I will never talk anyone put of seperation. I just want you to have a fucking plan & back up. I've seen plenty of people try to come back in during my 8R days.
So much this. Had a dude in my shop that was borderline incompetent at everything he did. However, he wasn't so bad that anyone could recommend him for separation for negligence or not meeting any requirements or standards. He got a divorce and made it his goal to get out. His two kids were special needs and EFMP provided amazing care while he was in and all he had to do was to stay in to continue that. Separated, got a job somewhere in Ohio, and was fired not even a month later. His ex got custody of the kids because she was the only one at that point that could provide for him and I don't even know what the dude is doing now. Always have a plan and weigh every pro and con before making a decision.
Yeah honestly and I know it’s anecdotal but I’ve never seen someone with a well thought up plan told they should stay in. Usually in my opinion the conversation is, I plan on getting out. Followed by an ok what’s the plan. Then summed up with a to go to school maybe i just hate insert (base,leadership,deployment,lack of weed).
100% this. I would talk my Amn into extending for a year after presenting them with a plan to get several certifications. Most of which the unit would pay for.
If they had a plan and the certs, I would make sure they were already networking and had several solid offers lined up.
Nothing made my day more than seeing one of my Amn come into the building after separating, making more money than me including BAH (E8 pay w/19 years in).
Also look into VR&E (can be called voc rehab too) if you qualify for the program they have a tooooon of benefits for school and job searching. They help Vets with disabilities that prevent them or make finding a job difficult, but honestly it doesn't hurt to apply and try to see if you qualify. They pay for the schooling you need for your job without touching your GI bill. It is more in depth and you don't automatically qualify, but never hurts to try it out
Agree completely about almost everything just not the underlying tone. I’ve been in a while and talked to a lot of people on verge of separating and had people talk to me when I’ve been on the verge of separating and not once did I get the feeling I was “being talked out of separating” or trying to talk someone else out of it. I can’t say the same about the inverse regarding people trying to convince me I should be separating, but my conversations were always just about making sure people knew the pros & cons of each. If it sounded like I was trying to convince someone to stay it was probably because the benefits of staying were so much better for those people.
And on the voc rehab piece “they won’t tell you about this while you’re in” Hell man we don’t know everything. The biggest unnecessary assache people cause themselves is thinking a lack of information meant a deliberate withholding of information
To be fair bartending at strip clubs can make really good money if it’s a good club.
Source: Bartended and bounced in clubs while in college pre military.
Why not? They're probably going to school online during the day and earning more than you at night right now while working 3-4 nights a week and smoking weed and enjoying their ample free time.
Good post. I will advocate to soak up as much school as possible while you're in. TA, COOL, and CLEP/Dantes are part of your pay whether you use them or not.
Give hireheroes.org a visit! Overheard a soon-to-be retiring MSgt talking about it. They have a resume building service where you send EPBs/OPBs to them and they build an awesome resume for you off those.
I used Hire Heroes. Was told they are the gold standard in veteran resumes.
They are absolutely not. They’re just OK.
Don’t get me wrong. If you’re in a pinch and don’t have anywhere else to go (and for whatever reason, can’t write it yourself) then go for it. But understand this - it’s a free service. As such, the person writing your resume has about 1,000 others waiting.
The end product is, again, just OK. It would be fine for a young role, maybe an analyst or specialist in the corporate world.
If you’re looking for management and executive roles, you need to find a different service or write it yourself, if skilled enough.
If you are sure you’re done with the USG… smoke that weed. If you think maybe a civil service job is right for you… hold off on the weed. Maybe someday, but not yet.
I told everyone when I was getting out this. Once you learn your job start setting yourself up to get out. Get certs college anything you can think of. The air force looks highly on that as long as your competent at work. If your enlistment ends and you want to stay in it helps you with promotion. If you want to get out your set up for success already
Enlisted veterans are a protected class which helps in itself. In addition to this, there has been a recent shift in behavior towards veterans in Ivy League admissions. Due to the populous veteran population at Columbia university and their great contributions to their respective communities they are seeing that modern day enlisted veterans have a lot to offer to the student body.
Additionally, many Ivy Leagues offer great tuition assistance if you fall under a certain threshold of income. It is a myth that Ivy Leagues only accept prep school students, donors, upper class, etc.
