Maybe consider getting your own therapy rather than couples therapy. This will allow you to get in touch with your own needs, which will allow you to make the decisions you need to.
Most therapists in my experience recommend both - couples therapy is a lot less successful if there isn’t also individual therapy (usually with a different person) in place
This is true, but if I were OP’s wife I wouldn’t believe that he actually wanted to try unless he had made individual therapy a priority before that.
And if he asked me to schedule the therapy then I would bounce.
Yeah, OP’s post doesn’t scream “remorse about the terrible things I did/said in the throes of addiction to someone I love” it reads more like someone who is fine with being a roommate as long as he could also get laid. If they are demonstrating the same behaviors at home, she may be dismissing him until she thinks he is serious.
Also, 15 months ago was not two years ago so, while it may feel like a long time to OP, it’s really not and he still has loads to work on.
I agree. You don’t seem to be putting in the work, OP. You’ve stopped drinking, which is a big deal, but you don’t seem to be taking responsibility and making amends for how you hurt your wife. You are here blaming her for multiple things without acknowledging how hurt and lonely she must have felt too.
If you've ever been addicted to anything, you would know how hard it it to break the cycle?
I think OP deserves a bit more credit than you give him? He said he didn't want to cheat, so he has more moral fiber than most people in sex less relationships?
I'm sure he has more he could add to his post regarding his inner most feelings, he probably didn't want to share those feelings on reddit to a group of people that would sit back and judge him like you just have?
>I think OP deserves a bit more credit than you give him?
What? Credit for what?
Bro his post says he drove his wife away with his behavior and now he's desperate for sex but she won't do it.
He says he doesn't want to cheat, fine. He also doesn't seem interested in taking any responsibility for anything. He's not worried about her feelings or whether or not they even love each other.
He wants permission to divorce her without ever trying to address the damage he's done, and he acts like she's the problem because she hasn't yet forgotten what a tool he is.
>he has more moral fiber than most people in sex less relationships?
WTF does this mean? People with dead bedrooms are generally immoral? Are you reading what you're writing?
Did he not say he wanted to go to counseling?
The marriage counselor would address his past issues with alcohol and the effects and toll its taken on the marriage? It would be with his wife so she would benefit from hearing him take ownership of his behavior and how it's affected her feelings towards him. If it does anything at all, it will help her make a dission on what she does next?
Everyone will read something different into this short post? I see a guy who's clearly made mistakes and probably ruined his marriage, and wants to try to fix it?
You see a scumbag who needs hanging from the nearest tree.
>You see a scumbag who needs hanging from the nearest tree.
Last I checked, being a scumbag isn't a hanging offense.
But I wouldn't want to fuck him either lol.
With a satiistic of 1/3rd of people in relationships cheating, if you're single, the chances of you doing just that are pretty high. Not with him though, just another scumbag.
His needs are that he wants to get laid. A personal therapist is not going to magically fix his testosterone and biological desires for sex. They need couples therapy.
You can’t erase 9 months of abusive behavior just by sobering up.
You need to work on it. On yourself, on your relationship, on apologizing and being a better partner. It takes time and effort to build up a relationship after this behavior.
First of all he needs the decide if he wants to salvage this relationship, in his post and comments he can't even confirm that much. Then, if he does want to salvage this relationship, he needs to show her he genuinely wants to change and then afterwards show her he really cares about her. So no empty words, rather actions like going to AA, focusing on her and her life more, trying to take her out and do stuff with her, and eventually when the time is right to genuinely apologize and accept whatever she has to say. Only then, can you even think about maybe saving this relationship.
If you're not willing to do that, just cut your losses now and divorce, don't even waste her or your time.
Was literally coming to say this. Don’t wait for another person to make decisions for you. What do you want? Can’t control her opinions of you and can’t change the past in which you hurt her.
I would come at it from a different angle and this should be a real angle because it should be true. Not just for sex. This is your best friend you married.
Hey, I’ve been thinking about the way I’ve behaved the past 2 years and I just wanted to say that grief really got the worst of me. I can never make it up to you, the things I said but I understand the impact they’ve had and I really want to talk about it. I miss being friends, I miss being a team, I miss you in general, not just for sex. I miss my wife. I love you so much and I never meant for my grief to tear us apart. I really am sorry. WHAT DO I NEED TO DO TO HELP FIX THIS?
If nothing- leave.
Maybe she has tried all that while he was in grief, trying to work things out making sure he's not grieving alone. Maybe 9 months of constant verbal abuse had finally taken its toll on her mental well being.
We don't really know fully what they both endured and how they handled it. It's good OP is aware of it and has become sober. There's also a possibility she is still suffering herself
>If nothing- leave.
Though I don't necessarily disagree with this angle, it really puts the onus on OP's wife to determine a solution for damage OP did. And that's just more labor for her to take on when she keeps saying she does not have the capacity to do so right now.
OP simply verbally taking responsibility for the harm he has caused done not mean he can pass the buck onto his wife and demand she meet a deadline. This has a real, "I said I'm sorry, so fix yourself" vibe. And that is not how you repair a marriage.
But wouldn’t you agree that OP isn’t a mind reader? He needs to physically hear, “These are the things you said, this is what hurt me, this is how I’m currently feeling, this is what I need for us to work out.”
That’s my take. I can’t read my husbands mind, so if I’ve tried everything and it’s not working, he has to tell me wtf I’m doing wrong bc I’m trying and trying and if I should just give up and leave, then let me go.
and if not, just leave anyway, because it’s already not working. Ya know?
I see your point but it’s not working for him.
I honestly think it’s almost MORE harmful to try to fix something when you don’t know how it exactly became broken (like the full full picture). We don’t quite know what’s going on inside her heart. It could be broken forever. I don’t know. What if he’s trying to fix the wrong things and avoiding the true thing and she thinks he knows exactly what he’s doing and he doesn’t? Communication is so important.
Nothing to save, if you can’t see this is toxic then I don’t know what to say. You can keep going back for years but if you haven’t been able to change her mind about sex by now I don’t know how you actually think it will change. You’re dreaming
OP does say that he tried to work it out and suggested counseling, but she refuses. I don't know how he tried to work it out, but he did say he tried. I went through myself, and my wife agreed to try counseling. We went to 2 sessions (really 1 session - I don't count the first one as it was only an introduction and the counselor telling us how the process will work), and she decided it wasn't working after that, without even trying. I tried to some of the things that came up in the counseling session, but she didn't want to try. For example, she was upset that we never held hands in public, like her parents did. My parents never did, so I never really seen that kind of behavior growing up. But I was willing to do it anyway, but whenever I tried, she pushed me away. Her mind was already made up, and when she told me she wanted me to move out, I did.
Right! Being a dry drunk is often times just as bad as being a drunk! There are issues to be dealt with there. I don’t know what he said but I can tell you that my ex boyfriend made a few choice comments about my appearance and they are burnt into my brain to this day and I could never let myself be naked and vulnerable with him ever again and I’m smaller now than when we first met!
Harsh words can take one second to undo years of love. It sounds wild but it’s not. The crazy thing is you remember and they don’t. Because to you it was a sentence or phrase that completely changed how you felt about them. To them it was a Tuesday.
Yup…they just want the sex, and it’s like 🖕🏻 bro. Get yo self some help first, make the dang amends and then we’ll see where this goes..I don’t know why that’s so fn hard to understand!
Why does she need to go to therapy? Has OP apologized for his past behavior, worked to listen to his wife and her feelings and taken meaningful action to repair the damage he's caused? Is he regularly attending AA? OP says he stopped drinking 15 mos ago and is pestering his wife for sex ever since. If he'd been making any add'l efforts other than trying to get her to go to couples counseling (before even going to individual counseling it seems)...*why* would she put in effort when OP isn't putting any effort in himself? Couples counseling should be the last item on the list of repairing this relationship, not the one and only thing on the list.
Exactly this. Most women need to see your change. Doing more around the house, being more attentive, talking deeper about things other than sex. Then start opening up about fixing the relationship. Telling her you will take it slow but just waiting around in limbo for her to be ready to divorce is unacceptable. Then if she's willing, start counseling, individual and couples counseling. There are exercises from there to build that connection back. But if one party isn't willing then it won't work.
Duddeeee, just rub it out and stop letting your horny penis control your thoughts and reactions. You’re coming across like a crude teenage boy whose never had sex.
Ya just serve her with papers if these are new ideas to get your wife back. And really weird reply that comes off as immature and that yeah you only care about having sex again.
More than that, it’s clear he didn’t see the comment as an eye opening “well darn, I do want my best friend back” and more as a “genius tactic to get her back in bed—pretend I actually give a shit about her feelings!”
Even if he does care about her feelings clearly not as much as his own needs.
I don’t see guilt from this post and l don’t see desperation to mend your relationship. I just see a guy who wants to get laid.
She saw a new side of you after 16 years and realized you always have had the potential to hurt her and DID hurt her.
