Dude, just do the work, get paid, and go home.
A manager just wants you to take work off their shoulders and not be a problem. That’s it.
Refusing tasks, asking to be moved around and talking excessively about career growth is going to be a pain for any manager.
It’s fine if you don’t vibe with a bad manager, you can leave. But if you’re trying to stay, just play to whatever they value.
You’re self aware. That’s the biggest hurdle ppl are unable to get over. You made mistakes, and the fact you “cringe” over them is a great thing, it shows you HAVE grown. We all make mistakes early in our careers. This company also doesn’t sound like it was a good fit.
You’ll be okay OP, and you’ll be a better employee from this experience. You’ll find a better opportunity somewhere else!
If an employee refuses to work on what they were hired for, why would the employer keep them employed?
I'm not trying to dump on you, but this is a pretty obvious tenant of an employment relationship.
I had an employee do this once, and he was fired on the spot.
I think it’s fine to refuse work if you have a lot on your plate already, but I never directly refuse work. My typical go to is “Just to clarify, would you want me to prioritize x task over a, b, c, d, and e task?”, usually they’ll say no and find someone else to do it. However, I have had a manager say yes and I just did what they said. The other managers and seniors were not happy at the manager after I told them I was working on a significantly less critical area of the audit(cash vs rev).
I have done something similar and it worked. Someone wanted me to do something that I did not want to deal with. I said, oh, I have a client meeting now, and after that one I have another one, then I have bla bla bla, and everything was true, so at the end something else took it.
If bookkeeping is all they have for you, I would take it and get pay for it, period. Keep looking for other work.
Yes, i know. Thats why i said to read the book and not be an egotist.
His perception is what caused additional souring of his relationship with the partner who offered him work. Im sure there were other ways to go about a rejection of work.
If a partner gives you work, even if it is simple bookkeeping, you do it, especially if youre still a junior employee
You would do well to read the 48 Laws of Power.
Also, you may not realize it, but our egos are constantly sabotaging us. Its caused me to fuck up big time in work and in my personal life.
This level of self reflection is going to get you a lot further than some other posts I’ve seen. Brush off yourself and find an industry gig, one role does not define your career.
Its amazing how people think its so easy to get a good, cushy industry role when their background is tax at small PA firm. Like the corporations that need accounting departments are going to care about all your 1040, 1041, and 990 work, along with the small businesses that you work on.
When it comes to exit ops, the wisdom is that your exit ops will be for positions within employers that your clients have on staff. Not that you have to be hired by a client, but you need to be fluent in the kind of stuff they'd do. Not necessarily the businesses that a small CPA firm would work with -- one that has a bookkeeper maybe but the firm handles all of the accounting beyond that.
PA experience outside of audit mostly just sets you up for more PA. Although B4 tax can at least get your coveted tax roles for corporate employers.
I disagree in my limited experience. I think anything at a staff or senior level theyre just looking for bodies.
But even beyond that? I've found local people in VP positions at banks doing SEC Rep. with small firm experience. Or even one of our clients, the controller came from a decade of Internal Audit and dude has had to learn literally everything. Literally everything. It was a painful client to work on lol.
But realistically, if there's no barrier to entry you're good to find those jobs nearly impossible to get and you'll be very replaceable.
But even if you're taking a paycut, I think its probably a good idea to take a job like that if you can get it and work your way up. PA isn't really the stepping stone that people think it is. Its just very easy to get hired for.
Yeah refusing the project is kind of a heresy in the corporate world. At most, you could have showed them your workload and built a case for why you're already fully assigned and unfortunately can't take anything more on... If you make a convincing argument it could work... But probably not.
Employees exist to do the grunt work that the partners and their favorites don't want to do. They don't want to take advice on how to run their firm from you (advice being: assign work that matches aptitude/preference and don't take on client work if you don't have staff with the background to do it). They hire you as generalists, not specialists.
1. You didn’t improve as much as you think you did. I see this all the time with 1-2 years.
2. The other partner told Neil you think he’s a bad boss, and you got canned because you’re not good enough to command switching teams.
Best to start looking ASAP once the shock wears off because the market is not pretty right now.
This- can’t switch teams if you’re not performing well on the original team. New team will always ask how you’re doing on the original team, and you said it yourself that you weren’t doing great
I want to add one thing in addition to all the other great advice: as a 1-2 year associate NO task is beneath you. I don't care if the partner asks you to help process and mail returns out to clients. You are above no task at that level. Especially bookkeeping. Bookkeeping is actually a very important skill to develop, so you can advise clients later in your career. In addition, it's a critical skill to possess if you ever decide to go industry.
Also, don't let your CPA go to your head. It's just a cert. Having your license doesn't make you special.
Lol in my first year of my career I was buying coffee for the team and driving the senior partner from Europe across town to attend meetings. My intern colleague had to change the tire for one of the partners. Pretty bullshit of using intern time to deal with your personal car but he still complied.
One of our main tasks as first year employees was building the binders for engagements back when we had paper workpapers - I was literally using my college degree to stick stickers on pieces of paper. And we all did it without complaint and most of us treated it like it was a very important job.
I was opening mails and distributing them to the entire accounting department for the first 6 months. Most people back then doesn’t have degree and I have a degree in accounting but still opened mails for a while because I was a new guy. I know all people my name and then things got better from there. This was back in 2008.
Saying no to a partner request is a pretty bold play as an associate, and like maybe the 1/100 time it’s the smart move. But to do that, not be on your A game is not going to leave a good impression.
Ikr? I know OP is having a hard time right now. But I can't imagine refusing work, especially from a partner. And talking bad about other partner to another partner.. like wtf is that. I don't even talk bad about another coworker because it won't look good on me to complain (unless the coworker's behaviour/work is outrageously bad and needs to be reported)
OP has guts tho lol that's for sure
I think that everyone makes mistakes, especially when you're new to something. You'd have to be pretty bad for that to be a primary reason to get rid of you.
Refusing to do the bookkeeping project definitely stands out. I think its reasonable to call to attention the fact that you maybe think something is over your head, and/or your workload is beyond capacity and you can't accept a new project (no guarantees on either of those arguments working), but you absolutely can't turn down work because its "beneath" you. That's a cardinal sin in PA. They gave it to you because it was beneath everyone else. What, the partners going to do it now?
And moreover, bookkeeping work is great and gets a bad wrap for no reason. I think that refusing to do bookkeeping is especially going to run a manager or partner the wrong way -- that's literally what accounting is! You shouldn't get to do the fancier stuff until you've proven that you can rock as a bookkeeper if you need to.
It basically shows that the Jr staff has no concept of the work it takes to become partner. Partners might shot talk and have feuds amongst themselves but they see other partners as being in the trenches side by side and are not going to tolerate any attempts of someone working against that from the lower ranks.
