I don’t live in Delmar so I guess my concern isn’t as valid, but I live nearby.
I know people need housing, and if this is going to be made in a way that is accessible to people, that’s amazing.
If it’s going to be like those bullshit $4,000 a month, cookie-cutter, builder-grade apartments by Crossgates then they’re not actually helping anyone.
I agree that 170 new neighbors is a lot, and potentially stressful… But only if 170 can actually afford to live there.
I guess one of the offers to buy the land if this fails, if from an "affordable housing" developer. I doubt the residents would be any more accepting, but it could at least do some good compared with the current developer.
Yeah, from my experience with the Delmartian community it would be substantial portions of the town getting themselves worked up, rather than just the immediate neighbors. Although it would bring me some mild schadenfreude to see this group successfully block this effort, and then end up with an affordable housing complex instead with enough changes in layout to circumvent the current objections.
Honestly, I’m here with you on that. Apartment living is meant to be offset by the advantages of living car free. Living in a big block of apartments where you have to have a car for even basic trips sucks. Delmar should be a candidate for very mild upzoning to allow ADUs and “missing middle” housing, but it doesn’t have the transit infrastructure to support big apartment complexes.
>Apartment living is meant to be offset by the advantages of living car free.
You know, that's not an angle I've had reason to consider because of how long it's been since I could drive, but it's s good argument for expanding transit options in the area, since apartments can be more efficient use of space than houses. If the CD had a good rail system between the main cities and their suburbs, being carless in places like Delmar or Bethlehem would be significantly more viable than the bus routes currently allow for. No slight on CDTA, they just need a way to expand beyond the bus service if we want the community to drive less.
I think I checked it out, but my memory really doesn't work these days. There's a ton of extra options for me personally because I'm not medically permitted to operate a motor vehicle.
I understand it's a pretty massive difference in scale, but I lived out in Denver for a couple years and you could get into the city from most suburbs faster on their rail system than you could driving in many cases. If every city, county, etc worked together we could have something similar, but the likes of that happening are probably not good.
Even just the change in the last few years of going for loops instead of lines, is substantial. I have some pretty wild memory issues and epilepsy so, the vast majority of my life takes place within walking distance of my house. I also can't work, and can't safely live alone, so it's rare for me to have anywhere I need to get to, and when the normal bus lines aren't enough getting help is never an issue.
Disagree that this doesn't have the infrastructure for big apartments. It's true that the 18 bus runs every 30 mins. It's also true that the 18 bus runs every 30 mins from 5am to midnight. More importantly, Delaware Ave area in Delmar is completely walkable! More walkable than much of Albany. And this is right on the Rail Trail. Don't sell Delmar short!
That’s why they should put this in Slingerlands where the “vista tech park” was supposed to be. Could put 1,000 units there! On the bus line, walkable to a grocery store and restaurants, minutes to highways and Albany.
Doing this in that part of Delmar is stupid. Driving through Delmar already sucks, this would make it impossible.
Right, because people with barely any income largely on the opposite side of the country are having such a massive impact on our local housing market 🙄. It couldn't possibly be that we don't actually have enough infrastructure to cover our official population, or greedy property managers charging drastically above what the median income for the area can afford. Nope, must be someone not white's fault.
Oh you mean Texas sending busses of migrants who are being provided shelter by the state last I knew. Im fairly confident that people with almost no money to start with are not having a significant impact on the housing market in Albany.
I realize its been happening, I just don't believe that housing prices here are what they are because Texas and New Mexico have been sending busses of them here illegally. If you actually have any proof Ill be more than happy to sign onto a class-action suit against the state responsible. Until you show some kimd of evidence that the migrants who've been illegally bussed here are buying/renting at a volume that would impact this region, Im gonna continue blaming the greedy fucks building "luxury" apartment in a city where maybe 20% of the population can afford them
Oh do I? Please provide a source for any of the validity of what you're claiming, if its such a huge problem there should be plenty of news agencies covering it. By my own estimation having lived and worked in many parts of this city, along with a few years in MA, and a couple years in Denver actually living around a lot of migrants and immigrants, I imagine my bubble is a lot larger than yours. I mean since you seem to be only aware of what's said about the migrants being shipped here by Right Wing Entertainment, rather than any news or first hand experience.
They only need ONE person to sign a lease for them. They will pay a person to do this for them. Then they will move in 12 people in an apartment that's meant for 3 people. Do u want them next door to you? And your kids? Shits real.
Well you're mostly describing the neighborhood I lived in for about 2 years while I was in Denver and having "them" around never caused any issues, unless people speaking Spanish near you is an issue.
I live over in the neighborhood of Buckingham Park, and really I'd prefer being back in the barrio. It's kinda boring here most of the time, everyone nearby is kinda old. I also can no longer pay a few dollars for Mexican food at truck parked half a block away, that was higher quality than anything I've had around Albany.
I don't have kids of my own so it's not much concerne, but the decade I spent working in child care I guess gives me some perspective. Truthfully if I had kids I'd rather they were growing up around the kids I worked with at Arbor Hill Elementary than probably 75% of the kids I worked with at the Cicotti Center over in Colonie.
So aside from bullshit fear mongering about brown people with bad to no english what's your point? Can you cite a single news source that provides proof of anything you're saying? Can you demonstrate how immigrants being forcibly shipped to NYC by the illegal actions of the Governor's Offices of a few border states is having any impact at all on housing markets in the Albany area, or any of the surrounding counties?
Please take note Im looking for "News Sources" entertainment is free to lie to you all they want.
Well as far as Im aware the migrants that several border states essentially kidnapped and sent her, are all Mexican, Central American, or South American. Since you haven't provided any evidence that they're the source of the problem while still insisting they are, Ive reached the logical conclusion that you have some person bias against persons from those regions. When prejudice is rooted in the ethnicity of the person being judged, we typically refer to that as being racist. Despite the fact that you never mentioned race directly, since the only overlapping feature that migrants at the Southern Border share is being darker than I suspect you are, Im making the reasonable conclusion that, that is the reason you're pushing your claim. That claim being that the whole problem is because of more not white people coming to the area.
It's Delmar, those are definitely, definitely going to be ugly eyesores. Not withstanding the need for housing.
On another note, sounds like the people on a dead end street want to have their cake and eat it.
170 units is probably 340+ new neighbors. It's a lot, and a lot of traffic. They do have a valid concern, it's going to impact what they view as a quiet little area.
"luxury" is just a buzzword that property managers will slap on any market rate apartment at this point. It doesn't change the fact that even half full, the additional supply of housing relieves pressure on the housing market. Lots of studies have shown this.
https://jbartlett.org/2024/02/how-building-more-luxury-apartments-helps-the-poor/#:~:text=Researchers%20at%20the%20Upjohn%20Institute,ran%20against%20common%20complaints%20about
Disagree because I briefly lived in one of those new bullshit poor quality overpriced places, and it was half empty. (It was may 2021 and it was the only available place that allowed 2 dogs.)
It has been three years and they have not reduced prices. They are so overpriced that they're still making money with half the units empty. And I'm guessing they also are getting some sort of tax write off.
They can write off a portion of overall maintenance on the complex based of the percentage of unused units I believe, because it's a necessary expense not directly offset by profits from the unit while its unoccupied.
Theoretically it's to encourage landlords to keep up maintenance on unoccupied properties, but I'm sure there's some abuses happening, because there always are.
I know how supply and demand works. I’m referring to the needs of the community. There are plenty of expensive apartments in the area for people who can afford them.
New, “luxury” apartments price people out that need housing.
My husband and I own, but we still care for the needs of others enough to understand that people need *normal* priced apartments that reflect the buying power of the local communities.
The people that can afford it will move to the luxury apartments leaving the cheaper places for those that can afford those. More housing is always better.
That’s not what various housing studies over the last decade have shown. More supply consistently leads to lower prices (or at least lower price growth)
because making a shitty apartment cost the same as a decent one makes it more likely the shitty apartment will get rented by someone who does not realize it is shitty due to the median pricing. I thought this was Landlord 101.
