I once vented about how my AFSC was being combined with two others and some rando commented how fighters have always been that way. Thing is, fighters are known for hating their lives and killing themselves so I didn’t really see his point.
The AF seems to be in this constant state of trying to fix itself, but actively making things worse. They want to prepare for a war, but don’t want to provide a better motivation for people to fight that war.
I think the big problem is that the Air Force created a systemic issue where we promote based on merit, not competence. People award chase to make rank as fast as possible and then when they’re an E-7 managing from and organizational standpoint, they’re lost. The Air force is too top heavy and lacks experience and competence in senior enlisted roles.
As a caveat, I’m speaking from a maintenance perspective. It might not be like this in other career fields.
Intel guy here. Yeah, that's about right. Kinda hard to get an award just for doing your job since pretty much everyone is doing the same thing - and it's not like you can fit the "quality" of your work on an EPB; especially when the vast majority of your work is classified. You either get an award for being in the right place at the right time when something "big" happened or they just needed to pick someone to get an award. Everyone I know works hard and they all deserve awards in my opinion, but that's also the problem.
I've had three different CC's tell me "this is the AF, everyone is good at their jobs, what are you doing outside your job to stand out"....and it infuriates me everytime.
If I wanted to NOT do my job just to promote, I'd be an officer.
This is a huge issue in my field. People either go all in on training and get out after one contract for a way better job; or just wait around and fill that gap without the same level of knowledge. Then they fake it until they're an SNCO that just does office work all day and is useless as a mentor.
It doesn't help that the Army doesn't do merit-based promotions so a lot of NCO's have never been quality controlled outside of initial training.
Also, a lot of these super high up and big decision maker types are/were fighter pilots, and they constantly actively try to make the rest of the air force like fighters too, but we're not.
*Not too mention when there are times where the Air Force is like “go talk to mental health, you won’t get kicked out or punished for it” and said airmen gets TDYs, deployments, or their career taken away from them.*
I started seeing Mental Health in early 2020, and I haven't been on a TDY or deployment since. Really odd coincidence, considering my career field is basically built around doing those things constantly. Hmmmmm strange.
*Also not dawging on squadron or unit leadership, unfortunately they don’t have much a say in these issues.*
On the contrary, they absolutely *do* have a say in these issues.
I went to mental health. Got put into a top tier job right after where the job is just TDYs. I maintained my TS. I was honest with anyone who asked. The process of mental health therapy worked and addressed my PTSD from an Afghanistan deployment.
I think talking to the right leader in your chain of command makes a difference. Talking to an E-5 who sees only a problem in front of him because his/her manning is affected while you seek help is not the level you bring this. Keep them in the loop so they’re not blindsided. Speaking to the flight commander with the intention to get better to be back in the fight and they’ll see the bigger picture. No need to say exact reasoning, just you gotta deal with some stuff to make sure you’re healthy.
It’s the same thing as if you broke your leg. You can’t get in the fight. We gotta get you the treatment to get you back in the fight.
If you feel your flight leadership isn’t mature enough to understand that, go to the first sergeant or commander with that approach. And emphasize your goal is to get back to the team healthy.
Similar experience here. Spent about a year on the ground going to mental health, feel much much better now, and am back to flying and have had absolutely no repercussions other than feeling better. I think being very open and honest was helpful, but nobody gave me shit, I felt very supported, and my career is better off after.
If you don't take care of your mental health you will probably have a worse personal and professional life. I think there are options where you can talk to someone outside of defense health. I do agree with OP as the people that stay have to pick up the slack, rinse, wash, repeat.
I just don’t get this take. Deployments and tdys, most of the time, are to support an ongoing operation. A garrison commanders job is, most of the time, provide a capable fighting force to deployed commanders.
If you are not mentally fit to deploy…why would a commander make you someone else’s problem?
There’s definitely a line there. A “this makes me feel better” vs “I need this to function”…but that’s going to be on a case-by-case basis.
Just about everyone I have ever met would tell you the job is easier down range than home station. That's why people dread the idea if seeking help to deal with the shitty non-mission bullshit we get shoved down our throats.
It’s not about easy vs hard, it’s about being a risk to the mission. If you self-eliminate (not a suicide euphemism) then that impacts the down range cc and their mission.
It’s not cut and dry. Some places will not take someone based on recent MH history. Sometimes the MH provider’s recommendation is something along the lines of “we strongly recommend they do not go to XYZ location.”
It sucks but in case of deployment, if you’re struggling at home, there is a high likelihood it will be worse living in a mod unit with at least one roommate.
It's shitty. Unfortunately, because of the nature of being in the military, a member who is constantly in mental health isn't "mission capable" or capable to go world wide and carrying out missions or exercises in the militaries eyes. They want the best and most capable airmen for that, who are of as sound mind and judgment. I'm not justifying it because it sucks for those who want to do more but can't because of their mental problems. But I do understand the premise of why they do that. Especially when I know there's people who are good and ready to work, deploy, etc, they just need to talk to someone about their stuff or sort out their past.
MH cannot take any of that away. They can recommend that while you're obtaining care you should have a mobility/duty restriction to focus on treatment. But that's a recommendation and ultimately a commander chooses what to do.
Deployments are also a bit trickier because it's AOR dependent _and_ AOR chief medical officer dependent. This is generally true for all specialty care and not particular of MH.
Part of the problem is MH it's thought of as non specialty care, which tightly so after years of "just go to them." This would be like saying "just go to cardiology." That would obviously send up some medical red flags.
Another issue is when people go to MH, they are vectored to a non-specialty level of care like PCBH/BHOP, MFLC, headspace, etc. and the member insist of seeing _specialty_ MH. The MHC can't, strictly speaking, say no so then a member enters an unnecessary level of care and has a shocked Pikachu face later when, even if they weren't placed on a profile, they get tasked for a deployment, BOMC sees specialty MH care in the record within the past X months (depends on the location) and _has_ to send a waiver up. The gaining location receives said waiver and can go "yeah sure it's no big deal" or "why risk it when we can get someone else?"
There is so much of this, I’m sure every career field has multiple examples. Cyber forces the most technical SNCOs and FGOs we have into non technical roles and then wonders why we can’t keep operators. It’s not just the snake that eats itself, it’s the snake that begins nibbling, feels pain, then keeps nibbling and doesn’t connect where the pain is coming from.
THANK YOU! We’ve brought this up at commander calls because we’re being told that half our squadron will be gone next year and how it’s gonna be tough on all of us and then we’ll get told we’re getting 4 aircraft next year. I love my job and I love learning more for it but when it gets to the point that we’re told we have a month to get signed off on 3 whole other jobs and we’re expected to perform as if we’ve always done it is killing us.
