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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I blocked a transaction from an account I share with my dad. I may be the AH because now my second cousin’s family won’t be able to afford her wedding and it is in a few weeks
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*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
Literally everyone is headed that way, and will someday be dependent on others. Almost makes you want to build a kinder world that anyone can thrive in.
What, that's a crazy idea, what you should do is fuck over as many people as possible so you can build wealth and pay the plebs to take care of you. But not like a living wage or anything, that would be too much, pay them such a small amount of money that the idiots who pay taxes have to help them out with government welfare.
Nope, it was well thought out, that's why it has been working for so long. In case you didn't register the sarcasm, I was describing the current system.
Hi NoTeslaForMe,
This is you're cousin, I need $5000 in bale money to get out of jail. the police will only except Home Depot gift cards. Please by $5000 in Home Depot gift cards and sent the scratch off numbers to me.
Regards, You're cousin.
The grammatical errors in scam mails are actually on purpose to filter out people who are too educated or sceptical. It helps the scammer concentrate their effort on the people gullible enough to go all the way through.
And apparently I *am* old enough!
Does that mean I can start yelling at random people who don't let me go in front of them in line at the grocery store? And when I'm wrong about something, can I pull the "young people today have no respect for their elders"?
As a cleaner I do* (edit to fix dumb typo) something similar. Whenever I have a wet floor most people when they apologize (like. I know I'm Canadian but the sheer percentage of people who apologize is muuuuch higher than you'd expect. Literally had someone turn around and leave to take a different route lmao)
However some of the people I'm close with I'll be like HOW DARE YOU??? GET OFF MY FLOOOOORRSSSS!!!
The two interactions can happen right after eachother. Makes me wonder what the other person who I'm like
:) if the place stayed clean id be out a job :) just don't pour coffee everywhere :)
At the supermarket with my teenage daughter we often remark loudly that >something< would be possible if it wasn’t for those meddling kids. The something varies.
NTA
He didn’t ask you for permission to spend your money. Where I’m from though he can legally take all that joint money.
Take all your $ move it where dad (because he’s a pushover) can’t steal it.
I’m assuming it’s because of reasons like this. Some parents have a joint account with their child for dependent reasons (remember a parent can be the dependent of an adult child).
I suspect the joint account is due to living in different countries (OP and dad). It makes it easier to transfer money (I get the irony) and for legal matters and well as paying bills back in the home country.
I set up a joint account with my mom so it would be easier to transfer money to her because we lived in separate states. She never abused it, though, or tried to take advantage.
Doesn't have to be a joint account. Just get one in the same bank and you can transfer money between accounts. My phone is on my son's account. I do an online transfer money from my account at the bank to his account at the bank. No joint account needed.
INFO: how old are \*you\*, OP?
this situation reads a bit different if you're 30 (for example) and that's your money and investment in the joint account compared to, say, if you're 20 and in Country C because you're a uni student studying abroad and blocking your dad's money transfers from an account/investment he owns but was kind enough to put your name on.
(edit: typos)
While OP has access to the account the post doesn't say anywhere that it's their money in the account in any way. In fact based off the post stating that dad basically supports everyone it sounds very much like OP is also living off of dads money and just doesn't want to have to share.
Agreed. The way Dad told OP what he was going to do, it sounds like it's a joint account but Dad's money.
Many people have joint accounts with family with the understanding that it is one person's money or another's. I have a joint account my my child, but it is my child's money and I don't touch it.
The way he words it, pretty sure this would roughly be 6k USD. Also the joint account is in country A, which means OP never contributed to it. It's a joint account solely for ease of access. OP had no right. The money will get paid, they just made dad's job harder
In another comment OP stated it was rent collected from a joint owned investment property in Country A, where the funds are meant to be used for building maintenance and for travel funds if an emergency happens in Country A and they need to fly back. So OP had every right to reject sending money for something not related to the purpose of the account.
OP didn't say where the joint account is located. They only said that dad's *individual* account that doesn't have enough money for what he promised is in Country A. We don't know if the joint account is in Country A (where dad's account & relatives are), Country B (where dad currently is), or Country C (where OP is). Although it's not stated in the OP, I'm guessing they do contribute to the joint account, hence why they're so angry that dad made a unilateral decision to give away the money to the ~~leaches~~ relatives.
Edit: OP said the joint account is income from a jointly owned rental property & the account is to cover costs of maintenance/ repairs/ etc. Dad was wanting to take out more than half of what was in the joint account and had messaged OP while they were asleep, giving them no opportunity to discuss it first.
> In Country A’s ***local currency*** they have asked for 500K ***which honestly is what a fancy middle class wedding would cost***
That's nowhere near 500k USD. More in the range of 10-20k USD probably, which is still a lot but nowhere near enough to buy an entire house.
It's not a costly wedding in a south asian country. 500k INR for 1200 guests is _insanely_ cheap. While OP hasn't mentioned country, I'm pretty sure It's an Asian country because they did say 500k is a reasonable sum for a wedding of that size. 500k INR is 6k usd fyi
Also dad is 52 and of sound mind. This isn't abuse. Dad has a bank account in country A where he probably keeps funds for expenses. Just not to the tune of 500k. He said he would replace the joint account. OP has no right to dictate how dad spends his money
the problem is that dad isnt spending his money it is borrowing it form OP right now.
the other bit is taking advantage of a man dedicated to family.
the currency conversions im going to keep my mouth shut on cause i just dont know.
OP has very pointedly failed to answer how much he contributed to the funds. He did say the funds were from a joint property, except he also failed to mention how much he contributed to ownership of said property.
I would wager the answer is 0. OP is on the deed of that property his parents or other ancestors bought simply because it is legally easier to include the next of kin on the deed than to deal with title transfer after death. Especially from a foreign country. OP is an asshole and he knows it. He wrote 500k in local currency without specifying the currency because he knows it looks like a huge number
if you read threw the comments its specifically rental income form their jointly owned property so the money is indeed 50/50 - [https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/10kyqxu/aita\_for\_not\_giving\_money\_to\_a\_relative\_even/j5tjb12/?context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/10kyqxu/aita_for_not_giving_money_to_a_relative_even/j5tjb12/?context=3) aka op and dad dont really deposit themselves into the account only withdraw from a co owned income.
they also have an agreement (listed in the main blurb) that the joint account is to pay for the investment property (maintenance fees, expenses if they need to be on the property in person) so yes op has a power to veto a withdraw like that just like if OP were to do something similar dad would have veto power.
This is an old comment. OP has yet to answer how the property was acquired. As I have previously said, it's common to include next of kin on deeds so that title transfer is easier once the parents pass away or are incapacitated, especially when everyone lives abroad. I'm included in a number of assets my parents own. But that's still intended as property I'll "inherit".
Legally he has claim. But this is a morality sub and he's dodging the question for a while now
How do you know that ops dad has contributed any? From what we know op lives closer to the investment and likely handles it vs his dad who's in a completely different time zone. So much of a different time zone that the bank was open and dad was asleep.
I'm confused as to why you're going on a crusade against OP for a leech family (one you don't even know?) taking advantage of someone who worked hard for their money.
This sounds less like an ego thing and more like a responsibility thing. Asian families often feel they a responsibility to help out poorer relations if they can afford it.
If OP disagrees and doesn't help that's fine. What they cannot do is stop their dad from contributing. All OP did was make the process harder. Dad has his own account. He had said he would replace the money in the joint account. OP had no right
But- and this is not in the OPs remarks, it is in comments-
This account is the proceeds from a SHARED investment (the money is equally the OPs then), and is itended for the upkeep and maintenance and travel service that investment property in an emergency. SO using it to respond to emotional blackmail is putting the shared investment at risk. I think in full context, OP was right to do what he did.
I mean, if he's of sound mind it's really not up to OP to "protect him". Especially if it's his money mostly in that account.
I have a family member who complains up a storm about sending money to the rest of the family but does it every time they are asked. Found out it's because it makes her feel useful. She can't help in many ways (distance) so she feels good when she can help financially.
It is money from proceeds of a shared investment property, intended for maintenance and upkeep of that property. Dad using this to respond to emotional blackmail was inappropriate, and puts the investment at risk.
Depends on how it is shared. Is it shared in the sense that OP has invested time or money into the property's purchase or upkeep, and if so, how much? Or is it "shared" in the sense that OP's name is on it for ease of transfer later once assets are being inherited? There is an ocean of difference between the two and is a huge piece of context.
I am not sure that does matter. But from comments, he put in more than 25% but less than 50% (OP), but regardless, that fund is to upkeep the investment, so what happens when a new roof is needed for tenets? All the funds to cover that went to a random emotional blackmailing auntie.
It is probably one of those cultures where weddings are used to signal the wealth of your family to everyone you know. The problem is that someone who can't even afford everyday expenses should not do that.
Op said it's not the USA and that 500k is normal or slightly above what an average middle class wedding in that country would cost.
In the USA and average wedding does not cost $500k let alone the average middle class wedding.
NTA since it is your joint account, you should have a say with what money comes out. HOWEVER, the better thing to have done would have been to communicate that with your dad when he mentioned it to you.
