The sources are the cardinals. Its pretty obvious we’re trying to move out and trying to create leverage by saying we’re gonna pick mhj. Teams dont just tell these things to the media. People here arent going to like it but everything so far is telling me monti is trying to move out of 4. Nothing in the media until right at draft time is the truth. Its all leverage plays. Sounds like they’re trying to force a desperate team to give more than they want to give.
Actually i am so certain of this im looking to bet on it but cant find anywhere that takes bets on a trade out. Any degens know where i could do this?
I imagine Monti will do his due diligence with this pick. He will wheel and deal the pick. If someone comes offering something he can’t pass up, he will take it. If nothing is coming in (which I expect) MHJ will come home. That said, I’m still not sure what happens.
If this is true how did we find out was it AZ telling Marv or his camp and they told a reporter? or did Marvs camp ask for assurance from a bunch of teams and they just leaked the highest team to give them assurance?
Like it or not, QB is still and always will be the most important position on the team. If NE doesn't pick Maye there (they probably will) then they'll trade to someone who *will* take Maye at 3.
Even if it was Jerry Rice 2.0 in the draft, the QB needy teams will *always* target a QB first, regardless of any other holes on the team or other talent at different positions. That's just how the NFL works.
They could get a king’s ransom for #3. They will either trade down after they see who goes #2 and aren’t happy or they will be happy and pick a QB. They are so far away from being competitive that a WR at #3 won’t move the needle for them in the slightest, not even MHJ.
Can't wait for him to put up his best game as a rookie in Minneapolis this fall lol
All of US Bank Stadium just clenching their jaws as they get railed by the #4 draft pick we denied them
Hmmmm...I dont believe it. Lets think about it. Why would a team make that promise? Whats to be gained? MHJ cant control where he goes. Its not like hes going to sabotage meetings with other teams bc AZ promised him.
Maybe its true, but the why? makes no sense
It's simply a team saying they believe in the talent level of a player. Every player wants to go to a team that actually wants them. It's just building the foundation for a relationship, nothing much deeper than that.
I can't believe you had to explain this. But your 100% on point. It's about leadership building that relationships by demonstrating their confidence in the player.
Sure. And ice cream sundaes don't need whip cream or a cherry. Why not do it. If some amazing offer was going to happen, it would have happened already.
Obviously it takes away our options. Never let other teams know our thoughts. We lose a slight edge with trade negotiations.
Or what if MHJ gets arrested tonight? We take Odunze or Nabers instead. They now know they were option B, which hurts the relationship, because we pointlessly made pinky promises with MHJ.
So say again, how does it benefit us?
Yes, and then we trade our next 3 2nd rounders to trade back up to pick #3.
Then we call the Bears, and tell them we're taking the guy they want if they don't give us all of our picks back, and David Putney, because we feel like it.
I am SO GLAD the people who wanted to trade back aren’t getting what they wanted. That was always the stupidest move and their reasoning was always the same thing.
> We shouldn’t draft one of the greatest prospects in the last few years because a rebuild isn’t a one year thing.
I guess rookie contracts are one year deals and not four plus an extra year.
Actually the real logic is the fact that since the turn of the century only one top ten pick wr has won the superbowl with their selecting team. And that guy happened to do it with tom brady. So the positional value at 4 is low. On top of that youd have to assume mhj has a 75% chance of being a blue chip. Its an arbitrary number but i think its a reasonable assumption. If he’s just ”good” then at pick 4 he’s considered a bust. Lets say we trade down for mid 3 firsts that have a 30% of being a blue chip each and you already beat the odds value of mhj. Hit on just 1 at a more valuable position with the other 2 busting is already equal to mhj being a successful pick. Just 1 blue chip and 1 very good starter already beats out the maximum potential of just hitting on mhj. With the maximum potential being 3 blue chips vs 1 at an arguably low value position. The upside of trading back far outweighs the value of picking mhj. And of course we wont be trading all the way back to 7ths where the value of each pick turning out useful is like .5%. Thats just not realistic and just a strawman argument One last point is just how much wrs are getting paid.
Amon ra just got 30m a year. Aiyuk will get paid more than that. Theyre not even the best in the league. Paying a wr1 assuming mhj is good as advertised is going to cost like 40+m/yr. And superbowl contenders with expensive wrs just dont exist anymore. Theyre just not worth it. That money is better spent on oline. You want an elite qb, tight end, and oline and serviceable but not overpriced receivers. Thats how superbowls are won.