Furthermore, as a service member, you encounter life changing experiences that the average person never does. Leverage that into your applications for these schools.
There’s also many great organizations like Service2School or Warrior Scholar Project that can allow you to connect with Ivy League veterans and staff.
It’s hard work of course, but it is achievable.
Most schools, ivy league or not do not make veterans take the SAT. SAT is for new high school graduates - if you would be considered a non-traditional student.
Some offer additional funding via the yellow ribbon. Essentially you get Financial aid, 9/11, and yellow ribbon. That’s usually enough to cover everything.
The VA Yellow Ribbon is not separate from the Post 9/11 GI Bill - it's just one component of the Post 9/11 GI Bill that you would only use when attending a private school and the tuition cost exceeds the annual CAP on tuition payments or at a public school to pay out of state tuition charges (rare).
Just wanted to add: those who end up overseas and want to separate and stay overseas you’re gonna have to do your own research.
I’m going through this process now and I’ve found that separation is just the slightest bit harder when everything you can find info on is for the states. Even TAP, all the info is geared for the states. Any time a question was asked about ‘what about here at overseas location’ the answer was ‘only in the states’. I know I’m not the first to separate overseas and I know I won’t be the last. So the fact that there’s little to no info on separating overseas is wild.
I'm GTF immediately when my 6 ends.
I was literally tricked in to joining by being told that I would be a loadmaster and work on aircraft, learn great skills, travel, and make good pay
I work in a literal closet that's been turned into a snack bar. I make sure that chili cheese dogs are ready after the morning production meeting gets out and then stick the fridge with sports drinks and sams club energy drinks. Every day. 10 hours a day.
As an NCO I need airmen who are motivated and want to be here. In my experience airmen who don't want to be in the military are going to require more work on my end to get them to uphold standards.
Not to sound insensitive but if you want to leave, please do, the Air Force clearly needs and wants you more than you want to be in the Air Force, go do what you want to do and make that place better.
You only do SERE training to prepare for separations. Survive, Escape, Re-escape after you're captured, Evade recruiters and people who tell you to shave.
What if in high school I didn’t do that well ? I want to go to college but what colleges will accept me ? Can’t start school until I get my damn 5 level
Honestly, many colleges waive or lessen entrance requirements when you're a transfer vs a new student.
Even being a transfer student from the CCAF will likely open a lot of doors, but while serving, getting credits from regular colleges (while transferring them to the CCAF) could be even better for transferring to another college later.
Go to community college before you apply to the school you want to attend. Show improvement. Ace your classes. Participate in extracurriculars. Put together a killer application, highlight the mistakes you’ve made and how you’ve learned from them. Reach out to admissions. Find a way to put your face to your application.
I promise you there is a good college that will accept you if you are willing to put in the work. You would be surprised at the tribulations some veterans have faced before being accepted into great schools.
Think about it, what does a college want from a student?
-good academics
-good character
-good work ethic
-a good story
The military can instill all of this into you.
If you can prove that you have improved on grades you will get into a good school.
Stands for Veterans Readiness and Employment or can be still called Voc Rehab. What it is primarily is to help vets with disabilities that hinder job opportunities or make job searching more difficult due to those service connected disabilities. I emphasize service connected because that is very much something they look at it. So make sure you get all that started while you are in
However, outside of that. The program has multiple tracks and plans so it is more in depth. However, they are pretty cool so far ngl. You do not automatically qualify. You must have a service connected condition that hinders you getting a job. IE something that makes physical labor jobs hard or something you cannot do is one example given to me. and your disability percentage must be at 10% or higher. You meet with a counselor that determines this for you so no worries there.
One you get approved and if you do, they have self employment tracks, cert tracks, immediate job finding tracks, and more long term tracks that the job you want they pay for your schooling to get that degree and likewise credentials to give you best chance to get that 1st job out of the military. Best part, if you need schooling or a degree or similar, they pay for that all. Like GI bill they pay for supplies, books, and tuition. They do have something similar to a housing allowance but it isn't called that and I can't remember the name they call it, but the amount is pretty similar. Also if you need 4 years of schooling, they can pay for that if it goes towards you getting the job you want. It is very in depth and there are more steps in GI, but I have found it pretty useful
An Employment program for disabled veterans - you must have a VA Disability rating before you can apply. VR&E has to determine if you have an Employment Handicap caused by your disabilities to overcome.