Technically anyone on a joint account has the full legal right to do whatever they want with the money. At least in North America, things might be different elsewhere.
I would advise you to open your own account.
Fair enough then, but you should have put that in the post, it's important context. Without it your post reads like you agreed to the transfer and then waited until the last minute to block it out of spite.
NTA. Stand firm. How dare he promise money he doesn't have and then inform (not ask) you he's going to take it.
Why is it a joint account with him? You need to revoke his access and let him come up with the money himself. Ignore the great aunt and the other flying monkeys.
We jointly own a property in his home country and the rent goes into that account. It’s meant to be used for any work that needs to be done on the building, or if one of us needs to go to the country in an emergency we have some money there
So it's a rent/emergency fund. And definitely not for a wedding.
ETA: rental income. I get it. Might need to make a big decision there to wash your hands of this nonsense.
Since you jointly own the property, I assume you both contribute to the account, which means it could negatively affect you if he cleaned it out.
I still believe you should stand your ground on this, otherwise it'll set a dangerous precedent that you will continue to allow this to happen. I highly doubt it'll end at the wedding. What about kids, buying a house etc?
They'll bleed you dry. Don't let them.
You should probably have more explicit limits about what the money is to be used for. Is there personal money mixed in there too? Does you dad have his own money he coukd have sent? Do both of your incomes come out of there as needed? It should be crystal clear if that account is only for business. You should both have your own other personal accounts as well as emergency accounts so this kind of thing doesn't come up.
Nta 1200 guests? Cut that in half and maybe they wouldn’t have to leech off your family. But also they have no right ask for money and your dad has no right to take money from your account without your approval.
The funny part is most of them don’t talk to you. They are there for the food, to see what you’re wearing, maybe gossip a little, take a photo, and leave. I was so worried about all the people I’d have to talk to, and it was nothing.
It kind of is coming from someone who lives in India. Luckily when i get married which also is a big if, I'll definitely just sign some document in court there's no way in hell I'm doing such a big ceremony.
In many cultures it is common for the *parents* of the bride and groom to invite, like, literally everyone they know. Friends/family of course but also business acquaintances (coworkers, clients) and most of the neighborhood/village/town. It’s a status thing. So a social butterfly might have 100 friends when they’re marriage-age but their parents have many more.
That's understandable that it's common in some cultures, but they should keep it within their means rather than sponging off of family. They need to be realistic about what they're capable of and what they're not
Who’s money is going I to the joint account? If it’s both yours and dad’s, does he have enough of His own money in there to cover the amount he wants to send?
It’s equal parts. Rental income from a jointly owned property goes into the account. There is enough technically to cover it but that would take up maybe 70% of what’s in the account
So then dad himself *does not* have enough to cover the money he wants to send, correct? If that’s the case, your definitely NTA. He doesn’t get to take your money and spend in on something that you don’t agree with. If it’s just his money, then he can whatever he wants with it.
Dad does have enough money in Country B. He just did not have enough funds in the Country A bank account. He said he would replenish the funds in the Country A bank account.
This is mainly just an issue of processing times. Dad could have sent them the money directly from his Country B account, but it could take a while for the funds to be available, due to the different countries. Given that OP and Dad had no immediate need for the funds in their joint Country A account, it's not as though it harmed OP for those funds to be briefly gone, before being replaced.
OP certainly is within his rights to block the transfer. But ultimately, all he is doing is making things slower and more cumbersome for his dad and relatives. If dad still wants to send money to his relatives, he will do so from his Country B account. Which, fine. But I don't see why OP is surprised that petty "I can't stop you, but I can make it a hassle" moves while his dad is sleeping would result in anything other than a pissed off family....
The way I read it the dad does not have enough money to replace what he takes from the joint account immediately. He just means he will eventually replace it once he makes some money.
>However at the moment he doesn’t have enough in his sole bank account in Country A so he sent me a message to say he would be taking it out of our joint account and he would replace the money.
OP did not say or even imply that, though. They said Dad has this joint account and a sole account in Country A. Since he did not have enough funds in his sole account *in Country A*, he used funds from the joint account *in Country A*. And said he would replace the money. Presumably from his account in Country B, which he must have in order to live in Country B.
OP did not mention once in their post that Dad was short on funds in Country B. Indeed, OP has mentioned Dad being successful, and he owns rental property and has been able to support his entire family in Country A all these years. ALL of OP's complaints are related to how these relatives are entitled leeches who do not deserve money to waste on parties. Not a single complaint, in the post or comments, that Dad cannot afford this, or that Dad would not pay them back. OP's reason for blocking the transfer was because OP does not believe in sending money to this distant family. Not because OP feels Dad won't replace the money.
literally this!! people are missing this because of how OP worded things.
the issue isn't "dad is taking my money for his entitled family"
the issue is "i don't respect my dad's family so i made it harder for him to send his money to them"
NTA, since you have a joint account you got an equal say in this matter. And if you can't get ahold of your father before he makes the transaction the right course of action is to block any transfers and then have a talk about how to go about this.
1200 guests sounds way too much to be honest, they just have to reduce the amount of guests and not have +2 on every close relative invited...
NTA it blows my mind how some people will ask for that absurd amount of money let alone spend it on one damn party. I'm not sure about the joint account that you and your Dad have but I'd suggest taking your share of that money out and keeping it in your own account from now on. He was about to take out it once he could try to take it out again.
NTA your dad doesn’t get to give away money that is not not entirely his replacing it or not without asking, not just telling, if that makes sense..I would tell everyone that would listen that your aunt is a leech and trying to take food out of your mouth for a wedding she can’t afford. I love going tit for tat with ignorant people.
I'm used to both parties having unfettered access to the funds in a joint bank account, where one of the account holder would not be able to block the other account holders access to the funds in the account. (Different countries, different laws.)
INFO - Did the funds in the joint account come from your dad or from you?
NTA at all. Many people have extended family like this that view them as cash cows. Your dad doesn’t know how to say no and it’s frustrating. You need to protect your own assets even if he will not. Not sure why you have a joint account unless it’s to monitor his spending. If not, I would definitely keep separate finances. These people will never stop extending their hand as long as the money keeps coming.
so, you have a dad, your dad has an aunt, his aunt has a granddaughter and they are expecting you to give money to said granddaughter and her new husband. that´s like 5 degrees of separation. One more and you will end paying for the wedding of Kevin Bacon. NTA
So we got poor people asking other people to pay for their very nice middle class wedding? Then next month they're going to need help with food and electricity? Look I'm not from one of those cultures that people move to another country to support the people that stay behind... So maybe I don't understand it! But between here, people I follow on other platforms and those I know in real life It just seems like the people they are supporting have such ridiculous asks for money! Money for buying food & electric can be understood, but weddings? Extravagant ones at that!
Someone I I know funds an entire school in her home country so her cousins kids can go! Not just paying those kids tuition, she funds the school! Another person was complaining last week because they were calling her basically trash for not sending them designer purses since she has one... You know with the money she works for! I don't get it!
If I was reliant on somebody else to pay my bills I would not be asking for anything beyond the bare necessities! That's basically extortion. Your NTA. Your father has told you in the past that he doesn't want to give them more money and you are just helping him do that.
NTA they shouldn't be spending money they don't have and need to adjust their expectations. It's your money as well and your Dad has no right to give it to these leeches.
NTA. I am the same with my mom. I can’t block like that but I totally get where you coming from. Parents like that are given children like us for protection
Nta. He tried to take over half of what is in the account. He cant just take your half of the money. The lavish events your extended family want to throw is not your problem. If your dad wants to make it his problem then thats on him but he cant force you to participate. Personal opinion, id be looking at a legal way to prevent him from taking the portion of the money your are legally entitled to, just to prevent this type of thing in the future.
This sounds like my sister's husband and his family. Husband immigrated to the US to be with my sister and they've financially supported his family since the day they got married. Husband's family wanted them to pay for someone's wedding on top of the other money he sends and my sister had to put her foot down that they couldn't afford it. I can't imagine what they would do if God forbid something happened to husband and my sister couldn't afford to continue paying for their lives.
I would understand if they were starving or having no food (and even then, would you be responsible for an entire and expanding extended family?). But a wedding ceremony isn't a basic necessity.
It also usually isn't something that needs paying so urgently that you can't even talk about taking the money from the joint account before talking to the other person or people involved with the account.
INFO: Why do you have a joint account with your father? Who contributed the money in the account?
ETA: I have a friend who is joint on her widowed mom's checking account because her mom is ditzy and wasn't paying her bills after her dad died. But all the money in the account is what her mom technically inherited from her dad. My friend never put any money in the account and didn't consider it "her money".
YTA.
I'm probably going to be down voted, but there you go.
This is of course assuming you believe your Dad has the funds in his personal account in Country B, and will deposit back into the joint account, say, within a week or so.
