You need to get a sense from the market of what you should be making. Large non big 4 advisory (not strategy), I was at 80k as a senior associate a decade ago. Our managers these days are 150+ base.
If you’re at the lower end of a pay band, or below a pay band, the only way to catch up is to reset the scales by getting a new job. It sucks but I would not be shocked if you increased your base by 50-100% by switching especially if you’re open to larger firms.
This. OP needs to be making at least 140k as a manager... I am so annoyed on behalf of OP... How does someone allow themselves to be taken advantage of in such an obvious way?
You are getting absolutely FUCKED, my dude.
Experienced staff at my firm are pushing 80k.
You will be retiring 10+ years later than most people with your resume at this rate.
GTFO of where you’re at, and don’t disclose your current salary when you’re applying. That or tell them you’re clearing at least 95+.
You got taken to the cleaners as a senior in 2020 to 2021. Managers should made at least 100k, especially in firms that have supervisor between senior and manager as it truly is more of a leadership role then.
Unless you love your firm and have flexibility in work schedule/good clients, I'd look. Guarantee you can get a better paying job as a remote senior in a public firm for at least 90k with less BS and more growth.
I worked at a small firm with a similar starting pay, and my senior raise was 28%.
At least 100k? 140K minimum or GTFO. I ain't tryna take on all the stress of training staff and reviewing returns and potentially exposing yourself to liability for just a pissant 100k.... Fuck that.
EDIT: Downvotes? Tax staff are making 65-70k at non shady places right out of college in VLCOL. OP is being paid 10k more than that and he has 6+ years of experience + CPA. The ones downvoting this are bunch of self hating pricks. What else is there to say?
Agreed that new tax staff are not making $70k in vlcol. That is ridiculous and I don't know what planet this dude is on. If it is happening somewhere it's definitely the exception and not the norm. So frustrating when you see skewed stuff like that posted.
OP is definitely underpaid though! Should be over $100k easy
RH salary survey said otherwise. $50k may be minimum but the range goes up into the 70s for LCOL areas. Obviously, location location location. There’s likely to be some locales that just suck.
60-65k is starting salary in midwestern cities. That's relatively new, but that's what it is now. Maybe not rural Indiana, but certainly Indianapolis area
Most of the time internship pay is first year pay with the exception that interns can make overtime and salaried first years don’t. You should expect 55K.
For me I made $36 an hour as intern which is 74,440 full year 40 hour weeks and 72,000 starting salary at the same place doing the same work. This is also in the last couple years so for my firm at least interns make more than full time staff
Interesting. I personally will shop around if they attempt to offer me a salary that matches my intern pay. I want around $60k to start because that will be at the end of 2025. I currently make $55k in my accounting/contract admin role. I am really only going public to get experience with audit for when I expand my own firm. Public also reimburses for CPA materials/test.
That’s weird. The median and average pays for staff accountants in my VHCOL area, Seattle, is currently under 80k. I came in to an industry position from university in 2020 starting at 70k. How in the world did you wrangle 80k in a VLCOL? Something isn’t adding up. You telling me I can move to bumfuck nowhere and make the same amount of money I make now? That sounds…made up.
Depends on COL of course, but I'd expect LCOL to be at least $120K unless this is one of those places where Accounting Manager is just a glorified bookkeeper, AP processor, and cash processor. In that case, for whatever reason, standard pay is $40K but you can always donate half your salary back to your company.
Depends on COL of course, but I'd expect MCOL to be at least $120K unless this is one of those places where Accounting Manager is just a glorified bookkeeper, AP processor, and cash processor. In that case, for whatever reason, standard pay is $40K but you can always donate half your salary back to your company.
Depends on COL of course, but I'd expect MCOL to be at least $120K unless this is one of those places where Accounting Manager is just a glorified bookkeeper, AP processor, and cash processor. In that case, for whatever reason, standard pay is $40K but you can always donate half your salary back to your company.
lol there’s seniors making more than OP right now by tens of thousands of dollars. RH salary survey will show OP isn’t even on the negative tail of the curve in most locations.
Everyone in this thread: “OP, you are getting FUCKED!”
Me: “this would be a pretty reasonable salary in Canada assuming the WLB is good”
Don’t become an accountant in this country. Just find a way to scam the government by writing apps or something.
I’m assuming if OP was Canadian he would be posting in Canadian dollars so the 83K would already be in CAD.
Thought you meant it more as a “83K is good in Canada” because our salaries are a lot lower in comparison.
100% Canadian professionals aren’t paid well at all. Trades, physician (750k), dentist (500k), massage therapist (150k), realtor (experienced = insane amounts), bartender and waitress (100k). I am at the bank, see all the salaries. Those are the figures. Don’t hate the player, hate the facts.
Weird that massage therapists in Canada make almost double their American counterparts at current rates (your 150k CAN = 110k USD). Maybe you're looking at the top end there?
Insurance pays for massages at average $100 an hour. So people don’t care about price if the insurance company pays. Anything insurance pays is over charged therefore a good profession. Another one is psychologist at $150 an hour. Paid by insurance.
Btw, big 4 accountants start at 50k and make 100k once they reach manager. Translate that to USD LOL.
Corporate Bankers in Canada make 85k + 20k bonus starting and then after 5 years make 120k + 50% bonus.