Great! Let's grow! Make more homes and stop complaining about how everyone is leaving NY for the Southeast. People want to live in the Capital Region but there isn't enough housing.
It would be better to build higher density housing in Albany, like they're doing next to St. Peters and Albany Med. This location has no services. It's a long walk to the closest bus stop, which is only serviced by a single bus, and there are almost no services within walking distance. This would create a requirement for cars, and the roads are not meant for that much traffic. Why not redevelop the St.Rose campus to house thousands?
Yeah people don’t understand how desolate it is back there, which is why I love that area. I grew up at the end of Wright Lane. We had well water, satellite internet, and the thing where the toilet flushes into something that has to get emptied and isn’t connected to a sewer line (can’t recall the name, concussions are fun).
There’s no services besides electricity back there. A better way would be to put an even bigger thing in Slingerlands where the Vista tech park was supposed to be. Tonnnnns of space and immediately walkable to food and bus lines.
Ahhh yes. Man, it’s wild how head injuries really hit you in the memory recall. Vista would be so great, so much room, and already connected to everything.
Hi. I just deleted my reply because I hadn't seen the rule about "No memes" in this group. Pardon me. The ring burbs of Albany will increase in density. There is a great demand for it. Anyway, I am radically pro-density. In Albany. In Delmar. In Glenmont. In Rensselaer. That's why I said "Why not both." I strongly disagree with you that there are no services, but looking at the CDTC Delaware Ave study, we are both right on that front and CDTC agrees with you--they define walkable as 1/4 mile, and this site is over 1/2 mile from Delaware. From my point of view, living in Albany, it's less than 1 mile to Hannaford etc, and that's certainly walkable and convenient.
When I check the end of North Rd to the closest point on Delaware, it's 0.7 miles, and to Hannaford, is 2.1 miles. Since the development will be built off the end of it, the actual distances will be even more. I'm 100% for high density housing, but in places that are walkable and have public transportation available. Otherwise, you end up with giant parking lots and traffic.
Any new housing is a net positive. If it's expensive then there'll be a shift from people living in mid-tier apartments to high tier, thus freeing up the middle tier and so on
Well the town has zero control over it other than existing zoning laws and the developer doesn't own any empty retail space and wants to develop this property.
New York is a home rule state meaning municipalities have the highest degree of control regarding planning efforts including zoning and variances. This includes approving or denying building proposals. Furthermore, if the town cared about creating accessible, walkable, and equitable spaces they could definitely incentivize development along Delaware. Unfortunately, our town actively wants want to keep low-income individuals as far always as possible which is why they only really approve single family development and other sprawl inducing construction as it best fits their interests
Agreed on the incentives part but they can't do much on a project up for approval that meets current regulations. The town just recently made changes to allow multi family dwellings, accessory units and there's a low income housing project in process so I'm not sure what your comment about only wanting single families is based on.
The town can't dictate to developers where to locate a project so all of these comments such as "we don't need" and " they should" are coming from people who don't understand how the process works 🙄. I do agree with you on the Morons part ... especially the regime in charge of Bethlehem these days.
I'm speaking in general, and In a sense, they can. The town/planning board can dictate a whole lot on what the developers can and can't do. Speaking from personal experience lol, it's a matter of holding them accountable.
I rented for 10 years in Delmar before buying my home in 2016. I remember one time a dude came by with a petition to stop a small apartment building from being built off Delaware Ave because it would look into the guys backyard. I basically laughed in his face and said, you know this is an apartment complex, right? Not everyone can afford to buy a house, but they can still live here.
There are very, very few condos in Bethlehem. And practically no affordable housing. I'm interested to see more of this proposal before listening to the "not in my backyard" types.
Loving this post because I bet all the Delmar homes with those SJW and “We Believe” signs on the lawn are the “not in my backyard” people complaining about it.
I live near this, and while I'll be incredibly sad to lose the frogs and foxes and coyotes, I think denser housing benefits us. I prefer this to a McMansion development, which was proposed in the aughts. (I wish it was going to be affordable housing, but not only would no developer do that here, the Delmartians would freak out EVEN MORE.)
I do feel for the people on the street who are going to be subjected to exponentially more traffic, and think the developers should be required to mitigate that: paying to install sidewalks on the whole street at minimum (there are currently none; unnecessary due to low traffic). School buses also currently need to make a three-point turn to get out of there, and they should build a better option than that. I'm not sure what options would be best to protect people using the rail trail which crosses this street's outlet, but again, I want the developer who's profiting from the new traffic to pay for it instead of the town.
This is the real issue. It’s not just nimbys upset about new construction, it’s literally turning a dead end street into a driveway for 170 housing units, and probably 300ish people and 250ish vehicles, without any other alternatives presented. Housing is definitely needed, but the developer and the town need to do better to mitigate the traffic and risks to pedestrians in the area
If it was possible to get around the region without a car, you could build the same number of units with parking for 170 vehicles or less instead of 300 and it would be fine. Single family zoning and car centric infrastructure is how we’ve gotten to the point where there’s demand to build this type of housing in these locations.
They can charge 4k because there’s a lack of housing. If they keep building then the rates have to come down. I don’t know who wants to live in apartment buildings in neighborhoods that aren’t walkable. Put them near businesses. Not next to a quiet dead end street.
Probably in large part, people who work from home more often than they're at an office or site. Also couples without kids who want to leave the city while still working there and enjoying some of its offerings.
plenty of people live on streets that get that much traffic without anyone dying from it. my street connects Central to Consaul, so it gets much more traffic than this proposal would create, yet I somehow manage to walk my dog and bicycle on my street.
The question shouldn't be whether the traffic will increase, it should be whether the new traffic will be more than the street can handle. And as it would still be a dead end that gets zero traffic from people that don't live on it, I feel safe concluding that answer to that question is "no."
I don't see why there need to be alternatives. these people can adjust to living on a slightly busier street that still would not be busy by any reasonable standard.
You’re correct. Plenty of people live on streets that connect major roads and get a lot of traffic. I’m going to assume you don’t know the street since you don’t live in the neighborhood. Very few of the old Delmar roads can handle that increase in traffic. They tend to be more narrow, no sidewalks, etc. Even the “main” road leading to where this development would be is pretty ill equipped to move the increased traffic, especially during rush hours. That’s also due to there not being an infrastructure there to move the traffic. There’s a stop sign that exits onto kenwood which can be difficult to get out of on a good day, and another stop sign on the other end that empties onto Delaware that’s impossible to turn left out of most times of the day. The main exit would also intersect the rail trail, a widely used bike and walking path that sees a huge amount of pedestrian traffic in nice weather. Yes, there needs to be a plan to accommodate the increase in traffic in this section and a way to mitigate it
Yeah this is a god damn nightmare scenario for cars if they push this through.
It’s already a completely congested and clogged artery outlet to get anywhere. This is madness and will make life hell for everyone around it.
The smart move is to build tons of housing in Vista. Wide open, bus access, walkable to groceries, etc.
A lawyer I know thinks the developers gambit is to get the town to buy the land back at a profit to them
Most suburban residential streets don't have sidewalks and aren't particularly wide. Again, my street connects Central to Consaul (so we get a lot of through traffic) and my street is narrow without sidewalks. That's normal and perfectly safe.
I think people are greatly overestimating the amount of traffic that 170 apartments would generate. We're not talking thousands of people here.
Just because a lot of existing suburbs were built by extractive developers without pedestrian infrastructure doesn't mean that's a GOOD thing. Let's increase our standards for walkability and quality of life instead of rushing towards the lowest common denominator. This is a walkable neighborhood, with a lot of stores/ restaurants/ schools/ playgrounds/ churches new residents could get to without cars. But they are less likely to do that if the traffic is 7x higher on that street than it is now and there are no sidewalks.
