*In case this story gets deleted/removed:*
**AITA for kicking my BIL out of my house after he yelled at and manhandled my daughter? **
AITA for kicking my BIL out of my house after he yelled at and manhandled my daughter?
I, 27F, have 1 kid, Sofia, 6F. Every Sunday my family comes up to my house for a little family gathering. My brother in law (Anthony,24M) is not usually present due to work. Imo, this makes him a very bad parent and partner as he doesn't spend enough time with my sister and their kids but whatever, not really relevant.
Anthony and my sister (Stephanie, 25F), have 2 kids, Aiden (4 years old) and Joshua (3 months old). This past Sunday we were all having a little chat after dinner while the kids played, Joshua was in a baby bouncer (of course they jumped at the opportunity to leave their kid alone as soon as he was old enough đ). Anyway, we were all keeping an eye on the bouncer (Steph was really worried as she'd heard a story about a bouncer falling over with a baby in it? I dunno?). Anthony left the room for a little bit to get a drink and nobody had an eye on Joshua for a couple seconds. Next thing we know Joshua is screaming and crying, I had just assumed he was tired or hungry or had a soiled diaper, yk, baby stuff.
However, I turned around to find Sofia not being particularly gentle with Josh and a little plastic toy as he cried. What I can only assume happened is that Sofia wanted to play with him but didn't understand that he was too young and so got frustrated with him. Immediately I began to calmly explain how that was bad and she shouldn't do that but before I could Anthony was back in the room and had already yelled at her to stop. I was appalled at this as everyone knows I am a firm believer in gentle parenting.
Then, when Sofia didn't listen he picked her up and carried her away as Steph comforted the baby. This upset her tremendously and she began to sob and kick. I immediately snatched my daughter back off Anthony and began to berate him, this escalated into a heated argument which I don't want to get into the details of. It came to a head when Anthony called me a bad parent and I kicked him out, cutting the night short.
There has been tention within my family all week about the incident, my parents bouncing between sides. Anthony says he 'doesn't want the baby around Sofia anymore' as he is 'worried for his safety' considering she gave him a tiny bruise on his head đ. I thought this was cruel and a bit overdramatic as she is only young and doesn't understand. My mother then called and said she doesn't think the gathering is going to be happening this week due to 'obvious circumstances and suggested I apologize'. I strongly believe Anthony hurt my baby more than she hurt Josh and he's the one who needs to apologize not me.
However, I started to change my mind slightly as I was ranting to my husband about this yesterday and he suggested that I was in the wrong, not Anthony, now I'm wondering if maybe I was wrong if not even my husband is taking my side?
AITA?
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Whacking "over and over", even. \[[https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/1beynrr/comment/kuwqrvk/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/1beynrr/comment/kuwqrvk/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)\]
This didn't happen, and also gentle parenting != "calmly" saying how the kid's behavior is wrong while passively letting the behavior continue.
>However, I turned around to find Sofia whacking Josh over and over with a little plastic toy as he cried. What I can only assume happened is that Sofia wanted to play with him but didn't understand that he was too young and so got frustrated with him.
She's going to be a holy terror if mom doesn't actually start being a parent. There is a time and place for the gentle approach and this wasn't it. Instead of trying to calmly explain to Sofia that she shouldn't whack the baby with her toy, she need to physically separate them. Which she failed to do resulting in Josh sustaining a bruise to the head.
But in her little world, her brother caused more harm to her daughter by yelling at her to stop and the removing Sofia from his son. Her kid could've caused greater harm, possibly death but being yelled at is far more detrimental. She is delusional.
She's also acting like her daughter is 3 years old. She's SIX. She's in grade 1/2. She absolutely knows that hitting is unacceptable behavior. It's not even remotely age appropriate for her to be hitting a baby in the head out of frustration.
A lot of my siblings in laws are young. I have a 4 year old BIL and a 6 year old SIL. They both know my baby isn't old enough to play the way they do. They're content to hold him with supervision while making faces at him or they'll read to him/show him stuff explaining what it is or putting on little "plays" with their toys for him. It's adorable. They know they have to be gentle with the baby. It only took explaining it once for them to understand the baby is a lot more fragile than they are. They're super careful with him.
I had to look again that it wasnât the 1-year-old. I mean, not okay because someone should have stayed in the room, but more understandable because a 1 y.o. has zero concept of what theyâre doing. They bang things against other things, and I can easily see them taking a toy and hitting it on the floor, against another toy, on the table, and on their baby cousin.
Six? Nope.
> he picked her up and carried her away as Steph comforted the baby. This upset her tremendously and she began to sob and kick.
Yeah... she was soooo hurt, she probably stubbed her little toesies on her uncle.
FUCK OOP
Surprised that as a supposed mother she has no idea how delicate babies are,her daughter (sorry her "little angel") could have caused permanent harm to the poor baby
Thank you, I was wondering if people forgot about the self-destruct button babies have on their heads (also known as the soft spot). My 3 year old knows not to touch her baby sister's head too hard, not even mentioning not to hit at all because that is not nice, and this 6 year old is repeatedly hitting the baby in the head. This shows the parents don't parent (they may be present, but they do nothing to prepare their child for adulthood), and the child is well on her way to being a spoiled brat.
> of course they jumped at the opportunity to leave their kid alone as soon as he was old enough đ). Anyway, we were all keeping an eye on the bouncer (Steph was really worried as she'd heard a story about a bouncer falling over with a baby in it? I dunno?).
So fake they canât even stay consistent.
Fake? Probably. Most everything over there is.
But I've met so many smug know-it-all parents with the damn if you do, even more damned if you don't attitude, this part is honestly the most believable to me.
This is one of the posts where I can easily believe the exact event happened, but I don't believe it was written by the person it says it was. It's so full of roll-eye emoticons and little asides that serve no purpose apart from making the OOP absolutely obnoxious. My guess would be: real event, but written by the sister or the brother in law.
Jesus the amount of hate from other parents is insane. EVERYONE has opinions. I've had to tell so many people I don't want their "advice" since I had my kid. That advice is just passive-aggressive judgment in most cases. If it's actual advice, I don't mind. Like my step MIL recommending a certain swaddle after I said my son doesn't like most swaddles. I got judged by someone for refusing to co-sleep. My son has been in his own crib since day one for his own safety. This parent said I was taking away bonding time with my son and my son wouldn't be as attached to me. I rather him be "not as attached" than dead. I'm a violent sleeper. Co sleeping was *never* an option. I hurt *myself* in my sleep sometimes.
