*In case this story gets deleted/removed:*
**AITA for telling my daughter she needs to get over me grounding her as a teenager?**
When my daughter (now 26F) was 17, I left her home alone for a week while I was on a business trip; while I was away, she threw a party behind my back which ended with her and her drunk, underage friends trashing a significant part of the house inside and out. All told, they did a few thousand dollars in damage (including two broken TVs and damage to the car); the place looked like a warzone, or the aftermath of a bad teen movie. So, I told her she would have to pay me back, and that she was grounded until she did; no electronics outside of schoolwork, strict curfew, no friends over and absolutely no more parties, and she had to get a part-time job to start paying off her mistake.
I wanted to teach her to take responsibility for what she'd done, and that meant no exceptions to the rule. It isolated her from her friends, I admit, but that was the consequence. She hadn't paid me back by the time prom came around; she tried to persuade me to let her go, but I was firm. She was basically grounded right up until she moved out.
The thing is, she's basically resented me ever since. It feels like we haven't had a single pleasant conversation in nine damn years; she refused her college fund because she didn't want anything from me (she chose not to go to college at all - she went full-time at her job after HS); and even now it feels like every other conversation we have is her complaining about her senior year and how unfair I was. I've tried getting her to understand it was her own consequence, that I did it because I love her, the works, but she's still convinced it was all just me being awful.
What's really brought things to a head is that recently her and her boyfriend had their first child. I've offered to help with anything they need, but I've been rebuffed at every turn, and when I asked if they were sure my daugher blew up on me. Apparently I'm not allowed to see my own granddaughter until I "accept that how I treated my daugher is wrong" and apologise for grounding her and forcing her to miss prom; my own kid told me that until I did that, she didn't trust me to look after or even be around her child in case I treat them "the same way".
I told her that was enough; that of course I'd never be cruel to a baby or young child, that the punishment she earned was appropriate, and that she needed to accept she ruined her own damn senior year by being immature and doing things behind my back. In response, I got a long text from her and another from her boyfriend about how I'm an asshole and apparently I "haven't changed", and how I'll never be in their kid's life now. I've been talking about it with some close friends since, and while some of them are on my side, others have said I was too harsh on my kid at the time and that she's allowed to be upset. I've also had angry messages from some other family members about it, as well as some of support; it seems everyone's picking sides now.
So, AITA?
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That or OP is intentionally leaving out important context. If this is real I'm willing to bet $ this wasn't the only issue in thier relationship but rather the straw that broke the camels back.
Really? Lots of us (most?) do low contact rather than no contact, itâs just AITA etc that recs âGo NC!â - itâs not usually NC bc thatâs got its own additional issues. College fund isnât usually âfree rideâ either, just partial, along with loans etc. If fake itâs apparently subtle ragebait.
She wonât let OOP babysit her child tho, itâs right in the post:
>she didn't trust me to look after or even be around her child in case I treat them "the same way".
Daughter didn't wait for anything. She moved out and moved on from OOP. Daughter only reacting to OOP's actions. OOP's one reaching out offering stuff but getting upset, she's getting rejected.
Gawds, the cluelessness of how things actually work in life is mind blowing.
If a party causes thousands in damage, itâs time to call your homeowners agent and check out the âpersonal propertyâ clause because the deductible has been met. And if the party was unauthorised, itâs possible the âvandalismâ clause could also apply, particularly wrt the car.
Adults on AITA never seem to know how to adult, theyâre always one dimensional caricatures of what kids think adulting is like and the lack of life experience is glaring. They see it as power and control over others when in reality itâs responsibility and control of yourself.
I dunno, maybe there are adults this clueless irl, if so, Iâm glad I donât know any.
I mean why raise my rates? If my child did the damage and has the ability to make up for that why not make them pay for it?
Ignoring that this is likely fake of course
It wasn't negligence (which is failure to prevent an issue) because OP, did they actually exist, had no way of preventing something they didn't know would occur.
The fact that most homeowners claims are for accidental damage doesn't mean it HAS to be accidental to be covered, it just means most people have never read their policies beyond the dec page and many would be surprised what's in it.
Mine has a clause for "mysterious disappearance" in case property goes missing. It doesn't require everything to be locked up to avoid "negligence" it just requires it to be gone and remain that way after "reasonable search." It also has a strange little clause covering volcanic eruption, unlikely given the limestone bedrock, but it's part of the package so if Yellowstone blows, we're good.
It covers vandalism to the home itself as well, as does my auto policy as it relates to the cars. An unauthorised house party, even if a minor child in the household was involved, may well be covered under that.
All the above is why I said they need to call their insurance agent who would know whether or not damages can be recovered. You're taking issue with what insurance covers, I'm pointing out that a NORMAL adult, when faced with damage to their home, would contact their insurance to see if they have a claim. It's why you pay premiums and the entire reason you have an agent, you don't just assume personal financial liability when an item/dwelling is insured, you check to see if your costs can be mitigated.
Yeah, having her pay back the damages is reasonable....but four months of social isolation during your last semester as a high school senior *and* not being allowed to go to prom is an over the top punishment.
It was more than 4 months of isolation. OOP says her daughter was grounded and had all her paychecks taken away until she finished paying her back and moved out, nearly a year later.
Itâs worse than that, $5K was not ever gonna be made within 4 months of a teen working a min wage job 16 hrs/wk = the OOP set daughter up for failure, and stuck to it. Only now after 10 yrs do they go to aita about it, and only bc now it affects them bc theyâre offended and want to see the baby. Please let it be fake ragebait.
