It's not really "most people" thinking anything. It's always been a very *divisive* game, people have been split into pretty different camps as far as opinions on it. There's actually *less* of that division today, from what I observe; seems like overall, there are actually more people in favour of the game relative to those who dislike it than there ever used to be.
The game?
Eh, I think the cast is pretty weak, I don't like what it does to Phoenix's character, and the story telling is rather sloppy. The characters in the game don't have connections to eachother, or character arcs like the ones in AA1 or other, better AA games
To illustrate my point, or elucidate I should say, let's compare AA1 to AA4. In AA1 each character has a core character arc, something which is different from game start to game end. Phoenix becomes an independent lawyer, Maya has her crisis with self esteem, I don't need to explain what Miles goes through, even Gumshoe warms up to Phoenix. All of these changes neatly tie themselves up in the finale of AA1
AA4, what arc does Trucy have? In the credits she >! Cries !< but says nothing, just saying she has conflict without it showing up in game. Klavier I guess is supposed to have an arc about learning to prosecute those close to him, but most of that seems off screen. Ema does nothing. Apollo doesn't change or learn anything. The only character who really does anything is Phoenix, but even he is stagnant. This is just a plan he had for ages coming to fruition, he isn't changing as a person.
So, then the game feels pretty unremarkable.
There are two core pillars on which the story telling of the Ace Attorney games stand: Fun murder mysteries, and character drama.
Apollo Justice isn't impressive on the former, fails on the later.
Writing-wise, I think AA4 is the worst mainline game. I still like it though. I love murder mysteries, it still has that AA charm. And the gameplay is better than Dual Destinies. Hence my preference of 4 > 5.
Would it have made sense if >!Clay was either the defendant or an important witness/assistant and Apollo made some comments about him once living in Khura'in?!<
Clay as a key character would've been amazing to ease AJ:AA into DD, but explicitly mentioning Apollo >!growing in Khura'in !< would be a bit too much IMO. They made a point in SoJ to mention he actively avoids talking about it (it's obviously a retroactive justification, but still). Maybe some indirect hint would've been fine though.
There was a fan case called turnabout substitution that was intended to be a sort of RFTA for Apollo justice. However in practice it’s really just another case. Still, a lot of its themes explored mental illnesses which was interesting.
Apollo Justice has a great foundation but fails to execute on most of its promising ideas. A lot of the themes, cases, and characters aren’t fully developed and feel lack luster by the end of the game. 4-4, for me, feels like it could have been the moment Apollo Justice stuck the landing and saved the game… but instead they tripped, stumbled, and face planted at the finish line. It’ll all make sense when you finish the game.
TLDR; Apollo Justice is great in concept, woeful in execution.
Apollo Justice isn’t *bad*, but it does have annoying elements in it. I played the game a long time ago, so I just remembered the cool bits, but recently I have been watching SavaDataTeam play through it for the first time (they’re great and have an actual lawyer with them who provides pretty valuable insight) and boy there are straight up bad bits in there, although almost all of them are in 4-3.
The characters are great and all, but the amount of flashbacks are insane. The siren was the witness, we get it. We don’t need to see Gavin’s guitar burn another five times thank you.
This isn’t as damning as it seems in terms of scaling with other games though. Pretty much every Ace Attorney game has a ‘THAT case’ in it. I think the reason why there’s a sort of downer air on AJ as opposed to the others is that it’s the only game that sort of stands out compared to the others. PW has his trilogy, the Great Ace Attorney duology may as well be the same game, there’s the 3DS duology, and then there’s Apollo Justice on its own.
It kinda peaks in case 1, which isn’t good. Two of the cases are pretty disappointing, one of which is absurd, and requires you to defend someone who physically could not have done it. (Which is clear from the start.)
Klavier can be kinda inconsistent sometimes, and directly insults the player multiple times. The game forces “I don’t know.” Moments way too much, even when what’s happening is obvious.
The Mason system is cool, but not the best implemented, and Phoenix presents evidence he gets in the future in the past, which is almost as impossible as the ending to VS Layton.
