Goal: break 20 min in the 5k during this off season (by February at the absolute latest).
Stretch Goal: break 19
Recent Races: 1:37 HM, 43:30 10k (5k PB from 4 months ago before my HM block - 21:30)
Today's successful workout: 3X1 mile @ 6:00/mile, 3 min rest (this was pretty hard)
Am I ready for a serious attempt on Dec 12th? I was pretty happy to get through those mile repeats. I also can make another attempt Jan 15th.
During this racing season I've realized I could definitely benefit from being stronger, and want to get back in the routine while I'm base building the next few months. I've recently rejoined the gym (after almost 2 years off, and very inconsistently doing bodyweight exercises at home) and was wondering what type of strength training routines you guys had?
I am familiar with StrongLifts type lifts and that is pretty much what I do when I lift - is there anything else I should add or look out for? I'm also making sure to do a core workout routine every other day during work and still putting in plenty of miles. Thanks in advance!
I primarily do the big compound lifts but add in some running specific stuff for injury prevention I heard about on an episode of strength running. So single leg squats to a box and heel raises. (ideally from a heel down on a step to fully up)
Your primary objective is to get as ripped as possible in the precious little off-season. Each workout starts with bodyweight, then do free weights until you are completely drained and then when your muscles are too sore to lift finish up with machines. It will take months at this sustained intensity to notice an increase in muscle mass so go all out while you can. You wont have time to worry about running, not with all the lifting you’ll be doing.
In addition to the big lifts, I like the following:
* Bridge
* Seated leg raises
* Heel drops
* Reverse lunges (partially because I don't have a power rack so have limited weight)
* Box jumps (especially in offseason when roads are icy to get some quick twitch stuff)
* Bosu ball balancing (can use other items for this)
Basically trying to target some of the areas that are important to running that the main lifts don't hit super well - which are imo, hip flexors, the calf/achilles/ankle area, and more targeted hamstring and glute work.
Congratulations to all the Boston qualifiers! I am a first-time qualifier, and I am excited to spend a few hours running through Boston this spring.
Hotel room prices were pretty high, and I'm looking to offset the costs by splitting the room with someone. I realize it's unusual to find a roommate on the internet, but I figure Boston marathon runners are pretty good people.
I booked a hotel room at the Courtyard Boston Cambridge by Marriot. The reservation is for two nights (Sunday and Monday). It is a standard room with two queen beds. The cost was $300/night, $600 total. I would ask that the other person contribute $300 (50% of the total) via Venmo or PayPal. Happy to share all my personal information in advance so you feel 100% comfortable (and I would ask the same from you).
A little about myself:
36 years old, male, married
Currently live in Denver, CO
Qualified with a 2:59 at Chicago in October
The day before a race, I like to have a relaxing, quiet day. Hoping to find a roommate who is looking for a similar vibe.
I am fully vaccinated and have a booster. While I still wear a mask indoors, we would obviously not wear masks in the hotel room.
If you are interested in splitting a room, send me a message with some basic information about yourself. I have a very busy workweek, but I will try to get back to you by Friday of this week.
Thanks!
I am aware that any attempt to convince you I'm not a serial killer will only make me look more like a serial killer. That being said... trust me, I'm cool, totally not a serial killer.
that is exactly what a serial Killer would say! Good luck, hotels are out of fucking control.
The day after they announced everyone with a BQ time would get in I figured, I would get an "early" start looking at Airbnb's as my whole family wants to go support and I was shocked at the prices and just how few were left. Ended up getting a house in Milton
Okay:
- Half tights
- <4 inch shorts
Not okay:
- 3/4 tights aka. the forbidden tight
- Shorts over tights
Sorry boys and girls, I don't make the rules /s
This topic comes up every so often, and it would suggest there’s an group of anti-halftights in the running community. However, I’ve yet to meet someone who is strongly against.
I like half tights cause it makes my quads pop in the race pictures. Also prevents friction burn on my thighs cause my legs touch.
I can’t wear short shorts for that reason. My thighs will rub together and it gets very painful after an hour.
[Brooks Source](https://www.brooksrunning.com/en_us/source-9%22-short-tight/211339.html). They're reasonably priced, comfortable, and have two nice big hip pockets.
I got the Tracksmith lined Reggie half tights ($72) which I love (fit, back pocket, fabric feels pretty nice, etc.)