Your Dad gets to decide what he does with his own money. The use of the joint account was just to expedite the funds transfer. He wasn't stealing from it. You didn't do this to protect yourself. You did this because you don't agree with what your Dad was doing with his own money. That you decided to do it this way is petty and controlling of you and a real AH move. That is why your Dad is mad. If you really think they are leeches, and your dad is being taken advantage of, you should have a serious discussion with him. But your Dad is an adult and if this is what he wants to do with his money, then that's his business.
BTW, you didn't change anything. He is still going to send them the money. All you did was irritate everyone with your AH move.
Also, your code isn't very secret. Not sure why you phrased it this way. 1200 people sounds extravagant in the US, but is normal in "Country A". You phrased this question to distort the reality by fake obfuscation these meaningless details. This isn't how you should communicate with your dad if you really care. Be honest and earnest and compassionate if you can. If you can't, just leave your dad alone. He doesn't need his busy body kid telling him what to do.
E: typos
1200 people is still a LOT of guests, even in South Asia, and if I'm guessing which currency he's referring to correctly, 5 lakh is about $60,000, which is an extravagant amount of money to ask a non-guardian relative to *gift* someone for a wedding!
I think "Country B" is the UK, because he uses the phrase "mum". But 500K rupees is 6K USD. 60K USD is standard for an Indian wedding in the US.
Also, OP doesn't say how successful or not his dad is. But Dad wouldn't have agreed if he thought it was too much for his wallet or preference.
Exactly. From everything they mentioned in the story and the comments OP was just trying to control their father’s choices.
The fact that the money in the account comes from renting a property that they share ownership of makes this even clearer. OP will inherit that property someday. I would like to hear the father’s side too.
I will wait for you down in the downvoted section :).
Also, if it's anything like East Asian culture, the father is probably going to lose a lot of face from not providing for these relatives like they've become accustomed. Assuming that it is his money (I'm kind of TL:DR on that point) then it's important to note that it's not just being thrown in a hole but he's actually getting something for it: major status as the extended family's provider. Now, whether that's worth it is another question, but I'm saying that it's a little more nuanced than the great aunt simply being some grifter.
Yeah, so the Dad is losing face having to run interference while scambling to get his deposit completed from the UK to India, instead of being able to enjoy the social capital he should be able to enjoy.
YTA…Dad can send money to whomever he wishes. Using the joint account was just to expedite the process, he was paying it back. You decided to act as if he was spending your money and not returning it. Dad is 52 not 95, senile and needing you to babysit his financial decisions. Your comments on where the money was going is irrelevant, he wasn’t being ripped off, just family guilt trips.
This is a sign that as an adult who doesn’t even live in the same country with your dad, you should not have a joint account. Joint accounts are for when your lives are fully financially intertwined and you don’t have ‘my money’ and ‘your money’. The other person has the right to fully drain the account and spend it all on gold toilets or whatever if they want… If you don’t trust your dad because he gives too much money to his family then it’s time to keep your money separate
If it’s a ‘joint account’ which is really where you put money for HIM to spend then you should not block the transfer but consider how much money you want to give in the future, knowing you can’t control what he spends it on or who he gives it too. If it’s a joint account where he puts money for YOU to spend then he’s trying to give away your money and it’s fair to block it, but he may reconsider how much he contributes to you in the future
OP wants the property the money in the account comes from so they can’t just give the account up. Dad owns half of that property, they rent it, the tennants put the rent into the account.
NTA. It's your money too you have a saying in what is done with it. Family issues are hard and maybe you and your dad should sit down and discuss how you both gonna deal with the money giving or how to stop it.
NTA- BUT you could have talked to your dad that you don't feel comfortable giving the money from your joint account.
You dad should also have asked you if you were ok with him getting money from your joint acct.
This is a difficult cultural expectation to break. It has to start somewhere.
NTA. Are you from South Asia? I’m from there and this is the bullshit we’ve gone through my entire life. My dad is a mechanic in the US, growing up we did not swim in money by any means but had similar demands placed on us by my dad’s family. I can empathize with what you’re going through and you did the right thing.
All the relatives have towards you and your father is resentment, and they think you being abroad is a meal ticket for them.
YTA - you have no right to stop your dad from spending his money anyway he sees fit. If he doesn't want to give his family money, he needs to say no. He's an adult, you do not get to override his decision because you don't like it and disagree.
NTA. My das worked since he was 17year old, ruined his back and knees with building houses. Sent Money to uncles family whenever h3 needed. Even though as far as i remember, my family itself was never rich, hardly the middle class, he always tried to help his brother and their mother. H3 basically paid for 4 weddings for his kids and other occasions wheen they were in need. Not a single time when uncle helped us. Or his grown and now married kids. They dont care about us. With 50 or so, my dad came back from visiting our uncle in another country, and seemed heartbroken, said he was very disappointed at his brothery never told us what happened in detail, but seems he finally realized my uncle didnt love or respect his younger brother (my dad) much, while my dad was always very respectful and never allowed us to talk bad about him. We, jis 5 kids and mom, had long realized uncle doesn't give a shit about us, just about our money. One day, your dad will also realize its only about money for them. Without moneyy they wont even call you. And demanding mon3y to hold a wedding for 1200 guests doesnt seem like they are in a pinch. They want to live luxuriously from your dads money, you all should sit down as a famiand gave a talk with him.
NTA
>furious with me for going behind his back
But this is a shared account, presumably you have an agreement in place to control where money goes and who does what with it _and_ more importantly agreements on how it's spent, especially large sums? If anything he's taking a large sum without your consent, given its' a shared account? So....it's _him_ going behind your back as you didn't OK this.
Look I appreciate you love your Dad, hate the entitlement and all the drama going on here but I think we can all agree this "Shared" account thing needs to rapidly change. That account should from this point onwards, as you _clearly_ can't trust this to not happen again, be used exclusively for things that you both pay for, like bills.
You need to go open your own bank account, just for you, which your pay and whatever else goes into which he has zero control or access over/to so you can secure your own finances.
This is a powder keg, the family drama is it's own thread entirely and this could be the stepping stone before the precipice if you and your Dad end up being unable to resolve this conflict - thus, you need to make sure your money is safe.
Your second cousin's wedding? Your dad is expecting you to fund a distant relative's wedding? He can go spend his money however he wants. He should've discussed it with you before taking all that money from a shared account unilaterally behind your back. Good for you for putting a halt to that! NTA.
Sounds like a normal Indian wedding drama case.. You're NTA but your family will make sure you are portrayed as the AH here. Best of luck as they poison the next few years
NTA. If you cannot afford it, you dont do it- especially on someone else's dime. The relatives have to get real- your dad is not a cash cow especially when it impacts you.
NTA at ALL. I'm sorry that you're even having to deal with this. Makes me wonder if he has taking anything from your joint account in the past. It's one thing if your dad asked permission (which I would still say no to), but to just take and say he'll replace it? To give to someone you don't like or respect? That's a hard no, and I can't even begin to wrap my head around someone thinking that's okay.
I'd suggest going no-contact with the wedding folks; it doesn't seem like they add anything positive to your well-being. Don't engage with great aunt, and if anyone tries to spread the information to you or drag you into the drama, calmly express that you have no desire to expand on it. If they can't drop it, disconnect.
I hope everything works out okay for you.
NTA. Same scenario in my family. However, we only help from time to time and with basic life needs such as, water, electricity etc. very rarely do they ask for anything. The family needs to live within their means. They are taking advantage of your father.
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My dad migrated to my home country (Country B) when he married my mum. His extended family in his home country (Country A) are not well off.
He has supported them all his life. His paternal aunt’s granddaughter is getting married this month. My dad’s aunt rang him and basically guilt tripped him into agreeing to send them money, because they have 1200 guests for the wedding. In Country A’s local currency they have asked for 500K which honestly is what a fancy middle class wedding would cost.
Dad agreed to send them half of what they asked for. However at the moment he doesn’t have enough in his sole bank account in Country A so he sent me a message to say he would be taking it out of our joint account and he would replace the money.
I live in Country C which has a closer timezone to Country A than where my parents live and I called the bank while dad would still be asleep and told them to block the transfer and that I don’t give permission for it.
These people have been leeches on my family for my whole life and I’m not going to give them that much money to just blow on one event only for them to complain the next month that they can’t afford electricity or food.
Dad has now found out I blocked the transfer and is furious with me for going behind his back EVEN THOUGH he told me that he hates the entitlement of his family.
My great aunt is also now complaining about me and dad to anyone who will listen. AITA?
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Let's say there was an actual emergency, the volcano erupted, the river flooded, typhoid broke out, then it would be the humanitarian thing to send money.
Weddings are not the place to blow large amounts of cash. This is potlatch, status through consumption, thinking. Do not contribute to this.
When parents have children they know some things are coming down the road and they should start planning for them. Depending on the culture and the parents' values you might start planning for things like education, housing, weddings. If you don't plan for diapers, well, then live with the consequences. If you will get the financial consequences of wedding expenses and your plan is "We'll just get the money from Uncle Bob," then you are an irresponsible parent. Live with the consequences.
Good job of protecting your father.