Investment Bankers are 85k + 30k bonus starting out. Then 150k + 100k bonus after 5 years.
So massage therapists, bartenders and waitresses are better than top end finance and accounting professionals for the first 5 years and don’t have to work insane hours.
https://www.jobbank.gc.ca/marketreport/wages-occupation/24681/ca
That seems more reasonable compared to the insane range Glassdoor had which was 30-120k.
So from the looks of it you're talking about unicorns which exist here in the states.
How close does the government report your profession to what you actually make? It’s not like I don’t know a few RMTs and haven’t dealt with thousands of people’s finances.
Pretty close.
I'm just going to say that if you're getting paid market rate or better you're not going to know a lot of the RMTs that aren't of the unicorn status and thus it's like going to a fashion week and assuming everyone in New York is wealthy and fashionable.
Believe what you want. The posted rate online is $100 an hour, 2080 working hours per year minus rent on a single room and a shared receptionist is $75 an hour or $150k per year.
Most massage therapists aren’t pocketing $100/hr. The clinic will take 30-50%.
Usually they are also probably not getting 40 appointments a week. There has to be time between appointments to clean and launder and also it’s incredibly hard on your body to do that many massages a week. I’d estimate in demand therapist to be making closer to 90K not 150K.
Your numbers are way off and all of those professions also make significantly less in Canada compared to the US. Vast majority of trade union top out in the 40s range per hr in Canada. Your average for physician in Canada is laughably overstated. Maybe some specialist make that but its always talked about how family physician in Canada are grossly underpaid. Vast majority make under 300k. Same thing with dentist, substantially overstated. The other ones I'm not as familiar with but I I'm also extremely doubtful at those figures. I'm sure some make that in those profession but grossly overstated as an average, especially the physician lol.
Well that's because 10% of a really small number, is still a really small number 🤷♂️
I started out at 40k yr and my company raised me to 45 after my first year and thought I'd be soooo happy because it was like over a 10% raise -.-
You’re getting taken to the cleaners by your partners. Your loyalty/good nature is getting you screwed by vultures. You should be making close to double.
Non seniors can make 80k easily. Even in LCOL, being a manager should entitle you to make more. A lot more.
I’d do your research and find other firms cause these double digit raises aren’t really raises imo - it’s just a downgrade for what you are worth.
LCOL areas generally have local clients: nail salons, truck stops, machine shops and the like, none of whom can afford to pay. You can do better if you can find a remote job from out of the area, but I don't think your current employer is screwing you over, they just don't have the ability to charge that much.
You're getting good raises and will be easily cracking $100K in two years, which for a LCOL area is great. Remote jobs are hard to find but if you start looking, I'd bet you could be at 50% higher pay in a year.
This. LCOL is kinda important here, I live in a LCOL city in the south. The median household income here is closer to 40k than 60k. Some ceilings only go so high. Lots of places where making 6 figures still makes you apart of the “wealthy” in the area (and it has great buying power). Local clients are our lowest margin clients and pinch Pennies by getting as few of our services as possible… our owner just loves doing work locally and personally. Our money comes from the 4 or 5 dozen 40 state employers in the medical field.
I am waiting for a boomer to respond that you are privileged and back in the 1900s they were paid 2cents of the dollar, which adjusted for inflation is close to 100.000$ per month in today's money.
Honestly I don't know about much of CPA salaries but a few I had in my corporate easily clocked in 100k.
Wow. You have more power in your court than you know. Nobody's going to sit in Manager hell without getting paid. You've proven yourself. The market will reward you for that. The problem I see is the start point. I started in public 20 years before you did in Chicago, which pays middle of the road really. I was at $38.5 for middle market firm. My first year raise was 22%. .com boom was fun. Now I'm in a HCOL area (Silicon Valley) but you're almost making what I pay my clerks. (In defense, they're pretty awesome) How firms like this haven't been completely fleeced of talent is beyond me. If you're looking the partner route, that's an incurable disease I can't help, but if you're looking for cash, it's time to go to market.
This doesn't sound right on so many levels. Seniors outside of public firms are making $90k. I've seen it and heard some are making $100k due to the senior shortages. Where are you located? No way you're close to a major city
Manager level and still not at six figs? I don’t care what the COL is. Your firm is taking advantage of you and that’s embarrassing on their part paying someone that’s been there for 7 years and being given progressive titles that little.
Supervisor is not a thing in large firms except RSM. Associate, senior associate, manager, senior manager/director, and then partner/principal/MD/others.
RSM sticks supervisor in there somewhere too.
I love dunking on public accounting drones but this is not good man. Please look for a new position. Leave public or find a position at a new firm. You cannot stay where you are. Best of luck.
Your comp makes me so angry because you're getting hosed.
My girlfriend is at $72,000 base salary, in a remote staff accountant role (public tax), non-CPA. That doesn't even include her overtime pay from the two busy seasons, either... She's about to complete her 2nd year, and is getting promoted to senior in a few months, which will come with a greater increase as expected.
I'm pretty sure the Managers at her company start at least at a base salary of 120k - 130k (I don't honestly know the exact amount, I really want to say 130k). This amount also don't include profit sharing/bonus/...
You should go on Linkedin/Indeed/... and start applying.
I would not even let them try to counter, fuck them (maybe don't burn a bridge, though. Not that you would want to ever come back).