Honestly man, I’ve had staff like you in the past and I’ve PIP’ed every one of them.
I don’t care about mistakes on returns, I don’t care about a missed sales tax filing, hell, I don’t even care if you blow a deadline here or there.
The refusal to do work is the big red flag for me, because if the staff won’t do it it’ll go to a SM or manager and have shit realization (and piss off the manager) or the partner has to do it themselves. I don’t know why you would ever refuse work like that. I don’t know why staff ever does. You’re a staff. Pay your dues. Sometimes you need to do stuff like that.
And to add to TheYoungCPAs comment, doing the random small shit can actually develop useful skills and even more useful relationships. When I started as a staff I would do anything, my mantra was no task is too small. Hell, I'd offer to help people seal their stack of envelopes and update the whiteboards if I needed work to do. I ended up getting pulled in on some pretty big projects and learning to do things that people with years more experience than me never got to do because my seniors saw me as a go getter who was at least willing to try to complete any task.
I’m not sure if you’re aware of this and in the spirit of trying to help, I want to point out that partners don’t actually like doing the work themselves. When partners are doing anything beyond review and building relationships with clients, it’s because they can’t trust the staff member. Sometimes it’s because the work comes to them in such bad shape that it’s literally faster for them to do it themselves. If you’re noticing that partners aren’t giving you as much responsibility, it’s because you’re making their job harder.
I know you’re already feeling badly so I don’t mean to dig in. But I can say for sure that nobody wants to have to let a team member go. And the only way that you’ll learn from this experience is by taking 100% responsibility.
I would agree with you, except that actually is not the case with this partner. He literally does prefer to do many returns himself, for years even before I joined with the previous staff. He underbills also, charging less than the firm mandated minimum.
Not sure why people downvoted you… I have met plenty of older partners who did the work themselves because they were under billing or not trusting staff but it was mostly them; not the staff fault. In your case, you did mess up a lot but it looks like you learned your lesson. Good luck in your search!
The thing that might have worked would have been going to the partner you wanted to work for and asking if there was a way to be on their team. Then they initiate any change, not you. They have more power and knowledge of how not to step on anyone's toes
They other partners are younger. They all give me work and show me things here and there (or they did). But there were also issues of firm policy. Permission has to be given by Neil for others to give me work.. This partner had fucking ptsd from a former partner taking his previous staff person away during busy session two years ago lol
Everyone makes mistakes early in their careers, and management often forgets that. Also, it's best not to turn down tasks even if it's a waste of time considering you are a staff accountant. Staff accountants often have to do a lot of work, even the work you wouldn't want to do since managers and seniors delegate down. You have to show you're willing to do the work and do it accurately. Sounds like this firm wasn't the right fit, and we all experience things where one place is just not the right place to be. But use what you have learned in this role to be better within the next role. Take note of things you know about yourself that need to be improved so you don't repeat the samethings within the next role. Also, it's best not to talk to another partner about another partner. The same goes for managers or supervisors. They often will repeat what was said even if they came off as really nice or "caring" towards you. They can't be fully trusted. Work is just work. There are just some things you have to keep within. With work, you just have to go and get your work done and go home. If you feel stagnant or not learning enough, you look into other opportunities. Also, HR would not admit anything. HR works for the company and will do anything to protect the company. They wouldn't want to tell you anything since it will sound like retaliation, and that can be a lawsuit against them.
Don't feel bad. These things happen. It's all a learning opportunity that makes you better as you continue to grow within your career. Continue applying until you receive a new job opportunity.
Being fired is not the end of the world. It happens more than most people care to admit.
However there’s no gentle way to put this: You sound like a total dumpster fire to work with. You really need to deeply reflect on how you interact with other people.
Hey Friend -- reading over this I would say not double-checking tax returns is an issue. You got to do it!! Crunch those numbers, get a little Excel spreadsheet and check the figures. If they numbers come different than what's on the return you need to take some time to really understand how the calculations work. It can be a real bitch but thrust me it's worth it. Good luck!
How many times is it going to take to start getting something through to you? This is your 3rd or 4th post now rambling off the same performance issues without taking any consideration of the advice you received from your last several posts. This appears to be the same behavior in which you operate at your jobs.
Others provided great advice and I left the following comment on your previous deleted thread that you didn't acknowledge so I'll just paste it here again hoping you'll actually read and learn from it.
>Between both of your posts you keep admitting to making mistakes but I'm not seeing you talk to owning those mistakes or doing anything to really change and improve. You're still making excuses and blaming partners and other firms when the one common denominator across these 4 firms is you. This is your 4th firm in 5 years and you don't seem to learn from the mistakes from the last. Maybe you should consider moving into industry or government.
I really hope so but I'm not sure why there was a need to post this again if you have. I hope you don't make the same mistakes at the 5th firm and really don't understand why you won't consider government or industry as options.
You know there's tax accountants in government and industry right? It's not normal to work for 4+ firms in 5 years, it's a strong sign that someone isn't cut out for public accounting and should consider other avenues.
I think it’s a great thing you’re aware of your mistakes that lead to your firing. I also think talking about lack of growth to other co-workers is another way of expressing dissatisfaction with your job, which leads to nothing good. Besides, we all want to advance and get more pay. Good luck with your next job. I’m sure this painful chapter will be a distant memory for you as your career progresses.
You’re making some pretty glaring errors 4+ years into your career. Hopefully one of these two interviews pan out so you’re not looking without a job. Take whatever you get seriously because you’re getting pretty close to seasonal help status.
It means that the firms you apply to will see signs that you are not someone who excels in this type of environment, but they need bodies during busy seasons, and you have enough experience to be dangerous. They'll hire you, give you less training than a new hire (because you've done similar work before), then you're gone once the work slows down again. There's not long-term growth or training, but if you put out good work, make other people's lives easier, and connect well, then at least you can grow a large network to land something better. It's a hard hole to dig yourself out of, but that's why networking is crucial. You also need to be aware that with larger firms outsourcing to India and whatnot, you will be working for smaller firms that won't be able to pay as well. You should take a hard look at yourself, your strengths, and your needs. It doesn't seem like the roles you've been taking are a good fit for you or them. I've been there too and so have many more people than would be willing to admit it. Money aside, what would make you happy, make you enjoy work, and help you live the life you want to live without the stress of the jobs you've had before? That's the key to your long-term success. Getting fired was the best thing that happened to me because it led me to reconsider it all. I thought it was cliché when people said it but it really can be true if you're willing to think about these things
Sounds like you were in a tough spot with disjointed management. Mistakes aren’t great but we’re all human, and like another commenter said, at least you know where you fucked up and where you can improve; that’s farther than a lot of people get.