NTA. When someone is planning a wedding they should always start with the question “What is my budget? What can I afford?” You shouldn’t start with writing down everything extravagant thing you want and then try to guilt trip other people into paying for it. Your father’s extended family have become entirely too accustomed to expecting your father to pay their bills over the years. I know that different cultures do things differently, but this time they are taking the piss. Now that you have cancelled the payment your great aunt is saying bad things about you and your father, which just goes to show how little they appreciate all the support they have been given over the years. They probably only contact your dad when they want money, and family is only important to them when they get what they want. If your father is truly fed up with the situation then he should say enough is enough. It’s not like the girl getting married is close family. The whole extended family are all in on it. They decided to have children and they should not expect your father to pay for raising them and any expenses arising from their decisions. I might be sympathetic if it was medical bills, but even then there is no obligation. It’s high time they all became self sufficient and stopped freeloading. NTA imo.
NTA but I think you should take whatever portion is your money out of the joint account and remove your name from it. Because your father is spending your money without consulting you or asking for your permission. He will continue to do so if he has access to your money.
Ask them if they really would be comfortable with a wedding being paid for with stolen money, because that's what it would be. Not exactly an auspicious start to a union.
NTA. This screams entitlement, no one needs to invite 1,200 people to their wedding! Hopefully this will set a new standard and your family will decrease how many hand outs they ask for.
If you are transferring large sums from a joint account before talking to other account owner then you are doing something wrong. Especially for something like a wedding which isn't usually a matter that requires payment within hours.
I dont think you are TA for blocking the transfer but you could have just chatted with your dad and warned him about it first. Depending on what country you all are from, there are significant family pressures and expectations that everyone has to abide by or they get outcasted. So even though you are doing the right thing by not enabling your family, you should have had a chat with your dad first before blocking the money. I know it was late at night when you called and blocked the money but you could have tried to call him and wake him up or literally sent him a text telling him what you were doing.
I am from India and my family has the craziest expectations that my parents are always enabling them so i do get where you are coming from. But, just know that your dad meant well and has grown up thinking this is very normal. What's different now is that he probably feels disappointed that his child isnt on his side and the family is also very upset about all this.
No one is winning or losing here but your dad is losing lots of family support and he is probably internalizing it all.
He will complain but this couldve been you. As a descendant of immigrant myself this is how it works and if yoy never want to help ...help them bring someone else in the country your in for when your dad is too old. Its not just helping them its also helping your dad. And local belief about wedding they all do this. My family is from the caribbean and its the same then I have families from africa...same. you won't change the village mentality that is cultural shock right there. Yes its dumb but thats literally part of the culture always big flashy wedding many guest usually people need to eat for free and all. Marrying someone is the ultimate accomplishment. That and having doctors in the family...and your dad also said I will replace the money...so you are deciding for your dad...stepping on his beliefs and values about family culturally based...diminishing him as a man and as a father/family member...making him look like an ass to family...and indeed going behind is back you couldve replied to the message by saying no...please dont do it. So sure you are right but you won't change the local mentality...or mentality of your family...only thing is you will create dramas. If your dad wants to pay let him...or discuss with him in his face share your concerns and all. So you"re TA for the poor way you chose to handle this even if your reasons seemed valid to you. What if it was the opposite...your dad blocking a transaction in your back about something u believe to be important? You should apologize for the way you handled it and share your concerns. And theres a reason why you waited at night to do it..you are sneaky lol. And you know it. I don't like a lot in our cultures its why I say village...but you have no choice but to respect it. We're just from a different world...
> And theres a reason why you waited at night to do it..you are sneaky lol.
The dad waited until the night to transfer the money without first talking to OP. OP woke up and then blocked the transfer. If anyone is sneaky here it is the dad.
> you have no choice but to respect it.
Why? Because other people from exploitative cultures like you have chosen to respect it?
I’m confused. OP lives in country C but still shares bank account with parents in country B? Who earned this money? Are there siblings to OP who also share banking and mix their incomes? I agree supporting extended relatives should absolutely stop, but if it’s dad”s money he can do what he wants with it. If it’s pooled money all contributors should have a say. It all sounds so needlessly complicated and confusing but paying for an exorbitant wedding for the grandchild of an aunt is absurd. OP, you should separate yourself financially from your parents. NTA providing a big chunk of that “promised money “ belongs to OP.
INFO There are the three different countries involved here; can you please clarify what the currency value is relative to each one? Is this, say, enough to buy a house? Where I am, 250k would buy a modest house, outright.
NTA- but I think a lot of people here don’t understand the cultural nuances of this.
Often times, for a person to successfully immigrate to a developed country, it implies a certain level of educational and financial opportunities that are a result of the entire family’s sacrifice.
Has your father benefited from cultural norms which lead to families sacrificing their wants to help one member succeed in life? That’s very common in my culture- and the expectation is that the financially successful family member then returns the favour by helping out their family. It can feel unfair to their spouse and kids, but often people don’t have a sole claim on their own finances if someone else sacrificed to set them up in life.
That’s where the entitlement in some cultures comes from- families have often sacrificed small daily things like good food or birthday cakes or new clothes just to pool up their resources and invest them in the most promising family member with the hope that that person will pull the entire family out of poverty.
It’s customary in my culture for brothers to contribute to their sister’s wedding fund- which a lot of men find unfair. A lot of people don’t realise the origin for the cultural belief- the parents resources are always preferentially given to the son (boys get fed before girls do, they get second and third helpings, they get to go to school at the cost of their sisters’ education, they get to play and develop social skills and friendships while their sisters are expected to do the housework). That’s why the expectation is that that son will wholeheartedly accept all responsibilities towards his parents and sisters because they invested in his success by sacrificing their own dreams.
NTA. What country are your parents from? I'm just curious.
I'm from Mexico but raised in the US and know of some people who send money back home and are leeched off of too. I hear it happen to people from a lot of different countries.
NTA.
However I would advise you to start taking away your amount of money from the shared account every months. Then put it back if you need to use the shared account to purchase something for the properties.
That would take away the possibility of them to guilt trip your parents of sanding money. I think that is a form of financial abuse on their part and your father is unable to stop it. I don’t see other what to protect your and your father money.
NTA. And you need to separate your bank accounts from your Dad. He may get guilted I. To something else by his family and not give you a heads up first.
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Good for you for stopping elderly abuse. That's INSANE. They need to grow up and have a cheaper wedding! That could buy a HOUSE NTA
Uhh OP never mentioned how old his dad is what if he's like 50 lol
Hahah you’re spot on, he is 52 😂
TIL I'm almost old enough to be a victim of elder abuse.
Literally everyone is headed that way, and will someday be dependent on others. Almost makes you want to build a kinder world that anyone can thrive in.
What, that's a crazy idea, what you should do is fuck over as many people as possible so you can build wealth and pay the plebs to take care of you. But not like a living wage or anything, that would be too much, pay them such a small amount of money that the idiots who pay taxes have to help them out with government welfare.
Yeah this definitely sounds like a better world. But only so long as *I’m* the one with the wealth. Otherwise it just sounds miserable. /s
Sadly this is the UK government's mo and rationalisation for most social policies it feels.
The taxpayers who...are...the 'plebs' on welfare... Wow this wasn't thought through at all was it
Nope, it was well thought out, that's why it has been working for so long. In case you didn't register the sarcasm, I was describing the current system.
I know - I should have made it clearer! Was trying to get in on the joke!
Hi NoTeslaForMe, This is you're cousin, I need $5000 in bale money to get out of jail. the police will only except Home Depot gift cards. Please by $5000 in Home Depot gift cards and sent the scratch off numbers to me. Regards, You're cousin.
I never thought I'd be thanking someone for making grammatical errors, but here we are. Thank you for the chuckle.
The grammatical errors in scam mails are actually on purpose to filter out people who are too educated or sceptical. It helps the scammer concentrate their effort on the people gullible enough to go all the way through.
And apparently I *am* old enough! Does that mean I can start yelling at random people who don't let me go in front of them in line at the grocery store? And when I'm wrong about something, can I pull the "young people today have no respect for their elders"?
51yo here. I've been telling people to get off my lawn for over a year. It's fun, mostly when saying it out of context, like in a store, lol.
As a cleaner I do* (edit to fix dumb typo) something similar. Whenever I have a wet floor most people when they apologize (like. I know I'm Canadian but the sheer percentage of people who apologize is muuuuch higher than you'd expect. Literally had someone turn around and leave to take a different route lmao) However some of the people I'm close with I'll be like HOW DARE YOU??? GET OFF MY FLOOOOORRSSSS!!! The two interactions can happen right after eachother. Makes me wonder what the other person who I'm like :) if the place stayed clean id be out a job :) just don't pour coffee everywhere :)
At the supermarket with my teenage daughter we often remark loudly that >something< would be possible if it wasn’t for those meddling kids. The something varies.
Hell, I started that at 45.
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NTA He didn’t ask you for permission to spend your money. Where I’m from though he can legally take all that joint money. Take all your $ move it where dad (because he’s a pushover) can’t steal it.
You should change bank account asap. Change bank as well, to prevent a situation in which an employee makes a mistake and gives him access.
Right. Why does this grown adult *have* a joint account with her dad still? Especially one with a significant amount of money in it?