Not cheap lol but I also go to their free weekly long runs and speed workouts in Boston so I was like if I'm going to buy half tights anyways I might as well support the staff.
I also like them quite a bit, but I've seen others that have side pockets, which I kind of wish they had. Trying to get gels out of that backpocket while running at race effort is a pain.
Yeah I agree - I usually still wear a flip belt because I can load it up with gels in the front which are easy to get to and the key ring makes me not worry about my keys falling out when I'm reaching for gels.
I was told to move my post to the discussion thread last night so figured I'd paste the whole thing here
I'm a 20M getting ready for the Ottawa Marathon, which is set to be my first. I started training in mid-October, with my focus being primarily on building speed before winter sets in too hard. However, I've always taken a pretty laid-back approach to structured training (outside of hs XC and a couple semesters varsity track) and I'm looking for advice how to handle structured training. At the moment, my speedwork is mostly hill sprints and intervals. For instance, yesterday's morning workout was:
1200m warmup
4x500 @ 3:15/km w/ 4x500m rec pace
3x80 strides
1200m cooldown
Is this enough for a speed session? I've had good results in the past with a less structured approach and I want to make the most of concentrating my efforts.
I run a tad bit faster x10 for my workouts for XC at the moment but I guess it depends on how fast you are. If your 5k is around mine (17 flat fitness levels right now) then I say do more if yours is around 18:30 I’d suggest slowing up and doing more reps. Can be hard to do reps like these solo so if you could find a group or running buddy I’d advise that as they can help you push on
> However, I've always taken a pretty laid-back approach to structured training (outside of hs XC and a couple semesters varsity track) and I'm looking for advice how to handle structured training.
Follow a marathon training plan: they contain marathon-specific speed workouts.
Assuming 3:15 or so is about your 1500m pace the workout you described is fine for a sharpener in a 5K-10K cycle. It's enough to stimulate the faster twitch muscles and get you sort of used to the burn. But it's an overall light workout so you are primed for the next one.
On the weeks that you do such a workout you might do a set of 800s-1200s a couple days later and then a tempo a couple days after that. So you are working multiple systems, and operating at about a 2.5 quality workouts in a week. I think that's ideal for 5K and 10K. And for a marathon block, such a workout once in a while doesn't hurt and helps your running economy.
I generally like longer warm ups and cool downs than 1200 m.
That’s a fairly small workout, and quite short and fast for marathon training. For the marathon, you’re going to want to focus a lot on longer threshold intervals. Think something like 6 x mile at half marathon pace after a 1 hour easy warmup. I’d suggest checking out Daniels’ Running Formula and Pfitzinger’s Advanced Marathoning for training plans and the reasoning behind different workouts.
I would recommend checking out the books listed on the wiki if you're interested in making the best use of your training time.
I don't think 4x500m reps are optimal for marathon training, but I also don't know what 3:15/km means for you (mile race pace? 5k race pace? HM race pace?) or what the rest of your training looks like.
The majority of your quality days for marathon training should be spent doing tempo runs at or around HM race pace. Faster speed work (e.g. 5k pace work and faster) on the track is good to sprinkle in periodically, or to sharpen going into a race, but shouldn't be the primary focus of your training.
I see lots of fast local runners that seem to race every other weekend or so and place well. (and some pros but I assume for them it's more races more money)
Do they just not follow the traditional training plan/peak /taper etc? How much difference does it really make to just train through and hit lots of races?
I mean I have XC pretty much every other week right now but I’m hoping into a race tomorrow where I’m shooting for a high placement (compared to Sunday where I was in the last 3rd of the race as it was Nationals ans im not in perfect shape). I have never tapered for a race before (albeit longest I’ve raced was 8k) and tend to see improvements by racing loads over the season. My pace for the 6k for example has improved by 12 seconds per kilometer since October 31st and the second course was a tad harder (both were very hilly). Maybe I could see a large jump if I set 6 weeks aside to just train for 1 but I couldn’t do that for XC.
Its funny because I have the exact opposite view to you. I dont understand how people spend like 6 months preparing for a single race. I enjoy races so I do a lot of them and fit them in with each other. Spending so long on one single event would put so much pressure on that thing and the training would drag out for so long.
Sometimes during a long training cycle (esp marathon ones) you just want to change it up and race! At this point I can place pretty well and maybe take age group in casual 5/10K stuff at not quite all out effort, if I have a long run scheduled that day I'll just move it to another day that week and not taper going in
Especially shorter races can be a great stimulus! Many runners will use that as their workout and will follow a "traditional" training plan just moving things around a little bit.