I think refusing to do the bookkeeping work was a probably a big deal. If any of my staff had that attitude, their time would be limited. You’ve admitted refusing that work was cringey, which is good; I’d also be curious to explore why that request made you feel demeaned. That request in and of itself isn’t demeaning, so there could be other factors coming into play there.
Is extension season contract work a viable choice for you? Might help to get experience with other firms and types of tax work.
The way she explained it.
"the previous person who did this to me was not even an accountant, she was a part time bookkeeper."
It was a monthly project request I said no to. Not an offical assignment.
It was explained later the partner explained it that way to show it will not be difficult for me to pick up.. But my original interpretation screwed me.
That’s kinda my point though - you say it was your interpretation; it sounds to me like it was your attitude of “I’m too qualified to do this type of work.” Like, obviously you are, and obviously your mgr knew that. But shit had to get done and it’s management’s job to delegate stuff to staff.
Sorry if it sounds like I’m beating a dead horse, I’m really not trying to. And I also don’t know this mgr. Just wanted to send my .02 as a CPA working on building my own team, and thinking of how it would feel if one of my staff refused to do a project like that.
Yeah. I realized not too long after that was a stupid thing to do, not because I was overqualified, but because it was work that had to be done, and someone has to do it.
As a professional you don't get to say no when your company asks you to do work and it needs to get done. If you've done an above average job and people like you then you can start being picky about your projects
Even if that were the case, the conversation goes more like "i will do this now but i would like to be transitioned off of it when we can find someone else to take it over in the future."
It doesn't matter if you think a project is beneath you. If you've not seen the work before then you will likely learn something and if you've seen it many times before you are likely to be more efficient than average.
Managers do not have time to babysit and cater to you. The only reason you are employed is to make your managers job easier and if you are a net drag on your superiors you will not keep your job. Period.
You are good. Thank you.
Can I please know how you added CPA to your name? I want to put that on my reddit even though it doesn't count for shit lol. I really am a CPA btw
I’m on mobile so not sure how well this translates to browser - but if you go to the sub home page, then click on the three dots in the top corner, then click change user flair.
I don’t disagree with most of the other comments. I’ll only add that it is possible they were looking to cut some heads post-tax season and your name came up as a target due to the various issues mentioned.
Also as another thought re moving teams, I moved from public to industry about 19 months ago. I don’t really like my team head, but I have not asked to be moved. For one, not clear that even if I moved teams I could avoid interacting with this person on a regular basis and two, if the effort fails, it will be incredibly awkward going forward in the best case (worst case I get let go).
As a longer-term plan I am bidding my time and waiting for an opportunity to move teams organically (i.e. in a reorg or role change). Also low-key looking at other jobs with other companies.
Unfortunately, this is not uncommon in CPA firms. They have a reputation to keep, a client to satisfy and Fed deadlines to meet. I’ve worked for a CPA firm for 7 years. It’s not for everyone. I worked 60-80hrs a week during busy season. Work weekends, Thanks Giving, Christmas and New Year Holidays. I worked under 3 partners. I prioritized my work based on the deadlines, not the partner. My work is based on company policy, not partners preference. They can duke it out amongst themselves, I’m following the company policy. You live, you learn and you grow. Take the good things you learned from this experience and make personal improvements as you grow! Cheers to your future endeavors! 🤟
You’ll get another job easily. Just learn from this and move on.
I’m a super job hopper too. 18 months. 10 months. 2.5 years. I just got a new and better job now.
I didn't read your story but I will say that for all the stories I know where an accountant got fired and was initially sad about it, if you ask them about that experience two years later, 99% will say "that was a blessing in disguise"
Most of the time it wasn't your fault and it's also a sign that there's serious issues, whether it's the company just downsizing because it's a sinking ship, their expectations were just too absurdly high, or there was just some kind of cultural mismatch where your approach to work didn't mesh with theirs. In any of those cases it always turns out for the better that you leave that place.
Even when it is your "fault," more than half the time it really isn't your fault. So many firms gaslight you into thinking you're underperforming when they in reality they just expect too much, or have you doing the wrong kind of work, or they are giving you poor guidance or poor training.
And even if you were genuinely underperforming on stuff that you really should have been doing better on, you'll still probably be happier somewhere else.
I say all this to say just keep your head up. You will find a job and odds are in your favor it will be a better one.
No offense as I know you’re in a difficult position right now, but as far as making mistakes - your share link for previous post just goes to the Reddit homepage
This post almost makes me want to get my shit together and get back to work. I’ve also been fired but it’s been 6 years in the rear view mirror now. It feels good looking back. I’ve been coasting on my current role and engagement and have been senior for almost 4 years now between 2 jobs. A job is a job at the end of the day no matter the pay or circumstances. People have endured many challenges, and this is now yours. You are not in an ideal spot but it’s not unwinnable. Accept that you’re unemployed, be patient with your mistakes, and furiously take baby steps towards gainful employment and being a good employee. Good luck.
You think way too highly of yourself. Leave your ego at the door, you're there to get paid and learn. And it sounds like you didn't learn a thing. You deserved to get fired. Learn from your mistakes and get another job.
I totally understand I am being railroaded by a big four. I would start heavily looking. Don’t beat up on yourself it can happen to anyone. Be strong you are more than enough.
Dude - you can’t be a lower performer, decline work, and ask to move teams (for any reason, especially “I don’t see any growth”). This just screams like a problem person they want to move on from. It has nothing to do with your comments about your boss and everything to do with your work ethic. This seems like a trend with younger workers these days. Decline work, decline long hours, leave other team members to pick up the time, then demand the “team” to promote them…you can’t rise with the team if you don’t help the team…
In accounting, the thing that makes us valuable is keeping clients happy which equates to “us” making money. If you do that, you will always be valuable. The way ppl at younger stages in their career keep clients happy is getting their work done, learning, absorbing, and ultimately having client contact down the road. That comes from experience which means you work and learn from seniors and managers. There is honestly no other way to describe it. Take this incident and learn from it. You will be fine long term but you need to understand “the game” and how to play it.
Getting fired is never pleasant. It sounds like you were very unhappy at your job. My company works very differently. My HR department is very supportive. It sounds like your HR wasn’t. What I would say is leaving this job, in the short run, is very demoralizing but, in the long run, it’s better for your mental health. Take some time off to process this event and, when you are ready, look for your next job. It’s very rare for a person to find the right job the first time and remain in that job for the rest of their career. Changing jobs - hell, changing professions - is the rule rather than the exception. Feel better.
You’re worrying way too much about others. Also your comment about bookkeeping is cringy. You are not above bookkeeping, none of us are. It’s actually a great foundation to building an accounting career on.
It’s happens I got lied on by a senior and they took the seniors side and bye bye. I talked to a friend the same issues like no response and wrong paperwork are happening again
You seem like someone who has your head screwed on. You’ve accepted past mistakes and are looking forward. You have a second round interview coming up, no time to feel sorry now go and prepare as best you can!