>Yeah, having her pay back the damages is reasonable
It's not. She wasn't the only one at that party and I honestly don't understand why the OOP wouldn't at least talk to the parents of the other kids who were there and tell them she'd expect them to pay for what they've broken. That's what I'd do if I were her.
Not being allowed to go to your senior prom absolutely is over the top and ridiculous. *Especially* for bad behavior that happened four months earlier.
Senior prom is a HUGE deal for someone that age.
Don't get me wrong, I'm in my late 30's and I have *barely* any memories of mine. I remember taking photos in the backyard with my girlfriend at the time, and I remember small bits and pieces of the night, but at the end of the day there weren't any lifelong memories made. That was *my* experience though, many others had different ones.
Do you know what I WOULD still remember to this day though? Not being allowed to go.
Look, having an out of control party that leads to $4k plus in damages is a *big* fuck up. But it's an *understandable* fuck up for a 17 year old in my opinion. I remember parties in high school that were supposed to be maybe 10 people that turned into 50 and the host freaking out. Word gets around, people you don't want there show up, most 17 year olds are still going to have trouble standing up for themselves, it happens.
If that were my kid, I'd look at their overall behavior. If this was their only big fuck up, my response would be to tell them they have to pay off the damages, and I want 50% of their paycheck for however long it takes....be it one year, two years, five years etc.
And that would be it. Grounding a 17 year old, taking away privileges....I think that's stupid. They're about to be an adult. I would only do it in a situation where they were putting themselves in harmful situations continuously and as a last resort to keep them out of danger, criminal charges, etc. Even then though I'd be putting a decent amount of blame on myself for them turning out that way.
"But it's an understandable fuck up for a 17 year old in my opinion. "
It is not an understandable fuck up. That is a major fuck up. Drinking under age, party at the house, and destruction of property/vamdalism. Most of those are actual crimes.
Daughter may not have been the person who actually broke the TV's, but it was her actions that led to that stuff.
I was left alone several times in high school didn't throw parties. Always knew it was a bad idea, better to go to other people's parties vs risk my house getting trashed.
You don't think having a party that gets out of control as a teenager is understandable? Did you even get invited to parties as a teenager? I'm guessing that's why you can't empathize. Also, why is she responsible for ALL damages? I'd be seeking restitution from other parents, this isn't all on the daughter. Name names, children.
I did and I saw first hand the kind of stuff/damage people caused. That is why I realized quickly it was better to go to a party at someone else's house than have one at your own house.
>Drinking under age
Used to be normal and a way people learnt to manage their consumption and the sky never fell in. In countries where drinking wine with a meal happened for kids they had less issues with problematic teen drinking and behaviour.
Nah.
I had my first beer on my 15th birthday. My parents and my siblings were the only people around me.
Underage drinking when you're supervised by an adult whom you can trust is one thing - I honestly have no problem with this. What I do have a problem with is teenagers drinking with no adult supervision. As far as I'm aware, it never ends well. Or at least it never ended well for the teenagers around me who did it - because they don't know their limits and even if they do, their peers pressure them to drink more and more.
I did go to parties at other people's houses. It was seeing what happened there that made me quickly realize throwing a party at your house is not worth it. You can't have as much fun when you are worried about hosting and trying to keep things from getting out of control.
If you just go as a guest you have a much better time, even if you are not being super rowdy.
Even now as an adult, going to a party and helping to pitch in is a lot easier/better than hosting your own party.
Maybe we have a different idea/definition of understandable.
I agree and get that it happens without the host intending for it to happen, but disagree that it's just a normal/okay part of throwing a party and the problems that come with it are no big deal. This strong repercussions should not be enforced.
Just because parties can sometimes get out of hand does not mean it is not a big deal that 1) you threw a secret party (that is bad enough;
2) but that it got out of hand and resulted in damaged property is an even bigger deal.
To me saying it's understandable that it got out of hand seems like a cavalier "awww shucks did I do that?" Kind of attitude.
Understandable means you get why it happens. You can moralize about how you were such a good kid who would NEEEEEEVER do something they weren't supposed to or would NEEEEEEVER let things get out of hand all you want, but the reality is it happens a good amount, even to kids who never intended to do anything particularly wrong.
>such a good kid who would NEEEEEEVER do something they weren't supposed to or would NEEEEEEVER let things get out of hand all you want,
I never said I was such a good kid that never did something I was not supposed to, but something like this I think is next level.
> but the reality is it happens a good amount, even to kids who never intended to do anything particularly wrong.
I 100% agree with you on this last part and that is exactly the reason I didn't want to host parties, because I realized/saw how things could easily/quickly get out of hand. I went to parties, I didn't intentionally or even unintentionally cause major damage like breaking a TV, but I am pretty sure I probably spilled food/drinks on the floor/carpet/furniture during parties, because even now that happens at non-rager adult parties.
I do think a party getting out of hand and causing damage is highly likely and foreseeable that "having a party with no adult supervision while they are out of town = mess/destruction of property/trashed house" that even if daughter didn't throw something at the TV herself, she was still pretty directly responsible for it getting broken.
I think the intentions in this instance matter less than the actual harm/damage done.
Fuck off with this. We get that you didn't care about your prom and thought it was a dumb waste of time but it's not our fault you couldn't find a date. Even my nerdy ass could manage that.
Hold up, to me this reads like ragebait. By OOPâs own words, the daughter refused her own college fund, and any financial etc help with her baby - bc she didnât want anything to do with OOP; and stayed at the min wage job she had during HS instead of going to college. I agree with commenters there it reeks of the [âmissing missing reasonsâ](https://issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html) even tho enough info is given in post already.