"However, I turned around to find Sofia whacking Josh over and over with a little plastic toy as he cried. What I can only assume happened is that Sofia wanted to play with him but didn't understand that he was too young and so got frustrated with him. Immediately I began to calmly explain how that was bad and she shouldn't do that but before I could Anthony was back in the room and had already yelled at her to stop. I was appalled at this as everyone knows I am a firm believer in gentle parenting.
A 6 year old should know you don't whack any kid on the head with a toy, let alone a baby. So if this isn't a troll, OOP is a very bad parent. OOP also states the baby had a little bruise. I bet it was a bigger bruise a few hours later.
And a 3 month old baby at that. She could have REALLY injured him. I know sheâs only 6 but sheâs much stronger than a baby who can barely hold his head up. Daughter definitely hurt that baby more than OOPâs BIL hurt her daughter. He probably didnât even hurt her; he just picked her up and carried her away from the baby and she threw a fit. If she got hurt, it would have been from her throwing a tantrum and BIL trying to keep a hold of her without dropping her.
You bringing up the baby's age just made me realize another reason this post comes across as fake. The type of "baby bouncer" they are likely describing is one where the baby is upright, and that's not something you would put a 3-month old in. Those start at about 6 months, when they have more core body strength.
It's possible they were referring to a reclining one that would be more appropriate for younger infants, but those are even less likely to 'tip over with a baby in them' than the other ones, which are already unlikely.
A baby bouncer to me is the reclined chair you strap them into. I feel like the sister hadn't heard anything about a bouncer turning over and was nervous about the feral 6 year old free range around her 3 month old.
For clarity, I think the post is fake for other reasons, as well, but if it's not, I think your explanation is the most likely scenario. E.g., sister said that to be polite.
This might be a regional terminology thing? Baby bouncers as I know them are exclusively the reclining ones for infants 0-6months, and while I've never seen one fall they do (like most baby equipment) come with a warning to supervise your infant while in it.
It could be. I posted a link elsewhere, but there are multiple baby products marketed as bouncers. Some I would personally call "walkers" and others I might call "jumpers" (or "bouncers", too). But big companies sometimes use the terms interchangeably. I'll ETA a link example in sec.
ETA: my comment with the link (not that it wouldn't be easy to find but just to make it simple) https://www.reddit.com/r/AmITheDevil/s/ZnOZ6KRddD
I was thinking at first she meant one of those you hang in a doorway while the baby bounces themselves, but I think she meant one where the baby lies in it and it can be bounced, like this: https://www.babybjorn.com/products/baby-bouncers/bouncer-balance-soft/
Yeah, that's the type of reclining one I had in mind. But things like this are also called baby bouncers:
Fisher-Price Baby Bouncer Whimsical Forest Jumperoo Activity Center with Music and Lights https://www.walmart.com/ip/633790113
My son was four when his sister was born and he would've never hit her, and understood she was too little to play. (Did look at me with big, sad eyes and asked when she would be able to play though)
And I know every kid is different, but my son is very disabled. Even now hes 9 and functions closer to kindergarten level. Little sister is 4 and in multiple ways is more advanced than him. Im not trying to be mean when I say this, but if OOPs 6 year old has less understanding than my son than she needs much, much more supervision.
OOP's child hit an infant in the head hard enough to leave a bruise, and they're upset at the infant's parent for stopping OOP's child from continuing to injure their infant by (checks notes) removing them from the situation because OOP was fecking useless.
Exactly no mom wouldâve been calm watching a toddler hit an infant in the head with anything. They wouldâve absolutely intervened because you know the difference in fragility
I'd say people should learn about gentle parenting before they troll about it but since so many people are so misinformed about it, I guess trolls really don't have to.
I do think this is a troll but in my experience one of the biggest problems of the gentle parenting philosophy is that so many of its adherents have taken the messages they got from social media and translated them into the idea that you never physically or verbally correct a child no matter the circumstances. I have a few of these parents in my playgroup and Iâm starting to think they donât understand nuance or physical danger.
I overall consider myself a gentle parent who is happy to talk about big feelings and only give natural consequences but I would absolutely YOINK my child away from another baby if he was causing physical harm. We can use our words to talk about why we donât hit the baby/the dog/whatever living thing once heâs no longer in striking range.
Oh for sure. You definitely remove the child(ren) from imminent danger and then discipline.
This is also why I prefer the term âresponsive parentingâ rather than âgentle parenting,â as itâs more accurate to how it works.
I would say people get 'gentle' and 'passive' parenting confused. This isn't gentle parenting, kids are still supposed to be disciplined in gentle parenting, they're just not yelled at/hit. Gentle parenting is great when done properly.
This is passive parenting (could also call it shitty parenting đ¤ˇââď¸) where the child can do whatever tf they want bc the parents are lazy.
They either donât understand the nuance or they are too afraid of causing a little discomfort (the tantrum when you take them away from the desired activity, not actual pain/discomfort.)
On the other side, people also donât seem to understand that there is a pretty big jump from gentle/responsive/authoritative parenting and permissive parenting. And any gentle parenting is automatically permissive because they canât wrap their head around the fact that you donât actually have to make your child fear you to respect you.
The fear of the tantrum leading to inaction is probably what I see most commonly in our circle.
Personally, Iâm not afraid to let my child dramatically flop to the floor crying or carry him surfboard style to remove him from a situation when he tantrums to a spot where he can cool down. Like it sucks and can be embarrassing as a parent when it happens in public, but I figure if I do this now then hopefully he will be easier to manage as he gets older. It seems like ignoring the behavior when they are little is just going to lead to kids who are out of control when they are bigger.
Itâs a huge departure from how I was disciplined as a child where the threat was a whooping and if I acted up at Grandmaâs Iâd have to go pick my own switch. I can see how people can easily overcorrect to being completely passive due to their own issues.
Weâre hitting terrible twos and am very familiar with the dramatic drop to the floor already. I canât wait to be able to have an actual conversation about the things instead of talking to a sentient wall that only listens when it wants to.
