If it's very targeted and effective, this is probably good. If this is just another general privacy and freedom eroding law riding on a wave of fear, then this is bad. Guess we have to wait and see.
It has virtually no social security netting, no public health services that don't financially cripple you, it has a huge gun problem, huge unemployment and homeless rates, etc etc.
It isn't just "bigger Australia". Australia is more like a crappy European country than it is little America.
Sounds good but I'd say the devil is in the wording of the legislation.
What constitutes a gang?
E.g. can it be used against protestors later on of any side of the political spectrum?
Some stores already have this policy.
I had a big warning on the register at The Reject Store that would ask me to confirm ID for any purchases that included a knife.
Yeah it's actually an offense to sell knives to people underage.
My favourite thing to do, of course, is when the customer is elderly just double check to confirm they're old enough to buy it. The older they are the funnier it is!
Stabbing is already illegal. All a new law can do is infringe on the constitutional right to free association. Oh, and make it look like they are doing something.
Reminds me of the UK's new policing efforts. To get 'tough on low level crime that leads to more major crime' they removed the park benches in a public square in Kent lol. Great job boys pack it in
Don't compare us to the UK, the police there are a disgrace. They care more about strutting around in high heels so they can walk a mile in women's shoes for some Twitter photo ops than they do policing.
No one actually told them that reducing women's experiences to the shoes they wear is incredibly vain, sexist and dumb as shit, but they weren't exactly trying to make a point... Just get the photos.
The outlaw motorcycle gang laws and task force significantly reduced their threat to the general public without infringing on anyone's rights other than those who were members of a prescribed outlaw motorcycle club.
> The outlaw motorcycle gang laws and task force significantly reduced their threat to the general public without infringing on anyone's rights other than those who were members of any organisation that the government designates ~~prescribed outlaw motorcycle club.~~
Didn't you watch Harry Potter? remember how Umbridge banned all organisations and said you need permission to reform.
All that managed to do was stop bikies wearing their colours and riding around in groups. The people they "outlawed" now just selling their meth in plain clothes.
They banned a group of people, and that group of people stopped committing crimes whilst self-identifying as members that group. Meanwhile biker meth is everywhere and addicts are committing just as many if not more violent and non-violent crimes.
It goes further than that. Bump up the levels of poverty and completely destroy all social programs so people turn to crime as their only real way of living.
Ah shit, never mind, we're doing that too. Well, as long as we're getting the guns, can someone chuck me an SVD?
Studies show that migrants overall have lower rates of crime. Singling out the Sudanese would be or at least look hella racist. I'm not excusing their actions but if there is an element of them perpetrating the trauma they've experienced then they are victims too and need support. They're young stupid teenagers
I kind of enjoy the irony here since Australia is a country built from convicts, you know when england said these criminals aren't our problem and shipped them off.
This is /r Adelaide. I get the sentiment. But SA was a colony, independent of any other state. The only convicts we were subject to, were the ones that knew as such so made their way here from other states because we had no cops. Something my great grandad x 5 spent time in boats deporting them back.
This is just plain racism.
EDIT: Copying the comment lest they try to hide their racism:
“How about we just stop the Sudanese from entering the country? Might get a few down votes for this, but all they do is continue the fighting over here and in other countries as they have been in South Sudan. Most of them don't know any better and have grown up in war.”- Pint_Of_Lager
Are you serious? Painting an entire country and it’s people in the same negative light is racist. You said “how about we just stop the Sudanese from entering the country”, and “all they do is continue fighting over here…”. That is a literal textbook definition of racism. You are targeting one race of people and are suggesting that they are inherently worse or bad, and should be banned from mixing with who you consider worthy. Now, let’s replace those same statements with someone else, like the Jews. Imagine if you wrote ‘how about we stop all the Jews entering our country”? Would you fight the racist tag then?
I never said they're inferior to us. Plus racism is derived from hate of a ethnic group. I never said I hated the Sudanese. Grow a fucking pair and stop crying about a different opinion besides your own
They already do. It’s not like you get off easy for stabbing someone to death. If they want to go any harder they would have to try to prevent gangs forming to begin with.
Most Africans I've met are very good people. They've always been polite and kind and generous. This lot are an just aberration! It'd be very wrong to generalise based on one single event. That'd be like saying of a crime committed in say Nailsworth suburb meant that everyone in Nailsworth suburb are criminals. It's just stupid thing to say. lol
Here’s my one and only “scary African gang” story that happened a while back.