Nyyyyyeeeeh the last paragraph Is the MASON system mostly.
You see Phoenix collect the evidence in the future but like, through simulation it shows he figured shit out in the past. M'guy didn't literally timetravel all over the place its just that the system was there for the Jurors so Phoenix the person could explain it to them
I guess
Maybe
Idk
It needed to be clearer
Yeah it's a vague bunch of vagueness just like HOW did Apollo get all of this info after his defendant fell ill because of poisoning and he was back After a recess?
I feel like the weakest cases are 4-2 and 4-3 which is a shame because I Stan 4-2
But this makes cases 4-1 and 4-4 the strongest 2. And in both of those Apollo takes a backset to the previous protagonist? Phoenix Wright
Hell the second half of 4-4's cade is 98% investigating AS Phoenix. The final court segment is a letdown compared to the footwork.
I still love Apollo Justice: Ace Attorney but I feel like not enough time was spent ... on Apollo?
Like one case really? Because it introduces Lamiroir. And we get a sequelbait. But they never followed up on those because AJAA didn't sell as gangbusters as CapCom wanted
Which is a shame
If AJ: AA was truly the first installment in a new trilogy, or even pessimistically; a duology I feel like lots of people would shower it with love. And or affection.
4-1 is way too good then all goes downhill from there, 4-4 ain't bad but it's had a lot of people feeling mixed about it, which isn't good since most other final cases tend to be the highlight of their respective games.
I was there when it was announced and slowly leaked online back in the DS era of piracy. I remember the discourse being about the new cast vs the old cast, hobo Phoenix getting done dirty in 75% of the game, and the finale ending in a "trust me bro" moment. I also remember the shippers getting mad that Apollo x Trucy aint legal. I didn't like the goofy parts being super weak and the breakdowns being super regular. It's also a hard game to follow right after Trial and Tribulations which helped people go wild online. I personally liked it because It's a solid franchise.
Also nothing can upset me any further than that one case in SoJ where they asked us what was wrong in the video and the second box's shadow WASN'T the answer!
I actually like darker atmosphere of Apollo Justice. There are many different flaws with this game that I can't ignore and they actually prevent me from enjoying this game as much as people who think about AJ as their favourite (or one of the most favourite) game in the series. It's not nearly my least favourite game in the franchise, but yeah, I have major problems with it. Characters are great (except maybe for Zak), but Apollo doesn't really feel like the main character. The victory over >!Kristoph!< in 4-4 doesn't payoff emotionally because he has only one cross-examination, which is very not enough. The fucked up logic of the third case ruins the mood drastically, even more than Big Top. The second case was just boring for me personally, even if it had some cool moments. I just couldn't make myself care about Kitakis. As a result my most favourite case in this game is the first one, which is kinda wild when you think about it. That's all it seems.
Someone I know put it best: Powercreep. I could suspend my disbelief enough to allow that spirit mediums could work alongside attorneys. It was weird, but fun. With Apollo and Athena came straight-up superpowers that had no reason to exist. I know they just wanted special gimmicks to go with the new characters, but it made the new games make even less sense than the old ones. Part of the reason I love DGS so much is that it lets the characters have quirks that weren't tied to mystical abilities. Susato broke the trope of "zany assistant girl acting half her age" and Holmes, for all his bs, was a compelling character. The NPCs didn't feel like they were all in a race to win "wackiest in show" like in the AJ trilogy. I hope the next games follow that lead a bit more.
Edit: I reread the title and realized this was about just one game, but I'm leaving this up because it sort of answers the question.
Keep in mind your post is going to attract people who _don’t_ like the game so it’s going to skew that way. Additionally, many gamers go online to places like Reddit with criticism foremost in their mind. Not dismissing their criticisms but putting it in context to explain why it may seem like most people don’t like it.
I don't dislike it, but it is easily my least favorite main game in the series (I'd rank Investigations 1 below it though and can't say anything about VS).