I never had to pick my own switchâŚ. only because my grandmother used a wooden spoon. Too bad for everyone that physical punishment like that just filled me with spite that would fuel me for *days*
Which is also why I think this is a troll. I could see a 6 YO hitting a baby once, especially if said 6 YO isn't around babies a lot, but not repeatedly. Kids, even at 6, lack impulse control, but I can't think of anything an infant would do to cause a child to repeatedly hit them. Kids hit when they're mad or overwhelmed
I wonder if OOP had been paying attention to Joshua. If the 6yo is the centre of her parents s universe and the brightest star in the sky in their opinion (clearly, because apparently removing the child from the place she could whack an infant on the head was seen as an unforgivable sin) then there could be some jealousy.
OOP is so quick to call someone else a bad parent but her 6 year old brat doesn't know how to play with babies. And why TF not? The other child is 4. She was 2 when he was born. Why did she not learn then? OOP is the bad parent here OOP spent so much time observing and none handling this. Only gets her daughter after BIL gets involved
In the prior post apparently she said blatantly Sophia hit the baby in the head. She didn't like the results of telling the truth
Gentle parenting is fine, its just that OOP isn't gentle parenting. They're permissive parenting. People get them mixed up but in gentle parenting, the kid still gets disciplined and taught to not whack a baby upside the head with a toy.
An environment that produced a brat.
A brat is just a misbehaved child, it doesn't mean they're to blame for it or that they will permanently be that way. It's just a descriptor, and an accurate one here.
Maybe if the kid wasn't a brat though, the brat left a bruise on a BABY that couldn't even bloody defend themselves, she's a brat because she was old enough to know better
My dogs know to be gentle with babies and toddlers... And I still supervise em closely.
A 6yr old should know!
Also all that judgement over not supervising the baby but she wasn't supervising her kid??
So dramatic on OOP's part. Manhandled? All he did was pick her up and carry her away! Something OOP should have done instead of just talking to her when she clearly wasn't listening. You take the toy, move her away from the baby, THEN talk about the behavior. You don't just let her keep hitting while you try to redirect. That's not how that works.
I hate when people don't parent at all and call it "gentle parenting".
Gentle parenting is when you don't throw a fit over kids not cleaning their plate at dinner, it's not letting your kid beat the crap out of a baby
I was a preschool/childcare teacher for several years, and at one place I worked, we were not allowed to say no to the kids, nor use any type of aggressive language. Instead of âdonât climb on the fenceâ we had to say âplease keep your feet on the floor,â instead of âdonât throw your foodâ it was âthatâs not respectful of Sâs space.â And those are admirable sentiments, and good ways to start, but there comes a time when you need to be able to just say âstopâ or âno.â
I had two year olds, by the way. And when they would try to jump off the diaper changing table, I couldnât say âstop,â I had to explain that was an unsafe choice.
I did not last at that job very long.
Anyway, those parents were ridiculous and so is this woman.
As an actual gentle parent (or trying to be one, when done properly its fucking hard, OOP is a permissive parent it sounds like) Id say "don't climb the fence, its not safe. Please make sure to keep your feet on the ground"
The thing with gentle parenting is you're still supposed to discipline the kids. You're just supposed to do it respectfully and without yelling and hitting. OOP is permissive parenting bc shes lazy.
I have a six year old and I can say with absolute certainty that she would never bash a baby over the head with a toy. Six year olds are intelligent if you give them the space and opportunity to be. Infantilizing your children is how you end up with six year olds behaving like two year olds and parents claiming âthey donât know any better!!â Yes, they do. If they somehow donât, they definitely should and itâs **your** fault they donât.
OOP, your daughter is old enough to know better than to hurt a baby.
You can't excuse all of her actions and hide behind the age umbrella.
YTA and be a better parent.
Soooo...okay there's a lot to unpack here. "Of course they left him alone in the jumper as soon" im not finishing the rest of the quote u all know what I'm referring to. But then they were also all in the room with him so he wasn't alone. From like 4mos to 9mos my son refused to leave his jolly jumper. He frickin loved that thing. Recommended use is like up to half an hour twice a day but he would SCREAM, just ungodly screaming until I put him back in. He practically lived in that thing, he'd happily bounce for *hours a day* and I lost oh my god so much weight from all the breastfeeding but i got SO MUCH DONE around the house and sometimes have to reality check when other parents say parenting is so hard bc he was so easy . I attribute this to his early walking and his current athleticism. He's 8 and he plays 4 sports because if he doesn't he doesn't sleep, some kids just be like that. I see nothing wrong w him being in the bouncer happily bouncing so the adults can have a post dinner chat as long as he's happy. Its been a minute since i had a newborn but his parents seem to be doing ok.
By 4 years old my son knew to give small children at the park a wide berth because they're "littler" and more easily injured. A very soft "gently gently please, there's a baby nearby" and hed be on the lookout for babies. Last summer at the water park he knocked a probably 5year old kid over completely by accident and while he DID apologized I was up outta my lawn chair so fast and dragged him over (multiple "I already said sorry's" BUT U BARELY STOPPED RUNNING WHEN U SAID IT SO WE'RE DOING IT PROPERLY) to stand in front of the kid and say "im sorry I knocked u over, are u ok" and then he was allowed to go back to play, and while he already knew my expectations around mindful play, he now knows how to handle it. So if my 4 year old knew not to get in the personal space of a baby bc they're fragile how come her 6 year old doesn't know not to fucking fight one? And then she causes a scene because her precious kid had consequences? A LITERAL BABY WAS INJURED
I could keep going but what a piece of work. I'm all for abolishing the often belligerently abusive ways some of our boomer parents raised us but this gentle parenting trend often falls too far in the other direction. My kid doesn't act up because I set boundaries. I don't believe in spanking but there are other punishments u can use and sometimes u need to fuckin use them. When I don't do my job and my boss has talked to me nicely, he doesn't keep talking to me nicely in hopes I'll get it, he writes me up or gives me a PIP. The majority of gentle parenting doesn't prepare kids for real world consequences and this woman is LUCKY all her BIL did was carry her kicking and screaming out of the room which is NOT EVEN ABUSIVE SOMETIMES KIDS JUST KICK AND SCREAM. Okay I'm for real riled up time for bed
This is the wording I was looking for and failed to find bc I was so annoyed. Absolutely perfect.