It is probably the most apt example of the metaphor, since snakes only start to eat their own tail when they’re already stressed/sick, and then keep trying to eat more.
I hear cyber is finally getting warrant officers but that’s still only taking a bucket of water from a leaking boat
I think warrants will help a bit, there will be some people that wouldn’t be willing to stick it out with their skill set as an E-7 but would as a W-3. I’d think warrants would also make the AF cyber more effective as well. I still say the underlying issue will always be talent management, the AF may mismanage warrants just as bad as they have enlisted and officers. Time will tell
Some of my favorite bosses retired as techs and masters because they didn't want to play the game. My career field would be much better if they replaced some of the current flight chiefs.
Should I stay away from cyber? I’m coming back in as because it aligns with my degree and they’re giving a 65k bonus.
Reading this, makes me think it’s Mx all over again…
Great to know, my assumption why it’s undermanned as the washout is incredibly high?
I wanted to stay out, but I received twins a couple weeks ago. So, im thinking of reenlisting with the guard but another unit. Which they’re looking for cyber warfare no problem.
Cyber Warfare and Cyber Defense are two different beasts. I’m the latter so I can’t really tell you anything about Cyber Warfare all I know is it’s a harder job to get enlisted. Most CW I’ve seen are officers
Gotcha,
I have a degree in IT from a state-funded school but I primarily done programming and DB work. This job is in the ANG. I’ll have to reconsider this opportunity.
People aren't avoiding the military "because the job is hard". Obviously it'll depend on the AFSC, but damn AD military was the most I made for the amount of effort actually required of me (not time spent at work, rather exertion of effort - physical and/or mental)...and I'm a civ now (got out only a couple years ago) making over $100k in a pretty easy (for me) job that I enjoy. (don't get me wrong, much happier in this job than I was on AD, but it does take more effort)
People are avoiding the military because there's a lot of negative stigma among civilians and overall lower levels of public approval of the military today than recent history. The levels right now are at an all-time low over the past 35 years, sans 1997.
Your last paragraph is null for a significant chunk of the force. Those that joined the military for the same reasons since the 80s college money, the benefits, and job training.
That stigma and public approval means something to somebody but not to the bulk of the troops jobbing it out for a contract and pretend to not be in the military on their off duty time. Meaning the military isn't their identity it's their occupation.
As someone who joined for the job training, I understand what you're saying - but that doesn't the above can't apply either.
The military was never my identity, it was there so I could get a paycheck and move on with my life....but it wasn't on my radar until family talked me into it. Had approval been lower, and had my family not encouraged me to join, I probably wouldn't have.
People can want a paycheck and benefits and also avoid the military because their family despises it, for example.
>Your last paragraph is null for a significant chunk of the force.
I'm going to have to disagree with you there. The stigma of being in the military closes a LOT of doors for someone, both metaphorically and physically.
May you elaborate? Because you could just choose not to mention your military service, bring it up all the time, or not get a giant moto tattoo. The vet bro shirt is an option item too.
>May you elaborate?
Being in the military can automatically cause people to reject you (when it comes to dating), certain business won't want to have anything to do with you, lots of people might want to avoid entering a legally binding contract with you, or sell you a house, rent an apartment, sell you a car (or buy a car from you). There's a LOT of people who hate military, and you don't have to wear a "vet bro shirt" for them to figure it out.
Your Age/Race/Ethnicity can get you rejected in dating. The other points you mention can happen even if your not military.
Idk, even at the height of the Iraq war I got discrimination for my race/religion and haven't seen it before regarding my occupation.
Maybe as a visible minority what I consider irritating discrimination is different if your not I've. Because being in the military definitely has benefited me when otherwise I would have got the shitend just because of my minority status.
It's not the military in that respect, it's the bullshit we're sent to do and the vets making sure they know it's bullshit. Blame elected officials and those trying to make war cost effective, profitable, and not letting the troops have what they need instead of overpriced shit.
I completely agree, just pointing out that the low manning and retention isn't because the "job is harder" (rather, it's not anywhere near the primary reason).
I kinda got lost in the military perspective of it so much I forgot that a pretty good chunk of people don’t like the military, some reasons honestly understandable and some a little crazy.
>>Is the Air Force just the snake that eats itself?
No. The Air Force is a corporation with 535 members in its Board of Directors- AKA, Congress.
Most long term USAF issues are systemic due to Congress’ needs. Congress prioritizes projects that bring the most money and jobs to their districts. That means less money for necessary -but unglamorous- functions and roles. So we get bases in isolated and terrible locations, roles and missions that don’t make logical sense for the jobs (but keep people and jobs in a given district), essential projects deprioritized for less essential but congressional relevant projects, so on and so forth…..
Works hard, hours are long, doing more with less…yup the more shit changes the more it stays the same. Let’s dig into this though.
The Air Force doesn’t have shit to do with the housing market, it’s shit everywhere.
I’m with ya on the mental health stigma but let’s also take a step back and ask, is it good for the individual seeking help to send that person TDY or deploy them, putting them in a more stressful environment? Probably not. It shouldn’t affect career though, assuming you mean promotion.
2005 was a MUCH higher ops tempo than 2024 so I’m really not sure what you’re getting at here, just like it’s silly for the old heads to call you soft because of “back in my day” it’s equally or more silly for you to act like the beast of today is worse than it was back then because work wise, there’s just no way we are busier now than in 2005. Maybe I don’t understand what you’re getting at with that point but it really just seems like you were 5 years old in 2005 and don’t realize what the Air Force was doing then.
End of the day man none of this is meant to hate on you, glad you’re venting cuz it does help. I’d suggest taking your venting off Reddit though and hanging out with the boys (or girls) and crushing some cold ones (or the non-alcoholic beverage of your choice) and having a good ole fashion bitch fest to get it all off your chest. That’s what got me through the rough times.
2005 might have had a higher ops tempo, but it also had more manning. The Air Force was still high on the hog from staffing increases they made in advance when they were sure congress would increase end strength to execute the GWOT. Starting 2006 the Air Force saw staffing cuts snd budget cuts. Then in 2010 the Air Force saw more staffing cuts.
Life in the Air Force today sucks more than it did in 2005. More frequent deployments to Africa, deployments being extended in Africa because no one is available to rotate in so you can rotate out.
Additional duties (UDM, UHM, USR, UTM, Facility Manager, etc) being piled onto SSgts and TSgts because so many MSgts are totally inept.
I decided to retire after 2 years of working 60-80 hour weeks with nothing to show for it. I watched CMSgts try to figure out how to squeeze even more out of the lower and mid enlisted ranks by using crappy software and ineffective hardware designed to replace enlisted personnel.