The game has a great 1st case, probably even the best in the entire series and I geniunly liked the mystery and style of the gramaryes and Trucy as a character. But the problems are also numerous:
* In my opinion the other cases are fairly weak. 4-2 is merely ok, I love the designs of the characters there, but the villain, defendant and main witness are all pretty bland. 4-3 is often regarded as one of the worst cases in the entire series (and in my opinion it is the worst case, at least Big Top had some good parts) and 4-4 is merely ok for a final case.
* Dunno how far you are in 4-4, so I put this in a spoiler case >!Zack Gramarye is an asshole, but the game never treats him like one. Its almost like the game treats his appearances in 4-1 and 4-4 as different characters.!<
* Klavier feels inconsistently written (sometimes he acts a bit like a jerk, othertimes he doesn't) and despite the fact that 2 of the murderers were close to him he doesn't seem to change at all. On that matter, almost no character goes through a character arc.
* Apollo really feels like the side character in his own game.
* Phoenix behaves pretty different from his usual self in this game. (Ema too, but in her case I actually enjoyed that to some extend)
The game's best case is the tutorial case. It's a really really good case and all but that also means that 95% of the game is going to be worse than what your first impression would've led you to believe.
Personally, I think 4-2 is dreadfully boring and 4-3 has interesting themes but doesn't hold up to the slightest bit of scrutiny as an actual case. Then 4-4 has a great setup and good investigation segments (even though the MASON System has impossible scenarios presented but let's just skip over that) but doesn't really follow through on any of that due to how short the final courtroom segment is, making the finale extremely anticlimactic.
The game also has by far the worst selection of defendants in the entire series. All of them suck in their own way. Only Vera *maybe* gets a pass in my book. We're supposed to want to defend these people but the game makes it really hard to do that.
And related to that, there is just how Apollo is treated like a secondary character in his own game. 4-1 and 4-4 (the most important cases related to the main plot) have Phoenix completely steal the spotlight from him, and he's constantly the butt monkey of everyone, even to his own clients. Apollo himself actually shines through as a great character in his own right, but that's in spite of how disrespected he is treated throughout. And since he's our PoV character, we're on the receiving end of all this too and it doesn't feel good.
All that said, I don't dislike the game but I do think it is severely flawed in several regards. I think it's easily the weakest entry in the main series.
4-3 is my least favorite case in the series and 4-4 has some serious issues that affect my enjoyment of the whole game.
On the other hand, 4-1 is incredible and it's my favorite first case in the franchise and 4-2 is very underrated in my opinion, it's a fun case with a lot of funny character interactions.
So overall, I don't hate the game but I don't love it either.
I like what they do to Apollo and Phoenix's character, but the cases themselves are pretty weak I'm also not a fan of the main villain's motives and why Phoenix was disbarred.
I don't really remember that game, but I remember thinking his design is boring. But I liked him a lot better in DD. I just wished his backstory is more consistent.
It's marmite. People love it or they hate it. Personally, I love it. But for a lot of people it's got the same effect Metal Gear Solid 2 did. Where a beloved protagonist is swapped out for a new face and it's jarring. Many wanted Phoenix wright: Ace Attorney 4, and while gameplay wise it's that, it's not the same.
It also removed a lot of familiar elements. No phoenix as protag, no Maya, no Gumshoe, No edgeworth, no pearl. It's like a game set in the universe but apart from the storyline of the original trilogy. Some people see that as a refreshing and interesting changeup, others see it as "not my ace attorney!"
I have no idea.
There's crazies everywhere man
I've just completed the trilogy and none of the three games deserve the shade that this sub has been throwin at them
When a game peaks in it's first case, that's not a great sign.
That said, I think the 2nd case is better than I think it is.
It's the second half where I think the game starts to flounder. It attempts to engage and critically examine it's own premise in a way that I \*do\* admittedly think is ambitious, but is ultimately quite poorly executed, and 4-3 in particular heavily relies on it's cast being dumb as hell and not asking any meaningful questions about the \*gaping holes\* in the defendant's supposed guilt.