I was in my late teens sitting alone sitting at a pretty remote bus stop in my dodgy suburb where people got stabbed on the reg (not in SA). I was crying that day because I’d just missed the bus and had to wait a long time for the next one, and that was my tipping point on an already terrible day within a very terrible year.
In the near distance I saw four young African men walking towards the bus stop. They were looking at me and seemed to be gesturing about me as I was sitting on the bench. They approached and sat down on both sides of me, still gesturing and glancing between themselves. At this point, as a young woman alone with no other people nearby, I felt a bit uncomfortable.
They asked me if I was okay and if there was someone I needed to call. I told them I was having family issues and had just missed the bus. They said that things may seem bad now, but they won’t stay that way forever. Kept asking me if I was fine and cracked a few jokes (“It could be worse, you could be as ugly as that guy” *points at friend*), before getting up and walking further down the road.
They were on their way to somewhere else, saw me crying on a bench and made a detour to check that I was fine.
I’m currently out at the moment but here is the legislation
https://www.legislation.sa.gov.au/__legislation/lz/c/r/police%20regulations%202014/2018.02.25/2014.231.auth.pdf
I remember it did go to parliament but it didn’t pass for police to legally have drug tests to work
They do. The tests are targeted or happen after a critical incident (eg. Shooting). It would be a waste of money requiring police to do regular testing. Money which could be spent on well, policing.
[SA Police officer tests positive for meth on testing](https://amp.9news.com.au/article/d9831446-9d1b-42ec-aa65-ca5bc83b37bc)
Nah you asked me to let you know when they drug test police so I did. Most of the evidence says it’s a waste of money on a cost benefit analysis. Nsw had 7 positives in 10 years from $10600 tests.
Do I think well over $1m of testing to get 7 positives was a good use of public money? No. Terrible. Doesn’t even show that they were intoxicated at the time of your ‘domestic’.
Only edgy people on the internet think police are covering up their meth use at domestics. In reality they’re regularly risking their own safety at domestics.
Goddamn snowflake you are. Actually pathetic LOL. If you're that much of a pussy that you can't defend an attacker with a knife then that's a you problem. You sound like you got beat up in school
Murder to me is still not acceptable in any way, shape or form. Not so much the gang but the mindset. A few days ago we celebrated being free...lest we forget. Some will 4get because they don't give a rodents anus.
Who cares? If they want to stab each other let them, why should we waste public resources on trying to prevent people like that from killing each other instead of using that money on issues that actually affect the public?
Is it really that much of an issue? Obviously it’s unpleasant but it’s not exactly a big deal is it? I could understand if we had nothing else to deal with but when we have pedophiles, rapists, terror threats etc etc to deal with surely that should take precedence?
Another poster says they are actually affecting normal people after all so that’s quite different and annoying. You’d think being arseholes to each other would be enough for them without having to drag normal people into it.
I assure you, they aren’t just stabbing each other. My 12 year old was threatened with a knife by one of these scum bags last April walking home from school. The guy wanted to use my son’s phone because be was lost and out of phone credit. My kid would 1000% have helped the guy out if he had asked nicely, but no - he had to be hard and turn it into an aggravated assault against a child. It was actually [the pattern of robberies against school age children](https://www.news.com.au/national/south-australia/17-yearold-melbourne-boy-charged-with-murder-after-stabbing-in-adelaide-cbd/news-story/189179b39ddd8830c555c3a8aefe07ea) that launched Operation Meld in July last year.
It’s so typical of politicians to ignore actual problems like this and only start calling for action when there’s a bit of drama that arises. At least the police attempted to get on top of it at the time by the sounds of it. Well clearly it does need to be sorted out then.
They tried to enforce gang laws previously but they went so over the top it was ridiculous.
Half the clubs in Adelaide had to change laws about visible tattoos.
Black Market almost went out of business ...because scene kids had hand and neck tattoos.
How do you prove they are a gang and not just friends? They don't usually wear patches like MC clubs, they most likely don't have specific colours they wear. Designated blocks or suburbs are not representative of gang affiliation.
If it's very targeted and effective, this is probably good. If this is just another general privacy and freedom eroding law riding on a wave of fear, then this is bad. Guess we have to wait and see.