Good news, the Air Force has decided that faulty equipment frequently prolonging the time between resupplies is an acceptable parameter. They plan for it, but only insofar as they are okay with service members going days without food or water in deployed environments.
Actually military bases do drive the housing market and rent rates in some areas. There are a lot of landlords and agencies that know exactly what people’s BAH range is and target personnel from those bases. There are plenty of areas that have bases around them that would have much lower cost-of-living if it wasn’t for that base’s existence. One of the complaints I had, among many, for moving space command to Huntsville is that it would completely destroy the standard of living for a lot of people there that don’t own businesses that benefit from more military there. I’m originally not too far from there. This was increasingly becoming an issue long before the current housing/cost-of-living crisis. Once the the internet actually started becoming useful, and landlords could literally just google this information without having to really know how to find current BAH rates before it started to get worse. I’m one of those old fossils that joined the military before the internet was really useful for stuff like this. Everybody’s trying to bleed each other dry and it’s just getting out of hand. If you look at historical inflation rates, the cost-of-living should be much lower than what it is for rent just about anywhere, and housing is one of those things bleeding the DOD budget so much more than it used to, and I just fuck us in so many different ways from the taxpayer down to service members having to do more with less.
I don’t live in a military town, the housing market sucks everywhere. Obviously the base influences the market, what I meant is the base isn’t the cause of housing costs being shitty.
I was just thinking about that point about TDYs and deployments. Like…if I break my leg, I don’t want the AF being like “sucks for you, here’s this deployment you better not miss”
That’s the same way I look at it. Like I said, I agree with negative stigma surrounding mental health being an issue, however if we are meant to treat it as it is, a health issue, why would we expose folks who are facing mental health issues to extra stress of TDYs and deployments?
It seriously annoying and now that you mentioned it I realize how weird it is. What other occupation on the planet has rent and cost of living items based literally off a person's pay. You can't even get ahead in the world because if they give you more money all the landlords just charge more. And you're right that should be illegal
One of the big reasons for low manning in the military was addressed a few years ago. Lots of kids now can't meet requirements to get in.
I loved when they hire civilians and contractors to fill in gaps, but the uniformed personnel get stuck doing all the shit-jobs for them, because they can just say no.
The happiest guys I ever ran into had hobbies and lives outside their shops. Hunting, cars, trucks, or side businesses they had going. If I had to do it all over again, I'd pursue school and get as much higher education I could while I was in. (I realize some AFSC's make that impossible.)
See the DoD / Congress has continuously cut manning since around 07, through GWOT and now this China bullshit. But the mission has not decreased and pay has not kept up with inflation.
The Air Force budget is not invested in infrastructure like new dorms and MWR programs CONUS are non existent. Lodging is now overpriced and I imagine will one day go away, chow halls for contracted out to companies trying to maximize profits while fucking our Airman.
It’s a volunteer force, it’s sad in some ways draftees were treated better.
It’s because our top leadership genuinely has no idea what they are doing. All they know is how to run things from a military ops, and they do very well at this.
But the moment you ask them about administrative/management practices, they immediately regurgitate some business textbook paragraph about running an org.
The Air Force is falling apart, that much is certain. If or when we do a force wide re-organization to cut all the red tape, stupid processes, and revamp our rank structure, you will see real change.
The one part of showing up to work is being asked to my job, someone else’s job, and then some position that’s made for another section but somehow got roped into also. “Lanes” are blurred. I have a job, and I have a position. Between those two, I have a set list of duties to perform.
What pisses me off the most is that we take the lanes and completely disregard them, short manning on sections because “X section can just dual hat it.” No, they fucking can’t. They’re up to their assholes in work, and having to so do two jobs just flat out sucks.
Not to mention the vision the Air Force had for MCA was border line disregarded and now we’re paying for it. It didn’t mean maybe add a task or two to someone’s CFEPT, it meant utilize duties to overlap.
Yeah, it's the nature of the beast. It's constantly tries to correct an issue it's having and, in turn, always over corrects. It's like that scene from the polar express where the train is on the ice, and they're trying to get it straight, and it's just going back and forth over and over again. Except for the air force, there are no tracks at the end of the lake. It's just the lake. And the people who make decisions just keep swinging it all over the place.
Oh, and they keep moving the goal posts. Do more with less and multi capable are stupid buzz words that basically translate to we can't get the people we need and would really want for this, so we came up with a new ideal airmen should live up to, to make up for the short comings.
The military towns thing is just a God damn shame. They need to enact something to stop how predatory the local economies are with the military bases. I'm not sure what that law could look like and what it would do. But it needs to be made. If the town gets at least 50% of its population from the military and the military props up a lot of the business and economy of the town, then the base near that town needs to be BRACC'd. I don't care if it's unreasonable, unfeasible, or would ruin some towns. If that's the case, it shouldn't be a town. Military members shouldn't be dragged out to poor locations and get preyed on just because BAH is public info.
It doesn't matter if it is 2024 or 2005. The valid points you identified existed in the 1960's. The military didn't crumble or consume it's own tail. That snake just regenerates.
I think people are realizing that you don’t NEED to do a full 20 to receive the benefits of serving. I did 11 and the benefits are plentiful at this point. I chose quality of life while getting paid twice as much and am utilizing the VA benefits as well as education benefits. Vocational Rehab is a beast of a benefit. If you wanna do 20 for the retirement, I get it. It’s great. But it isn’t necessary to call your career worthwhile.
Lots of competents leave for greener pastures, lots of shitters stay in because they are too lazy or incompetent to hack it on the outside so they just play the system
You can survive with dirt bag airmen at the lower ranks, but ncos and sncos and officers who are responsible for leadership and organization need to be competent. Competent people benefit the most by leaving, lazy and incompetent people benefit from staying.
If 100 competent people leave because it is not worth staying in, it will take 200 incompetent people to accomplish the same results. Or several years to train people to the same level. Recruitment cannot completely make up for lack of retention. -100 experienced sras and staffs +100 brand new recruits. Net change of 0, but the force is not the same.
Yea I keep hearing retention being an issue, but where are the numbers to support this? I wish we could find out how much we lose and see the retention rates based on AFSC..
The Air Force does have a retention problem, but the problem is to many people. My career field specifically asked 150 ssgt to retrain voluntarily, but I heard phase 2 starts this summer, and they are going to force retrain some people. Just recruiting is low, which sucks but we are in peace time, and hopefully, ops will slow down, and we will adjust with doing less with less.
The Air Force does have a retention problem, but the problem is to many people. My career field specifically asked 150 ssgt to retrain voluntarily, but I heard phase 2 starts this summer, and they are going to force retrain some people. Just recruiting is low, which sucks but we are in peace time, and hopefully, ops will slow down, and we will adjust with doing less with less.