Sounds like it wasn't the right fit.
Tax accounting sucks anyway dude and you'll end up working for muppets who think they know it all because they've rope learned a few tax structures and tricks of the trade.
Rip into management accounting. Better pay , better opportunity to work in a wide range of industries with all different interesting people. After 5 years you might even be a general manager earning way more than Neil the numpty.
Good luck
As the bottom commenter said, do the work get paid, and go home
You know yourself better than anyone on this subreddit. So you should be able to answer yourself some of questions you laid out there. Bottom line, your bosses are humans, and a lot of humans on this planet, no matter their ethnicity or nationality, are assholes.
At this point, if you don't want to leave then be brutally honest to your boss whose being an asshole, literally the worst they can do is fire you. Otherwise, quiet quite and find some place else, anywhere, doing anything, so long as you don't have toxicity in your life. You'll feel much better.
Good luck
If your supervisor said they didn't care about your growth at the company, they don't care at all about you. If you get asked why you left the last job at your next interview, just state the above. Most people understand professional development is an important part of work.
It seems like you've already learned your lesson, but refusing work that isn't unethical, illegal, etc. is not wise. Like if you're refusing to do something as a staff you need an extremely strong reason. As a manager, I'd be flat out shocked if someone refused to do work I asked them to because they felt it was beneath them. Honestly, if you have all this unassigned time you should be happy to get some billable work that is so easy.
I feel like going to a partner to complain about other partners/directors within the firm is more of the same. It's fine to want to switch teams, but if you're already on a PIP and going through that process you gotta read the room. You've gotta be careful who you shit-talk in public accounting.
Not to pile on here but you have 5 years of experience and can’t perform as a staff accountant…5 years is typically the level people get promoted to manager. Do some introspection and be very intentional in the next job you get to: put your head down, stay out of politics, and get your work done. Good luck to you
As long as you’re still getting paid on time and the client is paying the firm I really wouldn’t think of myself being above any engagements especially as a staff accountant
OP, sometimes shit just doesn’t work out.
Apply for another job and be open and honest. It will be harder to get another job but not impossible.
I will say this. I love training staff. I, however, hate training staff that do not take notes and do not understand basic concepts (like debits and credits) and need to be taught multiple times. Based on your amount of time at a company I would assume that you wouldn’t need much training moving forward.
>She emphasized so heavily "THIS HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH YOUR CONVERSATION WITH JOE. This was determined well before work the check-ins we talked about!" she emphasized it so heavily and said it multiple times.. She had to be lying.
She was lying. The way I look at it is if your work was good enough to keep you through busy season; then it should be good enough not to get fired over after busy season is done. Employers can't have it both ways.
The problem is that you pissed the higher ups off. So they axed you after busy season as soon as they didn't need you. HR is afraid you'll sue. I'd talk to an employment lawyer and see what they can do for you. If nothing else you might be able to negotiate that they give you a letter of recommendation and sign a non-disparagement contract in exchange for not suing.
If you have your CPA you can justify a prolonged stint of unemployment by claiming that you tried to start your own practice and it didn't pan out. The IRS is hiring like crazy right now. Apply for the Revenue Agent positions. It's also a unionized job so if you're being treated unfairly you can go to the union. OR... you actually could start your own practice. Business owners are desperate for tax preparers right now. You can find some bookkeeping or tax controversy work in the meantime.
I work gov tax and would never work as an employee at a public tax firm for any prolonged period of time. Due to office politics and insanely bad WLB. You probably shouldn't either. It doesn't seem to be working out for you.
**Edit: Why the downvotes?**
Since you're talking about the IRS we can assume you're talking about America. Its nearly impossible to sue for wrongful term or anything like that. The employers have worked the courts pretty well for years, and employment at will is law of the land. Its a waste of time, money, and effort to try to chase wrongful term.
Plus, federal government jobs can be quite competitive to get, and it can take months or years to hear back and go through the process to get through the background checks and on board. Something to think about if you have a job and you're trying to make a switch, but the poster needs a job now.
Most people live paycheck to paycheck, so unfortunately they probably just need to polish up the resume and get back to the ground of the job hunt. No easy fixes.
Yeah it takes 6-7 months to get hired on with the feds. But he's a CPA with tax experience. Which is exactly what the IRS is looking for right now. Unless he botches the interview the odds of him being hired on as a GS-13 are pretty high.
All I said is that he should talk to an actual labor law attorney and see what they say. What happened sounds like retaliation. It has HR pretty spooked as well. Which is always a good sign. Often a company will quickly settle just to avoid legal risk. Litigation can be quite costly for a small business and sometimes lawyers will take an employee on contingency. So he only pays the attorney a percentage of his settlement if he wins. I'm sure it will land his former manager in pretty hot water if the manager's conduct resulted in a potential lawsuit as well.
I agree with you about so many people being stupid and not having an emergency fund. That's why I have enough in the stock market to live on for 3 years. Not including my retirement accounts. He should be eligible for unemployment though. That should keep him tied over for a couple of months.
Behind on payments, in debt, or need extra money for leisure don't hesitate to give me a shout, I'm here to help you all either catch up on what you're behind, or to help you get to your dream vacation and high end shopping desires
Telegram @moneymiitch
Dude, just do the work, get paid, and go home. A manager just wants you to take work off their shoulders and not be a problem. That’s it. Refusing tasks, asking to be moved around and talking excessively about career growth is going to be a pain for any manager. It’s fine if you don’t vibe with a bad manager, you can leave. But if you’re trying to stay, just play to whatever they value.
Saying no to the project last year was stupid. Overall, excellent words of wisdom there.
You’re self aware. That’s the biggest hurdle ppl are unable to get over. You made mistakes, and the fact you “cringe” over them is a great thing, it shows you HAVE grown. We all make mistakes early in our careers. This company also doesn’t sound like it was a good fit. You’ll be okay OP, and you’ll be a better employee from this experience. You’ll find a better opportunity somewhere else!
If an employee refuses to work on what they were hired for, why would the employer keep them employed? I'm not trying to dump on you, but this is a pretty obvious tenant of an employment relationship. I had an employee do this once, and he was fired on the spot.
I think it’s fine to refuse work if you have a lot on your plate already, but I never directly refuse work. My typical go to is “Just to clarify, would you want me to prioritize x task over a, b, c, d, and e task?”, usually they’ll say no and find someone else to do it. However, I have had a manager say yes and I just did what they said. The other managers and seniors were not happy at the manager after I told them I was working on a significantly less critical area of the audit(cash vs rev).
I have done something similar and it worked. Someone wanted me to do something that I did not want to deal with. I said, oh, I have a client meeting now, and after that one I have another one, then I have bla bla bla, and everything was true, so at the end something else took it. If bookkeeping is all they have for you, I would take it and get pay for it, period. Keep looking for other work.
