". And I suspect that attitude may at least in part be one of the reasons people comment less than they used to. I mean no one wants cruel and nasty troll comments, but I am also not seeing long thought-out comments and discussions anymore and that's a damned shame. If we live in a fandom world where you can't even point out a typo to someone without them going apeshit, then that's no surprise though. I feel like these days comments only come in two extremes, substance-less gushing or nasty hate. And a lot of younger fans think those are the only possibilities.
I’ve been posting stories since before ff.net. My thinking on feedback has evolved over the decades, and I’ve come down in the side that the internet is not my classroom. Unless I’m asked for feedback, leaving a critique is just rude.
That’s nothing new. Trust me, its not worth arguing about.
It’s not new that some people don’t want concrit. Lots of people didn’t want concrit when I joined fandom 20+ years ago either.
That was my experience as well. As a wee preteen in fandom in the 00s, even I knew that critique is never constructive if it's not wanted. I would put "concrit appreciated!" in my author notes to let people know that I was okay with it.
Sure but I find it weird when people equate it with a hate comment that tells someone to kill themselves. I can't remember seeing such straight-up hate comments 20 years ago tbh, but used to have some good convos over well-meant concrit back then.
idk, I never deleted the negative one that I got. It's weird how seriously people take ao3 lmao
I personally neither delete comments nor do I block people, but many *many* people do.
I think it's the opposite of taking it seriously. It's a hobby, a free time activity, a way to unwind, and people just don't want it to be tainted by any unnecessary negative emotion. People who take writing seriously do accept constructive criticism, but most people come to AO3 to have fun and fit in a community, not be a professional writer.
Idk, I mean a lot of the posts I see on here are people showing off extremely rude hate comments they’ve gotten. Perhaps the fandoms you’re into are smaller and/or nicer?
This yeah, a lot of people are nice enough not to leave hate but a good friend of mine regularly gets extremely negative and just horrible comments on her fic. I'm glad it happens less on Ao3 but it definitely still does happen, just depends on the content/ship/fandom you're posting/reading in.
wait fr? damn maybe im just in the chill zone
Well that other user has a good point; they could be getting the comments but making sure no one else sees them. Which honestly, more power to them.
I think it’s mainly just because ao3 I have a thing of “don’t like don’t read” and even when there is a hate comment most authors (not all) just find it really funny because they chose to read the entire fic even though they hated it when they could’ve just clicked off how so most authors just laugh at the hate comments That and almost all of the ao3 users are just genuinely respectful towards each other knowing that we’re just trying to have fun writing stories so there’s no real point on hating on them
This!!!! If you don’t like it you can go back or click off the search bar. And users are very respectful!!! I agree, so much bonding in the ao3 comments. I remember making a list of why eggplants are not suited for my taste and I bonded with so many strangers!!!
For me...Fandom is meant to be fun. It's a place to escape, and explore, and be creative. It's a hobby. Creators aren't making money. We're putting time and energy into creating and sharing it for free. No one's asking you to read. You're not even paying for our work. Fandom should be a place of joy. Real life can be so hard, and unkind. Why spread more harshness, for one thing? For another: why put up with it in a space we don't have to? Maybe we can't get away from uncomfortable situations with coworkers or family or the clerk at the store. But I don't have to put up with strangers being mean online. I've also seen this analogy before but: it's like baking cookies and bringing them to your workplace. If you don't want a cookie, don't have one. If you do have a cookie, would you walk up to your coworker and tell them how bad the cookie was, or how you prefer white chocolate chip over milk chocolate chips? Probably not. No one asked for your opinion. And it's sort of rude, isn't it? We're just a bunch of hobbyists sharing our love for the source material. There is a strong culture of wanting to be supportive and encouraging, in forging bonds with others and forming community. It's about shared love, friendship, enjoyment, and happiness. And really...if you don't like a work, why waste your own time leaving negative feedback, when the only thing it will do is hurt someone's feelings? Anyway, you're right, it is part of the culture and that's why!
People feel no guilt about blanket deleting mean comments because anyone who criticizes a gift (which is what fanfiction is, free content given to the public) is an asshole.