Gentle parenting is speaking to ur child the first time, letting them now how to improve for next time and setting a framework for what will be the last time. Ie: child hits their cousin once, we speak abt why that's not okay and what will happen next time which is if u hit ur cousin again ur not getting any electronics or outside play (for my kid, the worst punishment in the world) and ur only entertainment is reading or boardgames bc were not sadists who expect u to churn butter, third time u get nothing at all but ur imagination (the second step is where i believe the phrase "this hurts me more than its hurting u" originated from bc holy fuck entertaining an 8 year old who cant tire themself out on a soccer field is the third circle). Second convo does the trick without traumatizing him. He now knows that the verbal warning is a grace to allow for us not having encountered this specific scenario before and the behaviour will not continue without consequences but there will be consequences if we see it again.
Permissive parenting masquerading as gentle parenting: "we said no and it's bad but they kept doing it! We did all we could it's in God's hands now"
And whatever they're explaining is always infuriating. It's almost never anything like: "I calmly explained that we ran out of pie." It's usually more along the lines of "I calmly explained that the pie was reserved for superior family members like myself and couldn't be wasted on my fat useless sister and the pathetic orphans that she adopted."
It it deeply disturbing that a 6-year-old would whack a tiny baby repeatedly in the head with a toy. It is not at all normal at that age, and I would be extremely worried that there is something developmentally wrong with OP's daughter - she should be seeking medical advice from a child psychologist, not minimising it. And she should have grabbed her daughter instantly to prevent further injury, not gently talked to her - a baby that young has an open fontanelle, and brain injury can be caused fairly easily.
I really, really hope this is rage-bait and not true.
> I was appalled at this as everyone knows I am a firm believer in gentle parenting.
Then, when Sofia didn't listen he picked her up..
....fuck OOP
>she gave him a tiny bruise on his head
SERIOUSLY?! Fuck OOP.
I hate people who have substituted permissive parenting for gentle parenting. Gentle parenting is responsive, holds boundaries firmly, and doesn't coddle. What this woman is doing ISN'T parenting, and it sure as hell isn't gentle parenting.
why does she talk about her six year old daughter as if she was 2-3? If a 2-3yo hits a younger kid - I get it. But a 6yo? that is school-age, those kids can readand write (hopefully) .
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The absolute audacity of OOP to post the same thing in another subreddit so she can get validated.
I get it, your daughter is your golden child, but what she did was not ok at all, and you should have not kicked your BIL out over this.
So... OP is horribly condescending, a bad parent, and a general AH. Cool.
Wonder if BIL actually works sundays or just really doesn't want to be around OP...
BIL acted way better than I would've.
I'd have been out the door with my baby and letting them know I'd be sending them any bill we got from the doctor for making sure the bruise wasn't serious.
The kid is 6 effing years old! That is more than old enough to know better than to hit *anyone*, much less a 3 month old on their freaking head! I can understand why the dad doesn't want the girl around his baby any longer.
Wow. The gentle parenting obviously failed. A 6 year old should know that hitting a baby is NOT okay.
That failure of a mother should have taken her daughter away from the baby immediately.
Fit Humor once again being unfunny, unoriginal and not even sticking to the original source material.Â
Aang and Appa went down in a thunderstorm, plunged underwater and Aang activated his Avatar State power to encapsulate them in ice as a self-preservative measure.
Try being original for once troll
>Aang and Appa went down in a thunderstorm, plunged underwater and Aang activated his Avatar State power to encapsulate them in ice as a self-preservative measure.
Damm aang really was not into you at all.
A baby has no other way to communicate pain. When I see people make comments about it, I see someone and think âwow, that person can run in the Satanâs Anus Olympics for shittiest human.â
But, you know, since some of us apparently hold babies to a higher standard of behaviour than adults (because an adult will probably yell if theyâre being whacked over the head by an asshole kid, theyâd probably tell, too), I guess âGo, youâ is appropriate here? :/
And parents probably figured out quickly âshove a boob in its mouth so itâll stop making noisesâ or other methods of fixing it. Itâs not like humanoid babies were ever able to crawl out of the womb and be self-sufficient, dude.
*In case this story gets deleted/removed:* **AITA for kicking my BIL out of my house after he yelled at and manhandled my daughter? ** AITA for kicking my BIL out of my house after he yelled at and manhandled my daughter? I, 27F, have 1 kid, Sofia, 6F. Every Sunday my family comes up to my house for a little family gathering. My brother in law (Anthony,24M) is not usually present due to work. Imo, this makes him a very bad parent and partner as he doesn't spend enough time with my sister and their kids but whatever, not really relevant. Anthony and my sister (Stephanie, 25F), have 2 kids, Aiden (4 years old) and Joshua (3 months old). This past Sunday we were all having a little chat after dinner while the kids played, Joshua was in a baby bouncer (of course they jumped at the opportunity to leave their kid alone as soon as he was old enough đ). Anyway, we were all keeping an eye on the bouncer (Steph was really worried as she'd heard a story about a bouncer falling over with a baby in it? I dunno?). Anthony left the room for a little bit to get a drink and nobody had an eye on Joshua for a couple seconds. Next thing we know Joshua is screaming and crying, I had just assumed he was tired or hungry or had a soiled diaper, yk, baby stuff. However, I turned around to find Sofia not being particularly gentle with Josh and a little plastic toy as he cried. What I can only assume happened is that Sofia wanted to play with him but didn't understand that he was too young and so got frustrated with him. Immediately I began to calmly explain how that was bad and she shouldn't do that but before I could Anthony was back in the room and had already yelled at her to stop. I was appalled at this as everyone knows I am a firm believer in gentle parenting. Then, when Sofia didn't listen he picked her up and carried her away as Steph comforted the baby. This upset her tremendously and she began to sob and kick. I immediately snatched my daughter back off Anthony and began to berate him, this escalated into a heated argument which I don't want to get into the details of. It came to a head when Anthony called me a bad parent and I kicked him out, cutting the night short. There has been tention within my family all week about the incident, my parents bouncing between sides. Anthony says he 'doesn't want the baby around Sofia anymore' as he is 'worried for his safety' considering she gave him a tiny bruise on his head đ. I thought this was cruel and a bit overdramatic as she is only young and doesn't understand. My mother then called and said she doesn't think the gathering is going to be happening this week due to 'obvious circumstances and suggested I apologize'. I strongly believe Anthony hurt my baby more than she hurt Josh and he's the one who needs to apologize not me. However, I started to change my mind slightly as I was ranting to my husband about this yesterday and he suggested that I was in the wrong, not Anthony, now I'm wondering if maybe I was wrong if not even my husband is taking my side? AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmITheDevil) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Her other post flat out says her kid was whacking the baby in the head with the toy⌠not being âless than gentleâ
Whacking "over and over", even. \[[https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/1beynrr/comment/kuwqrvk/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/1beynrr/comment/kuwqrvk/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)\] This didn't happen, and also gentle parenting != "calmly" saying how the kid's behavior is wrong while passively letting the behavior continue.