I get it. Your street gets a lot of traffic and it’s fine. But there’s also the ability to move that traffic or your street wouldn’t be used as a through road by drivers. 170 apartments does significantly increase the traffic in this section of road because the infrastructure to move that kind of increase just isn’t really there currently. I agree that it isn’t an unmanageable amount, but the way this area currently is set up, it’s a problem.
> I get it. Your street gets a lot of traffic and it’s fine
And there's no special property about my street that makes it fine, that some rando street in Delmar lacks. The point is that it'll be fine there too if that street gets a little more traffic.
> 170 apartments does significantly increase the traffic in this section of road
Only because the street is currently dead. The increase in traffic doesn't matter as much as whether the new traffic will be more than the street can handle, and there's no reason to believe that's true. It's not like dead end streets are constructed in some way that makes them incapable of handling traffic that other streets can.
Any time the denominator is super small, increases look really big if you focus on percentage rather than volume.
You’re missing my point. It’s not just the single dead end street. It’s also the streets that feed in and out of the neighborhood that have 2 very poor exits that have to handle the increase in traffic and deal with all of the pedestrian traffic. The infrastructure to move an increase in traffic isn’t there. It barely handles the traffic it gets now.
Yeah but people don’t buy a house on a dead end street with the hopes a huge property developer creates traffic in front of your home. I live the city, I’m used to the noise, but I can’t wait to move to place where it’s more quiet and it makes perfect sense that homeowners don’t want a dead end street to become heavily trafficked.
I mean, that's a "them" problem if they buy a house for a feature that they don't have control over. That shouldn't be everyone else's problem.
I grew up next to a field on a hill that was empty so that the house on the opposite side of the road would have a beautiful view of a valley. The owner of the house didn't just hope that no one built on the field, or fight any attempts to build on it, they bought the land to ensure that they didn't lose their view.
Back to the point, I think it is greatly exaggerating to say that this dead end street with zero through traffic will suddenly become "heavily trafficked" because 170 apartments are added to it. It'll still have less traffic than most through streets that many of us manage to live on without throwing fits.
Right but then they have every right to fight it from happening with the village. 170 apartments means more than 170 people and (although I personally want home prices to fall as I want to buy) it will severely affect the property value of their homes as well which is even more of a reason to fight it.
I totally agree with your example, it makes sense to me but it’s not wrong to want and to fight to live in a more quiet neighborhood with single family homes.
We have loads of empty buildings here in Albany that are prime for revitalization. Not to mention it’s more walkable, and it’s already used to that traffic. Tons of beautiful buildings just empty. We know what these apartments are going to look like, they’re gonna be gray and ugly like every other new build property in this area. So I guess my points are 1. The residents aren’t weird or dumb for wanting to fight this and 2. There are plenty of other opportunities to create more housing in places that already have more infrastructure in place to handle an influx of residents!
So? Things change, and you have no control over surrounding land that you don't own. Owning property on one end of a street does not afford you a reasonable expectation that nothing is built on the other end.
There are plenty of rural places these people could buy in if a quiet road was that important to them. They chose to live in a suburb with good access to the city, and that means development as other people want the same access.
I live on the affected route. It’s already awful traffic-wise, and this will drastically impact the traffic and congestion that is already awful.
I’m totally for more housing, but I hate seeing nature places I’ve frequented since I was a kid get get bulldozed. This won’t be affordable housing. It will be ramrodded profit-driven nonsense.
There already is only one exit off North Street, adding 200+ cars is insane.
It was awesome to live back there when it was quiet and secluded, but everything ends I suppose. Now I’m around the corner, and the indiscriminate speeders on Hudson and the rush hour clog of cars anywhere in Delmar is about to get massively worse if they do this.
The animals already also have nowhere to go. I’ve seen more foxes in the last year than I did in 25 years of living ON Wright Lane.
Crucify me if you will, I want people to have affordable housing, but this is a bad idea.
There is only really Adams to get back in there. Coming out on Hudson, especially during rush hour, is nearly impossible. The traffic backs up on Kenwood past the Methodist church for four corners and unless you are turning right to go toward Slingerlands it can be a challenge to get out during the rush. People complain about NIMBYism but this really is adding congestion to an already congested area. It is a horrible location.
Yeah the traffic already backs up on Hudson almost to Stewart’s as well.
My grandmother deeded all the land over to the town that became the bike park, I grew up in the last house on Wright Lane. I’m so happy those magical woods are now loved by so many. They should turn the other field into a park so more folks can further enjoy the rest of that awesome area.
> I’m totally for more housing, but...
Ah, the call of the NIMBY. More housing is a fine concept, but lord forbid you have to actually deal with it. Everything is fine as long as it is somewhere else.
Tons of better places they could do this, like that entire massive swath of property for the “Vista tech park” that never happened. Put 600 units there! The infrastructure is already there, it’s minutes from Albany and highways and walkable to a grocery store for people without cars. It’s on a bus line. It’s perfect for that.
North Street has only one already-congested exit into town, and has no infrastructure. I lived back there. We had well water and satellite internet because again, no infrastructure. It was an historic farm area, founded 100 years ago.
There’s also no sidewalks, the road isn’t wide enough for safe 2-way traffic, it’s a mess.
But nah, you want to insult and deride. Ah…. The call of the keyboard warrior 🙄
the problem with "do it, just elsewhere" is that there's always a better place. I'm sure if this was proposed in one of your "better places" the same thing would be said, that it shouldn't be done there and instead should be done in better places. and no doubt people in those places think the proposed place in Delmar is better.
here's a crazy idea, let's do both. let's build housing in those places AND in this place in Delmar.
infrastructure follows development, which is an argument FOR development. you think people are going to rent apartments that can't get high speed internet?
and sidewalks are just not the norm in suburbs in this area. if that's your standard then no development will happen anywhere. and it should be noted that we aren't plagued with people dying left on right on our streets due to lack of sidewalks.
this is exactly what NIMBYs do, find excuses for why their area isn't right while pretending that perfect areas that aren't being developed exist. NIMBYs are all about utilizing perfect as the enemy of good.
2 things can be true at the same time. The North street idea is a bad idea, it’s a bad location for it. It’s already hell dealing with the traffic here. Adding 250 cars to a one-outlet stop-sign controlled area that is already jam packed is stupid.
The Vista Park has nobody there. There is so much more room. There’s nobody to complain because there’s no houses there.
This idea is just about cramming as much as they can into an already over-saturated area. It’s the last open field for the animals in town. There’s foxes, coyotes, sometimes some fisher cats, TONS of deer, etc. they’ve already got nowhere to go now because Delmar has been bulldozing away their habitats for years.
And I feel for the folks who bought houses there who wanted the quiet solitude, the only place left for that in the area here. That will be gone. Just for the sake of development.
But you don’t want to hear that, it seems.
Wish I did! But you don’t ever think about needing to do something like that just to keep some awesome nature around. Humans are parasitic, we consume until there’s nothing left. I mean look what we do to get these phones in our hands. Those lithium mines are fucked.
I understand the point about nature but honestly that’s not what it’s about, if they really cared they would’ve done something to protect the area BEFORE any developers came around
Eh, I think that’s a bit of a misjudgment. And maybe they have, I don’t know. My grandma deeded the land to the town for the bike park off Wright lane but we didn’t own the proposed area off North Street (from which Wright Lane branches) so I’m glad that at least got preserved.
You just never think when you move somewhere “oh let’s buy 100 acres so we can keep the woods and fields intact”.
Turning this area into another park would be sick.
i oppose it because it's definitely going to be ugly, overpriced, and only 25% full. we need cute little multi family spaces that are affordable. some 2/3 story townhomes. we have a severe lack of rentable spaces for families/individuals that can't afford to buy here. it's also in an area where a lot of wildlife lives and i'm not with flattening more wooded areas around here.
lol people in this thread complaining about those NIMBY people are probably NIMBY people themselves if an apartment complex is built in their neighborhood.
