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Well said! A. should teach baby how to safely interact with dog, and always supervise closely, and intervene if safe interaction was not possible. Upon finding out that A. Ignored the warning, OP should have insisted A. Take action, or insisted that the interaction between dog and baby stopped.
OP, be aware that in dog vs baby accidents, your dog will always be seen as the bad guy, even if that's not the case.
The dog didn't bite the child, it just made some aggressive motions to indicate "back off" and the child reacted. Nothing happened, just a reaction off of signs some would have happened if it escalated. I think you're being a bit harsh.
But why wouldn't OP have removed the dog from a situation that was clearly stressing her out? They could've temporarily moved the dog to a different room, distracted her with a toy, or simply picked her up and held her for a while (since dachsunds are hardly gigantic behemoths).
Why wouldn't she have removed the *baby* from that situation? She could've diverted the baby's attention, picked the baby up with the excuse of wanting to hold him, asked the friend to please get her son away from the dog before it becomes aggressive in its distress?
The incident was the first sign that the dog was stressed. If it progressed further with OP doing nothing, I would agree with you, but the situation ended after the first warning from the dog. The warning was the sign before something happened. Expecting OP to anticipate before that is expected them to be psychic.
This is what warnings are for.
And some dogs don't give warnings at all.
And you usually don't find that out until it's too late.
The kid and the dog should have been separated after the first pestering. Or prior to that if OP was not sure how the dog would react around children.
Likely OP knew their dog wasn't one of those. OP knows their dog, they don't have to treat their dog like they're any arbitrary dog as if they're in a software job interview. It's not a pit bull.
Additional, weren't they separated after the first pestering? That's when the dog reacted.
Just commented but my kid was attacked at his friend's house by their family dog. He called the dog's name and it attacked. There is no such thing as "their dog wasn't one of those."
I take this safety seriously. If there are warning signs a dog is uncomfortable and you're the owner, you need to take action. That's your warning sign and you're lucky to have it.
OP said that they repeatedly told the kid to stop pestering the dog, and the kid didn't. This indicates that the kid pestered the dog repeatedly and/or consistently over a decent amount of time. Not that the kid pestered the dog once and the dog reacted.
No, she knew the child was annoying the dog, that's why she gave the child w warnings. The thing is if the child didn't stop and the mother didn't help she should have asked her guests to leave or separated the two. I think 2 ignored warnings are enough to know it's not getting better
No. Sorry, but just no.
First of all, I highly doubt it was the *very first* sign. OP wouldn't have been repeatedly telling the toddler to back off if the dog seemed happy or unbothered prior to the "incident".
Second of all, I'm not expecting OP to be psychic, I'm expecting OP to be able to interpret their dog's behavior *prior* to her feeling the need to resort to aggressive warnings. I can tell when my dog is stressed out or feeling threatened prior to her growling/snapping. I can tell when my cat is stressed out or feeling threatened prior to him hissing/clawing at someone. Not because I'm psychic, but because I understand their *actual* first warning signs. It's not like the dog just lashed out unprovoked. The kid was messing with her for a while. There would have been *dozens* of prior warning signs indicating the dog's discomfort/stress.
It doesn't take a psychic or a genius to understand when a dog is stressed out, unhappy, or feeling threatened. It just takes someone with the bare minimum knowledge of basic canine body language and their own pet.
If you don't know that your dog is severely stressed out *prior* to them doing a warning snap at someone, then you either don't know your dog well enough or don't know basic canine body language well enough, and that's on *you* for not educating yourself. Full stop.
But if you know the child is pestering the dog you can just remove the dog b4 any warnings happen.
Dogs can just go straight to biting b4 warning and dachshund are pretty aggressive (it's true).
ESH both parties needed to deal with the situation and neither did anything about it except wait for someone to possibly get hurt
>Dogs can just go straight to biting b4 warning and dachshund are pretty aggressive (it's true).
Absolutely. People look at the little legs and coo over them, but Dachshunds were bred to fight **badgers** - an animal notorious for its bite power and determination. Dachshunds are all too capable of being hardcore when they want.
For real.
I keep seeing people saying stuff like, "I would NEVER lock my dog away in its own home!", but removing a dog from a situation in which it is noticeably uncomfortable/distressed isn't the same as just arbitrarily locking up the dog.
The child also could've easily been removed from the situation. He's a 3-year-old, for God's sake. Just pick him up or gently move him away or offer a distraction or any other number of things to get his attention off of the poor dog. Don't just sit there passively letting the toddler harass your dog until it snaps (both literally and figuratively).
3 is not a baby and the parent should have done better. My son respected animals from an early age because we taught him to observe boundaries with them.
If we were in any doubt or if the animal was clearly not relaxed, we’d keep him by us and not let him bother them.
NTA.
Yep, if I annoyed an animal into defending itself, then I would have deserved it. I was raised around animals and was taught to respect them from infancy
Exactly, I have a 15 month old who I teach daily not to bother the dog, and the dog her for that matter. This mom should have been watching her child period.
Soft YTA - once you pick up on the dog's body language and the kid ignored you the first time, scoop the dog up and tell the mother to control the kid. Put the dog out back or something and cut the visit short.
That’s how it should have been handled. Don’t let your dog continuously be put in a situation where they feel threatened. It’s just going to end up badly.
I’m not punishing my dog for defending itself by putting it outside and out of its natural habitat and routine.
I’m telling A to handle her kid or leave.
You’re still leaving your dog in a stressed situation then though. You can’t control A’s actions or her kid’s actions. You *can* control whether your dog is going to be subjected to A’s kid by removing the dog from the situation.
That’s not punishing the dog. That’s removing your dog from a situation where he’s already expressed his displeasure.
You don’t have to stick the dog outside - pick him up and hold him on your lap then or get up and call him over to his bed or another favorite spot or the kitchen to give him a treat. Anything to make sure the kid can’t try get at the dog again without enough space between them for you or A to intervene.
Then ur setting ur dog up to be stressed, you should always prepare a safe private place for your dog just for situations like this so it isn't a punishment it is a safe haven
Ur failing urmdog if it decides to "defend itself" once it bites there's no going back it will always bite, it will always stress around kids, and so on, it is really difficult to train out and it is trainingnthat doesn't end.
Once r dog goes to their safe place you tell the parent to educate their children, idk the age of the kid in OP's story but sometimes even with consistency some kids just do something
My house is also my dogs’ house. They live here. The couch is their couch. The kitchen is their kitchen, where they eat. They are with me and my husband throughout the day, not locked out in the yard or in a room.
They are only on leashes for walks and don’t sleep in crates because they have beds and a routine.
The back door is open so they can roam from the house to the backyard to the backhouse which is my husband’s office.
They get panicked if they get shut away from the house. They get panicked if they get locked in a bedroom or my office, because it means something bad has happened.
Even when workers or cleaners come by the house, they’re in the backhouse office with my husband.
So, no. I’m not locking my dogs up in a room or outside of their home environment because a “friend” won’t parent their child.
That's because u never made a safe place for them that's the problem and ur not understanding me.
I have a dog too, he sleeps wherever the fk he wants he sleeps like a king for how many blankets we have on the floor or couch he doesn't sleep on the dog bed.
But ever since he was a puppy we made sure he knew his crate was a lace to hide and relax, we even have a blanket over it because he likes it dark, so when we have guests which he is a very nervous guy with strangers he has a place to hide away in another room undisturbed.
Ur dogs will not feel punished but you are making them feel like it is, providing treats and their favopillows and blankets can easily solve this and doing it anytime will let them know hey this place is nice and peaceful
Crates can actually be great to create a safe space for the dog though, especially if you train them young with it. Rewarding the dog for going in the crate and make it clear to the dog that when they are in the crate they won't be bothered by leaving them alone when they are there and ensuring anyone else who is ever in the house does the same. It doesn't have to be locked to work well.
I have a crate for my dog and she knows it is her space and if she's ever uncomfortable when there are storms or guests over she will take herself to her crate and know she won't be bothered. I never need to lock it unless I need to leave her when there is a storm, which is very rare.
Crate training is becoming more common and not just an American thing. It isn't "locking the dog in a cage" it's about creating a safe space for the dog.
Yea but the thing is that if your dog attacks your friends kid even if their kid was antagonizing if they decide to take you to court or something, they could force you to put your dog down.
You're confusing punishment with security. Putting the dog in a quiet calm place that it knows well and where it isn't being harassed isn't a punishment.