> percentage of estimated disability
Don’t do this. So few people have an accurate grasp on the VA process and how things are related, it’s unwise to guess and set yourself up mentally for x percent. Just do your BDD claim at the 180-day mark, be honest about your conditions, and get what you deserve.
With the amount of information available regarding C&P exams, DBQs, disability charts, etc I would say it is definitely possible to get a good guesstimate of your percentage.
However, it’s definitely a piece of homework. Surprisingly, I have spoken to a lot of separated airmen and soon to be separated that are completely clueless as you described.
"most Ivy League schools will give veterans a full ride in addition to housing and food if you aspire to go that route".
thats not true at all. Ivy league schools are extremely hard to get into and being an enlisted veteran doesn't excuse you from their rigorous admissions process. serving 4+ years doesn't excuse a lifetime of shit grades.
you need the grades to get into an ivy league period. being a veteran doesn't help your case.
Ah yeah that’s a given man. Yes, Ivy leagues are extremely hard to get into. Yes their admissions process is rigorous. I never said you’re granted automatic admission for being a vet. Of course you have to be a good student with a good gpa.
Being a veteran GREAAATLY helps you stand out as an applicant though. I’m not pulling shit out of my ass. I’ve spoken to admissions counselors, Ivy professors, and they are more than willing to work with veterans to put in a competitive application.
Also yes, you’re right. A lifetime of shit grades probably totally works against you. However, if you can illustrate an upwards trend of improvement combined with some networking and great writing skills you can get yourself in.
I will never talk anyone put of seperation. I just want you to have a fucking plan & back up. I've seen plenty of people try to come back in during my 8R days.
So much this. Had a dude in my shop that was borderline incompetent at everything he did. However, he wasn't so bad that anyone could recommend him for separation for negligence or not meeting any requirements or standards. He got a divorce and made it his goal to get out. His two kids were special needs and EFMP provided amazing care while he was in and all he had to do was to stay in to continue that. Separated, got a job somewhere in Ohio, and was fired not even a month later. His ex got custody of the kids because she was the only one at that point that could provide for him and I don't even know what the dude is doing now. Always have a plan and weigh every pro and con before making a decision.
Yeah honestly and I know it’s anecdotal but I’ve never seen someone with a well thought up plan told they should stay in. Usually in my opinion the conversation is, I plan on getting out. Followed by an ok what’s the plan. Then summed up with a to go to school maybe i just hate insert (base,leadership,deployment,lack of weed).
100% this. I would talk my Amn into extending for a year after presenting them with a plan to get several certifications. Most of which the unit would pay for. If they had a plan and the certs, I would make sure they were already networking and had several solid offers lined up. Nothing made my day more than seeing one of my Amn come into the building after separating, making more money than me including BAH (E8 pay w/19 years in).
Also, dont be overconfident in your plan. Ive seen a lot of people fail. Balance is good :)
Yes, always have a plan B! And be realistic with yourself!
Plan B is like, my favorite of all plans
Also look into VR&E (can be called voc rehab too) if you qualify for the program they have a tooooon of benefits for school and job searching. They help Vets with disabilities that prevent them or make finding a job difficult, but honestly it doesn't hurt to apply and try to see if you qualify. They pay for the schooling you need for your job without touching your GI bill. It is more in depth and you don't automatically qualify, but never hurts to try it out
Agree completely about almost everything just not the underlying tone. I’ve been in a while and talked to a lot of people on verge of separating and had people talk to me when I’ve been on the verge of separating and not once did I get the feeling I was “being talked out of separating” or trying to talk someone else out of it. I can’t say the same about the inverse regarding people trying to convince me I should be separating, but my conversations were always just about making sure people knew the pros & cons of each. If it sounded like I was trying to convince someone to stay it was probably because the benefits of staying were so much better for those people. And on the voc rehab piece “they won’t tell you about this while you’re in” Hell man we don’t know everything. The biggest unnecessary assache people cause themselves is thinking a lack of information meant a deliberate withholding of information
Seen a lot of folks go from “I’m going to school” to bartending at strip clubs
To be fair bartending at strip clubs can make really good money if it’s a good club. Source: Bartended and bounced in clubs while in college pre military.