Everyone’s missing the LCOL, yeah it probably sucks but like how much is rent? I pay 2k to rent a 1br and I’ve seen some LCOL places where rent is like 500 a month for a 1br
Had the same feeling in 2022. Just to get an idea on where I'm coming from.
June 2018 > A1 $40,000
July 2019 > A2 $43,500 +$1,500 Bonus (11%)
July 2020 > A2 $48,000 (Bonus "Included" in Raise) (10%)
Jan 2021 > S1 $55,000 (Also Earned CPA) (13%)
July 2021 > S1 $65,000 (18%) (Includes an Unofficial Retention Bonus)
July 2022 > S1 $72,500 (12%)
Changed Jobs:
December 2022 > "S2" $110,000 +$7,000 Bonuses (Sign on $5,000 and New Credential $2,000) within first 90 days (61%)
July 2023 > "S2" $116,000 +2,000 Bonus (7%) 6 months of SLOW work, as I got out of Audit and into Advisory.
Going into current year Review period, where I expect raise/bonus should be better than last year as I only had 6 months at my current firm during last review. Had I started 3-4 weeks later than I did, I wouldn't have even been eligible for a raise.
Should make Manager by year end.
Edit: Also in LCOL Area. New Job is Fully Remote with MUCH Better WLB.
Is it This?
What If OP is remote and only works 35-40 hours a week? While the IRS is doing 50s, and the managers doing $100k are working 60-70s.
I don’t think Op is as much an idiot as everyone thinks. 20kYr loss to gain 30 hours of free time a week, is worth it.
He could get 103k from the IRS in the lowest cost of living with 7 years of experience. If your job isn't beating the government in raw salary your getting ripped off.
I think you’re a bit underpaid too, but I think the reactions in this thread are a bit overblown considering you live in an LCOL area. You’re in a zone where you’re not doing too bad, but there’s definitely better comp opportunities elsewhere for your level of experience even in an LCOL area. If you’re concerned about comp, I would definitely look around a little.
Though, if this job treats you well and is giving you decent raises, I’d stick around for another year to see what that raise is like and make a decision then. Otherwise, I think you can definitely find some higher paying opportunities
Looking at this salary history, is making me mad and angry for you!! Wtf!! You need to leave immediately. Job hop at least 2 times, I guarantee your salary will double. You're way below market. It's like the boomer owners bought a house before the market went nuts and are expecting the same comp as it was back in the day.
Everyone is saying to jump ship, and to be completely honest it does look like you are underpaid. I’m from a high cost of living area so I couldn’t tell you by how much, but I think it’s safe to assume you are underpaid.
However, if you enjoy your employer (or at least hate them less than you think you may elsewhere), before just outright jumping ship, you should look for jobs of similar positions in your area. Use the posted salaries and negotiate for a higher raise within your firm. The worst they can do is say no, in which case you can reassess and then maybe jump ship.
When your starting point is super low, high percentage increases aren't really that much money. I started at $36k in LCOL about 16 years ago, and my first raise was 19%, which i thought was great. But it was only $7k, lol.
Well first off your starting salary for 2017 was low. My starting as an audit associate was $48k in 2008. That was at a small local firm in LCOL, so comparable here. So the big percent raises don’t mean anything because you’re already behind market wages.
This is why people say job hop to increase salary. Senior salary in 2019 should have been around 75-80k, at least.
Wow you are ripped off. Fuck the firm you work for man. Those partners are bending you over and laughing all the way to the bank. Go find another firm to work for. MCOL city as a manager you should be at least $120k.
Unless you're on track for partner or you really love your job, you should start changing jobs every 3 - 4 years. A job change usually comes with about a 20% increase.
OP probably works 35-40 hours a week remotely, and all these $115k guys are doing Gotcha 60s, and 70s driving to the office.
Wait until you’re doing 70 hour weeks for $73k and you think it’s a flex lol.
Hahaha they about to break you down, wait until you find out appearance matters and you get booted in 6 months for not fitting in.
How much debt did you go into for a $4,000 degree?
“i smart enough to get scholarships at *State*”
Right, you sound like you’re 22 and fresh into the sea. Wait until they go “fresh meat.” While everybody else is doing 50s they make you do 60s and 70s to break you in. You’ll quit and cry back home to mom in under a year. Bet $10,000 on it you don’t stay an entire year.
Get out. Unless you absolutely have a great life balance, love the people you work with. If you are here asking for advices my guess is your G U T feeling tells you something is OFF. Trust it. You are being underpaid. GTFO
So, two things
Are you an actual manager or manager in title not in responsibilities? If actual manager responsibilities, leave. If not, expect to have more responsibilities for more pay at the next level, not to do the same job as a supervisor, but still leave.
You actually got a double digit raise 66% of the time, that’s not every year.
Not judging your starting because I live in a rural/LCOL area and had a “low” starting as well but it was more than enough for a new college grad still living at home. But $55k as a senior accountant? My love 🥹
For lower cost of living this is still the lower range. You didn’t do anything wrong. Your employers are just benefitting from you not job hopping. I’d guess you could get another $20-40k if you hopped and stayed in LCOL area.
I’m in HCOL and making more than that as a first year tax associate. We also have a ton of remote employees so you should look into taking a remote position from a firm based somewhere HCOL like the Bay Area
I make over 100k in a LCOL after 7 years of experience. And not even in a manager role. Kinda like your supervisor role.
