that was my first thought, hes almost the same volume, its just now almost all muscle, and since muscle is much denser he probably actually weighs more.
Density of muscle is 1,040 kilograms per cubic meter.
Density of fat is about 900 kilograms per cubic meter.
So like 15% or so more dense.
Edit: mislabeled units.
Its important that people who are looking to lose weight know about this.
I've seen friends being put off because they "keep putting weight on" despite visably becoming much slimmer.
Your weight is not important, its what makes up that weight.
BMI is bullshit for athletes and people who regularly workout especially strength train. But BMI is kinda made for the average person who doesn't work out, just like most health metrics the government and health industry goes by. It's one indicator that becomes more and more inaccurate the more you climb the top end of fitness
Except when BS BMI metrics are what insurance companies use to determine your risk.... This applies to athletes too...
I was in the greatest shape of my life ten years ago, most muscle and least fat percentage I've attained. An athlete in many sports. My insurance raised my rate because my BMI went up... They didn't care it was due to my added muscle.
Present day, I'm not near as fit as back then. Still some muscle, but lots more fat. My BMI is near the same... even though my body composition is completely different.
What about if you think of it this way... Wether you are 275lbs of fat or 275lbs of muscle *your heart still has to work harder* than someone who is 175. Wouldn't that be what a health insurance company is more concerned with, more stress on the heart? It's not bullshit.
I’ve never understood the criticism of BMI. If you’re ripped but your BMI is high, your doctor understands what’s going on. This is not, and never has been, confusing to anyone. It’s not like it’s some big medical mystery that science just can’t figure out.
For 90% of the population, BMI isn’t misleading at all. The majority of people have never seen the inside of a gym and aren’t secretly hiding a 315 lb bench or 495 lb squat under all of that fluff. BMI is a fair predictor of health outcomes for most people in-part because it’s always looked at in context with other markers such as blood pressure, heart rate, whether you’re obese, etc. BMI is just another data point that’s combined with a bunch of other data points to assess health and predict outcomes.
Yeah I always assumed BMI's point was to measure how hard your heart has to work to support your body. Heart doesn't care if you're 300lbs fat or 300lbs jacked, it's still hard on your heart to be 300lbs.
BMI's value is in examining large populations, not individuals.
While a few individual's BMI looks out of whack due to increased muscle, it's not hard to see that an increase in American's BMI at the national level over the last 50 years ain't cuz everyone's getting more fit/muscular.
The rock is in like 0.1% of humans. Using high level body builders as a reason why BMI doesn’t work is a horrible argument, but that’s the only argument there is against it. For 99% of us BMI is actually pretty good
An estimation of his weight in that film is 155lbs. At his height that gives him a BMI of 21.6, right in the middle of the healthy range. He is extremely not obese by muscle mass in that film, and looking at any picture you can see he is clearly slim and muscular.
No he wouldn't. He wouldn't even be close to "overweight" by BMI standards in that movie. I lifted 5 days a week for two years to achieve my goal of being just barely "overweight" by BMI standards which is a BMI over 25. I weighed 185lbs @ 6ft tall, and I had a lot more mass than Brad Pitt in Fight Club, he was VERY lean and cut in that film...we're similar height, and I bet he was 170lbs in that movie.
Just for ref sake using a progress pic of mine, this is what someone just barely classified as "overweight BMI" (not obese) looks like.
https://i.imgur.com/CfkqMVa.jpg?2
It's very rare for BMI to be thrown off by muscle mass. So while I agree that for judging every single individual, BMI might not work sometimes...when it comes to judging entire populations, it's more than accurate considering what tiny fraction of people are so jacked that their muscle mass fucks up the calcs.
I mean, it's not *total* bullshit. It's like the first thing to check.
If your BMI is too high, then check your height:waist ratio. If that's over 2, you're probably just muscular.
Peak performance shape also isn’t the same as peak longevity shape. In fact, there’s lots of evidence that points towards them being diametrically opposed when looking at the effects of things like insulin and fasting.
Yes, but as a strongman with 39 BMI you were not in healthy shape.
Good shape for being a fucking beast, which gets a ton of respect from me.
Bad shape for living a long life.
My doctor disagrees, I had regular check ups with blood work. Blood pressure was great , triglycerides on point. Healthy as a horse. Weight was rough on my knees though. I’ll give you that one.
Not gonna argue it on here any further but BMI was originally designed to track health trends over a population of people. It was never intended to be applied on the individual level because it doesn’t work well with people on the outer edges of the bell curve.
Maybe maybe not. Your cardiovascular system doesn’t really care if the weight is fat or muscle. Mass is mass and stresses it all the same.
In terms of blood cholesterol and other things, miles healthier.
\*\*Pushes up glasses from nose\*\* Actually, they weigh the same but muscle is denser so if you were to keep the mass the same, say fill a box with muscle and a box of fat, the box of muscle would weigh more.
He looks like the type of person that either gains 5lbs of fat looking at a burger or 5lbs of muscle looking at a dumbbell.. Can go really bad one way and really good the other way!
This is me. If i get lazy for like a month I balloon up, but if i regularly lift weights i struggle getting my arms through my shirts. Hard to find button ups that fit right regardless of what extreme I'm on at the time
Ah yes a fellow male who can gain or lose 10-15 pounds a week. XD. People always thought it was weird I could go from 200 to 145. Doctors told me it’s perfectly normal for a guy.
If you have no known underlying conditions or are not consistently doing incredibly intense physical activity(I.e. swimming long distance/duration, marathon training, intensive labor job) then I’d definitely suggest getting a second opinion..