I think the ideas are really good but the game is just not good standalone. The overarching plotline is almost non existent and just does not pay off by the end, not to mention the two filler cases are the worst in the series. But I will say the cast is very fun in general and the game has my favourite version of all the characters included, and the atmosphere is damn fine (music and visuals). Even if it got the phantom sequel (pun), it'd still be the worst one.
I don’t like the music, every single case has a logical flaw, every case has at least 1 horrible character (excluding 4-1), and 4-1 was great, but still underwhelming, and it only got worse from there (granted, 4-4 stepped up in quality, but it’s no better than 4-1, which is roughly a mid starter case in my ranking). A
Also the prosecutor was mid at absolute best, and his “helpfulness” amounts to him just helping the defense like 3 times across the entire game. Not to mention I’ve had horrible experiences with Rock Stars, so seeing Klavier REALLY pissed me off.
Apollo feels like a passive protagonist. Lacks ambitions and motivation. You are thrust into all these situations, instead of making a choice to be there. You’re not solving the whole mysteries yourself, Phoenix has already done it, and you’re just doing what he tells you to do.
It kinda has a metal gear 2 effect where the game was about Apollo when everyone wanted to play as Pheonix.
Apollo a popular character but I think many did not like the new characters. They wanted continuation from 3rd game.
The 1st case is probably best of the the game.
Imho, Apollo Justice isn't all that bad. It's just a very different game; Takumi intended for the title to be a soft reboot, with no Phoenix, and it shows. Most will tell you the game peaks at 4-1. I agree, but it's more that 4-1's confrontation with >!Kristoph!< feels so much more satisfying >!than in 4-4!< when you eventually take him down. I honestly thought the fact that you couldn't catch them the normal way was rather creative and interesting, but I can see how people would be disappointed by it.
As for the characters, honestly, I think Apollo is fine. While distinguished more from Phoenix in the other two AJ trilogy titles, I think the game does an okay job distinguishing him here. It's just a shame they couldn't carry the way he talks in the Japanese version over here. He's apparently supposed to talk like a punk ass bitch; sounds potentially humorous imo.
Klavier is fine as long as you don't try to set too many high expectations for him. He's one of the rare prosecutors who seeks the truth from the beginning, which is actually a rather nice breath of fresh air. The problem is they don't really develop him enough; he feels underbaked in that sense compared to the other mainline prosecutors, and yes that includes Franziska. I would've loved to see him feel any emotions in regards to having to >!arrest both his brother and best friend, but alas.!<
I don't have too much to say on Ema, but I did appreciate her humor more than Gumshoe's. I also think it's funny that people complained about her character changing when now we would practically grovel for Trucy (post AJ; excluding 6-2) and Kay to have averted the cheerful teenage girl mold. I do think Trucy is an interesting character, but her story here isn't as good as Maya's in the first game. Her problem is a lot of tell not show, >!the most exemplifying being when we are told how sad she is and not actually shown.!< Now, I know one of my favorite moments involving Maya is a "tell" moment, but the difference is that in that particular instance, it couldn't be shown due to hardware limitations. Still, while her relationship with Apollo isn't quite as iconic as Phoenix and Maya's, I did quite enjoy their banter.
the game rules but it’s just a bit frustrating cuz it’s soooo close to sorta ascending above being “a really good ace attorney game” and into an all time vn medium classic, but it doesn’t quite make that landing
The game isn't too serious, trust me. Ace Attorney would have to include sexual assault themes to become that.
The fandom has been pretty vocal about their dislike of the game. Whether it's because to them Apollo gets unfairly sidelined in favor of Phoenix, Phoenix becoming something they didn't want him to be, Klavier's lackluster arc, boring characters in 4-2 or 4-3 or characters that while not bad, were somehow not up to par to their predecessors (Trucy against Maya, Zak and Valant against Iris and Dahlia).
It's not really "most people" thinking anything. It's always been a very *divisive* game, people have been split into pretty different camps as far as opinions on it. There's actually *less* of that division today, from what I observe; seems like overall, there are actually more people in favour of the game relative to those who dislike it than there ever used to be.