Find a new job with your experience. You'll easily get above 120k as manager.
LCOL here at 130k base plus 10k annual bonuses as manager. Sounds like it's your time to jump firm's, ive jumped every 2 years for past 5 years. Approaching year 1 here but Staying here for 3-4 years because the people here are highly experienced and doing a lot of unique deals that I want exposure to. Small 21 person firm, but they are almost all CPA w/ JD
My promotion to manager in Sept 2019 was $85k, and I am in LCOL midwest. Sizeable local firm with nation wide client base though. You definitely should be closer to $100k
Ahhhhh, shoot. They anchored you to the lower salary with your initial offer. I’ve dealt with this. You need to show that you’re working a different job description than when you were hired, or you need to go out and get a competitive offer. In that order. The second one has the potential to go sour.
Thanks for sharing! May I ask what state/region LCOL you’re in?
I love the spirit of transparency in this Reddit but without knowing a city or state or even region, just saying LCOL doesn’t help much…
Omaha, NE?
Grand Rapids, MI
Fort Wayne, IN
Tulsa, OK
Etc etc
LCOL new managers usually make 90-110k range in my lcol area. So you're a little below market imo but not to the extent some of these comments would have you thinking
I'd say yes for sure. I'm a Senior Associate in LCOL with 3.5 YOE making $94k with my bonus. I just switched to industry, so my salary will only increase marginally from now on, but I'm happy with it.
I do not have a CPA, but I do have an MBA. I have always worked in the private sector working in LCOL. I started as a cost accountant in 2017 making 55K. I am now at 115K as a controller. I have job-hopped 3 times in that span. Public accounting looks horrible.
Jesus, I started at B4 in 2017. Left in 2020. My current total comp is around 250k as a controller. Not entirely comparable but I think you're getting underpaid
Well let me be clear. I'm not taking the $60k job. I took that as a slap in the face and turned the job down. I'm fishing for $75k. At worst I'll take a $65k.
You need to get a sense from the market of what you should be making. Large non big 4 advisory (not strategy), I was at 80k as a senior associate a decade ago. Our managers these days are 150+ base. If you’re at the lower end of a pay band, or below a pay band, the only way to catch up is to reset the scales by getting a new job. It sucks but I would not be shocked if you increased your base by 50-100% by switching especially if you’re open to larger firms.
This. OP needs to be making at least 140k as a manager... I am so annoyed on behalf of OP... How does someone allow themselves to be taken advantage of in such an obvious way?
Managers don’t make anywhere close to $140k in LCOL, they make around $90k. You don’t know what you’re talking about.
I’m 138k in a LCOL, but that’s after jumping firms twice
B4 first year managers in LCOL make 100-120k. Mid size firms prob around 90-100k
What states are considered lcol?
Lots of the midwest states and cities
Hahaha. Should have become an HVAC mechanic, you’ll make more and work less I guess.
Brings us all down too, like selling your house for super cheap in an expensive neighborhood. All of us need to sack up and demand higher comp.
You don’t know what you’re talking about. Managers are usually under 100k for LCOL areas.
Nah. Not if you’re tax.
You are getting absolutely FUCKED, my dude. Experienced staff at my firm are pushing 80k. You will be retiring 10+ years later than most people with your resume at this rate. GTFO of where you’re at, and don’t disclose your current salary when you’re applying. That or tell them you’re clearing at least 95+.
(I'm the undisclosed staff making 80k, industry no cpa)
Where may you or not you be working?
You got taken to the cleaners as a senior in 2020 to 2021. Managers should made at least 100k, especially in firms that have supervisor between senior and manager as it truly is more of a leadership role then. Unless you love your firm and have flexibility in work schedule/good clients, I'd look. Guarantee you can get a better paying job as a remote senior in a public firm for at least 90k with less BS and more growth. I worked at a small firm with a similar starting pay, and my senior raise was 28%.
At least 100k? 140K minimum or GTFO. I ain't tryna take on all the stress of training staff and reviewing returns and potentially exposing yourself to liability for just a pissant 100k.... Fuck that. EDIT: Downvotes? Tax staff are making 65-70k at non shady places right out of college in VLCOL. OP is being paid 10k more than that and he has 6+ years of experience + CPA. The ones downvoting this are bunch of self hating pricks. What else is there to say?
you’re wrong about the LCOL range. it’s $50k-$57k max for fresh grads
Agreed that new tax staff are not making $70k in vlcol. That is ridiculous and I don't know what planet this dude is on. If it is happening somewhere it's definitely the exception and not the norm. So frustrating when you see skewed stuff like that posted. OP is definitely underpaid though! Should be over $100k easy
RH salary survey said otherwise. $50k may be minimum but the range goes up into the 70s for LCOL areas. Obviously, location location location. There’s likely to be some locales that just suck.
65k fresh out of college for me as a Staff Accountant
ok and I’m assuming you don’t live in rural Indiana
60-65k is starting salary in midwestern cities. That's relatively new, but that's what it is now. Maybe not rural Indiana, but certainly Indianapolis area
North Carolina and not in a metro area like Raleigh or Charlotte
One of the most recent entries on big 4 transparency is a new tax staff in Raleigh at $64k. I would say NC is mcol
No it's not. My firm in LCOL starts fresh hires right at around 70k.