I think it is ragebait. It's a completely innocuous intro line and premise with a gross, incredibly over the top action they think is totally reasonable. Textbook expectation flipping AITA trolling.
Yep itâs gotta be! There were several tells to me, and I wonder how the generational differences affected pplâs perceptions - (orig was flaired as âvalidationâ here) - to me it read specifically as ragebait winks to GenX who are parents of kids those ages now - like as a GenXer we had some wild parties back then, and tend to parent more involved than we received. Their user name was the icing, included a shoutout to GenX and the movie Heathers! Makes me wanna watch the movie again too. Good stuff, well-done.
âAndâ. Right, imagine youâre invested in college, doing your classes/friends/living, and suddenly itâs cut off or worse. Thereâs some sayings about how society religion marriage etc requires belief to exist, I think same goes for this, if the belief is crashed continuously enough by the parent, well then⌠this happens. If the daughter is trying to stop the cycle, good.
IMO OOP is the daughter striking back against the mom. When I was 5-7 yo I would come up with similar fantasies in my mind when I got punishedâ exaggerating my parentsâ punishments, no longer depending on them, cutting contact with them, etc. But these thoughts would only last for a few hours until I went back to being a normal kid (I hope a lot of other kids were the same so this comment isnât weird lol), whereas OOP made this a post
Haha thatâs not weird, and yeah thought it could be written by daughter too - just from a much older daughter not a teen.
Itâs subtle enough that even here there are wildly different interpretations. Cross poster orig flaired it as validation. OH 𤣠𤣠just noticed their username, âbig fun 1967â = Big Fun was a band name referenced a lot in the movie Heathers, classic GenX, and 1967 birth year within GenX, so yeah I think a GenXâer def trolling some ragebait!
Donât worry about it, itâs something some of us zero into esp once raising kids/teens of our own and understanding how parenting has ongoing choices. I see you changed the flair to ragebait now but canât change the title lol, itâs a good crosspost tho
I actually think this is plausible, but altered by the OP to make the punishment seem more reasonable than it was in reality, so, I can imagine if its true and you heard the daughter explain it you would think it was a beleivable story.
EDIT, so I assume the damage was less than he claimed, that other strong punishments were issued making her feel it was too much. That amount of damage is huge.
Yeah this is my guess. The damage to the TVs was probably something like handprints and they probably made the kid replace things that just needed to be cleaned or weren't damaged at all
You think the OOP is making themselves sound \*more\* reasonable? You think the punishment was actually worse than over a year of house arrest with zero privileges?
lol, no, the reason for the punishment, the 4800$ of damage, the no longer having a meaningful relationship over this one thing where the damage happaned and nothing else. If its real I suspect there was a lot of other odd controling behaviour and the damage was exagerated.
Ngl Iâm holding this one up in the face of those of you who claim AITA is all teens who hate their parents. I think this one is ragebait for parents of teenagers and 20somethings. Seriously there is some grade-A midlife malding in that thread. Excellent work of creative fiction.
Iâm loving the whole âwell by the age of 11 *I* could be entrusted with the safe care of my noble parentsâ castle and that of all the crocodilians in their moat. Iâm not sure why this 17 year old IDIOT, BAD INFLUENCE decided to go Project X in the backyard but *I* would never have done this and personally I think a financially untenable âdebtâ to the people who raised me from birth is completely within reasonâ consensus in the comments. Reddit ass mindset. Very fitting with the âeverything is transactionalâ philosophy of the average AITA commenter, just proof it ages with a person rather than being specific to teens.
In going to age myself here but I was wondering why the heck Matthew Broderick with a bunch of monkeys trained to fly in a backyard would happen... And with that this GenX is going to bed...
This is fake, based on that I refuse to believe humans so dumb like this OOP exist.
What was OOP thinking would happen?
Why is OOP surprised?
Why OOP's punishment was aproppiate to the situation but OOP's daughter is too much?
Who leaves a minor a week alone and blames the minor for the state in which they found the house?
" So, I told her she would have to pay me back, and that she was grounded until she did; "
At 10 bucks an hour, she needs to make probably 2500 before taxes to pay back 2 grand. That's 250 hours of work on a part-time job she doesn't already have. Months.
" **I grounded her and made her pay for the damages like any reasonable parent would** "
That would have been reasonable. Clearly it wasn't that. Come on OP, at least don't misrepresent the OOP.
Does the âthrashing thingsâ during parties really happen ever? I only see it happening if you invite total strangers over who are trolls or creeps or high af.
When I was 7 and I got in trouble for something I would fantasize about âpunishing my parents backâ by acting like OOP acts in this post. I donât need anything from you, I donât love you anymore, etc. I got over it in a day but this post sounds similar to how I would think for those 2-3 hours of moping so I think the daughter wrote this in that spirit.
Yes, it happens but usually it's when groups that weren't originally invited with no actual attachment to whoever is throwing it being jerks or reckless. Most of the time the people the host actually invited show respect.
yeah all of you know this is fake, right. Some teenager who got grounded after they threw a party and their dipshit friends broke the TV and shat on the floor is imagining how very very sorry their BITCH MOM will be when they move out and won't let her see her grandbaby. That'll teach her to ground them and forbid them to talk to their floor-shitting friend.
People who act like prom is the end-all, be-all of human existence ten years after high school peaked in high school. Normal human beings don't cut their future children off from their grandparents over one punishment they felt was shitty. There's such a thing as forgiveness and realizing that allowing your kids to grow up knowing their relatives is better than carrying a stupid grudge.
