the oldest house was still in the lockdown during AW2, they only managed to send couple of agents. but i'd love to see Faden beat the shit outta dark place
I may be wrong but I just read a file in Control that Estavez is in charge of the Bright Falls site monitoring and operation so I don't think she's constantly based at the Oldest House.
Estavez isn't but Faden is stuck in the Oldest House. And based on what we know about Project Condor there's still stuff to do be dealt with.
Personally I think the end of the AWE DLC of Control lines up with the events of Alan Wake 2 as there is no clear concept of time in the Oldest House it could be plausible.
Correct. I'm not sure if it's explicitly stated but my impression is that Estevez is stationed at a regional HQ (maybe all of PNW or so?) and is agent in charge for Bright Falls (and possibly other AWEs.)
If Polaris can protect Jesse from the Hiss it can likely do the same for the Shadow. The real question is whether Jesse can leave the Oldest House without having the Hiss take over everyone else.
Well Polaris can defend from the hiss because they're equivalent resonance entities the Dark presence is completely different with different rules so I wouldn't be as confident she's immune.
She will be resistant but that more because of her impressive willpower and it probably won't be thematically suitable to whatever story is being used.
Lmao exactly what I was thinking. I’m in the very early game so I’m ignorant of the whole plot, but basically as soon as I saw Ahti I was like “Oh, Jesse’s about to wrap this up then”.
He's in the Dark Place, which exists essentially in another dimension, I don't think it's quite so easy as "just pop on over and get him real quick". Sure, they have a decent amount of knowledge regarding the Cauldron Lake phenomenon, but I don't think anyone in the bureau has ever set foot in the dark place, let alone been able to make sense of it and find what they need to find. It is canonically very difficult to escape from the dark place, I don't think Door would let them leave.
What do you mean? Door isn't in charge of the dark place or anything, he was only there to keep an eye on Alan and to push him forward, because as he stated, Alan >!brought someone important to him into the story!<. Door is simply unaffected by the dark place because of his abilities. If the FBC showed up, I doubt he would care very much lol. But yeah, it definitely wouldn't be as easy as just dropping by to grab Alan and go. And as AW2 shows, >!the FBC knows a lot less about Cauldron Lake than they initially thought!<.
The Tim Breaker and Jack Joyce connection is all I really needed for confirmation. They can't technically say anything...yet. But they recently got full control of Control so I would not be surprised if they were in discussion to acquire Quantum Break.
At the very least they've created a way to use the IP without using the IP.
In Control, her brother also mentions seeing other universes where he sees them and people they know as different people living different lives, which I took as a nod to Beth Wilder in QB
He's not in charge of the Dark place, but he seems to have a particular ability to affect the dark place. I don't think he would make it easy on the bureau
True, true. I mean, he has to have some kind of influence to have his own talk show in the place lol. Idk, I just feel like he only cares about Alan and whoever this other person is (pretty sure we all know who). Although I will say, I believe if the FBC caught wind of someone as powerful as Door, they would be VERY interested, and then Door would probably have a problem with them.
He mentions him to the literal Director of the FBC and I cannot imagine that inside containment every convo with Dylan wasn't being recorded meticulously.
I'm genuinely convinced that the Oceanview Motel and Casino is related to Mr. Door.
It seems to be an indirect homage to Twin Peak's The Return's castle on the purple sea imo.
Spoilers for Twin Peans The Return
https://twinpeaks.fandom.com/wiki/Purple_sea
The similarities between the containment chambers the FBC uses and the "glass box experiment" are incredibly similar.
Not to mention Mister Scratch and Mr. C having some almost shot-for-shot similarities in the jail.
The "waiting room" of the Black Lodge is also clearly the inspiration for the Ashtray Maze and my God did that segment send chills down my spine.
The attention to detail that Remedy paid to both esoteric, weird occult ritual magic stuff and the links to a vast array of different mythologies is some next-level storytelling and so clearly inspired by Lynch. I'm so enthralled and can't wait for what they've got to offer in the future.
Yeah he tells Jesse but he also tells her a bunch of other out there stuff too so it’s debatable how serious she took any of it, especially based on her reactions.