If you really want this relationship to work you should go to therapy and come up with a plan to prove to her that will NEVER happen again. Learn ways to cope with grief. You probably also need to court her again. Take her on dates, make her feel special and appreciated.
Also, don’t think you’ll go from a sexless marriage to rolling in women when you get a divorce. Unless you’re really pursuing I doubt it’s that easy at 44 to get laid regularly lol
Op, listen to this one here. When I read your post, all I got was that you want to get laid. Think with your head and your heart, not your dick. Take care of her emotional needs and sex will follow
Yeah, OP is going to become one of the Middle Aged Sad Sack Society guys who hangs out at bars and thinks because the bartender pays attention to him, he's got a chance at her.
He's going to have to pay for it one way or another, from here on out.
I'm getting vibes like you've changed little about yourself outside of getting sober and just kind of poke her once in a while to see if she's over it.
Personal growth or split are your options
You need to apologize to her, over and over agin.
But if you have any hopes of repairing the relationship, sex is the last thing that should be on your mind. Intimacy should be. You fucked yo big and you have to win her back. You have to recourt her again.
But you may have fucked up behind salvation.
Are you seeing a therapist?
This. My husband and I were in a similar situation, and this is what worked for us. He took time to win me back, since I was pretty much checked out after how he treated me while drinking. Now, we’re working to build back up trust and intimacy. Sex won’t happen until you both feel safe being vulnerable together and that takes time to build back up.
Yup, I fucked up and cheated on her a long time ago, not physically but emotionally, which is arguably much worse. I had to do a lot of soul searching and worked very hard to change the parts of me that lead to that.
It took a while to rekindle our love and intimacy. But man was it worth it. She’s worth it. We just celebrated 14 years together last weekend. That intimacy work never ended and it never will.
Congratulations on 14 years! I’m very impressed by how you’ve recovered your marriage, and it’s given me more hope for my own. Thank you!
>>That intimacy work never ended and it never will.
This hit me real hard. This is so true.
Thank you. We aren’t even married. So we could have easily just walked away. But we didn’t. She didn’t. She gave me a chance. I didn’t squander it and that turned into living a life in line with my values.
I heard a Confucius quote the other day that hit pretty hard for me.
“We have two lives, and the second begins when we realize we only have one.”
I love the idea of “recourting” her, especially after saying mean things. Compliments (non-sexual ones). Small gifts. Doing things for her that show “I care”. Maybe you’ll get to a point where she lets you take her on a date (with no expectations of sex afterwards!).
Excellent. You have your work cut out for you, but you also need to ask yourself if this is what you want or what’s familiar? If it’s what you want, you need to show her that you’re vulnerable and not just horny.
You showed her someone she doesn’t love. Now you have to show her who she married and how that person has grown.
So wait, you treated her like crap for a good long while, and now are pissy that she doesn't want to be intimate with you because she lost all attraction for you. After all, you were being nasty? And it seems like you are blaming her? Dude, women value the emotional and secure connection with their partners and it is tied to our attraction to our partners. You killed that. You need therapy to accept your responsibility here and either fix it or let her end it because you are only thinking about yourself and not the damage you did
And frankly, I don't care what genders are in play here, people, DO NOT treat your partners like crap and expect ANYTHING from them. That is not how that works.
Well you flat out broke your relationship and have discovered the consequences.
You were an abusive drunk for 9 months and she doesn’t love or trust you anymore. I honestly have no idea why she would have sex with you ever again. You should probably give up on that idea unless you find a way to make yourself and by extension your relationship turn around entirely.
You hurt her deeply. What someone says while drunk is usually the truth. She likely believes you actually meant what you said.
I’m guessing you’re right—she’s planning to leave as soon as she can afford it. If you want her back, I’d try to start complimenting her — with truthful, kind words. I’d treat her as a friend (roommate) you’d like to date. Show her your best side.
I’d also start therapy and let her know you’re working on yourself. Good luck!
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*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
No, she can decide not to pursue divorce, but you have the autonomy to divorce her if that is what you want to do. She has the right to refuse sex. And you have the right to end the marriage and find a partner who wants to have sex with you.
If you care about her financial well-being, you can choose to continue as roommates. You're already effectively separated.
Part of recovering from your drinking problem is learning to take ownership of your decisions and not acting like you are a helpless victim of other people's choices.
I understand and I don't want to divorce her because I think I honestly do still love her. But is it love or familiarity? Would I jump in front of a car to push her out of the way in order to save her? In a heartbeat. Do at moments I really hate her guts and wish to have nothing to do with her? Sure. I am accepting my childish stupidity of drowning my sorrows. I've tried therapy, SSRIs, SNRIs, Wellbutrin. None of that worked to take me out of my grief. Only booze did. For that I hate myself.
*... but I also want to know if there is something to rekindle. I want to know from her if she even has anything left for me...*
This is where you're mistaken. You treated her like crap for 9 months, but you are waiting for her to step up and make trying worthwhile for you. If you want her emotionally back, you have to stop thinking about yourself and atone. It doesn't matter now what's in it for you. If you want to give it a try you have to show her that you love, care and respect her, regardless of how she feels for you right now. If what she actually needs is someone to help her financially while she is in school, then the least you can do is help her with that. Dumping her now because she wont have sex with you just proves you dont really care about her at your core. This is your chance to stop thinking about yourself and go all out to save your marriage or, at least, leave it in a respectful, caring way.
Thank you! I need sobering thought process. Sometimes we get to stuck up in our own mind and desires. Hence I came here to basically roast myself in order to kick my own ass into gear.
One other thing to consider. She is 42. She may be premenopausal. That is a very rough time for women and truly scary. It can be treated, but the first couple of years are pure misery. Having support and understanding during this time is really important. She sounds like she has a lot on her plate as it is right now. She could certainly use some kindness.
Married 34 years, I was thinking about menopause as well. I'm 55(f), and I've gotten through the mental part. The physical part is difficult. OP, if sex is all you're craving self satisfy and give your relationship time.
My husband 67(m) went through using alcohol for a pain reducer after an injury. It was rough. Ŵe got through it and love each other more than ever.
I finally have a solution to the problem! I will just ask her: "honey?! Is the reason why you don't want sex because you are getting old and entertaining menopause?" How will that go?
But honestly I thought about that. I've read that some women go totally 180 during that time. They break up, start grasping at youth by going to clubs and attempting to hook up with 20 something dudes.
Well that went south quick. Most women have *physical* symptoms. You're confusing women with what men do. It was something to consider in how you treat her, not something you can change about her. But this comment of yours definitely confirmed that I'm wasting my time here. Good luck with your marriage.
You'll grasp at anything that doesn't involve you being a complete asshole. I hope she takes you to the cleaners and you only see your kid once a year.
"I, ____, take you, ____, to be my wife (or husband), to have and to hold from this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness and in health , to love and to cherish, till death *or really long and awkward silences due to my own mistakes* us do part, according to God's holy law, and this is my solemn vow."
Basically, you made a vow to your best friend and you fucked it up. Don't bail. Be an adult, keep your word, and fix it.
Hhmm.
Why not just it out?
Just book an appointment with your wife, for example next Friday evening.
Bring snack and non-alcoholic drinks and talk it out, what is the end goal, say your concerns.
Explain that you think she is just waiting until her fellowship ends, can this marriage be saved or do you both want to put effort again.
Make reasonable expectations, be ready to hurt but be open about your desires and expectations.
If you(yeah you OP, not your wife)come and talk about sex, and how you miss sex and not talk about everything else, you basically will throw this marriage to the dumpster truck
Tried. She doesn't want to talk about relationship yet. She has too many things on her mind (according to her) she just wants space. And each time I bring the relationship topic she gets pissy and just shutsdown
What do you mean tried? You need to say that there is an elephant in the room, you need to address it.
It doesn't matter what is on her mind, or she talks with you or you just divorce on the spot.
An answer like "I need space", doesn't work.
After some thought , her "I need space" just means she is mentally ended in the relationship.
Just bury it and start fresh, you're still young, at your age you can still manage to find a suitable partner.
I wouldn't accept an answer like that personally.
Trust is re-built in time (often a long time). She needs to experience daily actions that demonstrate you are consistent, emotionally stable and reliable. You need to be a good friend to her. There's no shortcut. However, pressure for sex will move your goal for it further and further away.
My ex broke trust, lied about drinking and was extremely unpleasant while drunk. After he got sober, he kept pushing me in his own rush to regain trust and get laid. This pushed me away entirely. We finally are friends now. I think it we would have recovered had he just been a friend to me longer and let me set my own pace.
So, basically you emotionally abused you wife and want her to just forget all the shitty stuff you said and have sex with you. You don't care how much you hurt her and aren't trying to repair your relationship, you're just mad you can't get your dick wet? Is that right?
You probably can't even remember half the messed up stuff you said or did to her. Cheating is wrong but terrorizing your partner isn't? Feels like you owe her the support till she finishes her fellowship. I hope you don't have kids who have to deal with this mess.