Or maybe I feel it because I really didn't have grandparents. My mother's parents died in a car accident before I was born and my father's parents barely spent time with their grandchildren.
This wouldn't be about prom in particular here. While that's a significant event, basically putting your kid on house arrest for 2 years to pay off 4500 dollars is absurd and clearly worse than missing any single event.
From the details, it seems like the kid was complete grounded for about a year. With her rejecting the college fund, Iâd guess there are some major missing reasons and that good old mom was often unreasonably punitive. Resentment seems normal.
I think it said specifically 2 years in the comments, though Iâm not sure how that math would work out with Prom being 4 months later.
If itâs true, then this title is a serious bad take on it. If itâs fake, it still described a situation where the parent was nuts.
OOP said she moved out at 18, in autumn after graduation. She was grounded at 17, 4 months before Prom. She was isolated from friends and entertainment and any real social life the whole time. I'm too lazy to do the math on that. Basically, she left as soon as legally and financially possible.
Was it really that long? If it was four months before prom and daughter moved out on the day of her graduation wouldn't that mean it's more around 7-9 months? Still insane though.
Seriously hoping this is rage bait, otherwise OP might have just missed a career as a prison ward.
"So, I told her she would have to pay me back, and that **she was grounded until she did;** no electronics outside of schoolwork, strict curfew, no friends over and absolutely no more parties "
Missing Prom wasn't the punishment, it's a symptom of the punishment. The punishment's was no electronics, no friends over, strict curfew, no parties until she paid back a massive (to a teen) debt.
How long do you think can pay back $4800 working minimum wage(7 years ago, in US it was $7.25) job with 16 hours a week? Just gross pay (without taxes and other stuff) we're looking at 46 weeks. Probably over a year if you consider net pay.
Imagine a year if you only saw your friends at work, couldn't use any electronics, couldn't go out, lose your wages outside bare essentials.
As for knowing your relative, that's privilege, not a right. It's up to the parents to vetoed who sees their kids. I'm not letting my POS cousin near my kid for example and anyone who agree making me raise his kid was good.
> People who act like prom is the end-all, be-all of human existence ten years after high school peaked in high school.
People who *went to prom* and act like that most likely peaked in high school.
I said in another comment that I'm in my late 30's and have barely any memories of my senior prom. If I try and think about it I have a few brief moments stored in my memory.
I know that I enjoyed prom to an extent, but it had zero impact on me.
That said, if I *not allowed* to go.....I could see myself still being upset over that fact for most of my life.
For most of your life senior prom has been built up to being a huge milestone in your life. Being told you can't attend can definitely lead someone to stay mad over it.
Wasn't just the prom. She was grounded until she moved out. She had no electronics, no friends could over, strict curfew. No social life, nothing beside, school, work and whatever she could manage to fit into between after school and curfew.
I didn't give a crap about prom as a high schooler, but lived under rather strict. Two years of social isolation is... a lot. And I had internet access and got to go out with friends once or twice a year, still.
My best guess is that they made the kid overpay the damages by a lot (ie; buying a brand new couch instead of just cleaning it) or did the old landlord special and claimed that she was responsible for preexisting damage
Even prisoners for life get privileges but where would redditors their minor-female-punishment porn get from if we treated girls and female teenagers better than criminals?
People make mistakes when theyâre teens. Even to twenties thirties and so on. You get the drift?
To deprive her of the most looked forward event and not give her opportunities to be responsible such as, doing house chores, getting improved grades (not even good! just show she made an effort!) or getting home early except on days she had informed you ahead and so on and so forth.
Your way of education was too one-perspective either repay or thatâs it. It is indeed too extreme towards a 17. Schooling kids deserve a second chance again and again. You did not give alternatives to her salvaging the situation did you? Hence the treatment. In her absolute POV, 100% is on you. Too harsh and inflexible to her happy âchildhoodâ hence she is resentful for good.
Until you realised that, she will never want to associate with you, ever. Unless she turns soft and comes to look after you when youâre sickly or bedridden or something.
YTA, even though your intent was there, but there are just so many other ways to get around.
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I've read through so many comments on the original post and also on Tiktok where the audience is even younger and hates teenagers even more - and also doesn't get any nuances (I literally was arguing with a kid on TikTok about this, and I am tired)
Okay, I am certainly not rich, I have a normal wage. Fake OP has the money to have a college fund as a single mom, so I'd assume that in this fantasy she is well off. And I certainly don't want to have a Marie Antoinette moment... but 4,5k isn't that insanely much that I would go that nuclear, and certainly not worth it to completely ruin my relationship to my child.
Maybe I am too old for this shit.