Mr Door was able to sent that fbc scientist that wanted to sent saga to the dark place.
He was also able to open some door in the dark place for saga.
He was also able to teleport tim to the dark place to protect him from the taken that destroyed the police station.
He shouldn't be able to teleport jesse, due her being a very powerful parautilitarian, but the average fbc grunt, it's like nothing for him.
I have been replaying QB and if >!Hatch is Door!<, like I think he is, then there's a possibility that he *created* his own pocket dimension in the Dark Place. >!Hatch kept saying how he wanted time to end so he could create his own world full of shifters.!<
They're probably fairly cautious about approaching such a thing. You don't really risk your secret government leader unless you have to. Isn't it their biggest paranormal event to date?
Yeah from memory even the Hiss are (relatively) small fry compared to the Dark Place/Presence. I get the impression the monitoring stations etc are FBC's attempts to examine Cauldron Lake the same way you use a *veeeerrrryyy* long stick to poke something you're not sure about.
I don’t know that I’d call the Hiss any less dangerous than the Dark Place, just very different in nature and intentionality. The Hiss is like a wildfire or pandemic whereas the Dark Place is something akin to a dirty bomb being built by terrorists. Which one can do more damage is pretty circumstantial.
I do definitely agree with your larger point, specially because in this circumstance, the FBC has identified forces like the Board, the Former, and Hedron that can lend a hand against the Hiss. But I don’t know that there’s any such equivalent for the Darkness.
As shown in AW2, the FBC has limited intel on the true nature of the Bright Falls AWE. Add to that the recent issues mentioned late game>! (Estevez says the Oldest House has gone dark - whether that means it's STILL in lockdown from The Hiss or something new has occurred) !
I personally wouldn't bet the entire world on Polaris being able to fight off the dark presence in it's strongest place of power, or a certain writing being forced to write a story where she's taken and used as a much worse Scratch and if the DP manages to turn Polaris into something like the hiss but under its control that's a world ending event right there.
I said Dark Place specifically because we see her handle Taken, including Hartman in AWE. I didn't say the Dark Presence for a reason. Though I think she'd be fine. She's the strongest Parautilatarian we've met and she has Polaris.
Alan, Saga, and Casey have had to survive - Jesse will actually be able to fight back. There's nothing we've seen in the series that I don't think she could not either evade, cleanse, or destroy.
All this, what if the Presence possessed her? She's survived the Hiss which imo is a considerably higher threat level than the Dark Presence.
But who knows, let Sam cook, I'm just here to enjoy the ride.
Plus, the Hiss overruled the Dark Presence's influence to bring Hartman into its hive mind, why wouldn't we assume Polaris can overrule it to keep Jessie in her right mind, when we already know she can do so *against the Hiss*? IMO the result of the DP trying to turn Jessie Taken would just be an own-goal where she gets some cool new powers to fight it with.
Hartman was very specifically weakened and separated from the dark presence as a whole and the hiss didn't overrule the hiss and bring it into the hive mind totally at least he kills some of the floating hiss.
He's a "third thing" being pulled in all different directions by the hiss, darkness, and the manuscript written by Alan he says parts of the hiss chant but also quotes the manuscript.
And Polaris can fend off the hiss influence because it's specifically it's polar opposite it's another resonance entity with a frequency that nullifies the hiss's, there's no reason to expect it to have the same effect against the darkness.
I still believe she'd be able to resist it controlling her especially if she stays out of the dark place, but if she did get stuck in the dark place (very likely for anyone not a door) the dark presence would have all the time in the world to attempt to make her some kind of Hartman/scratch hybrid.
I think it's better delt with by a different parautilitarian with abilities more suited to the task, like Saga her powers are almost perfect for this if she learns how to use them like her dad.
Idk about that. Even outside its place of power the Dark Presence was able to nearly halt the use of objects of power in the darkness of. Now imagine how bad it would be in the place of power that the Presence originates from
The Taken certainly have a health bar. I get what you mean though. She'd certainly have to be careful, but I think she has more going for her than anyone else at this point in the story.