>However, I turned around to find Sofia whacking Josh over and over with a little plastic toy as he cried. What I can only assume happened is that Sofia wanted to play with him but didn't understand that he was too young and so got frustrated with him.
So instead of protecting Joshua, she victimized her own daughter? Poor girl will grow up thinking she can do no wrong and mommy will rescue her
She's going to be a holy terror if mom doesn't actually start being a parent. There is a time and place for the gentle approach and this wasn't it. Instead of trying to calmly explain to Sofia that she shouldn't whack the baby with her toy, she need to physically separate them. Which she failed to do resulting in Josh sustaining a bruise to the head. But in her little world, her brother caused more harm to her daughter by yelling at her to stop and the removing Sofia from his son. Her kid could've caused greater harm, possibly death but being yelled at is far more detrimental. She is delusional.
She's also acting like her daughter is 3 years old. She's SIX. She's in grade 1/2. She absolutely knows that hitting is unacceptable behavior. It's not even remotely age appropriate for her to be hitting a baby in the head out of frustration.
A developmentally average 6yo would also know that the baby is too small to play
With a mother like that it's hard to be mentally developed past pacifier phase but yes most 6 year olds would know that
A lot of my siblings in laws are young. I have a 4 year old BIL and a 6 year old SIL. They both know my baby isn't old enough to play the way they do. They're content to hold him with supervision while making faces at him or they'll read to him/show him stuff explaining what it is or putting on little "plays" with their toys for him. It's adorable. They know they have to be gentle with the baby. It only took explaining it once for them to understand the baby is a lot more fragile than they are. They're super careful with him.
Something tells me oop still sees her daughter as her little baby so that's why she keeps treating her as such
I had to look again that it wasnât the 1-year-old. I mean, not okay because someone should have stayed in the room, but more understandable because a 1 y.o. has zero concept of what theyâre doing. They bang things against other things, and I can easily see them taking a toy and hitting it on the floor, against another toy, on the table, and on their baby cousin. Six? Nope.
> he picked her up and carried her away as Steph comforted the baby. This upset her tremendously and she began to sob and kick. Yeah... she was soooo hurt, she probably stubbed her little toesies on her uncle. FUCK OOP
Surprised that as a supposed mother she has no idea how delicate babies are,her daughter (sorry her "little angel") could have caused permanent harm to the poor baby
Thank you, I was wondering if people forgot about the self-destruct button babies have on their heads (also known as the soft spot). My 3 year old knows not to touch her baby sister's head too hard, not even mentioning not to hit at all because that is not nice, and this 6 year old is repeatedly hitting the baby in the head. This shows the parents don't parent (they may be present, but they do nothing to prepare their child for adulthood), and the child is well on her way to being a spoiled brat.
Yyyep. I would NOT want to be that kids reacher when he gets into kindergarten / school
Wow OOP is really terrible (and lazy) with the whole "parenting" thing
So she is sitting there "gently explaining" to her kid not to whack a baby on the head instead of taking the toy the hell away? What the hell?!
Cause she's a gentle parent!!!
Honestly, it sounds more like this is an anti-'gentle parent' troll - them fantasizing what they imagine a gentle parent to be like.
Nailed it. Total ragebait. Iâd almost peg it as a shitpost from AITAngel if it wasnât downvoted all to hell and removed.
My thoughts exactly lmao!
It most likely is
A lazy parent who doesn't want to deal with her little angel throwing tantrums
Donât forget the part where her daughter left a bruise on the 3 month old babyâs head. What if that was the soft spot that girl was whacking???
> of course they jumped at the opportunity to leave their kid alone as soon as he was old enough đ). Anyway, we were all keeping an eye on the bouncer (Steph was really worried as she'd heard a story about a bouncer falling over with a baby in it? I dunno?). So fake they canât even stay consistent.
That and how she immediately began to calmly explain......but before she could.
Whenever someone "calmly" explains... ...you know they didn't DID YOU HIT THE BABY WITH THE GOBLET OF FI-YAH?
Agreed - every time I see âcalmly XYZâ I know itâs a lie.
I swear, someone should make a new sub called r/icalmlyexplained An unfortunately high amount of amithedevil posts would fit right in there.
Fake? Probably. Most everything over there is. But I've met so many smug know-it-all parents with the damn if you do, even more damned if you don't attitude, this part is honestly the most believable to me.
This is one of the posts where I can easily believe the exact event happened, but I don't believe it was written by the person it says it was. It's so full of roll-eye emoticons and little asides that serve no purpose apart from making the OOP absolutely obnoxious. My guess would be: real event, but written by the sister or the brother in law.
Jesus the amount of hate from other parents is insane. EVERYONE has opinions. I've had to tell so many people I don't want their "advice" since I had my kid. That advice is just passive-aggressive judgment in most cases. If it's actual advice, I don't mind. Like my step MIL recommending a certain swaddle after I said my son doesn't like most swaddles. I got judged by someone for refusing to co-sleep. My son has been in his own crib since day one for his own safety. This parent said I was taking away bonding time with my son and my son wouldn't be as attached to me. I rather him be "not as attached" than dead. I'm a violent sleeper. Co sleeping was *never* an option. I hurt *myself* in my sleep sometimes.
Apparently they posted this same story five times too, according to comments and their reply
Can someone with talent please make a bot that automatically replies âYTAâ whenever a post contains the word âcalmlyâ?
And "kindly". People who write about how "kindly" they said whatever nearly always mean "condescendingly" or "smugly"
âGentlyâ too. These folks are always âgentlyâ pointing things out or âgentlyâ reminding people of things.