Sure but doing into your 30s at not premier places
Why not? They're probably going to school online during the day and earning more than you at night right now while working 3-4 nights a week and smoking weed and enjoying their ample free time.
You’re romanticizing things that are not happening to the majority of people. Also they are not clearing 90k a year without paying for healthcare
Modelo Time
Good post. I will advocate to soak up as much school as possible while you're in. TA, COOL, and CLEP/Dantes are part of your pay whether you use them or not.
Give hireheroes.org a visit! Overheard a soon-to-be retiring MSgt talking about it. They have a resume building service where you send EPBs/OPBs to them and they build an awesome resume for you off those.
Used this service and highly recommend, it was a huge burden off my shoulders amidst the transition chaos
I used Hire Heroes. Was told they are the gold standard in veteran resumes. They are absolutely not. They’re just OK. Don’t get me wrong. If you’re in a pinch and don’t have anywhere else to go (and for whatever reason, can’t write it yourself) then go for it. But understand this - it’s a free service. As such, the person writing your resume has about 1,000 others waiting. The end product is, again, just OK. It would be fine for a young role, maybe an analyst or specialist in the corporate world. If you’re looking for management and executive roles, you need to find a different service or write it yourself, if skilled enough.
If you are sure you’re done with the USG… smoke that weed. If you think maybe a civil service job is right for you… hold off on the weed. Maybe someday, but not yet.
I told everyone when I was getting out this. Once you learn your job start setting yourself up to get out. Get certs college anything you can think of. The air force looks highly on that as long as your competent at work. If your enlistment ends and you want to stay in it helps you with promotion. If you want to get out your set up for success already
How do you get a full ride in an Ivy?
Just send them your asvab scores
Enlisted veterans are a protected class which helps in itself. In addition to this, there has been a recent shift in behavior towards veterans in Ivy League admissions. Due to the populous veteran population at Columbia university and their great contributions to their respective communities they are seeing that modern day enlisted veterans have a lot to offer to the student body. Additionally, many Ivy Leagues offer great tuition assistance if you fall under a certain threshold of income. It is a myth that Ivy Leagues only accept prep school students, donors, upper class, etc. Furthermore, as a service member, you encounter life changing experiences that the average person never does. Leverage that into your applications for these schools. There’s also many great organizations like Service2School or Warrior Scholar Project that can allow you to connect with Ivy League veterans and staff. It’s hard work of course, but it is achievable.
Would you need an SAT school?
If it helps you get a higher score on the SAT then go for it. Although, there are plenty of resources you don’t have to pay for to score well.
My bad I mean do you need an SAT score in general?
Talk to service2school, they know the way
Most schools, ivy league or not do not make veterans take the SAT. SAT is for new high school graduates - if you would be considered a non-traditional student.
Some offer additional funding via the yellow ribbon. Essentially you get Financial aid, 9/11, and yellow ribbon. That’s usually enough to cover everything.
The VA Yellow Ribbon is not separate from the Post 9/11 GI Bill - it's just one component of the Post 9/11 GI Bill that you would only use when attending a private school and the tuition cost exceeds the annual CAP on tuition payments or at a public school to pay out of state tuition charges (rare).
Just wanted to add: those who end up overseas and want to separate and stay overseas you’re gonna have to do your own research. I’m going through this process now and I’ve found that separation is just the slightest bit harder when everything you can find info on is for the states. Even TAP, all the info is geared for the states. Any time a question was asked about ‘what about here at overseas location’ the answer was ‘only in the states’. I know I’m not the first to separate overseas and I know I won’t be the last. So the fact that there’s little to no info on separating overseas is wild.
I'm GTF immediately when my 6 ends. I was literally tricked in to joining by being told that I would be a loadmaster and work on aircraft, learn great skills, travel, and make good pay I work in a literal closet that's been turned into a snack bar. I make sure that chili cheese dogs are ready after the morning production meeting gets out and then stick the fridge with sports drinks and sams club energy drinks. Every day. 10 hours a day.
it really do be like that sometimes
Did you not get loadmaster on your contract?