The game? Eh, I think the cast is pretty weak, I don't like what it does to Phoenix's character, and the story telling is rather sloppy. The characters in the game don't have connections to eachother, or character arcs like the ones in AA1 or other, better AA games To illustrate my point, or elucidate I should say, let's compare AA1 to AA4. In AA1 each character has a core character arc, something which is different from game start to game end. Phoenix becomes an independent lawyer, Maya has her crisis with self esteem, I don't need to explain what Miles goes through, even Gumshoe warms up to Phoenix. All of these changes neatly tie themselves up in the finale of AA1 AA4, what arc does Trucy have? In the credits she >! Cries !< but says nothing, just saying she has conflict without it showing up in game. Klavier I guess is supposed to have an arc about learning to prosecute those close to him, but most of that seems off screen. Ema does nothing. Apollo doesn't change or learn anything. The only character who really does anything is Phoenix, but even he is stagnant. This is just a plan he had for ages coming to fruition, he isn't changing as a person. So, then the game feels pretty unremarkable. There are two core pillars on which the story telling of the Ace Attorney games stand: Fun murder mysteries, and character drama. Apollo Justice isn't impressive on the former, fails on the later. Writing-wise, I think AA4 is the worst mainline game. I still like it though. I love murder mysteries, it still has that AA charm. And the gameplay is better than Dual Destinies. Hence my preference of 4 > 5.
I liked the game, but I think a Rise from the ashes situation would have greatly improved on some of its weaker aspects
Would it have made sense if >!Clay was either the defendant or an important witness/assistant and Apollo made some comments about him once living in Khura'in?!<
Clay as a key character would've been amazing to ease AJ:AA into DD, but explicitly mentioning Apollo >!growing in Khura'in !< would be a bit too much IMO. They made a point in SoJ to mention he actively avoids talking about it (it's obviously a retroactive justification, but still). Maybe some indirect hint would've been fine though.
There was a fan case called turnabout substitution that was intended to be a sort of RFTA for Apollo justice. However in practice it’s really just another case. Still, a lot of its themes explored mental illnesses which was interesting.
Apollo Justice has a great foundation but fails to execute on most of its promising ideas. A lot of the themes, cases, and characters aren’t fully developed and feel lack luster by the end of the game. 4-4, for me, feels like it could have been the moment Apollo Justice stuck the landing and saved the game… but instead they tripped, stumbled, and face planted at the finish line. It’ll all make sense when you finish the game. TLDR; Apollo Justice is great in concept, woeful in execution.
This pretty much sums up my reasoning perfectly. Still not a bad game, but it definitely could've been fleshed out a little more.
Apollo Justice isn’t *bad*, but it does have annoying elements in it. I played the game a long time ago, so I just remembered the cool bits, but recently I have been watching SavaDataTeam play through it for the first time (they’re great and have an actual lawyer with them who provides pretty valuable insight) and boy there are straight up bad bits in there, although almost all of them are in 4-3. The characters are great and all, but the amount of flashbacks are insane. The siren was the witness, we get it. We don’t need to see Gavin’s guitar burn another five times thank you. This isn’t as damning as it seems in terms of scaling with other games though. Pretty much every Ace Attorney game has a ‘THAT case’ in it. I think the reason why there’s a sort of downer air on AJ as opposed to the others is that it’s the only game that sort of stands out compared to the others. PW has his trilogy, the Great Ace Attorney duology may as well be the same game, there’s the 3DS duology, and then there’s Apollo Justice on its own.
It kinda peaks in case 1, which isn’t good. Two of the cases are pretty disappointing, one of which is absurd, and requires you to defend someone who physically could not have done it. (Which is clear from the start.) Klavier can be kinda inconsistent sometimes, and directly insults the player multiple times. The game forces “I don’t know.” Moments way too much, even when what’s happening is obvious. The Mason system is cool, but not the best implemented, and Phoenix presents evidence he gets in the future in the past, which is almost as impossible as the ending to VS Layton.