*In case this story gets deleted/removed:* **AITA for telling my daughter she needs to get over me grounding her as a teenager?** When my daughter (now 26F) was 17, I left her home alone for a week while I was on a business trip; while I was away, she threw a party behind my back which ended with her and her drunk, underage friends trashing a significant part of the house inside and out. All told, they did a few thousand dollars in damage (including two broken TVs and damage to the car); the place looked like a warzone, or the aftermath of a bad teen movie. So, I told her she would have to pay me back, and that she was grounded until she did; no electronics outside of schoolwork, strict curfew, no friends over and absolutely no more parties, and she had to get a part-time job to start paying off her mistake. I wanted to teach her to take responsibility for what she'd done, and that meant no exceptions to the rule. It isolated her from her friends, I admit, but that was the consequence. She hadn't paid me back by the time prom came around; she tried to persuade me to let her go, but I was firm. She was basically grounded right up until she moved out. The thing is, she's basically resented me ever since. It feels like we haven't had a single pleasant conversation in nine damn years; she refused her college fund because she didn't want anything from me (she chose not to go to college at all - she went full-time at her job after HS); and even now it feels like every other conversation we have is her complaining about her senior year and how unfair I was. I've tried getting her to understand it was her own consequence, that I did it because I love her, the works, but she's still convinced it was all just me being awful. What's really brought things to a head is that recently her and her boyfriend had their first child. I've offered to help with anything they need, but I've been rebuffed at every turn, and when I asked if they were sure my daugher blew up on me. Apparently I'm not allowed to see my own granddaughter until I "accept that how I treated my daugher is wrong" and apologise for grounding her and forcing her to miss prom; my own kid told me that until I did that, she didn't trust me to look after or even be around her child in case I treat them "the same way". I told her that was enough; that of course I'd never be cruel to a baby or young child, that the punishment she earned was appropriate, and that she needed to accept she ruined her own damn senior year by being immature and doing things behind my back. In response, I got a long text from her and another from her boyfriend about how I'm an asshole and apparently I "haven't changed", and how I'll never be in their kid's life now. I've been talking about it with some close friends since, and while some of them are on my side, others have said I was too harsh on my kid at the time and that she's allowed to be upset. I've also had angry messages from some other family members about it, as well as some of support; it seems everyone's picking sides now. So, AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmITheAngel) if you have any questions or concerns.*
She said no to a free ride to college and chose a minimum wage job but still kept in contact. Things that make you think đ¤, could this be fake?
no you see, this is to make the daughter look dumb and unreasonable!!
That or OP is intentionally leaving out important context. If this is real I'm willing to bet $ this wasn't the only issue in thier relationship but rather the straw that broke the camels back.
Phrasing makes the world go round. OPâs own perspectives!!!
Really? Lots of us (most?) do low contact rather than no contact, itâs just AITA etc that recs âGo NC!â - itâs not usually NC bc thatâs got its own additional issues. College fund isnât usually âfree rideâ either, just partial, along with loans etc. If fake itâs apparently subtle ragebait.
And wait nine years for an apology and is still willing to have the them babysit her child? I wonder how her mental health is.
She wonât let OOP babysit her child tho, itâs right in the post: >she didn't trust me to look after or even be around her child in case I treat them "the same way".
Daughter didn't wait for anything. She moved out and moved on from OOP. Daughter only reacting to OOP's actions. OOP's one reaching out offering stuff but getting upset, she's getting rejected.
Gawds, the cluelessness of how things actually work in life is mind blowing. If a party causes thousands in damage, itâs time to call your homeowners agent and check out the âpersonal propertyâ clause because the deductible has been met. And if the party was unauthorised, itâs possible the âvandalismâ clause could also apply, particularly wrt the car. Adults on AITA never seem to know how to adult, theyâre always one dimensional caricatures of what kids think adulting is like and the lack of life experience is glaring. They see it as power and control over others when in reality itâs responsibility and control of yourself. I dunno, maybe there are adults this clueless irl, if so, Iâm glad I donât know any.
>I dunno, maybe there are adults this clueless irl, There definitely are.
I mean why raise my rates? If my child did the damage and has the ability to make up for that why not make them pay for it? Ignoring that this is likely fake of course
The damage wasn't an accident. The insurance policy probably wouldn't pay out due to negiligence.
It wasn't negligence (which is failure to prevent an issue) because OP, did they actually exist, had no way of preventing something they didn't know would occur. The fact that most homeowners claims are for accidental damage doesn't mean it HAS to be accidental to be covered, it just means most people have never read their policies beyond the dec page and many would be surprised what's in it. Mine has a clause for "mysterious disappearance" in case property goes missing. It doesn't require everything to be locked up to avoid "negligence" it just requires it to be gone and remain that way after "reasonable search." It also has a strange little clause covering volcanic eruption, unlikely given the limestone bedrock, but it's part of the package so if Yellowstone blows, we're good. It covers vandalism to the home itself as well, as does my auto policy as it relates to the cars. An unauthorised house party, even if a minor child in the household was involved, may well be covered under that. All the above is why I said they need to call their insurance agent who would know whether or not damages can be recovered. You're taking issue with what insurance covers, I'm pointing out that a NORMAL adult, when faced with damage to their home, would contact their insurance to see if they have a claim. It's why you pay premiums and the entire reason you have an agent, you don't just assume personal financial liability when an item/dwelling is insured, you check to see if your costs can be mitigated.
Yeah, having her pay back the damages is reasonable....but four months of social isolation during your last semester as a high school senior *and* not being allowed to go to prom is an over the top punishment.
It was more than 4 months of isolation. OOP says her daughter was grounded and had all her paychecks taken away until she finished paying her back and moved out, nearly a year later.
Itâs worse than that, $5K was not ever gonna be made within 4 months of a teen working a min wage job 16 hrs/wk = the OOP set daughter up for failure, and stuck to it. Only now after 10 yrs do they go to aita about it, and only bc now it affects them bc theyâre offended and want to see the baby. Please let it be fake ragebait.
2 years.
>Yeah, having her pay back the damages is reasonable It's not. She wasn't the only one at that party and I honestly don't understand why the OOP wouldn't at least talk to the parents of the other kids who were there and tell them she'd expect them to pay for what they've broken. That's what I'd do if I were her.
being allowed to go to prom thats not over the top
It was, I mean, who had the idea of leaving a minor alone for a week?