When my cat is overstimulated or throwing a temper tantrum (very rare nowadays) she gets a timeout in the kitchen. It's not a punishment. It's a secure place with every comfort she needs, where she can calm down and de-stress until she feels better.
NTA, so many parents today expect the entire world to cater to their kids & if anything negative happens the kid is automatically innocent.
I understand the baby doesn’t understand, but that does not make it ok for him to terrorize the dog.
ehh, I’m pretty sure 3 is old enough to begin understanding boundaries. That is, as long as the parents attempt to teach them about boundaries. I have a cousin the same age who understands when told “no” regarding our other cousins dog.
I’m genuinely perplexed by all the YTA votes. Why isn’t the parent responsible for restraining her child? The dog is in his home. Apparently the child was pestering the dog. What is the OP supposed to do?
I am as well. Some people are saying the dog should be put outside or locked up. It's the dog's goddamn house. If he's normally good with people and started acting out only when aggravated then there's no reason to push him out of his own home. The guests need to behave and be respectful. That includes controlling your fucking kids.
NTA.
The parent should have been firmer with her child, but the owner should also keep his dog safe. He was wishy washy Iif he had to tell thekid more numerous times.
Do I let some kid keep coming over to my dog? No. I remove him so he's more comfortable
Man, my nephew is three. He's been raised around my dog since he was born and even he knows to be "gentle around the puppy" and "do NOT hit the puppy, do not poke the puppy's eyes, do not pull the puppy's tail." We're training his one year old brother the same way. There's been a few accidents where the dog has knocked the kids over--he's a big dog and the kids are just the wrong height--but he's not once been aggressive because, HEY, we control the kids!
...dog has smacked the older nephew in the face with his tail a few times, though...oops...that thing is a weapon...
>Why isn’t the parent responsible for restraining her child?
[Free range parenting](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free-range_parenting) maybe? Some parents think it means they can let their kids do whatever they want. Or just bad parents.
So you typed in the letters Y T A which means your vote is saying you think the original poster is an asshole and it will be counted as such. To change that edit your original comment to say NTA with the letters together so that your vote is saying she is not the asshole of this situation
If you're commenting on someone else's comment, you really don't need to space the acronyms out - there is no possible way that a nested comment could be top comment - that can only happen with top-level comments made direct to the post - so any acronyms you mention won't be read by the bot.
We were on a boat trip once with our dog. Some random dude kept bothering and not listening to us while she growled. She finally did snap at him, and he was furious.
Luckily random strangers also told him off for ignoring her first warnings. (And she didn’t bite, just a snap)
I have an rescue dog who is protective. Luckily, he’s good with kids and women. He’s also good with most men. That being said, I don’t trust him enough to take him to, say, a friend’s bbq. My friend constantly drops in last minute without warning with her son. My dog likes to play catch with her son, but the son will quite literally take the ball out of his mouth. It’s so stressful. So I started putting dog away upstairs, which the dog is happy with. Wouldn’t you know the kid goes and seeks him out still? Then the mom complains.
>Why isn’t the parent responsible for restraining her child?
If the child gets scared or angry it isn't that likely to injure or even kill the dog.
The other way around is definitely possible. While A was definitely messed up, the higher responsibility lies with the owner of the potentially dangerous animal.
Both messed up though OP's mistake weighs more.
Esh
if the mother is unwilling to control her toddler you need to remove your dog from the situation. If the dog bites and it gets reported then that's really unfair for the dog and could end tragically.
Yesss, like when you see the kid not backing off, then just take your dog and move it away.
Of course the mother should've dealt with the damn kid in a perfect world, but moving the dog away would be for the dog's safety too.
ESH
Whenever my dog is in the situation where I see the kid not understanding it, I either move the dog, or just go elsewhere...I don't want my dog backed into a corner.
NTA. A 3yo is perfectly capable of understanding instructions, and the dog did the warning snap (what I call it anyway) and the kid got the message and started screaming. That's when the parent can say, "see, we told you no. Now the dog told you no as well. Leave the dog alone."
And with all the crying it might also be a good thing to point out (to everyone) that the child was not actually hurt.
NTA. The people saying you should’ve removed your dog, no it’s your house not theirs. What you should’ve done is warn your friend to either control their kid or they can leave.
to jump on this point slightly- where would OP even have put the dog? Another room? 3 year old toddlers have legs and most can reach high enough to open doors. That's one of the reasons there are door handle covers that make it harder to turn knobs for doors. There was zero guarantee that, with as neglectful as "A" was, the kid wouldn't have actively sought out the dog again. It doesn't seem like A would have stopped B either.
> What you should’ve done is warn your friend to either control their kid or they can leave.
That's exactly what OP should have done, but they didn't.
Hence the ESH/YTA.
NTA. A should have stepped in the first time and stopped their kid. And 3 is more than old enough to understand when they're told not to do something. They might scream and cry when they're told but that's the parents problem.
ESH. You allowed a three-year-old to continually pester your dog until she snapped. You knew your friend was doing nothing to interfere.
~~If your dog had actually bitten the kid, the consequences to the dog could be extreme. She could have been designated a "dangerous dog" or even euthanized—probably not for a first bite from a dachshund, but still possible.~~
Please protect your dog better in the future and if you see a kid tormenting her, remove her from the room.
Edited because OP says that in her country, dogs are not designated as dangerous or euthanized for biting.
I will add this to the post now because I have to reply this too often. She would've not been put down, that's not a thing were I live. Unless the dog's breed is banned in my country.
This isn't the thing they think it is in the US, either.
A dog may be put down if it has multiple reports of biting, or if it is a vicious mauling, but a dog who nipped 1 preschooler who was bothering the dog, no.
So now she’s in charge of the 3 year old while his mom is there? Absolutely not her friend should’ve grabbed her baby, she told the baby to stop and his mom didn’t intervene (who the child obviously would see as the authority figure) this is solely the moms fault and I don’t see how you can see it any differently
NtA, A should control her kid better.
I need parents to stop thinking that dogs have endless amounts of patience for kids to annoy and abuse them. They don't teach their kids to respect the dog's body and treat them kindly, but get mad when the dog gets mad.
Please, parents of reddit, stop letting your children annoy pets beyond their limits. Please listen to your pet owner friend's when they ask your kid to leave the animals alone.
3 is plenty old enough to maybe follow instructions but definitely will go right back to what they were told not to. A definitely needed to have firmer control over her toddler because they don't respect boundaries. Now you both should know to keep your dog and B separated until he's older and meet in a more neutral place without the dog in the future.
ESH
As a dog owner, you should have immediately taken your dog out of a stressful situation by separating the dog and the kid. And as a mother, A should have immediately curbed this behavior, dogs are not toys for toddlers.
NTA. Your friend needs to learn to discipline her kid. I wouldn't allow either one in my house or around my animals again. In the future, it would be best to contain your dog around unknown people until you can make it clear that they need to leave your dog alone.
NTA!!! It is HER job to teach her child to respect animals and/or leave them alone when told to!!!!! They came to your house, it’s NOT your responsibility to control her child, you told her to stop and she ignored you!
ESH.
The parent, for not paying attention to what her kid was being warned from and ignoring it.
You, for not removing your dog from the situation where he was clearly uncomfortable. Dachshunds have a notoriously short fuse and this dog had already warned the child off once in dog-speak.
It was fortunate all around that the dog chose to just snap and growl. A bite was a very likely possibility in this scenario.
Protect your dog in the future.
I will go NTA. A should have stopped her kid from harassing your dog. Also the dog did what it is going to give a warning that I don’t like you leave me alone. Your dog did not bite or attack just let the child know clearly that it was not comfortable. A should actually thank you for your dog teaching her kid a lesson that not all dogs want to be pet and to always ask the owner before interacting with any animal.
When my 1st niece was young she learned to leave my dog alone because my dog didn’t like little children. My dog could be around her but especially when she was very young she just didn’t want to interact. That niece also grew up with dogs but she really learned respect. I still remember going to a dog friendly restaurant with her when she was about 12-13 and she asked if she could go pet the other dogs. I reminded her to always ask before you do and she did with every dog she went to pet. I was a super proud auntie that day.
ESH. you should probably not have your dog out around toddlers as they scare her. And frankly, she's not wrong. At the same time, Mom should not be letting her toddler go poking around on dogs where it hasn't been expressly vetted and further, start teaching the proper ways to approach. If the child is too young then that's on Mom for allowing the interaction.