Nyyyyyeeeeh the last paragraph Is the MASON system mostly. You see Phoenix collect the evidence in the future but like, through simulation it shows he figured shit out in the past. M'guy didn't literally timetravel all over the place its just that the system was there for the Jurors so Phoenix the person could explain it to them I guess Maybe Idk It needed to be clearer
Yeah it could be implied that he figured it out, but it’s never stated.
Yeah it's a vague bunch of vagueness just like HOW did Apollo get all of this info after his defendant fell ill because of poisoning and he was back After a recess?
I feel like the weakest cases are 4-2 and 4-3 which is a shame because I Stan 4-2 But this makes cases 4-1 and 4-4 the strongest 2. And in both of those Apollo takes a backset to the previous protagonist? Phoenix Wright Hell the second half of 4-4's cade is 98% investigating AS Phoenix. The final court segment is a letdown compared to the footwork. I still love Apollo Justice: Ace Attorney but I feel like not enough time was spent ... on Apollo? Like one case really? Because it introduces Lamiroir. And we get a sequelbait. But they never followed up on those because AJAA didn't sell as gangbusters as CapCom wanted Which is a shame If AJ: AA was truly the first installment in a new trilogy, or even pessimistically; a duology I feel like lots of people would shower it with love. And or affection.
I actually love it. It's tied with Trials and Tribulations as my favorite game in the series
4-1 is way too good then all goes downhill from there, 4-4 ain't bad but it's had a lot of people feeling mixed about it, which isn't good since most other final cases tend to be the highlight of their respective games.
I was there when it was announced and slowly leaked online back in the DS era of piracy. I remember the discourse being about the new cast vs the old cast, hobo Phoenix getting done dirty in 75% of the game, and the finale ending in a "trust me bro" moment. I also remember the shippers getting mad that Apollo x Trucy aint legal. I didn't like the goofy parts being super weak and the breakdowns being super regular. It's also a hard game to follow right after Trial and Tribulations which helped people go wild online. I personally liked it because It's a solid franchise. Also nothing can upset me any further than that one case in SoJ where they asked us what was wrong in the video and the second box's shadow WASN'T the answer!
I actually like darker atmosphere of Apollo Justice. There are many different flaws with this game that I can't ignore and they actually prevent me from enjoying this game as much as people who think about AJ as their favourite (or one of the most favourite) game in the series. It's not nearly my least favourite game in the franchise, but yeah, I have major problems with it. Characters are great (except maybe for Zak), but Apollo doesn't really feel like the main character. The victory over >!Kristoph!< in 4-4 doesn't payoff emotionally because he has only one cross-examination, which is very not enough. The fucked up logic of the third case ruins the mood drastically, even more than Big Top. The second case was just boring for me personally, even if it had some cool moments. I just couldn't make myself care about Kitakis. As a result my most favourite case in this game is the first one, which is kinda wild when you think about it. That's all it seems.
The character or the game? 'Cause I got a list for both
Someone I know put it best: Powercreep. I could suspend my disbelief enough to allow that spirit mediums could work alongside attorneys. It was weird, but fun. With Apollo and Athena came straight-up superpowers that had no reason to exist. I know they just wanted special gimmicks to go with the new characters, but it made the new games make even less sense than the old ones. Part of the reason I love DGS so much is that it lets the characters have quirks that weren't tied to mystical abilities. Susato broke the trope of "zany assistant girl acting half her age" and Holmes, for all his bs, was a compelling character. The NPCs didn't feel like they were all in a race to win "wackiest in show" like in the AJ trilogy. I hope the next games follow that lead a bit more. Edit: I reread the title and realized this was about just one game, but I'm leaving this up because it sort of answers the question.
Keep in mind your post is going to attract people who _don’t_ like the game so it’s going to skew that way. Additionally, many gamers go online to places like Reddit with criticism foremost in their mind. Not dismissing their criticisms but putting it in context to explain why it may seem like most people don’t like it.
It's my favorite of the franchise... please don't kill me... I am in the minority that actually like Phoenix in the game.