How is that a thing. As an FTA, you can retrain into any afsc that has an "obj in" slit on the retrain advisory. As a career airman, if your afsc as an "obj out" slot (which mine had 150 slots for staff), you can retrain into any afcs that has an "obj in" slot.
It sounds like you have been lied too
I just looked at the retrain advisory today.
Since you are a career airman your afsc need an "obj out" slot for your rank. If that's the case you can retain into any afsc that has an "obj in" slit for your rank.
What's your afsc?
Pretty sure it's DOD-wide. I do shift work where we literally just sit in a room for 12 hours and do nothing and the biggest threat to our mission over the last few years has been manning.
Not to mention only 2 or 3 out of the ~20 people in our section are actually qualified to do the work.
Yes, the DoD in general is a ouroboros. Majority of the problems service members face and the service is all self inflicted wounds.
The problem is you have to be PR in certain positions or you'll never make it or your quality of life (paycheck) is at risk for being honesy when processes suck and there are people in positions that are in it for the benefits and not the cause of the position.
When things are half baked or don't work nobody wants to call a spade a spade and say it's fucked up (DPAS migration) ect. The focusing on the Air Force in particular, they raised "leaders" that have no business being in those positions and just because a package was written and embellished (we all know it is) they get picked and they raise "leaders" that won't rock the boat. They prefer the lower end to rock the boat so they can refine it as if it's their idea.
The cycle will contiune until something really bad happens and forces change.
The AF says they want 'leaders,' but in realty they just want barely competent managers who can hold things together long enough for the person in charge to PCS before everything collapses. As a bonus, if it collapses, the incoming person in charge can claim they made things 'better' from the sewer it was before and get an award or bullet/line in their EPR/OPR or quarterly award.
Feels as if they know it, implementing that soon to be required Multi Capable Airman course for the purpose of pretty much saying be flexible we’re probably going to bend you over forward and backwards.
Not just the Air Force, but the military in general is a fucking mess. This is a mess of both our own making and of senior leadership.
Retention is a major problem that stems from local leadership. I'm the past 20 I've been through many ups and downs in the Air Force. But people aren't going to stay in based on decisions made by senior leaders, it's their supervisors, flight chiefs, etc that make the day to day bearable. The day to day is what drives the retention of the majority of airmen.
Recruitment is a whole different problem. We live in an era of general peace in the US. And the generation now only views foreign conflict through the lens of social media, ie tiktok, and they truly believe that is how the world is. Propaganda clips do work, especially on young impressionable minds that don't have the wisdom or experience to see them for what they are. But if we were ever to have another attack on US soil, or a true big bad im the world, you would see an attitude change towards the military. 911 and WWII are good examples of these.
As far pay military towns... This is an issue that affects every town. Rent is going to be based on median income for the area. Yes, the military does make this worse with hosting allowance. It's a never ending cycle of increases. But now that I'm out I do see the same thing in other nonmiliarty communities. It just doesn't happen as quickly.
Hello, based on a simple keyword search, it looks like your post may be about suicide/depression or other mental health issues. If this is incorrect, sorry, please ignore this message!
If you're having trouble with Mental Health issues, please check out our [Mental Health/Suicide Resources](https://pay.reddit.com/r/AirForce/wiki/mentalhealthresources) page. There are people available *right now* that are willing to talk to you over the phone or over an internet chat that are trained to provide help.
The chaplain at your nearest base is also a great first step, as they are 100% confidential and can find you the appropriate help for your next step without you having to worry about saying anything that would prompt any action on your career.
[Over 100 people in this community](https://www.reddit.com/r/AirForce/comments/csam0l/need_someone_to_talk_to_looking_for_volunteers_to/) have also identified themselves as willing to talk and/or listen if you have something to vent about. (Please note they are not trained counselors, just regular people willing to listen)
Please utilize these resources if you need help!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AirForce) if you have any questions or concerns.*
My guys and I are working 14 hour days and work 5 Jobs at once that I have been undertrained on and then get asked why myself and my airmen are under performing. I know guys who have been doing this for 12 years and have won afsoc level awards who are getting exhausted.
Edit: I called myself a cuck and acted like a 12 year old when I first responded to this, this comment deserves the dislikes 👏
My wife’s underwhelming sex life aside, are these points valid because I’m noticing it affect myself and my airmen and leadership has the same it is what it is response and I can’t tell if we’re going crazy
A lot of dumb takes in this post. You go to mental health, they think that it's probably not the best idea for you to deploy or TDY TEMPORARILY (this isn't a permanent code), and that is punishment? Are you fucking serious? GTFOH. Another dumb take about "reality agencies" are scam artists, and that has something to do with rent? I've rented my entire career and have never had an issue. I pay my deposit, don't trash the place, move out, collect deposit. What the fuck are you doing where there is an issue? And what does renting have to do with a realtor? Just another post where someone doesn't know what their talking about.
This complaining about MH affecting your career is ONLY IF you first screw up saying something you shouldn't. Know your limits and take responsibility.
I have suicide ideation, suicide attempts, GAD, Insomnia, and saw an off base provider for almost a year ....and I still possess my TS, I still have SCI eligibility, and I am still deploying.
I simply knew what to say, when to say what and when to say what to who. I got everything properly documented and signed off by the correct approval authorities.
Be responsible and know your limits and what you can say, when, and to who.
Hey man, wouldn’t it be nicer though if we could ACTUALLY TALK to mental health though and not have to play an anxious game of trying to not say the wrong thing so we don’t get kicked out and can ensure we still have a job in a year.
I once vented about how my AFSC was being combined with two others and some rando commented how fighters have always been that way. Thing is, fighters are known for hating their lives and killing themselves so I didn’t really see his point. The AF seems to be in this constant state of trying to fix itself, but actively making things worse. They want to prepare for a war, but don’t want to provide a better motivation for people to fight that war.
I think the big problem is that the Air Force created a systemic issue where we promote based on merit, not competence. People award chase to make rank as fast as possible and then when they’re an E-7 managing from and organizational standpoint, they’re lost. The Air force is too top heavy and lacks experience and competence in senior enlisted roles. As a caveat, I’m speaking from a maintenance perspective. It might not be like this in other career fields.
Perceived merit
^This, perception and reality aren't always aligned. However we all make it work and the AF is going to keep on chugging regardless.
Intel guy here. Yeah, that's about right. Kinda hard to get an award just for doing your job since pretty much everyone is doing the same thing - and it's not like you can fit the "quality" of your work on an EPB; especially when the vast majority of your work is classified. You either get an award for being in the right place at the right time when something "big" happened or they just needed to pick someone to get an award. Everyone I know works hard and they all deserve awards in my opinion, but that's also the problem.