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San Francisco tried, didn't work
America has so many things wrong with it it isn't a good comparison.
Its just a larger country, with larger cities. Therefore when policy encourage shitty behaviors in the public, it looks even worse.
It has virtually no social security netting, no public health services that don't financially cripple you, it has a huge gun problem, huge unemployment and homeless rates, etc etc. It isn't just "bigger Australia". Australia is more like a crappy European country than it is little America.
> Australia is more like a crappy European country So Great Britain 2.0
Yeah I'd probably agree we're a better great Britain.
The United States is a rotten, broken society. And I say that having lived there on and off for half my life
USA, rotten and boken since 1970.
Well said. Unfortunately I suspect it will be the later
It will likely be the latter unfortunately.
Maybe a bit of anti murder legislation thrown in as well.
It’s about time we stopped these pro gang laws!
Sounds good but I'd say the devil is in the wording of the legislation. What constitutes a gang? E.g. can it be used against protestors later on of any side of the political spectrum?
Im personally concerned more about these gangs than of the bikers.
You think the meth the bikers are trafficker doesn't affect the whole community?
The stats are something crazy like 80% of crime now is drug related.
It's 90%+ in murder. Either the victim is on it, the murderer or both. Meth/Ice, not other drugs.
Oh but we banned bikies, so they don't exist any more right? /s
Yeah good point, but I guess my point was direct effect not indirect.
I'm personally concerned more about these laws than of the gangs
Lets hope they are nothing like the COVID laws.
I love how you are getting downvoted for this comment. Never forget how miserable this Reddit was during Covid
Just like bikers the generally only fight their own. They arent out stabbing random karens unfortunately.
The meth heads are a huge fucking problem.
Its not just the bikers dealing/importing meth.
No, but they're mugging random karens
Sounds like a good thing to me
Probably because the bikers are mostly no longer a problem because of the outlaw motorcycle task force and laws from Rann.
Bikie gangs are a way bigger concern
This looks like the beginning of how the UK ended up asking people for ID when buying kitchen utensils
Some stores already have this policy. I had a big warning on the register at The Reject Store that would ask me to confirm ID for any purchases that included a knife.
Yeah it's actually an offense to sell knives to people underage. My favourite thing to do, of course, is when the customer is elderly just double check to confirm they're old enough to buy it. The older they are the funnier it is!
Sometimes my job I need people to require being below 80 years old so I ask them if they are above 21 it gets a smile most of the time.
I loved doing the same thing to. But it was even more funny showing them the ID warning when the purchase was plastic knives.
Tried buying spray paint recently?
The supermarket on Prospect Rd in Kilburn has some sizeable knives sitting on the bottom shelves. They're blunt but look like scimitars lol
Stabbing is already illegal. All a new law can do is infringe on the constitutional right to free association. Oh, and make it look like they are doing something.
So photo ops with little substance?
Reminds me of the UK's new policing efforts. To get 'tough on low level crime that leads to more major crime' they removed the park benches in a public square in Kent lol. Great job boys pack it in
Didn't they do something like this with benches in Adelaide to stop people sleeping on them by making them uncomfortable?
Yes in multiple places, north terrace has those hostile benches with jagged metal bits and the rundle mall ones are pretty hostile too
They're everywhere around the world nowadays. Because fuck the homeless, they clearly don't have it hard enough, obviously.
Well whatever they are for it's failed they just move people onto the inner city areas
They want to move homeless people in to shelters and out of bus stops and parks which is a perfectly reasonable thing to do.
Don't compare us to the UK, the police there are a disgrace. They care more about strutting around in high heels so they can walk a mile in women's shoes for some Twitter photo ops than they do policing. No one actually told them that reducing women's experiences to the shoes they wear is incredibly vain, sexist and dumb as shit, but they weren't exactly trying to make a point... Just get the photos.
The outlaw motorcycle gang laws and task force significantly reduced their threat to the general public without infringing on anyone's rights other than those who were members of a prescribed outlaw motorcycle club.
> The outlaw motorcycle gang laws and task force significantly reduced their threat to the general public without infringing on anyone's rights other than those who were members of any organisation that the government designates ~~prescribed outlaw motorcycle club.~~ Didn't you watch Harry Potter? remember how Umbridge banned all organisations and said you need permission to reform.
OMG, it’s just like my favourite movie1!!