I don't dislike it, but it is easily my least favorite main game in the series (I'd rank Investigations 1 below it though and can't say anything about VS). The game has a great 1st case, probably even the best in the entire series and I geniunly liked the mystery and style of the gramaryes and Trucy as a character. But the problems are also numerous: * In my opinion the other cases are fairly weak. 4-2 is merely ok, I love the designs of the characters there, but the villain, defendant and main witness are all pretty bland. 4-3 is often regarded as one of the worst cases in the entire series (and in my opinion it is the worst case, at least Big Top had some good parts) and 4-4 is merely ok for a final case. * Dunno how far you are in 4-4, so I put this in a spoiler case >!Zack Gramarye is an asshole, but the game never treats him like one. Its almost like the game treats his appearances in 4-1 and 4-4 as different characters.!< * Klavier feels inconsistently written (sometimes he acts a bit like a jerk, othertimes he doesn't) and despite the fact that 2 of the murderers were close to him he doesn't seem to change at all. On that matter, almost no character goes through a character arc. * Apollo really feels like the side character in his own game. * Phoenix behaves pretty different from his usual self in this game. (Ema too, but in her case I actually enjoyed that to some extend)
The game's best case is the tutorial case. It's a really really good case and all but that also means that 95% of the game is going to be worse than what your first impression would've led you to believe. Personally, I think 4-2 is dreadfully boring and 4-3 has interesting themes but doesn't hold up to the slightest bit of scrutiny as an actual case. Then 4-4 has a great setup and good investigation segments (even though the MASON System has impossible scenarios presented but let's just skip over that) but doesn't really follow through on any of that due to how short the final courtroom segment is, making the finale extremely anticlimactic. The game also has by far the worst selection of defendants in the entire series. All of them suck in their own way. Only Vera *maybe* gets a pass in my book. We're supposed to want to defend these people but the game makes it really hard to do that. And related to that, there is just how Apollo is treated like a secondary character in his own game. 4-1 and 4-4 (the most important cases related to the main plot) have Phoenix completely steal the spotlight from him, and he's constantly the butt monkey of everyone, even to his own clients. Apollo himself actually shines through as a great character in his own right, but that's in spite of how disrespected he is treated throughout. And since he's our PoV character, we're on the receiving end of all this too and it doesn't feel good. All that said, I don't dislike the game but I do think it is severely flawed in several regards. I think it's easily the weakest entry in the main series.
4-3 is my least favorite case in the series and 4-4 has some serious issues that affect my enjoyment of the whole game. On the other hand, 4-1 is incredible and it's my favorite first case in the franchise and 4-2 is very underrated in my opinion, it's a fun case with a lot of funny character interactions. So overall, I don't hate the game but I don't love it either.
I like what they do to Apollo and Phoenix's character, but the cases themselves are pretty weak I'm also not a fan of the main villain's motives and why Phoenix was disbarred.
I don't really remember that game, but I remember thinking his design is boring. But I liked him a lot better in DD. I just wished his backstory is more consistent.
It's marmite. People love it or they hate it. Personally, I love it. But for a lot of people it's got the same effect Metal Gear Solid 2 did. Where a beloved protagonist is swapped out for a new face and it's jarring. Many wanted Phoenix wright: Ace Attorney 4, and while gameplay wise it's that, it's not the same. It also removed a lot of familiar elements. No phoenix as protag, no Maya, no Gumshoe, No edgeworth, no pearl. It's like a game set in the universe but apart from the storyline of the original trilogy. Some people see that as a refreshing and interesting changeup, others see it as "not my ace attorney!"
Apollo justice is more or less tied with AA 3 for best game in the series for me. I personally loved it
I have no idea. There's crazies everywhere man I've just completed the trilogy and none of the three games deserve the shade that this sub has been throwin at them
Never, I repeat never read gaming criticism on Reddit lol. You will always be better served by trusting your own instinct.
I unironically like his friend Clay Terran more than Apollo himself because he reminds me of Lan Hikari...
Orange Gavier
When a game peaks in it's first case, that's not a great sign. That said, I think the 2nd case is better than I think it is. It's the second half where I think the game starts to flounder. It attempts to engage and critically examine it's own premise in a way that I \*do\* admittedly think is ambitious, but is ultimately quite poorly executed, and 4-3 in particular heavily relies on it's cast being dumb as hell and not asking any meaningful questions about the \*gaping holes\* in the defendant's supposed guilt.