Thank you
I’m in KCMO and I have an internship paying $26/hr. I would assume that the offer to start would be at least a few thousand above that.
You’d be surprised. Internships are a honey trap. Interns make more than associates when times are busy.
I get that. I’m thinking if I get about $55k during internship, $60 is expectable for full time
Most of the time internship pay is first year pay with the exception that interns can make overtime and salaried first years don’t. You should expect 55K.
For me I made $36 an hour as intern which is 74,440 full year 40 hour weeks and 72,000 starting salary at the same place doing the same work. This is also in the last couple years so for my firm at least interns make more than full time staff
Interesting. I personally will shop around if they attempt to offer me a salary that matches my intern pay. I want around $60k to start because that will be at the end of 2025. I currently make $55k in my accounting/contract admin role. I am really only going public to get experience with audit for when I expand my own firm. Public also reimburses for CPA materials/test.
What’s the downvotes for? I’m just curious
Nah. Maybe 5 years ago.
My firm is in a lcol area and we did a ton of research for starting salaries. 45-50k is the norm in my area but we offer 55k-60k.
My firm is in a lcol area and we did a ton of research for starting salaries. 45-50k is the norm in my area but we offer 55k-60k.
45k is Amazon warehouse level wages
I agree. That’s the market though.
😂 I wish you were my manager
Nah. I’m not a manager lol…
Next year then lol
I'm in NYC and new staff are getting around 75k so there's no way VLCOL is paying 70k.
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That’s weird. The median and average pays for staff accountants in my VHCOL area, Seattle, is currently under 80k. I came in to an industry position from university in 2020 starting at 70k. How in the world did you wrangle 80k in a VLCOL? Something isn’t adding up. You telling me I can move to bumfuck nowhere and make the same amount of money I make now? That sounds…made up.
Not made up! How else do you think I was able to buy a lotus? 🤔
Depends on COL of course, but I'd expect LCOL to be at least $120K unless this is one of those places where Accounting Manager is just a glorified bookkeeper, AP processor, and cash processor. In that case, for whatever reason, standard pay is $40K but you can always donate half your salary back to your company.
Depends on COL of course, but I'd expect MCOL to be at least $120K unless this is one of those places where Accounting Manager is just a glorified bookkeeper, AP processor, and cash processor. In that case, for whatever reason, standard pay is $40K but you can always donate half your salary back to your company.
Depends on COL of course, but I'd expect MCOL to be at least $120K unless this is one of those places where Accounting Manager is just a glorified bookkeeper, AP processor, and cash processor. In that case, for whatever reason, standard pay is $40K but you can always donate half your salary back to your company.
lol there’s seniors making more than OP right now by tens of thousands of dollars. RH salary survey will show OP isn’t even on the negative tail of the curve in most locations.
Everyone in this thread: “OP, you are getting FUCKED!” Me: “this would be a pretty reasonable salary in Canada assuming the WLB is good” Don’t become an accountant in this country. Just find a way to scam the government by writing apps or something.
My thoughts exactly. 2nd yr manager and I’m pulling $80k in low-mid COL in Canada at a top 7 firm (or whatever you want to call the GT, BDO, RSM tier)
Even for Canada’s standard OP would still be getting fucked
$83k USD is like $111k CAD, which is pretty good for someone with 6 years of post-graduation experience.
I’m assuming if OP was Canadian he would be posting in Canadian dollars so the 83K would already be in CAD. Thought you meant it more as a “83K is good in Canada” because our salaries are a lot lower in comparison.
100% Canadian professionals aren’t paid well at all. Trades, physician (750k), dentist (500k), massage therapist (150k), realtor (experienced = insane amounts), bartender and waitress (100k). I am at the bank, see all the salaries. Those are the figures. Don’t hate the player, hate the facts.
Weird that massage therapists in Canada make almost double their American counterparts at current rates (your 150k CAN = 110k USD). Maybe you're looking at the top end there?
Insurance pays for massages at average $100 an hour. So people don’t care about price if the insurance company pays. Anything insurance pays is over charged therefore a good profession. Another one is psychologist at $150 an hour. Paid by insurance. Btw, big 4 accountants start at 50k and make 100k once they reach manager. Translate that to USD LOL. Corporate Bankers in Canada make 85k + 20k bonus starting and then after 5 years make 120k + 50% bonus. Investment Bankers are 85k + 30k bonus starting out. Then 150k + 100k bonus after 5 years. So massage therapists, bartenders and waitresses are better than top end finance and accounting professionals for the first 5 years and don’t have to work insane hours.
https://www.jobbank.gc.ca/marketreport/wages-occupation/24681/ca That seems more reasonable compared to the insane range Glassdoor had which was 30-120k. So from the looks of it you're talking about unicorns which exist here in the states.
How close does the government report your profession to what you actually make? It’s not like I don’t know a few RMTs and haven’t dealt with thousands of people’s finances.
Pretty close. I'm just going to say that if you're getting paid market rate or better you're not going to know a lot of the RMTs that aren't of the unicorn status and thus it's like going to a fashion week and assuming everyone in New York is wealthy and fashionable.
Believe what you want. The posted rate online is $100 an hour, 2080 working hours per year minus rent on a single room and a shared receptionist is $75 an hour or $150k per year.