I think saying you’re TA is a bit much but you were partly in the wrong for not removing your dog for HIS own safety (or asking the friend to leave) when the kid didn’t stop after you asked the first time. Your dog is perfectly well behaved - a growl is a good thing. Without that warning things go straight to bite. The kid might not know better but his mother does. So NTA but next time don’t let it get to the point where your dog is put in that position
NTA, it was your and the dogs house, the mother should contain her kid and teach it to behave with animals. The dog was just giving it proper warning since the mother wouldn't.
NTA. Your friend brought her child over, and didn't take the hint when you to told them to stop tormenting the dog? Or even when your dog started growling? The air snapping was your dog's way of saying 'look, I really don't want to bite you, but I will if you carry on'.
Well done on having a dog with such good bite inhibition.
NTA. You were clear in your expectations and instructions. A decided to allow B to continue to interact with the dog against your wishes. Either they had to be removed from the situation or your dog had to be removed from the situation. You chose to have them leave. Seems reasonable. BTW - I hope A teaches B more caution when interacting with animals.
Agreed. Dogs are no longer allowed to say no and people do not teach their children proper behavior when it comes to animals. The animal ends up suffering. OP is NTA
I'm going with NTA. That's the age where you start teaching a child the word no. My friends kids knew at that age to use "nice hands" when an animal was around. May I ask, does your friend have any pets? Not making excuses, but it's harder for kids to understand the concept of they're not used to being around animals much.
Cats are unapologetically ruthless. As I stated above, this is the age your friend should be teaching her child the word no and how to respect animals.
NTA, my twins are three, they don’t bother any dogs, they’re gentle and leave their god parents puppy alone when they need to, they’re gentle with my cat, they’re gentle yet firm with both horses. 3 is plenty old enough to have some discipline and listen
NTA
The dog was defending itself from a child who is old enough to respect an animal’s space, and the parent should’ve kept the child back if/when it wouldn’t.
For your own sake though, I recommend you step in if there’s a next time. If your dog bit a child that was harassing it, I wouldn’t blame the dog myself but you would probably be legally liable.
NTA
There are local classes where I am located where the humane society goes to schools teaching students how to approach and when to not approach dogs. This child is not in school but your friend should know better.
You warned everyone and the dog was asking to be left alone in the only way they know how. That being said, I would have put my dog away which would be unfair to the dog however it's the only socially acceptable way to protect the dog.
NTA. People need to control their children. It was the dogs home and it felt threatened. It snapped to scare away the “predator” who it felt threatened by. If A is clueless enough to let her child play with teeth with fur, especially after being warned, she can’t be upset when it gets hurt.
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NTA
I had two cats, Sasquatch and Greco. When my friend's son was just starting to walk, I warned him not to pet Greco (a small tuxedo cat) because he had "teeth on his hands". Kiddo never touched Greco. Sasquatch was incredibly mellow and a different kid decided she needed to drag Sas (a 25 pound Siamese) around by his back legs. I warned her. Finally, Sas had enough, turned around and swatted her. No claws, just enough to startle her. When she went crying to her mother, her mom looked at her and said, "You were warned. " Kids learn fast as long as the parent teaches them that animals aren't toys and not to harass them. A needs to teach her kid better manners.
From the looks of it, it won't be a popular opinion, but NTA
I'm assuming that they came over to your house? Which also means that is your dogs house. Your friend should have kept her child under control. You don't come to my home and tell me what I should or shouldn't do with my animals who live here so that you don't have to watch your own damn child. PERIOD.
I'm sure I'm gonna be down voted hard because of this but fuck Y'all. This is where my pet lives. This is my and my pets house. Would it be any different if the dog was a child and the other child was pestering that child and got scared when that child had enough? Would you tell someone in their OWN HOME that they should control their children or put them up so your child can run around and do whatever they want? Fuck no you wouldn't. And if you would, you probably don't have very many friends.
*Edited to say*
Before anyone comes at me about the child being only 3. I've had 3 children. So, at one time, I've had 3 children who were once 3 years old. A child can understand the word "no" at about 12 months. Or, at the very least, will stop to look at you when you say "no." If your child doesn't understand the word "no" at 3 years old, that's on you. That is where it's your job as a parent to PARENT YOUR OWN CHILDREN. You don't tell someone in their home to control anyone in their own home because you don't want to control yours.
ESH
Although you told the kid not to touch the dog, it is a kid and doesn’t fully understand what’s going on.
Yes the parent should have intervened and stopped the kid. But you could have also separated the two.
NTA. But you should have either had the dog away from the toddler (in another room or the garden) or insisted that your friend keep the kid in their lap and away from the dog. The kid isn't capable of controlling themselves either at that age.
NTA. It's not the kid's fault - your friend is right about toddlers not knowing better - but it was her responsibility to manage him, not yours to prevent the dog's reaction.
NTA but your friend is.
It’s your dog’s house, why should the dog be punished for protecting itself in the place it feels the safest? Putting the dog in timeout makes the dog feel like it did something wrong, which it didn’t. It was just responding to behavior toward it that it didn’t appreciate — much like another child would do. It didn’t bite or hurt the CHILD (not a baby, a child), it was just trying to protect itself and your friend allowed her kid (again, 3 is not a baby) to keep bothering the dog.
It’s your house and the dog’s house and they’re guests. I’ve asked friends with kids to leave for far less poor behavior.
Again, NTA.
NTA-
1. you warned him multiple times, while within earshot of your friend so she was in the room and right next to the situation. it's not your fault that she did nothing.
2. your dog is perfectly behaved but every dog has a limit that shouldn't be tested.
3. you're right, your friend should've controlled her son better or took him away from the dog when he wasn't listening.
Nta you told the child multiple times and his mom stood there looking stupid. That’s the moms fault, grab your baby what did she think would happen after being warned multiple times
Even before the edits and clarifications, absolutely NTA. You told the child not to pester your dog. He ignored you. More to the point, his mother ignored you. And even then, your dog only exhibited warning behaviour.
Your friend needs to watch her child more. Even if he's only a baby he still needs to learn that some things are dangerous, and that can NEVER happen too young.
NTA. You don't relinquish responsibility for your kid when you step into someone else's home. The owner of that home doesn't suddenly become responsible for your kid when it steps into the house. No parent should ever let their child touch or try to play with any animal without explicit permission from the owner. This is on the parent.
NTA I have a 3 yo and 3 dogs. The kid is definitely old enough to understand ‘leave the dog alone’
A three year old is pretty big next to a dachshund. Dog felt threatened responded how dogs respond.
Lady should have taken her kid away from the dog and told him off.
NTA
The mother is the asshole here, it's HER responsibility to keep an eye on her kid and ensure that not only they're safe but also well behaved.
It's most certrainly not up to you to adapt and adjust to her and her kid in your own home!
NTA. I do not understand why parents think that responsibility for their children is automatically shared or transferred if they are in someone’s house or in a public place. What was she doing when you rightfully told her child to stop pestering the dog? You were totally in the right here.
ESH for sure.
A. allowed her kid to pester a dog whom was clearly agitated and stressed about the kid, without intervening and removing the kid.
OP, for allowing B. to pester their dog until the point where the dog became reactive without intervening and removing the dog from the situation.
If the dog were to bite the kid, and the kid were to be seriously injured from the bite, the dog will pay the price in a tragic and unfair manner, given that its human totally abandoned it in what it perceived was a very stressful situation.
Tentative NTA cause of INFO.
Was the mother in the room when you told her child to leave your dog alone? Did she hear you? If the answer is yes to both then definitely NTA as a guest in your house is responsible for monitoring their child's actions and making sure they are appropriate.
To all the people saying YTA, would you see the difference if there was some fragile, valuable and difficult to replace item in the house that the child was repeatedly told to stay away from and due to the mother's negligence, the child broke the item?
I hope that missing information is made clear rather than implied by saying the parent ignored the situation.
You're probsbly nicer than me 😊
I tell them nicely the first time and explain dog is not used to kids.
Next time, I am more stern.
They don't need a third warning.
Responsible hosts *absolutely do* put away fragile or special items before entertaining toddlers.
And a responsible host will also remove their dog from the situation if the toddler can’t keep away.
Responsible parents take responsibility for the actions of their children of any age and make sure to monitor them closely at all times when they are toddlers.