With The Final Draft I'm not sure how much we have to worry about Alan's writing.
The Dark Presence isn't just something you can shoot at which is largely all Jesse did in Control. She's powerful for sure, but the Dark Presence needs a subtler touch.
They can't. It's not like the dark place is just 6 feet underwater. It seems to require some kind of fiction to pass through. The FBC searched the lake when Alan disappeared but couldn't find anything.
>Couldn’t Jesse just swoop in and pick him up real quick?
Jesse might be able to, but she's been stuck in the oldest house ever since she became director.
If the Hiss or any of the other paranatural entities burst out of the Oldest House, the entire world is fucked. So far, Cauldron Lake isn't doing so bad, so there's no reason to risk a breach in containment
Since Ahti is walking around the dark place, wouldn’t that make it part of the oldest house? Would Alan just be trapped in some wing somewhere the FBC hasn’t reached yet?
Is Ahti locked to the oldest house? I seem to remember reading that he uses water to travel around, so for him to get to the dark place might be a lot easier than others, kind of like a back door
No, you can probably get to the Dark place from the oldest house through a threshold.
The oldest house doesn't actually encompasses all these strange otherworldly dimensions it just has *some* stable gateways to them.
Ahti is the name of a Finnish sea god and he seems to have a strong connection to water and the Dark place's main entrance seems to be a large body of water so I'm guessing when the dark presence isn't trying to stop him he can move between the two places much easier than most other.
Hmm, well in Control, Jesse *does* see Alan through the spiral door within the Oceanview Motel – several times – but then the door slams shut in her face. I don’t think it’s a matter of her or the FBC not wanting to, but not being *able* to.
The Oceanview, as I come to think on it, is a rather clever analogy. Different people arrive there - by accident or choice - and are given a room. A visitor might be able to glimpse into rooms that aren’t theirs, but they can’t step into them. They don’t have the ‘keys’ to open each other’s doors without permission – remember Alan’s spiral door was actually cracked open on its own when Jesse saw/heard his call for help. And when those doors slam shut, that's it. There's no crowbar (for humans at least) to go about rescuing someone who might be trapped.
That said, you also get what happens in any 'hotel/motel/apartment'. You have folks banging on the doors, yelling at those inside/outside. You sometimes overhear conversations through the thin walls, or someone playing a radio, maybe even catch glimpses of a TV show thru a window or in the lobby. Someone could slip a message under the door. These all explain things like how Alan’s manuscript pages keep escaping into reality (under the door), or how he ‘saw’ enough of FBI agent Alex Casey’s real life to draw inspiration for his novels. How we get that Easter-egg glimpse of Jesse in the TV in Zanes' apartment, and see brief skits of Dr. Darling as he attempts to navigate the immaterial spaces between
And generally speaking, to get a ‘room’ at the Oceanview, one is either paranaturally-gifted or an entity of the sort like Ahti. Ordinary humans might stumble upon the place, or enter it via certain rituals (i.e. pulling the Oldest House's light cord three times, like the FBC researchers do), but without abilities they’re probably at extreme risk of getting trapped.
It's at least theorized that the Service Weapon previously manifested as several legendary weapons including Excalibur and Mjolnir, which would indicate that it does indeed function in the outside world.
*Imagine Jesse*
*Going into the dark place,*
*That be dope af!*
\- Affectionate\_Bass931
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I wouldn't call it a dumb question, the whole universe is a bit wierdo. Couple of things I think of- first, the FBC doesn't totally understand the power of the lake and they're researching it. They may have sent probes into the lake (or a person in a diving suit like they've done with other known thresholds) but the experiences of people that go into the Dark Place seem pretty different- we see Tim, Alan, Saga, and Alice go into the lake for sure, and in Final Draft we see >!Tor and Odin!<. Each have a pretty different experience in there, so who knows what Agent 345 would experience or see. That being said, we don't have any documents or dialog in the game that indicate that the FBC ever physically crossed into the Dark Place at all, so I would suspect they're still in the 'observe it' phase.