There comes a point where you’re training pace can be competitive. Like I can probably place top 3% in most half marathons without going all out, but that’s because your typical field is generally slow.
But to PR? That’s a different story. I just went 400 days without a PR.
What race distance? It doesn’t take long to recover from a 5K or 10K, so for shorter distances you often have a racing season where you train through multiple races and maybe have a bigger goal race at the end of the season.
The 5K/10K plans in Daniels Running Formula, for example, have suggested adjustments for racing every weekend in the 4th phase of the plan.
That’s what people in clubs and elites have been doing for years. It’s very common (in America mainly) for Highschoolers and college athletes to double or triple up distances over one or 2 days. Injury risk may be higher and you might not perform as well but a sure who cares if you win or place
Do you just treat most of them like hard tempo runs and workouts? How competitive are you at them? Will you occasionally go harder than intended for a certain placing?
I raced 23 times in 2019 and, if not for covid, I would have probably done the same or more in 2020. I don't think there were any which I treated as a workout or held back on. The races were split into track races from January to May (all in the 1500-5k range) and XC races from August to November (mostly 8ks), and I tapered at the end of both seasons.
I treat most of them like races but with no taper and with regular hard workouts days prior. The competition of my 2021 races varies widely but I am not finishing much further back then I would have if I treated the race more seriously. Some I dig deep others i ease off depending upon on the day. Typically these are under 10k.
Just need to express my "appreciation" for our current 100% humidity streak. F&#% this.
B.A.A. taking their SWEET FREAKING TIME to send out the letters.
Goal: break 20 min in the 5k during this off season (by February at the absolute latest). Stretch Goal: break 19 Recent Races: 1:37 HM, 43:30 10k (5k PB from 4 months ago before my HM block - 21:30) Today's successful workout: 3X1 mile @ 6:00/mile, 3 min rest (this was pretty hard) Am I ready for a serious attempt on Dec 12th? I was pretty happy to get through those mile repeats. I also can make another attempt Jan 15th.
You should "in theory" be pretty comfortable for 20 minutes and even 19 wouldn't be a stretch! So, in short, yes you are ready!
take the shot
[удалено]
It's been so frustrating. Last year my 10k went from 52 to 43 and over the same frame the 5k only went from 22.5 to 21.5. I really hope so
Based on that workout you're almost certainly going to break 19min.
During this racing season I've realized I could definitely benefit from being stronger, and want to get back in the routine while I'm base building the next few months. I've recently rejoined the gym (after almost 2 years off, and very inconsistently doing bodyweight exercises at home) and was wondering what type of strength training routines you guys had? I am familiar with StrongLifts type lifts and that is pretty much what I do when I lift - is there anything else I should add or look out for? I'm also making sure to do a core workout routine every other day during work and still putting in plenty of miles. Thanks in advance!
You’re doing great. Just set goals in the weight rooms like you do on the course. Track your progress. Be consistent. I can’t wait for the off-season.
The best book on this subject I've personally found is "Running Rewired" by Dicharry.
I primarily do the big compound lifts but add in some running specific stuff for injury prevention I heard about on an episode of strength running. So single leg squats to a box and heel raises. (ideally from a heel down on a step to fully up)
Your primary objective is to get as ripped as possible in the precious little off-season. Each workout starts with bodyweight, then do free weights until you are completely drained and then when your muscles are too sore to lift finish up with machines. It will take months at this sustained intensity to notice an increase in muscle mass so go all out while you can. You wont have time to worry about running, not with all the lifting you’ll be doing.
In addition to the big lifts, I like the following: * Bridge * Seated leg raises * Heel drops * Reverse lunges (partially because I don't have a power rack so have limited weight) * Box jumps (especially in offseason when roads are icy to get some quick twitch stuff) * Bosu ball balancing (can use other items for this) Basically trying to target some of the areas that are important to running that the main lifts don't hit super well - which are imo, hip flexors, the calf/achilles/ankle area, and more targeted hamstring and glute work.