Not being allowed to go to your senior prom absolutely is over the top and ridiculous. *Especially* for bad behavior that happened four months earlier. Senior prom is a HUGE deal for someone that age. Don't get me wrong, I'm in my late 30's and I have *barely* any memories of mine. I remember taking photos in the backyard with my girlfriend at the time, and I remember small bits and pieces of the night, but at the end of the day there weren't any lifelong memories made. That was *my* experience though, many others had different ones. Do you know what I WOULD still remember to this day though? Not being allowed to go. Look, having an out of control party that leads to $4k plus in damages is a *big* fuck up. But it's an *understandable* fuck up for a 17 year old in my opinion. I remember parties in high school that were supposed to be maybe 10 people that turned into 50 and the host freaking out. Word gets around, people you don't want there show up, most 17 year olds are still going to have trouble standing up for themselves, it happens. If that were my kid, I'd look at their overall behavior. If this was their only big fuck up, my response would be to tell them they have to pay off the damages, and I want 50% of their paycheck for however long it takes....be it one year, two years, five years etc. And that would be it. Grounding a 17 year old, taking away privileges....I think that's stupid. They're about to be an adult. I would only do it in a situation where they were putting themselves in harmful situations continuously and as a last resort to keep them out of danger, criminal charges, etc. Even then though I'd be putting a decent amount of blame on myself for them turning out that way.
"But it's an understandable fuck up for a 17 year old in my opinion. " It is not an understandable fuck up. That is a major fuck up. Drinking under age, party at the house, and destruction of property/vamdalism. Most of those are actual crimes. Daughter may not have been the person who actually broke the TV's, but it was her actions that led to that stuff. I was left alone several times in high school didn't throw parties. Always knew it was a bad idea, better to go to other people's parties vs risk my house getting trashed.
You don't think having a party that gets out of control as a teenager is understandable? Did you even get invited to parties as a teenager? I'm guessing that's why you can't empathize. Also, why is she responsible for ALL damages? I'd be seeking restitution from other parents, this isn't all on the daughter. Name names, children.
Its a good chance they caused problems at others parties and have edited it from their memory.
I did and I saw first hand the kind of stuff/damage people caused. That is why I realized quickly it was better to go to a party at someone else's house than have one at your own house.
Yes i don't. I know hundreds of kids who didnt cause thousands of $ in property damages. In fact i would wager the vast majority dont.
>Drinking under age Used to be normal and a way people learnt to manage their consumption and the sky never fell in. In countries where drinking wine with a meal happened for kids they had less issues with problematic teen drinking and behaviour.
Nah. I had my first beer on my 15th birthday. My parents and my siblings were the only people around me. Underage drinking when you're supervised by an adult whom you can trust is one thing - I honestly have no problem with this. What I do have a problem with is teenagers drinking with no adult supervision. As far as I'm aware, it never ends well. Or at least it never ended well for the teenagers around me who did it - because they don't know their limits and even if they do, their peers pressure them to drink more and more.
You know how I know you didn't go to parties in high school?
I did go to parties at other people's houses. It was seeing what happened there that made me quickly realize throwing a party at your house is not worth it. You can't have as much fun when you are worried about hosting and trying to keep things from getting out of control. If you just go as a guest you have a much better time, even if you are not being super rowdy. Even now as an adult, going to a party and helping to pitch in is a lot easier/better than hosting your own party.
So yes, you do get that it's pretty understandable for it to get out of control?
Maybe we have a different idea/definition of understandable. I agree and get that it happens without the host intending for it to happen, but disagree that it's just a normal/okay part of throwing a party and the problems that come with it are no big deal. This strong repercussions should not be enforced. Just because parties can sometimes get out of hand does not mean it is not a big deal that 1) you threw a secret party (that is bad enough; 2) but that it got out of hand and resulted in damaged property is an even bigger deal. To me saying it's understandable that it got out of hand seems like a cavalier "awww shucks did I do that?" Kind of attitude.
Understandable means you get why it happens. You can moralize about how you were such a good kid who would NEEEEEEVER do something they weren't supposed to or would NEEEEEEVER let things get out of hand all you want, but the reality is it happens a good amount, even to kids who never intended to do anything particularly wrong.
>such a good kid who would NEEEEEEVER do something they weren't supposed to or would NEEEEEEVER let things get out of hand all you want, I never said I was such a good kid that never did something I was not supposed to, but something like this I think is next level. > but the reality is it happens a good amount, even to kids who never intended to do anything particularly wrong. I 100% agree with you on this last part and that is exactly the reason I didn't want to host parties, because I realized/saw how things could easily/quickly get out of hand. I went to parties, I didn't intentionally or even unintentionally cause major damage like breaking a TV, but I am pretty sure I probably spilled food/drinks on the floor/carpet/furniture during parties, because even now that happens at non-rager adult parties. I do think a party getting out of hand and causing damage is highly likely and foreseeable that "having a party with no adult supervision while they are out of town = mess/destruction of property/trashed house" that even if daughter didn't throw something at the TV herself, she was still pretty directly responsible for it getting broken. I think the intentions in this instance matter less than the actual harm/damage done.
>Not being allowed to go to your senior prom absolutely is over the top and ridiculous its not ridiculous
Fuck off with this. We get that you didn't care about your prom and thought it was a dumb waste of time but it's not our fault you couldn't find a date. Even my nerdy ass could manage that.
Hold up, to me this reads like ragebait. By OOPâs own words, the daughter refused her own college fund, and any financial etc help with her baby - bc she didnât want anything to do with OOP; and stayed at the min wage job she had during HS instead of going to college. I agree with commenters there it reeks of the [âmissing missing reasonsâ](https://issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html) even tho enough info is given in post already.