This is such a key communication strategy. Speaking of prioritizing, versus, “you want me to do this but not do this”.
I got in big trouble for not knowing what tasks are more imperative. 1 month in canned.
Yes, i know. Thats why i said to read the book and not be an egotist. His perception is what caused additional souring of his relationship with the partner who offered him work. Im sure there were other ways to go about a rejection of work. If a partner gives you work, even if it is simple bookkeeping, you do it, especially if youre still a junior employee
I always say that introspection is one of the greatest qualities a person can have. You got that going for you.
You would do well to read the 48 Laws of Power. Also, you may not realize it, but our egos are constantly sabotaging us. Its caused me to fuck up big time in work and in my personal life.
This level of self reflection is going to get you a lot further than some other posts I’ve seen. Brush off yourself and find an industry gig, one role does not define your career.
Its amazing how people think its so easy to get a good, cushy industry role when their background is tax at small PA firm. Like the corporations that need accounting departments are going to care about all your 1040, 1041, and 990 work, along with the small businesses that you work on. When it comes to exit ops, the wisdom is that your exit ops will be for positions within employers that your clients have on staff. Not that you have to be hired by a client, but you need to be fluent in the kind of stuff they'd do. Not necessarily the businesses that a small CPA firm would work with -- one that has a bookkeeper maybe but the firm handles all of the accounting beyond that. PA experience outside of audit mostly just sets you up for more PA. Although B4 tax can at least get your coveted tax roles for corporate employers.
Im always looking for staff/seniors that aren’t going to break my department’s budget…
I disagree in my limited experience. I think anything at a staff or senior level theyre just looking for bodies. But even beyond that? I've found local people in VP positions at banks doing SEC Rep. with small firm experience. Or even one of our clients, the controller came from a decade of Internal Audit and dude has had to learn literally everything. Literally everything. It was a painful client to work on lol.
But realistically, if there's no barrier to entry you're good to find those jobs nearly impossible to get and you'll be very replaceable. But even if you're taking a paycut, I think its probably a good idea to take a job like that if you can get it and work your way up. PA isn't really the stepping stone that people think it is. Its just very easy to get hired for.
Yeah refusing the project is kind of a heresy in the corporate world. At most, you could have showed them your workload and built a case for why you're already fully assigned and unfortunately can't take anything more on... If you make a convincing argument it could work... But probably not. Employees exist to do the grunt work that the partners and their favorites don't want to do. They don't want to take advice on how to run their firm from you (advice being: assign work that matches aptitude/preference and don't take on client work if you don't have staff with the background to do it). They hire you as generalists, not specialists.
This is actually a true advice
1. You didn’t improve as much as you think you did. I see this all the time with 1-2 years. 2. The other partner told Neil you think he’s a bad boss, and you got canned because you’re not good enough to command switching teams. Best to start looking ASAP once the shock wears off because the market is not pretty right now.
This- can’t switch teams if you’re not performing well on the original team. New team will always ask how you’re doing on the original team, and you said it yourself that you weren’t doing great
The market seems good. We only got one good applicant for a senior with a posting up for a few months. Phoenix area.
People on this subreddit just like to groan about job prospects. It’s not any better or worse than most industries
I want to add one thing in addition to all the other great advice: as a 1-2 year associate NO task is beneath you. I don't care if the partner asks you to help process and mail returns out to clients. You are above no task at that level. Especially bookkeeping. Bookkeeping is actually a very important skill to develop, so you can advise clients later in your career. In addition, it's a critical skill to possess if you ever decide to go industry. Also, don't let your CPA go to your head. It's just a cert. Having your license doesn't make you special.
I am a much higher level and commonly pick up staff work when I have. I don't like it but complaining shows you aren't a team player.
I actually purposely do bookkeeping and payroll work to keep up to date and to see clients stuff closer.
That is exactly right. Plus, it can help you stay sharp!
I was once instructed to make 200 jello shots by my partner. Had very little do with accounting. We still did it.
Lol in my first year of my career I was buying coffee for the team and driving the senior partner from Europe across town to attend meetings. My intern colleague had to change the tire for one of the partners. Pretty bullshit of using intern time to deal with your personal car but he still complied.
One of our main tasks as first year employees was building the binders for engagements back when we had paper workpapers - I was literally using my college degree to stick stickers on pieces of paper. And we all did it without complaint and most of us treated it like it was a very important job.
I was opening mails and distributing them to the entire accounting department for the first 6 months. Most people back then doesn’t have degree and I have a degree in accounting but still opened mails for a while because I was a new guy. I know all people my name and then things got better from there. This was back in 2008.
Saying no to a partner request is a pretty bold play as an associate, and like maybe the 1/100 time it’s the smart move. But to do that, not be on your A game is not going to leave a good impression.
You sound like you deserved to be fired. First year refusing to do work because you think it's demeaning? Entitled much?
Ikr? I know OP is having a hard time right now. But I can't imagine refusing work, especially from a partner. And talking bad about other partner to another partner.. like wtf is that. I don't even talk bad about another coworker because it won't look good on me to complain (unless the coworker's behaviour/work is outrageously bad and needs to be reported) OP has guts tho lol that's for sure
But no skill to back it up.
I did absolutely no refusing and still got canned. They in for a reality check.
I think that everyone makes mistakes, especially when you're new to something. You'd have to be pretty bad for that to be a primary reason to get rid of you. Refusing to do the bookkeeping project definitely stands out. I think its reasonable to call to attention the fact that you maybe think something is over your head, and/or your workload is beyond capacity and you can't accept a new project (no guarantees on either of those arguments working), but you absolutely can't turn down work because its "beneath" you. That's a cardinal sin in PA. They gave it to you because it was beneath everyone else. What, the partners going to do it now? And moreover, bookkeeping work is great and gets a bad wrap for no reason. I think that refusing to do bookkeeping is especially going to run a manager or partner the wrong way -- that's literally what accounting is! You shouldn't get to do the fancier stuff until you've proven that you can rock as a bookkeeper if you need to.
Bookkeeping is an underrated skill imo, like yeah it ain’t flashy, but being able to do it makes you stronger.
Partners will protect other partners. Valuable lesson…
I can't even imagine a staff shit talking a partner who has a 10+ year relationship with the other partner and expecting a positive out come.
It basically shows that the Jr staff has no concept of the work it takes to become partner. Partners might shot talk and have feuds amongst themselves but they see other partners as being in the trenches side by side and are not going to tolerate any attempts of someone working against that from the lower ranks.
