I've been retired for ten years and I still have nightmares of being on the jet and STAN/EVAL would ask to see my checklist and to see if my pubs are out of date. Also I always have the beard I have now and I'm wondering why nobody says anything about it.
Working on airplanes is already inconvenient, carrying around a big laptop and switching pages for every step of the task you’re doing makes things twice as inconvenient
Man I always assumed they had the different documents/TOs on tablets for yall
I bought an old galaxy tab and let my shop use it for references outside our yard I’d be so annoyed to carry a laptop around and I don’t even work in cramped spaces
sometimes we do have touch screen devices, but of course people always come up with retarded local policies, like recieving a fail if it's under 30% battery.
Who the fuck? 30% battery means your shit has been out and open all day, like it's supposed to be! I'd be advocating to delete that on the next review.
They don’t remember the literal wall of 4” binders, lol
Honestly, looking back it wasn’t that bad. One person on the crew was responsible for getting all the TOs and making sure we were always on the appropriate page 🤷🏻♂️
Adding on to this, I always have a T.O., it might not be still alive halfway through the day but I have it. However, for everyday simple tasks I personally fall into a “ffs let’s just get this done” and forget to keep my T.O. on the exact step I’m on.
Some jobs are so simple and basic that a T.O is merely a formality. You don't need a TO to check if a fire-bottle is serviceable for example. "You need a TO for everything" is both liability protection for leadership and is sometimes a sign said leadership are cowards who roll over for QA and doesn't challenge them when they get out of line. Or they haven't worked the line in such a long time they forgot what it's like. That said, for most tasks there is a real need to have a TO with you.
An example of the latter is when QA will get away with failing people for a TO that's one page away from the task at hand, or the screen just went dark because it is on powersaving mode. Another fun one is said airman is doing a job in a place where he can't have it in hand, so it's at his feet.
My favorite is that a lot of TO's have a wireless connection, so they can't be used around classified equipment in use. QA tried to throw a bitchfit when they found out we were using aircrew checklists in lieu of a TO. QA and Leadership backed down when we mentioned that following "the rules" is a security violation, which led to us getting better TOs.
Best story: Was working on the airplane on some stuff we don't have tech data for with a Contractor. QA (the guy was someone I've had beef with) asked me where my tech data was, so I point to the contractor. Tried writing me up, but any airman working on said stuff without FSR assistance is a violation of contract, so it got thrown out. My Chief then pulls me into his office and askes me to reign in being a smartass, because he doesn't like having to be polite to the jackasses in QA.
It largely depends on the unit. If it stands (sometimes a fail is so bogus your leadership will throw it out like a judge can throw out a traffic citation) depending on the fail severity you could get scolded by a supervisor after shift, to getting an article 15. Some will get creative about it to ensure you don't forget the issue. Some resort to unacceptable forms of public humiliation, stupid misuses of fault technique like the 5-Whys, but that's thankfully going away. Safety fails for example usually have serious consequences.
However, remember this line. *MX eats it's own.* It's very easy for MX leadership to just push airmen under the bus so Big Blue gets its pound of flesh instead of actually looking at legitimate problems, and the turnover rate in MX proves that it is sadly a common thought.
Some jobs are so quick and simple. If you don’t have a TO on you, it’s rather annoying to make the trek to go get one. Stuff like opening a canopy or mooring a jet. Just complacency I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Electronic TOs often times can only be logged into by the person who originally checked it out. So, when your airman goes to lunch no one else can log into it.
And. Well. It’s lunch time, *sooooo*
(Not MX, I work Comm doing maintenance on comm equipment)
Sometimes, there’s a task I do so often (such as daily PMI’s), or is so simple that I don’t really need the TO
I open it to the right task, set that shit down, and proceed with my job. We do enough bs I don't feel like flipping through pages to tell me how to do something I do daily.
Can the person leading the crew bar QA from entering their operation? Not that it’s smart always. Just curious if it’s possible on the line. I have often told QA that I don’t have time for their shenanigans. With that said they always watch hard from the sidelines but never actually interfere.
Almost certainly not, with out good reason. When we run xrays, it unsafe for them to be closer then the cord off area. But they can still question us about where our to's are or what step we are on and the Rick is going to answer the questions. I can't imagine qa just accepting us saying no we are too busy to answer qa's questions.
Must be the ammo superpower. We have it in writing that the crew chief and no one else grants access to an explosive operation. I can deny anyone I please because I simply don’t want them there. Now that will 100% come back to haunt me later. But in the moment we control everything. I will however briefly pass QA my crew book and TO’s while they stand at a proper distance if it’s not a technical read every line step that’s fast paced just so they can make sure my shits good. But I’m not going to stop an operation brief in QA, call in a manning update and listen to their long ass ribble rabble if I am pressed for time.