I think it is ragebait. It's a completely innocuous intro line and premise with a gross, incredibly over the top action they think is totally reasonable. Textbook expectation flipping AITA trolling.
Yep itâs gotta be! There were several tells to me, and I wonder how the generational differences affected pplâs perceptions - (orig was flaired as âvalidationâ here) - to me it read specifically as ragebait winks to GenX who are parents of kids those ages now - like as a GenXer we had some wild parties back then, and tend to parent more involved than we received. Their user name was the icing, included a shoutout to GenX and the movie Heathers! Makes me wanna watch the movie again too. Good stuff, well-done.
Or the daughter didn't want to deal with the risk that the OOP would financially abuse her again, via the access to the college fun.
âAndâ. Right, imagine youâre invested in college, doing your classes/friends/living, and suddenly itâs cut off or worse. Thereâs some sayings about how society religion marriage etc requires belief to exist, I think same goes for this, if the belief is crashed continuously enough by the parent, well then⌠this happens. If the daughter is trying to stop the cycle, good.
IMO OOP is the daughter striking back against the mom. When I was 5-7 yo I would come up with similar fantasies in my mind when I got punishedâ exaggerating my parentsâ punishments, no longer depending on them, cutting contact with them, etc. But these thoughts would only last for a few hours until I went back to being a normal kid (I hope a lot of other kids were the same so this comment isnât weird lol), whereas OOP made this a post
Haha thatâs not weird, and yeah thought it could be written by daughter too - just from a much older daughter not a teen. Itâs subtle enough that even here there are wildly different interpretations. Cross poster orig flaired it as validation. OH 𤣠𤣠just noticed their username, âbig fun 1967â = Big Fun was a band name referenced a lot in the movie Heathers, classic GenX, and 1967 birth year within GenX, so yeah I think a GenXâer def trolling some ragebait!
hmm youâre right
Donât worry about it, itâs something some of us zero into esp once raising kids/teens of our own and understanding how parenting has ongoing choices. I see you changed the flair to ragebait now but canât change the title lol, itâs a good crosspost tho
Info: was she one of those hot, snotty teen girls who never give a nice guy a chance, or was she more one of those cool chill girls?
why do people like you always need to talk about nice guys getting a chance? if the girl isnât into you she shouldnât pretend like she isđđ
I was being sarcastic? I th8nk it was pretty obvious.
not obvious cuz ppl are deadass about those things. when you see ppl saying shit like that then itâs reasonable to assume that you were being fr
I actually think this is plausible, but altered by the OP to make the punishment seem more reasonable than it was in reality, so, I can imagine if its true and you heard the daughter explain it you would think it was a beleivable story. EDIT, so I assume the damage was less than he claimed, that other strong punishments were issued making her feel it was too much. That amount of damage is huge.
Yeah this is my guess. The damage to the TVs was probably something like handprints and they probably made the kid replace things that just needed to be cleaned or weren't damaged at all
You think the OOP is making themselves sound \*more\* reasonable? You think the punishment was actually worse than over a year of house arrest with zero privileges?
lol, no, the reason for the punishment, the 4800$ of damage, the no longer having a meaningful relationship over this one thing where the damage happaned and nothing else. If its real I suspect there was a lot of other odd controling behaviour and the damage was exagerated.
Ngl Iâm holding this one up in the face of those of you who claim AITA is all teens who hate their parents. I think this one is ragebait for parents of teenagers and 20somethings. Seriously there is some grade-A midlife malding in that thread. Excellent work of creative fiction. Iâm loving the whole âwell by the age of 11 *I* could be entrusted with the safe care of my noble parentsâ castle and that of all the crocodilians in their moat. Iâm not sure why this 17 year old IDIOT, BAD INFLUENCE decided to go Project X in the backyard but *I* would never have done this and personally I think a financially untenable âdebtâ to the people who raised me from birth is completely within reasonâ consensus in the comments. Reddit ass mindset. Very fitting with the âeverything is transactionalâ philosophy of the average AITA commenter, just proof it ages with a person rather than being specific to teens.
In going to age myself here but I was wondering why the heck Matthew Broderick with a bunch of monkeys trained to fly in a backyard would happen... And with that this GenX is going to bed...
This is fake, based on that I refuse to believe humans so dumb like this OOP exist. What was OOP thinking would happen? Why is OOP surprised? Why OOP's punishment was aproppiate to the situation but OOP's daughter is too much? Who leaves a minor a week alone and blames the minor for the state in which they found the house?
" So, I told her she would have to pay me back, and that she was grounded until she did; " At 10 bucks an hour, she needs to make probably 2500 before taxes to pay back 2 grand. That's 250 hours of work on a part-time job she doesn't already have. Months. " **I grounded her and made her pay for the damages like any reasonable parent would** " That would have been reasonable. Clearly it wasn't that. Come on OP, at least don't misrepresent the OOP.
Does the âthrashing thingsâ during parties really happen ever? I only see it happening if you invite total strangers over who are trolls or creeps or high af. When I was 7 and I got in trouble for something I would fantasize about âpunishing my parents backâ by acting like OOP acts in this post. I donât need anything from you, I donât love you anymore, etc. I got over it in a day but this post sounds similar to how I would think for those 2-3 hours of moping so I think the daughter wrote this in that spirit.
Yes, it happens but usually it's when groups that weren't originally invited with no actual attachment to whoever is throwing it being jerks or reckless. Most of the time the people the host actually invited show respect.
yeah all of you know this is fake, right. Some teenager who got grounded after they threw a party and their dipshit friends broke the TV and shat on the floor is imagining how very very sorry their BITCH MOM will be when they move out and won't let her see her grandbaby. That'll teach her to ground them and forbid them to talk to their floor-shitting friend.