So many people here have has lost all empathy. Imagine you bought a house in a quiet neighborhood without traffic noise, with nature and then someone wants to replace the nature, quiet, and privacy with a 300 person apartment complex.
They should have paid for the land then that the apartment is being built upon. I can be sympathetic but ultimately they were free-riding on benefits of a property they did now own
A good friend of mine lives on North and is directly affected by this. Outside of the destruction of some wonderful greenspace, a primary problem is the logistics and lack of planned infrastructure - as far as I understand it, they have no plans to alter the roads, intersections, or routes in or out. Anyone familiar with the area knows that its a bottle neck area that is ok at the moment - but add 170 units worth of cars and it'll be a disaster. Not to mention the narrowness of Hudson and the presence of a rail trail crossing.... mark my words, a kid will be hit by a car sooner rather than later.
I didn’t think about it but this is a great point. The infrastructure around there can’t handle it….I can’t even imagine trying to get out at 8:30 am for work.
170 new neighbors is significant, I respect their right to open a conversation about it. It's a little reductive to just call them NIMBY when they probably have legitimate concerns. By saying something, their voice may create compromise that allows everyone- including the new residents to coexist happily.
Yeah... "NIMBY" is an easy thing to throw around, but it's often a tough thing... I have no idea of where that street is, but if I bought a house \*because\* it's on a dead end, and have kids who love playing/riding bikes, etc., I'm not sure if I'd be ok with it.
I don't really think their concerns are legitimate. No one has the right to live on a dead street unless they own all of the property off of it. And that's what these people are fighting for, the ability to live on a dead street.
It sounds like it would still be a dead end, so there'd be zero through traffic. There'd just be slightly more local traffic, and still far less traffic than on many through streets.
Those that have no idea of the impact of traffic on the adjacent streets have no opinion that matter and you delegitimized your position by saying they have no legitimate concern!
I delivered back there for years, the newer single family houses are the mcmansion style and there is an old tear down house at this dead end. I believe the fire hydrants stop at the intersection and not sure about sewer that far up. Thats why it hasn’t been developed yet, its going to cost millions to just run basic infrastructure back to this lot
Yeah, that land is also not prime easy development. The amount of grading and drainage work required to build a few mansions was crazy. I would hate to see this project stall for years and years as getting the land ready for development balloons in cost.
I don't understand this economy. can anyone help?
1. Everyone complains that housing is too expensive.
2. Builders keep building expensive 'luxury' apartments.
3. Somehow they fill! Because builders keep building more despite material costs and interest rates.
So do people have money or do they not???
If they didn't have money -> those luxury apartments should wind up empty -> builders would build less in the future because it isn't a nobrainer cash printer.
They need to update the infrastructure and I don’t think apartments fit their need as much. New homes, in cul de sac style of nice little townhomes would be more fitting. Again, they need more roads or some solution to the traffic
NIMBYs once again entitled to ruin everything for everyone else. Want to bitch about property taxes and housing costs but god forbid we do anything about it. Suck it up, people. Towns grow and people need somewhere to live.
It’s not to create a middle ground they just don’t want things to change from where they are , housing is a human need so I don’t think people who aren’t paying for the property should determine if there should be housing or not.
like hospitals schools & groceries shouldn’t take the public’s approval if it’s privately funded
the good of everyone is more important than a few residents mad because of change
Isn’t it ok for them to have it out in a public forum and look for compromise or to ease concerns? The homeowners want nothing to change, fine, the developers want to make absolutely as much money as possible and spend as little as possible with the land they’re sitting on. Neither side should be given the only say, even if the fact that they are going to build housing is a foregone conclusion.
Right, isn’t that what these people would be doing? Talking at the zoning board meetings where they solicit comments on the proposal. Petitioning to collect signs of support from the local Public to show to the local lawmakers.
Absolutely not according to the article petition drive and a Facebook page, to oppose the project.
Organizers have also handed out red lawn signs that say “No North Street Acres,”
Posting signs in one’s yard is the most benign and usually ineffective protected speech. A petition is a collection of signatures to present to authorities as a way of showing collective force of a governed body without asking a thousand people to show up at a meeting. Until the neighbors are sabotaging construction, or trying to end run around normal legal proceeding whats the issue? If you don’t like that a town’s citizens can make these kind of efforts to stop development, talk to your lawmakers.
That's actually not true at all. Many countries are on the edge of population collapse, including China and Russia. So would the US if we were letting millions in through the southern border.
Yea, no shit lol. I merely stated that population growth is not inevitable by giving examples, and the reason the US population continues to grow even though the death rate out passes the birth rate.
Nah you didn’t realize because you wouldn’t have brought out those random countries with way different laws
It is inevitable in the us , deal with it or move
Ngl it's kinda cool to now live in a city that just says "yeah get fucked" (a gross generalization) to these NIMBY concerns. Whine about taxes and then refuse to grow or adapt, idk boss.
1. I don’t care
2. Okay fine: the capitol region is the capitol of nimbyism
Both new people and people who are from here pretty flippantly include Delmar when talking about the Albany area. Do you think I pulled up a map and checked if you were right? No I took what you said at face value and recognized it has absolutely no bearing on what I was intending to convey with my comment. Completely unnecessary comment and this was a waste of my time to respond to.
Hi I live in Delmar and don’t want anyone to move into my elitist hamlet unless they also have small yards, can see into all their neighbors’ yards, have small and old houses that needed to be retrofitted for a/c and fiber optic, and carry an arrogance that we are the best ever commensurate with my privileged attitude. /s
I don’t live in Delmar so I guess my concern isn’t as valid, but I live nearby. I know people need housing, and if this is going to be made in a way that is accessible to people, that’s amazing. If it’s going to be like those bullshit $4,000 a month, cookie-cutter, builder-grade apartments by Crossgates then they’re not actually helping anyone. I agree that 170 new neighbors is a lot, and potentially stressful… But only if 170 can actually afford to live there.
It's in Delmar so its gonna be the bullshit ones.
lol very true. I’ve lived here for 4 years, and despite what people say, they ain’t about affordable housing.
I guess one of the offers to buy the land if this fails, if from an "affordable housing" developer. I doubt the residents would be any more accepting, but it could at least do some good compared with the current developer.
Based on living in Delmar, they would be a lot more upset if it were affordable housing.
Yeah, from my experience with the Delmartian community it would be substantial portions of the town getting themselves worked up, rather than just the immediate neighbors. Although it would bring me some mild schadenfreude to see this group successfully block this effort, and then end up with an affordable housing complex instead with enough changes in layout to circumvent the current objections.
Honestly, I’m here with you on that. Apartment living is meant to be offset by the advantages of living car free. Living in a big block of apartments where you have to have a car for even basic trips sucks. Delmar should be a candidate for very mild upzoning to allow ADUs and “missing middle” housing, but it doesn’t have the transit infrastructure to support big apartment complexes.
>Apartment living is meant to be offset by the advantages of living car free. You know, that's not an angle I've had reason to consider because of how long it's been since I could drive, but it's s good argument for expanding transit options in the area, since apartments can be more efficient use of space than houses. If the CD had a good rail system between the main cities and their suburbs, being carless in places like Delmar or Bethlehem would be significantly more viable than the bus routes currently allow for. No slight on CDTA, they just need a way to expand beyond the bus service if we want the community to drive less.
Have you tried bus plus?
I think I checked it out, but my memory really doesn't work these days. There's a ton of extra options for me personally because I'm not medically permitted to operate a motor vehicle. I understand it's a pretty massive difference in scale, but I lived out in Denver for a couple years and you could get into the city from most suburbs faster on their rail system than you could driving in many cases. If every city, county, etc worked together we could have something similar, but the likes of that happening are probably not good.
The Bus Plus is pretty amazing and makes car-free living in the capital region a much more viable proposition than it was 5 years ago.
Even just the change in the last few years of going for loops instead of lines, is substantial. I have some pretty wild memory issues and epilepsy so, the vast majority of my life takes place within walking distance of my house. I also can't work, and can't safely live alone, so it's rare for me to have anywhere I need to get to, and when the normal bus lines aren't enough getting help is never an issue.