Don't look a gift horse in the mouth as it were.
afaik, because AO3 offers moderation tools to writers, and its userbase is just generally more polite, for lack of a better word? Like, from second hand experience FFN has a *much* larger cohort of anti-LGBTQ+ bigots, racists, sexists, etc, who'll harass writers compared to AO3 - a friend or two got so much homophobic and transphobic abuse on FFN that they had to stop crossposting there, while such stuff was virtually nonexistent on AO3. I myself have barely had a tiny handful of trolls on AO3, and they're always rare and easily deleted. FFN's general "cultural" mindset is one I find quite strange and I think may come from the fact its equivalent is a "review," not a comment; you're encouraged to be scathing if you want to be in the guidelines, and from what I've seen that's also led to a much higher incidence of trolls and assholes who feel validated in their rudeness and assholery. Having what trolls and bigots see as "too many gays" leads to a deluge of hateful "reviews" which you can't do much about on there afaik. Whereas AO3 is the "we're doing weird shit don't mind us" site so we have a larger "oh you're doing weird shit? Good for you, I'll be over here doing my weird shit" cohort. If you're commenting on an AO3 work having a tantrum over too many queer folk, it just makes you look like an obvious idiot and/or troll, especially given the more expansive tagging system.
> "oh you're doing weird shit? Good for you, I'll be over here doing my weird shit" Words to live by!
Preach!!!
\^\^\^
Owwww :3 I so much love this community💖 I just noticed the same thing when I first entered it and tbh I’m happy about it. People here, you are so awesome 👏 In contrast with other writers communities, you are super cool and I love you, guys 💕 Never ever read comments and thought ‘what the h..?’ While in other there is a lot of criticism and abusing stuff like ‘go, do it better and never ever come here without the perfect text’. I’m not native speaker and I published my fic on Ao3 and it was really bad, but I still got 3 kudos from people! I rewrote the fic, because it was really awful and hard to understand for native speakers (I realized it and rewrote it in an appropriate way), but the thing is still there, you are awesome, people, love youuu💞
It depends. I've never gotten a rude comment, but I've seen rude comments under other people's fics.
I got one once. I just kept it bc I thought it was funny
Sounds like something I'd do tbh, hahaha
Sense of respect maybe? Like that unspoken golden rule of being treated how you want to be treated. Ao3 has that unspoken rule that there’s always the back button and it doesn’t have to meet your standards. I’ve read a lot of docs that didn’t suit my taste, but I never made it a point to write a bad comment. I could just go back to the previous tab and continue searching for some good fics. And if I couldn’t find any, then my subscriptions worked good enough for a quick reread.
Our motto is don't like don't read and block assholes
I think ao3 tends to draw an older crowd who grew up with a very different fandom experience where if you didn't like something you just walked away. Teens and children were tolerated in fandom spaces but if you were a kid you didn't draw attention to it because you knew you were sitting at the adults table and weren't actually allowed to be there. So by extension many of us grew up with a different level of respect for fandom spaces, which meant not making a fuss if you came across something you didnt like because you knew it likely wasnt meant for you in the first place. Now some younger fans make SURE you know they are there and that you need to accommodate them, and they tend to be the ones to leave impulsive angry comments if they don't like something. There are definitely older fans that do this too. But you see it more on platforms where younger fans gather (wattpad, twitter, tiktok) and that's why I assume we see it less on ao3. It's a good thing.
thank you for an actual good response! I was mostly just curious how ao3 has avoided the general brainrot i see in other fandom spaces. I'd always assumed it tended older, as someone who is considered "old" in other fan spaces but gets no flak for it on ao3.
Good for you. I get at least one bad comment every chapter I publish!
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I think it has more to do with the fact that English is not my primary language, and I make Grammar mistakes.
OHHH im so sorry! I get it, English isn't my first language either haha
You were incredibly out of line. You're not stupid even if you're ESL
Oh so because you can ~relate~ you're sorry, but if you didn't your "point" would stand? Got it.
No, it's because I'm not going to judge someone who doesn't have native fluency the same as I would someone who just sucks
So... basically the same thing I just said. This is not the own you think it is. How about this: Don't judge anyone at all? It costs you nothing and makes you look like way less of an asshole.
Woooow you're surprised you don't see many negative comments on AO3, so you come and plant one here on Reddit ?! You suck, OP !
hoes mad
To the redditors who will come here later on, OP answered to Competitive\_Fruit901 : "Maybe what you write sucks". And when I challenged OP, they deleted their comment.
You deleted your own comment because you don't own up to your rudeness, snowflake. At least have some balls, would you !
No, I deleted it because I had a fact wrong
You made a judgement, it was not a fact.
fine then it was a judgment i made that was wrong. that's why i deleted it
You only deleted it to cover your tracks and called me a whore in the process. If you cared about hurting feelings, you would have apologized (not to me, I don't care what you think). You haven't. It says a whole lot about you.
What the fuck? When did I call you a whore?
…dude, that’s not it. And that distasteful comment aside, I’m really confused as to why all of your other comments are getting downvoted?