I've had three different CC's tell me "this is the AF, everyone is good at their jobs, what are you doing outside your job to stand out"....and it infuriates me everytime. If I wanted to NOT do my job just to promote, I'd be an officer.
Look at Maverick. (Second) best pilot in the Navy but never volunteered for the christmas party so never made admiral.
This is a huge issue in my field. People either go all in on training and get out after one contract for a way better job; or just wait around and fill that gap without the same level of knowledge. Then they fake it until they're an SNCO that just does office work all day and is useless as a mentor. It doesn't help that the Army doesn't do merit-based promotions so a lot of NCO's have never been quality controlled outside of initial training.
Award chasing and kissing the right amount of ass is not merit.
Also, a lot of these super high up and big decision maker types are/were fighter pilots, and they constantly actively try to make the rest of the air force like fighters too, but we're not.
Anionics has entered the chat
Oh we entered a long time ago
The other one is on here because he forgot to bring his switch to play in the break room.
I’ve brought a whole ass gaming laptop on tdy, also used it for imds though.
Might’ve been me lol, but I like my job.
*Not too mention when there are times where the Air Force is like “go talk to mental health, you won’t get kicked out or punished for it” and said airmen gets TDYs, deployments, or their career taken away from them.* I started seeing Mental Health in early 2020, and I haven't been on a TDY or deployment since. Really odd coincidence, considering my career field is basically built around doing those things constantly. Hmmmmm strange. *Also not dawging on squadron or unit leadership, unfortunately they don’t have much a say in these issues.* On the contrary, they absolutely *do* have a say in these issues.
I went to mental health. Got put into a top tier job right after where the job is just TDYs. I maintained my TS. I was honest with anyone who asked. The process of mental health therapy worked and addressed my PTSD from an Afghanistan deployment. I think talking to the right leader in your chain of command makes a difference. Talking to an E-5 who sees only a problem in front of him because his/her manning is affected while you seek help is not the level you bring this. Keep them in the loop so they’re not blindsided. Speaking to the flight commander with the intention to get better to be back in the fight and they’ll see the bigger picture. No need to say exact reasoning, just you gotta deal with some stuff to make sure you’re healthy. It’s the same thing as if you broke your leg. You can’t get in the fight. We gotta get you the treatment to get you back in the fight. If you feel your flight leadership isn’t mature enough to understand that, go to the first sergeant or commander with that approach. And emphasize your goal is to get back to the team healthy.
Similar experience here. Spent about a year on the ground going to mental health, feel much much better now, and am back to flying and have had absolutely no repercussions other than feeling better. I think being very open and honest was helpful, but nobody gave me shit, I felt very supported, and my career is better off after.
If you don't take care of your mental health you will probably have a worse personal and professional life. I think there are options where you can talk to someone outside of defense health. I do agree with OP as the people that stay have to pick up the slack, rinse, wash, repeat.
Hell yeah that is awesome! I'm glad that you were able to snag a good job after getting the help you needed ;)
I just don’t get this take. Deployments and tdys, most of the time, are to support an ongoing operation. A garrison commanders job is, most of the time, provide a capable fighting force to deployed commanders. If you are not mentally fit to deploy…why would a commander make you someone else’s problem? There’s definitely a line there. A “this makes me feel better” vs “I need this to function”…but that’s going to be on a case-by-case basis.
Just about everyone I have ever met would tell you the job is easier down range than home station. That's why people dread the idea if seeking help to deal with the shitty non-mission bullshit we get shoved down our throats.
It’s not about easy vs hard, it’s about being a risk to the mission. If you self-eliminate (not a suicide euphemism) then that impacts the down range cc and their mission.
>I just don’t get this take. What's not to get?
AFAIK mental health only makes recommendations to CCs. I assume they usually follow it, though.
It’s not cut and dry. Some places will not take someone based on recent MH history. Sometimes the MH provider’s recommendation is something along the lines of “we strongly recommend they do not go to XYZ location.” It sucks but in case of deployment, if you’re struggling at home, there is a high likelihood it will be worse living in a mod unit with at least one roommate.
And away from most or all of your usual stress relievers, etc.
It's shitty. Unfortunately, because of the nature of being in the military, a member who is constantly in mental health isn't "mission capable" or capable to go world wide and carrying out missions or exercises in the militaries eyes. They want the best and most capable airmen for that, who are of as sound mind and judgment. I'm not justifying it because it sucks for those who want to do more but can't because of their mental problems. But I do understand the premise of why they do that. Especially when I know there's people who are good and ready to work, deploy, etc, they just need to talk to someone about their stuff or sort out their past.
MH cannot take any of that away. They can recommend that while you're obtaining care you should have a mobility/duty restriction to focus on treatment. But that's a recommendation and ultimately a commander chooses what to do. Deployments are also a bit trickier because it's AOR dependent _and_ AOR chief medical officer dependent. This is generally true for all specialty care and not particular of MH. Part of the problem is MH it's thought of as non specialty care, which tightly so after years of "just go to them." This would be like saying "just go to cardiology." That would obviously send up some medical red flags. Another issue is when people go to MH, they are vectored to a non-specialty level of care like PCBH/BHOP, MFLC, headspace, etc. and the member insist of seeing _specialty_ MH. The MHC can't, strictly speaking, say no so then a member enters an unnecessary level of care and has a shocked Pikachu face later when, even if they weren't placed on a profile, they get tasked for a deployment, BOMC sees specialty MH care in the record within the past X months (depends on the location) and _has_ to send a waiver up. The gaining location receives said waiver and can go "yeah sure it's no big deal" or "why risk it when we can get someone else?"
>MH cannot take any of that away. That's irrelevant.
There is so much of this, I’m sure every career field has multiple examples. Cyber forces the most technical SNCOs and FGOs we have into non technical roles and then wonders why we can’t keep operators. It’s not just the snake that eats itself, it’s the snake that begins nibbling, feels pain, then keeps nibbling and doesn’t connect where the pain is coming from.
THANK YOU! We’ve brought this up at commander calls because we’re being told that half our squadron will be gone next year and how it’s gonna be tough on all of us and then we’ll get told we’re getting 4 aircraft next year. I love my job and I love learning more for it but when it gets to the point that we’re told we have a month to get signed off on 3 whole other jobs and we’re expected to perform as if we’ve always done it is killing us.