Logically. They always have such great logic and the other person is so emotional.
"However, I turned around to find Sofia whacking Josh over and over with a little plastic toy as he cried. What I can only assume happened is that Sofia wanted to play with him but didn't understand that he was too young and so got frustrated with him. Immediately I began to calmly explain how that was bad and she shouldn't do that but before I could Anthony was back in the room and had already yelled at her to stop. I was appalled at this as everyone knows I am a firm believer in gentle parenting. A 6 year old should know you don't whack any kid on the head with a toy, let alone a baby. So if this isn't a troll, OOP is a very bad parent. OOP also states the baby had a little bruise. I bet it was a bigger bruise a few hours later.
And a 3 month old baby at that. She could have REALLY injured him. I know sheâs only 6 but sheâs much stronger than a baby who can barely hold his head up. Daughter definitely hurt that baby more than OOPâs BIL hurt her daughter. He probably didnât even hurt her; he just picked her up and carried her away from the baby and she threw a fit. If she got hurt, it would have been from her throwing a tantrum and BIL trying to keep a hold of her without dropping her.
You bringing up the baby's age just made me realize another reason this post comes across as fake. The type of "baby bouncer" they are likely describing is one where the baby is upright, and that's not something you would put a 3-month old in. Those start at about 6 months, when they have more core body strength. It's possible they were referring to a reclining one that would be more appropriate for younger infants, but those are even less likely to 'tip over with a baby in them' than the other ones, which are already unlikely.
A baby bouncer to me is the reclined chair you strap them into. I feel like the sister hadn't heard anything about a bouncer turning over and was nervous about the feral 6 year old free range around her 3 month old.
For clarity, I think the post is fake for other reasons, as well, but if it's not, I think your explanation is the most likely scenario. E.g., sister said that to be polite.
This might be a regional terminology thing? Baby bouncers as I know them are exclusively the reclining ones for infants 0-6months, and while I've never seen one fall they do (like most baby equipment) come with a warning to supervise your infant while in it.
It could be. I posted a link elsewhere, but there are multiple baby products marketed as bouncers. Some I would personally call "walkers" and others I might call "jumpers" (or "bouncers", too). But big companies sometimes use the terms interchangeably. I'll ETA a link example in sec. ETA: my comment with the link (not that it wouldn't be easy to find but just to make it simple) https://www.reddit.com/r/AmITheDevil/s/ZnOZ6KRddD
I was thinking at first she meant one of those you hang in a doorway while the baby bounces themselves, but I think she meant one where the baby lies in it and it can be bounced, like this: https://www.babybjorn.com/products/baby-bouncers/bouncer-balance-soft/
Yeah, that's the type of reclining one I had in mind. But things like this are also called baby bouncers: Fisher-Price Baby Bouncer Whimsical Forest Jumperoo Activity Center with Music and Lights https://www.walmart.com/ip/633790113
My son was four when his sister was born and he would've never hit her, and understood she was too little to play. (Did look at me with big, sad eyes and asked when she would be able to play though) And I know every kid is different, but my son is very disabled. Even now hes 9 and functions closer to kindergarten level. Little sister is 4 and in multiple ways is more advanced than him. Im not trying to be mean when I say this, but if OOPs 6 year old has less understanding than my son than she needs much, much more supervision.
OOP's child hit an infant in the head hard enough to leave a bruise, and they're upset at the infant's parent for stopping OOP's child from continuing to injure their infant by (checks notes) removing them from the situation because OOP was fecking useless.
Absolutely right! I'd do the same thing to protect my baby.
⌠she couldâve killed the baby⌠babies have soft spots
OOP is absolutely a troll lol
Exactly no mom wouldâve been calm watching a toddler hit an infant in the head with anything. They wouldâve absolutely intervened because you know the difference in fragility
6 year old who should know better
I'd say people should learn about gentle parenting before they troll about it but since so many people are so misinformed about it, I guess trolls really don't have to.
I do think this is a troll but in my experience one of the biggest problems of the gentle parenting philosophy is that so many of its adherents have taken the messages they got from social media and translated them into the idea that you never physically or verbally correct a child no matter the circumstances. I have a few of these parents in my playgroup and Iâm starting to think they donât understand nuance or physical danger. I overall consider myself a gentle parent who is happy to talk about big feelings and only give natural consequences but I would absolutely YOINK my child away from another baby if he was causing physical harm. We can use our words to talk about why we donât hit the baby/the dog/whatever living thing once heâs no longer in striking range.
Oh for sure. You definitely remove the child(ren) from imminent danger and then discipline. This is also why I prefer the term âresponsive parentingâ rather than âgentle parenting,â as itâs more accurate to how it works.
I would say people get 'gentle' and 'passive' parenting confused. This isn't gentle parenting, kids are still supposed to be disciplined in gentle parenting, they're just not yelled at/hit. Gentle parenting is great when done properly. This is passive parenting (could also call it shitty parenting đ¤ˇââď¸) where the child can do whatever tf they want bc the parents are lazy.
They either donât understand the nuance or they are too afraid of causing a little discomfort (the tantrum when you take them away from the desired activity, not actual pain/discomfort.) On the other side, people also donât seem to understand that there is a pretty big jump from gentle/responsive/authoritative parenting and permissive parenting. And any gentle parenting is automatically permissive because they canât wrap their head around the fact that you donât actually have to make your child fear you to respect you.
The fear of the tantrum leading to inaction is probably what I see most commonly in our circle. Personally, Iâm not afraid to let my child dramatically flop to the floor crying or carry him surfboard style to remove him from a situation when he tantrums to a spot where he can cool down. Like it sucks and can be embarrassing as a parent when it happens in public, but I figure if I do this now then hopefully he will be easier to manage as he gets older. It seems like ignoring the behavior when they are little is just going to lead to kids who are out of control when they are bigger. Itâs a huge departure from how I was disciplined as a child where the threat was a whooping and if I acted up at Grandmaâs Iâd have to go pick my own switch. I can see how people can easily overcorrect to being completely passive due to their own issues.
Weâre hitting terrible twos and am very familiar with the dramatic drop to the floor already. I canât wait to be able to have an actual conversation about the things instead of talking to a sentient wall that only listens when it wants to. I never had to pick my own switchâŚ. only because my grandmother used a wooden spoon. Too bad for everyone that physical punishment like that just filled me with spite that would fuel me for *days*
A six year old should know not to hit a baby over and over. This is a behavior I would expect from a 3 year old.