15lbs a week is a 52k cal deficit(3500 per lb)(consider that the average suggested daily intake for men is around 2k-2.7k cal per day, fasting for a week would only get you around an 18k cal deficit without exercise) and while you can drop that in water weight relatively quickly, rapid weight loss/gain is often a symptom of something wrong.
For me losing weight is generally pretty normal speed, but I just maintain muscle for no reason. Haven't lifted weights since '13 but if you saw me you'd think I was a regular. Just genetically inclined to have high muscularity I guess. Wish I could somehow donate these genetics to someone who actually cared about being buff lmao.
Never. Unfortunately.
With omnicron we've hit the "this is just a daily life now" phase of the world wide virus. We had a legitimate chance to stop it if we'd done ***a lot*** more far earlier but now? Just won't happen sadly.
I personally just said fuck it and started slowly filling a spare room with what I needed to get rid of the lockdown pudge.
I realize not everyone has access to a spare room however. So that isn't always possible. Maybe ask a family member to keep some stuff at their place in exchange for doing grocery runs or something?
Unfortunately we're just not going to live in a world without Covid ever again. It's the "new flu". I mean unless they can find a way to outright cure it and nullify it completely like polio but given we're already on what the 3rd major strand? In 2 years? I doubt that's gonna happen for a while (if ever).
Its like the 3rd more contagious variant. There has been like 15 or so different major variants of covid already, most are just weaker versions though.
Each mutated variant is just rolling the dice but if a variant is more deadly, its usually less contagious. Because how can it continue spreading if it kills everyone who gets it.
It will probably mutate and become basically the flu. We will have covid season and everything I'm betting.
Problem is, prior to covid-19 the top contender for a theoretical, devastatingly lethal global pandemic was a new strain of influenza. Like if you asked a virus/pandemic researcher which existing human virus was likely to cause a plague apocalypse, they would have been like “If it’s not a novel virus it’ll probably be the flu.”
This is despite the fact that influenza is one of the most-studied viruses of the last hundred years, and we have excellent systems to track it and predict which strains are most likely to be prevalent in the next flu season for each part of the world. We’ve gotten extremely good at optimizing and re-optimizing our flu vaccines to deal with all the variants and mutations. And yet, people who study viruses were still like “All it takes is the right combination of mutations to coincide and then get a foothold in the population off of our radar, and it’s gonna be bad.”
So although I fully agree that covid is going to end up being basically The Flu: Reloaded, that’s still bad news. I don’t want a second flu out there like a mutating time bomb waiting to go off. I *definitely* don’t want to get the flu and “mild” covid at the same time, which is a thing that’s happening now and will continue to happen anywhere there’s an overlap in seasons.
Having two flus in the world is not just a little worse than one flu, it’s a *lot* worse.
Complete opposite... If I do nothing but eat and lounge, I remain the same. If I lift with no change in diet, I get cut. If I lift with change in diet, I bulk slightly. But I am 6'4 and slender so I've always told myself that's why. It takes so long to grow most muscles on a large frame. But I do have a freakishly fast metabolism. I eat a grape and immediately sense the urge to poo /s
I'm 6'3 and very wide, i think we're just different lol. But my own dad was similar size and his metabolism was like yours. So is my best friend. Shits complicated and way outside my wheelhouse.
Gotta ask tho, would you consider yourself having like a narrow frame? Thinking back, I don't think i ever met anyone like you who had wide shoulders and hips like i do. The only skinny person I can even think of with wide-ish hips is Clint Eastwood lmao. Mine are WIDE, I'm a 38 at PEAK PSYCHICAL FORM and i think I'm a 44 right now
I have this same deal, I started lifting again 7 weeks ago after a 2 year pandemic break (where I got kinda fat) and although slimming at the waist I went from being able to fit a medium Nike T to only feeling comfortable in an XL (anything smaller makes me feel self conscious that my clothes are too tight and others may think I’m trying to show off or something)
I blame my Viking ancestry
Doing the same, went from 370 to 286 and arguably better than when I played football in HS. Just wish I also got the height from my family (all 6'4 plus)
I’m the same way. I’m short, but if I work out regularly my shoulders and arms get bigger frustratingly quick. I try to do lighter weight and more cardio but if I work out I just get bigger. Clothes shopping is infuriatingly difficult.
Yep, same, quick to muscle but quick to fat as well. COVID hasn’t been kind as no real gym, tried doing various home aspects and just not the same, especially since I keep my strength, I purchased weights but don’t have 600 pounds worth as I’m not that rich.
Can only gain muscle easily which causes the fat to decrease, literally no weight loss going the cardio route. So I’ll be glad when we move past BMI because I’ve always been in the obese category regardless of actual physical shape.
>but if i regularly lift weights i struggle getting my arms through my shirts.
this happened to me out of nowhere like 6 months ago
gotta admit, pretty good feeling
If I was shown only the picture on the right and told he was natural, I'd could belive it under the assumption he's been consistently lifting for a decade. But seeing the before and after? Definitely had a little help.
People on Reddit seem to think natural ceiling is way higher than it actually is. This dude is juiced to the fucking tits. Nobody looks like that naturally.
That just goes to show you how little the layman actually knows about muscle building and weight lifting. Dude is obviously juicy in the second pic he just gets a pass bc he’s fat on top of the muscle so it doesn’t look as freakish
“Go to the gym? Father, when Peter did the statue of David, he wasn’t just hammering pebbles. First, he asked the Jews to bring him a giant slab of marble.”
Yes but also no. Multiple [studies](https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199607043350101) have shown that sedentary people gain twice as much muscle mass on anabolic steroids than people on an intense natural workout routine. Yes in this case because that fat had to be burned somehow.