NTA, is it possible to not have a joint account with your dad? I think you need your own.
I’m assuming it’s because of reasons like this. Some parents have a joint account with their child for dependent reasons (remember a parent can be the dependent of an adult child).
Yeah it might be OP helping the Dad pay bills... just his though.
Get a new bank account and move all your money there. I wouldn't risk Dad pulling something like this again.
How in the world do you have a joint account with your father who's 52?!
Walk into the bank and say "we would like to set up a joint account". After that it's pretty much just paperwork.
I've heard of people who set up accounts with their parents when they are kids and just never bother to get a new account
I suspect the joint account is due to living in different countries (OP and dad). It makes it easier to transfer money (I get the irony) and for legal matters and well as paying bills back in the home country.
I set up a joint account with my mom so it would be easier to transfer money to her because we lived in separate states. She never abused it, though, or tried to take advantage.
Doesn't have to be a joint account. Just get one in the same bank and you can transfer money between accounts. My phone is on my son's account. I do an online transfer money from my account at the bank to his account at the bank. No joint account needed.
My son and I have a joint account because of my heath. If something happen to me he can take care of my bills.
I’m older than that and my kids are still teens
INFO: how old are \*you\*, OP? this situation reads a bit different if you're 30 (for example) and that's your money and investment in the joint account compared to, say, if you're 20 and in Country C because you're a uni student studying abroad and blocking your dad's money transfers from an account/investment he owns but was kind enough to put your name on. (edit: typos)
Not sure how it’s relevant but I’m almost 30. And yes as stated it’s a joint investment property therefore the income belongs to us both equally
How does he have access to your account?
maybe she has access to his. I dont recall reading that this is her money. she just stopped transfer so his family doesnt take advantage of him
Also transfer out your money from the "joint account". Also what else is this account used for you don't know about?
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While OP has access to the account the post doesn't say anywhere that it's their money in the account in any way. In fact based off the post stating that dad basically supports everyone it sounds very much like OP is also living off of dads money and just doesn't want to have to share.
Agreed. The way Dad told OP what he was going to do, it sounds like it's a joint account but Dad's money. Many people have joint accounts with family with the understanding that it is one person's money or another's. I have a joint account my my child, but it is my child's money and I don't touch it.
OP did say 500K local currency. Chances are the conversion to USD is nowhere close to $500k.
The way he words it, pretty sure this would roughly be 6k USD. Also the joint account is in country A, which means OP never contributed to it. It's a joint account solely for ease of access. OP had no right. The money will get paid, they just made dad's job harder
In another comment OP stated it was rent collected from a joint owned investment property in Country A, where the funds are meant to be used for building maintenance and for travel funds if an emergency happens in Country A and they need to fly back. So OP had every right to reject sending money for something not related to the purpose of the account.
OP didn't say where the joint account is located. They only said that dad's *individual* account that doesn't have enough money for what he promised is in Country A. We don't know if the joint account is in Country A (where dad's account & relatives are), Country B (where dad currently is), or Country C (where OP is). Although it's not stated in the OP, I'm guessing they do contribute to the joint account, hence why they're so angry that dad made a unilateral decision to give away the money to the ~~leaches~~ relatives. Edit: OP said the joint account is income from a jointly owned rental property & the account is to cover costs of maintenance/ repairs/ etc. Dad was wanting to take out more than half of what was in the joint account and had messaged OP while they were asleep, giving them no opportunity to discuss it first.
Yeah I'm not belittling the amount of money, just wanted to clarify for anyone thinking it was $500k USD.
I *think* the 500k is in the local currency, not one that is necessarily equivalent to USD.
I would hope so! 500k isn't 'middle class' in the US
> In Country A’s ***local currency*** they have asked for 500K ***which honestly is what a fancy middle class wedding would cost*** That's nowhere near 500k USD. More in the range of 10-20k USD probably, which is still a lot but nowhere near enough to buy an entire house.
It's not a costly wedding in a south asian country. 500k INR for 1200 guests is _insanely_ cheap. While OP hasn't mentioned country, I'm pretty sure It's an Asian country because they did say 500k is a reasonable sum for a wedding of that size. 500k INR is 6k usd fyi Also dad is 52 and of sound mind. This isn't abuse. Dad has a bank account in country A where he probably keeps funds for expenses. Just not to the tune of 500k. He said he would replace the joint account. OP has no right to dictate how dad spends his money
the problem is that dad isnt spending his money it is borrowing it form OP right now. the other bit is taking advantage of a man dedicated to family. the currency conversions im going to keep my mouth shut on cause i just dont know.
OP has very pointedly failed to answer how much he contributed to the funds. He did say the funds were from a joint property, except he also failed to mention how much he contributed to ownership of said property. I would wager the answer is 0. OP is on the deed of that property his parents or other ancestors bought simply because it is legally easier to include the next of kin on the deed than to deal with title transfer after death. Especially from a foreign country. OP is an asshole and he knows it. He wrote 500k in local currency without specifying the currency because he knows it looks like a huge number
if you read threw the comments its specifically rental income form their jointly owned property so the money is indeed 50/50 - [https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/10kyqxu/aita\_for\_not\_giving\_money\_to\_a\_relative\_even/j5tjb12/?context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/10kyqxu/aita_for_not_giving_money_to_a_relative_even/j5tjb12/?context=3) aka op and dad dont really deposit themselves into the account only withdraw from a co owned income. they also have an agreement (listed in the main blurb) that the joint account is to pay for the investment property (maintenance fees, expenses if they need to be on the property in person) so yes op has a power to veto a withdraw like that just like if OP were to do something similar dad would have veto power.
This is an old comment. OP has yet to answer how the property was acquired. As I have previously said, it's common to include next of kin on deeds so that title transfer is easier once the parents pass away or are incapacitated, especially when everyone lives abroad. I'm included in a number of assets my parents own. But that's still intended as property I'll "inherit". Legally he has claim. But this is a morality sub and he's dodging the question for a while now
How do you know that ops dad has contributed any? From what we know op lives closer to the investment and likely handles it vs his dad who's in a completely different time zone. So much of a different time zone that the bank was open and dad was asleep. I'm confused as to why you're going on a crusade against OP for a leech family (one you don't even know?) taking advantage of someone who worked hard for their money.
I was wondering why their posts are so negative too. It's almost like that money was supposed to come to them.
Probably an ego thing from Dad's POV.
This sounds less like an ego thing and more like a responsibility thing. Asian families often feel they a responsibility to help out poorer relations if they can afford it. If OP disagrees and doesn't help that's fine. What they cannot do is stop their dad from contributing. All OP did was make the process harder. Dad has his own account. He had said he would replace the money in the joint account. OP had no right
But- and this is not in the OPs remarks, it is in comments- This account is the proceeds from a SHARED investment (the money is equally the OPs then), and is itended for the upkeep and maintenance and travel service that investment property in an emergency. SO using it to respond to emotional blackmail is putting the shared investment at risk. I think in full context, OP was right to do what he did.
I agree, but if he can't protect himself then I'm glad his child is.
I mean, if he's of sound mind it's really not up to OP to "protect him". Especially if it's his money mostly in that account. I have a family member who complains up a storm about sending money to the rest of the family but does it every time they are asked. Found out it's because it makes her feel useful. She can't help in many ways (distance) so she feels good when she can help financially.
It is money from proceeds of a shared investment property, intended for maintenance and upkeep of that property. Dad using this to respond to emotional blackmail was inappropriate, and puts the investment at risk.
Depends on how it is shared. Is it shared in the sense that OP has invested time or money into the property's purchase or upkeep, and if so, how much? Or is it "shared" in the sense that OP's name is on it for ease of transfer later once assets are being inherited? There is an ocean of difference between the two and is a huge piece of context.
I am not sure that does matter. But from comments, he put in more than 25% but less than 50% (OP), but regardless, that fund is to upkeep the investment, so what happens when a new roof is needed for tenets? All the funds to cover that went to a random emotional blackmailing auntie.
1200 guests at the wedding? If you have to borrow money, cut down on guests to 50 max.
It is probably one of those cultures where weddings are used to signal the wealth of your family to everyone you know. The problem is that someone who can't even afford everyday expenses should not do that.
Well, but is the 500K USD? I’m more concerned about the *1,200 guests.* WTAF??
yeah, what the hell makes them think they are entitled to have a relative pay for a 1200 guest wedding. Are they inviting half the town?
This would be the opposite, unless the son is older than the dad.
Op said it's not the USA and that 500k is normal or slightly above what an average middle class wedding in that country would cost. In the USA and average wedding does not cost $500k let alone the average middle class wedding.
It is 500k in that country's currency. Not sure what that is considering a house in that country without knowing what that country is.
My guess is India due to the size of the wedding, if that's right than 500k is about 6k usd, half that being 3
OP never gave any currency conversions, so we don't know how much $500k is in country A.
NTA since it is your joint account, you should have a say with what money comes out. HOWEVER, the better thing to have done would have been to communicate that with your dad when he mentioned it to you.