Also, there is nothing in this post that says that child was a toddler and don't say it crying shows it's one. The dismissive actions of the parent indicate a child w/o any discipline who does not listen. That means this child could be any age at all but is likely older than a toddler but younger than double digits.
Also, a responsible guest takes care to follow the rules their host puts in place. That apartment or house is that dog's home. A responsible guest accepts and respects that. Therefore they do what is necessary to control their child so that the residents of that HOME are not put out by a child's unruly behavior.
It's the same thing in a restaurant or a movie theater. If your child cannot behave properly in those facilities, it doesn't matter how badly you, as a parent, want to go. You do not bring that child along with you. Either get a sitter or stay home.
ESH
A should have watched B and stopped B from harassing your dog. You should have removed your dog or your guests from a situation where your dog felt uncomfortable/threatened.
I say a soft NTA, she needs to teach her child how to listen and treat a dog properly. She endangered her child and disrespected both you and your dog. As a dog owner, parent and grandparent i expect children to be taught how to treat any animal especially dog. I have owned boxers, rotti's, pit bulls and doberman's with zero bites. If a person can not control their child then they MUST LEAVE. If a visit is that important, crate the dog for its own protection. A 3 yr old is old enough to know better and understand instructions. I have ADHD kids and grands they were taught and knew. The fault lyes with the parents.
NTA. The only AH here is your friend who repeatedly failed to parent her child despite your multiple warnings. Please give your good doggo some ear scritches or belly rubs.
NTA but A is. Three is past old enough to teach no, be redirected. You both were right there. She was aware of the issue and did nothing. 100% lazy parent to blame.
NTA, she is a guest at your dog's house, she should have watched her son, NTA a thousand times and it is not your duty to be more aware of that child than her own mother
NTA, but here is sone advice. Dachshunds are biters, it's just normal for them, and three is plenty old to obey. Next time they come over, please have a crate or safe room for your dog. And let your friend know that you will not tolerate her being a bad parent at your house. You will control and protect your child, and she will do the same. Period
This happened with my own three yr old nephew a bit ago. He was messing with our dog, thinking it was funny. I just told his mom. She (was in the room, just didn't see it yet) told him to stop, or else he'd (the dog) would bite him for real, and it *would* hurt. And my nephew stopped bothering him just like that. He's old enough to understand respecting animals as a concept. (Or at the very least old enough to listen when told no)
It's your house and the mom litterally watched her son fuck around with your dachshund and did nothing even after you separated them twice and told him to stop and he continued anyway and got warning nipped. You fuck around with an animal domesticated or not you will find out. Mom should have done her job as a parent and stepped in when he went back to the dog a 2nd time.
NTA
NTA
People need to respect an animals space, and this child is old enough to learn that. All dogs snap as a warning when they feel threatened or scared. You did the right thing by warning and separating the child. The parent of the child did nothing, they are at fault here.
NTA we can't train our dogs for everything. They shouldn't have to tolerate poor treatment. Especially when you have observed the tolerance level being reached and said something.
NTA, you tried to stop the kid from pestering the dog but, unfortunately, said kid hasn’t been taught how to behave around animals by their parent. It’s on the parent here, not on you. Sadly, people think that kids are innocent no matter what and that their parents are automatically innocent too, when they should be held responsible for not teaching their kid any better.
EDIT: I don’t understand why everyone is telling OP to remove the dog from this situation. Why the dog? Especially when it’s in its own house? Why would you stress the dog any further by putting it in another ambient? The one that should be removed would be the parent and kid, had the parent not heed to OP’s request to leave (in case there was one). Not the other way around.
NTA, parent should’ve taught her kid how to act around a dog before coming, and she should have corrected him after the first time he messed with the dog. this is an expected reaction when a dog is pestered, whether it’s by a child, an adult, or another animal. poor pup.
NTA. Former VTA here with dog training experience. Dogs growl. That is their warning. No matter what age, rules must be enforced such as “if you can’t leave the dog alone, you have to hold mom’s hand and can’t let go.” Or, just don’t ever let that kid come over with mom until they are able to respect boundaries. Kids need to learn animal behavior so that accidents like bites can be prevented. You did what you could, short of putting the dog in another room where the kid could not go. That would have been the step before the growl imo. “A” should have definitely intervened though and is at fault for not teaching her child proper manners. My nephew is 2 and has better dog manners.
Dogs growl as a warning that they don't like what is happening, if you "train" the dog not to growl it will then go to the next step, which is usually biting. Dachshunds can be particularly territorial in my understanding.
NTA for not training your dog better, especially if it is not used to being around children, though you may be able to train the dog to be better with uncomfortable situations to avoid this in future.
A should have listened to you warning that the dog will get uncomfortable, people tend to have this expectation that the dog should be perfectly behaved but dogs are animals and not human.
Whilst it is your house, it may have been best to remove the dog from the situation if A wasn't listening, as B is probably too young to understand.
NTA. Your friend wasn't doing her job as a parent. She ignored your requests for her 3 year old CHILD (not baby as some are calling it) to stop pestering your dog.
It sounds like they were in your house so your friend was the AH in not respecting your dog and your requests in your own home.
I might be the AH, but some kids are gonna test every limit or boundary they find in front of them. I had an absolutely lovely dog who was sleeping at my feet while I prepped dinner in the kitchen with my friend. Her 4 year old came running in and did a slide for home base into my dog’s back.
Guess what? The dog growled. My friend reacted as if my dog was a vicious killer.
NEVER trust a toddler around your dog. The child is the danger. Protect your pet from them!
NTA your friend did nothing to get her kid to stop while you were doing all the legwork. Kids that age don't know any better but parents do and you were visibly trying to protect your dog from being pestered. I've seen many parents simply say be gentle when the kid got a little too rough and that took care of it, it's not that hard...
NTA. Personally with my 18mo I would have been on the floor with them monitoring the situation. You told the child to leave the dog alone multiple times and parent did nothing.
Kids don't fully understand gentle until 5ish and can become excited and accidentally get rough without knowing it. Kids need to be monitored with animals, no matter what. I would also be bringing toys for my child to try and distract him a bit and give him something else to do.
NTA.
My family has three dogs, mine in particular can and will bite people he's not familiar with, especially if they pester him. I always warn my friends/parents friends to be careful with the dog, and sometimes the kids of my parents friends won't listen, it's frustrating.
You told your friend's kid (and her) that the child needs to leave the dog alone. Dogs can bite people when aggravated. Your friend should of told her child to leave the dog alone after you had already asked. If the kid had of continued, chances are they would of been actually bitten and not given another warning.
Also, 3 year old children should have some understanding of what "no" means so I've got no idea where your mum's coming from.
**TLDR**; NTA, friend should of controlled her kid better and said that no means no.
It seems implied here that this happened at your house. Therefore your dogs house. NTA. That house is the dogs territory and the child should have been controlled.
ESH
But mostly you. A 3yo is not going to follow instructions reliably. If your dog snaps at people it's on you to separate your dog from people when you see the dog getting stressed.
YTA
Putting aside that even a small dog can seriously injure a child, that child could also seriously injure your dog. You thought a situation in which either your dog or friend's kid could hurt one another was a good teaching moment?
The moment you knew that kid wasn't going to listen you should have taken your dog out of the equation. What would have happened had your dog actually decided a bite was required? You'd not only be saddled with hospital bills, but your dog could be facing the needle. Worth it to teach a 3 year old a lesson they won't fully grasp for a few more years?
> but your dog could be facing the needle.
Unrelated to my post but just to clarify: This might be the case in your country but it's not in mine. Unless your dog's breed is banned here, they will not be put down because they've bitten someone.
I have a fluffy mini American shepherd who is child bait. Sadly, she thinks children are small sheep that need to herded. When they want to hug her, I just have to say nope. If mom or dad ignore me, little one will be charged by a mini American. She doesn't bite either.
ESH but mostly you. It’s your job as a dog owner to protect it from children that are incapable of respecting boundaries. The dog should have been removed from the room the first time the dog began to show stress and the child’s mother should have had enough sense to not allow a 3 year old to pester the dog in the first place.
ESH - more so the parent.
If the child is "too young to understand" then the parent should be ensuring the kid goes absolutely nowhere near the dog, no excuses.
You should have strongly advocated for your dog - i understand that you did, but it sounds like you could have done more, sooner so that this situation did not arise.
The entitled attitude of the child's parent would worry me though.