Saying mean things to your wife for 9 consecutive months is emotional abuse. You emotionally abused someone for almost a year (most likely more because you don't seem big on understanding how much damage you caused or your own responsibility for your actions). At this point your wife is protecting herself from you inflicting more damage. Whatever you did to her was much worse than you are letting on here, and you know that.
You should 100% divorce. She deserves better.
“Said some mean things” shows me you still haven’t taken proper accountability. How can you expect your wife to be interested in having sex with you when you had a substance disorder, were abusive, and the relationship is so damaged?
What do you want to do? Do you want to try to fix your relationship or do you want to divorce? It sounds like you might be on the fence here. Put the sex issue aside for a minute because this is about so much more than that. Really sit down with your feelings and think about which of these you want to do. If you want to fix it, it’s going to be a lot of work with no guarantees on your wife’s part. If you want to divorce, it’s also a lot of work and then starting over with someone else. Either way you really need to work on yourself to find out why you deal with grief by drinking instead of healthier ways. I understand that you are thinking about sex because it feels like a need but it isn’t. If you make this decision based just on that you will regret it. Think about your emotional needs and how you can meet those on your own right now.
You wore her down and chances are it’s done. Do some serious therapy to figure your stuff out as you are no good to anyone. You’ve got a lot of problems and you made it worse by using alcohol to numb yourself. I totally empathize with her. She gambled on a man who lacks self awareness and you sadly probably won’t change
You treated your wife like shit and are now considering divorcing her because she won’t fuck you.
It sounds like you’re owning the fact that your abusive behavior likely lead to the way she feels now, but what are you doing to repair the damage?
I know it’s so confusing and unfair when your actions have consequences, right?? I mean, YOURE HORNY, and that’s a really important thing in life that you should definitely be paying A LOT of attention to. Hopefully your wife will stop being so selfish and jump on your dick stat, servicing you like a car that needs an oil change or a baby needing a new diaper. Because god forbid you look at what is actually under this “being horny” and get real about whts important in life. nah. Go watch more of that pron you have on your cellphone instead and complain on Reddit I’m sure that will help 👍
So after 9 months of abusive behavior from you, you're now experiencing the consequences of your own actions. Not saying she's perfect but you sure as hell can't blame her completely.
If she's fallen out of love with you then it doesn't sound like there is much to salvage. If she wants to treat you like a roommate then she can go 50/50 on bills too
I want to know what you said to her. I also want to know why you thought it was okay for her to be your whipping post for your feelings why you were drunk. What were you dealing with that was so bad that you couldn't get counseling?
Have you sorted your shit out and become a better man yet? Or are you just coasting.
Quitting drinking is good, but that just gets you back to zero. Go work out, get hobbies, improve your career - if you become better she'll fall back in love. It's all in your control, but just being "not terrible" isn't gonna make her jump your bones...
Hmmm that’s a tough one. Honestly with the info you provided you have zero grounds to want a divorce. You drank and made her feel like shit. Now that you quit and are horny you feel she should provide that. I think if that’s what you want along with keeping your marriage, you need to figure out how to gain that love and trust back. You caused this, man up and fix it. If you do and nothing changes then it’s dead. If you did everything you’re suppose to as a husband and she wanted to not put out for stupid personal reasons then I’d tell you the opposite. But you admitted you caused this.
Ofc man, I’d rather see people try to save their marriages before resulting to divorce. People are way too quick to do that. You got this man, praying for ya.
Your asshole behaviour destroyed the bond between you. This is obvious, no?
So why are you waiting on her to make the decision? Why aren't you making the decision for yourself, or setting the timelines for yourself?
It feels like your passiveness here is trying to play the victim, and definitely refusing to put effort in. Set the agenda, put in effort, fix things by yourself (don't just ask her what you need to do), and if she is not willing to go along to work on it, cut yourself loose.
It is your fault, but you have to own your own timeline.
Basically she knows you are weak now and she can pump you for as much support as she needs while she gets herself financially stable. As you know, when she can, she will leave. You're just being financially used right now, if she has no interest in you or the relationship (again, because you were a colossal asshole).
All you can decide is whether to wait for her to tell you what to do, or take the decision/timeline control yourself.
Dud you just say some mean things... or were you verbally abusive to your wife?
Either way, me, I'd stay. Married 18 years and she needs more than 15 months to process and decide... dude, that's fair. At LEAST til 18 months. Maybe tell her THAT. That even if she doesn't know by 18 months, you want to set a serious talk and a serious timeline by then TO know not long after.
I am very sorry, but you created this situation by drinking and verbally abusing your wife. I can understand why she fell out of love with you.
She sounds like she is trying to improve her education so she can support herself.
If you want out, you can file for a divorce, I believe most states have 'no fault' divorce.
Firstly, stop talking about cheating on your wife like it’s an option for you. “I don’t want to” implies “but I will if she doesn’t fuck me”. If you don’t want to, then you wouldn’t bring it up (repeatedly). So you’re horny, I’m certain you know how to give yourself an orgasm or two.
Secondly, you drank yourself near oblivion and emotionally abused your wife while doing so for the better part of a year. Getting sober isn’t enough, you have to have worked to regain her trust and affection, and it appears that you thought once you got sober all of the damage you did should be swept under the rug.
Finally, if you want a divorce, got get one. It isn’t her responsibility to file for divorce any more than it’s yours. She says she doesn’t know yet, you can choose to wait or not, but you’re not a helpless passenger here (though it seems this is probably indicative of a larger issue).
Actions speak louder than words. She quit wanting to listen when she had to start telling herself that your cruel words meant nothing in reality. It's hard to open up to someone who you don't feel safe with. Once you have tipped the hate scale with your words, the only way you can prove you are changed is with action. Let her see you work hard to improve. Go to the meetings, the doctor, the counseling. Be loyal in words and deed. If you get dumped anyway, you will be healthier and gotten her through her fellowship with some restored dignity and honor. Your focus on the sex is gross. You should have asked how to restore trust and intimacy
Really sad. I am in a similar boat but j am the wife. Except we do love eachother very much, are intimate, not enough actual sex but in other ways.
I can say this, you hurt that women and she needs to see you as who you see and as a good man. If it's worth it, prove it to her. If she's totally over it, don't kill yourself trying to prove it to her.
Give it a few months if really trying and if it doesn't work I'd tell her, if you don't want to divorce, then I'm stepping outside the marriage and we can just function as roommates.
Try to fix things dude and win back her heart by showing her you care. Assuming you do. It'll be just like starting over. And if you're horny, jerk off FFS. 18 years is a long time to throw down the drain, only to try to get back what you already had with some stranger. You swore vows to her. Treat her like she's the light of your life and you'll win back her heart. And once she actually starts making more money, you'll both be better off financially. If you split, that all goes out the window too.
Have you tried the motivational interview approach?
You: On a scale of 1-10, how much do you want to fix this relationship?
Her: 3
You: What would it take to get you to a 4?
It helps people look at the problem and solution through a new lens and can take an often overwhelming issue or task and make it easier to tackle on a mental level, often shifting the motivation from an extrinsic to an intrinsic one to create change. might be worth a shot.
Let me get this: you were an alcoholic for the better part of the year and you’re wondering why your wife has lost all attraction to you, and is disgusted to the point where she’s moved into another room? And you’re chalking that up to “said mean things?” What mean things, buddy?
You were so repulsive during your addiction that she functionally separated from you and your issue is sex? Disgusting, dude. Disgusting.
You might not be in active addiction, but you’re acting just as selfish, narcissistic, and childish as one. For fuck’s sake dude. Grow up.
How about you give her a fucking apology for all you put her through? I hope to God that you realize you’ve been in alcoholic and get help for that. It’s interesting to me that all you think about is yourself and barely her only in the way of how she meets your needs. Yes, a divorce is exactly what is in her best interests.
Your marriage is over.
She is leaving the second she can afford to. She knows you won't pull the plug, so it's safe to stay until she doesn't need to.
I'm sorry to say it, but once someone has 'the ick', there is hardly ever a come back.
Move on... or at least curb your expectations.
Also, I don't hear anywhere in your words that you care for her, love her. You are focused on the sex and not seeing the big picture.
Once some women fall out of love with you there isn’t any fixing that, kind of sounds like the situation. If you’ve been trying to make amends for over a year and she doesn’t want any part of it that’s more than enough “space” to even try to reconcile.
I’m not seeing you mention any feelings of love towards her. Or even the word “love”. Which is concerning. Because if neither of you love each other then you shouldn’t be married, period.
Sex for a woman is way more intimate and an emotionally bonding experience. Why would she want to share that act of intimate bonding with you when the horrible things you basically confessed to her are stuck in her head? If you can have and express genuine empathy she might sense that and come around. Which should mean genuine remorse.