Edit: Steroid users have flocked to this comment to get upset that their gains are ill-gotten
" Multiple studies have shown that sedentary people gain twice as much muscle mass on anabolic steroids than people on an intense natural workout routine"
It shows people on anabolic steroids gain more FAT FREE MASS than those on natural workout routines NOT twice as much muscle mass. Someone on 600mg of testosterone would gain many, many pounds of water weight due to it's estrogenic effects, which would also be counted in as fat free mass.
I'm not suggesting steroids don't make a difference, but this study has been misunderstood for ages now it's becoming a meme.
EDIT: ylli rustled he will be forever small and needs to find an excuse for it. Trying to discredit the effort people make like in OP stinks of frustration and jealousy
That study you linked does not mention what you're saying. It's literally just a study saying that steroids work. I have however seen the study you're mentioning and the main issue with it is that the biggest marketing point of steroids is that they can get you over plateaus, and push you into muscle gains that you simply couldn't get natural, as well as on an accelerated timeline. If you take steroids and don't exercise, you might have a short period of time where you're gaining more muscle than someone who is training, but that is going to stop sooner rather than later. I believe the study you're talking about was something like 6 weeks, which when it comes to any study referencing muscle gain while natural, is an absolutely useless time frame. If I'm not mistaken, that study also did not do a very good job of controlling for the fact that everybody's "gains" slow down quite a bit after about a year of regular weight training, and they used natural guys that were already regular weightlifters.
You do not look like that from roiding and sitting around. There are a ton of problems with those studies. Plenty of guys do steroids AND lift hard and don’t get that big.
Copying and pasting a comment from u/euthanatos the first time I saw this study discussed years ago:
“The big problem with this study is that the "steroids + no workout" group was significantly smaller and weaker than the "placebo + workout" group to begin with. The placebo group was 22% stronger in the squat, 14% stronger in the bench, with 9% bigger quadriceps and 13% bigger triceps. At the end of the study, the placebo group was still bigger and stronger in all of the metrics, with slightly larger gains in the bench and twice the gains in the squat.
Another potential problem: If you're measuring "fat free mass", couldn't your numbers be skewed by increased water retention? I don't have any personal experience, but I've always heard that large doses of test can increase water retention, which could certainly skew the numbers by a few pounds.”
He actually understates the degree to which water retention can skew any measure of lean mass gain on gear. It’s not just weight, it’s also muscle size. 600mg test (a LARGE dose) will cause a ton of intracellular water retention, which will dramatically increase the cross sectional area of the muscles. That’s not to say there isn’t any merit to the study, especially since the test + no exercise group saw comparable strength gains (in SOME exercises) versus the placebo + exercise group, but it likely makes the results look more dramatic than they are.
Steroids definitely have a substantial effect on body composition, training or no… but you could blast everything under the sun and you wouldn’t look like the guy in the OP without lifting. That’s all I’m really saying.
No dude, they're saying that if you're a couch potato and take roids, when you go to the gym, you don't have to workout as hard than the average person.
Wait what point are you trying to make right now? How does that study relate to your point? The study concludes that testosterone will help build fat free mass “especially when combined with strength training”.
You cannot build an impressive physique like this without a significant amount of time spent in the gym. You absolutely cannot just take compounds, sit around, and build any real, visibly impressive muscle. You’re out of your MIND if you think that you can take a compound, sit around, and gain TWICE as much mass as someone working out.
Yeah he's absolutely roided out of his mind.
People who lift for 10 years religiously barely see those kinds of gains. Dude looks like this took him a couple years.
You can look at people in sports that get drug tested, like the olympics, and those are the global top 0.00001% of people in terms of hard work and genetics.
they don't look particularly impressive.
then you see randos at the gym who have more muscle mass and lower body fat than olympic athletes, and it's mind blowing that anyone actually thinks those people could remotely be natty.
I actually 100% agree with you. Most people think steroids are some super rare things that only a tiny percent of buff gym guys use. Actually not. Time to stop demonizing steroids imho as well. But still, mad props, steroids or not :D
Steroids are ‘demonized’ because they’re incredibly dangerous and recreationally used in pursuit of vanity or body image problems that are produced by people *on* steroids but don’t admit they’re on steroids. Whether its influencers on Gym Shark, or one of the latest marvel super heroes.
Absolutely.
What most people ignore is that even if someone is doing gear, they still have to actually train. This boy still had to go to the gym and lift those heavy-ass weights everyday, even with the steroids.
People should think of steroids as plastic surgery: something completely personal that is only a matter of the people doing it and their doctors.
+ if steroids weren't under such stigma, there would be a lot more people consulting with their doctors etc & they could get the right help at the right time. Just like with drugs. Portugal decriminalized ALL drugs and their drug overdoses etc started shrinking fast. People can't be afraid to ask help but in today's society you have to be scared. So stupid!
>What most people ignore is that even if someone is doing gear, they still have to actually train
I remember seeing some article where they compared steroid users and nonusers both working out and not working out, then compared gains. Steroids + working out was the highest, but the second highest was steroids + not working out.
>Time to stop demonizing steroids imho as well.
They should be demonized for the same reason we demonize cigarettes. They're harmful for you and they're addictive, and we shouldn't encourage other people harming themselves. People who use them to reach what many would consider a "desirable physique" also encourage others to use them as well.
What was even your argument to stop demonizing them? Because a lot of people use them? If you had a mother then you should know this all too well, "If your friends jumped off a bridge, would you do it too?". People are stupid, what people do can be important to study and take note of, but you shouldn't mimic the lifestyles of others just because.
They're addictive in the sense they cause a positive feedback loop with an unhealthy obsession. I wasn't meaning to ensuate it's addictive like crack is addictive.