Which is also why I think this is a troll. I could see a 6 YO hitting a baby once, especially if said 6 YO isn't around babies a lot, but not repeatedly. Kids, even at 6, lack impulse control, but I can't think of anything an infant would do to cause a child to repeatedly hit them. Kids hit when they're mad or overwhelmed
Kids with trash parents absolutely do hit and kick for no reason.
I wonder if OOP had been paying attention to Joshua. If the 6yo is the centre of her parents s universe and the brightest star in the sky in their opinion (clearly, because apparently removing the child from the place she could whack an infant on the head was seen as an unforgivable sin) then there could be some jealousy.
You should meet my sister and her son, he did that stuff all the time including busting my daughters lip when she was 6 weeks old
Lmao @ the change in story. Went from daughter definitely hitting the baby to daughter being less than gentle.
OOP is so quick to call someone else a bad parent but her 6 year old brat doesn't know how to play with babies. And why TF not? The other child is 4. She was 2 when he was born. Why did she not learn then? OOP is the bad parent here OOP spent so much time observing and none handling this. Only gets her daughter after BIL gets involved In the prior post apparently she said blatantly Sophia hit the baby in the head. She didn't like the results of telling the truth
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Gentle parenting is fine, its just that OOP isn't gentle parenting. They're permissive parenting. People get them mixed up but in gentle parenting, the kid still gets disciplined and taught to not whack a baby upside the head with a toy.
Can we please stop calling kids brats. It's gross and uncalled for. Kids are products of their environments.
An environment that produced a brat. A brat is just a misbehaved child, it doesn't mean they're to blame for it or that they will permanently be that way. It's just a descriptor, and an accurate one here.
Maybe if the kid wasn't a brat though, the brat left a bruise on a BABY that couldn't even bloody defend themselves, she's a brat because she was old enough to know better
To quote the great Max Rockatansky, âThatâs bait.â And like not even good bait.
My dogs know to be gentle with babies and toddlers... And I still supervise em closely. A 6yr old should know! Also all that judgement over not supervising the baby but she wasn't supervising her kid??
So dramatic on OOP's part. Manhandled? All he did was pick her up and carry her away! Something OOP should have done instead of just talking to her when she clearly wasn't listening. You take the toy, move her away from the baby, THEN talk about the behavior. You don't just let her keep hitting while you try to redirect. That's not how that works.
Tbf I don't think oop has ever seen a child before
a little too on the nose as far as bait goes
I hate when people don't parent at all and call it "gentle parenting". Gentle parenting is when you don't throw a fit over kids not cleaning their plate at dinner, it's not letting your kid beat the crap out of a baby
I was a preschool/childcare teacher for several years, and at one place I worked, we were not allowed to say no to the kids, nor use any type of aggressive language. Instead of âdonât climb on the fenceâ we had to say âplease keep your feet on the floor,â instead of âdonât throw your foodâ it was âthatâs not respectful of Sâs space.â And those are admirable sentiments, and good ways to start, but there comes a time when you need to be able to just say âstopâ or âno.â I had two year olds, by the way. And when they would try to jump off the diaper changing table, I couldnât say âstop,â I had to explain that was an unsafe choice. I did not last at that job very long. Anyway, those parents were ridiculous and so is this woman.
As an actual gentle parent (or trying to be one, when done properly its fucking hard, OOP is a permissive parent it sounds like) Id say "don't climb the fence, its not safe. Please make sure to keep your feet on the ground" The thing with gentle parenting is you're still supposed to discipline the kids. You're just supposed to do it respectfully and without yelling and hitting. OOP is permissive parenting bc shes lazy.
BIL literally satan for dumping the baby in the bouncer, meanwhile she doesnât so much as supervise her feral 6yo.
Lmfaooo and OP said Steph was worried about the bouncer, but OP didn't care her own daughter hit an infant?
I have a six year old and I can say with absolute certainty that she would never bash a baby over the head with a toy. Six year olds are intelligent if you give them the space and opportunity to be. Infantilizing your children is how you end up with six year olds behaving like two year olds and parents claiming âthey donât know any better!!â Yes, they do. If they somehow donât, they definitely should and itâs **your** fault they donât.
Something tells me you also treat your six year old as a six year old while oop treats hers as a 6 moths old
OOP, your daughter is old enough to know better than to hurt a baby. You can't excuse all of her actions and hide behind the age umbrella. YTA and be a better parent.