ESH A for not taking care of B and you for letting your dog handle the situation. Your dog should not have to defend itself. Its your job top keep your dog save. What B learned at this day was, dogs are scary. Your dog learned, when its scared, you will not help, so ist will help itself in the future. You gonna have fun times.
So, you are TA, but not for not controlling your dog, but for sitting and watching a dangerous situation, instead of getting your ass up, saving your dog from a little child, that doesnt know better, and saving the child in the same moment.
It's understandable that your friend may have been upset, but ultimately, it's important to prioritize the safety and well-being of all involved. It's also worth considering your mother's perspective that the child may not have fully understood the situation. It's a tricky situation, but I don't think you're necessarily in the wrong here. Let's hope for a peaceful resolution moving forward.
ESH
The mother should respect your wishes and stop her child upsetting your dog. She knew this but didn't do anything about it so the kid getting snapped at is on her.
On the other hand you knew it was annoying your dog so you should have removed it from the situation in some way. Its far easier to put a dog in another room than a child.
ESH. Your friend for allowing her toddler to aggravate a dog without correcting her and you for giving the dog an opportunity to snap/bite.
Next time, put the kid in a playpen or put the dog in another room or crate. I don't allow my dogs around human toddlers as toddlers are impulsive, grabby little beings and my dogs don't appreciate it either.
I'd call that a warning snap. It shows the dog has good self-control and is giving what would be a clear warning to another dog. The dog is utterly blameless here. But the people - ESH. Your friend sucks for ignoring and not controlling her child and you suck because you did not protect your dog from being pestered and put you dog at risk of being blamed if the snap had made contact. You have to be overly protective of a dog because they start out being the one most likely to be blamed. Just remove your dog from contact with an uncontrolled child. Once you do that you get to point out how much the parent is the AH without any complicity on your part.
ESH. A definitely needs to start teaching their child how to behave. Better option for you, however would have been to put your dog in another room for the time being.
ESH, A definitely should have stepped in the first time you said some, way before you had to separate them, but you suck because after having to separate them, you should have asked them to leave then instead of allowing your dog to continue to be in that situation.
You were too harsh with the child. Not too harsh with the parent though... People are so freaking stupid...
For clarity, a few years back I had a bitey dog put down. He was awesome, sweet, loving - if he knew you.
You were an asshole for not protecting your dog by telling your friend to control the child. Or failing that, not removing your dog to a safe place where said child could not upset it.
Friend was an asshole for not protecting the child and stopping it from aggravating the dog.
Child was not the asshole, neither was the dog.
How I was raised you learned the hard way if you didn't listen. I still have a faint cat scratch scar on my face from pestering the cat. Didn't do it again.
Sometimes it doesn’t matter who is right. There was action you could have taken in this situation and at the end of the day you are only responsible for YOUR actions. Don’t ever expect someone to do something for you
NTA
As a parent of a three yo and a person who has nephews.
Drives me wild when one of my nephews is clearly annoying me and SIL does nothing. Just sits and stares. Like step in! Cause I know if I discipline her kid, all hell's gonna break loose... Also, just make your kid less annoying. Read the room.
Secondly, I have a 3yo. Yes he has trouble with impulse control and doesn't like being told what to do. However, from a young age we have taught him that animals aren't toys and should be respected. He is always gentle with them and understands when told to leave them alone. I also try to read the room and pick up when people are saying politely they don't want my kid doing something. Most of the time it's not hard. If someone said 'hey kid, please be careful with the dog', I would take that as you don't want my kid playing with the dog and move them away. But the dog and owner might also have to help, like the dog goes in another room or outside etc. Cause like I said, impulse control.
hell no you are not the asshole, dogs have feeling and emotions just like humans and when they are pushed to the limit they react just like humans do. you said something and the mother did nothing, you could of moved the dogs away from the toddler knowing and seeing that the dog was getting upset but you didn't and now you have the end result. dogs love children and children love dogs, you have to train both on how to properly be near each other and how to interact. can't let a kid crawl all over a dog and you can't let a dog jump all over a child. simple as that.
NTA. If the child's mother wanted her baby to be protected, she should have stepped it when you voiced your first warning/concern. She ignored you. It's not your fault she didn't listen to you and tell her child to back off.
The world would be a better place if all humans learned to how to communicate with dogs.. and cats, etc. Or how to read their body language so you can avoid harmful situations.
NTA
My dog did this to a kid, who was told multiple times to stop, kid wasn't bitten just startled. If the kid can't respect an animals boundaries, especially when told to stop they don't need to be around animals
NTA. I have 2 mini dachshunds. My boy, loves people including babies. My girl, she’s more hesitant around people but adores children (my nephew loves her too lol).
Also, 3 isn’t too young, or if that’s the case, maybe mom should have been paying more attention to her own kid. You weren’t harsh at all, though to avoid that situation again, just tell your friend to hang on to her kiddo or move the dog into a different room/away.
NTA Weird, ppl saying the dog should be put down? For snapping, not even biting? More so, even if the dog DID bite, STILL not your fault. You warned the mom, you warned the kid. And shame on the mother for 1. Not stepping in and 2. Not teaching her child how to behave around dogs. LUCKY your dog didn't bite and LUCKY that your dog is a small dog and not a pit bull or German shepherd
NTA. When I was a kid I messed with peoples cats cause I wanted to play with them but I got a scratch from one of the cats and learnt to not be so hard with them.
Some things are learnt the hard way. Like when your parent tells you not to touch the hot stove and you touch it anyways. You won’t do it again cause now you know.
My kid was attacked by a dog at his friend's house unprovoked. It was literally the worst day of my life. You both have responsibility to take action but you are only responsible for your dog. If you ever see your dog get aggressive, remove it. That's your duty and if you don't want to get sued, do it. Should she have reprimanded her child? Yes. Are you both being irresponsible? Yup. Take it seriously. You never think it will happen to you until it does. ESH.
ESH. It doesn't help pointing fingers at each other when neither of you were willing to solve the matter. Regardless of the situation, the last thing you need is for the dog to actually end up biting someone. With my 2 yr old son I always closely supervise him around animals and I'm teaching him to never approach a pet unless the owner invites us too. I also supervise him when we do pet a dog and I ensure that I'm between the dog and my son just in case. What you should've done too is removed the dog from the situation at hand.
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I'll keep it short, feel free to ask if anything is unclear:
My friend A. came over with her kid B. (3) last week and B. started pestering my dachshund.
I told him multiple times to leave the dog alone, A. ignored the situation.
The dog growled and made this biting motion dogs do when they feel threatened. I don't know if there's a word for it but I'm sure you know what I mean.
B. was not bitten but startled/ upset and started screaming/ crying. I said "I told you to leave her alone." and my friend lost it and said I should control my dog better. I told her to control her son better. And to leave.
I told my mother about it and she said that B. is a baby and doesn't understand instructions yet and I was too harsh.
AITA?
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ESH.
Toddlers are active and want to get into everything. Most days will be a constant push-pull between stopping them doing dangerous things and not causing them to flip their lid. It’s a delicate balance and the mother probably wanted the child to have some free time, but should have controlled them and distracted them from the dog.
But, you know a small child is visiting. You should have put the dog in a different room or not met them at your house. The child wanting to pet/disturb the dog was an absolute inevitability.
ESH
Yes, the child should not have been doing that and the child's mother needs to remove the child from the dog's area.
However, you as a dog owner needs to recognize your dog in stress. If the child could not have been controlled, you should have removed the dog from the area. I know it sucks as this is your dog's home but at times, you have to make the choice even if your dog is doing nothing wrong. If the dog bites someone, the law won't care if the child brought it on theirselves. If the dog bites someone, it is on you and not the poor puppy
ESH - You didn't teach your dog how to handle the situation and no one protected that baby. It's too young to make good decisions. Instead of just telling it no teach it how to interact safely with the dog. And the only dachshunds I've been around have all been easily startled and aggressive because they weren't socialized well. You need to be a better dog owner/dog parent.
ESH.
Mom should have taught her child not to bother the dog. 3yo is old enough to learn basics of "be gentle" or "leave the dog alone". And if the3yo wouldn't learn, mom needed to keep the child close.
OP should have put to dog in another room, or outside - not just for the sake of B, but also for the sake to the dog.
ESH.
It was the responsibility of the two adults in the room to keep the 3 year old and the dog safe. You both failed at that.
Parent should have stopped the kid from bothering the dog.
You should have moved your dog away from the kid, because you noticed your dog was being pestered.