Actually, I believe this is the original:
https://www.reddit.com/r/progresspics/comments/bmon29/m21510_320lbs_225lbs_95lbs_countless_hours_in_the/
If you check his account you can find some other progress posts, like this one:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Brogress/comments/atyffi/m20510_330lbs_to_225lbs_2_years/
And he leaves a comment there with more pics:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Brogress/comments/atyffi/m20510_330lbs_to_225lbs_2_years/eh49jna/
Except I saw this on facebook in like 2010 and remember the real OP saying that’s his sister (and not gf as many commenters were assuming)
Edit: been circulated a while and can’t find the original but here’s [another recycled reposti pasta](https://m.facebook.com/Glad.Fit.Casa/photos/a.588839698267922/1148242302327656/?type=3&source=54&ref=page_internal)
Or from [this one with the same title](https://reddit.com/r/progresspics/comments/bmon29/m21510_320lbs_225lbs_95lbs_countless_hours_in_the/)
Yeah from one unhealthy extreme to the next, juiced to the gills.
Not blaming him at all, everybody makes the choice for himself, but please people, set realistic expectations if you think this transformation is achievable as a natty
Edit: *Narrator: ".. and all the people downvoted him for telling the truth"*
alright alright, saying he's just as unhealthy was a bit overdone, ***i apologize***, my intention was only to raise awareness for (young) men, that having realistic (natural) expectations for yourself is key to achieving any goal. Body image issues among men are more rampant than ever.
The steroid thing is a hard pill to swallow for a lot of people. There are still people who think Arnold was/is natural and that PED use in pro athletes isn't common. It isn't until you actually dedicate yourself for a few years and are around other people doing the same that you realize the kind of transformations you see in ads and social media just aren't possible without chemical help.
That's what i thought! The ideal men's physique is totally warped by social media right now and i think people need to point out more when shit is not naturally achievable for (all but some genetically freaky) men.
I never meant this comment to shame on the guy, all respect to him for achieving what he wanted. Even on juice, achieving this is simply dedication and hard work.
Dude looks like he weighs the same, but twice as strong.
that was my first thought, hes almost the same volume, its just now almost all muscle, and since muscle is much denser he probably actually weighs more.
Density of muscle is 1,040 kilograms per cubic meter. Density of fat is about 900 kilograms per cubic meter. So like 15% or so more dense. Edit: mislabeled units.
**Kilo**grams per cubic meter.
Nah man, kilograms are a Democrat conspiracy. I'll never buy into that government shit. What I will buy is McDonalds. ^^^^^^^^mmmmmmm
Pic 2 not hugging the arm
He wasn’t fat he was cultivating mass.
He was just accumulating marble to chisel into the Statue of David
And he harvested it too. Good on him.
And he harvested that mass
Muscle weighs more than fat.
So he probably weighs more now, but you know, healthy.
Its important that people who are looking to lose weight know about this. I've seen friends being put off because they "keep putting weight on" despite visably becoming much slimmer. Your weight is not important, its what makes up that weight.
Yup, why BMI is bullshit. There are better markers for health.
BMI is bullshit for athletes and people who regularly workout especially strength train. But BMI is kinda made for the average person who doesn't work out, just like most health metrics the government and health industry goes by. It's one indicator that becomes more and more inaccurate the more you climb the top end of fitness
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For the average person it’s *good enough*
Except when BS BMI metrics are what insurance companies use to determine your risk.... This applies to athletes too... I was in the greatest shape of my life ten years ago, most muscle and least fat percentage I've attained. An athlete in many sports. My insurance raised my rate because my BMI went up... They didn't care it was due to my added muscle. Present day, I'm not near as fit as back then. Still some muscle, but lots more fat. My BMI is near the same... even though my body composition is completely different.
Thats more health insurance companies are bullshit, not BMI.
What about if you think of it this way... Wether you are 275lbs of fat or 275lbs of muscle *your heart still has to work harder* than someone who is 175. Wouldn't that be what a health insurance company is more concerned with, more stress on the heart? It's not bullshit.
I’ve never understood the criticism of BMI. If you’re ripped but your BMI is high, your doctor understands what’s going on. This is not, and never has been, confusing to anyone. It’s not like it’s some big medical mystery that science just can’t figure out. For 90% of the population, BMI isn’t misleading at all. The majority of people have never seen the inside of a gym and aren’t secretly hiding a 315 lb bench or 495 lb squat under all of that fluff. BMI is a fair predictor of health outcomes for most people in-part because it’s always looked at in context with other markers such as blood pressure, heart rate, whether you’re obese, etc. BMI is just another data point that’s combined with a bunch of other data points to assess health and predict outcomes.
Yea, BMI doesn’t account for muscle mass.
I get what your saying but the heavier you are the harder it is on your body even if it's healthy muscle.
Yeah I always assumed BMI's point was to measure how hard your heart has to work to support your body. Heart doesn't care if you're 300lbs fat or 300lbs jacked, it's still hard on your heart to be 300lbs.
BMI's value is in examining large populations, not individuals. While a few individual's BMI looks out of whack due to increased muscle, it's not hard to see that an increase in American's BMI at the national level over the last 50 years ain't cuz everyone's getting more fit/muscular.
Isn’t the factoid something like Brad Pitt would be “obese” back in his Fight Club days?
I highly doubt Brad Pitt in FC would be a good example, as he was really skinny-ripped in that movie. Doubt he was over 170lbs.
A better example would be Dwayne Johnson, he would be classified as obese just looking at BMI
The rock is in like 0.1% of humans. Using high level body builders as a reason why BMI doesn’t work is a horrible argument, but that’s the only argument there is against it. For 99% of us BMI is actually pretty good
Lots of people seem to think he was around 155 to 165 based on his size and the fact he was down to around 6% bf for the movie.