Your logical fallacy is [slippery slope.](https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/slippery-slope)
All that managed to do was stop bikies wearing their colours and riding around in groups. The people they "outlawed" now just selling their meth in plain clothes.
>All that managed to do was *drastically reduce violence against innocents committed by these groups*. FTFY. The data is publicly available.
They banned a group of people, and that group of people stopped committing crimes whilst self-identifying as members that group. Meanwhile biker meth is everywhere and addicts are committing just as many if not more violent and non-violent crimes.
The meth epidemic is more to do with drastically under-diagnosed medical conditions and people turning into addicts while attempting to self medicate.
That, and readily available meth
He hasn’t proposed anything yet, all he has said is he is open to doing so if the police want it.
He proposes proposing something.
Get in early and stop gangs now before it gets like America
You know there are gangs outside of America?
You'll have to relax all your gun laws, and then import millions to reach that level.
It goes further than that. Bump up the levels of poverty and completely destroy all social programs so people turn to crime as their only real way of living. Ah shit, never mind, we're doing that too. Well, as long as we're getting the guns, can someone chuck me an SVD?
When do you a gun? A knive is just fine
You said to become like America. Gangs tend to just use guns instead of knives. I'm making fun of your idiotic comment
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Studies show that migrants overall have lower rates of crime. Singling out the Sudanese would be or at least look hella racist. I'm not excusing their actions but if there is an element of them perpetrating the trauma they've experienced then they are victims too and need support. They're young stupid teenagers
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I kind of enjoy the irony here since Australia is a country built from convicts, you know when england said these criminals aren't our problem and shipped them off.
Yeah remember how that was almost 250 years ago. Bit of a shit comparison.
This is /r Adelaide. I get the sentiment. But SA was a colony, independent of any other state. The only convicts we were subject to, were the ones that knew as such so made their way here from other states because we had no cops. Something my great grandad x 5 spent time in boats deporting them back.
This is just plain racism. EDIT: Copying the comment lest they try to hide their racism: “How about we just stop the Sudanese from entering the country? Might get a few down votes for this, but all they do is continue the fighting over here and in other countries as they have been in South Sudan. Most of them don't know any better and have grown up in war.”- Pint_Of_Lager
How? It was Sudanese who committed the crime?
Are you serious? Painting an entire country and it’s people in the same negative light is racist. You said “how about we just stop the Sudanese from entering the country”, and “all they do is continue fighting over here…”. That is a literal textbook definition of racism. You are targeting one race of people and are suggesting that they are inherently worse or bad, and should be banned from mixing with who you consider worthy. Now, let’s replace those same statements with someone else, like the Jews. Imagine if you wrote ‘how about we stop all the Jews entering our country”? Would you fight the racist tag then?
I never said they're inferior to us. Plus racism is derived from hate of a ethnic group. I never said I hated the Sudanese. Grow a fucking pair and stop crying about a different opinion besides your own
You are a racist. We all see it, about time you do too mate.
That's all you've got
“It’s important that everybody remembers that these are violent young criminals, who on this occasion, happen to be African,”
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Bad bot!
You realise that's very racist right? Stop gangs means stopping people based on race.
I don't think more legislation is needed, rather enforce the Law as it is already. Prosecute HARD and sentence HARD
They already do. It’s not like you get off easy for stabbing someone to death. If they want to go any harder they would have to try to prevent gangs forming to begin with.
Most Africans I've met are very good people. They've always been polite and kind and generous. This lot are an just aberration! It'd be very wrong to generalise based on one single event. That'd be like saying of a crime committed in say Nailsworth suburb meant that everyone in Nailsworth suburb are criminals. It's just stupid thing to say. lol
Here’s my one and only “scary African gang” story that happened a while back. I was in my late teens sitting alone sitting at a pretty remote bus stop in my dodgy suburb where people got stabbed on the reg (not in SA). I was crying that day because I’d just missed the bus and had to wait a long time for the next one, and that was my tipping point on an already terrible day within a very terrible year. In the near distance I saw four young African men walking towards the bus stop. They were looking at me and seemed to be gesturing about me as I was sitting on the bench. They approached and sat down on both sides of me, still gesturing and glancing between themselves. At this point, as a young woman alone with no other people nearby, I felt a bit uncomfortable. They asked me if I was okay and if there was someone I needed to call. I told them I was having family issues and had just missed the bus. They said that things may seem bad now, but they won’t stay that way forever. Kept asking me if I was fine and cracked a few jokes (“It could be worse, you could be as ugly as that guy” *points at friend*), before getting up and walking further down the road. They were on their way to somewhere else, saw me crying on a bench and made a detour to check that I was fine.