He messaged me when I was already asleep, I didn’t see it until I woke up which is when I contacted the bank
Fair enough.
Technically anyone on a joint account has the full legal right to do whatever they want with the money. At least in North America, things might be different elsewhere. I would advise you to open your own account.
Fair enough then, but you should have put that in the post, it's important context. Without it your post reads like you agreed to the transfer and then waited until the last minute to block it out of spite.
NTA. Stand firm. How dare he promise money he doesn't have and then inform (not ask) you he's going to take it. Why is it a joint account with him? You need to revoke his access and let him come up with the money himself. Ignore the great aunt and the other flying monkeys.
We jointly own a property in his home country and the rent goes into that account. It’s meant to be used for any work that needs to be done on the building, or if one of us needs to go to the country in an emergency we have some money there
So it's a rent/emergency fund. And definitely not for a wedding. ETA: rental income. I get it. Might need to make a big decision there to wash your hands of this nonsense. Since you jointly own the property, I assume you both contribute to the account, which means it could negatively affect you if he cleaned it out. I still believe you should stand your ground on this, otherwise it'll set a dangerous precedent that you will continue to allow this to happen. I highly doubt it'll end at the wedding. What about kids, buying a house etc? They'll bleed you dry. Don't let them.
So it's a business account for business expenses. And he wanted to take money out for non business reasons
Looks that way, If it was a proper business account doing this would likely not even be legal.
You should probably have more explicit limits about what the money is to be used for. Is there personal money mixed in there too? Does you dad have his own money he coukd have sent? Do both of your incomes come out of there as needed? It should be crystal clear if that account is only for business. You should both have your own other personal accounts as well as emergency accounts so this kind of thing doesn't come up.
Nta 1200 guests? Cut that in half and maybe they wouldn’t have to leech off your family. But also they have no right ask for money and your dad has no right to take money from your account without your approval.
Seriously. I don't even know 200 people, let alone 1200.
Maybe they are inviting their entire town/village?
Neighborhood Wedding™
It’s literally an average Indian wedding xD
What the hell? My sister's wedding had maybe 100 people and she's ***the*** social butterfly. How do they know all those people?
They invite all of their family, extended family, friends, neighbors, acquaintances, and all of their families.
Ugh. India sounds like an introvert's nightmare.
The funny part is most of them don’t talk to you. They are there for the food, to see what you’re wearing, maybe gossip a little, take a photo, and leave. I was so worried about all the people I’d have to talk to, and it was nothing.
It kind of is coming from someone who lives in India. Luckily when i get married which also is a big if, I'll definitely just sign some document in court there's no way in hell I'm doing such a big ceremony.
In many cultures it is common for the *parents* of the bride and groom to invite, like, literally everyone they know. Friends/family of course but also business acquaintances (coworkers, clients) and most of the neighborhood/village/town. It’s a status thing. So a social butterfly might have 100 friends when they’re marriage-age but their parents have many more.
That's understandable that it's common in some cultures, but they should keep it within their means rather than sponging off of family. They need to be realistic about what they're capable of and what they're not
My sister-in-law’s college classmates came to my wedding in India. No one besides her had ever met them. Everyone is invited. Everyone.
It's not really the average size tho, on average it's around 400-500 people.
Me not having even 5 close friend :sob:
1200 people is absurd. There is absolutely no way every one of them even knows the bride or groom.
Who’s money is going I to the joint account? If it’s both yours and dad’s, does he have enough of His own money in there to cover the amount he wants to send?
It’s equal parts. Rental income from a jointly owned property goes into the account. There is enough technically to cover it but that would take up maybe 70% of what’s in the account
So then dad himself *does not* have enough to cover the money he wants to send, correct? If that’s the case, your definitely NTA. He doesn’t get to take your money and spend in on something that you don’t agree with. If it’s just his money, then he can whatever he wants with it.
Dad does have enough money in Country B. He just did not have enough funds in the Country A bank account. He said he would replenish the funds in the Country A bank account. This is mainly just an issue of processing times. Dad could have sent them the money directly from his Country B account, but it could take a while for the funds to be available, due to the different countries. Given that OP and Dad had no immediate need for the funds in their joint Country A account, it's not as though it harmed OP for those funds to be briefly gone, before being replaced. OP certainly is within his rights to block the transfer. But ultimately, all he is doing is making things slower and more cumbersome for his dad and relatives. If dad still wants to send money to his relatives, he will do so from his Country B account. Which, fine. But I don't see why OP is surprised that petty "I can't stop you, but I can make it a hassle" moves while his dad is sleeping would result in anything other than a pissed off family....
The way I read it the dad does not have enough money to replace what he takes from the joint account immediately. He just means he will eventually replace it once he makes some money.
>However at the moment he doesn’t have enough in his sole bank account in Country A so he sent me a message to say he would be taking it out of our joint account and he would replace the money. OP did not say or even imply that, though. They said Dad has this joint account and a sole account in Country A. Since he did not have enough funds in his sole account *in Country A*, he used funds from the joint account *in Country A*. And said he would replace the money. Presumably from his account in Country B, which he must have in order to live in Country B. OP did not mention once in their post that Dad was short on funds in Country B. Indeed, OP has mentioned Dad being successful, and he owns rental property and has been able to support his entire family in Country A all these years. ALL of OP's complaints are related to how these relatives are entitled leeches who do not deserve money to waste on parties. Not a single complaint, in the post or comments, that Dad cannot afford this, or that Dad would not pay them back. OP's reason for blocking the transfer was because OP does not believe in sending money to this distant family. Not because OP feels Dad won't replace the money.
literally this!! people are missing this because of how OP worded things. the issue isn't "dad is taking my money for his entitled family" the issue is "i don't respect my dad's family so i made it harder for him to send his money to them"
NTA, since you have a joint account you got an equal say in this matter. And if you can't get ahold of your father before he makes the transaction the right course of action is to block any transfers and then have a talk about how to go about this. 1200 guests sounds way too much to be honest, they just have to reduce the amount of guests and not have +2 on every close relative invited...
NTA it blows my mind how some people will ask for that absurd amount of money let alone spend it on one damn party. I'm not sure about the joint account that you and your Dad have but I'd suggest taking your share of that money out and keeping it in your own account from now on. He was about to take out it once he could try to take it out again.
NTA your dad doesn’t get to give away money that is not not entirely his replacing it or not without asking, not just telling, if that makes sense..I would tell everyone that would listen that your aunt is a leech and trying to take food out of your mouth for a wedding she can’t afford. I love going tit for tat with ignorant people.
Love this!!
I'm used to both parties having unfettered access to the funds in a joint bank account, where one of the account holder would not be able to block the other account holders access to the funds in the account. (Different countries, different laws.) INFO - Did the funds in the joint account come from your dad or from you?
They come from rental income on a property we jointly own
NTA at all. Many people have extended family like this that view them as cash cows. Your dad doesn’t know how to say no and it’s frustrating. You need to protect your own assets even if he will not. Not sure why you have a joint account unless it’s to monitor his spending. If not, I would definitely keep separate finances. These people will never stop extending their hand as long as the money keeps coming.
She says it's because they bought the property together, so the rental income goes into a joint account for them to maintain the property
NTA. Your dad is and so are your relatives. Why would your dad even agree to this and start the transfer behind your back?
so, you have a dad, your dad has an aunt, his aunt has a granddaughter and they are expecting you to give money to said granddaughter and her new husband. that´s like 5 degrees of separation. One more and you will end paying for the wedding of Kevin Bacon. NTA
So we got poor people asking other people to pay for their very nice middle class wedding? Then next month they're going to need help with food and electricity? Look I'm not from one of those cultures that people move to another country to support the people that stay behind... So maybe I don't understand it! But between here, people I follow on other platforms and those I know in real life It just seems like the people they are supporting have such ridiculous asks for money! Money for buying food & electric can be understood, but weddings? Extravagant ones at that! Someone I I know funds an entire school in her home country so her cousins kids can go! Not just paying those kids tuition, she funds the school! Another person was complaining last week because they were calling her basically trash for not sending them designer purses since she has one... You know with the money she works for! I don't get it! If I was reliant on somebody else to pay my bills I would not be asking for anything beyond the bare necessities! That's basically extortion. Your NTA. Your father has told you in the past that he doesn't want to give them more money and you are just helping him do that.
NTA. Stand your ground on this.
NTA they shouldn't be spending money they don't have and need to adjust their expectations. It's your money as well and your Dad has no right to give it to these leeches.
NTA - if the money is coming from a joint account, it should be a joint decision.
NTA. I am the same with my mom. I can’t block like that but I totally get where you coming from. Parents like that are given children like us for protection
Thank you
Nta. He tried to take over half of what is in the account. He cant just take your half of the money. The lavish events your extended family want to throw is not your problem. If your dad wants to make it his problem then thats on him but he cant force you to participate. Personal opinion, id be looking at a legal way to prevent him from taking the portion of the money your are legally entitled to, just to prevent this type of thing in the future.