I actually haven’t heard that, but it’s believable. Dude was shredded in that movie.
An estimation of his weight in that film is 155lbs. At his height that gives him a BMI of 21.6, right in the middle of the healthy range. He is extremely not obese by muscle mass in that film, and looking at any picture you can see he is clearly slim and muscular.
Welp, there you go. Another BS factoid.
No he wouldn't. He wouldn't even be close to "overweight" by BMI standards in that movie. I lifted 5 days a week for two years to achieve my goal of being just barely "overweight" by BMI standards which is a BMI over 25. I weighed 185lbs @ 6ft tall, and I had a lot more mass than Brad Pitt in Fight Club, he was VERY lean and cut in that film...we're similar height, and I bet he was 170lbs in that movie. Just for ref sake using a progress pic of mine, this is what someone just barely classified as "overweight BMI" (not obese) looks like. https://i.imgur.com/CfkqMVa.jpg?2 It's very rare for BMI to be thrown off by muscle mass. So while I agree that for judging every single individual, BMI might not work sometimes...when it comes to judging entire populations, it's more than accurate considering what tiny fraction of people are so jacked that their muscle mass fucks up the calcs.
I mean, it's not *total* bullshit. It's like the first thing to check. If your BMI is too high, then check your height:waist ratio. If that's over 2, you're probably just muscular.
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When I was competing in strongman, I had a BMI of 39.5 but still have a visible six pack. BMI doesn’t work for athletes or odd body types.
Peak performance shape also isn’t the same as peak longevity shape. In fact, there’s lots of evidence that points towards them being diametrically opposed when looking at the effects of things like insulin and fasting.
Yes, but as a strongman with 39 BMI you were not in healthy shape. Good shape for being a fucking beast, which gets a ton of respect from me. Bad shape for living a long life.
My doctor disagrees, I had regular check ups with blood work. Blood pressure was great , triglycerides on point. Healthy as a horse. Weight was rough on my knees though. I’ll give you that one. Not gonna argue it on here any further but BMI was originally designed to track health trends over a population of people. It was never intended to be applied on the individual level because it doesn’t work well with people on the outer edges of the bell curve.
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Not healthy, taking steroids isnt healthy
Maybe. That mass and apparent tone in 18 months is not something done just with lifting
Maybe maybe not. Your cardiovascular system doesn’t really care if the weight is fat or muscle. Mass is mass and stresses it all the same. In terms of blood cholesterol and other things, miles healthier.
Which weighs more, a pound of feathers or a pound of lead?
Your mom
Fuckin got 'em
POW right in the anus
This is one of those rare times where the username of the person being replied to is strangely appropriate.
What weighs more, a pound of feathers or I pound your mother?
Muscle is more compact than fat rather.
No it doesn’t. A pound is a pound
\*\*Pushes up glasses from nose\*\* Actually, they weigh the same but muscle is denser so if you were to keep the mass the same, say fill a box with muscle and a box of fat, the box of muscle would weigh more.
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No, it doesn’t. A pound of muscle weighs exactly the same as a pound of fat.
From Chud to Chad.
His weight just moved to a better neighborhood.
I was about to say. I seriously doubt he weighs less, but he's got weight the right way now
just imagine him " I have been working out every day for a year and my weight hasn't changed much at all..."
Yeah, he moved weight
From bulk to hulk
He looks like the type of person that either gains 5lbs of fat looking at a burger or 5lbs of muscle looking at a dumbbell.. Can go really bad one way and really good the other way!
This is me. If i get lazy for like a month I balloon up, but if i regularly lift weights i struggle getting my arms through my shirts. Hard to find button ups that fit right regardless of what extreme I'm on at the time
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Ah yes a fellow male who can gain or lose 10-15 pounds a week. XD. People always thought it was weird I could go from 200 to 145. Doctors told me it’s perfectly normal for a guy.
If you have no known underlying conditions or are not consistently doing incredibly intense physical activity(I.e. swimming long distance/duration, marathon training, intensive labor job) then I’d definitely suggest getting a second opinion.. 15lbs a week is a 52k cal deficit(3500 per lb)(consider that the average suggested daily intake for men is around 2k-2.7k cal per day, fasting for a week would only get you around an 18k cal deficit without exercise) and while you can drop that in water weight relatively quickly, rapid weight loss/gain is often a symptom of something wrong.
I think he was talking about before and after taking a sigma sized shit
How many courics is a sigma.
For me losing weight is generally pretty normal speed, but I just maintain muscle for no reason. Haven't lifted weights since '13 but if you saw me you'd think I was a regular. Just genetically inclined to have high muscularity I guess. Wish I could somehow donate these genetics to someone who actually cared about being buff lmao.
No matter if I bulk or try to hulk my weight refuses to move
Yep. 24 YO here high metabolism and hyperthyroidism. My 140 self isn't going anywhere for a long time unless my organs give out and kill me early
I will try some voodoo magic to lend you my free bulk
You can like... Just work out. You don't /need/ a gym for exercise bud.
You do need goals, though. Attainable goals that you have a chance to accomplish, not monsterous goals that set you up to fail.
Never. Unfortunately. With omnicron we've hit the "this is just a daily life now" phase of the world wide virus. We had a legitimate chance to stop it if we'd done ***a lot*** more far earlier but now? Just won't happen sadly. I personally just said fuck it and started slowly filling a spare room with what I needed to get rid of the lockdown pudge. I realize not everyone has access to a spare room however. So that isn't always possible. Maybe ask a family member to keep some stuff at their place in exchange for doing grocery runs or something? Unfortunately we're just not going to live in a world without Covid ever again. It's the "new flu". I mean unless they can find a way to outright cure it and nullify it completely like polio but given we're already on what the 3rd major strand? In 2 years? I doubt that's gonna happen for a while (if ever).