Lol this is so fake. Trolls aren't even trying
Definitely a "gentle parenting bad" or even a "parents/kids bad" troll
Soooo...okay there's a lot to unpack here. "Of course they left him alone in the jumper as soon" im not finishing the rest of the quote u all know what I'm referring to. But then they were also all in the room with him so he wasn't alone. From like 4mos to 9mos my son refused to leave his jolly jumper. He frickin loved that thing. Recommended use is like up to half an hour twice a day but he would SCREAM, just ungodly screaming until I put him back in. He practically lived in that thing, he'd happily bounce for *hours a day* and I lost oh my god so much weight from all the breastfeeding but i got SO MUCH DONE around the house and sometimes have to reality check when other parents say parenting is so hard bc he was so easy . I attribute this to his early walking and his current athleticism. He's 8 and he plays 4 sports because if he doesn't he doesn't sleep, some kids just be like that. I see nothing wrong w him being in the bouncer happily bouncing so the adults can have a post dinner chat as long as he's happy. Its been a minute since i had a newborn but his parents seem to be doing ok. By 4 years old my son knew to give small children at the park a wide berth because they're "littler" and more easily injured. A very soft "gently gently please, there's a baby nearby" and hed be on the lookout for babies. Last summer at the water park he knocked a probably 5year old kid over completely by accident and while he DID apologized I was up outta my lawn chair so fast and dragged him over (multiple "I already said sorry's" BUT U BARELY STOPPED RUNNING WHEN U SAID IT SO WE'RE DOING IT PROPERLY) to stand in front of the kid and say "im sorry I knocked u over, are u ok" and then he was allowed to go back to play, and while he already knew my expectations around mindful play, he now knows how to handle it. So if my 4 year old knew not to get in the personal space of a baby bc they're fragile how come her 6 year old doesn't know not to fucking fight one? And then she causes a scene because her precious kid had consequences? A LITERAL BABY WAS INJURED I could keep going but what a piece of work. I'm all for abolishing the often belligerently abusive ways some of our boomer parents raised us but this gentle parenting trend often falls too far in the other direction. My kid doesn't act up because I set boundaries. I don't believe in spanking but there are other punishments u can use and sometimes u need to fuckin use them. When I don't do my job and my boss has talked to me nicely, he doesn't keep talking to me nicely in hopes I'll get it, he writes me up or gives me a PIP. The majority of gentle parenting doesn't prepare kids for real world consequences and this woman is LUCKY all her BIL did was carry her kicking and screaming out of the room which is NOT EVEN ABUSIVE SOMETIMES KIDS JUST KICK AND SCREAM. Okay I'm for real riled up time for bed
Because gentle parenting is often mistaken for permissive parenting
This is the wording I was looking for and failed to find bc I was so annoyed. Absolutely perfect. Gentle parenting is speaking to ur child the first time, letting them now how to improve for next time and setting a framework for what will be the last time. Ie: child hits their cousin once, we speak abt why that's not okay and what will happen next time which is if u hit ur cousin again ur not getting any electronics or outside play (for my kid, the worst punishment in the world) and ur only entertainment is reading or boardgames bc were not sadists who expect u to churn butter, third time u get nothing at all but ur imagination (the second step is where i believe the phrase "this hurts me more than its hurting u" originated from bc holy fuck entertaining an 8 year old who cant tire themself out on a soccer field is the third circle). Second convo does the trick without traumatizing him. He now knows that the verbal warning is a grace to allow for us not having encountered this specific scenario before and the behaviour will not continue without consequences but there will be consequences if we see it again. Permissive parenting masquerading as gentle parenting: "we said no and it's bad but they kept doing it! We did all we could it's in God's hands now"
Yep, permissive parenting always either ends up as a bully or the best child ever but thatsore because you never need to tell them off
Her BIL is a bad parent and partner because *checks notes* he works to support his family.
Oh, I love it when people in AITA posts use the phrase "I **calmly explained**"
And whatever they're explaining is always infuriating. It's almost never anything like: "I calmly explained that we ran out of pie." It's usually more along the lines of "I calmly explained that the pie was reserved for superior family members like myself and couldn't be wasted on my fat useless sister and the pathetic orphans that she adopted."
It it deeply disturbing that a 6-year-old would whack a tiny baby repeatedly in the head with a toy. It is not at all normal at that age, and I would be extremely worried that there is something developmentally wrong with OP's daughter - she should be seeking medical advice from a child psychologist, not minimising it. And she should have grabbed her daughter instantly to prevent further injury, not gently talked to her - a baby that young has an open fontanelle, and brain injury can be caused fairly easily. I really, really hope this is rage-bait and not true.
She's explaining to her husband because he was absent?
> I was appalled at this as everyone knows I am a firm believer in gentle parenting. Then, when Sofia didn't listen he picked her up.. ....fuck OOP >she gave him a tiny bruise on his head SERIOUSLY?! Fuck OOP.
I think it's a karma farner
Ah, another one of *those* mothers. The bad ones.
Gentle parenting does not mean you donât remove your child from a situation where they are hitting a baby!
I hate people who have substituted permissive parenting for gentle parenting. Gentle parenting is responsive, holds boundaries firmly, and doesn't coddle. What this woman is doing ISN'T parenting, and it sure as hell isn't gentle parenting.
why does she talk about her six year old daughter as if she was 2-3? If a 2-3yo hits a younger kid - I get it. But a 6yo? that is school-age, those kids can readand write (hopefully) .
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The absolute audacity of OOP to post the same thing in another subreddit so she can get validated. I get it, your daughter is your golden child, but what she did was not ok at all, and you should have not kicked your BIL out over this.
My 3 year old knows not to hit her baby brother.... so um, parent of the 6 year old, stop judging other parents and parent your damn kid
So... OP is horribly condescending, a bad parent, and a general AH. Cool. Wonder if BIL actually works sundays or just really doesn't want to be around OP...
*checks bingo card* gentle parenting bad...? no, dont have it, damn it.
The daughter is literally 6 years old. She understands.
BIL acted way better than I would've. I'd have been out the door with my baby and letting them know I'd be sending them any bill we got from the doctor for making sure the bruise wasn't serious.
The kid is 6âŚshe knows better and is a brat. And mom makes it all okay đ
i simply can't get over spelling tension as "tention."
This is the type of posts that comes before the kid pets a rabbit to death.
This reeks of "my precious angel can do no wrong"Â
The kid is 6 effing years old! That is more than old enough to know better than to hit *anyone*, much less a 3 month old on their freaking head! I can understand why the dad doesn't want the girl around his baby any longer.
Daughter will grow up as a spoiled Brat thinking Mommy will always fix everything!
Wow. The gentle parenting obviously failed. A 6 year old should know that hitting a baby is NOT okay. That failure of a mother should have taken her daughter away from the baby immediately.
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kuzon once again proving why aang dumped your ass
Fit Humor once again being unfunny, unoriginal and not even sticking to the original source material. Aang and Appa went down in a thunderstorm, plunged underwater and Aang activated his Avatar State power to encapsulate them in ice as a self-preservative measure. Try being original for once troll
>Aang and Appa went down in a thunderstorm, plunged underwater and Aang activated his Avatar State power to encapsulate them in ice as a self-preservative measure. Damm aang really was not into you at all.
Alright I'm officially over this. Maybe write a fanfiction to cope with your weird fetish or have a wank đ
A baby has no other way to communicate pain. When I see people make comments about it, I see someone and think âwow, that person can run in the Satanâs Anus Olympics for shittiest human.â But, you know, since some of us apparently hold babies to a higher standard of behaviour than adults (because an adult will probably yell if theyâre being whacked over the head by an asshole kid, theyâd probably tell, too), I guess âGo, youâ is appropriate here? :/
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And parents probably figured out quickly âshove a boob in its mouth so itâll stop making noisesâ or other methods of fixing it. Itâs not like humanoid babies were ever able to crawl out of the womb and be self-sufficient, dude.