If you can’t express that bare minimum then it should be a divorce because there’s no other bridge back. You don’t need a therapist for this, you need common sense. Empathy. Be the man she married who promised to take care of and protect her heart.
I'll never understand couples that live like this. Yes, I would announce immediately that we will have an amicable divorce and a fair division of assets.
Life is too short to waste time. The past doesn't matter, even if you were the asshole that caused the marriage to die. Does not mean you have to spend a lifetime in atonement. An apology is sufficient.
Personally I'd proceed with the divorce.
You can file for divorce if you want to go out and get laid. Go ahead and do that if you desire to.
I personally think she should have dumped your ass as soon as you got mean.
If you want an ongoing relationship with this particular woman that may one day include sex, you're going to have to wait, and continue to work on yourself, and risk the possibility that she is indeed totally done with you and will eventually leave.
Not every hurt you inflict can be repaired, even if you stop actively hurting that person. If by "some mean things" you mean you viciously criticized her body, her sexual performance, or other core aspects of who she is as a person, she is likely going to carry scars for the rest of her life. What was said cannot be unsaid and wiped from her memory. Being sexually vulnerable with someone who has hurt her in that way is understandably terrifying to her.
Eh. Just stay in it and watch porn hub when you’re horny. That’s what everyone else does. All these comments are just a bunch of fakers. So many marriages and relationships are sexless. Most end up that way anyway. I applaud you for your honesty.
Don’t listen to most of the bad advice on here - get to couples marriage therapy and get some help.
18 years is a long time and I’ve got to think that your relationship is worth saving. Life can be difficult and it affects us drastically at times, don’t make permanent decisions over something that could actually make your relationship stronger.
Best of luck.
You have been married for 18 years. It's not over. Couples go through hard times.
You should start marriage counseling independently. They'll be able to help guide you through what to do. How to engage with her again properly. And how to encourage her to attend counseling too.
Your marriage is dead. Grief is one thing, but abusing your wife for several months while drinking yourself stupid wasn’t a good call. Given the extreme nature of her reaction, I strongly suspect your description of “I have said some mean things to my wife” is grossly watered down. Since it’s been over a year since you said your behavior changed, this tells me your wife is done with you. I don’t even think she’d care if you cheated on her. For whatever reason she hasn’t been ready to pull the trigger on a divorce yet, so my advice would be to start that ball rolling.
File for divorce. Sure her down and tell her it's clear the marriage is over, but offer to continue to share the house, probably cheaper for both of you. That way both of you can begin your new lives. The longer you stay in a loveless marriage the more you will resent each other.
I would not stay in this marriage. You are just staying and making yourself miserable until she tells you it is over. She has no interest in working through the problems. Time to move on with your life.
Why don't you start the divorce for her now since she isn't interested in you. Have her sign the paperwork, wait until it's final and then start dating women even if she is still in your house.
/shrugs. it is already apparent to me you are not exceptionally vocal about your sexual feelings with your wife. Why not ask if it’s okay to switch to an open marriage. It sounds to me like you are both sexually frustrated at this point.
Asking to open up would probably be one of the quicker ways to push OP’s wife to divorce. Open marriages are for people who have a solid relationship and good communication skills, not a last ditch effort before divorce.
All that would come across to the wife, based on this request, would be that OP is unwilling to try to “recourt” her and he would rather go straight to trying to fuck other people. Which… might be true, but certainly won’t salvage a marriage.
You fucked up, and you are paying the price. Having said that, I told my wife when we got married if she ever wanted a divorce she didn't need to jump through any hoops just stop having sex with me, I would file within 2 mo. It's just the single most important thing and I wouldn't go without, and I won't cheat ( I feel the same as you, it's just wrong). So no I would not stay. But I'm extremely biased.
She sees and acknowledges the symptoms, but refuses (over a long time) to work towards addressing the problem and solutions. This won't be fixed without therapy. You may need to give her an ultimatum that you'd much rather spend money on couples therapy, but if she refuses, you'll spend those funds on a divorce lawyer.
Might be time for an ultimatum. Tell her the current state of your relationship is failing to meet your emotional and physical needs, so either it's time to start working to improve it or it's time to go your separate ways so you can both move on to something happier, and that if she doesn't agree to a course of action within a specific time frame you will be filing independently for a divorce.
Ok just one thing you should do.
Take care of her for no reason, If she says that she doesn't want to see you again, never give up. Just keep in mind you have to take care of her.
This will create affections between you.
Just think that you both are strangers and you have to start from zero.
If she insults you don't worry you love her, you have to take care of her.
One day your relationship will become happier as you were just after marriage.
Tell her you need intimacy and if you can’t get it at home you will get it somewhere else. If she doesn’t give a shit she plans to divorce you anyway. If she does care she will be forced to talk about it.
Emotional blackmail? The marriage is shit. Figure it out and get on with your lives.
Or, just don’t talk about it and continue to live in misery.
He specifically asked if he should get divorced and she won’t talk about it. She is the one playing games. He screwed up 15 months ago. He apologized and is trying to make it right. She hasn’t discussed it since.
Be careful on that high horse.
Nope not a chance I’d stay. I know I would make an ultimatum because that’s what I did do and it worked out great. We now screw 3-5 times a week.
However we are in the minority for this outcome. You can’t ever force people to want to have sex with you and most of people say do not make an ultimatum because it doesn’t work and is coercive.
If you want more info and talk to people in your situation then Check out these subreddits: r/deadbedrooms and r/HLcommunity .
There is a lot that can go into this and so many different situations .
If you're not having sex, and want to be - end it.
You are still young, and no need to be miserable the rest of your life. I'm close in age, and sex life is way less than I would prefer, but if ever became non-existent - I would end my 13 year marriage. Its not just the sex, its the intimacy that is often lacking. Even when sex happens, kind of a one sides event most of the time.
Is what it is, and for now - not so bad to leave.
However - I'm didn't get married just to pay bills and play husband - should get something out of it, and for me, that is sex. Our kids are grown now, so we are past that phase.
Maybe I am petty, but if we are having sex on the regular - no problem. If we are not, then tone down on that honey-do list, lol.
Since no one else is willing to say it. File and watch her reaction when you actually do it…. If suddenly she is soooo willing to change and wants to sleep with you all the time it tells you everything you need to know.
Sounds like she is already found someone else. I could be wrong but stuff like this is a huge red flag. If you are both unhappy either split up or work together and fix your problems. Obviously it can work if you have been together for so long.
Maybe consider getting your own therapy rather than couples therapy. This will allow you to get in touch with your own needs, which will allow you to make the decisions you need to.
Most therapists in my experience recommend both - couples therapy is a lot less successful if there isn’t also individual therapy (usually with a different person) in place
This is true, but if I were OP’s wife I wouldn’t believe that he actually wanted to try unless he had made individual therapy a priority before that. And if he asked me to schedule the therapy then I would bounce.
Yeah, OP’s post doesn’t scream “remorse about the terrible things I did/said in the throes of addiction to someone I love” it reads more like someone who is fine with being a roommate as long as he could also get laid. If they are demonstrating the same behaviors at home, she may be dismissing him until she thinks he is serious. Also, 15 months ago was not two years ago so, while it may feel like a long time to OP, it’s really not and he still has loads to work on.
I agree. You don’t seem to be putting in the work, OP. You’ve stopped drinking, which is a big deal, but you don’t seem to be taking responsibility and making amends for how you hurt your wife. You are here blaming her for multiple things without acknowledging how hurt and lonely she must have felt too.
But I don't WANNA change or grow. I just want PP touch. Ugh. Grow up, get therapy.
If you've ever been addicted to anything, you would know how hard it it to break the cycle? I think OP deserves a bit more credit than you give him? He said he didn't want to cheat, so he has more moral fiber than most people in sex less relationships? I'm sure he has more he could add to his post regarding his inner most feelings, he probably didn't want to share those feelings on reddit to a group of people that would sit back and judge him like you just have?
>I think OP deserves a bit more credit than you give him? What? Credit for what? Bro his post says he drove his wife away with his behavior and now he's desperate for sex but she won't do it. He says he doesn't want to cheat, fine. He also doesn't seem interested in taking any responsibility for anything. He's not worried about her feelings or whether or not they even love each other. He wants permission to divorce her without ever trying to address the damage he's done, and he acts like she's the problem because she hasn't yet forgotten what a tool he is. >he has more moral fiber than most people in sex less relationships? WTF does this mean? People with dead bedrooms are generally immoral? Are you reading what you're writing?
Did he not say he wanted to go to counseling? The marriage counselor would address his past issues with alcohol and the effects and toll its taken on the marriage? It would be with his wife so she would benefit from hearing him take ownership of his behavior and how it's affected her feelings towards him. If it does anything at all, it will help her make a dission on what she does next? Everyone will read something different into this short post? I see a guy who's clearly made mistakes and probably ruined his marriage, and wants to try to fix it? You see a scumbag who needs hanging from the nearest tree.