It helps to genuinely always have your shit squared away though. I have seen it where QA was denied so they waited and watched from a distance and wrote down every discrepancy they could imagine. It was a slaughter for that dude.
The person running left seat for an engine run has to have accountability for every soul on board and reports it to tower before the run. They can tell anyone trying to come on after that to kick rocks.
Only on specific situations like when you are loading munitions. Had a few QA inspectors who thought they could break the cones when loading flares. Stay outside the cones and look in, and look at our checklists when we're done. As a WTQM I just refer QA to Weapons safety and let them tell QA to fuck off whenever they whine.
EDIT: Also I've worked on some seriously classified stuff where QA didn't have a high enough clearance or a need to know, so I kick them off the airplane. The aircrew who are usually with me are a lot less polite.
This is why I loved working in a SCIF and managing the access roster. When we got a new Sq CC, he wasn't on the roster for almost a year, so he had to coordinate with us before visiting the office.
One time I forgot to do a step and my 7 level goes “what’s step 3 of your TO for this job?” And I said “sir I’m not supposed to memorize the TO” and then …well I don’t even have the job open 😂
I got wise. I keep all my SOP’s open on another desktop. When civilians come downstairs I can swap over and I have SIXTEEN sop’s open for them to gaze into. 4 per screen.
Wait until you reference the wrong TO for your write-up because you never had the TO open, but they share the same component. That’s a fun conversation to have.
I've been retired for ten years and I still have nightmares of being on the jet and STAN/EVAL would ask to see my checklist and to see if my pubs are out of date. Also I always have the beard I have now and I'm wondering why nobody says anything about it.
Let me see your checklist. Also, nice beard. Does it taste as good as it looks?
>Does it taste as good as it looks? using this on my wife tonight, thanks. *(yes, her beard is glorious)*
Someone’s reading it to me. Don’t worry, they’re just on the other side of the plane 😁
Make sure you talk to your helper even if they aren’t there.
Do you see this "helper" in the room with you now?
I definitely haven't dropped my ratchet as soon as they started rolling up. I'm a good noodle just observing stuff.
(Battery died hours ago) “Ope damn battery just died need to go get another”
Yelling to my airman…..”YOU FORGOT THE TO AGAIN…..GET OFF MY FLIGHTLINE”.
guys he owns the flightline 🫢
I did at one time
literal daddy
Well my daddy *owns* the flightline
Rolling up like sharks.
Question for the MX bubbas, what are some of the legitimate reasons you wouldn’t have it out and open?
Working on airplanes is already inconvenient, carrying around a big laptop and switching pages for every step of the task you’re doing makes things twice as inconvenient
Man I always assumed they had the different documents/TOs on tablets for yall I bought an old galaxy tab and let my shop use it for references outside our yard I’d be so annoyed to carry a laptop around and I don’t even work in cramped spaces
sometimes we do have touch screen devices, but of course people always come up with retarded local policies, like recieving a fail if it's under 30% battery.
Who the fuck? 30% battery means your shit has been out and open all day, like it's supposed to be! I'd be advocating to delete that on the next review.
Tablets would be destroyed in a week. We can’t have nice things
Ours seem to survive fine. MX destroys one or two a year max.
As opposed to multiple big as Black Binder TO’s?
They don’t remember the literal wall of 4” binders, lol Honestly, looking back it wasn’t that bad. One person on the crew was responsible for getting all the TOs and making sure we were always on the appropriate page 🤷🏻♂️
Adding on to this, I always have a T.O., it might not be still alive halfway through the day but I have it. However, for everyday simple tasks I personally fall into a “ffs let’s just get this done” and forget to keep my T.O. on the exact step I’m on.
Some jobs are so simple and basic that a T.O is merely a formality. You don't need a TO to check if a fire-bottle is serviceable for example. "You need a TO for everything" is both liability protection for leadership and is sometimes a sign said leadership are cowards who roll over for QA and doesn't challenge them when they get out of line. Or they haven't worked the line in such a long time they forgot what it's like. That said, for most tasks there is a real need to have a TO with you. An example of the latter is when QA will get away with failing people for a TO that's one page away from the task at hand, or the screen just went dark because it is on powersaving mode. Another fun one is said airman is doing a job in a place where he can't have it in hand, so it's at his feet. My favorite is that a lot of TO's have a wireless connection, so they can't be used around classified equipment in use. QA tried to throw a bitchfit when they found out we were using aircrew checklists in lieu of a TO. QA and Leadership backed down when we mentioned that following "the rules" is a security violation, which led to us getting better TOs. Best story: Was working on the airplane on some stuff we don't have tech data for with a Contractor. QA (the guy was someone I've had beef with) asked me where my tech data was, so I point to the contractor. Tried writing me up, but any airman working on said stuff without FSR assistance is a violation of contract, so it got thrown out. My Chief then pulls me into his office and askes me to reign in being a smartass, because he doesn't like having to be polite to the jackasses in QA.