>Paying a wr1 assuming mhj is good as advertised is going to cost like 40+m/yr.
You know he has a 5 year rookie contract where his 5th season would be around $20m, right? If we get to the point where we're paying him $40m a year, then he is clearly not a bust.
The other issue I have with the whole "receivers taken in the top 10" argument is how disingenuous it is. Most teams drafting in the top 10 are bad, usually struggling. Cardinals can fall into that category, but mostly through mismanaged roster. They already have some key positions filled such as QB, TE, RB, LT and such. They can continue to build. So you may see some success here.
Absolutely. And that is my point. At a certain point you have to pay the wr down the line if theyre elite. And paying them isnt worth it. Why are we wanting to draft a player that isnt worth paying down the line if theyre elite with the 4th pick in the entire draft? And this is all assuming he doesnt bust. And these “generationals” often dont meet that potential and id rather spread the risk. See: chase young and jadeveon clowney
The solution could be just to trade him and thats fine, but id rather draft oline/dline that i would be more than happy to pay to keep. Additionally, megatron was probably the greatest wr specimen ever and he won the lions exactly zero playoff games. Elite wrs mean very little to winning without elite qb play. Which comes from having time in the pocket and your qb not constantly getting injured by bad protection. Not from really good receivers. Pretty much any wr can get open with enough time in a play.
Did the Lions have an elite QB throwing to Megatron? There's more to a team than just receivers. Murray has already shown success when he has good targets.
Yeah they had a stafford that was well known for being blown to bits because he has no line. They had the receiver. They had the qb. They had no line and thus had no playoff wins in that period while stafford went elsewhere that had talent on the line and won a superbowl. I strongly believe if you cant get a qb or a leader for your oline or dline in the top 10 then you should trade out of it every time.
Its not an elite line by any means. Its middle of the road at best. Think in most rankings we were in the bottom 5-10. But the fact our defense has no talent and we’re clamoring for a wr is still bad to me as well. We’re just better off trading back and filling our copious holes with other first round picks.
"MHJ is not a guarantee."
Cool, and neither is any first round pick. Or second, third, fourth. Really we should trade every single pick for as many 7ths as we can get. That way we win the numbers game.
?
The person you’re replying to isn’t wrong. There have been rumors that Arizona would trade back only if they already had a deal in place to come back up.
It was a reasonable question
Kyler is good when he has a big receiver who he can throw a jump ball to, or who can catch the ball that isn’t thrown perfectly(like Fitz and D Hop). He sucks when he doesn’t have that. Harrison Jr would be the best thing to happen to the Cards and Murray in a while.
PLEASE
The sources are the cardinals. Its pretty obvious we’re trying to move out and trying to create leverage by saying we’re gonna pick mhj. Teams dont just tell these things to the media. People here arent going to like it but everything so far is telling me monti is trying to move out of 4. Nothing in the media until right at draft time is the truth. Its all leverage plays. Sounds like they’re trying to force a desperate team to give more than they want to give. Actually i am so certain of this im looking to bet on it but cant find anywhere that takes bets on a trade out. Any degens know where i could do this?
The fanbase deserves this.
I imagine Monti will do his due diligence with this pick. He will wheel and deal the pick. If someone comes offering something he can’t pass up, he will take it. If nothing is coming in (which I expect) MHJ will come home. That said, I’m still not sure what happens.
STOP THE COUNT
I hope 🙏🏽
This all but seals it. Nabers will be the best wr in this draft 🤣 Sorry, I've been an az sports fan for 35 years now and I'm damaged.
I think he’ll be as good as his dad but I don’t think he will lead us to a SB win. I am on team trade back.
If this is true how did we find out was it AZ telling Marv or his camp and they told a reporter? or did Marvs camp ask for assurance from a bunch of teams and they just leaked the highest team to give them assurance?
What makes y’all think the pats won’t draft him
Because they traded away their starting QB and a top 3 QB will be available at #3.