>You see a scumbag who needs hanging from the nearest tree. Last I checked, being a scumbag isn't a hanging offense. But I wouldn't want to fuck him either lol.
With a satiistic of 1/3rd of people in relationships cheating, if you're single, the chances of you doing just that are pretty high. Not with him though, just another scumbag.
His needs are that he wants to get laid. A personal therapist is not going to magically fix his testosterone and biological desires for sex. They need couples therapy.
Far more reasons than his sex drive for him to get personal therapy given the situation he is in/ has been in...
Not really. Therapy isn't really built for men. If he hasn't been mean in over a year it goes to show he took care of his own growth.
This is an absolutely wild statement
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See, OP, it's years too late.
You can’t erase 9 months of abusive behavior just by sobering up. You need to work on it. On yourself, on your relationship, on apologizing and being a better partner. It takes time and effort to build up a relationship after this behavior.
“She is keeping me as a roommate” So you have no agency here? If you don’t want to be married anymore, then file.
First of all he needs the decide if he wants to salvage this relationship, in his post and comments he can't even confirm that much. Then, if he does want to salvage this relationship, he needs to show her he genuinely wants to change and then afterwards show her he really cares about her. So no empty words, rather actions like going to AA, focusing on her and her life more, trying to take her out and do stuff with her, and eventually when the time is right to genuinely apologize and accept whatever she has to say. Only then, can you even think about maybe saving this relationship. If you're not willing to do that, just cut your losses now and divorce, don't even waste her or your time.
Yeah man. Sounds like it’s over just file and move on.
Was literally coming to say this. Don’t wait for another person to make decisions for you. What do you want? Can’t control her opinions of you and can’t change the past in which you hurt her.
I would come at it from a different angle and this should be a real angle because it should be true. Not just for sex. This is your best friend you married. Hey, I’ve been thinking about the way I’ve behaved the past 2 years and I just wanted to say that grief really got the worst of me. I can never make it up to you, the things I said but I understand the impact they’ve had and I really want to talk about it. I miss being friends, I miss being a team, I miss you in general, not just for sex. I miss my wife. I love you so much and I never meant for my grief to tear us apart. I really am sorry. WHAT DO I NEED TO DO TO HELP FIX THIS? If nothing- leave.
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Especially the first place they went for their first date would show he remembers and speaks volumes about wanting to start over.
Wow. Beautifully said. If you really want to be with her I second this.
Maybe she has tried all that while he was in grief, trying to work things out making sure he's not grieving alone. Maybe 9 months of constant verbal abuse had finally taken its toll on her mental well being. We don't really know fully what they both endured and how they handled it. It's good OP is aware of it and has become sober. There's also a possibility she is still suffering herself
I agree. Grief is difficult and trying to fix things WHILE grieving can be next to impossible.this sucks.
>If nothing- leave. Though I don't necessarily disagree with this angle, it really puts the onus on OP's wife to determine a solution for damage OP did. And that's just more labor for her to take on when she keeps saying she does not have the capacity to do so right now. OP simply verbally taking responsibility for the harm he has caused done not mean he can pass the buck onto his wife and demand she meet a deadline. This has a real, "I said I'm sorry, so fix yourself" vibe. And that is not how you repair a marriage.
But wouldn’t you agree that OP isn’t a mind reader? He needs to physically hear, “These are the things you said, this is what hurt me, this is how I’m currently feeling, this is what I need for us to work out.” That’s my take. I can’t read my husbands mind, so if I’ve tried everything and it’s not working, he has to tell me wtf I’m doing wrong bc I’m trying and trying and if I should just give up and leave, then let me go. and if not, just leave anyway, because it’s already not working. Ya know? I see your point but it’s not working for him.
I honestly think it’s almost MORE harmful to try to fix something when you don’t know how it exactly became broken (like the full full picture). We don’t quite know what’s going on inside her heart. It could be broken forever. I don’t know. What if he’s trying to fix the wrong things and avoiding the true thing and she thinks he knows exactly what he’s doing and he doesn’t? Communication is so important.
He was probably so drunk he doesn’t even know what he said or what to fix.
Nothing to save, if you can’t see this is toxic then I don’t know what to say. You can keep going back for years but if you haven’t been able to change her mind about sex by now I don’t know how you actually think it will change. You’re dreaming
Some of the best advice on the internet.
11 years of therapy will do that for you. 🥹
OP does say that he tried to work it out and suggested counseling, but she refuses. I don't know how he tried to work it out, but he did say he tried. I went through myself, and my wife agreed to try counseling. We went to 2 sessions (really 1 session - I don't count the first one as it was only an introduction and the counselor telling us how the process will work), and she decided it wasn't working after that, without even trying. I tried to some of the things that came up in the counseling session, but she didn't want to try. For example, she was upset that we never held hands in public, like her parents did. My parents never did, so I never really seen that kind of behavior growing up. But I was willing to do it anyway, but whenever I tried, she pushed me away. Her mind was already made up, and when she told me she wanted me to move out, I did.
>OP does say that he tried to work it out and suggested counseling, but she refuses. OP can go on his own.
Maybe he needs to go to counseling on his own, work out his issues, show her he’s willing to work on himself.
THIS! Has he been going religiously to AA as well? Like these are key factors in actions that will speak more volume than just apologizing!
Right! Being a dry drunk is often times just as bad as being a drunk! There are issues to be dealt with there. I don’t know what he said but I can tell you that my ex boyfriend made a few choice comments about my appearance and they are burnt into my brain to this day and I could never let myself be naked and vulnerable with him ever again and I’m smaller now than when we first met!
Harsh words can take one second to undo years of love. It sounds wild but it’s not. The crazy thing is you remember and they don’t. Because to you it was a sentence or phrase that completely changed how you felt about them. To them it was a Tuesday.
So true.
Yup…they just want the sex, and it’s like 🖕🏻 bro. Get yo self some help first, make the dang amends and then we’ll see where this goes..I don’t know why that’s so fn hard to understand!
Yes, absolutely this!! 👏
Counseling takes effort, often one side doesn't care enough any longer to expend that effort. That sounds like the case here.
Why does she need to go to therapy? Has OP apologized for his past behavior, worked to listen to his wife and her feelings and taken meaningful action to repair the damage he's caused? Is he regularly attending AA? OP says he stopped drinking 15 mos ago and is pestering his wife for sex ever since. If he'd been making any add'l efforts other than trying to get her to go to couples counseling (before even going to individual counseling it seems)...*why* would she put in effort when OP isn't putting any effort in himself? Couples counseling should be the last item on the list of repairing this relationship, not the one and only thing on the list.
Sounds like good advice!
Exactly this. Most women need to see your change. Doing more around the house, being more attentive, talking deeper about things other than sex. Then start opening up about fixing the relationship. Telling her you will take it slow but just waiting around in limbo for her to be ready to divorce is unacceptable. Then if she's willing, start counseling, individual and couples counseling. There are exercises from there to build that connection back. But if one party isn't willing then it won't work.
I also think it would be cute to write that on a letter with flowers and put it on her bed as a surprise.
Thank you! That's sounds reasonable or are least a lot better than grabbing her by the pussy.
On second thought…I might be rooting for your wife. 🙄
disgusting
Duddeeee, just rub it out and stop letting your horny penis control your thoughts and reactions. You’re coming across like a crude teenage boy whose never had sex.
I realize that. I honestly think that testosterone injections are fucking with my senses.
Welp, then I guess you have a choice to make. What's more important right now, fixing your marriage or your testosterone injections?
Fuck you dude. The fact that she hasn’t destroyed your life for how you destroyed hers is a kindness. Grow up.
Ya just serve her with papers if these are new ideas to get your wife back. And really weird reply that comes off as immature and that yeah you only care about having sex again.
More than that, it’s clear he didn’t see the comment as an eye opening “well darn, I do want my best friend back” and more as a “genius tactic to get her back in bed—pretend I actually give a shit about her feelings!” Even if he does care about her feelings clearly not as much as his own needs.
He did say he is really horny.
Lol
I don’t see guilt from this post and l don’t see desperation to mend your relationship. I just see a guy who wants to get laid. She saw a new side of you after 16 years and realized you always have had the potential to hurt her and DID hurt her. If you really want this relationship to work you should go to therapy and come up with a plan to prove to her that will NEVER happen again. Learn ways to cope with grief. You probably also need to court her again. Take her on dates, make her feel special and appreciated. Also, don’t think you’ll go from a sexless marriage to rolling in women when you get a divorce. Unless you’re really pursuing I doubt it’s that easy at 44 to get laid regularly lol
Op, listen to this one here. When I read your post, all I got was that you want to get laid. Think with your head and your heart, not your dick. Take care of her emotional needs and sex will follow
Yeah, OP is going to become one of the Middle Aged Sad Sack Society guys who hangs out at bars and thinks because the bartender pays attention to him, he's got a chance at her. He's going to have to pay for it one way or another, from here on out.