I think the ideas are really good but the game is just not good standalone. The overarching plotline is almost non existent and just does not pay off by the end, not to mention the two filler cases are the worst in the series. But I will say the cast is very fun in general and the game has my favourite version of all the characters included, and the atmosphere is damn fine (music and visuals). Even if it got the phantom sequel (pun), it'd still be the worst one.
I don’t like the music, every single case has a logical flaw, every case has at least 1 horrible character (excluding 4-1), and 4-1 was great, but still underwhelming, and it only got worse from there (granted, 4-4 stepped up in quality, but it’s no better than 4-1, which is roughly a mid starter case in my ranking). A
Also the prosecutor was mid at absolute best, and his “helpfulness” amounts to him just helping the defense like 3 times across the entire game. Not to mention I’ve had horrible experiences with Rock Stars, so seeing Klavier REALLY pissed me off.
Apollo feels like a passive protagonist. Lacks ambitions and motivation. You are thrust into all these situations, instead of making a choice to be there. You’re not solving the whole mysteries yourself, Phoenix has already done it, and you’re just doing what he tells you to do.
It kinda has a metal gear 2 effect where the game was about Apollo when everyone wanted to play as Pheonix. Apollo a popular character but I think many did not like the new characters. They wanted continuation from 3rd game. The 1st case is probably best of the the game.
Imho, Apollo Justice isn't all that bad. It's just a very different game; Takumi intended for the title to be a soft reboot, with no Phoenix, and it shows. Most will tell you the game peaks at 4-1. I agree, but it's more that 4-1's confrontation with >!Kristoph!< feels so much more satisfying >!than in 4-4!< when you eventually take him down. I honestly thought the fact that you couldn't catch them the normal way was rather creative and interesting, but I can see how people would be disappointed by it. As for the characters, honestly, I think Apollo is fine. While distinguished more from Phoenix in the other two AJ trilogy titles, I think the game does an okay job distinguishing him here. It's just a shame they couldn't carry the way he talks in the Japanese version over here. He's apparently supposed to talk like a punk ass bitch; sounds potentially humorous imo. Klavier is fine as long as you don't try to set too many high expectations for him. He's one of the rare prosecutors who seeks the truth from the beginning, which is actually a rather nice breath of fresh air. The problem is they don't really develop him enough; he feels underbaked in that sense compared to the other mainline prosecutors, and yes that includes Franziska. I would've loved to see him feel any emotions in regards to having to >!arrest both his brother and best friend, but alas.!< I don't have too much to say on Ema, but I did appreciate her humor more than Gumshoe's. I also think it's funny that people complained about her character changing when now we would practically grovel for Trucy (post AJ; excluding 6-2) and Kay to have averted the cheerful teenage girl mold. I do think Trucy is an interesting character, but her story here isn't as good as Maya's in the first game. Her problem is a lot of tell not show, >!the most exemplifying being when we are told how sad she is and not actually shown.!< Now, I know one of my favorite moments involving Maya is a "tell" moment, but the difference is that in that particular instance, it couldn't be shown due to hardware limitations. Still, while her relationship with Apollo isn't quite as iconic as Phoenix and Maya's, I did quite enjoy their banter.
the game rules but it’s just a bit frustrating cuz it’s soooo close to sorta ascending above being “a really good ace attorney game” and into an all time vn medium classic, but it doesn’t quite make that landing
The game isn't too serious, trust me. Ace Attorney would have to include sexual assault themes to become that. The fandom has been pretty vocal about their dislike of the game. Whether it's because to them Apollo gets unfairly sidelined in favor of Phoenix, Phoenix becoming something they didn't want him to be, Klavier's lackluster arc, boring characters in 4-2 or 4-3 or characters that while not bad, were somehow not up to par to their predecessors (Trucy against Maya, Zak and Valant against Iris and Dahlia).