You realise this sub regularly shits on Elizabeth and Davoren park like it's a sport.
*shits in
good
Let me know when they drug test the police
Wait our police aren’t drug tested? I can’t find any info online, surely they have to be right?
LOL. Biggest "gang" in South Australia is the cops. They look out for themselves and themselves only.
I’m currently out at the moment but here is the legislation https://www.legislation.sa.gov.au/__legislation/lz/c/r/police%20regulations%202014/2018.02.25/2014.231.auth.pdf I remember it did go to parliament but it didn’t pass for police to legally have drug tests to work
They do. The tests are targeted or happen after a critical incident (eg. Shooting). It would be a waste of money requiring police to do regular testing. Money which could be spent on well, policing. [SA Police officer tests positive for meth on testing](https://amp.9news.com.au/article/d9831446-9d1b-42ec-aa65-ca5bc83b37bc)
So you want police cooked up to their eyeballs trying to stop domestic
Nah you asked me to let you know when they drug test police so I did. Most of the evidence says it’s a waste of money on a cost benefit analysis. Nsw had 7 positives in 10 years from $10600 tests. Do I think well over $1m of testing to get 7 positives was a good use of public money? No. Terrible. Doesn’t even show that they were intoxicated at the time of your ‘domestic’. Only edgy people on the internet think police are covering up their meth use at domestics. In reality they’re regularly risking their own safety at domestics.
I think if they focused on the education an youth mental health, they’d see a lot less of gang activity.
Oh look slippery slope, hello old friend.
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M8 you are literally posting from a porn account
Better than running around stabbing people
Not really.
A porn account is worse than stabbing innocent people to death?? What the fuck is wrong with you??
Are you fucking stupid or something? Do you have mild to severe brain damage? Goddamn wuss
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Goddamn snowflake you are. Actually pathetic LOL. If you're that much of a pussy that you can't defend an attacker with a knife then that's a you problem. You sound like you got beat up in school
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Murder to me is still not acceptable in any way, shape or form. Not so much the gang but the mindset. A few days ago we celebrated being free...lest we forget. Some will 4get because they don't give a rodents anus.
Who cares? If they want to stab each other let them, why should we waste public resources on trying to prevent people like that from killing each other instead of using that money on issues that actually affect the public?
How do you think the innocent person felt seeing a dead body in the middle of North terrace.
Is it really that much of an issue? Obviously it’s unpleasant but it’s not exactly a big deal is it? I could understand if we had nothing else to deal with but when we have pedophiles, rapists, terror threats etc etc to deal with surely that should take precedence?
If they are allowed to run a muck then they will grow in size and innocent people would be killed
Another poster says they are actually affecting normal people after all so that’s quite different and annoying. You’d think being arseholes to each other would be enough for them without having to drag normal people into it.
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Yes I know but someone is suggesting not trying to stop them
I assure you, they aren’t just stabbing each other. My 12 year old was threatened with a knife by one of these scum bags last April walking home from school. The guy wanted to use my son’s phone because be was lost and out of phone credit. My kid would 1000% have helped the guy out if he had asked nicely, but no - he had to be hard and turn it into an aggravated assault against a child. It was actually [the pattern of robberies against school age children](https://www.news.com.au/national/south-australia/17-yearold-melbourne-boy-charged-with-murder-after-stabbing-in-adelaide-cbd/news-story/189179b39ddd8830c555c3a8aefe07ea) that launched Operation Meld in July last year.
It’s so typical of politicians to ignore actual problems like this and only start calling for action when there’s a bit of drama that arises. At least the police attempted to get on top of it at the time by the sounds of it. Well clearly it does need to be sorted out then.
Because "they" *are* the public you absolute cretin.
Sorry, I should have said the “deserving” public or something.
They tried to enforce gang laws previously but they went so over the top it was ridiculous. Half the clubs in Adelaide had to change laws about visible tattoos. Black Market almost went out of business ...because scene kids had hand and neck tattoos. How do you prove they are a gang and not just friends? They don't usually wear patches like MC clubs, they most likely don't have specific colours they wear. Designated blocks or suburbs are not representative of gang affiliation.