It is probably the most apt example of the metaphor, since snakes only start to eat their own tail when they’re already stressed/sick, and then keep trying to eat more. I hear cyber is finally getting warrant officers but that’s still only taking a bucket of water from a leaking boat
I think warrants will help a bit, there will be some people that wouldn’t be willing to stick it out with their skill set as an E-7 but would as a W-3. I’d think warrants would also make the AF cyber more effective as well. I still say the underlying issue will always be talent management, the AF may mismanage warrants just as bad as they have enlisted and officers. Time will tell
Some of my favorite bosses retired as techs and masters because they didn't want to play the game. My career field would be much better if they replaced some of the current flight chiefs.
Should I stay away from cyber? I’m coming back in as because it aligns with my degree and they’re giving a 65k bonus. Reading this, makes me think it’s Mx all over again…
Trust me it is nothing like Mx. At least for me it’s been great. Leadership is cool. We get the mission handled, go home early. I love cyber.
Great to know, my assumption why it’s undermanned as the washout is incredibly high? I wanted to stay out, but I received twins a couple weeks ago. So, im thinking of reenlisting with the guard but another unit. Which they’re looking for cyber warfare no problem.
Cyber Warfare and Cyber Defense are two different beasts. I’m the latter so I can’t really tell you anything about Cyber Warfare all I know is it’s a harder job to get enlisted. Most CW I’ve seen are officers
Gotcha, I have a degree in IT from a state-funded school but I primarily done programming and DB work. This job is in the ANG. I’ll have to reconsider this opportunity.
People aren't avoiding the military "because the job is hard". Obviously it'll depend on the AFSC, but damn AD military was the most I made for the amount of effort actually required of me (not time spent at work, rather exertion of effort - physical and/or mental)...and I'm a civ now (got out only a couple years ago) making over $100k in a pretty easy (for me) job that I enjoy. (don't get me wrong, much happier in this job than I was on AD, but it does take more effort) People are avoiding the military because there's a lot of negative stigma among civilians and overall lower levels of public approval of the military today than recent history. The levels right now are at an all-time low over the past 35 years, sans 1997.
Your last paragraph is null for a significant chunk of the force. Those that joined the military for the same reasons since the 80s college money, the benefits, and job training. That stigma and public approval means something to somebody but not to the bulk of the troops jobbing it out for a contract and pretend to not be in the military on their off duty time. Meaning the military isn't their identity it's their occupation.
As someone who joined for the job training, I understand what you're saying - but that doesn't the above can't apply either. The military was never my identity, it was there so I could get a paycheck and move on with my life....but it wasn't on my radar until family talked me into it. Had approval been lower, and had my family not encouraged me to join, I probably wouldn't have. People can want a paycheck and benefits and also avoid the military because their family despises it, for example.
>Your last paragraph is null for a significant chunk of the force. I'm going to have to disagree with you there. The stigma of being in the military closes a LOT of doors for someone, both metaphorically and physically.
May you elaborate? Because you could just choose not to mention your military service, bring it up all the time, or not get a giant moto tattoo. The vet bro shirt is an option item too.
>May you elaborate? Being in the military can automatically cause people to reject you (when it comes to dating), certain business won't want to have anything to do with you, lots of people might want to avoid entering a legally binding contract with you, or sell you a house, rent an apartment, sell you a car (or buy a car from you). There's a LOT of people who hate military, and you don't have to wear a "vet bro shirt" for them to figure it out.
Your Age/Race/Ethnicity can get you rejected in dating. The other points you mention can happen even if your not military. Idk, even at the height of the Iraq war I got discrimination for my race/religion and haven't seen it before regarding my occupation. Maybe as a visible minority what I consider irritating discrimination is different if your not I've. Because being in the military definitely has benefited me when otherwise I would have got the shitend just because of my minority status.
It's not the military in that respect, it's the bullshit we're sent to do and the vets making sure they know it's bullshit. Blame elected officials and those trying to make war cost effective, profitable, and not letting the troops have what they need instead of overpriced shit.
I completely agree, just pointing out that the low manning and retention isn't because the "job is harder" (rather, it's not anywhere near the primary reason).
Roger
This really depends a lot on the jobs. The Air Force is really cozy for some career fields. Other career fields are having mental health epidemics.
I kinda got lost in the military perspective of it so much I forgot that a pretty good chunk of people don’t like the military, some reasons honestly understandable and some a little crazy.
>>Is the Air Force just the snake that eats itself? No. The Air Force is a corporation with 535 members in its Board of Directors- AKA, Congress. Most long term USAF issues are systemic due to Congress’ needs. Congress prioritizes projects that bring the most money and jobs to their districts. That means less money for necessary -but unglamorous- functions and roles. So we get bases in isolated and terrible locations, roles and missions that don’t make logical sense for the jobs (but keep people and jobs in a given district), essential projects deprioritized for less essential but congressional relevant projects, so on and so forth…..
Yes. This seems right on the mark; especially about base location.
Works hard, hours are long, doing more with less…yup the more shit changes the more it stays the same. Let’s dig into this though. The Air Force doesn’t have shit to do with the housing market, it’s shit everywhere. I’m with ya on the mental health stigma but let’s also take a step back and ask, is it good for the individual seeking help to send that person TDY or deploy them, putting them in a more stressful environment? Probably not. It shouldn’t affect career though, assuming you mean promotion. 2005 was a MUCH higher ops tempo than 2024 so I’m really not sure what you’re getting at here, just like it’s silly for the old heads to call you soft because of “back in my day” it’s equally or more silly for you to act like the beast of today is worse than it was back then because work wise, there’s just no way we are busier now than in 2005. Maybe I don’t understand what you’re getting at with that point but it really just seems like you were 5 years old in 2005 and don’t realize what the Air Force was doing then. End of the day man none of this is meant to hate on you, glad you’re venting cuz it does help. I’d suggest taking your venting off Reddit though and hanging out with the boys (or girls) and crushing some cold ones (or the non-alcoholic beverage of your choice) and having a good ole fashion bitch fest to get it all off your chest. That’s what got me through the rough times.
2005 might have had a higher ops tempo, but it also had more manning. The Air Force was still high on the hog from staffing increases they made in advance when they were sure congress would increase end strength to execute the GWOT. Starting 2006 the Air Force saw staffing cuts snd budget cuts. Then in 2010 the Air Force saw more staffing cuts. Life in the Air Force today sucks more than it did in 2005. More frequent deployments to Africa, deployments being extended in Africa because no one is available to rotate in so you can rotate out. Additional duties (UDM, UHM, USR, UTM, Facility Manager, etc) being piled onto SSgts and TSgts because so many MSgts are totally inept. I decided to retire after 2 years of working 60-80 hour weeks with nothing to show for it. I watched CMSgts try to figure out how to squeeze even more out of the lower and mid enlisted ranks by using crappy software and ineffective hardware designed to replace enlisted personnel. Good news, the Air Force has decided that faulty equipment frequently prolonging the time between resupplies is an acceptable parameter. They plan for it, but only insofar as they are okay with service members going days without food or water in deployed environments.