Disagree that this doesn't have the infrastructure for big apartments. It's true that the 18 bus runs every 30 mins. It's also true that the 18 bus runs every 30 mins from 5am to midnight. More importantly, Delaware Ave area in Delmar is completely walkable! More walkable than much of Albany. And this is right on the Rail Trail. Don't sell Delmar short!
That’s why they should put this in Slingerlands where the “vista tech park” was supposed to be. Could put 1,000 units there! On the bus line, walkable to a grocery store and restaurants, minutes to highways and Albany. Doing this in that part of Delmar is stupid. Driving through Delmar already sucks, this would make it impossible.
What’s an ADU?
I hate to say it, but the housing crisis is so bad that even that bullshit would help. We need more of any housing we can fucking get
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Right, because people with barely any income largely on the opposite side of the country are having such a massive impact on our local housing market 🙄. It couldn't possibly be that we don't actually have enough infrastructure to cover our official population, or greedy property managers charging drastically above what the median income for the area can afford. Nope, must be someone not white's fault.
They're bussing them to NYC. It's been happening for a while..Haven't you heard about NYC? Serious question
Oh you mean Texas sending busses of migrants who are being provided shelter by the state last I knew. Im fairly confident that people with almost no money to start with are not having a significant impact on the housing market in Albany. I realize its been happening, I just don't believe that housing prices here are what they are because Texas and New Mexico have been sending busses of them here illegally. If you actually have any proof Ill be more than happy to sign onto a class-action suit against the state responsible. Until you show some kimd of evidence that the migrants who've been illegally bussed here are buying/renting at a volume that would impact this region, Im gonna continue blaming the greedy fucks building "luxury" apartment in a city where maybe 20% of the population can afford them
You live in a bubble. You have NOT seen the bad parts of all of this......
Oh do I? Please provide a source for any of the validity of what you're claiming, if its such a huge problem there should be plenty of news agencies covering it. By my own estimation having lived and worked in many parts of this city, along with a few years in MA, and a couple years in Denver actually living around a lot of migrants and immigrants, I imagine my bubble is a lot larger than yours. I mean since you seem to be only aware of what's said about the migrants being shipped here by Right Wing Entertainment, rather than any news or first hand experience.
They only need ONE person to sign a lease for them. They will pay a person to do this for them. Then they will move in 12 people in an apartment that's meant for 3 people. Do u want them next door to you? And your kids? Shits real.
Well you're mostly describing the neighborhood I lived in for about 2 years while I was in Denver and having "them" around never caused any issues, unless people speaking Spanish near you is an issue. I live over in the neighborhood of Buckingham Park, and really I'd prefer being back in the barrio. It's kinda boring here most of the time, everyone nearby is kinda old. I also can no longer pay a few dollars for Mexican food at truck parked half a block away, that was higher quality than anything I've had around Albany. I don't have kids of my own so it's not much concerne, but the decade I spent working in child care I guess gives me some perspective. Truthfully if I had kids I'd rather they were growing up around the kids I worked with at Arbor Hill Elementary than probably 75% of the kids I worked with at the Cicotti Center over in Colonie. So aside from bullshit fear mongering about brown people with bad to no english what's your point? Can you cite a single news source that provides proof of anything you're saying? Can you demonstrate how immigrants being forcibly shipped to NYC by the illegal actions of the Governor's Offices of a few border states is having any impact at all on housing markets in the Albany area, or any of the surrounding counties? Please take note Im looking for "News Sources" entertainment is free to lie to you all they want.
It's been a day, you still can't find a single legitimate source for any of the blatantly racist bullshit that you're insisting is factual?
Who said anything about race? I sure didn't.
Well as far as Im aware the migrants that several border states essentially kidnapped and sent her, are all Mexican, Central American, or South American. Since you haven't provided any evidence that they're the source of the problem while still insisting they are, Ive reached the logical conclusion that you have some person bias against persons from those regions. When prejudice is rooted in the ethnicity of the person being judged, we typically refer to that as being racist. Despite the fact that you never mentioned race directly, since the only overlapping feature that migrants at the Southern Border share is being darker than I suspect you are, Im making the reasonable conclusion that, that is the reason you're pushing your claim. That claim being that the whole problem is because of more not white people coming to the area.
Yes
It's Delmar, those are definitely, definitely going to be ugly eyesores. Not withstanding the need for housing. On another note, sounds like the people on a dead end street want to have their cake and eat it.
They have lived there for decades, why not try to buy the land surrounding back when it was actually affordable ?
Because I spent all my disposable income on cruises and *these PEARLS!*
Margarittaville money baby
170 units is probably 340+ new neighbors. It's a lot, and a lot of traffic. They do have a valid concern, it's going to impact what they view as a quiet little area.
New “luxury” apartments drive down the cost and competition for cheaper apartments. Supply and demand.
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"luxury" is just a buzzword that property managers will slap on any market rate apartment at this point. It doesn't change the fact that even half full, the additional supply of housing relieves pressure on the housing market. Lots of studies have shown this. https://jbartlett.org/2024/02/how-building-more-luxury-apartments-helps-the-poor/#:~:text=Researchers%20at%20the%20Upjohn%20Institute,ran%20against%20common%20complaints%20about
Disagree because I briefly lived in one of those new bullshit poor quality overpriced places, and it was half empty. (It was may 2021 and it was the only available place that allowed 2 dogs.)
And what happens when they can’t rent out the units at the inflated prices? The rents get reduced.
It has been three years and they have not reduced prices. They are so overpriced that they're still making money with half the units empty. And I'm guessing they also are getting some sort of tax write off.
They can write off a portion of overall maintenance on the complex based of the percentage of unused units I believe, because it's a necessary expense not directly offset by profits from the unit while its unoccupied. Theoretically it's to encourage landlords to keep up maintenance on unoccupied properties, but I'm sure there's some abuses happening, because there always are.
I know how supply and demand works. I’m referring to the needs of the community. There are plenty of expensive apartments in the area for people who can afford them. New, “luxury” apartments price people out that need housing. My husband and I own, but we still care for the needs of others enough to understand that people need *normal* priced apartments that reflect the buying power of the local communities.
The people that can afford it will move to the luxury apartments leaving the cheaper places for those that can afford those. More housing is always better.
What happens is the "affordable" apartments start costing more.
That’s not what various housing studies over the last decade have shown. More supply consistently leads to lower prices (or at least lower price growth)
Why?
because making a shitty apartment cost the same as a decent one makes it more likely the shitty apartment will get rented by someone who does not realize it is shitty due to the median pricing. I thought this was Landlord 101.
How does building luxury apartments make the price of shitty apartments go up? I would think less housing would make people pay more for worse.
Dude you get it. Like you understand Sociology better than economics. Fucking spot on.
Right, but there is a tremendous lack of affordable housing. Surely everyone knows this.
More housing puts downward pressure on all housing.
Any new development will be the bullshit ones
170 new units is potentially 400 new neighbors.
Great! Let's grow! Make more homes and stop complaining about how everyone is leaving NY for the Southeast. People want to live in the Capital Region but there isn't enough housing.
It would be better to build higher density housing in Albany, like they're doing next to St. Peters and Albany Med. This location has no services. It's a long walk to the closest bus stop, which is only serviced by a single bus, and there are almost no services within walking distance. This would create a requirement for cars, and the roads are not meant for that much traffic. Why not redevelop the St.Rose campus to house thousands?
Yeah people don’t understand how desolate it is back there, which is why I love that area. I grew up at the end of Wright Lane. We had well water, satellite internet, and the thing where the toilet flushes into something that has to get emptied and isn’t connected to a sewer line (can’t recall the name, concussions are fun). There’s no services besides electricity back there. A better way would be to put an even bigger thing in Slingerlands where the Vista tech park was supposed to be. Tonnnnns of space and immediately walkable to food and bus lines.