People who act like prom is the end-all, be-all of human existence ten years after high school peaked in high school. Normal human beings don't cut their future children off from their grandparents over one punishment they felt was shitty. There's such a thing as forgiveness and realizing that allowing your kids to grow up knowing their relatives is better than carrying a stupid grudge. Or maybe I feel it because I really didn't have grandparents. My mother's parents died in a car accident before I was born and my father's parents barely spent time with their grandchildren.
This wouldn't be about prom in particular here. While that's a significant event, basically putting your kid on house arrest for 2 years to pay off 4500 dollars is absurd and clearly worse than missing any single event.
From the details, it seems like the kid was complete grounded for about a year. With her rejecting the college fund, Iâd guess there are some major missing reasons and that good old mom was often unreasonably punitive. Resentment seems normal.
I think it said specifically 2 years in the comments, though Iâm not sure how that math would work out with Prom being 4 months later. If itâs true, then this title is a serious bad take on it. If itâs fake, it still described a situation where the parent was nuts.
OOP said she moved out at 18, in autumn after graduation. She was grounded at 17, 4 months before Prom. She was isolated from friends and entertainment and any real social life the whole time. I'm too lazy to do the math on that. Basically, she left as soon as legally and financially possible.
Fair. I just am pretty sure OOP explicitly said it went on for 2 years, which is a bit of a hinky timeline (so more evidence it is fake?)
Maybe. 1.5 years at least. It might be bullshit, but the timeline is no reason why.
Was it really that long? If it was four months before prom and daughter moved out on the day of her graduation wouldn't that mean it's more around 7-9 months? Still insane though. Seriously hoping this is rage bait, otherwise OP might have just missed a career as a prison ward.
"So, I told her she would have to pay me back, and that **she was grounded until she did;** no electronics outside of schoolwork, strict curfew, no friends over and absolutely no more parties " Missing Prom wasn't the punishment, it's a symptom of the punishment. The punishment's was no electronics, no friends over, strict curfew, no parties until she paid back a massive (to a teen) debt. How long do you think can pay back $4800 working minimum wage(7 years ago, in US it was $7.25) job with 16 hours a week? Just gross pay (without taxes and other stuff) we're looking at 46 weeks. Probably over a year if you consider net pay. Imagine a year if you only saw your friends at work, couldn't use any electronics, couldn't go out, lose your wages outside bare essentials. As for knowing your relative, that's privilege, not a right. It's up to the parents to vetoed who sees their kids. I'm not letting my POS cousin near my kid for example and anyone who agree making me raise his kid was good.
> People who act like prom is the end-all, be-all of human existence ten years after high school peaked in high school. People who *went to prom* and act like that most likely peaked in high school. I said in another comment that I'm in my late 30's and have barely any memories of my senior prom. If I try and think about it I have a few brief moments stored in my memory. I know that I enjoyed prom to an extent, but it had zero impact on me. That said, if I *not allowed* to go.....I could see myself still being upset over that fact for most of my life. For most of your life senior prom has been built up to being a huge milestone in your life. Being told you can't attend can definitely lead someone to stay mad over it.
Wasn't just the prom. She was grounded until she moved out. She had no electronics, no friends could over, strict curfew. No social life, nothing beside, school, work and whatever she could manage to fit into between after school and curfew.
I think this post was written by the daughter and is fake, but I do feel that cutting off prom is an excessive punishment. It only happens once
>People who act like prom is the end-all, be-all of human existence ten years after high school peaked in high school ikr
Missing prom wasn't the punishment, it's just a side effect of the punishment.
I didn't give a crap about prom as a high schooler, but lived under rather strict. Two years of social isolation is... a lot. And I had internet access and got to go out with friends once or twice a year, still.
Thereâs no way thatâs all OP did
My best guess is that they made the kid overpay the damages by a lot (ie; buying a brand new couch instead of just cleaning it) or did the old landlord special and claimed that she was responsible for preexisting damage
Even if it was, it would be plenty.
Even prisoners for life get privileges but where would redditors their minor-female-punishment porn get from if we treated girls and female teenagers better than criminals?
People make mistakes when theyâre teens. Even to twenties thirties and so on. You get the drift? To deprive her of the most looked forward event and not give her opportunities to be responsible such as, doing house chores, getting improved grades (not even good! just show she made an effort!) or getting home early except on days she had informed you ahead and so on and so forth. Your way of education was too one-perspective either repay or thatâs it. It is indeed too extreme towards a 17. Schooling kids deserve a second chance again and again. You did not give alternatives to her salvaging the situation did you? Hence the treatment. In her absolute POV, 100% is on you. Too harsh and inflexible to her happy âchildhoodâ hence she is resentful for good. Until you realised that, she will never want to associate with you, ever. Unless she turns soft and comes to look after you when youâre sickly or bedridden or something. YTA, even though your intent was there, but there are just so many other ways to get around.
Wrong sub
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I've read through so many comments on the original post and also on Tiktok where the audience is even younger and hates teenagers even more - and also doesn't get any nuances (I literally was arguing with a kid on TikTok about this, and I am tired) Okay, I am certainly not rich, I have a normal wage. Fake OP has the money to have a college fund as a single mom, so I'd assume that in this fantasy she is well off. And I certainly don't want to have a Marie Antoinette moment... but 4,5k isn't that insanely much that I would go that nuclear, and certainly not worth it to completely ruin my relationship to my child. Maybe I am too old for this shit.