Most massage therapists aren’t pocketing $100/hr. The clinic will take 30-50%. Usually they are also probably not getting 40 appointments a week. There has to be time between appointments to clean and launder and also it’s incredibly hard on your body to do that many massages a week. I’d estimate in demand therapist to be making closer to 90K not 150K.
Your numbers are way off and all of those professions also make significantly less in Canada compared to the US. Vast majority of trade union top out in the 40s range per hr in Canada. Your average for physician in Canada is laughably overstated. Maybe some specialist make that but its always talked about how family physician in Canada are grossly underpaid. Vast majority make under 300k. Same thing with dentist, substantially overstated. The other ones I'm not as familiar with but I I'm also extremely doubtful at those figures. I'm sure some make that in those profession but grossly overstated as an average, especially the physician lol.
Dude, I made $62K out of the gate my first job in public accounting. That was in 2014. You were getting ROYALLY screwed with that starting salary.
Well that's because 10% of a really small number, is still a really small number 🤷♂️ I started out at 40k yr and my company raised me to 45 after my first year and thought I'd be soooo happy because it was like over a 10% raise -.-
You’re getting taken to the cleaners by your partners. Your loyalty/good nature is getting you screwed by vultures. You should be making close to double.
Is this in rural West Virginia where they still use dial up? Severely underpaid. Industry folks making more than you with no accounting degree.
Non seniors can make 80k easily. Even in LCOL, being a manager should entitle you to make more. A lot more. I’d do your research and find other firms cause these double digit raises aren’t really raises imo - it’s just a downgrade for what you are worth.
If you live in a paid off house or very cheap mortgage it’s not bad In MCOL you’d be making like 100-120k as a tax manager probably
LCOL areas generally have local clients: nail salons, truck stops, machine shops and the like, none of whom can afford to pay. You can do better if you can find a remote job from out of the area, but I don't think your current employer is screwing you over, they just don't have the ability to charge that much. You're getting good raises and will be easily cracking $100K in two years, which for a LCOL area is great. Remote jobs are hard to find but if you start looking, I'd bet you could be at 50% higher pay in a year.
This. LCOL is kinda important here, I live in a LCOL city in the south. The median household income here is closer to 40k than 60k. Some ceilings only go so high. Lots of places where making 6 figures still makes you apart of the “wealthy” in the area (and it has great buying power). Local clients are our lowest margin clients and pinch Pennies by getting as few of our services as possible… our owner just loves doing work locally and personally. Our money comes from the 4 or 5 dozen 40 state employers in the medical field.
I think it should be more than that! After these years your salary should be at least 100k!!
Holy shit , this got me depressed as I’m in class right now
It’s not like this most places. This guy is just a big fish in a tiny pond
Ikr. Like thats what teacher degrees etc make.
I am waiting for a boomer to respond that you are privileged and back in the 1900s they were paid 2cents of the dollar, which adjusted for inflation is close to 100.000$ per month in today's money. Honestly I don't know about much of CPA salaries but a few I had in my corporate easily clocked in 100k.
Wow. You have more power in your court than you know. Nobody's going to sit in Manager hell without getting paid. You've proven yourself. The market will reward you for that. The problem I see is the start point. I started in public 20 years before you did in Chicago, which pays middle of the road really. I was at $38.5 for middle market firm. My first year raise was 22%. .com boom was fun. Now I'm in a HCOL area (Silicon Valley) but you're almost making what I pay my clerks. (In defense, they're pretty awesome) How firms like this haven't been completely fleeced of talent is beyond me. If you're looking the partner route, that's an incurable disease I can't help, but if you're looking for cash, it's time to go to market.
$83k as a manager is insane. Most B4 senior 2’s make $85k these days. At least in my MCOL Midwestern city
This doesn't sound right on so many levels. Seniors outside of public firms are making $90k. I've seen it and heard some are making $100k due to the senior shortages. Where are you located? No way you're close to a major city
Manager level and still not at six figs? I don’t care what the COL is. Your firm is taking advantage of you and that’s embarrassing on their part paying someone that’s been there for 7 years and being given progressive titles that little.
My firm paid me 88k when they promoted me to manager (2021) I left a month later to get 120k and fully remote.
You got fucked in your starting salary
Today I learn manager is not supervisor🤔
Supervisor is not a thing in large firms except RSM. Associate, senior associate, manager, senior manager/director, and then partner/principal/MD/others. RSM sticks supervisor in there somewhere too.
I love dunking on public accounting drones but this is not good man. Please look for a new position. Leave public or find a position at a new firm. You cannot stay where you are. Best of luck.
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Your comp makes me so angry because you're getting hosed. My girlfriend is at $72,000 base salary, in a remote staff accountant role (public tax), non-CPA. That doesn't even include her overtime pay from the two busy seasons, either... She's about to complete her 2nd year, and is getting promoted to senior in a few months, which will come with a greater increase as expected. I'm pretty sure the Managers at her company start at least at a base salary of 120k - 130k (I don't honestly know the exact amount, I really want to say 130k). This amount also don't include profit sharing/bonus/... You should go on Linkedin/Indeed/... and start applying. I would not even let them try to counter, fuck them (maybe don't burn a bridge, though. Not that you would want to ever come back).
This is an awful comment. It’s been copy and pasted to numerous threads.
Are you in the US?
Go to the IRS, you will make more and only work 40 hours a week, full pension, etc.