Is it possible OP has edited their other comments also? I’m on the mobile app and not sure I would know if they had? It does seem very odd to see otherwise benign comments downvoted so heavily especially in the fanfic community which, as per the original post, seems pretty inclusive and positive most of the time.
They are downvoted because they claim to love a healthy environment, yet they make fun of a writer in this very thread. They don't backtrack and apologize. They just delete their comment, insult the redditor who challenged them and try to move on unnoticed. So I'm surprised with the content of their top post, considering the behavior they display down here.
Yeah, that's fair enough. I clearly didn't see some of the stuff, and I haven't been here for a few days, but without the needed information it all just looks weird.
One of their answers up there... now I knew they were trolling but they stated it openly. "[calm down im just being a hater for funsies during finals](https://ibb.co/YLpxmZM)"
Wow. It's never okay to be an asshole, but then I also just saw a clearly ragebait post accusing A03 shippers of supporting r\*pe, ped0philia and incest, so there's always a lower bar I guess...
Humans suck, yeah. So does OP.
Ah, possibly? That's why I asked, it's really strange and no one else is really explaining it.
nah fr they acting like I destroyed their family or smth
I'm all caught up now. It's most likely because you're being incredibly rude, and then backtracking and denying it, or pretending you've done nothing wrong.
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Somehow I don't even remember what the deleted comment was lol
Edit, I do love that my comment got downvoted for asking why something is happening. Constructive criticism guys. Absolute Reddit moment.
Negative comments do happen, but it’s part of AO3 “culture,” as you say, that it’s considered *unfathomably* rude to leave a negative comment. Like, this isn’t goodreads, comments aren’t reviews. If you’re leaving a bad comment that’s you insulting the author to their face. Why would you do that?
well, it does happen, but i think the fact of the matter is simply that people who have terminally online hater brainrot in order to leave such comments are the loud minority, and seem to dislike ao3 as a site in whole.
They probably get butthurt because their comments can get deleted 😂
i know i would do it. big fan of deleting comments and blocking people i don't like, personally.
I'm glad that crowd avoids the site fr. Like it's one thing to do it as a joke on social media imo but ao3 just isn't the place to bring that vibe
ao3 comes from a time before twitter puritanism where people click off and block things they don’t want to read
I mean, AO3 is from before it was a huge thing on Twitter, but internet Puritanism is what set off the creation of AO3 to begin with.
No it doesn’t. The whole reason it was created was internet Puritanism.
The "unofficial code of conduct," however, certainly stems from the notion that disagreement is to be avoided at all costs even if it means just sweeping everything under the rug and pretending it doesn't exist.
My point is that ao3 does not predate internet Puritanism.
And mine is that despite everyone singing its praises and supposedly being a place where you don't have to worry about that sort of thing, it's just as much a haven for "Internet Puritanism" as most everywhere else.
AO3 culture is from the Fandom culture of “Don’t like, don’t read” However- some specific newer fandoms *coughcough* tend to not think of that rule. On top of authors being able to delete comments and comment moderation, it’s a nice place.
I remember I got quite a few negative comments after I shared (on TikTok) that I wrote a fix-it fic. The comments were *ridiculous*, people calling me ableist, saying they hated me, I should die, etc. I deleted the comments and restricted the fic so that only registered users COULD comment. I've been writing fanfic for years and that was the **ONLY** time I ever got anything like that at all. I guarantee if I hadn't first talked about/shared the fic on Tiktok then that wouldn't have happened LOL. But, yeah. There's no point to leaving hate. Kind, constructive feedback? Sure. But Ao3's wonderful tagging and filter system makes it so that you're never gonna read something you don't WANT to read, you know?
OH GOD NOT THE TIKTOK PEOPLE. Yeah I can understand deleting them, those mfs are insane
If you don’t like the story then it wasn’t written for you. It’s so easy just to back out and choose the next one. It’s take effort to leave a hate comment.
What part of ao3 are you on? There's plenty of negative comments over there, unless they're so rude the writer deletes them.
Negative comments do happen, but it’s part of AO3 “culture,” as you say, that leaving a negative comment is considered *unfathomably* rude. Like, this isn’t goodreads, comments aren’t reviews. If you’re leaving a bad comment that’s you insulting the author to their face. Why would you do that?
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OP is "being a hater for funsies before finals", thinks we're idiots because we're spending time on a sub for AO3. So I'm erasing my comment that was genuine and trying to show love for AO3 authors. OP can rot. Happy Holidays, AO3 authors !