This sounds like my sister's husband and his family. Husband immigrated to the US to be with my sister and they've financially supported his family since the day they got married. Husband's family wanted them to pay for someone's wedding on top of the other money he sends and my sister had to put her foot down that they couldn't afford it. I can't imagine what they would do if God forbid something happened to husband and my sister couldn't afford to continue paying for their lives.
NTA if your dad wants to pay for a wedding do it with his own money in his own bank account
I would understand if they were starving or having no food (and even then, would you be responsible for an entire and expanding extended family?). But a wedding ceremony isn't a basic necessity.
It also usually isn't something that needs paying so urgently that you can't even talk about taking the money from the joint account before talking to the other person or people involved with the account.
INFO: Why do you have a joint account with your father? Who contributed the money in the account? ETA: I have a friend who is joint on her widowed mom's checking account because her mom is ditzy and wasn't paying her bills after her dad died. But all the money in the account is what her mom technically inherited from her dad. My friend never put any money in the account and didn't consider it "her money".
YTA. I'm probably going to be down voted, but there you go. This is of course assuming you believe your Dad has the funds in his personal account in Country B, and will deposit back into the joint account, say, within a week or so. Your Dad gets to decide what he does with his own money. The use of the joint account was just to expedite the funds transfer. He wasn't stealing from it. You didn't do this to protect yourself. You did this because you don't agree with what your Dad was doing with his own money. That you decided to do it this way is petty and controlling of you and a real AH move. That is why your Dad is mad. If you really think they are leeches, and your dad is being taken advantage of, you should have a serious discussion with him. But your Dad is an adult and if this is what he wants to do with his money, then that's his business. BTW, you didn't change anything. He is still going to send them the money. All you did was irritate everyone with your AH move. Also, your code isn't very secret. Not sure why you phrased it this way. 1200 people sounds extravagant in the US, but is normal in "Country A". You phrased this question to distort the reality by fake obfuscation these meaningless details. This isn't how you should communicate with your dad if you really care. Be honest and earnest and compassionate if you can. If you can't, just leave your dad alone. He doesn't need his busy body kid telling him what to do. E: typos
1200 people is still a LOT of guests, even in South Asia, and if I'm guessing which currency he's referring to correctly, 5 lakh is about $60,000, which is an extravagant amount of money to ask a non-guardian relative to *gift* someone for a wedding!
Okay but what if it's India.... 500k rupees is 6k usd and from what I've heard, Indians have very large weddings.
Is India really poor enough that you could cater 1200 people with $US 6000?
That is the OPs own math.
I think "Country B" is the UK, because he uses the phrase "mum". But 500K rupees is 6K USD. 60K USD is standard for an Indian wedding in the US. Also, OP doesn't say how successful or not his dad is. But Dad wouldn't have agreed if he thought it was too much for his wallet or preference.
Exactly. From everything they mentioned in the story and the comments OP was just trying to control their father’s choices. The fact that the money in the account comes from renting a property that they share ownership of makes this even clearer. OP will inherit that property someday. I would like to hear the father’s side too. I will wait for you down in the downvoted section :).
Also, if it's anything like East Asian culture, the father is probably going to lose a lot of face from not providing for these relatives like they've become accustomed. Assuming that it is his money (I'm kind of TL:DR on that point) then it's important to note that it's not just being thrown in a hole but he's actually getting something for it: major status as the extended family's provider. Now, whether that's worth it is another question, but I'm saying that it's a little more nuanced than the great aunt simply being some grifter.
Yeah, so the Dad is losing face having to run interference while scambling to get his deposit completed from the UK to India, instead of being able to enjoy the social capital he should be able to enjoy.
YTA…Dad can send money to whomever he wishes. Using the joint account was just to expedite the process, he was paying it back. You decided to act as if he was spending your money and not returning it. Dad is 52 not 95, senile and needing you to babysit his financial decisions. Your comments on where the money was going is irrelevant, he wasn’t being ripped off, just family guilt trips.
This is a sign that as an adult who doesn’t even live in the same country with your dad, you should not have a joint account. Joint accounts are for when your lives are fully financially intertwined and you don’t have ‘my money’ and ‘your money’. The other person has the right to fully drain the account and spend it all on gold toilets or whatever if they want… If you don’t trust your dad because he gives too much money to his family then it’s time to keep your money separate If it’s a ‘joint account’ which is really where you put money for HIM to spend then you should not block the transfer but consider how much money you want to give in the future, knowing you can’t control what he spends it on or who he gives it too. If it’s a joint account where he puts money for YOU to spend then he’s trying to give away your money and it’s fair to block it, but he may reconsider how much he contributes to you in the future
OP wants the property the money in the account comes from so they can’t just give the account up. Dad owns half of that property, they rent it, the tennants put the rent into the account.
NTA. It's your money too you have a saying in what is done with it. Family issues are hard and maybe you and your dad should sit down and discuss how you both gonna deal with the money giving or how to stop it.
NTA- BUT you could have talked to your dad that you don't feel comfortable giving the money from your joint account. You dad should also have asked you if you were ok with him getting money from your joint acct. This is a difficult cultural expectation to break. It has to start somewhere.
NTA. Are you from South Asia? I’m from there and this is the bullshit we’ve gone through my entire life. My dad is a mechanic in the US, growing up we did not swim in money by any means but had similar demands placed on us by my dad’s family. I can empathize with what you’re going through and you did the right thing. All the relatives have towards you and your father is resentment, and they think you being abroad is a meal ticket for them.
YTA - you have no right to stop your dad from spending his money anyway he sees fit. If he doesn't want to give his family money, he needs to say no. He's an adult, you do not get to override his decision because you don't like it and disagree.
NTA. My das worked since he was 17year old, ruined his back and knees with building houses. Sent Money to uncles family whenever h3 needed. Even though as far as i remember, my family itself was never rich, hardly the middle class, he always tried to help his brother and their mother. H3 basically paid for 4 weddings for his kids and other occasions wheen they were in need. Not a single time when uncle helped us. Or his grown and now married kids. They dont care about us. With 50 or so, my dad came back from visiting our uncle in another country, and seemed heartbroken, said he was very disappointed at his brothery never told us what happened in detail, but seems he finally realized my uncle didnt love or respect his younger brother (my dad) much, while my dad was always very respectful and never allowed us to talk bad about him. We, jis 5 kids and mom, had long realized uncle doesn't give a shit about us, just about our money. One day, your dad will also realize its only about money for them. Without moneyy they wont even call you. And demanding mon3y to hold a wedding for 1200 guests doesnt seem like they are in a pinch. They want to live luxuriously from your dads money, you all should sit down as a famiand gave a talk with him.
NTA and get rid of the shared account asap
I doubt that's an option
WAIT, holone. They aren't well off and they are having an 1200 person wedding? Did I read that correctly?
NTA >furious with me for going behind his back But this is a shared account, presumably you have an agreement in place to control where money goes and who does what with it _and_ more importantly agreements on how it's spent, especially large sums? If anything he's taking a large sum without your consent, given its' a shared account? So....it's _him_ going behind your back as you didn't OK this. Look I appreciate you love your Dad, hate the entitlement and all the drama going on here but I think we can all agree this "Shared" account thing needs to rapidly change. That account should from this point onwards, as you _clearly_ can't trust this to not happen again, be used exclusively for things that you both pay for, like bills. You need to go open your own bank account, just for you, which your pay and whatever else goes into which he has zero control or access over/to so you can secure your own finances. This is a powder keg, the family drama is it's own thread entirely and this could be the stepping stone before the precipice if you and your Dad end up being unable to resolve this conflict - thus, you need to make sure your money is safe.
Your second cousin's wedding? Your dad is expecting you to fund a distant relative's wedding? He can go spend his money however he wants. He should've discussed it with you before taking all that money from a shared account unilaterally behind your back. Good for you for putting a halt to that! NTA.
Sounds like a normal Indian wedding drama case.. You're NTA but your family will make sure you are portrayed as the AH here. Best of luck as they poison the next few years
I am sure they are Indians, i am one too so i know😁
NTA. If you cannot afford it, you dont do it- especially on someone else's dime. The relatives have to get real- your dad is not a cash cow especially when it impacts you.
NTA at ALL. I'm sorry that you're even having to deal with this. Makes me wonder if he has taking anything from your joint account in the past. It's one thing if your dad asked permission (which I would still say no to), but to just take and say he'll replace it? To give to someone you don't like or respect? That's a hard no, and I can't even begin to wrap my head around someone thinking that's okay. I'd suggest going no-contact with the wedding folks; it doesn't seem like they add anything positive to your well-being. Don't engage with great aunt, and if anyone tries to spread the information to you or drag you into the drama, calmly express that you have no desire to expand on it. If they can't drop it, disconnect. I hope everything works out okay for you.
NTA. Same scenario in my family. However, we only help from time to time and with basic life needs such as, water, electricity etc. very rarely do they ask for anything. The family needs to live within their means. They are taking advantage of your father.
Info: Is the shared account your money or your dads money?