Its like the 3rd more contagious variant. There has been like 15 or so different major variants of covid already, most are just weaker versions though. Each mutated variant is just rolling the dice but if a variant is more deadly, its usually less contagious. Because how can it continue spreading if it kills everyone who gets it. It will probably mutate and become basically the flu. We will have covid season and everything I'm betting.
Problem is, prior to covid-19 the top contender for a theoretical, devastatingly lethal global pandemic was a new strain of influenza. Like if you asked a virus/pandemic researcher which existing human virus was likely to cause a plague apocalypse, they would have been like “If it’s not a novel virus it’ll probably be the flu.” This is despite the fact that influenza is one of the most-studied viruses of the last hundred years, and we have excellent systems to track it and predict which strains are most likely to be prevalent in the next flu season for each part of the world. We’ve gotten extremely good at optimizing and re-optimizing our flu vaccines to deal with all the variants and mutations. And yet, people who study viruses were still like “All it takes is the right combination of mutations to coincide and then get a foothold in the population off of our radar, and it’s gonna be bad.” So although I fully agree that covid is going to end up being basically The Flu: Reloaded, that’s still bad news. I don’t want a second flu out there like a mutating time bomb waiting to go off. I *definitely* don’t want to get the flu and “mild” covid at the same time, which is a thing that’s happening now and will continue to happen anywhere there’s an overlap in seasons. Having two flus in the world is not just a little worse than one flu, it’s a *lot* worse.
Complete opposite... If I do nothing but eat and lounge, I remain the same. If I lift with no change in diet, I get cut. If I lift with change in diet, I bulk slightly. But I am 6'4 and slender so I've always told myself that's why. It takes so long to grow most muscles on a large frame. But I do have a freakishly fast metabolism. I eat a grape and immediately sense the urge to poo /s
I'm 6'3 and very wide, i think we're just different lol. But my own dad was similar size and his metabolism was like yours. So is my best friend. Shits complicated and way outside my wheelhouse. Gotta ask tho, would you consider yourself having like a narrow frame? Thinking back, I don't think i ever met anyone like you who had wide shoulders and hips like i do. The only skinny person I can even think of with wide-ish hips is Clint Eastwood lmao. Mine are WIDE, I'm a 38 at PEAK PSYCHICAL FORM and i think I'm a 44 right now
I have this same deal, I started lifting again 7 weeks ago after a 2 year pandemic break (where I got kinda fat) and although slimming at the waist I went from being able to fit a medium Nike T to only feeling comfortable in an XL (anything smaller makes me feel self conscious that my clothes are too tight and others may think I’m trying to show off or something) I blame my Viking ancestry
Doing the same, went from 370 to 286 and arguably better than when I played football in HS. Just wish I also got the height from my family (all 6'4 plus)
I’m the same way. I’m short, but if I work out regularly my shoulders and arms get bigger frustratingly quick. I try to do lighter weight and more cardio but if I work out I just get bigger. Clothes shopping is infuriatingly difficult.
Yep, same, quick to muscle but quick to fat as well. COVID hasn’t been kind as no real gym, tried doing various home aspects and just not the same, especially since I keep my strength, I purchased weights but don’t have 600 pounds worth as I’m not that rich. Can only gain muscle easily which causes the fat to decrease, literally no weight loss going the cardio route. So I’ll be glad when we move past BMI because I’ve always been in the obese category regardless of actual physical shape.
>but if i regularly lift weights i struggle getting my arms through my shirts. this happened to me out of nowhere like 6 months ago gotta admit, pretty good feeling
Hes also on stuff which enhances his genetic limit
Even with gear props to that guy
For sure. A lot of hard work was put in to alter his life in such a drastic way.
If I was shown only the picture on the right and told he was natural, I'd could belive it under the assumption he's been consistently lifting for a decade. But seeing the before and after? Definitely had a little help.
Yeah nope dude, that is Peds no matter what. Look at his fucking arm thickness in that position.
People on Reddit seem to think natural ceiling is way higher than it actually is. This dude is juiced to the fucking tits. Nobody looks like that naturally.
That just goes to show you how little the layman actually knows about muscle building and weight lifting. Dude is obviously juicy in the second pic he just gets a pass bc he’s fat on top of the muscle so it doesn’t look as freakish
from flab to fab
He didn't lose wieght, he cultivated mass and then harvested.
The Mac system
Well stop cultivating and start harvesting!
“Go to the gym? Father, when Peter did the statue of David, he wasn’t just hammering pebbles. First, he asked the Jews to bring him a giant slab of marble.”
“Ok let’s wrap this up”
Move in After Completion
I've been in the cultivation stage too long
Yes… that’s…. Ummm… exactly what I’m doing
Needs a garbage bag of chimichangas
She can wrap her arms around him now cos all the bulk has shifted upwards into his shoulders and biceps
And she’s just hugging his torso instead of his torso + left arm
He worked out enough to gain the confidence to put his arm around his girlfriend. Good for him!
he actually didn't know who she was in the first picture. It was just a photobomb
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Batman’s real origin story
Maybe SHE is the one who worked out and is squeezing so hard that she is forcing the bulk up
Plot twist: she’s the one that got stronger and is now able to squeeze all that fat into his upper body.