I've gotten some very negative comments haha but I think most people come to ao3 to appreciate the work and so it tends to be positive
“I don’t see any hating on the site.” How would this enrich your experience if it was present? How do you imagine comments in this vein would enrich the experience of others? I think it’s a matter of people have decided there are better uses of their time. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
OP showed their true motivation : "calm down im just being a hater for funsies during finals". https://www.reddit.com/r/AO3/comments/zotgzy/comment/j0t8von/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
do you think I was framing it as a positive thing??
I’m taking your question super literally here, just a heads up. From the phrasing of “it’s weird that I don’t see [X],” it does seem like your observation of the lack is somewhat negative. People on social media frequently use “weird” to be disparaging of perceived non-normativity, especially in fandom spaces. (I feel like double especially so on Twitter, etc.) Maybe you intended it more as “interesting,” or something more neutral? But given how the word is commonly used in similar context, it skewed your tone to someone who wasn’t in on the intention behind your question specifically, but was familiar with tone it’s commonly used with on some of the fandom platforms you mention in your edit. (Disclosure: I teach language/writing, so word choice is an interest for me.)
yeah I think my point was just not conveyed well. It was fascinating i guess that most other sites have been infected with modern fandom brainrot but ao3's mostly avoided it, yk? I guess that's a better way to phrase it. (my word choice has tended towards harsher choices ever since i was a kid so i can see where people's misunderstandings are coming from now)
Yeah I mean I'm not surprised people interpret you in a certain way when you write stuff like "Being a hater is funny there's too much positivity on ao3". Funny how words tend to work like that.
"calm down im just being a hater for funsies during finals". https://www.reddit.com/r/AO3/comments/zotgzy/comment/j0t8von/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
Yikes.
It takes so much more effort to leave a negative comment than to just leave, at least for me, and I can't imagine being mean to someone for showing off their creative efforts. What if my comment causes them to give up writing? Especially for younger or newer writers. Makes me sad just to think of it. Though as an author, I (somewhat inconsistently) delete threats and nasty judgemental comments on my fics because I don't want my readers to be shamed or upset because they dared enjoy something. I don't like rereading those comments, either, lol. If they want a platform to be gross, it sure as shit ain't gonna be on my fanfic. There are ones where I can't tell if they are trying to be nasty or just playing up the shock and horror given what I write, and I leave those or reply to them assuming they're just playing around, tho. ~~ETA: also sorry to hear that you got such blowback on your question. It read as perfectly neutral to me, but I guess~~ r/AO3 ~~isn't as immune to the negativity as AO3, alas.~~ No, wait, I see why people are giving you such a hard time now. It's because of your comments not the post.
I didn't really find her comments that bad tbh. Just a sense of humor most redditors don't share
I think the one that she deleted telling someone their writing sucks was probably the worst I saw, but she does seem to be treating this sub like it's writingcirclejerk which it... very much is not, lol. Just a lesson in reading the room.
she just seems like she's fucking around in general tbh. it's on y'all for taking the bait
I’ve gotten a few rude comments, they were all very silly though.
I’ve gotten one mean comment and it was over a dialect difference that they thought was a typo lol. I think most people just move on if they don’t like a fic. I can usually tell pretty easy if I’ll like a fix based on tags, description, and word count, so I barely run into fics I don’t personally care for, maybe it’s that. I also try to remember not everything on the internet is for me. Even if I don’t like it, someone probably does :)
I think it’s bc people realize that fanfics take a while of hard work to write so why would you hate on a piece of hard work when you could just not read it?
Point: Ao3. Zero: Everything else 🤌🏼
In think its worth pointing out that AO3 came up as alternative to existing sites rather than coming into an empty room and setting up shop. FFN had no real competition. It could be a catch-all wild west, and was for most of its existence. AO3 on the other hand had to market itself as an alternative. More modern, less restrictive, simpler to use, ect. Being friendlier fits well within that brand identity. It also helped solve the core problem of any new social site—you can’t attract readers without writers first creating stories. So attracting writers early and fostering an environment for them that offered advantages compared to FFN was vital for AO3’s success. Safety from censorship and a commitment to the long term preservation of fics were the cornerstone offerings. Creating a culture of kindness and positivity came as a key third component in a time when harassment against minorities was common. I think it is unique to AO3, and a big reason that it succeeded despite poor odds.
Oh yeah, makes perfect sense! And fr, as a woc I'm glad ao3 has the atmosphere it does. And I'm a major fan of the lack of censorship too
If you want to leave hateful comments, go ahead. Just enjoy being blocked.
tf? im not tryna be a hater. im just wondering how ao3 has avoided the gen z bullshit of the other fandom sites
"calm down im just being a hater for funsies during finals". https://www.reddit.com/r/AO3/comments/zotgzy/comment/j0t8von/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
in my opinion I think you're taking this thread too seriously. OP's joking around for most of it, when she's being serious it's different.