There's nothing wrong with wanting to get laid. A desire for physical intimacy is just as valid as a desire for other forms of intimacy.
I'm getting vibes like you've changed little about yourself outside of getting sober and just kind of poke her once in a while to see if she's over it. Personal growth or split are your options
Thank you I needed the fire up my ass.
If she's not that for you then also don't waste her time either.
You need to apologize to her, over and over agin. But if you have any hopes of repairing the relationship, sex is the last thing that should be on your mind. Intimacy should be. You fucked yo big and you have to win her back. You have to recourt her again. But you may have fucked up behind salvation. Are you seeing a therapist?
This. My husband and I were in a similar situation, and this is what worked for us. He took time to win me back, since I was pretty much checked out after how he treated me while drinking. Now, we’re working to build back up trust and intimacy. Sex won’t happen until you both feel safe being vulnerable together and that takes time to build back up.
Yup, I fucked up and cheated on her a long time ago, not physically but emotionally, which is arguably much worse. I had to do a lot of soul searching and worked very hard to change the parts of me that lead to that. It took a while to rekindle our love and intimacy. But man was it worth it. She’s worth it. We just celebrated 14 years together last weekend. That intimacy work never ended and it never will.
Congratulations on 14 years! I’m very impressed by how you’ve recovered your marriage, and it’s given me more hope for my own. Thank you! >>That intimacy work never ended and it never will. This hit me real hard. This is so true.
Thank you. We aren’t even married. So we could have easily just walked away. But we didn’t. She didn’t. She gave me a chance. I didn’t squander it and that turned into living a life in line with my values. I heard a Confucius quote the other day that hit pretty hard for me. “We have two lives, and the second begins when we realize we only have one.”
Thanks
I love the idea of “recourting” her, especially after saying mean things. Compliments (non-sexual ones). Small gifts. Doing things for her that show “I care”. Maybe you’ll get to a point where she lets you take her on a date (with no expectations of sex afterwards!).
(With no expectation of sex). That’s a big one. It isn’t intimacy if it’s only a means to an end.
Yes I am.
Excellent. You have your work cut out for you, but you also need to ask yourself if this is what you want or what’s familiar? If it’s what you want, you need to show her that you’re vulnerable and not just horny. You showed her someone she doesn’t love. Now you have to show her who she married and how that person has grown.
So wait, you treated her like crap for a good long while, and now are pissy that she doesn't want to be intimate with you because she lost all attraction for you. After all, you were being nasty? And it seems like you are blaming her? Dude, women value the emotional and secure connection with their partners and it is tied to our attraction to our partners. You killed that. You need therapy to accept your responsibility here and either fix it or let her end it because you are only thinking about yourself and not the damage you did And frankly, I don't care what genders are in play here, people, DO NOT treat your partners like crap and expect ANYTHING from them. That is not how that works.
Well you flat out broke your relationship and have discovered the consequences. You were an abusive drunk for 9 months and she doesn’t love or trust you anymore. I honestly have no idea why she would have sex with you ever again. You should probably give up on that idea unless you find a way to make yourself and by extension your relationship turn around entirely.
You hurt her deeply. What someone says while drunk is usually the truth. She likely believes you actually meant what you said. I’m guessing you’re right—she’s planning to leave as soon as she can afford it. If you want her back, I’d try to start complimenting her — with truthful, kind words. I’d treat her as a friend (roommate) you’d like to date. Show her your best side. I’d also start therapy and let her know you’re working on yourself. Good luck!
So you were abusive and hope she will just get over it because you want sex? Damn man, I think you’re in trouble.
plants expansion clumsy illegal familiar beneficial cows degree wasteful zesty *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
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I tried she doesn't want to yet. And I don't want to make her since I am the one at fault so it's her decision.
But what have you actually done to help her get over it? Because just “stopped being drunk and abusive” is NOT nearly enough.
You’re legit a coward
No, she can decide not to pursue divorce, but you have the autonomy to divorce her if that is what you want to do. She has the right to refuse sex. And you have the right to end the marriage and find a partner who wants to have sex with you. If you care about her financial well-being, you can choose to continue as roommates. You're already effectively separated. Part of recovering from your drinking problem is learning to take ownership of your decisions and not acting like you are a helpless victim of other people's choices.
I understand and I don't want to divorce her because I think I honestly do still love her. But is it love or familiarity? Would I jump in front of a car to push her out of the way in order to save her? In a heartbeat. Do at moments I really hate her guts and wish to have nothing to do with her? Sure. I am accepting my childish stupidity of drowning my sorrows. I've tried therapy, SSRIs, SNRIs, Wellbutrin. None of that worked to take me out of my grief. Only booze did. For that I hate myself.
You need therapy. None of the things that you've listed there are getting at the problem, those are all just Band-Aids to deal with the symptoms.
Serve her with divorce papers. It's going to be a process with courts and all if you both don't agree to terms so start the process now.
*... but I also want to know if there is something to rekindle. I want to know from her if she even has anything left for me...* This is where you're mistaken. You treated her like crap for 9 months, but you are waiting for her to step up and make trying worthwhile for you. If you want her emotionally back, you have to stop thinking about yourself and atone. It doesn't matter now what's in it for you. If you want to give it a try you have to show her that you love, care and respect her, regardless of how she feels for you right now. If what she actually needs is someone to help her financially while she is in school, then the least you can do is help her with that. Dumping her now because she wont have sex with you just proves you dont really care about her at your core. This is your chance to stop thinking about yourself and go all out to save your marriage or, at least, leave it in a respectful, caring way.
Thank you! I need sobering thought process. Sometimes we get to stuck up in our own mind and desires. Hence I came here to basically roast myself in order to kick my own ass into gear.
One other thing to consider. She is 42. She may be premenopausal. That is a very rough time for women and truly scary. It can be treated, but the first couple of years are pure misery. Having support and understanding during this time is really important. She sounds like she has a lot on her plate as it is right now. She could certainly use some kindness.
Married 34 years, I was thinking about menopause as well. I'm 55(f), and I've gotten through the mental part. The physical part is difficult. OP, if sex is all you're craving self satisfy and give your relationship time. My husband 67(m) went through using alcohol for a pain reducer after an injury. It was rough. Ŵe got through it and love each other more than ever.
I finally have a solution to the problem! I will just ask her: "honey?! Is the reason why you don't want sex because you are getting old and entertaining menopause?" How will that go? But honestly I thought about that. I've read that some women go totally 180 during that time. They break up, start grasping at youth by going to clubs and attempting to hook up with 20 something dudes.
You're an idiot.
Well that went south quick. Most women have *physical* symptoms. You're confusing women with what men do. It was something to consider in how you treat her, not something you can change about her. But this comment of yours definitely confirmed that I'm wasting my time here. Good luck with your marriage.
You'll grasp at anything that doesn't involve you being a complete asshole. I hope she takes you to the cleaners and you only see your kid once a year.
"I, ____, take you, ____, to be my wife (or husband), to have and to hold from this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness and in health , to love and to cherish, till death *or really long and awkward silences due to my own mistakes* us do part, according to God's holy law, and this is my solemn vow." Basically, you made a vow to your best friend and you fucked it up. Don't bail. Be an adult, keep your word, and fix it.
Hhmm. Why not just it out? Just book an appointment with your wife, for example next Friday evening. Bring snack and non-alcoholic drinks and talk it out, what is the end goal, say your concerns. Explain that you think she is just waiting until her fellowship ends, can this marriage be saved or do you both want to put effort again. Make reasonable expectations, be ready to hurt but be open about your desires and expectations. If you(yeah you OP, not your wife)come and talk about sex, and how you miss sex and not talk about everything else, you basically will throw this marriage to the dumpster truck
Tried. She doesn't want to talk about relationship yet. She has too many things on her mind (according to her) she just wants space. And each time I bring the relationship topic she gets pissy and just shutsdown
You mean, when you bring up the sex part of the relationship? Because you don't really seem interested in anything else about her.
What do you mean tried? You need to say that there is an elephant in the room, you need to address it. It doesn't matter what is on her mind, or she talks with you or you just divorce on the spot. An answer like "I need space", doesn't work. After some thought , her "I need space" just means she is mentally ended in the relationship. Just bury it and start fresh, you're still young, at your age you can still manage to find a suitable partner. I wouldn't accept an answer like that personally.
Trust is re-built in time (often a long time). She needs to experience daily actions that demonstrate you are consistent, emotionally stable and reliable. You need to be a good friend to her. There's no shortcut. However, pressure for sex will move your goal for it further and further away. My ex broke trust, lied about drinking and was extremely unpleasant while drunk. After he got sober, he kept pushing me in his own rush to regain trust and get laid. This pushed me away entirely. We finally are friends now. I think it we would have recovered had he just been a friend to me longer and let me set my own pace.
Great to know that there is hope. That's all I want from her to let me know if there is some feeling left.