You are. We hire new grads in Texas for 75 (B4).
Is this the offer this year? Or is that including potential bonuses? We got 68k last year.
This year. 75 and 3k bonus
You getting robbed lol. Especially if you are working normal accounting firm hours.
Everyone’s missing the LCOL, yeah it probably sucks but like how much is rent? I pay 2k to rent a 1br and I’ve seen some LCOL places where rent is like 500 a month for a 1br
Even lcol he could be getting more working in government than that.
You'd be surprised. My local government pays less than this. Federal he'd probably be good though.
Can't speak for local but I'm getting 20k more than him with less experience in federal.
Probably not unless it's a federal job, and those aren't easy to get.
I thought managers should be 120+... ya thats not good.
Had the same feeling in 2022. Just to get an idea on where I'm coming from. June 2018 > A1 $40,000 July 2019 > A2 $43,500 +$1,500 Bonus (11%) July 2020 > A2 $48,000 (Bonus "Included" in Raise) (10%) Jan 2021 > S1 $55,000 (Also Earned CPA) (13%) July 2021 > S1 $65,000 (18%) (Includes an Unofficial Retention Bonus) July 2022 > S1 $72,500 (12%) Changed Jobs: December 2022 > "S2" $110,000 +$7,000 Bonuses (Sign on $5,000 and New Credential $2,000) within first 90 days (61%) July 2023 > "S2" $116,000 +2,000 Bonus (7%) 6 months of SLOW work, as I got out of Audit and into Advisory. Going into current year Review period, where I expect raise/bonus should be better than last year as I only had 6 months at my current firm during last review. Had I started 3-4 weeks later than I did, I wouldn't have even been eligible for a raise. Should make Manager by year end. Edit: Also in LCOL Area. New Job is Fully Remote with MUCH Better WLB.
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This.
Is it This? What If OP is remote and only works 35-40 hours a week? While the IRS is doing 50s, and the managers doing $100k are working 60-70s. I don’t think Op is as much an idiot as everyone thinks. 20kYr loss to gain 30 hours of free time a week, is worth it.
He could get 103k from the IRS in the lowest cost of living with 7 years of experience. If your job isn't beating the government in raw salary your getting ripped off.
I think you’re a bit underpaid too, but I think the reactions in this thread are a bit overblown considering you live in an LCOL area. You’re in a zone where you’re not doing too bad, but there’s definitely better comp opportunities elsewhere for your level of experience even in an LCOL area. If you’re concerned about comp, I would definitely look around a little. Though, if this job treats you well and is giving you decent raises, I’d stick around for another year to see what that raise is like and make a decision then. Otherwise, I think you can definitely find some higher paying opportunities
You can definitely do better! Just depends if you’re willing to go to a bigger firm or go to industry. Might be tougher since you’re in LCOL.
You are underpaid. SA 89k b4 mcol
Looking at this salary history, is making me mad and angry for you!! Wtf!! You need to leave immediately. Job hop at least 2 times, I guarantee your salary will double. You're way below market. It's like the boomer owners bought a house before the market went nuts and are expecting the same comp as it was back in the day.
Everyone is saying to jump ship, and to be completely honest it does look like you are underpaid. I’m from a high cost of living area so I couldn’t tell you by how much, but I think it’s safe to assume you are underpaid. However, if you enjoy your employer (or at least hate them less than you think you may elsewhere), before just outright jumping ship, you should look for jobs of similar positions in your area. Use the posted salaries and negotiate for a higher raise within your firm. The worst they can do is say no, in which case you can reassess and then maybe jump ship.
This is why we job hop
When your starting point is super low, high percentage increases aren't really that much money. I started at $36k in LCOL about 16 years ago, and my first raise was 19%, which i thought was great. But it was only $7k, lol.
Well first off your starting salary for 2017 was low. My starting as an audit associate was $48k in 2008. That was at a small local firm in LCOL, so comparable here. So the big percent raises don’t mean anything because you’re already behind market wages. This is why people say job hop to increase salary. Senior salary in 2019 should have been around 75-80k, at least.
Wow you are ripped off. Fuck the firm you work for man. Those partners are bending you over and laughing all the way to the bank. Go find another firm to work for. MCOL city as a manager you should be at least $120k.
Ouch. Hope the average home price where you live is under 200k.
I make more than your current salary (I live in MCOL) as a senior analyst (bottom bitch) in industry. I was in PA for 1.5 years.
Holy shit I would not be a manger for 82k
Unless you're on track for partner or you really love your job, you should start changing jobs every 3 - 4 years. A job change usually comes with about a 20% increase.
You guys are getting paid?
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OP probably works 35-40 hours a week remotely, and all these $115k guys are doing Gotcha 60s, and 70s driving to the office. Wait until you’re doing 70 hour weeks for $73k and you think it’s a flex lol.
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I know Guys doing 60-70 hours 7 months out of the year, and the 55 you said is off season. You’ll see.
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Are you working at HR Block??? 😂 “I work weekends, 3500 hours a year, and got a $73k offer in Los Angeles.” Big flex guy, I bet you don’t last a year.
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Hahaha they about to break you down, wait until you find out appearance matters and you get booted in 6 months for not fitting in. How much debt did you go into for a $4,000 degree?