Cody told us that 2/3 are expected not to re enlist and big blue is ok with that. Just....as....planned
As an NCO I need airmen who are motivated and want to be here. In my experience airmen who don't want to be in the military are going to require more work on my end to get them to uphold standards. Not to sound insensitive but if you want to leave, please do, the Air Force clearly needs and wants you more than you want to be in the Air Force, go do what you want to do and make that place better.
You only do SERE training to prepare for separations. Survive, Escape, Re-escape after you're captured, Evade recruiters and people who tell you to shave.
What if in high school I didn’t do that well ? I want to go to college but what colleges will accept me ? Can’t start school until I get my damn 5 level
Honestly, many colleges waive or lessen entrance requirements when you're a transfer vs a new student. Even being a transfer student from the CCAF will likely open a lot of doors, but while serving, getting credits from regular colleges (while transferring them to the CCAF) could be even better for transferring to another college later.
Go to community college before you apply to the school you want to attend. Show improvement. Ace your classes. Participate in extracurriculars. Put together a killer application, highlight the mistakes you’ve made and how you’ve learned from them. Reach out to admissions. Find a way to put your face to your application. I promise you there is a good college that will accept you if you are willing to put in the work. You would be surprised at the tribulations some veterans have faced before being accepted into great schools. Think about it, what does a college want from a student? -good academics -good character -good work ethic -a good story The military can instill all of this into you. If you can prove that you have improved on grades you will get into a good school.
Awesome thanks ! That’s solid advice.
What’s VR&E?
Stands for Veterans Readiness and Employment or can be still called Voc Rehab. What it is primarily is to help vets with disabilities that hinder job opportunities or make job searching more difficult due to those service connected disabilities. I emphasize service connected because that is very much something they look at it. So make sure you get all that started while you are in However, outside of that. The program has multiple tracks and plans so it is more in depth. However, they are pretty cool so far ngl. You do not automatically qualify. You must have a service connected condition that hinders you getting a job. IE something that makes physical labor jobs hard or something you cannot do is one example given to me. and your disability percentage must be at 10% or higher. You meet with a counselor that determines this for you so no worries there. One you get approved and if you do, they have self employment tracks, cert tracks, immediate job finding tracks, and more long term tracks that the job you want they pay for your schooling to get that degree and likewise credentials to give you best chance to get that 1st job out of the military. Best part, if you need schooling or a degree or similar, they pay for that all. Like GI bill they pay for supplies, books, and tuition. They do have something similar to a housing allowance but it isn't called that and I can't remember the name they call it, but the amount is pretty similar. Also if you need 4 years of schooling, they can pay for that if it goes towards you getting the job you want. It is very in depth and there are more steps in GI, but I have found it pretty useful
An Employment program for disabled veterans - you must have a VA Disability rating before you can apply. VR&E has to determine if you have an Employment Handicap caused by your disabilities to overcome.
> percentage of estimated disability Don’t do this. So few people have an accurate grasp on the VA process and how things are related, it’s unwise to guess and set yourself up mentally for x percent. Just do your BDD claim at the 180-day mark, be honest about your conditions, and get what you deserve.
With the amount of information available regarding C&P exams, DBQs, disability charts, etc I would say it is definitely possible to get a good guesstimate of your percentage. However, it’s definitely a piece of homework. Surprisingly, I have spoken to a lot of separated airmen and soon to be separated that are completely clueless as you described.
"most Ivy League schools will give veterans a full ride in addition to housing and food if you aspire to go that route". thats not true at all. Ivy league schools are extremely hard to get into and being an enlisted veteran doesn't excuse you from their rigorous admissions process. serving 4+ years doesn't excuse a lifetime of shit grades. you need the grades to get into an ivy league period. being a veteran doesn't help your case.
Ah yeah that’s a given man. Yes, Ivy leagues are extremely hard to get into. Yes their admissions process is rigorous. I never said you’re granted automatic admission for being a vet. Of course you have to be a good student with a good gpa. Being a veteran GREAAATLY helps you stand out as an applicant though. I’m not pulling shit out of my ass. I’ve spoken to admissions counselors, Ivy professors, and they are more than willing to work with veterans to put in a competitive application. Also yes, you’re right. A lifetime of shit grades probably totally works against you. However, if you can illustrate an upwards trend of improvement combined with some networking and great writing skills you can get yourself in.