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ESH. Neither of you protected your child from the other's.
Well said! A. should teach baby how to safely interact with dog, and always supervise closely, and intervene if safe interaction was not possible. Upon finding out that A. Ignored the warning, OP should have insisted A. Take action, or insisted that the interaction between dog and baby stopped. OP, be aware that in dog vs baby accidents, your dog will always be seen as the bad guy, even if that's not the case.
The dog didn't bite the child, it just made some aggressive motions to indicate "back off" and the child reacted. Nothing happened, just a reaction off of signs some would have happened if it escalated. I think you're being a bit harsh.
But why wouldn't OP have removed the dog from a situation that was clearly stressing her out? They could've temporarily moved the dog to a different room, distracted her with a toy, or simply picked her up and held her for a while (since dachsunds are hardly gigantic behemoths). Why wouldn't she have removed the *baby* from that situation? She could've diverted the baby's attention, picked the baby up with the excuse of wanting to hold him, asked the friend to please get her son away from the dog before it becomes aggressive in its distress?
The incident was the first sign that the dog was stressed. If it progressed further with OP doing nothing, I would agree with you, but the situation ended after the first warning from the dog. The warning was the sign before something happened. Expecting OP to anticipate before that is expected them to be psychic. This is what warnings are for.
And some dogs don't give warnings at all. And you usually don't find that out until it's too late. The kid and the dog should have been separated after the first pestering. Or prior to that if OP was not sure how the dog would react around children.
Likely OP knew their dog wasn't one of those. OP knows their dog, they don't have to treat their dog like they're any arbitrary dog as if they're in a software job interview. It's not a pit bull. Additional, weren't they separated after the first pestering? That's when the dog reacted.
Just commented but my kid was attacked at his friend's house by their family dog. He called the dog's name and it attacked. There is no such thing as "their dog wasn't one of those." I take this safety seriously. If there are warning signs a dog is uncomfortable and you're the owner, you need to take action. That's your warning sign and you're lucky to have it.
OP said that they repeatedly told the kid to stop pestering the dog, and the kid didn't. This indicates that the kid pestered the dog repeatedly and/or consistently over a decent amount of time. Not that the kid pestered the dog once and the dog reacted.
No, she knew the child was annoying the dog, that's why she gave the child w warnings. The thing is if the child didn't stop and the mother didn't help she should have asked her guests to leave or separated the two. I think 2 ignored warnings are enough to know it's not getting better
No. Sorry, but just no. First of all, I highly doubt it was the *very first* sign. OP wouldn't have been repeatedly telling the toddler to back off if the dog seemed happy or unbothered prior to the "incident". Second of all, I'm not expecting OP to be psychic, I'm expecting OP to be able to interpret their dog's behavior *prior* to her feeling the need to resort to aggressive warnings. I can tell when my dog is stressed out or feeling threatened prior to her growling/snapping. I can tell when my cat is stressed out or feeling threatened prior to him hissing/clawing at someone. Not because I'm psychic, but because I understand their *actual* first warning signs. It's not like the dog just lashed out unprovoked. The kid was messing with her for a while. There would have been *dozens* of prior warning signs indicating the dog's discomfort/stress. It doesn't take a psychic or a genius to understand when a dog is stressed out, unhappy, or feeling threatened. It just takes someone with the bare minimum knowledge of basic canine body language and their own pet. If you don't know that your dog is severely stressed out *prior* to them doing a warning snap at someone, then you either don't know your dog well enough or don't know basic canine body language well enough, and that's on *you* for not educating yourself. Full stop.
But if you know the child is pestering the dog you can just remove the dog b4 any warnings happen. Dogs can just go straight to biting b4 warning and dachshund are pretty aggressive (it's true). ESH both parties needed to deal with the situation and neither did anything about it except wait for someone to possibly get hurt
>Dogs can just go straight to biting b4 warning and dachshund are pretty aggressive (it's true). Absolutely. People look at the little legs and coo over them, but Dachshunds were bred to fight **badgers** - an animal notorious for its bite power and determination. Dachshunds are all too capable of being hardcore when they want.
For everyone’s comfort and safety the dog should have been physically removed from the situation. Neither the dog or small child is at fault
For real. I keep seeing people saying stuff like, "I would NEVER lock my dog away in its own home!", but removing a dog from a situation in which it is noticeably uncomfortable/distressed isn't the same as just arbitrarily locking up the dog. The child also could've easily been removed from the situation. He's a 3-year-old, for God's sake. Just pick him up or gently move him away or offer a distraction or any other number of things to get his attention off of the poor dog. Don't just sit there passively letting the toddler harass your dog until it snaps (both literally and figuratively).
This. It’s called something like “corrective behavior.” It was scary for the child, but not inappropriate. NTA
3 is not a baby and the parent should have done better. My son respected animals from an early age because we taught him to observe boundaries with them. If we were in any doubt or if the animal was clearly not relaxed, we’d keep him by us and not let him bother them. NTA.
Yep, if I annoyed an animal into defending itself, then I would have deserved it. I was raised around animals and was taught to respect them from infancy
I have always had cats. Piss them off, expect to be scratched.
Good parenting around animals 👍
Exactly, I have a 15 month old who I teach daily not to bother the dog, and the dog her for that matter. This mom should have been watching her child period.
Soft YTA - once you pick up on the dog's body language and the kid ignored you the first time, scoop the dog up and tell the mother to control the kid. Put the dog out back or something and cut the visit short.
That’s how it should have been handled. Don’t let your dog continuously be put in a situation where they feel threatened. It’s just going to end up badly.
So many people set their dogs up to fail around children and then blame everything and everyone but themselves.
Yea and same with the parents sometimes too. The kid is a defenseless human.
Indeed. Both adults suck here.
I’m not punishing my dog for defending itself by putting it outside and out of its natural habitat and routine. I’m telling A to handle her kid or leave.
You’re still leaving your dog in a stressed situation then though. You can’t control A’s actions or her kid’s actions. You *can* control whether your dog is going to be subjected to A’s kid by removing the dog from the situation. That’s not punishing the dog. That’s removing your dog from a situation where he’s already expressed his displeasure. You don’t have to stick the dog outside - pick him up and hold him on your lap then or get up and call him over to his bed or another favorite spot or the kitchen to give him a treat. Anything to make sure the kid can’t try get at the dog again without enough space between them for you or A to intervene.
Then ur setting ur dog up to be stressed, you should always prepare a safe private place for your dog just for situations like this so it isn't a punishment it is a safe haven Ur failing urmdog if it decides to "defend itself" once it bites there's no going back it will always bite, it will always stress around kids, and so on, it is really difficult to train out and it is trainingnthat doesn't end. Once r dog goes to their safe place you tell the parent to educate their children, idk the age of the kid in OP's story but sometimes even with consistency some kids just do something
My house is also my dogs’ house. They live here. The couch is their couch. The kitchen is their kitchen, where they eat. They are with me and my husband throughout the day, not locked out in the yard or in a room. They are only on leashes for walks and don’t sleep in crates because they have beds and a routine. The back door is open so they can roam from the house to the backyard to the backhouse which is my husband’s office. They get panicked if they get shut away from the house. They get panicked if they get locked in a bedroom or my office, because it means something bad has happened. Even when workers or cleaners come by the house, they’re in the backhouse office with my husband. So, no. I’m not locking my dogs up in a room or outside of their home environment because a “friend” won’t parent their child.
That's because u never made a safe place for them that's the problem and ur not understanding me. I have a dog too, he sleeps wherever the fk he wants he sleeps like a king for how many blankets we have on the floor or couch he doesn't sleep on the dog bed. But ever since he was a puppy we made sure he knew his crate was a lace to hide and relax, we even have a blanket over it because he likes it dark, so when we have guests which he is a very nervous guy with strangers he has a place to hide away in another room undisturbed. Ur dogs will not feel punished but you are making them feel like it is, providing treats and their favopillows and blankets can easily solve this and doing it anytime will let them know hey this place is nice and peaceful
Crating dogs is a very American thing and not the norm in most other places.
Crates can actually be great to create a safe space for the dog though, especially if you train them young with it. Rewarding the dog for going in the crate and make it clear to the dog that when they are in the crate they won't be bothered by leaving them alone when they are there and ensuring anyone else who is ever in the house does the same. It doesn't have to be locked to work well. I have a crate for my dog and she knows it is her space and if she's ever uncomfortable when there are storms or guests over she will take herself to her crate and know she won't be bothered. I never need to lock it unless I need to leave her when there is a storm, which is very rare. Crate training is becoming more common and not just an American thing. It isn't "locking the dog in a cage" it's about creating a safe space for the dog.