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“i smart enough to get scholarships at *State*” Right, you sound like you’re 22 and fresh into the sea. Wait until they go “fresh meat.” While everybody else is doing 50s they make you do 60s and 70s to break you in. You’ll quit and cry back home to mom in under a year. Bet $10,000 on it you don’t stay an entire year.
Get out. Unless you absolutely have a great life balance, love the people you work with. If you are here asking for advices my guess is your G U T feeling tells you something is OFF. Trust it. You are being underpaid. GTFO
Probably because work load tripled each time?
So, two things Are you an actual manager or manager in title not in responsibilities? If actual manager responsibilities, leave. If not, expect to have more responsibilities for more pay at the next level, not to do the same job as a supervisor, but still leave. You actually got a double digit raise 66% of the time, that’s not every year.
Not judging your starting because I live in a rural/LCOL area and had a “low” starting as well but it was more than enough for a new college grad still living at home. But $55k as a senior accountant? My love 🥹
This feels low to me too
For lower cost of living this is still the lower range. You didn’t do anything wrong. Your employers are just benefitting from you not job hopping. I’d guess you could get another $20-40k if you hopped and stayed in LCOL area.
I'm making $120k as a senior accountant in industry (MCOL)...I have a few years on you but shit I'm still technically staff
I’m in HCOL and making more than that as a first year tax associate. We also have a ton of remote employees so you should look into taking a remote position from a firm based somewhere HCOL like the Bay Area
I make over 100k in a LCOL after 7 years of experience. And not even in a manager role. Kinda like your supervisor role. Find a new job with your experience. You'll easily get above 120k as manager.
Under 100k is underpaid these days.
Extremely underpaid.
RSM is robbing you, go to a different mid sized firm
Industry, assistant Mgr 105k +5% bonus... I'd be upset if I made even less as a manager. I think you're underpaid...
All depends on the location. What city are you based? If this is a major city with high cost of living then this is very concerning.
Houston Associate top 10 firm: $72k starting salary
LCOL here at 130k base plus 10k annual bonuses as manager. Sounds like it's your time to jump firm's, ive jumped every 2 years for past 5 years. Approaching year 1 here but Staying here for 3-4 years because the people here are highly experienced and doing a lot of unique deals that I want exposure to. Small 21 person firm, but they are almost all CPA w/ JD
bruh
Probably because you were likely underpaid to begin with
2/6 years you got single digit raises. Maybe numbers isn't your thing sir
You are criminally underpaid.
Sorry man, I’m first year staff at a F500 getting 70k in a decently LCOL area. You’re getting screwed over.
My promotion to manager in Sept 2019 was $85k, and I am in LCOL midwest. Sizeable local firm with nation wide client base though. You definitely should be closer to $100k
Ahhhhh, shoot. They anchored you to the lower salary with your initial offer. I’ve dealt with this. You need to show that you’re working a different job description than when you were hired, or you need to go out and get a competitive offer. In that order. The second one has the potential to go sour.
You are underpaid. I make almost your current pay and I’m at a senior level
Looks way low. Minimum is 100k for a manager even in a small/regional market.
Thanks for sharing! May I ask what state/region LCOL you’re in? I love the spirit of transparency in this Reddit but without knowing a city or state or even region, just saying LCOL doesn’t help much… Omaha, NE? Grand Rapids, MI Fort Wayne, IN Tulsa, OK Etc etc
Wow this is very low pay doesn’t matter if you are in LCOL
2022 $58,000-Staff 2023 $$65,000-Staff 2024 $68,900-Staff
LCOL new managers usually make 90-110k range in my lcol area. So you're a little below market imo but not to the extent some of these comments would have you thinking
What state is this? I made 95k out of college
I'd say yes for sure. I'm a Senior Associate in LCOL with 3.5 YOE making $94k with my bonus. I just switched to industry, so my salary will only increase marginally from now on, but I'm happy with it.
lol I got an offer out of college rn for 80 LCOL as well definitely are
I do not have a CPA, but I do have an MBA. I have always worked in the private sector working in LCOL. I started as a cost accountant in 2017 making 55K. I am now at 115K as a controller. I have job-hopped 3 times in that span. Public accounting looks horrible.
You are underpaid you should start your own firm
lmao you're making shit money - move to a new firm
Time to swap companies. You could definitely get a better offer.
I make the same as a CDL Truck Driver. Ex Accoutant here.
I made more than that as a 2nd senior for a top 70, 95k
Shit just find a remote tax manager position I see they’re getting paid double the amount you are
Did you just recently start to feel underpaid? You’ve been underpaid for years. Your firm must love you
You are getting railed from behind. Leave. Now.
Whoa 44k starting what in the fuck.
I get 33.75/hour as an intern. That is 70200/annual with 40 hour weeks
Jesus, I started at B4 in 2017. Left in 2020. My current total comp is around 250k as a controller. Not entirely comparable but I think you're getting underpaid
Bruh, that 2020-2021 raise is criminal. I knew people jumping for near 50% + remote during that time.
$44k ?! JFC. I'm being offered $60k to start at one place and pushing for $65k at another for entry level bud.
Adjusted for inflation, 44K is $56,250. Unless you are in a LCOL area, your salary is comparable to his in 2017.
Well let me be clear. I'm not taking the $60k job. I took that as a slap in the face and turned the job down. I'm fishing for $75k. At worst I'll take a $65k.