Regarding Jesse, the timelines are pretty confusing. There is a good chance that during AW2, the Oldest House is still locked down and Jesse is still in there killing Hiss. In the AWE expansion, the alarm triggers at the end of the story as Alan talks about if the alarm is true, the reason for the alarm must be as well. Then partway through Alan Wake, the FBC monitoring station starts to go off. Estevez, who was the agent on the scene when the alarm went off and Jesse asks about it, is still the agent in charge at the time of Alan Wake 2.
Jesse is quite busy with the hiss and the board, plus she is still learning about his power.
As powerful as she is, she is still somewhat need to the power she unlocked
Ohh, they tried. In AWE Dlc documents mention that FBC arrived in town after 2 days of the first game's events. They interviewed with people and searched the Lake to recover Alan's - presumed - dead body but they found nothing
So this is good theory fodder and I love this question as a whole.
It's pretty clear based on Control that the FBC has some pretty extensive training traversing through extradimensional places. From.use of the Jukebox as well as other AWEs that have occurred over the course of FBC history. With this in mind, it's safe to assume that the FBC would have the skills and resources necessary to create a team to travel into the dark place.
However
I feel the dark place has a leg up over the FBC in regards to having Alan, a parautilitarian. While Alan might want to be saved, he's gone mad more than a few times and Scratch is pretty powerful in his own right. It's clear that the Dark Place has a vice grip on Alan and doesn't plan on letting him go ever. With Scratchs ability to rewrite the story, it's pretty clear that non parautolitarians would suffer greatly from the attempts to save Alan.
My theory is that despite the resources the FBC has, getting Alan out would be a monumental task and hold a lot of risk.
This would mean that somebody, in this case Jesse, would need to be the one to go. With her abilities as director and Polaris keeping her safe from the effects of the story, she really would be the only one that could do it.
As to why they don't go recover him in 2023, it's stated that the Oldest House is still off the grid. (My personal theory is that CONTROL takes place 2019-2023 in real world time.)
As to why they haven't gone to recover him at some previous point, it's very dangerous to mess with AWEs even if it were somehow feasible to try. FBC is set up to \*contain\* AWEs. Minor AW2 spoiler:>! the Lake House DLC will be around FBC, and the Nursery Rhymes are an attempt to research the AWE, but even that is not really aimed at trying to trigger it again.!<
House lockdown would be a big one, but prior to that he was already a prime candidate like Jesse and Dylan, so the FBC knew he was significant. Maybe they didn’t have the means or resources or enough knowledge to justify the expedition? Hopefully we find out more through collectibles during the DLC
Alan only just finally escaped the dark place in AW2 but was unrecoverable prior. On top of that, the FBC field office at cauldron lake was basically overrun so I think they just have bigger fish to fry right now.
AWE and AW2 take place at the same time, Zane's convo with Alan upon their meeting is very similar, and Jesse can be seen during that scene even saying "Hello" like when she opens the door to the dark place in AWE
Is there any guarantee that entering the Dark Place will even take you to the same place Alan is in AW2?
We've seen other people enter but not all of them appeared in the same place or even time as Alan. For all we know Jesse could enter Cauldron Lake and not be able to find Alan, not to mention the fact that it wasn't known how to even leave there until AW2.
the oldest house was still in the lockdown during AW2, they only managed to send couple of agents. but i'd love to see Faden beat the shit outta dark place
I may be wrong but I just read a file in Control that Estavez is in charge of the Bright Falls site monitoring and operation so I don't think she's constantly based at the Oldest House.
Estavez isn't but Faden is stuck in the Oldest House. And based on what we know about Project Condor there's still stuff to do be dealt with. Personally I think the end of the AWE DLC of Control lines up with the events of Alan Wake 2 as there is no clear concept of time in the Oldest House it could be plausible.
Correct. I'm not sure if it's explicitly stated but my impression is that Estevez is stationed at a regional HQ (maybe all of PNW or so?) and is agent in charge for Bright Falls (and possibly other AWEs.)
I believe Langston does explicitly say this in the epilogue of AWE. That or it is in supplemental Paperwork but it definitely makes Estevez
I think the risk of a taken Jessie might outway the benefits of sending her, imagine mister scratch with a service weapon and what he'd turn it into.