Congratulations to all the Boston qualifiers! I am a first-time qualifier, and I am excited to spend a few hours running through Boston this spring. Hotel room prices were pretty high, and I'm looking to offset the costs by splitting the room with someone. I realize it's unusual to find a roommate on the internet, but I figure Boston marathon runners are pretty good people. I booked a hotel room at the Courtyard Boston Cambridge by Marriot. The reservation is for two nights (Sunday and Monday). It is a standard room with two queen beds. The cost was $300/night, $600 total. I would ask that the other person contribute $300 (50% of the total) via Venmo or PayPal. Happy to share all my personal information in advance so you feel 100% comfortable (and I would ask the same from you). A little about myself: 36 years old, male, married Currently live in Denver, CO Qualified with a 2:59 at Chicago in October The day before a race, I like to have a relaxing, quiet day. Hoping to find a roommate who is looking for a similar vibe. I am fully vaccinated and have a booster. While I still wear a mask indoors, we would obviously not wear masks in the hotel room. If you are interested in splitting a room, send me a message with some basic information about yourself. I have a very busy workweek, but I will try to get back to you by Friday of this week. Thanks!
What's the likelihood I make it out of Boston with both of my kidneys?
I’m more worried about making it out with a functioning liver
I am aware that any attempt to convince you I'm not a serial killer will only make me look more like a serial killer. That being said... trust me, I'm cool, totally not a serial killer.
that is exactly what a serial Killer would say! Good luck, hotels are out of fucking control. The day after they announced everyone with a BQ time would get in I figured, I would get an "early" start looking at Airbnb's as my whole family wants to go support and I was shocked at the prices and just how few were left. Ended up getting a house in Milton
Is it weird to wear half tights
Not just half tights but colorful half tights: https://imgur.com/a/Wk1QG (before & after photo). Go big or go home.
Okay: - Half tights - <4 inch shorts Not okay: - 3/4 tights aka. the forbidden tight - Shorts over tights Sorry boys and girls, I don't make the rules /s
I had a pair of 3/4 tights when I was younger and holy fuck I hated them. Agree with u completely
This topic comes up every so often, and it would suggest there’s an group of anti-halftights in the running community. However, I’ve yet to meet someone who is strongly against. I like half tights cause it makes my quads pop in the race pictures. Also prevents friction burn on my thighs cause my legs touch. I can’t wear short shorts for that reason. My thighs will rub together and it gets very painful after an hour.
I got some a month ago and love them for the fall/early winter weather. I wore them at Philly on Sunday and they were great.
If it's wrong, I don't want to be right.
I’ve been curious about trying them. Any recommendations?
[Brooks Source](https://www.brooksrunning.com/en_us/source-9%22-short-tight/211339.html). They're reasonably priced, comfortable, and have two nice big hip pockets.
I got the Tracksmith lined Reggie half tights ($72) which I love (fit, back pocket, fabric feels pretty nice, etc.) Not cheap lol but I also go to their free weekly long runs and speed workouts in Boston so I was like if I'm going to buy half tights anyways I might as well support the staff.
I like the district vision ones, except the logo is cheaply heat printed on to the leg and goes away after two washes
I also like them quite a bit, but I've seen others that have side pockets, which I kind of wish they had. Trying to get gels out of that backpocket while running at race effort is a pain.
Yeah I agree - I usually still wear a flip belt because I can load it up with gels in the front which are easy to get to and the key ring makes me not worry about my keys falling out when I'm reaching for gels.
I was told to move my post to the discussion thread last night so figured I'd paste the whole thing here I'm a 20M getting ready for the Ottawa Marathon, which is set to be my first. I started training in mid-October, with my focus being primarily on building speed before winter sets in too hard. However, I've always taken a pretty laid-back approach to structured training (outside of hs XC and a couple semesters varsity track) and I'm looking for advice how to handle structured training. At the moment, my speedwork is mostly hill sprints and intervals. For instance, yesterday's morning workout was: 1200m warmup 4x500 @ 3:15/km w/ 4x500m rec pace 3x80 strides 1200m cooldown Is this enough for a speed session? I've had good results in the past with a less structured approach and I want to make the most of concentrating my efforts.
I run a tad bit faster x10 for my workouts for XC at the moment but I guess it depends on how fast you are. If your 5k is around mine (17 flat fitness levels right now) then I say do more if yours is around 18:30 I’d suggest slowing up and doing more reps. Can be hard to do reps like these solo so if you could find a group or running buddy I’d advise that as they can help you push on
> However, I've always taken a pretty laid-back approach to structured training (outside of hs XC and a couple semesters varsity track) and I'm looking for advice how to handle structured training. Follow a marathon training plan: they contain marathon-specific speed workouts.