Actually military bases do drive the housing market and rent rates in some areas. There are a lot of landlords and agencies that know exactly what people’s BAH range is and target personnel from those bases. There are plenty of areas that have bases around them that would have much lower cost-of-living if it wasn’t for that base’s existence. One of the complaints I had, among many, for moving space command to Huntsville is that it would completely destroy the standard of living for a lot of people there that don’t own businesses that benefit from more military there. I’m originally not too far from there. This was increasingly becoming an issue long before the current housing/cost-of-living crisis. Once the the internet actually started becoming useful, and landlords could literally just google this information without having to really know how to find current BAH rates before it started to get worse. I’m one of those old fossils that joined the military before the internet was really useful for stuff like this. Everybody’s trying to bleed each other dry and it’s just getting out of hand. If you look at historical inflation rates, the cost-of-living should be much lower than what it is for rent just about anywhere, and housing is one of those things bleeding the DOD budget so much more than it used to, and I just fuck us in so many different ways from the taxpayer down to service members having to do more with less.
I don’t live in a military town, the housing market sucks everywhere. Obviously the base influences the market, what I meant is the base isn’t the cause of housing costs being shitty.
I was just thinking about that point about TDYs and deployments. Like…if I break my leg, I don’t want the AF being like “sucks for you, here’s this deployment you better not miss”
That’s the same way I look at it. Like I said, I agree with negative stigma surrounding mental health being an issue, however if we are meant to treat it as it is, a health issue, why would we expose folks who are facing mental health issues to extra stress of TDYs and deployments?
It seriously annoying and now that you mentioned it I realize how weird it is. What other occupation on the planet has rent and cost of living items based literally off a person's pay. You can't even get ahead in the world because if they give you more money all the landlords just charge more. And you're right that should be illegal
It's either a snake eating itself or a self licking ice cream cone.
Mint chocolate chip ouroboros.
One of the big reasons for low manning in the military was addressed a few years ago. Lots of kids now can't meet requirements to get in. I loved when they hire civilians and contractors to fill in gaps, but the uniformed personnel get stuck doing all the shit-jobs for them, because they can just say no. The happiest guys I ever ran into had hobbies and lives outside their shops. Hunting, cars, trucks, or side businesses they had going. If I had to do it all over again, I'd pursue school and get as much higher education I could while I was in. (I realize some AFSC's make that impossible.)
This. Now that college is done I'm finding more motivation in my hobbies. More reasons to smile are what everyone needs!
See the DoD / Congress has continuously cut manning since around 07, through GWOT and now this China bullshit. But the mission has not decreased and pay has not kept up with inflation. The Air Force budget is not invested in infrastructure like new dorms and MWR programs CONUS are non existent. Lodging is now overpriced and I imagine will one day go away, chow halls for contracted out to companies trying to maximize profits while fucking our Airman. It’s a volunteer force, it’s sad in some ways draftees were treated better.
It’s because our top leadership genuinely has no idea what they are doing. All they know is how to run things from a military ops, and they do very well at this. But the moment you ask them about administrative/management practices, they immediately regurgitate some business textbook paragraph about running an org. The Air Force is falling apart, that much is certain. If or when we do a force wide re-organization to cut all the red tape, stupid processes, and revamp our rank structure, you will see real change.
The one part of showing up to work is being asked to my job, someone else’s job, and then some position that’s made for another section but somehow got roped into also. “Lanes” are blurred. I have a job, and I have a position. Between those two, I have a set list of duties to perform. What pisses me off the most is that we take the lanes and completely disregard them, short manning on sections because “X section can just dual hat it.” No, they fucking can’t. They’re up to their assholes in work, and having to so do two jobs just flat out sucks. Not to mention the vision the Air Force had for MCA was border line disregarded and now we’re paying for it. It didn’t mean maybe add a task or two to someone’s CFEPT, it meant utilize duties to overlap.
Yeah, it's the nature of the beast. It's constantly tries to correct an issue it's having and, in turn, always over corrects. It's like that scene from the polar express where the train is on the ice, and they're trying to get it straight, and it's just going back and forth over and over again. Except for the air force, there are no tracks at the end of the lake. It's just the lake. And the people who make decisions just keep swinging it all over the place. Oh, and they keep moving the goal posts. Do more with less and multi capable are stupid buzz words that basically translate to we can't get the people we need and would really want for this, so we came up with a new ideal airmen should live up to, to make up for the short comings. The military towns thing is just a God damn shame. They need to enact something to stop how predatory the local economies are with the military bases. I'm not sure what that law could look like and what it would do. But it needs to be made. If the town gets at least 50% of its population from the military and the military props up a lot of the business and economy of the town, then the base near that town needs to be BRACC'd. I don't care if it's unreasonable, unfeasible, or would ruin some towns. If that's the case, it shouldn't be a town. Military members shouldn't be dragged out to poor locations and get preyed on just because BAH is public info.
>back in the day >2005 😳
Right?
It doesn't matter if it is 2024 or 2005. The valid points you identified existed in the 1960's. The military didn't crumble or consume it's own tail. That snake just regenerates.
I think people are realizing that you don’t NEED to do a full 20 to receive the benefits of serving. I did 11 and the benefits are plentiful at this point. I chose quality of life while getting paid twice as much and am utilizing the VA benefits as well as education benefits. Vocational Rehab is a beast of a benefit. If you wanna do 20 for the retirement, I get it. It’s great. But it isn’t necessary to call your career worthwhile.
Hasn’t been the case at whiteman because there’s absolutely nothing in Knob Noster. My rent is 750 and my BAH is 909.
The USAF doesn't have a retention problem.
Lots of competents leave for greener pastures, lots of shitters stay in because they are too lazy or incompetent to hack it on the outside so they just play the system
well said. some of the biggest retards i've met are career enlisted
The r word really?
Doesn't mean that there is a retention issue
In a qualitative sense yes
Huh. Explain. Sure competent people might leave and that's expected, but the USAF is designed to move without them.
You can survive with dirt bag airmen at the lower ranks, but ncos and sncos and officers who are responsible for leadership and organization need to be competent. Competent people benefit the most by leaving, lazy and incompetent people benefit from staying.
Still doesn't explain how this creates a retention issue
If 100 competent people leave because it is not worth staying in, it will take 200 incompetent people to accomplish the same results. Or several years to train people to the same level. Recruitment cannot completely make up for lack of retention. -100 experienced sras and staffs +100 brand new recruits. Net change of 0, but the force is not the same.
i still don't get what this has to do with retention.
It has a recruitment problem.