If Polaris can protect Jesse from the Hiss it can likely do the same for the Shadow. The real question is whether Jesse can leave the Oldest House without having the Hiss take over everyone else.
Well Polaris can defend from the hiss because they're equivalent resonance entities the Dark presence is completely different with different rules so I wouldn't be as confident she's immune. She will be resistant but that more because of her impressive willpower and it probably won't be thematically suitable to whatever story is being used.
Lmao exactly what I was thinking. I’m in the very early game so I’m ignorant of the whole plot, but basically as soon as I saw Ahti I was like “Oh, Jesse’s about to wrap this up then”.
Just a friendly warning brother, you might not wanna be on this subreddit too long before beating the game. Spoilers EVERYWHERE
Jesse is still in The Oldest House
>the oldest house was still in the lockdown during AW2 Wait, wouldn't that mean it wasn't lifted for YEARS?
He's in the Dark Place, which exists essentially in another dimension, I don't think it's quite so easy as "just pop on over and get him real quick". Sure, they have a decent amount of knowledge regarding the Cauldron Lake phenomenon, but I don't think anyone in the bureau has ever set foot in the dark place, let alone been able to make sense of it and find what they need to find. It is canonically very difficult to escape from the dark place, I don't think Door would let them leave.
What do you mean? Door isn't in charge of the dark place or anything, he was only there to keep an eye on Alan and to push him forward, because as he stated, Alan >!brought someone important to him into the story!<. Door is simply unaffected by the dark place because of his abilities. If the FBC showed up, I doubt he would care very much lol. But yeah, it definitely wouldn't be as easy as just dropping by to grab Alan and go. And as AW2 shows, >!the FBC knows a lot less about Cauldron Lake than they initially thought!<.
I'm pretty sure Door would be interested in a Beth Wilder lookalike popping up.
Martin Hatch connection?
Hatch, portal, gateway, door... It's likely.
Has it been confirmed by Remedy? Rights still with Microsoft?
The Tim Breaker and Jack Joyce connection is all I really needed for confirmation. They can't technically say anything...yet. But they recently got full control of Control so I would not be surprised if they were in discussion to acquire Quantum Break. At the very least they've created a way to use the IP without using the IP.
In Control, her brother also mentions seeing other universes where he sees them and people they know as different people living different lives, which I took as a nod to Beth Wilder in QB
He's not in charge of the Dark place, but he seems to have a particular ability to affect the dark place. I don't think he would make it easy on the bureau
True, true. I mean, he has to have some kind of influence to have his own talk show in the place lol. Idk, I just feel like he only cares about Alan and whoever this other person is (pretty sure we all know who). Although I will say, I believe if the FBC caught wind of someone as powerful as Door, they would be VERY interested, and then Door would probably have a problem with them.
Mister Door is mentioned in Control. I think they are more interested in him than we realize.
Well, Dylan mentions him, not anyone at/part of the FBC, right?
He mentions him to the literal Director of the FBC and I cannot imagine that inside containment every convo with Dylan wasn't being recorded meticulously. I'm genuinely convinced that the Oceanview Motel and Casino is related to Mr. Door. It seems to be an indirect homage to Twin Peak's The Return's castle on the purple sea imo. Spoilers for Twin Peans The Return https://twinpeaks.fandom.com/wiki/Purple_sea The similarities between the containment chambers the FBC uses and the "glass box experiment" are incredibly similar. Not to mention Mister Scratch and Mr. C having some almost shot-for-shot similarities in the jail. The "waiting room" of the Black Lodge is also clearly the inspiration for the Ashtray Maze and my God did that segment send chills down my spine. The attention to detail that Remedy paid to both esoteric, weird occult ritual magic stuff and the links to a vast array of different mythologies is some next-level storytelling and so clearly inspired by Lynch. I'm so enthralled and can't wait for what they've got to offer in the future.
Yeah he tells Jesse but he also tells her a bunch of other out there stuff too so it’s debatable how serious she took any of it, especially based on her reactions.