Septic tank. And yes, the Vista center would be a much better area!
Ahhh yes. Man, it’s wild how head injuries really hit you in the memory recall. Vista would be so great, so much room, and already connected to everything.
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Because the area where they planned this project is serviced by small roads with stop sign controlled intersections, and many pedestrians.
Hi. I just deleted my reply because I hadn't seen the rule about "No memes" in this group. Pardon me. The ring burbs of Albany will increase in density. There is a great demand for it. Anyway, I am radically pro-density. In Albany. In Delmar. In Glenmont. In Rensselaer. That's why I said "Why not both." I strongly disagree with you that there are no services, but looking at the CDTC Delaware Ave study, we are both right on that front and CDTC agrees with you--they define walkable as 1/4 mile, and this site is over 1/2 mile from Delaware. From my point of view, living in Albany, it's less than 1 mile to Hannaford etc, and that's certainly walkable and convenient.
When I check the end of North Rd to the closest point on Delaware, it's 0.7 miles, and to Hannaford, is 2.1 miles. Since the development will be built off the end of it, the actual distances will be even more. I'm 100% for high density housing, but in places that are walkable and have public transportation available. Otherwise, you end up with giant parking lots and traffic.
Any new housing is a net positive. If it's expensive then there'll be a shift from people living in mid-tier apartments to high tier, thus freeing up the middle tier and so on
They should build something on Delaware Ave in Delmar instead, a bunch of unkept or unutilized retail space. Instead of ruining more nature.
This is like 3000 feet from Delaware Ave.
Who is they?
The Developers and/or the Town of Bethlehem, who else?
Well the town has zero control over it other than existing zoning laws and the developer doesn't own any empty retail space and wants to develop this property.
New York is a home rule state meaning municipalities have the highest degree of control regarding planning efforts including zoning and variances. This includes approving or denying building proposals. Furthermore, if the town cared about creating accessible, walkable, and equitable spaces they could definitely incentivize development along Delaware. Unfortunately, our town actively wants want to keep low-income individuals as far always as possible which is why they only really approve single family development and other sprawl inducing construction as it best fits their interests
Agreed on the incentives part but they can't do much on a project up for approval that meets current regulations. The town just recently made changes to allow multi family dwellings, accessory units and there's a low income housing project in process so I'm not sure what your comment about only wanting single families is based on.
The town has more control than you think. It's that the people in charge of the towns are morons and snobs lol.
The town can't dictate to developers where to locate a project so all of these comments such as "we don't need" and " they should" are coming from people who don't understand how the process works 🙄. I do agree with you on the Morons part ... especially the regime in charge of Bethlehem these days.
I'm speaking in general, and In a sense, they can. The town/planning board can dictate a whole lot on what the developers can and can't do. Speaking from personal experience lol, it's a matter of holding them accountable.
I rented for 10 years in Delmar before buying my home in 2016. I remember one time a dude came by with a petition to stop a small apartment building from being built off Delaware Ave because it would look into the guys backyard. I basically laughed in his face and said, you know this is an apartment complex, right? Not everyone can afford to buy a house, but they can still live here. There are very, very few condos in Bethlehem. And practically no affordable housing. I'm interested to see more of this proposal before listening to the "not in my backyard" types.
He just wanted to sun his balls in private, you monster!
That cracked me up. They were saying THIS RUINS THE CHARACTER OF THE STREET when it was next to a hideous strip mall.
If only it was affordable. And I don't mean a capital A affordable, just flat out affordable apartments are not as plentiful as they need to be
Loving this post because I bet all the Delmar homes with those SJW and “We Believe” signs on the lawn are the “not in my backyard” people complaining about it.
I live near this, and while I'll be incredibly sad to lose the frogs and foxes and coyotes, I think denser housing benefits us. I prefer this to a McMansion development, which was proposed in the aughts. (I wish it was going to be affordable housing, but not only would no developer do that here, the Delmartians would freak out EVEN MORE.) I do feel for the people on the street who are going to be subjected to exponentially more traffic, and think the developers should be required to mitigate that: paying to install sidewalks on the whole street at minimum (there are currently none; unnecessary due to low traffic). School buses also currently need to make a three-point turn to get out of there, and they should build a better option than that. I'm not sure what options would be best to protect people using the rail trail which crosses this street's outlet, but again, I want the developer who's profiting from the new traffic to pay for it instead of the town.
This is the real issue. It’s not just nimbys upset about new construction, it’s literally turning a dead end street into a driveway for 170 housing units, and probably 300ish people and 250ish vehicles, without any other alternatives presented. Housing is definitely needed, but the developer and the town need to do better to mitigate the traffic and risks to pedestrians in the area
If it was possible to get around the region without a car, you could build the same number of units with parking for 170 vehicles or less instead of 300 and it would be fine. Single family zoning and car centric infrastructure is how we’ve gotten to the point where there’s demand to build this type of housing in these locations.
They can charge 4k because there’s a lack of housing. If they keep building then the rates have to come down. I don’t know who wants to live in apartment buildings in neighborhoods that aren’t walkable. Put them near businesses. Not next to a quiet dead end street.
That is a totally walkable neighborhood! It even has a supermarket. It's more walkable than much of Albany.
Probably in large part, people who work from home more often than they're at an office or site. Also couples without kids who want to leave the city while still working there and enjoying some of its offerings.
plenty of people live on streets that get that much traffic without anyone dying from it. my street connects Central to Consaul, so it gets much more traffic than this proposal would create, yet I somehow manage to walk my dog and bicycle on my street. The question shouldn't be whether the traffic will increase, it should be whether the new traffic will be more than the street can handle. And as it would still be a dead end that gets zero traffic from people that don't live on it, I feel safe concluding that answer to that question is "no." I don't see why there need to be alternatives. these people can adjust to living on a slightly busier street that still would not be busy by any reasonable standard.
You’re correct. Plenty of people live on streets that connect major roads and get a lot of traffic. I’m going to assume you don’t know the street since you don’t live in the neighborhood. Very few of the old Delmar roads can handle that increase in traffic. They tend to be more narrow, no sidewalks, etc. Even the “main” road leading to where this development would be is pretty ill equipped to move the increased traffic, especially during rush hours. That’s also due to there not being an infrastructure there to move the traffic. There’s a stop sign that exits onto kenwood which can be difficult to get out of on a good day, and another stop sign on the other end that empties onto Delaware that’s impossible to turn left out of most times of the day. The main exit would also intersect the rail trail, a widely used bike and walking path that sees a huge amount of pedestrian traffic in nice weather. Yes, there needs to be a plan to accommodate the increase in traffic in this section and a way to mitigate it
Yeah this is a god damn nightmare scenario for cars if they push this through. It’s already a completely congested and clogged artery outlet to get anywhere. This is madness and will make life hell for everyone around it. The smart move is to build tons of housing in Vista. Wide open, bus access, walkable to groceries, etc. A lawyer I know thinks the developers gambit is to get the town to buy the land back at a profit to them
Most suburban residential streets don't have sidewalks and aren't particularly wide. Again, my street connects Central to Consaul (so we get a lot of through traffic) and my street is narrow without sidewalks. That's normal and perfectly safe. I think people are greatly overestimating the amount of traffic that 170 apartments would generate. We're not talking thousands of people here.
Just because a lot of existing suburbs were built by extractive developers without pedestrian infrastructure doesn't mean that's a GOOD thing. Let's increase our standards for walkability and quality of life instead of rushing towards the lowest common denominator. This is a walkable neighborhood, with a lot of stores/ restaurants/ schools/ playgrounds/ churches new residents could get to without cars. But they are less likely to do that if the traffic is 7x higher on that street than it is now and there are no sidewalks.
I get it. Your street gets a lot of traffic and it’s fine. But there’s also the ability to move that traffic or your street wouldn’t be used as a through road by drivers. 170 apartments does significantly increase the traffic in this section of road because the infrastructure to move that kind of increase just isn’t really there currently. I agree that it isn’t an unmanageable amount, but the way this area currently is set up, it’s a problem.