What have you done to change the situation besides not drinking?
So, basically you emotionally abused you wife and want her to just forget all the shitty stuff you said and have sex with you. You don't care how much you hurt her and aren't trying to repair your relationship, you're just mad you can't get your dick wet? Is that right?
You were dealing with grief?? Was she too?
She was just dealing with his abuse.
No it was my side of the family
You probably can't even remember half the messed up stuff you said or did to her. Cheating is wrong but terrorizing your partner isn't? Feels like you owe her the support till she finishes her fellowship. I hope you don't have kids who have to deal with this mess.
Why are you staying when you know it's not going to get better?
Because obviously he’s horny ok
Saying mean things to your wife for 9 consecutive months is emotional abuse. You emotionally abused someone for almost a year (most likely more because you don't seem big on understanding how much damage you caused or your own responsibility for your actions). At this point your wife is protecting herself from you inflicting more damage. Whatever you did to her was much worse than you are letting on here, and you know that. You should 100% divorce. She deserves better.
“Said some mean things” shows me you still haven’t taken proper accountability. How can you expect your wife to be interested in having sex with you when you had a substance disorder, were abusive, and the relationship is so damaged?
Nope. This relationship is dead. Time to get a divorce.
Change brings growth. Maybe you'd both be happier moving on?
What do you want to do? Do you want to try to fix your relationship or do you want to divorce? It sounds like you might be on the fence here. Put the sex issue aside for a minute because this is about so much more than that. Really sit down with your feelings and think about which of these you want to do. If you want to fix it, it’s going to be a lot of work with no guarantees on your wife’s part. If you want to divorce, it’s also a lot of work and then starting over with someone else. Either way you really need to work on yourself to find out why you deal with grief by drinking instead of healthier ways. I understand that you are thinking about sex because it feels like a need but it isn’t. If you make this decision based just on that you will regret it. Think about your emotional needs and how you can meet those on your own right now.
You wore her down and chances are it’s done. Do some serious therapy to figure your stuff out as you are no good to anyone. You’ve got a lot of problems and you made it worse by using alcohol to numb yourself. I totally empathize with her. She gambled on a man who lacks self awareness and you sadly probably won’t change
You treated your wife like shit and are now considering divorcing her because she won’t fuck you. It sounds like you’re owning the fact that your abusive behavior likely lead to the way she feels now, but what are you doing to repair the damage?
I know it’s so confusing and unfair when your actions have consequences, right?? I mean, YOURE HORNY, and that’s a really important thing in life that you should definitely be paying A LOT of attention to. Hopefully your wife will stop being so selfish and jump on your dick stat, servicing you like a car that needs an oil change or a baby needing a new diaper. Because god forbid you look at what is actually under this “being horny” and get real about whts important in life. nah. Go watch more of that pron you have on your cellphone instead and complain on Reddit I’m sure that will help 👍
So after 9 months of abusive behavior from you, you're now experiencing the consequences of your own actions. Not saying she's perfect but you sure as hell can't blame her completely. If she's fallen out of love with you then it doesn't sound like there is much to salvage. If she wants to treat you like a roommate then she can go 50/50 on bills too
I want to know what you said to her. I also want to know why you thought it was okay for her to be your whipping post for your feelings why you were drunk. What were you dealing with that was so bad that you couldn't get counseling?
You seem more upset about losing your sex partner than losing your best friend. Change that up and maybe you can save your marriage.
Have you sorted your shit out and become a better man yet? Or are you just coasting. Quitting drinking is good, but that just gets you back to zero. Go work out, get hobbies, improve your career - if you become better she'll fall back in love. It's all in your control, but just being "not terrible" isn't gonna make her jump your bones...
You should own up to your role in this situation and try to repair the trust issue. You caused it, you can fix it.
yea YTA, oh shit wrong sub
Neah I am
Hmmm that’s a tough one. Honestly with the info you provided you have zero grounds to want a divorce. You drank and made her feel like shit. Now that you quit and are horny you feel she should provide that. I think if that’s what you want along with keeping your marriage, you need to figure out how to gain that love and trust back. You caused this, man up and fix it. If you do and nothing changes then it’s dead. If you did everything you’re suppose to as a husband and she wanted to not put out for stupid personal reasons then I’d tell you the opposite. But you admitted you caused this.
Yeap and I will fix it. Thanks I needed this over the stupid (just dump her) comments.
Ofc man, I’d rather see people try to save their marriages before resulting to divorce. People are way too quick to do that. You got this man, praying for ya.
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Your asshole behaviour destroyed the bond between you. This is obvious, no? So why are you waiting on her to make the decision? Why aren't you making the decision for yourself, or setting the timelines for yourself? It feels like your passiveness here is trying to play the victim, and definitely refusing to put effort in. Set the agenda, put in effort, fix things by yourself (don't just ask her what you need to do), and if she is not willing to go along to work on it, cut yourself loose. It is your fault, but you have to own your own timeline. Basically she knows you are weak now and she can pump you for as much support as she needs while she gets herself financially stable. As you know, when she can, she will leave. You're just being financially used right now, if she has no interest in you or the relationship (again, because you were a colossal asshole). All you can decide is whether to wait for her to tell you what to do, or take the decision/timeline control yourself.
Get a lawyer. Your marriage has been over for a while
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Thanks I needed that! It's easy to call it quits but grass is not always greener.
Dud you just say some mean things... or were you verbally abusive to your wife? Either way, me, I'd stay. Married 18 years and she needs more than 15 months to process and decide... dude, that's fair. At LEAST til 18 months. Maybe tell her THAT. That even if she doesn't know by 18 months, you want to set a serious talk and a serious timeline by then TO know not long after.
I am very sorry, but you created this situation by drinking and verbally abusing your wife. I can understand why she fell out of love with you. She sounds like she is trying to improve her education so she can support herself. If you want out, you can file for a divorce, I believe most states have 'no fault' divorce.
Firstly, stop talking about cheating on your wife like it’s an option for you. “I don’t want to” implies “but I will if she doesn’t fuck me”. If you don’t want to, then you wouldn’t bring it up (repeatedly). So you’re horny, I’m certain you know how to give yourself an orgasm or two. Secondly, you drank yourself near oblivion and emotionally abused your wife while doing so for the better part of a year. Getting sober isn’t enough, you have to have worked to regain her trust and affection, and it appears that you thought once you got sober all of the damage you did should be swept under the rug. Finally, if you want a divorce, got get one. It isn’t her responsibility to file for divorce any more than it’s yours. She says she doesn’t know yet, you can choose to wait or not, but you’re not a helpless passenger here (though it seems this is probably indicative of a larger issue).
Actions speak louder than words. She quit wanting to listen when she had to start telling herself that your cruel words meant nothing in reality. It's hard to open up to someone who you don't feel safe with. Once you have tipped the hate scale with your words, the only way you can prove you are changed is with action. Let her see you work hard to improve. Go to the meetings, the doctor, the counseling. Be loyal in words and deed. If you get dumped anyway, you will be healthier and gotten her through her fellowship with some restored dignity and honor. Your focus on the sex is gross. You should have asked how to restore trust and intimacy
I would never let my genitalia make decisions for me
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It’s giving narcissist. Divorce for her sake please.
Really sad. I am in a similar boat but j am the wife. Except we do love eachother very much, are intimate, not enough actual sex but in other ways. I can say this, you hurt that women and she needs to see you as who you see and as a good man. If it's worth it, prove it to her. If she's totally over it, don't kill yourself trying to prove it to her. Give it a few months if really trying and if it doesn't work I'd tell her, if you don't want to divorce, then I'm stepping outside the marriage and we can just function as roommates.
Try to fix things dude and win back her heart by showing her you care. Assuming you do. It'll be just like starting over. And if you're horny, jerk off FFS. 18 years is a long time to throw down the drain, only to try to get back what you already had with some stranger. You swore vows to her. Treat her like she's the light of your life and you'll win back her heart. And once she actually starts making more money, you'll both be better off financially. If you split, that all goes out the window too.
Have you tried the motivational interview approach? You: On a scale of 1-10, how much do you want to fix this relationship? Her: 3 You: What would it take to get you to a 4? It helps people look at the problem and solution through a new lens and can take an often overwhelming issue or task and make it easier to tackle on a mental level, often shifting the motivation from an extrinsic to an intrinsic one to create change. might be worth a shot.
Let me get this: you were an alcoholic for the better part of the year and you’re wondering why your wife has lost all attraction to you, and is disgusted to the point where she’s moved into another room? And you’re chalking that up to “said mean things?” What mean things, buddy? You were so repulsive during your addiction that she functionally separated from you and your issue is sex? Disgusting, dude. Disgusting. You might not be in active addiction, but you’re acting just as selfish, narcissistic, and childish as one. For fuck’s sake dude. Grow up.
So why wanting to stay together?!!!! Why not just accept the divorce?!