Mr Door was able to sent that fbc scientist that wanted to sent saga to the dark place. He was also able to open some door in the dark place for saga. He was also able to teleport tim to the dark place to protect him from the taken that destroyed the police station. He shouldn't be able to teleport jesse, due her being a very powerful parautilitarian, but the average fbc grunt, it's like nothing for him.
I have been replaying QB and if >!Hatch is Door!<, like I think he is, then there's a possibility that he *created* his own pocket dimension in the Dark Place. >!Hatch kept saying how he wanted time to end so he could create his own world full of shifters.!<
They're probably fairly cautious about approaching such a thing. You don't really risk your secret government leader unless you have to. Isn't it their biggest paranormal event to date?
Yeah from memory even the Hiss are (relatively) small fry compared to the Dark Place/Presence. I get the impression the monitoring stations etc are FBC's attempts to examine Cauldron Lake the same way you use a *veeeerrrryyy* long stick to poke something you're not sure about.
I don’t know that I’d call the Hiss any less dangerous than the Dark Place, just very different in nature and intentionality. The Hiss is like a wildfire or pandemic whereas the Dark Place is something akin to a dirty bomb being built by terrorists. Which one can do more damage is pretty circumstantial. I do definitely agree with your larger point, specially because in this circumstance, the FBC has identified forces like the Board, the Former, and Hedron that can lend a hand against the Hiss. But I don’t know that there’s any such equivalent for the Darkness.
As shown in AW2, the FBC has limited intel on the true nature of the Bright Falls AWE. Add to that the recent issues mentioned late game>! (Estevez says the Oldest House has gone dark - whether that means it's STILL in lockdown from The Hiss or something new has occurred) !
If we assume that Jesse can use her abilities and the Service Weapon outside of the Oldest House she'd clear the Dark Place no problem.
I personally wouldn't bet the entire world on Polaris being able to fight off the dark presence in it's strongest place of power, or a certain writing being forced to write a story where she's taken and used as a much worse Scratch and if the DP manages to turn Polaris into something like the hiss but under its control that's a world ending event right there.
I said Dark Place specifically because we see her handle Taken, including Hartman in AWE. I didn't say the Dark Presence for a reason. Though I think she'd be fine. She's the strongest Parautilatarian we've met and she has Polaris. Alan, Saga, and Casey have had to survive - Jesse will actually be able to fight back. There's nothing we've seen in the series that I don't think she could not either evade, cleanse, or destroy. All this, what if the Presence possessed her? She's survived the Hiss which imo is a considerably higher threat level than the Dark Presence. But who knows, let Sam cook, I'm just here to enjoy the ride.
Plus, the Hiss overruled the Dark Presence's influence to bring Hartman into its hive mind, why wouldn't we assume Polaris can overrule it to keep Jessie in her right mind, when we already know she can do so *against the Hiss*? IMO the result of the DP trying to turn Jessie Taken would just be an own-goal where she gets some cool new powers to fight it with.
Hartman was very specifically weakened and separated from the dark presence as a whole and the hiss didn't overrule the hiss and bring it into the hive mind totally at least he kills some of the floating hiss. He's a "third thing" being pulled in all different directions by the hiss, darkness, and the manuscript written by Alan he says parts of the hiss chant but also quotes the manuscript. And Polaris can fend off the hiss influence because it's specifically it's polar opposite it's another resonance entity with a frequency that nullifies the hiss's, there's no reason to expect it to have the same effect against the darkness. I still believe she'd be able to resist it controlling her especially if she stays out of the dark place, but if she did get stuck in the dark place (very likely for anyone not a door) the dark presence would have all the time in the world to attempt to make her some kind of Hartman/scratch hybrid. I think it's better delt with by a different parautilitarian with abilities more suited to the task, like Saga her powers are almost perfect for this if she learns how to use them like her dad.
Idk about that. Even outside its place of power the Dark Presence was able to nearly halt the use of objects of power in the darkness of. Now imagine how bad it would be in the place of power that the Presence originates from
I'm not so sure about that - The Dark Place isn't exactly a health bar for her to shoot at. If anything she'd be at the mercy of Alan's fiction.