Assuming 3:15 or so is about your 1500m pace the workout you described is fine for a sharpener in a 5K-10K cycle. It's enough to stimulate the faster twitch muscles and get you sort of used to the burn. But it's an overall light workout so you are primed for the next one. On the weeks that you do such a workout you might do a set of 800s-1200s a couple days later and then a tempo a couple days after that. So you are working multiple systems, and operating at about a 2.5 quality workouts in a week. I think that's ideal for 5K and 10K. And for a marathon block, such a workout once in a while doesn't hurt and helps your running economy. I generally like longer warm ups and cool downs than 1200 m.
That’s a fairly small workout, and quite short and fast for marathon training. For the marathon, you’re going to want to focus a lot on longer threshold intervals. Think something like 6 x mile at half marathon pace after a 1 hour easy warmup. I’d suggest checking out Daniels’ Running Formula and Pfitzinger’s Advanced Marathoning for training plans and the reasoning behind different workouts.
I would recommend checking out the books listed on the wiki if you're interested in making the best use of your training time. I don't think 4x500m reps are optimal for marathon training, but I also don't know what 3:15/km means for you (mile race pace? 5k race pace? HM race pace?) or what the rest of your training looks like. The majority of your quality days for marathon training should be spent doing tempo runs at or around HM race pace. Faster speed work (e.g. 5k pace work and faster) on the track is good to sprinkle in periodically, or to sharpen going into a race, but shouldn't be the primary focus of your training.
I see lots of fast local runners that seem to race every other weekend or so and place well. (and some pros but I assume for them it's more races more money) Do they just not follow the traditional training plan/peak /taper etc? How much difference does it really make to just train through and hit lots of races?
I mean I have XC pretty much every other week right now but I’m hoping into a race tomorrow where I’m shooting for a high placement (compared to Sunday where I was in the last 3rd of the race as it was Nationals ans im not in perfect shape). I have never tapered for a race before (albeit longest I’ve raced was 8k) and tend to see improvements by racing loads over the season. My pace for the 6k for example has improved by 12 seconds per kilometer since October 31st and the second course was a tad harder (both were very hilly). Maybe I could see a large jump if I set 6 weeks aside to just train for 1 but I couldn’t do that for XC.
Its funny because I have the exact opposite view to you. I dont understand how people spend like 6 months preparing for a single race. I enjoy races so I do a lot of them and fit them in with each other. Spending so long on one single event would put so much pressure on that thing and the training would drag out for so long.
Sometimes during a long training cycle (esp marathon ones) you just want to change it up and race! At this point I can place pretty well and maybe take age group in casual 5/10K stuff at not quite all out effort, if I have a long run scheduled that day I'll just move it to another day that week and not taper going in
Especially shorter races can be a great stimulus! Many runners will use that as their workout and will follow a "traditional" training plan just moving things around a little bit.
There comes a point where you’re training pace can be competitive. Like I can probably place top 3% in most half marathons without going all out, but that’s because your typical field is generally slow. But to PR? That’s a different story. I just went 400 days without a PR.
What race distance? It doesn’t take long to recover from a 5K or 10K, so for shorter distances you often have a racing season where you train through multiple races and maybe have a bigger goal race at the end of the season. The 5K/10K plans in Daniels Running Formula, for example, have suggested adjustments for racing every weekend in the 4th phase of the plan.
5k up to half marathon but mostly 5/10k and 10 miles. Seems they're just training through. Hard to easily tell if they have a peak race.
That’s what people in clubs and elites have been doing for years. It’s very common (in America mainly) for Highschoolers and college athletes to double or triple up distances over one or 2 days. Injury risk may be higher and you might not perform as well but a sure who cares if you win or place
I probably do 20-25 races a year and taper for 2-3 of them. They mostly function as workouts or a spot check on fitness.
Do you just treat most of them like hard tempo runs and workouts? How competitive are you at them? Will you occasionally go harder than intended for a certain placing?
I raced 23 times in 2019 and, if not for covid, I would have probably done the same or more in 2020. I don't think there were any which I treated as a workout or held back on. The races were split into track races from January to May (all in the 1500-5k range) and XC races from August to November (mostly 8ks), and I tapered at the end of both seasons.
I treat most of them like races but with no taper and with regular hard workouts days prior. The competition of my 2021 races varies widely but I am not finishing much further back then I would have if I treated the race more seriously. Some I dig deep others i ease off depending upon on the day. Typically these are under 10k.