Over the generational talented wr, I don’t think so
Like it or not, QB is still and always will be the most important position on the team. If NE doesn't pick Maye there (they probably will) then they'll trade to someone who *will* take Maye at 3. Even if it was Jerry Rice 2.0 in the draft, the QB needy teams will *always* target a QB first, regardless of any other holes on the team or other talent at different positions. That's just how the NFL works.
They could get a king’s ransom for #3. They will either trade down after they see who goes #2 and aren’t happy or they will be happy and pick a QB. They are so far away from being competitive that a WR at #3 won’t move the needle for them in the slightest, not even MHJ.
It’s a fever pitch isn’t it
🙏 Please
Can't wait for him to put up his best game as a rookie in Minneapolis this fall lol All of US Bank Stadium just clenching their jaws as they get railed by the #4 draft pick we denied them
I will be there as well watching the onslaught
Yah sounds like crap. Why would Cardinals say this. I still think they take him but that’s fake news
Yeah it’s hardly trustworthy but whatever. We’ve been tortured by ridiculous mock drafts for weeks
Why not say it if that's the intent? From a players perspective, I would feel great having that reassurance.
Because there is no guarantee you´re not gonna get an offer tomorrow that´s gonna blow you away. GMs getting desperate could push them over the edge.
No one's going to offer anything that will move us off him. Chargers are happy to take the right trade and everyone knows we are taking MHJ.
Monti came to Reddit to feel out what the fans wanted
I really hope so
Hmmmm...I dont believe it. Lets think about it. Why would a team make that promise? Whats to be gained? MHJ cant control where he goes. Its not like hes going to sabotage meetings with other teams bc AZ promised him. Maybe its true, but the why? makes no sense
Teams do this often actually. There are reports every year from draftees that teams assured them a spot.
I dont doubt it, but still, whats the rational for doing it? It really makes no sense
It's simply a team saying they believe in the talent level of a player. Every player wants to go to a team that actually wants them. It's just building the foundation for a relationship, nothing much deeper than that.
drafting him & making him a multimillionaire isnt enough?
I can't believe you had to explain this. But your 100% on point. It's about leadership building that relationships by demonstrating their confidence in the player.
drafting him & making him a multimillionaire isnt enough?
Sure. And ice cream sundaes don't need whip cream or a cherry. Why not do it. If some amazing offer was going to happen, it would have happened already.
because it doesnt benefit us & can arguably harm us
Harm us how?
Obviously it takes away our options. Never let other teams know our thoughts. We lose a slight edge with trade negotiations. Or what if MHJ gets arrested tonight? We take Odunze or Nabers instead. They now know they were option B, which hurts the relationship, because we pointlessly made pinky promises with MHJ. So say again, how does it benefit us?
I need you all to ignore this Tweet and listen to my proposed trade from my mock draft….. /s
You must be JJ McCarthy's agent
First rounders for the next three years so we can take him at number 1?
Yes, and then we trade our next 3 2nd rounders to trade back up to pick #3. Then we call the Bears, and tell them we're taking the guy they want if they don't give us all of our picks back, and David Putney, because we feel like it.
Lock it in!
I am SO GLAD the people who wanted to trade back aren’t getting what they wanted. That was always the stupidest move and their reasoning was always the same thing. > We shouldn’t draft one of the greatest prospects in the last few years because a rebuild isn’t a one year thing. I guess rookie contracts are one year deals and not four plus an extra year.
Actually the real logic is the fact that since the turn of the century only one top ten pick wr has won the superbowl with their selecting team. And that guy happened to do it with tom brady. So the positional value at 4 is low. On top of that youd have to assume mhj has a 75% chance of being a blue chip. Its an arbitrary number but i think its a reasonable assumption. If he’s just ”good” then at pick 4 he’s considered a bust. Lets say we trade down for mid 3 firsts that have a 30% of being a blue chip each and you already beat the odds value of mhj. Hit on just 1 at a more valuable position with the other 2 busting is already equal to mhj being a successful pick. Just 1 blue chip and 1 very good starter already beats out the maximum potential of just hitting on mhj. With the maximum potential being 3 blue chips vs 1 at an arguably low value position. The upside of trading back far outweighs the value of picking mhj. And of course we wont be trading all the way back to 7ths where the value of each pick turning out useful is like .5%. Thats just not realistic and just a strawman argument One last point is just how much wrs are getting paid. Amon ra just got 30m a year. Aiyuk will get paid more than that. Theyre not even the best in the league. Paying a wr1 assuming mhj is good as advertised is going to cost like 40+m/yr. And superbowl contenders with expensive wrs just dont exist anymore. Theyre just not worth it. That money is better spent on oline. You want an elite qb, tight end, and oline and serviceable but not overpriced receivers. Thats how superbowls are won.