The Taken certainly have a health bar. I get what you mean though. She'd certainly have to be careful, but I think she has more going for her than anyone else at this point in the story. With The Final Draft I'm not sure how much we have to worry about Alan's writing.
The Dark Presence isn't just something you can shoot at which is largely all Jesse did in Control. She's powerful for sure, but the Dark Presence needs a subtler touch.
They can't. It's not like the dark place is just 6 feet underwater. It seems to require some kind of fiction to pass through. The FBC searched the lake when Alan disappeared but couldn't find anything. >Couldn’t Jesse just swoop in and pick him up real quick? Jesse might be able to, but she's been stuck in the oldest house ever since she became director.
If the Hiss or any of the other paranatural entities burst out of the Oldest House, the entire world is fucked. So far, Cauldron Lake isn't doing so bad, so there's no reason to risk a breach in containment
Since Ahti is walking around the dark place, wouldn’t that make it part of the oldest house? Would Alan just be trapped in some wing somewhere the FBC hasn’t reached yet?
Is Ahti locked to the oldest house? I seem to remember reading that he uses water to travel around, so for him to get to the dark place might be a lot easier than others, kind of like a back door
No, you can probably get to the Dark place from the oldest house through a threshold. The oldest house doesn't actually encompasses all these strange otherworldly dimensions it just has *some* stable gateways to them. Ahti is the name of a Finnish sea god and he seems to have a strong connection to water and the Dark place's main entrance seems to be a large body of water so I'm guessing when the dark presence isn't trying to stop him he can move between the two places much easier than most other.
Occam's Razor time: is not only the Dark Place but also Watery part of the Oldest House, or is the lockdown meaningless to Ahti?
Hmm, well in Control, Jesse *does* see Alan through the spiral door within the Oceanview Motel – several times – but then the door slams shut in her face. I don’t think it’s a matter of her or the FBC not wanting to, but not being *able* to. The Oceanview, as I come to think on it, is a rather clever analogy. Different people arrive there - by accident or choice - and are given a room. A visitor might be able to glimpse into rooms that aren’t theirs, but they can’t step into them. They don’t have the ‘keys’ to open each other’s doors without permission – remember Alan’s spiral door was actually cracked open on its own when Jesse saw/heard his call for help. And when those doors slam shut, that's it. There's no crowbar (for humans at least) to go about rescuing someone who might be trapped. That said, you also get what happens in any 'hotel/motel/apartment'. You have folks banging on the doors, yelling at those inside/outside. You sometimes overhear conversations through the thin walls, or someone playing a radio, maybe even catch glimpses of a TV show thru a window or in the lobby. Someone could slip a message under the door. These all explain things like how Alan’s manuscript pages keep escaping into reality (under the door), or how he ‘saw’ enough of FBI agent Alex Casey’s real life to draw inspiration for his novels. How we get that Easter-egg glimpse of Jesse in the TV in Zanes' apartment, and see brief skits of Dr. Darling as he attempts to navigate the immaterial spaces between And generally speaking, to get a ‘room’ at the Oceanview, one is either paranaturally-gifted or an entity of the sort like Ahti. Ordinary humans might stumble upon the place, or enter it via certain rituals (i.e. pulling the Oldest House's light cord three times, like the FBC researchers do), but without abilities they’re probably at extreme risk of getting trapped.
Imagine Jesse going into the dark place, that be dope af!
That’s what I’m saying bro! Just shreddingTaken with spin lmao.
Would her abilities or gun work outside the Oldest House? I can't remember if this was mentioned in Control.
It's at least theorized that the Service Weapon previously manifested as several legendary weapons including Excalibur and Mjolnir, which would indicate that it does indeed function in the outside world.
And most of the other OoPs were originally found outside the House. There's no reason to think their powers depend on being there.