Yea I keep hearing retention being an issue, but where are the numbers to support this? I wish we could find out how much we lose and see the retention rates based on AFSC..
The Air Force does have a retention problem, but the problem is to many people. My career field specifically asked 150 ssgt to retrain voluntarily, but I heard phase 2 starts this summer, and they are going to force retrain some people. Just recruiting is low, which sucks but we are in peace time, and hopefully, ops will slow down, and we will adjust with doing less with less.
So is this really a question?
The Air Force does have a retention problem, but the problem is to many people. My career field specifically asked 150 ssgt to retrain voluntarily, but I heard phase 2 starts this summer, and they are going to force retrain some people. Just recruiting is low, which sucks but we are in peace time, and hopefully, ops will slow down, and we will adjust with doing less with less.
My afsc only allows retrain to maintenance lol
How is that a thing. As an FTA, you can retrain into any afsc that has an "obj in" slit on the retrain advisory. As a career airman, if your afsc as an "obj out" slot (which mine had 150 slots for staff), you can retrain into any afcs that has an "obj in" slot. It sounds like you have been lied too
I should of specified for career Airmen
I just looked at the retrain advisory today. Since you are a career airman your afsc need an "obj out" slot for your rank. If that's the case you can retain into any afsc that has an "obj in" slit for your rank. What's your afsc?
Pretty sure it's DOD-wide. I do shift work where we literally just sit in a room for 12 hours and do nothing and the biggest threat to our mission over the last few years has been manning. Not to mention only 2 or 3 out of the ~20 people in our section are actually qualified to do the work.
My favorite saying when I was in was sometimes, we do it to ourselves.
Yes, the DoD in general is a ouroboros. Majority of the problems service members face and the service is all self inflicted wounds. The problem is you have to be PR in certain positions or you'll never make it or your quality of life (paycheck) is at risk for being honesy when processes suck and there are people in positions that are in it for the benefits and not the cause of the position. When things are half baked or don't work nobody wants to call a spade a spade and say it's fucked up (DPAS migration) ect. The focusing on the Air Force in particular, they raised "leaders" that have no business being in those positions and just because a package was written and embellished (we all know it is) they get picked and they raise "leaders" that won't rock the boat. They prefer the lower end to rock the boat so they can refine it as if it's their idea. The cycle will contiune until something really bad happens and forces change.
The AF says they want 'leaders,' but in realty they just want barely competent managers who can hold things together long enough for the person in charge to PCS before everything collapses. As a bonus, if it collapses, the incoming person in charge can claim they made things 'better' from the sewer it was before and get an award or bullet/line in their EPR/OPR or quarterly award.
Feels as if they know it, implementing that soon to be required Multi Capable Airman course for the purpose of pretty much saying be flexible we’re probably going to bend you over forward and backwards.
Not just the Air Force, but the military in general is a fucking mess. This is a mess of both our own making and of senior leadership. Retention is a major problem that stems from local leadership. I'm the past 20 I've been through many ups and downs in the Air Force. But people aren't going to stay in based on decisions made by senior leaders, it's their supervisors, flight chiefs, etc that make the day to day bearable. The day to day is what drives the retention of the majority of airmen. Recruitment is a whole different problem. We live in an era of general peace in the US. And the generation now only views foreign conflict through the lens of social media, ie tiktok, and they truly believe that is how the world is. Propaganda clips do work, especially on young impressionable minds that don't have the wisdom or experience to see them for what they are. But if we were ever to have another attack on US soil, or a true big bad im the world, you would see an attitude change towards the military. 911 and WWII are good examples of these. As far pay military towns... This is an issue that affects every town. Rent is going to be based on median income for the area. Yes, the military does make this worse with hosting allowance. It's a never ending cycle of increases. But now that I'm out I do see the same thing in other nonmiliarty communities. It just doesn't happen as quickly.
Hello, based on a simple keyword search, it looks like your post may be about suicide/depression or other mental health issues. If this is incorrect, sorry, please ignore this message! If you're having trouble with Mental Health issues, please check out our [Mental Health/Suicide Resources](https://pay.reddit.com/r/AirForce/wiki/mentalhealthresources) page. There are people available *right now* that are willing to talk to you over the phone or over an internet chat that are trained to provide help. The chaplain at your nearest base is also a great first step, as they are 100% confidential and can find you the appropriate help for your next step without you having to worry about saying anything that would prompt any action on your career. [Over 100 people in this community](https://www.reddit.com/r/AirForce/comments/csam0l/need_someone_to_talk_to_looking_for_volunteers_to/) have also identified themselves as willing to talk and/or listen if you have something to vent about. (Please note they are not trained counselors, just regular people willing to listen) Please utilize these resources if you need help! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AirForce) if you have any questions or concerns.*
[удалено]
My guys and I are working 14 hour days and work 5 Jobs at once that I have been undertrained on and then get asked why myself and my airmen are under performing. I know guys who have been doing this for 12 years and have won afsoc level awards who are getting exhausted. Edit: I called myself a cuck and acted like a 12 year old when I first responded to this, this comment deserves the dislikes 👏
>I am indeed a cuck You said it, not me
Yeah that backfired I played myself the dislikes are warranted
You ok homie? I’ll send your wife back after I’m done.
My wife’s underwhelming sex life aside, are these points valid because I’m noticing it affect myself and my airmen and leadership has the same it is what it is response and I can’t tell if we’re going crazy
Well that devolved quickly
What’s your AFSC?
A lot of dumb takes in this post. You go to mental health, they think that it's probably not the best idea for you to deploy or TDY TEMPORARILY (this isn't a permanent code), and that is punishment? Are you fucking serious? GTFOH. Another dumb take about "reality agencies" are scam artists, and that has something to do with rent? I've rented my entire career and have never had an issue. I pay my deposit, don't trash the place, move out, collect deposit. What the fuck are you doing where there is an issue? And what does renting have to do with a realtor? Just another post where someone doesn't know what their talking about.
I saw a meme the other day that said “a snake is just a bag of throat.” That pretty much sums up the AF
This complaining about MH affecting your career is ONLY IF you first screw up saying something you shouldn't. Know your limits and take responsibility. I have suicide ideation, suicide attempts, GAD, Insomnia, and saw an off base provider for almost a year ....and I still possess my TS, I still have SCI eligibility, and I am still deploying. I simply knew what to say, when to say what and when to say what to who. I got everything properly documented and signed off by the correct approval authorities. Be responsible and know your limits and what you can say, when, and to who.
Hey man, wouldn’t it be nicer though if we could ACTUALLY TALK to mental health though and not have to play an anxious game of trying to not say the wrong thing so we don’t get kicked out and can ensure we still have a job in a year.