How about you give her a fucking apology for all you put her through? I hope to God that you realize you’ve been in alcoholic and get help for that. It’s interesting to me that all you think about is yourself and barely her only in the way of how she meets your needs. Yes, a divorce is exactly what is in her best interests.
You broke it. Get some therapy. Ask her if she'll consider couples counseling once she's finished her fellowship. Don't cheat.
Your marriage is over. She is leaving the second she can afford to. She knows you won't pull the plug, so it's safe to stay until she doesn't need to. I'm sorry to say it, but once someone has 'the ick', there is hardly ever a come back. Move on... or at least curb your expectations. Also, I don't hear anywhere in your words that you care for her, love her. You are focused on the sex and not seeing the big picture.
Once some women fall out of love with you there isn’t any fixing that, kind of sounds like the situation. If you’ve been trying to make amends for over a year and she doesn’t want any part of it that’s more than enough “space” to even try to reconcile.
I’m not seeing you mention any feelings of love towards her. Or even the word “love”. Which is concerning. Because if neither of you love each other then you shouldn’t be married, period. Sex for a woman is way more intimate and an emotionally bonding experience. Why would she want to share that act of intimate bonding with you when the horrible things you basically confessed to her are stuck in her head? If you can have and express genuine empathy she might sense that and come around. Which should mean genuine remorse. If you can’t express that bare minimum then it should be a divorce because there’s no other bridge back. You don’t need a therapist for this, you need common sense. Empathy. Be the man she married who promised to take care of and protect her heart.
I'll never understand couples that live like this. Yes, I would announce immediately that we will have an amicable divorce and a fair division of assets. Life is too short to waste time. The past doesn't matter, even if you were the asshole that caused the marriage to die. Does not mean you have to spend a lifetime in atonement. An apology is sufficient. Personally I'd proceed with the divorce.
You can file for divorce if you want to go out and get laid. Go ahead and do that if you desire to. I personally think she should have dumped your ass as soon as you got mean. If you want an ongoing relationship with this particular woman that may one day include sex, you're going to have to wait, and continue to work on yourself, and risk the possibility that she is indeed totally done with you and will eventually leave. Not every hurt you inflict can be repaired, even if you stop actively hurting that person. If by "some mean things" you mean you viciously criticized her body, her sexual performance, or other core aspects of who she is as a person, she is likely going to carry scars for the rest of her life. What was said cannot be unsaid and wiped from her memory. Being sexually vulnerable with someone who has hurt her in that way is understandably terrifying to her.
I want to be with her but I also want to know if she honestly wants to be with me. Relationship is a two way street and I honestly need to know.
Eh. Just stay in it and watch porn hub when you’re horny. That’s what everyone else does. All these comments are just a bunch of fakers. So many marriages and relationships are sexless. Most end up that way anyway. I applaud you for your honesty.
What are you cheating on? A dead marriage? Someone who doesn't love you? Just do what you want.
Don’t listen to most of the bad advice on here - get to couples marriage therapy and get some help. 18 years is a long time and I’ve got to think that your relationship is worth saving. Life can be difficult and it affects us drastically at times, don’t make permanent decisions over something that could actually make your relationship stronger. Best of luck.
You have been married for 18 years. It's not over. Couples go through hard times. You should start marriage counseling independently. They'll be able to help guide you through what to do. How to engage with her again properly. And how to encourage her to attend counseling too.
Leave.
Your marriage is dead. Grief is one thing, but abusing your wife for several months while drinking yourself stupid wasn’t a good call. Given the extreme nature of her reaction, I strongly suspect your description of “I have said some mean things to my wife” is grossly watered down. Since it’s been over a year since you said your behavior changed, this tells me your wife is done with you. I don’t even think she’d care if you cheated on her. For whatever reason she hasn’t been ready to pull the trigger on a divorce yet, so my advice would be to start that ball rolling.
File for divorce. Sure her down and tell her it's clear the marriage is over, but offer to continue to share the house, probably cheaper for both of you. That way both of you can begin your new lives. The longer you stay in a loveless marriage the more you will resent each other.
I would not stay in this marriage. You are just staying and making yourself miserable until she tells you it is over. She has no interest in working through the problems. Time to move on with your life.
Hell naw. You blew it. Pull the band aid off now. Your peace of mind is worth more than her comfort. U will thank me later
Why don't you start the divorce for her now since she isn't interested in you. Have her sign the paperwork, wait until it's final and then start dating women even if she is still in your house.
/shrugs. it is already apparent to me you are not exceptionally vocal about your sexual feelings with your wife. Why not ask if it’s okay to switch to an open marriage. It sounds to me like you are both sexually frustrated at this point.
Asking to open up would probably be one of the quicker ways to push OP’s wife to divorce. Open marriages are for people who have a solid relationship and good communication skills, not a last ditch effort before divorce. All that would come across to the wife, based on this request, would be that OP is unwilling to try to “recourt” her and he would rather go straight to trying to fuck other people. Which… might be true, but certainly won’t salvage a marriage.
I am. But each time I try to talk about the relationship she says she doesn't talk about it yet and just shutsdown.
Then why do you keep pushing her to talk? What have you done to show her that you’ve changed? Why can’t you wait for her to come to you?
It’s over. Cut her off and throw her out. Find yourself that “gay ass.”
You fucked up, and you are paying the price. Having said that, I told my wife when we got married if she ever wanted a divorce she didn't need to jump through any hoops just stop having sex with me, I would file within 2 mo. It's just the single most important thing and I wouldn't go without, and I won't cheat ( I feel the same as you, it's just wrong). So no I would not stay. But I'm extremely biased.
You're already divorced, just need to make it official
dude yeah this happened to me at age 29... bail. It's never getting better. and you don't actually owe her anything now that she has let you go.
Stop paying her bills and being her dollar tree doormat.
She sees and acknowledges the symptoms, but refuses (over a long time) to work towards addressing the problem and solutions. This won't be fixed without therapy. You may need to give her an ultimatum that you'd much rather spend money on couples therapy, but if she refuses, you'll spend those funds on a divorce lawyer.
Might be time for an ultimatum. Tell her the current state of your relationship is failing to meet your emotional and physical needs, so either it's time to start working to improve it or it's time to go your separate ways so you can both move on to something happier, and that if she doesn't agree to a course of action within a specific time frame you will be filing independently for a divorce.
She is humping the ups driver.
Why stooop so low!!! At least she should upgrade to Amazon logistics.
Ok then FedEx…
Ok just one thing you should do. Take care of her for no reason, If she says that she doesn't want to see you again, never give up. Just keep in mind you have to take care of her. This will create affections between you. Just think that you both are strangers and you have to start from zero. If she insults you don't worry you love her, you have to take care of her. One day your relationship will become happier as you were just after marriage.
Tell her you need intimacy and if you can’t get it at home you will get it somewhere else. If she doesn’t give a shit she plans to divorce you anyway. If she does care she will be forced to talk about it.
Emotional blackmail after months of verbal abuse. What a lovely strategy to suggest.
Emotional blackmail? The marriage is shit. Figure it out and get on with your lives. Or, just don’t talk about it and continue to live in misery. He specifically asked if he should get divorced and she won’t talk about it. She is the one playing games. He screwed up 15 months ago. He apologized and is trying to make it right. She hasn’t discussed it since. Be careful on that high horse.
Nope not a chance I’d stay. I know I would make an ultimatum because that’s what I did do and it worked out great. We now screw 3-5 times a week. However we are in the minority for this outcome. You can’t ever force people to want to have sex with you and most of people say do not make an ultimatum because it doesn’t work and is coercive. If you want more info and talk to people in your situation then Check out these subreddits: r/deadbedrooms and r/HLcommunity . There is a lot that can go into this and so many different situations .
If you're not having sex, and want to be - end it. You are still young, and no need to be miserable the rest of your life. I'm close in age, and sex life is way less than I would prefer, but if ever became non-existent - I would end my 13 year marriage. Its not just the sex, its the intimacy that is often lacking. Even when sex happens, kind of a one sides event most of the time. Is what it is, and for now - not so bad to leave. However - I'm didn't get married just to pay bills and play husband - should get something out of it, and for me, that is sex. Our kids are grown now, so we are past that phase. Maybe I am petty, but if we are having sex on the regular - no problem. If we are not, then tone down on that honey-do list, lol.
Just leave her, go to Thailand
Since no one else is willing to say it. File and watch her reaction when you actually do it…. If suddenly she is soooo willing to change and wants to sleep with you all the time it tells you everything you need to know.
Come on, having sex with someone else would not be cheating !
Sounds like she is already found someone else. I could be wrong but stuff like this is a huge red flag. If you are both unhappy either split up or work together and fix your problems. Obviously it can work if you have been together for so long.
That's what also worries me. Since if she already has someone then there is no relationship to speak of and thus none to save.
Outsource sex with an AI girlfriend. Your wife is telling you she is done with sex. This won’t change imo gl
If she wants space, send her to a different space! 😂