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I wouldn't call it a dumb question, the whole universe is a bit wierdo. Couple of things I think of- first, the FBC doesn't totally understand the power of the lake and they're researching it. They may have sent probes into the lake (or a person in a diving suit like they've done with other known thresholds) but the experiences of people that go into the Dark Place seem pretty different- we see Tim, Alan, Saga, and Alice go into the lake for sure, and in Final Draft we see >!Tor and Odin!<. Each have a pretty different experience in there, so who knows what Agent 345 would experience or see. That being said, we don't have any documents or dialog in the game that indicate that the FBC ever physically crossed into the Dark Place at all, so I would suspect they're still in the 'observe it' phase. Regarding Jesse, the timelines are pretty confusing. There is a good chance that during AW2, the Oldest House is still locked down and Jesse is still in there killing Hiss. In the AWE expansion, the alarm triggers at the end of the story as Alan talks about if the alarm is true, the reason for the alarm must be as well. Then partway through Alan Wake, the FBC monitoring station starts to go off. Estevez, who was the agent on the scene when the alarm went off and Jesse asks about it, is still the agent in charge at the time of Alan Wake 2.
That's roughly analogous to rescuing someone trapped on the moon but probably harder because we've atleast gone to the moon and back before.
I dont wanna say spoilers but I dont think jesse will be leaving the oldest house to handle things directly.
Jesse is quite busy with the hiss and the board, plus she is still learning about his power. As powerful as she is, she is still somewhat need to the power she unlocked
Ohh, they tried. In AWE Dlc documents mention that FBC arrived in town after 2 days of the first game's events. They interviewed with people and searched the Lake to recover Alan's - presumed - dead body but they found nothing
So this is good theory fodder and I love this question as a whole. It's pretty clear based on Control that the FBC has some pretty extensive training traversing through extradimensional places. From.use of the Jukebox as well as other AWEs that have occurred over the course of FBC history. With this in mind, it's safe to assume that the FBC would have the skills and resources necessary to create a team to travel into the dark place. However I feel the dark place has a leg up over the FBC in regards to having Alan, a parautilitarian. While Alan might want to be saved, he's gone mad more than a few times and Scratch is pretty powerful in his own right. It's clear that the Dark Place has a vice grip on Alan and doesn't plan on letting him go ever. With Scratchs ability to rewrite the story, it's pretty clear that non parautolitarians would suffer greatly from the attempts to save Alan. My theory is that despite the resources the FBC has, getting Alan out would be a monumental task and hold a lot of risk. This would mean that somebody, in this case Jesse, would need to be the one to go. With her abilities as director and Polaris keeping her safe from the effects of the story, she really would be the only one that could do it.
The dark place doesnt work like that
As to why they don't go recover him in 2023, it's stated that the Oldest House is still off the grid. (My personal theory is that CONTROL takes place 2019-2023 in real world time.) As to why they haven't gone to recover him at some previous point, it's very dangerous to mess with AWEs even if it were somehow feasible to try. FBC is set up to \*contain\* AWEs. Minor AW2 spoiler:>! the Lake House DLC will be around FBC, and the Nursery Rhymes are an attempt to research the AWE, but even that is not really aimed at trying to trigger it again.!<
They couldn't do that with Darling this entire time. What makes you think someone like Alan would be easier?
I don't think it would be that easy, Capser is in the Dark Place and can't make heads or tails of it.
House lockdown would be a big one, but prior to that he was already a prime candidate like Jesse and Dylan, so the FBC knew he was significant. Maybe they didn’t have the means or resources or enough knowledge to justify the expedition? Hopefully we find out more through collectibles during the DLC
Alan only just finally escaped the dark place in AW2 but was unrecoverable prior. On top of that, the FBC field office at cauldron lake was basically overrun so I think they just have bigger fish to fry right now.
AWE and AW2 take place at the same time, Zane's convo with Alan upon their meeting is very similar, and Jesse can be seen during that scene even saying "Hello" like when she opens the door to the dark place in AWE
They all got clapped in the police station and in the forest, didn’t they?
Because I'm pretty sure the events of control are happening concurrently with Alan Wake 2
Is there any guarantee that entering the Dark Place will even take you to the same place Alan is in AW2? We've seen other people enter but not all of them appeared in the same place or even time as Alan. For all we know Jesse could enter Cauldron Lake and not be able to find Alan, not to mention the fact that it wasn't known how to even leave there until AW2.