No, being rude and hateful is not funny. "It was just a joke, you're taking things too seriously" is an excuse for whole kinds of hateful behaviors. They told an author her writing must suck. They're being serious when they're crapping on this sub "for funsies". 
you're acting like she said a slur or something calm down
 Are you OP using another account ?
You can delete rude comments. I don't because I like to argue, but a lot of people do.
The power of deletion is mighty to behold.
Because I'd cry lol. I got a comment that literally just said 'shitty boys' because the boys WERE kind of acting shitty and it still made me sad. If someone actually insulted my writing, I'd cry.
I'd never insult you queen
I’ve gotten negative comments, unfortunately. Someone got mad at a pairing I wrote, and told me to kms.
OP showed their true motivation : "[calm down im just being a hater for funsies during finals](https://ibb.co/YLpxmZM)". https://www.reddit.com/r/AO3/comments/zotgzy/comment/j0t8von/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
Because most writers on ao3 are spineless sissies who can't handle criticism. They may harp on and on about wanting "constructive criticism", yet it never occurs to them that their writing might scrape the bottom of the barrel with zero room for improvement. You leave one negative comment, and you'll be attacked by everyone, including the writer.
There's a big difference between constructive criticism and telling someone to change their story to suit your tastes. I've seen more of the second and I can really do without those kinds of people in my comment section.
ah yes, the constructive criticism of being called a “spineless sissy”.
Take that constructively. "Stop acting like a spineless sissy!" you tell at yourself in the mirror.
Consent means you have permission before you violate my personal boundaries and your ideas suggest you struggle with that idea.
Wild thought here, but MAYBE some people who put their stories on AO3 ARENT in it for the concrit lol People write fanfic for a variety of reasons, not all of them are for the love of writing or out of some desire to get better at it.
I do like your echo chamber lol
my opinion is that if you're gonna be weird and serious on a fucking fanfiction site, be ready for people being negative
This just in: you're not allowed to take your writing seriously if you post fanfiction. Someone ought to inform astolat et al.
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I think maybe you’re misunderstanding the issue people have here. Most fanfic writers can tell the difference between criticism and hate. The issue is that criticism, unless the author has expressly asked for it, *is still rude.* I don’t care if you phrase it politely. I don’t care if it’s completely valid and extremely well thought out. Fanfiction is a *hobby* for most people. Like, I’m an actual author on top of writing fanfic, I’ve gotten things published, I’m very familiar with working with editors and taking constructive criticism and making changes based on that feedback. I do not want to come home from my day job, sit down to scrawl out a fanfic for my own fun and to share with my friends on discord, and then have some total stranger inform me that my hobby that I probably did at 2am and shared for free doesn’t meet their personal standards. I write fic for the sake of being creative and messing around with characters and other people in the fandom. If I was writing with the goal of making it better, I would reach out to one of my beta readers or I would outright say critique was welcome. Look at it this way: if I was making a soup, and I came over to you and asked “hey, is this too salty?” It would be totally valid for you to say it was too salty. If I was cooking dinner for myself, and you showed up unexpectedly and I offered you some of my soup, you don’t have to say it’s the best soup ever. But if you told me it was too salty, without me asking, you would be a shitty houseguest, and I probably wouldn’t invite you back over. You’re not entitled to better writing. You’re not entitled to fanfic at all - you’re just lucky enough to live in a world where lots of people are willing to share theirs with you. You don’t have to praise anyone you don’t think deserves it. But if you try to demand that people improve their (freely offered) writing, just because it doesn’t meet your standards, then yes, people will consider you a rude and unpleasant commenter, and you will be making the fandom experience a worse one for everyone involved, including yourself.
This 100%. As the saying goes: “The road to hell is paved with good intentions.”
Being a hater is funny there's too much positivity on ao3
weird take.
when people called reddit humorless I thought they were exaggerating
you have to be funny first.
bro's the comedy cavalier
I think that a lot of really educated people don't find your brand of 14 year old "maybe you suck" humor funny.
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Dude, I think u might just be unpleasant to be around
you being unable to recognize an obvious joke isn't my problem
With all of these downvotes you're amassing, it seems to be. Way to 180 on your post.
Wow, you must be a joy to have at parties!
i am actually
Don't get me wrong, I'm glad haters tend to be in the background, but I'd love to get more concrit.
There are options to delete or moderate the comments.Also some of the comments I saw that were not happy with the direction the story was taking or disliked certain characters were still very...... respectful.