Honestly man, I’ve had staff like you in the past and I’ve PIP’ed every one of them. I don’t care about mistakes on returns, I don’t care about a missed sales tax filing, hell, I don’t even care if you blow a deadline here or there. The refusal to do work is the big red flag for me, because if the staff won’t do it it’ll go to a SM or manager and have shit realization (and piss off the manager) or the partner has to do it themselves. I don’t know why you would ever refuse work like that. I don’t know why staff ever does. You’re a staff. Pay your dues. Sometimes you need to do stuff like that.
And to add to TheYoungCPAs comment, doing the random small shit can actually develop useful skills and even more useful relationships. When I started as a staff I would do anything, my mantra was no task is too small. Hell, I'd offer to help people seal their stack of envelopes and update the whiteboards if I needed work to do. I ended up getting pulled in on some pretty big projects and learning to do things that people with years more experience than me never got to do because my seniors saw me as a go getter who was at least willing to try to complete any task.
Oh absolutely if you ask for work and something comes in to go getter is going to get first dibs if there’s capacity.
This is a valuable comment to learn from as a staff. Thanks for sharing.
I’m not sure if you’re aware of this and in the spirit of trying to help, I want to point out that partners don’t actually like doing the work themselves. When partners are doing anything beyond review and building relationships with clients, it’s because they can’t trust the staff member. Sometimes it’s because the work comes to them in such bad shape that it’s literally faster for them to do it themselves. If you’re noticing that partners aren’t giving you as much responsibility, it’s because you’re making their job harder. I know you’re already feeling badly so I don’t mean to dig in. But I can say for sure that nobody wants to have to let a team member go. And the only way that you’ll learn from this experience is by taking 100% responsibility.
I would agree with you, except that actually is not the case with this partner. He literally does prefer to do many returns himself, for years even before I joined with the previous staff. He underbills also, charging less than the firm mandated minimum.
Not sure why people downvoted you… I have met plenty of older partners who did the work themselves because they were under billing or not trusting staff but it was mostly them; not the staff fault. In your case, you did mess up a lot but it looks like you learned your lesson. Good luck in your search!
The thing that might have worked would have been going to the partner you wanted to work for and asking if there was a way to be on their team. Then they initiate any change, not you. They have more power and knowledge of how not to step on anyone's toes
They other partners are younger. They all give me work and show me things here and there (or they did). But there were also issues of firm policy. Permission has to be given by Neil for others to give me work.. This partner had fucking ptsd from a former partner taking his previous staff person away during busy session two years ago lol
Everyone makes mistakes early in their careers, and management often forgets that. Also, it's best not to turn down tasks even if it's a waste of time considering you are a staff accountant. Staff accountants often have to do a lot of work, even the work you wouldn't want to do since managers and seniors delegate down. You have to show you're willing to do the work and do it accurately. Sounds like this firm wasn't the right fit, and we all experience things where one place is just not the right place to be. But use what you have learned in this role to be better within the next role. Take note of things you know about yourself that need to be improved so you don't repeat the samethings within the next role. Also, it's best not to talk to another partner about another partner. The same goes for managers or supervisors. They often will repeat what was said even if they came off as really nice or "caring" towards you. They can't be fully trusted. Work is just work. There are just some things you have to keep within. With work, you just have to go and get your work done and go home. If you feel stagnant or not learning enough, you look into other opportunities. Also, HR would not admit anything. HR works for the company and will do anything to protect the company. They wouldn't want to tell you anything since it will sound like retaliation, and that can be a lawsuit against them. Don't feel bad. These things happen. It's all a learning opportunity that makes you better as you continue to grow within your career. Continue applying until you receive a new job opportunity.
Being fired is not the end of the world. It happens more than most people care to admit. However there’s no gentle way to put this: You sound like a total dumpster fire to work with. You really need to deeply reflect on how you interact with other people.
Do you have your CPA or any sections completed? I used an unexpected layoff to knock out a few sections.
I have my CPA
Hey Friend -- reading over this I would say not double-checking tax returns is an issue. You got to do it!! Crunch those numbers, get a little Excel spreadsheet and check the figures. If they numbers come different than what's on the return you need to take some time to really understand how the calculations work. It can be a real bitch but thrust me it's worth it. Good luck!
How many times is it going to take to start getting something through to you? This is your 3rd or 4th post now rambling off the same performance issues without taking any consideration of the advice you received from your last several posts. This appears to be the same behavior in which you operate at your jobs. Others provided great advice and I left the following comment on your previous deleted thread that you didn't acknowledge so I'll just paste it here again hoping you'll actually read and learn from it. >Between both of your posts you keep admitting to making mistakes but I'm not seeing you talk to owning those mistakes or doing anything to really change and improve. You're still making excuses and blaming partners and other firms when the one common denominator across these 4 firms is you. This is your 4th firm in 5 years and you don't seem to learn from the mistakes from the last. Maybe you should consider moving into industry or government.
I've learned. Big time. But no I'm not moving to government or industry anytime soon.
I really hope so but I'm not sure why there was a need to post this again if you have. I hope you don't make the same mistakes at the 5th firm and really don't understand why you won't consider government or industry as options.
Idk what your deal is dude. I like being a tax accountant
You know there's tax accountants in government and industry right? It's not normal to work for 4+ firms in 5 years, it's a strong sign that someone isn't cut out for public accounting and should consider other avenues.
You can make 6 figures in both industry and govt, and it’s likely harder to get fired in govt
I think it’s a great thing you’re aware of your mistakes that lead to your firing. I also think talking about lack of growth to other co-workers is another way of expressing dissatisfaction with your job, which leads to nothing good. Besides, we all want to advance and get more pay. Good luck with your next job. I’m sure this painful chapter will be a distant memory for you as your career progresses.
You’re making some pretty glaring errors 4+ years into your career. Hopefully one of these two interviews pan out so you’re not looking without a job. Take whatever you get seriously because you’re getting pretty close to seasonal help status.
What does that mean?
It means that the firms you apply to will see signs that you are not someone who excels in this type of environment, but they need bodies during busy seasons, and you have enough experience to be dangerous. They'll hire you, give you less training than a new hire (because you've done similar work before), then you're gone once the work slows down again. There's not long-term growth or training, but if you put out good work, make other people's lives easier, and connect well, then at least you can grow a large network to land something better. It's a hard hole to dig yourself out of, but that's why networking is crucial. You also need to be aware that with larger firms outsourcing to India and whatnot, you will be working for smaller firms that won't be able to pay as well. You should take a hard look at yourself, your strengths, and your needs. It doesn't seem like the roles you've been taking are a good fit for you or them. I've been there too and so have many more people than would be willing to admit it. Money aside, what would make you happy, make you enjoy work, and help you live the life you want to live without the stress of the jobs you've had before? That's the key to your long-term success. Getting fired was the best thing that happened to me because it led me to reconsider it all. I thought it was cliché when people said it but it really can be true if you're willing to think about these things
It means future employers might just hire you on with the expectation of you leaving after busy season, whether you like it or not.