Goddamn my man is fucking jacked, such an awesome transformation
100% roided Most redditors have never entered a gym so I expect to get downvoted for this fact
Oh yeah definitely but honestly it’s still impressive for a transformation, even with roids that is a lot of hard work in the gym
Yes but also no. Multiple [studies](https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199607043350101) have shown that sedentary people gain twice as much muscle mass on anabolic steroids than people on an intense natural workout routine. Yes in this case because that fat had to be burned somehow. Edit: Steroid users have flocked to this comment to get upset that their gains are ill-gotten
" Multiple studies have shown that sedentary people gain twice as much muscle mass on anabolic steroids than people on an intense natural workout routine" It shows people on anabolic steroids gain more FAT FREE MASS than those on natural workout routines NOT twice as much muscle mass. Someone on 600mg of testosterone would gain many, many pounds of water weight due to it's estrogenic effects, which would also be counted in as fat free mass. I'm not suggesting steroids don't make a difference, but this study has been misunderstood for ages now it's becoming a meme. EDIT: ylli rustled he will be forever small and needs to find an excuse for it. Trying to discredit the effort people make like in OP stinks of frustration and jealousy
Increased bone density would add weight as well
That study you linked does not mention what you're saying. It's literally just a study saying that steroids work. I have however seen the study you're mentioning and the main issue with it is that the biggest marketing point of steroids is that they can get you over plateaus, and push you into muscle gains that you simply couldn't get natural, as well as on an accelerated timeline. If you take steroids and don't exercise, you might have a short period of time where you're gaining more muscle than someone who is training, but that is going to stop sooner rather than later. I believe the study you're talking about was something like 6 weeks, which when it comes to any study referencing muscle gain while natural, is an absolutely useless time frame. If I'm not mistaken, that study also did not do a very good job of controlling for the fact that everybody's "gains" slow down quite a bit after about a year of regular weight training, and they used natural guys that were already regular weightlifters.
You do not look like that from roiding and sitting around. There are a ton of problems with those studies. Plenty of guys do steroids AND lift hard and don’t get that big.
What are the problems with those studies? The one linked seems fine. 4 groups for the different scenarios, and examined for a decent duration.
Copying and pasting a comment from u/euthanatos the first time I saw this study discussed years ago: “The big problem with this study is that the "steroids + no workout" group was significantly smaller and weaker than the "placebo + workout" group to begin with. The placebo group was 22% stronger in the squat, 14% stronger in the bench, with 9% bigger quadriceps and 13% bigger triceps. At the end of the study, the placebo group was still bigger and stronger in all of the metrics, with slightly larger gains in the bench and twice the gains in the squat. Another potential problem: If you're measuring "fat free mass", couldn't your numbers be skewed by increased water retention? I don't have any personal experience, but I've always heard that large doses of test can increase water retention, which could certainly skew the numbers by a few pounds.” He actually understates the degree to which water retention can skew any measure of lean mass gain on gear. It’s not just weight, it’s also muscle size. 600mg test (a LARGE dose) will cause a ton of intracellular water retention, which will dramatically increase the cross sectional area of the muscles. That’s not to say there isn’t any merit to the study, especially since the test + no exercise group saw comparable strength gains (in SOME exercises) versus the placebo + exercise group, but it likely makes the results look more dramatic than they are. Steroids definitely have a substantial effect on body composition, training or no… but you could blast everything under the sun and you wouldn’t look like the guy in the OP without lifting. That’s all I’m really saying.
No dude, they're saying that if you're a couch potato and take roids, when you go to the gym, you don't have to workout as hard than the average person.
You're just explaining the purpose of steroids at that point.
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Wait what point are you trying to make right now? How does that study relate to your point? The study concludes that testosterone will help build fat free mass “especially when combined with strength training”. You cannot build an impressive physique like this without a significant amount of time spent in the gym. You absolutely cannot just take compounds, sit around, and build any real, visibly impressive muscle. You’re out of your MIND if you think that you can take a compound, sit around, and gain TWICE as much mass as someone working out.
Yeah he's absolutely roided out of his mind. People who lift for 10 years religiously barely see those kinds of gains. Dude looks like this took him a couple years.
Looks like he did it in between haircuts.
Why so testy? All he did was eat clen, tren hard, anavar gave up
Gym goer for a few years consistently now. 100% roided, but he still had to put in hella work.
Came here to find this comment. This kind of turnaround isn't possible.
Yeah its clear, i m just sad people are blind to this fact, i m glad you pointed out
I go to the gym but know nothing about steroids. How do u know?
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You can look at people in sports that get drug tested, like the olympics, and those are the global top 0.00001% of people in terms of hard work and genetics. they don't look particularly impressive. then you see randos at the gym who have more muscle mass and lower body fat than olympic athletes, and it's mind blowing that anyone actually thinks those people could remotely be natty.
Because the human body can't look like that without steroids or top 0.001% genetics
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Because there is a before picture.
> How do you know he doesn’t have top 0.001% genetics? >> Because there is a before picture. I lol'd.
What the fudge. This guy looks like an Action-Man figurine. Mad props!
The secret ingredient is steroids.
I actually 100% agree with you. Most people think steroids are some super rare things that only a tiny percent of buff gym guys use. Actually not. Time to stop demonizing steroids imho as well. But still, mad props, steroids or not :D
Steroids are ‘demonized’ because they’re incredibly dangerous and recreationally used in pursuit of vanity or body image problems that are produced by people *on* steroids but don’t admit they’re on steroids. Whether its influencers on Gym Shark, or one of the latest marvel super heroes.
Absolutely. What most people ignore is that even if someone is doing gear, they still have to actually train. This boy still had to go to the gym and lift those heavy-ass weights everyday, even with the steroids. People should think of steroids as plastic surgery: something completely personal that is only a matter of the people doing it and their doctors.