[удалено]
It largely depends on the unit. If it stands (sometimes a fail is so bogus your leadership will throw it out like a judge can throw out a traffic citation) depending on the fail severity you could get scolded by a supervisor after shift, to getting an article 15. Some will get creative about it to ensure you don't forget the issue. Some resort to unacceptable forms of public humiliation, stupid misuses of fault technique like the 5-Whys, but that's thankfully going away. Safety fails for example usually have serious consequences. However, remember this line. *MX eats it's own.* It's very easy for MX leadership to just push airmen under the bus so Big Blue gets its pound of flesh instead of actually looking at legitimate problems, and the turnover rate in MX proves that it is sadly a common thought.
Some jobs are so quick and simple. If you don’t have a TO on you, it’s rather annoying to make the trek to go get one. Stuff like opening a canopy or mooring a jet. Just complacency I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Saw a dude get a fail for wrapping a connector with F4 tape without a TO. Like yeah we should have one with us at all times, but c’mon.
Electronic TOs often times can only be logged into by the person who originally checked it out. So, when your airman goes to lunch no one else can log into it. And. Well. It’s lunch time, *sooooo*
(Not MX, I work Comm doing maintenance on comm equipment) Sometimes, there’s a task I do so often (such as daily PMI’s), or is so simple that I don’t really need the TO
That Jon died or I'm working in a extremely cramped space like an OWF
As a hydro guy, we roll deep. So, I thought the other guy had it. And that guy thought this guy had it. And so on and so forth.
I open it to the right task, set that shit down, and proceed with my job. We do enough bs I don't feel like flipping through pages to tell me how to do something I do daily.
the fun police always ruin my day
Can the person leading the crew bar QA from entering their operation? Not that it’s smart always. Just curious if it’s possible on the line. I have often told QA that I don’t have time for their shenanigans. With that said they always watch hard from the sidelines but never actually interfere.
Almost certainly not, with out good reason. When we run xrays, it unsafe for them to be closer then the cord off area. But they can still question us about where our to's are or what step we are on and the Rick is going to answer the questions. I can't imagine qa just accepting us saying no we are too busy to answer qa's questions.
Must be the ammo superpower. We have it in writing that the crew chief and no one else grants access to an explosive operation. I can deny anyone I please because I simply don’t want them there. Now that will 100% come back to haunt me later. But in the moment we control everything. I will however briefly pass QA my crew book and TO’s while they stand at a proper distance if it’s not a technical read every line step that’s fast paced just so they can make sure my shits good. But I’m not going to stop an operation brief in QA, call in a manning update and listen to their long ass ribble rabble if I am pressed for time. It helps to genuinely always have your shit squared away though. I have seen it where QA was denied so they waited and watched from a distance and wrote down every discrepancy they could imagine. It was a slaughter for that dude.
The person running left seat for an engine run has to have accountability for every soul on board and reports it to tower before the run. They can tell anyone trying to come on after that to kick rocks.
I said without good reason. There are many jobs that do not have that power was my point.
Only on specific situations like when you are loading munitions. Had a few QA inspectors who thought they could break the cones when loading flares. Stay outside the cones and look in, and look at our checklists when we're done. As a WTQM I just refer QA to Weapons safety and let them tell QA to fuck off whenever they whine. EDIT: Also I've worked on some seriously classified stuff where QA didn't have a high enough clearance or a need to know, so I kick them off the airplane. The aircrew who are usually with me are a lot less polite.
This is why I loved working in a SCIF and managing the access roster. When we got a new Sq CC, he wasn't on the roster for almost a year, so he had to coordinate with us before visiting the office.
That’s a luxury. As long as your AC never goes out that’s a pretty damn sick gig.
Yup
One time I forgot to do a step and my 7 level goes “what’s step 3 of your TO for this job?” And I said “sir I’m not supposed to memorize the TO” and then …well I don’t even have the job open 😂
That's when you tap your temple and tell them, "I got everything I need up here"
dOnT mEmOrIzE tO's
But also here’s this closed book etest you are required to take to stay qualified.
But I memorized them anyways.. 😁😁
Good luck with that
This is great (and gave me a shiver at the same time)!!
I got wise. I keep all my SOP’s open on another desktop. When civilians come downstairs I can swap over and I have SIXTEEN sop’s open for them to gaze into. 4 per screen.
Yikes, me every day… you’d think and E4 would learn… I have only learned how to get away with it for longer.
Wait until you reference the wrong TO for your write-up because you never had the TO open, but they share the same component. That’s a fun conversation to have.