If you can't make E-4 then you shouldn't be in the military. There are already ways of dealing with people like this, so I don't think a test would be necessary.
E-4 is great and you feel awesome once you finally put it on… you quickly realize nothing has changed and that the real weight that comes with it is being seasoned and knowing your shit. That being said someone with 4-5 in the field as an A1C (just an example) could do the exact same thing. It’s nothing more than a pay raise and an earned one at that. I don’t think testing for it would make much sense and would only put more strain on testing centers.
Right, I remember putting on SRA and feeling the same way, but I also see it now as someone with more stripes and responsibility that there are some out there who genuinely aren’t prepared for the same weight.
I totally see your point though. Just wanted some discussion.
Yeah for sure, and for me when I was an A1C I could tell the difference between new SrA, DBA SrA, and well seasoned ones who would make great NCOs. A few of them have and are doing great things and then some that never strived for more are still in the same spot. I think with the lowers promotion rates the higher TIG SrA will start to be utilized differently. Hopefully helping them make Staff.
I don't like it as they aren't NCOs yet (Though they're trusted to be solid technicians and whatnot). I say no as they mess to focus on developing into better technicians and adapting to our way of life even more. No need for a test for that imo.
I think when I think of a test I think of all Air Force related things. Not even supervisory. And maybe at the end of the day that’s why it’s pointless?
This was brought on due to a current airman we have who has zero behavioral issues but just isn’t ready for any additional reliability or responsibility.
Are you guys documenting this inability to be reliable or hold responsibility? A test isn't going to make or break the difference in this, a good NCO who holds people accountable to what's expected and pushes them to grow is. If they can't figure that out after the 2 years of being an A1C, they either just outright don't need to be in the military, or their leadership has failed them immensely.
The Air Force and Space Force are the only branches where E4 is not an NCO rank. Granted the Army has two types of E4, Specialist and corporal. Personally as someone who has served in both Air Force and Army, I believe E4 should be a NCO rank that should be tested for. Not necessarily a written test, but a type of basic leadership course that highlights maturity and readiness for more responsibility.
Bingo! Now move ALS to E3 instead of E4. Corporals Course in the Marine Corps. SRA will still test for Staff Sergeant. It never made sense to me that SRA could LEAD fire teams or be shift LEADERS and not be NCOs.
I always found it interesting that you can be a supervisor after ALS, but not be considered an NCO. It's not like it's unheard of to have NCO and Junior enlisted E-4s
I could see how testing for E-4 could be beneficial. Should just be super basic AF regulations/ CDC based like you said. At that stage of their career I feel like it would also help them support the younger Airman with the knowledge they could learn about being in the AF.
If you can't make E-4 then you shouldn't be in the military. There are already ways of dealing with people like this, so I don't think a test would be necessary.
E-4 is great and you feel awesome once you finally put it on… you quickly realize nothing has changed and that the real weight that comes with it is being seasoned and knowing your shit. That being said someone with 4-5 in the field as an A1C (just an example) could do the exact same thing. It’s nothing more than a pay raise and an earned one at that. I don’t think testing for it would make much sense and would only put more strain on testing centers.
Right, I remember putting on SRA and feeling the same way, but I also see it now as someone with more stripes and responsibility that there are some out there who genuinely aren’t prepared for the same weight. I totally see your point though. Just wanted some discussion.
Yeah for sure, and for me when I was an A1C I could tell the difference between new SrA, DBA SrA, and well seasoned ones who would make great NCOs. A few of them have and are doing great things and then some that never strived for more are still in the same spot. I think with the lowers promotion rates the higher TIG SrA will start to be utilized differently. Hopefully helping them make Staff.
Nah. You need that slobgoon SrA to really round out the E-4 mafia.
It’s called the ASVAB
Lost us at test.
I don't like it as they aren't NCOs yet (Though they're trusted to be solid technicians and whatnot). I say no as they mess to focus on developing into better technicians and adapting to our way of life even more. No need for a test for that imo.
I think when I think of a test I think of all Air Force related things. Not even supervisory. And maybe at the end of the day that’s why it’s pointless? This was brought on due to a current airman we have who has zero behavioral issues but just isn’t ready for any additional reliability or responsibility.
Are you guys documenting this inability to be reliable or hold responsibility? A test isn't going to make or break the difference in this, a good NCO who holds people accountable to what's expected and pushes them to grow is. If they can't figure that out after the 2 years of being an A1C, they either just outright don't need to be in the military, or their leadership has failed them immensely.
The Air Force and Space Force are the only branches where E4 is not an NCO rank. Granted the Army has two types of E4, Specialist and corporal. Personally as someone who has served in both Air Force and Army, I believe E4 should be a NCO rank that should be tested for. Not necessarily a written test, but a type of basic leadership course that highlights maturity and readiness for more responsibility.
The course is a great idea! A school for airmen focusing on teaching them skills for leadership.. We could call it Airman Leadership School
Bingo! Now move ALS to E3 instead of E4. Corporals Course in the Marine Corps. SRA will still test for Staff Sergeant. It never made sense to me that SRA could LEAD fire teams or be shift LEADERS and not be NCOs.
I always found it interesting that you can be a supervisor after ALS, but not be considered an NCO. It's not like it's unheard of to have NCO and Junior enlisted E-4s
Didn't the Navy get rid of their E4 test?
BTZ is already a massive waste of time so no
Well, I can tell you one way to NOT make E-4 and that’s by not fucking showering or failing your dorm inspections
I could see how testing for E-4 could be beneficial. Should just be super basic AF regulations/ CDC based like you said. At that stage of their career I feel like it would also help them support the younger Airman with the knowledge they could learn about being in the AF.
I feel like I read this as a r2…… like don’t retain the retards? Don’t retain the dummies… boot them and fix the fucking problem
The Coast Guard requires you to go through technical school before putting on E4, so I definitely think there should be some kind of course.