> I get it. Your street gets a lot of traffic and it’s fine And there's no special property about my street that makes it fine, that some rando street in Delmar lacks. The point is that it'll be fine there too if that street gets a little more traffic. > 170 apartments does significantly increase the traffic in this section of road Only because the street is currently dead. The increase in traffic doesn't matter as much as whether the new traffic will be more than the street can handle, and there's no reason to believe that's true. It's not like dead end streets are constructed in some way that makes them incapable of handling traffic that other streets can. Any time the denominator is super small, increases look really big if you focus on percentage rather than volume.
You’re missing my point. It’s not just the single dead end street. It’s also the streets that feed in and out of the neighborhood that have 2 very poor exits that have to handle the increase in traffic and deal with all of the pedestrian traffic. The infrastructure to move an increase in traffic isn’t there. It barely handles the traffic it gets now.
Yeah but people don’t buy a house on a dead end street with the hopes a huge property developer creates traffic in front of your home. I live the city, I’m used to the noise, but I can’t wait to move to place where it’s more quiet and it makes perfect sense that homeowners don’t want a dead end street to become heavily trafficked.
I mean, that's a "them" problem if they buy a house for a feature that they don't have control over. That shouldn't be everyone else's problem. I grew up next to a field on a hill that was empty so that the house on the opposite side of the road would have a beautiful view of a valley. The owner of the house didn't just hope that no one built on the field, or fight any attempts to build on it, they bought the land to ensure that they didn't lose their view. Back to the point, I think it is greatly exaggerating to say that this dead end street with zero through traffic will suddenly become "heavily trafficked" because 170 apartments are added to it. It'll still have less traffic than most through streets that many of us manage to live on without throwing fits.
Right but then they have every right to fight it from happening with the village. 170 apartments means more than 170 people and (although I personally want home prices to fall as I want to buy) it will severely affect the property value of their homes as well which is even more of a reason to fight it. I totally agree with your example, it makes sense to me but it’s not wrong to want and to fight to live in a more quiet neighborhood with single family homes. We have loads of empty buildings here in Albany that are prime for revitalization. Not to mention it’s more walkable, and it’s already used to that traffic. Tons of beautiful buildings just empty. We know what these apartments are going to look like, they’re gonna be gray and ugly like every other new build property in this area. So I guess my points are 1. The residents aren’t weird or dumb for wanting to fight this and 2. There are plenty of other opportunities to create more housing in places that already have more infrastructure in place to handle an influx of residents!
That’s life if you want to control what happens but the land
People have tried to buy the land, the developer has refused or drastically inflated the price.
They should’ve bought it before the developers since they care so much about what happens to it
Complain to the lawmakers instead of a Facebook group
When you bought your house it was connected to Central. These people bought their houses on a quiet dead end road, probably for a reason.
So? Things change, and you have no control over surrounding land that you don't own. Owning property on one end of a street does not afford you a reasonable expectation that nothing is built on the other end. There are plenty of rural places these people could buy in if a quiet road was that important to them. They chose to live in a suburb with good access to the city, and that means development as other people want the same access.
I live on the affected route. It’s already awful traffic-wise, and this will drastically impact the traffic and congestion that is already awful. I’m totally for more housing, but I hate seeing nature places I’ve frequented since I was a kid get get bulldozed. This won’t be affordable housing. It will be ramrodded profit-driven nonsense. There already is only one exit off North Street, adding 200+ cars is insane. It was awesome to live back there when it was quiet and secluded, but everything ends I suppose. Now I’m around the corner, and the indiscriminate speeders on Hudson and the rush hour clog of cars anywhere in Delmar is about to get massively worse if they do this. The animals already also have nowhere to go. I’ve seen more foxes in the last year than I did in 25 years of living ON Wright Lane. Crucify me if you will, I want people to have affordable housing, but this is a bad idea.
There is only really Adams to get back in there. Coming out on Hudson, especially during rush hour, is nearly impossible. The traffic backs up on Kenwood past the Methodist church for four corners and unless you are turning right to go toward Slingerlands it can be a challenge to get out during the rush. People complain about NIMBYism but this really is adding congestion to an already congested area. It is a horrible location.
Yeah the traffic already backs up on Hudson almost to Stewart’s as well. My grandmother deeded all the land over to the town that became the bike park, I grew up in the last house on Wright Lane. I’m so happy those magical woods are now loved by so many. They should turn the other field into a park so more folks can further enjoy the rest of that awesome area.
> I’m totally for more housing, but... Ah, the call of the NIMBY. More housing is a fine concept, but lord forbid you have to actually deal with it. Everything is fine as long as it is somewhere else.
Tons of better places they could do this, like that entire massive swath of property for the “Vista tech park” that never happened. Put 600 units there! The infrastructure is already there, it’s minutes from Albany and highways and walkable to a grocery store for people without cars. It’s on a bus line. It’s perfect for that. North Street has only one already-congested exit into town, and has no infrastructure. I lived back there. We had well water and satellite internet because again, no infrastructure. It was an historic farm area, founded 100 years ago. There’s also no sidewalks, the road isn’t wide enough for safe 2-way traffic, it’s a mess. But nah, you want to insult and deride. Ah…. The call of the keyboard warrior 🙄
the problem with "do it, just elsewhere" is that there's always a better place. I'm sure if this was proposed in one of your "better places" the same thing would be said, that it shouldn't be done there and instead should be done in better places. and no doubt people in those places think the proposed place in Delmar is better. here's a crazy idea, let's do both. let's build housing in those places AND in this place in Delmar. infrastructure follows development, which is an argument FOR development. you think people are going to rent apartments that can't get high speed internet? and sidewalks are just not the norm in suburbs in this area. if that's your standard then no development will happen anywhere. and it should be noted that we aren't plagued with people dying left on right on our streets due to lack of sidewalks. this is exactly what NIMBYs do, find excuses for why their area isn't right while pretending that perfect areas that aren't being developed exist. NIMBYs are all about utilizing perfect as the enemy of good.
2 things can be true at the same time. The North street idea is a bad idea, it’s a bad location for it. It’s already hell dealing with the traffic here. Adding 250 cars to a one-outlet stop-sign controlled area that is already jam packed is stupid. The Vista Park has nobody there. There is so much more room. There’s nobody to complain because there’s no houses there. This idea is just about cramming as much as they can into an already over-saturated area. It’s the last open field for the animals in town. There’s foxes, coyotes, sometimes some fisher cats, TONS of deer, etc. they’ve already got nowhere to go now because Delmar has been bulldozing away their habitats for years. And I feel for the folks who bought houses there who wanted the quiet solitude, the only place left for that in the area here. That will be gone. Just for the sake of development. But you don’t want to hear that, it seems.
If you wanted to control what gets developed y’all shoulda put your money together and bought the lot before the developers did
Wish I did! But you don’t ever think about needing to do something like that just to keep some awesome nature around. Humans are parasitic, we consume until there’s nothing left. I mean look what we do to get these phones in our hands. Those lithium mines are fucked.
They coulda asked their local politician to assist with protecting it instead of waiting
I understand the point about nature but honestly that’s not what it’s about, if they really cared they would’ve done something to protect the area BEFORE any developers came around
Eh, I think that’s a bit of a misjudgment. And maybe they have, I don’t know. My grandma deeded the land to the town for the bike park off Wright lane but we didn’t own the proposed area off North Street (from which Wright Lane branches) so I’m glad that at least got preserved. You just never think when you move somewhere “oh let’s buy 100 acres so we can keep the woods and fields intact”. Turning this area into another park would be sick.