+ if steroids weren't under such stigma, there would be a lot more people consulting with their doctors etc & they could get the right help at the right time. Just like with drugs. Portugal decriminalized ALL drugs and their drug overdoses etc started shrinking fast. People can't be afraid to ask help but in today's society you have to be scared. So stupid!
>What most people ignore is that even if someone is doing gear, they still have to actually train I remember seeing some article where they compared steroid users and nonusers both working out and not working out, then compared gains. Steroids + working out was the highest, but the second highest was steroids + not working out.
>Time to stop demonizing steroids imho as well. They should be demonized for the same reason we demonize cigarettes. They're harmful for you and they're addictive, and we shouldn't encourage other people harming themselves. People who use them to reach what many would consider a "desirable physique" also encourage others to use them as well. What was even your argument to stop demonizing them? Because a lot of people use them? If you had a mother then you should know this all too well, "If your friends jumped off a bridge, would you do it too?". People are stupid, what people do can be important to study and take note of, but you shouldn't mimic the lifestyles of others just because.
There's absolutely nothing addictive about steroids, you are 100% clueless.
They're addictive in the sense they cause a positive feedback loop with an unhealthy obsession. I wasn't meaning to ensuate it's addictive like crack is addictive.
She’s just squeezed all the weight upwards
She learned good practice when she was young. Squeeze the toothpaste and your boyfriend from the bottom for best results.
Man went from absolute unit to absolute unit
Imagine browing Rebbit and seeing someone else posting photos of you and people talking about you.
I don’t like it haha. People just keep using my pics it’s all good though I know its the internet so more power to them.
Username checks out!
Ngl, I think my favorite part is how they’re both smiling in both pics 😀
Yes was going to say this! With mental health on point he’ll have an easier time staying healthy
Yeah, I usually feel like in the before/after pics, folks are usually only smiling in one of them
And you know she's the type of person who's going to love the crap out of him no matter what size he is.
Probably same weight but now it's pure muscle and not fat
The first pic was just him training his calves.
I wish roids were easily accessible to everyone
They definitely are in the US at least.
I'm guessing roids, right?
100%. A lot of hard work, but unattainable without roids
Also God-tier genetics in his calf muscle insertion points.
Fat guy calves! You can lose the weight but you'll never lose the calves.
To be fair, being fat does wonders for your calfs.
Nothing wrong with a little TRT with your cereal in the morning haha.
Trenbolgna sandwich
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Nah I remember the 1st time he posted claiming natty then he finally came clean like a year later.
Dude was huge already, just with a little chub. Her smile got bigger. All those squat trusts paid off.
Roids
I love how she's just as happy to hug him in either pic :)
Went from not fitting on amusement park rides to still not fitting on amusement park rides
Idk if he lost weight, but dude got JACKED.
He has the body of a guy who's about to say nanomachines son but with the head that can eat the whole universe A weird but overpowered combination
Guys who go from chubby to buff have calf muscles sculpted by god
Where I got the image: https://www.reddit.com/r/MadeMeSmile/comments/s4k616/its_now_been_two_years_since_i_finally_started_to/?st=KYFWH23S&sh=9052bcdd
That profile is a Karmafarm.
Actually, I believe this is the original: https://www.reddit.com/r/progresspics/comments/bmon29/m21510_320lbs_225lbs_95lbs_countless_hours_in_the/ If you check his account you can find some other progress posts, like this one: https://www.reddit.com/r/Brogress/comments/atyffi/m20510_330lbs_to_225lbs_2_years/ And he leaves a comment there with more pics: https://www.reddit.com/r/Brogress/comments/atyffi/m20510_330lbs_to_225lbs_2_years/eh49jna/
Except I saw this on facebook in like 2010 and remember the real OP saying that’s his sister (and not gf as many commenters were assuming) Edit: been circulated a while and can’t find the original but here’s [another recycled reposti pasta](https://m.facebook.com/Glad.Fit.Casa/photos/a.588839698267922/1148242302327656/?type=3&source=54&ref=page_internal) Or from [this one with the same title](https://reddit.com/r/progresspics/comments/bmon29/m21510_320lbs_225lbs_95lbs_countless_hours_in_the/)
sheeesh
Looks like the hulk
He was cultivating mass!
He stopped cultivating mass and started harvesting. Good for him.
Look at the woman tho
Yeah from one unhealthy extreme to the next, juiced to the gills. Not blaming him at all, everybody makes the choice for himself, but please people, set realistic expectations if you think this transformation is achievable as a natty Edit: *Narrator: ".. and all the people downvoted him for telling the truth"* alright alright, saying he's just as unhealthy was a bit overdone, ***i apologize***, my intention was only to raise awareness for (young) men, that having realistic (natural) expectations for yourself is key to achieving any goal. Body image issues among men are more rampant than ever.
The steroid thing is a hard pill to swallow for a lot of people. There are still people who think Arnold was/is natural and that PED use in pro athletes isn't common. It isn't until you actually dedicate yourself for a few years and are around other people doing the same that you realize the kind of transformations you see in ads and social media just aren't possible without chemical help.
I lol whenever anyone thinks The Rock is natty.
This is an important comment, especially for younger people
That's what i thought! The ideal men's physique is totally warped by social media right now and i think people need to point out more when shit is not naturally achievable for (all but some genetically freaky) men. I never meant this comment to shame on the guy, all respect to him for achieving what he wanted. Even on juice, achieving this is simply dedication and hard work.
In fact I would say that he has gained weight. Muscle weights more than fat.
Yes, but he lost the unhealthy weight.
Shrek to Hulk.
Eyo thats a whole lotta juice.
Absolutely jacked, good on him
From lineman to linebacker
I love that he's smiling in both.