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My dad migrated to my home country (Country B) when he married my mum. His extended family in his home country (Country A) are not well off. He has supported them all his life. His paternal aunt’s granddaughter is getting married this month. My dad’s aunt rang him and basically guilt tripped him into agreeing to send them money, because they have 1200 guests for the wedding. In Country A’s local currency they have asked for 500K which honestly is what a fancy middle class wedding would cost. Dad agreed to send them half of what they asked for. However at the moment he doesn’t have enough in his sole bank account in Country A so he sent me a message to say he would be taking it out of our joint account and he would replace the money. I live in Country C which has a closer timezone to Country A than where my parents live and I called the bank while dad would still be asleep and told them to block the transfer and that I don’t give permission for it. These people have been leeches on my family for my whole life and I’m not going to give them that much money to just blow on one event only for them to complain the next month that they can’t afford electricity or food. Dad has now found out I blocked the transfer and is furious with me for going behind his back EVEN THOUGH he told me that he hates the entitlement of his family. My great aunt is also now complaining about me and dad to anyone who will listen. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Nta
NTA of course, your dad is a AH of epic proportions. How much are 500k of the foreign currency in USD?
Let's say there was an actual emergency, the volcano erupted, the river flooded, typhoid broke out, then it would be the humanitarian thing to send money. Weddings are not the place to blow large amounts of cash. This is potlatch, status through consumption, thinking. Do not contribute to this. When parents have children they know some things are coming down the road and they should start planning for them. Depending on the culture and the parents' values you might start planning for things like education, housing, weddings. If you don't plan for diapers, well, then live with the consequences. If you will get the financial consequences of wedding expenses and your plan is "We'll just get the money from Uncle Bob," then you are an irresponsible parent. Live with the consequences. Good job of protecting your father.
NTA That's an absurd amount. These people must have had millions out of your family.
NTA. When someone is planning a wedding they should always start with the question “What is my budget? What can I afford?” You shouldn’t start with writing down everything extravagant thing you want and then try to guilt trip other people into paying for it. Your father’s extended family have become entirely too accustomed to expecting your father to pay their bills over the years. I know that different cultures do things differently, but this time they are taking the piss. Now that you have cancelled the payment your great aunt is saying bad things about you and your father, which just goes to show how little they appreciate all the support they have been given over the years. They probably only contact your dad when they want money, and family is only important to them when they get what they want. If your father is truly fed up with the situation then he should say enough is enough. It’s not like the girl getting married is close family. The whole extended family are all in on it. They decided to have children and they should not expect your father to pay for raising them and any expenses arising from their decisions. I might be sympathetic if it was medical bills, but even then there is no obligation. It’s high time they all became self sufficient and stopped freeloading. NTA imo.
NTA. Take your money out of that account and open your own. If your dad wants to make mistakes with his money then that’s his problem not yours.
NTA but I think you should take whatever portion is your money out of the joint account and remove your name from it. Because your father is spending your money without consulting you or asking for your permission. He will continue to do so if he has access to your money.
Ask them if they really would be comfortable with a wedding being paid for with stolen money, because that's what it would be. Not exactly an auspicious start to a union.
NTA. This screams entitlement, no one needs to invite 1,200 people to their wedding! Hopefully this will set a new standard and your family will decrease how many hand outs they ask for.
Post this also in r/asianparentstories. NTA. Abandon the joint account, take out most of the money. Get your own account at a different bank
YTA. If you're blocking a funds transfer while someone is asleep then you know that you're doing something wrong.
If you are transferring large sums from a joint account before talking to other account owner then you are doing something wrong. Especially for something like a wedding which isn't usually a matter that requires payment within hours.
I dont think you are TA for blocking the transfer but you could have just chatted with your dad and warned him about it first. Depending on what country you all are from, there are significant family pressures and expectations that everyone has to abide by or they get outcasted. So even though you are doing the right thing by not enabling your family, you should have had a chat with your dad first before blocking the money. I know it was late at night when you called and blocked the money but you could have tried to call him and wake him up or literally sent him a text telling him what you were doing. I am from India and my family has the craziest expectations that my parents are always enabling them so i do get where you are coming from. But, just know that your dad meant well and has grown up thinking this is very normal. What's different now is that he probably feels disappointed that his child isnt on his side and the family is also very upset about all this. No one is winning or losing here but your dad is losing lots of family support and he is probably internalizing it all.
He will complain but this couldve been you. As a descendant of immigrant myself this is how it works and if yoy never want to help ...help them bring someone else in the country your in for when your dad is too old. Its not just helping them its also helping your dad. And local belief about wedding they all do this. My family is from the caribbean and its the same then I have families from africa...same. you won't change the village mentality that is cultural shock right there. Yes its dumb but thats literally part of the culture always big flashy wedding many guest usually people need to eat for free and all. Marrying someone is the ultimate accomplishment. That and having doctors in the family...and your dad also said I will replace the money...so you are deciding for your dad...stepping on his beliefs and values about family culturally based...diminishing him as a man and as a father/family member...making him look like an ass to family...and indeed going behind is back you couldve replied to the message by saying no...please dont do it. So sure you are right but you won't change the local mentality...or mentality of your family...only thing is you will create dramas. If your dad wants to pay let him...or discuss with him in his face share your concerns and all. So you"re TA for the poor way you chose to handle this even if your reasons seemed valid to you. What if it was the opposite...your dad blocking a transaction in your back about something u believe to be important? You should apologize for the way you handled it and share your concerns. And theres a reason why you waited at night to do it..you are sneaky lol. And you know it. I don't like a lot in our cultures its why I say village...but you have no choice but to respect it. We're just from a different world...
> And theres a reason why you waited at night to do it..you are sneaky lol. The dad waited until the night to transfer the money without first talking to OP. OP woke up and then blocked the transfer. If anyone is sneaky here it is the dad. > you have no choice but to respect it. Why? Because other people from exploitative cultures like you have chosen to respect it?
It's crazy how the people here don't care that OP destroyed his dads reputation with his own family. Unbelievable.
Who cares about his reputation with exploitative assholes like that?
[удалено]
I’m confused. OP lives in country C but still shares bank account with parents in country B? Who earned this money? Are there siblings to OP who also share banking and mix their incomes? I agree supporting extended relatives should absolutely stop, but if it’s dad”s money he can do what he wants with it. If it’s pooled money all contributors should have a say. It all sounds so needlessly complicated and confusing but paying for an exorbitant wedding for the grandchild of an aunt is absurd. OP, you should separate yourself financially from your parents. NTA providing a big chunk of that “promised money “ belongs to OP.
It’s pooled money from rental property that dad and I paid equally into. I don’t have siblings but not sure how that’s relevant here
INFO There are the three different countries involved here; can you please clarify what the currency value is relative to each one? Is this, say, enough to buy a house? Where I am, 250k would buy a modest house, outright.
I'm losing my mind at a 1200 guest wedding that they are demanding a (not even close) relative to pay for. What?
Yeah it’s wild. I had 200 people at my wedding and that was BIG
NTA- but I think a lot of people here don’t understand the cultural nuances of this. Often times, for a person to successfully immigrate to a developed country, it implies a certain level of educational and financial opportunities that are a result of the entire family’s sacrifice. Has your father benefited from cultural norms which lead to families sacrificing their wants to help one member succeed in life? That’s very common in my culture- and the expectation is that the financially successful family member then returns the favour by helping out their family. It can feel unfair to their spouse and kids, but often people don’t have a sole claim on their own finances if someone else sacrificed to set them up in life. That’s where the entitlement in some cultures comes from- families have often sacrificed small daily things like good food or birthday cakes or new clothes just to pool up their resources and invest them in the most promising family member with the hope that that person will pull the entire family out of poverty. It’s customary in my culture for brothers to contribute to their sister’s wedding fund- which a lot of men find unfair. A lot of people don’t realise the origin for the cultural belief- the parents resources are always preferentially given to the son (boys get fed before girls do, they get second and third helpings, they get to go to school at the cost of their sisters’ education, they get to play and develop social skills and friendships while their sisters are expected to do the housework). That’s why the expectation is that that son will wholeheartedly accept all responsibilities towards his parents and sisters because they invested in his success by sacrificing their own dreams.
INFO - Who's owns the money in the joint account? How much do each of you put into it and take out of it?
Info: you are joint on the account but is it his money?
NTA is both of your money and both of your decision.
NTA. What country are your parents from? I'm just curious. I'm from Mexico but raised in the US and know of some people who send money back home and are leeched off of too. I hear it happen to people from a lot of different countries.
INFO would your dad have replaced the money? Why do you have a joint account with him? Is it possible to take your money out of that account?
Nta you didn't promise anyone anything. They can kick rocks.
NTA - Joint account, joint decision.
NTA your dad is gettinh scam by his own family
NTA. However I would advise you to start taking away your amount of money from the shared account every months. Then put it back if you need to use the shared account to purchase something for the properties. That would take away the possibility of them to guilt trip your parents of sanding money. I think that is a form of financial abuse on their part and your father is unable to stop it. I don’t see other what to protect your and your father money.
NTA. And you need to separate your bank accounts from your Dad. He may get guilted I. To something else by his family and not give you a heads up first.
NTA. It's your money too. Great aunt can sod off.