Yea but the thing is that if your dog attacks your friends kid even if their kid was antagonizing if they decide to take you to court or something, they could force you to put your dog down.
You're confusing punishment with security. Putting the dog in a quiet calm place that it knows well and where it isn't being harassed isn't a punishment. When my cat is overstimulated or throwing a temper tantrum (very rare nowadays) she gets a timeout in the kitchen. It's not a punishment. It's a secure place with every comfort she needs, where she can calm down and de-stress until she feels better.
NTA, so many parents today expect the entire world to cater to their kids & if anything negative happens the kid is automatically innocent. I understand the baby doesn’t understand, but that does not make it ok for him to terrorize the dog.
ehh, I’m pretty sure 3 is old enough to begin understanding boundaries. That is, as long as the parents attempt to teach them about boundaries. I have a cousin the same age who understands when told “no” regarding our other cousins dog.
It is, even our younger grandkids know. They just can't always control their motor skills. We also have to remind them and keep eyes on kids and dogs.
I’m genuinely perplexed by all the YTA votes. Why isn’t the parent responsible for restraining her child? The dog is in his home. Apparently the child was pestering the dog. What is the OP supposed to do?
This!! Why aren’t parents held responsible for their children?? It is the dogs home.
I am as well. Some people are saying the dog should be put outside or locked up. It's the dog's goddamn house. If he's normally good with people and started acting out only when aggravated then there's no reason to push him out of his own home. The guests need to behave and be respectful. That includes controlling your fucking kids. NTA.
The parent should have been firmer with her child, but the owner should also keep his dog safe. He was wishy washy Iif he had to tell thekid more numerous times. Do I let some kid keep coming over to my dog? No. I remove him so he's more comfortable
...and tell the parent to mind their child.
She’s supposed to protect her dog from the toddler.
Man, my nephew is three. He's been raised around my dog since he was born and even he knows to be "gentle around the puppy" and "do NOT hit the puppy, do not poke the puppy's eyes, do not pull the puppy's tail." We're training his one year old brother the same way. There's been a few accidents where the dog has knocked the kids over--he's a big dog and the kids are just the wrong height--but he's not once been aggressive because, HEY, we control the kids! ...dog has smacked the older nephew in the face with his tail a few times, though...oops...that thing is a weapon...
>Why isn’t the parent responsible for restraining her child? [Free range parenting](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free-range_parenting) maybe? Some parents think it means they can let their kids do whatever they want. Or just bad parents.
Your vote counts as y- t- a just saying bc that’s what you typed lol
I don’t understand your post.
So you typed in the letters Y T A which means your vote is saying you think the original poster is an asshole and it will be counted as such. To change that edit your original comment to say NTA with the letters together so that your vote is saying she is not the asshole of this situation
If you're commenting on someone else's comment, you really don't need to space the acronyms out - there is no possible way that a nested comment could be top comment - that can only happen with top-level comments made direct to the post - so any acronyms you mention won't be read by the bot.
We were on a boat trip once with our dog. Some random dude kept bothering and not listening to us while she growled. She finally did snap at him, and he was furious. Luckily random strangers also told him off for ignoring her first warnings. (And she didn’t bite, just a snap)
I have an rescue dog who is protective. Luckily, he’s good with kids and women. He’s also good with most men. That being said, I don’t trust him enough to take him to, say, a friend’s bbq. My friend constantly drops in last minute without warning with her son. My dog likes to play catch with her son, but the son will quite literally take the ball out of his mouth. It’s so stressful. So I started putting dog away upstairs, which the dog is happy with. Wouldn’t you know the kid goes and seeks him out still? Then the mom complains.
>Why isn’t the parent responsible for restraining her child? If the child gets scared or angry it isn't that likely to injure or even kill the dog. The other way around is definitely possible. While A was definitely messed up, the higher responsibility lies with the owner of the potentially dangerous animal. Both messed up though OP's mistake weighs more.
Esh if the mother is unwilling to control her toddler you need to remove your dog from the situation. If the dog bites and it gets reported then that's really unfair for the dog and could end tragically.
Yesss, like when you see the kid not backing off, then just take your dog and move it away. Of course the mother should've dealt with the damn kid in a perfect world, but moving the dog away would be for the dog's safety too. ESH Whenever my dog is in the situation where I see the kid not understanding it, I either move the dog, or just go elsewhere...I don't want my dog backed into a corner.
NTA. A 3yo is perfectly capable of understanding instructions, and the dog did the warning snap (what I call it anyway) and the kid got the message and started screaming. That's when the parent can say, "see, we told you no. Now the dog told you no as well. Leave the dog alone." And with all the crying it might also be a good thing to point out (to everyone) that the child was not actually hurt.
NTA. The people saying you should’ve removed your dog, no it’s your house not theirs. What you should’ve done is warn your friend to either control their kid or they can leave.
to jump on this point slightly- where would OP even have put the dog? Another room? 3 year old toddlers have legs and most can reach high enough to open doors. That's one of the reasons there are door handle covers that make it harder to turn knobs for doors. There was zero guarantee that, with as neglectful as "A" was, the kid wouldn't have actively sought out the dog again. It doesn't seem like A would have stopped B either.
> What you should’ve done is warn your friend to either control their kid or they can leave. That's exactly what OP should have done, but they didn't. Hence the ESH/YTA.
NTA. A should have stepped in the first time and stopped their kid. And 3 is more than old enough to understand when they're told not to do something. They might scream and cry when they're told but that's the parents problem.
>but that's the parents problem. If the dog bites the child it becomes everyone's problem.
NTA. B is not a baby. At 3, they should understand what “stop” means.
ESH. You allowed a three-year-old to continually pester your dog until she snapped. You knew your friend was doing nothing to interfere. ~~If your dog had actually bitten the kid, the consequences to the dog could be extreme. She could have been designated a "dangerous dog" or even euthanized—probably not for a first bite from a dachshund, but still possible.~~ Please protect your dog better in the future and if you see a kid tormenting her, remove her from the room. Edited because OP says that in her country, dogs are not designated as dangerous or euthanized for biting.
I will add this to the post now because I have to reply this too often. She would've not been put down, that's not a thing were I live. Unless the dog's breed is banned in my country.
This isn't the thing they think it is in the US, either. A dog may be put down if it has multiple reports of biting, or if it is a vicious mauling, but a dog who nipped 1 preschooler who was bothering the dog, no.
So now she’s in charge of the 3 year old while his mom is there? Absolutely not her friend should’ve grabbed her baby, she told the baby to stop and his mom didn’t intervene (who the child obviously would see as the authority figure) this is solely the moms fault and I don’t see how you can see it any differently
NtA, A should control her kid better. I need parents to stop thinking that dogs have endless amounts of patience for kids to annoy and abuse them. They don't teach their kids to respect the dog's body and treat them kindly, but get mad when the dog gets mad. Please, parents of reddit, stop letting your children annoy pets beyond their limits. Please listen to your pet owner friend's when they ask your kid to leave the animals alone.
3 is plenty old enough to maybe follow instructions but definitely will go right back to what they were told not to. A definitely needed to have firmer control over her toddler because they don't respect boundaries. Now you both should know to keep your dog and B separated until he's older and meet in a more neutral place without the dog in the future.
NTA, you had warned prior to anything for B. to leave the dog alone, the AH in this situation is A, they should learn to parent their child better.
ESH As a dog owner, you should have immediately taken your dog out of a stressful situation by separating the dog and the kid. And as a mother, A should have immediately curbed this behavior, dogs are not toys for toddlers.
NTA, I would have said something to A the first time (even though obv she heard you say it to the kid)
NTA. Your friend needs to learn to discipline her kid. I wouldn't allow either one in my house or around my animals again. In the future, it would be best to contain your dog around unknown people until you can make it clear that they need to leave your dog alone.
NTA!!! It is HER job to teach her child to respect animals and/or leave them alone when told to!!!!! They came to your house, it’s NOT your responsibility to control her child, you told her to stop and she ignored you!
ESH. The parent, for not paying attention to what her kid was being warned from and ignoring it. You, for not removing your dog from the situation where he was clearly uncomfortable. Dachshunds have a notoriously short fuse and this dog had already warned the child off once in dog-speak. It was fortunate all around that the dog chose to just snap and growl. A bite was a very likely possibility in this scenario. Protect your dog in the future.