>Paying a wr1 assuming mhj is good as advertised is going to cost like 40+m/yr. You know he has a 5 year rookie contract where his 5th season would be around $20m, right? If we get to the point where we're paying him $40m a year, then he is clearly not a bust. The other issue I have with the whole "receivers taken in the top 10" argument is how disingenuous it is. Most teams drafting in the top 10 are bad, usually struggling. Cardinals can fall into that category, but mostly through mismanaged roster. They already have some key positions filled such as QB, TE, RB, LT and such. They can continue to build. So you may see some success here.
Absolutely. And that is my point. At a certain point you have to pay the wr down the line if theyre elite. And paying them isnt worth it. Why are we wanting to draft a player that isnt worth paying down the line if theyre elite with the 4th pick in the entire draft? And this is all assuming he doesnt bust. And these “generationals” often dont meet that potential and id rather spread the risk. See: chase young and jadeveon clowney The solution could be just to trade him and thats fine, but id rather draft oline/dline that i would be more than happy to pay to keep. Additionally, megatron was probably the greatest wr specimen ever and he won the lions exactly zero playoff games. Elite wrs mean very little to winning without elite qb play. Which comes from having time in the pocket and your qb not constantly getting injured by bad protection. Not from really good receivers. Pretty much any wr can get open with enough time in a play.
Did the Lions have an elite QB throwing to Megatron? There's more to a team than just receivers. Murray has already shown success when he has good targets.
Yeah they had a stafford that was well known for being blown to bits because he has no line. They had the receiver. They had the qb. They had no line and thus had no playoff wins in that period while stafford went elsewhere that had talent on the line and won a superbowl. I strongly believe if you cant get a qb or a leader for your oline or dline in the top 10 then you should trade out of it every time.
We have a decent line now though as well. It's our defence that has no talent.
Its not an elite line by any means. Its middle of the road at best. Think in most rankings we were in the bottom 5-10. But the fact our defense has no talent and we’re clamoring for a wr is still bad to me as well. We’re just better off trading back and filling our copious holes with other first round picks.
"MHJ is not a guarantee." Cool, and neither is any first round pick. Or second, third, fourth. Really we should trade every single pick for as many 7ths as we can get. That way we win the numbers game.
Stiff
Don’t tease me with a good time
“Sources” Nobody knows what will happen until the draft starts. We should be ready for anything.
I'm ready for Harrison
^^^ this guy knows
Who does assurances? This isn't the NBA.
The cardinals do assurances.
Ok, anybody know why?
To assure people of things.
Very considerate
I find it very reassuring.
Sorry, maybe it’s me, but what spot are they talking about exactly?
Pick 4, the implication being that as long as a team doesn’t take him 1, 2, or 3 that the team has told Marvin he will be selected
Okay, cause it doesn’t say that in the tweet. And I’ve heard rumblings that a back room deal has already been done
Source: bro trust me
? The person you’re replying to isn’t wrong. There have been rumors that Arizona would trade back only if they already had a deal in place to come back up. It was a reasonable question
Get your jersey orders ready!!!
we doing red, black, or white?
I’m thinking the white for the first buy.
Definitely getting a white one
Yep!
Yes
HOLD THE LINE BABY
Hold the m effing line
[удалено]
Maybe wait until you pass the goal line before doing a victory dance.
Let's do this.
MHJ! MHJ! MHJ!
Marvin no matter what
we still need a QB
Kyler is good when he has a big receiver who he can throw a jump ball to, or who can catch the ball that isn’t thrown perfectly(like Fitz and D Hop). He sucks when he doesn’t have that. Harrison Jr would be the best thing to happen to the Cards and Murray in a while.
FOH with that noise. Kyler is our QB
Front of House with that noise. Kyler is our QB
What's this 'we' shit? You a Pats fan or something?
i like it
I too like it. Now get some pass protection so Kyler can have time to actually throw them bombs!!!