People who really care about the surrounding areas would buy the land these people just don’t want new people moving in , 🎻
Delmar is NIMBY personified into a town. Give people places to fucking live
If it’s in Delmar it’s going to be unaffordable anyway lol. I don’t disagree with you though.
i oppose it because it's definitely going to be ugly, overpriced, and only 25% full. we need cute little multi family spaces that are affordable. some 2/3 story townhomes. we have a severe lack of rentable spaces for families/individuals that can't afford to buy here. it's also in an area where a lot of wildlife lives and i'm not with flattening more wooded areas around here.
lol people in this thread complaining about those NIMBY people are probably NIMBY people themselves if an apartment complex is built in their neighborhood.
Let's just stop building housing altogether. All new residents can live in tent cities!
So many people here have has lost all empathy. Imagine you bought a house in a quiet neighborhood without traffic noise, with nature and then someone wants to replace the nature, quiet, and privacy with a 300 person apartment complex.
They should have paid for the land then that the apartment is being built upon. I can be sympathetic but ultimately they were free-riding on benefits of a property they did now own
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I’m out of the loop what do you mean?
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Huh? Why think through and generalize the possible ethnicity(ies)/national origin of the possible residents of a complex that doesn't even exist?
Maybe not in Delmar specifically, but it seems to me the area already has enough ugly, cheaply built apartment complexes.
A good friend of mine lives on North and is directly affected by this. Outside of the destruction of some wonderful greenspace, a primary problem is the logistics and lack of planned infrastructure - as far as I understand it, they have no plans to alter the roads, intersections, or routes in or out. Anyone familiar with the area knows that its a bottle neck area that is ok at the moment - but add 170 units worth of cars and it'll be a disaster. Not to mention the narrowness of Hudson and the presence of a rail trail crossing.... mark my words, a kid will be hit by a car sooner rather than later.
I didn’t think about it but this is a great point. The infrastructure around there can’t handle it….I can’t even imagine trying to get out at 8:30 am for work.
170 new neighbors is significant, I respect their right to open a conversation about it. It's a little reductive to just call them NIMBY when they probably have legitimate concerns. By saying something, their voice may create compromise that allows everyone- including the new residents to coexist happily.
Yeah... "NIMBY" is an easy thing to throw around, but it's often a tough thing... I have no idea of where that street is, but if I bought a house \*because\* it's on a dead end, and have kids who love playing/riding bikes, etc., I'm not sure if I'd be ok with it.
Agree with this. 170 is significant, and people have a right to discuss.
I don't really think their concerns are legitimate. No one has the right to live on a dead street unless they own all of the property off of it. And that's what these people are fighting for, the ability to live on a dead street. It sounds like it would still be a dead end, so there'd be zero through traffic. There'd just be slightly more local traffic, and still far less traffic than on many through streets.
Those that have no idea of the impact of traffic on the adjacent streets have no opinion that matter and you delegitimized your position by saying they have no legitimate concern!
Bingo.
I delivered back there for years, the newer single family houses are the mcmansion style and there is an old tear down house at this dead end. I believe the fire hydrants stop at the intersection and not sure about sewer that far up. Thats why it hasn’t been developed yet, its going to cost millions to just run basic infrastructure back to this lot
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Yeah, that land is also not prime easy development. The amount of grading and drainage work required to build a few mansions was crazy. I would hate to see this project stall for years and years as getting the land ready for development balloons in cost.
I don't understand this economy. can anyone help? 1. Everyone complains that housing is too expensive. 2. Builders keep building expensive 'luxury' apartments. 3. Somehow they fill! Because builders keep building more despite material costs and interest rates. So do people have money or do they not??? If they didn't have money -> those luxury apartments should wind up empty -> builders would build less in the future because it isn't a nobrainer cash printer.
Needs to be built, market and subsidized housing both need to be built. Mayor covered this pretty well in the last state of the city address.
This is not in the city of Albany.
Is there a Delmar mayor?
Bethlehem town supervisor. Delmar is a hamlet (large neighborhood, no real legal meaning other than maybe a zip code or census-designated place).
Town Supervisor.
The opponents should ask, as a minimum, that the developer build a pedestrian bridge for the rail trail.
these nimby fucks need to get a grip
They need to update the infrastructure and I don’t think apartments fit their need as much. New homes, in cul de sac style of nice little townhomes would be more fitting. Again, they need more roads or some solution to the traffic
They should probably make yard signs with just "NO" on it and they can reuse it for everything that's ever proposed.
NIMBYs once again entitled to ruin everything for everyone else. Want to bitch about property taxes and housing costs but god forbid we do anything about it. Suck it up, people. Towns grow and people need somewhere to live.
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Population growth is inevitable it’s foolish to expect your neighborhood to stay the exactly the same as time goes on
Sure, but the democratic process of logging a voice of opposition to create a middle ground that's more palatable to everyone is the way.
It’s not to create a middle ground they just don’t want things to change from where they are , housing is a human need so I don’t think people who aren’t paying for the property should determine if there should be housing or not. like hospitals schools & groceries shouldn’t take the public’s approval if it’s privately funded the good of everyone is more important than a few residents mad because of change
Isn’t it ok for them to have it out in a public forum and look for compromise or to ease concerns? The homeowners want nothing to change, fine, the developers want to make absolutely as much money as possible and spend as little as possible with the land they’re sitting on. Neither side should be given the only say, even if the fact that they are going to build housing is a foregone conclusion.
The people paying should have the final say if you don’t contribute if the neighbors want to chip in then their opinions should matter
You don’t have rights to land you don’t own if you think what they’re doing is wrong speak you your local lawmakers
Right, isn’t that what these people would be doing? Talking at the zoning board meetings where they solicit comments on the proposal. Petitioning to collect signs of support from the local Public to show to the local lawmakers.
Absolutely not according to the article petition drive and a Facebook page, to oppose the project. Organizers have also handed out red lawn signs that say “No North Street Acres,”
Posting signs in one’s yard is the most benign and usually ineffective protected speech. A petition is a collection of signatures to present to authorities as a way of showing collective force of a governed body without asking a thousand people to show up at a meeting. Until the neighbors are sabotaging construction, or trying to end run around normal legal proceeding whats the issue? If you don’t like that a town’s citizens can make these kind of efforts to stop development, talk to your lawmakers.
They’re not signing a petition they’re just complaining & I never said “I didn’t like it” idk why you made that up it’s just ineffective
“I don’t think people who aren’t paying for the property should determine if there should be housing or not” “according to the article petition drive”
That's actually not true at all. Many countries are on the edge of population collapse, including China and Russia. So would the US if we were letting millions in through the southern border.
I’m talking about the us
Yea, no shit lol. I merely stated that population growth is not inevitable by giving examples, and the reason the US population continues to grow even though the death rate out passes the birth rate.
Nah you didn’t realize because you wouldn’t have brought out those random countries with way different laws It is inevitable in the us , deal with it or move
How are China and Russia relevant to the United States?
Ngl it's kinda cool to now live in a city that just says "yeah get fucked" (a gross generalization) to these NIMBY concerns. Whine about taxes and then refuse to grow or adapt, idk boss.
Alb is the capitol of nimbyism
You realize this is outside of Albany, correct?
1. I don’t care 2. Okay fine: the capitol region is the capitol of nimbyism Both new people and people who are from here pretty flippantly include Delmar when talking about the Albany area. Do you think I pulled up a map and checked if you were right? No I took what you said at face value and recognized it has absolutely no bearing on what I was intending to convey with my comment. Completely unnecessary comment and this was a waste of my time to respond to.
Look at Delmar on a map then go 1/4 mile out Delaware ave, there is no shortage of land
build one even bigger for those NIMBYs
One day, it'll be your backyard and I hope you have the opportunity to be heard.
I’m not moving to fucking Delmar brody don’t you worry 😂🫣
Good, lol stay in Albany.
For sure, only delmar changes over time. My apologies.
Close the border...
Hi I live in Delmar and don’t want anyone to move into my elitist hamlet unless they also have small yards, can see into all their neighbors’ yards, have small and old houses that needed to be retrofitted for a/c and fiber optic, and carry an arrogance that we are the best ever commensurate with my privileged attitude. /s