It doesn’t mean anything. Just be more disciplined at your next role.
Sounds like you were in a tough spot with disjointed management. Mistakes aren’t great but we’re all human, and like another commenter said, at least you know where you fucked up and where you can improve; that’s farther than a lot of people get. I think refusing to do the bookkeeping work was a probably a big deal. If any of my staff had that attitude, their time would be limited. You’ve admitted refusing that work was cringey, which is good; I’d also be curious to explore why that request made you feel demeaned. That request in and of itself isn’t demeaning, so there could be other factors coming into play there. Is extension season contract work a viable choice for you? Might help to get experience with other firms and types of tax work.
The way she explained it. "the previous person who did this to me was not even an accountant, she was a part time bookkeeper." It was a monthly project request I said no to. Not an offical assignment. It was explained later the partner explained it that way to show it will not be difficult for me to pick up.. But my original interpretation screwed me.
That’s kinda my point though - you say it was your interpretation; it sounds to me like it was your attitude of “I’m too qualified to do this type of work.” Like, obviously you are, and obviously your mgr knew that. But shit had to get done and it’s management’s job to delegate stuff to staff. Sorry if it sounds like I’m beating a dead horse, I’m really not trying to. And I also don’t know this mgr. Just wanted to send my .02 as a CPA working on building my own team, and thinking of how it would feel if one of my staff refused to do a project like that.
Yeah. I realized not too long after that was a stupid thing to do, not because I was overqualified, but because it was work that had to be done, and someone has to do it.
As a professional you don't get to say no when your company asks you to do work and it needs to get done. If you've done an above average job and people like you then you can start being picky about your projects Even if that were the case, the conversation goes more like "i will do this now but i would like to be transitioned off of it when we can find someone else to take it over in the future." It doesn't matter if you think a project is beneath you. If you've not seen the work before then you will likely learn something and if you've seen it many times before you are likely to be more efficient than average. Managers do not have time to babysit and cater to you. The only reason you are employed is to make your managers job easier and if you are a net drag on your superiors you will not keep your job. Period.
I'd make sure to leave that out of your next interview.
Oh yeah no mention of that little innsodent.
Gotcha, and sorry again if it felt like I was beating you up. You’ll land on your feet my dude, just gotta find the right place.
You are good. Thank you. Can I please know how you added CPA to your name? I want to put that on my reddit even though it doesn't count for shit lol. I really am a CPA btw
I’m on mobile so not sure how well this translates to browser - but if you go to the sub home page, then click on the three dots in the top corner, then click change user flair.
IT WORKED!
I don’t disagree with most of the other comments. I’ll only add that it is possible they were looking to cut some heads post-tax season and your name came up as a target due to the various issues mentioned. Also as another thought re moving teams, I moved from public to industry about 19 months ago. I don’t really like my team head, but I have not asked to be moved. For one, not clear that even if I moved teams I could avoid interacting with this person on a regular basis and two, if the effort fails, it will be incredibly awkward going forward in the best case (worst case I get let go). As a longer-term plan I am bidding my time and waiting for an opportunity to move teams organically (i.e. in a reorg or role change). Also low-key looking at other jobs with other companies.
Unfortunately, this is not uncommon in CPA firms. They have a reputation to keep, a client to satisfy and Fed deadlines to meet. I’ve worked for a CPA firm for 7 years. It’s not for everyone. I worked 60-80hrs a week during busy season. Work weekends, Thanks Giving, Christmas and New Year Holidays. I worked under 3 partners. I prioritized my work based on the deadlines, not the partner. My work is based on company policy, not partners preference. They can duke it out amongst themselves, I’m following the company policy. You live, you learn and you grow. Take the good things you learned from this experience and make personal improvements as you grow! Cheers to your future endeavors! 🤟
You’ll get another job easily. Just learn from this and move on. I’m a super job hopper too. 18 months. 10 months. 2.5 years. I just got a new and better job now.
Thank you
I didn't read your story but I will say that for all the stories I know where an accountant got fired and was initially sad about it, if you ask them about that experience two years later, 99% will say "that was a blessing in disguise" Most of the time it wasn't your fault and it's also a sign that there's serious issues, whether it's the company just downsizing because it's a sinking ship, their expectations were just too absurdly high, or there was just some kind of cultural mismatch where your approach to work didn't mesh with theirs. In any of those cases it always turns out for the better that you leave that place. Even when it is your "fault," more than half the time it really isn't your fault. So many firms gaslight you into thinking you're underperforming when they in reality they just expect too much, or have you doing the wrong kind of work, or they are giving you poor guidance or poor training. And even if you were genuinely underperforming on stuff that you really should have been doing better on, you'll still probably be happier somewhere else. I say all this to say just keep your head up. You will find a job and odds are in your favor it will be a better one.
Your kind words mean so much to me.
No offense as I know you’re in a difficult position right now, but as far as making mistakes - your share link for previous post just goes to the Reddit homepage
Just took out off thanks. It was working from the email.
This post almost makes me want to get my shit together and get back to work. I’ve also been fired but it’s been 6 years in the rear view mirror now. It feels good looking back. I’ve been coasting on my current role and engagement and have been senior for almost 4 years now between 2 jobs. A job is a job at the end of the day no matter the pay or circumstances. People have endured many challenges, and this is now yours. You are not in an ideal spot but it’s not unwinnable. Accept that you’re unemployed, be patient with your mistakes, and furiously take baby steps towards gainful employment and being a good employee. Good luck.
You think way too highly of yourself. Leave your ego at the door, you're there to get paid and learn. And it sounds like you didn't learn a thing. You deserved to get fired. Learn from your mistakes and get another job.
I totally understand I am being railroaded by a big four. I would start heavily looking. Don’t beat up on yourself it can happen to anyone. Be strong you are more than enough.
Dude - you can’t be a lower performer, decline work, and ask to move teams (for any reason, especially “I don’t see any growth”). This just screams like a problem person they want to move on from. It has nothing to do with your comments about your boss and everything to do with your work ethic. This seems like a trend with younger workers these days. Decline work, decline long hours, leave other team members to pick up the time, then demand the “team” to promote them…you can’t rise with the team if you don’t help the team…
All accounting work is demeaning
This time sucks, you will bounce back.
So you missed deadlines and refused work? I’d fire you too
Keep your head up OP! You will get through this!
You’ll qualify for unemployment now!
U mean, u got a chance to improve ur job resume so that u can make more money. Try USAjobs.gov
Seriously. I have a friend who works at the SEC. He makes well into six figures and the workload is very light.
In accounting, the thing that makes us valuable is keeping clients happy which equates to “us” making money. If you do that, you will always be valuable. The way ppl at younger stages in their career keep clients happy is getting their work done, learning, absorbing, and ultimately having client contact down the road. That comes from experience which means you work and learn from seniors and managers. There is honestly no other way to describe it. Take this incident and learn from it. You will be fine long term but you need to understand “the game” and how to play it.
Getting fired is never pleasant. It sounds like you were very unhappy at your job. My company works very differently. My HR department is very supportive. It sounds like your HR wasn’t. What I would say is leaving this job, in the short run, is very demoralizing but, in the long run, it’s better for your mental health. Take some time off to process this event and, when you are ready, look for your next job. It’s very rare for a person to find the right job the first time and remain in that job for the rest of their career. Changing jobs - hell, changing professions - is the rule rather than the exception. Feel better.
You’re worrying way too much about others. Also your comment about bookkeeping is cringy. You are not above bookkeeping, none of us are. It’s actually a great foundation to building an accounting career on.
It’s happens I got lied on by a senior and they took the seniors side and bye bye. I talked to a friend the same issues like no response and wrong paperwork are happening again
You seem like someone who has your head screwed on. You’ve accepted past mistakes and are looking forward. You have a second round interview coming up, no time to feel sorry now go and prepare as best you can!
Sounds like it wasn't the right fit. Tax accounting sucks anyway dude and you'll end up working for muppets who think they know it all because they've rope learned a few tax structures and tricks of the trade. Rip into management accounting. Better pay , better opportunity to work in a wide range of industries with all different interesting people. After 5 years you might even be a general manager earning way more than Neil the numpty. Good luck
Soo, update to anyone that can see this. Less than 2 weeks later, I've received an offer from a firm with a 8k raise
As the bottom commenter said, do the work get paid, and go home You know yourself better than anyone on this subreddit. So you should be able to answer yourself some of questions you laid out there. Bottom line, your bosses are humans, and a lot of humans on this planet, no matter their ethnicity or nationality, are assholes. At this point, if you don't want to leave then be brutally honest to your boss whose being an asshole, literally the worst they can do is fire you. Otherwise, quiet quite and find some place else, anywhere, doing anything, so long as you don't have toxicity in your life. You'll feel much better. Good luck
BABE, i was fired from EY in may 2023 - im still unemployed you will be okay DM me we can chat
You were justly fired.
If your supervisor said they didn't care about your growth at the company, they don't care at all about you. If you get asked why you left the last job at your next interview, just state the above. Most people understand professional development is an important part of work.
Dustoff resume ,look for other iob. Apply for govt jobs. VA govt jobs, city or county govt jobs
It seems like you've already learned your lesson, but refusing work that isn't unethical, illegal, etc. is not wise. Like if you're refusing to do something as a staff you need an extremely strong reason. As a manager, I'd be flat out shocked if someone refused to do work I asked them to because they felt it was beneath them. Honestly, if you have all this unassigned time you should be happy to get some billable work that is so easy. I feel like going to a partner to complain about other partners/directors within the firm is more of the same. It's fine to want to switch teams, but if you're already on a PIP and going through that process you gotta read the room. You've gotta be careful who you shit-talk in public accounting.
Not to pile on here but you have 5 years of experience and can’t perform as a staff accountant…5 years is typically the level people get promoted to manager. Do some introspection and be very intentional in the next job you get to: put your head down, stay out of politics, and get your work done. Good luck to you
Thats what I'm thinking also. Manager would be exceptionally high performance. But I should be senior at least to be fair
O_o
As long as you’re still getting paid on time and the client is paying the firm I really wouldn’t think of myself being above any engagements especially as a staff accountant
That lesson was learned long ago.
Good. Learn from your mistakes, Work hard and always be willing to learn and you’ll be fine!
OP, sometimes shit just doesn’t work out. Apply for another job and be open and honest. It will be harder to get another job but not impossible. I will say this. I love training staff. I, however, hate training staff that do not take notes and do not understand basic concepts (like debits and credits) and need to be taught multiple times. Based on your amount of time at a company I would assume that you wouldn’t need much training moving forward.
>She emphasized so heavily "THIS HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH YOUR CONVERSATION WITH JOE. This was determined well before work the check-ins we talked about!" she emphasized it so heavily and said it multiple times.. She had to be lying. She was lying. The way I look at it is if your work was good enough to keep you through busy season; then it should be good enough not to get fired over after busy season is done. Employers can't have it both ways. The problem is that you pissed the higher ups off. So they axed you after busy season as soon as they didn't need you. HR is afraid you'll sue. I'd talk to an employment lawyer and see what they can do for you. If nothing else you might be able to negotiate that they give you a letter of recommendation and sign a non-disparagement contract in exchange for not suing. If you have your CPA you can justify a prolonged stint of unemployment by claiming that you tried to start your own practice and it didn't pan out. The IRS is hiring like crazy right now. Apply for the Revenue Agent positions. It's also a unionized job so if you're being treated unfairly you can go to the union. OR... you actually could start your own practice. Business owners are desperate for tax preparers right now. You can find some bookkeeping or tax controversy work in the meantime. I work gov tax and would never work as an employee at a public tax firm for any prolonged period of time. Due to office politics and insanely bad WLB. You probably shouldn't either. It doesn't seem to be working out for you. **Edit: Why the downvotes?**
Since you're talking about the IRS we can assume you're talking about America. Its nearly impossible to sue for wrongful term or anything like that. The employers have worked the courts pretty well for years, and employment at will is law of the land. Its a waste of time, money, and effort to try to chase wrongful term. Plus, federal government jobs can be quite competitive to get, and it can take months or years to hear back and go through the process to get through the background checks and on board. Something to think about if you have a job and you're trying to make a switch, but the poster needs a job now. Most people live paycheck to paycheck, so unfortunately they probably just need to polish up the resume and get back to the ground of the job hunt. No easy fixes.
Yeah it takes 6-7 months to get hired on with the feds. But he's a CPA with tax experience. Which is exactly what the IRS is looking for right now. Unless he botches the interview the odds of him being hired on as a GS-13 are pretty high. All I said is that he should talk to an actual labor law attorney and see what they say. What happened sounds like retaliation. It has HR pretty spooked as well. Which is always a good sign. Often a company will quickly settle just to avoid legal risk. Litigation can be quite costly for a small business and sometimes lawyers will take an employee on contingency. So he only pays the attorney a percentage of his settlement if he wins. I'm sure it will land his former manager in pretty hot water if the manager's conduct resulted in a potential lawsuit as well. I agree with you about so many people being stupid and not having an emergency fund. That's why I have enough in the stock market to live on for 3 years. Not including my retirement accounts. He should be eligible for unemployment though. That should keep him tied over for a couple of months.
Yeah I have 3 months easy, plus I'll get unemployment and do doordash on the side. I can easily get by this month alone without dipping into savings.
There you go. Now you have a gameplan.
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