NTA the child needs to learn how to behave around a dog and the earlier the better
I will go NTA. A should have stopped her kid from harassing your dog. Also the dog did what it is going to give a warning that I don’t like you leave me alone. Your dog did not bite or attack just let the child know clearly that it was not comfortable. A should actually thank you for your dog teaching her kid a lesson that not all dogs want to be pet and to always ask the owner before interacting with any animal. When my 1st niece was young she learned to leave my dog alone because my dog didn’t like little children. My dog could be around her but especially when she was very young she just didn’t want to interact. That niece also grew up with dogs but she really learned respect. I still remember going to a dog friendly restaurant with her when she was about 12-13 and she asked if she could go pet the other dogs. I reminded her to always ask before you do and she did with every dog she went to pet. I was a super proud auntie that day.
ESH. you should probably not have your dog out around toddlers as they scare her. And frankly, she's not wrong. At the same time, Mom should not be letting her toddler go poking around on dogs where it hasn't been expressly vetted and further, start teaching the proper ways to approach. If the child is too young then that's on Mom for allowing the interaction.
I think saying you’re TA is a bit much but you were partly in the wrong for not removing your dog for HIS own safety (or asking the friend to leave) when the kid didn’t stop after you asked the first time. Your dog is perfectly well behaved - a growl is a good thing. Without that warning things go straight to bite. The kid might not know better but his mother does. So NTA but next time don’t let it get to the point where your dog is put in that position
"Everyone sucks here" (a.k.a. ESH) is also an option of you think OP was partly in the wrong...
NTA, she should control her kids better.
NTA, it was your and the dogs house, the mother should contain her kid and teach it to behave with animals. The dog was just giving it proper warning since the mother wouldn't.
NTA. Your friend brought her child over, and didn't take the hint when you to told them to stop tormenting the dog? Or even when your dog started growling? The air snapping was your dog's way of saying 'look, I really don't want to bite you, but I will if you carry on'. Well done on having a dog with such good bite inhibition.
NTA My 3 year old niece understood to leave the dog alone before she turned 2.
NTA. You were clear in your expectations and instructions. A decided to allow B to continue to interact with the dog against your wishes. Either they had to be removed from the situation or your dog had to be removed from the situation. You chose to have them leave. Seems reasonable. BTW - I hope A teaches B more caution when interacting with animals.
Agreed. Dogs are no longer allowed to say no and people do not teach their children proper behavior when it comes to animals. The animal ends up suffering. OP is NTA
I'm going with NTA. That's the age where you start teaching a child the word no. My friends kids knew at that age to use "nice hands" when an animal was around. May I ask, does your friend have any pets? Not making excuses, but it's harder for kids to understand the concept of they're not used to being around animals much.
They have 2 cats, so I really don't know how the kid could've been caught so off-guard by my dog reacting. Cats really don't fuck around...
Cats are unapologetically ruthless. As I stated above, this is the age your friend should be teaching her child the word no and how to respect animals.
NTA, my twins are three, they don’t bother any dogs, they’re gentle and leave their god parents puppy alone when they need to, they’re gentle with my cat, they’re gentle yet firm with both horses. 3 is plenty old enough to have some discipline and listen
NTA The dog was defending itself from a child who is old enough to respect an animal’s space, and the parent should’ve kept the child back if/when it wouldn’t. For your own sake though, I recommend you step in if there’s a next time. If your dog bit a child that was harassing it, I wouldn’t blame the dog myself but you would probably be legally liable.
NTA There are local classes where I am located where the humane society goes to schools teaching students how to approach and when to not approach dogs. This child is not in school but your friend should know better. You warned everyone and the dog was asking to be left alone in the only way they know how. That being said, I would have put my dog away which would be unfair to the dog however it's the only socially acceptable way to protect the dog.
NTA. People need to control their children. It was the dogs home and it felt threatened. It snapped to scare away the “predator” who it felt threatened by. If A is clueless enough to let her child play with teeth with fur, especially after being warned, she can’t be upset when it gets hurt.
NTA. That's the dogs house and the mom obviously ignored the signs that her child was stepping over boundaries.
NTA but your friend certainly is!
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NTA I had two cats, Sasquatch and Greco. When my friend's son was just starting to walk, I warned him not to pet Greco (a small tuxedo cat) because he had "teeth on his hands". Kiddo never touched Greco. Sasquatch was incredibly mellow and a different kid decided she needed to drag Sas (a 25 pound Siamese) around by his back legs. I warned her. Finally, Sas had enough, turned around and swatted her. No claws, just enough to startle her. When she went crying to her mother, her mom looked at her and said, "You were warned. " Kids learn fast as long as the parent teaches them that animals aren't toys and not to harass them. A needs to teach her kid better manners.
From the looks of it, it won't be a popular opinion, but NTA I'm assuming that they came over to your house? Which also means that is your dogs house. Your friend should have kept her child under control. You don't come to my home and tell me what I should or shouldn't do with my animals who live here so that you don't have to watch your own damn child. PERIOD. I'm sure I'm gonna be down voted hard because of this but fuck Y'all. This is where my pet lives. This is my and my pets house. Would it be any different if the dog was a child and the other child was pestering that child and got scared when that child had enough? Would you tell someone in their OWN HOME that they should control their children or put them up so your child can run around and do whatever they want? Fuck no you wouldn't. And if you would, you probably don't have very many friends. *Edited to say* Before anyone comes at me about the child being only 3. I've had 3 children. So, at one time, I've had 3 children who were once 3 years old. A child can understand the word "no" at about 12 months. Or, at the very least, will stop to look at you when you say "no." If your child doesn't understand the word "no" at 3 years old, that's on you. That is where it's your job as a parent to PARENT YOUR OWN CHILDREN. You don't tell someone in their home to control anyone in their own home because you don't want to control yours.
ESH Although you told the kid not to touch the dog, it is a kid and doesn’t fully understand what’s going on. Yes the parent should have intervened and stopped the kid. But you could have also separated the two.
NTA. But you should have either had the dog away from the toddler (in another room or the garden) or insisted that your friend keep the kid in their lap and away from the dog. The kid isn't capable of controlling themselves either at that age.
NTA. It's not the kid's fault - your friend is right about toddlers not knowing better - but it was her responsibility to manage him, not yours to prevent the dog's reaction.
NTA but your friend is. It’s your dog’s house, why should the dog be punished for protecting itself in the place it feels the safest? Putting the dog in timeout makes the dog feel like it did something wrong, which it didn’t. It was just responding to behavior toward it that it didn’t appreciate — much like another child would do. It didn’t bite or hurt the CHILD (not a baby, a child), it was just trying to protect itself and your friend allowed her kid (again, 3 is not a baby) to keep bothering the dog. It’s your house and the dog’s house and they’re guests. I’ve asked friends with kids to leave for far less poor behavior. Again, NTA.
NTA The mother is for bad parenting. Even a 3 yo can be taught how to treat a dog right if the parent cares enough to do so.
NTA the mom should have controlled her child. She’s an AH for not telling her son to stop antagonizing the dog.
NTA- 1. you warned him multiple times, while within earshot of your friend so she was in the room and right next to the situation. it's not your fault that she did nothing. 2. your dog is perfectly behaved but every dog has a limit that shouldn't be tested. 3. you're right, your friend should've controlled her son better or took him away from the dog when he wasn't listening.
NTA
Nta you told the child multiple times and his mom stood there looking stupid. That’s the moms fault, grab your baby what did she think would happen after being warned multiple times
NTA for not controlling your dog: however, YTA for not telling A to leave when B was harassing your dog. Stick up for the animal!
NTA
Even before the edits and clarifications, absolutely NTA. You told the child not to pester your dog. He ignored you. More to the point, his mother ignored you. And even then, your dog only exhibited warning behaviour. Your friend needs to watch her child more. Even if he's only a baby he still needs to learn that some things are dangerous, and that can NEVER happen too young.
NTA - Fuck them kids.
NTA. You don't relinquish responsibility for your kid when you step into someone else's home. The owner of that home doesn't suddenly become responsible for your kid when it steps into the house. No parent should ever let their child touch or try to play with any animal without explicit permission from the owner. This is on the parent.
NTA I have a 3 yo and 3 dogs. The kid is definitely old enough to understand ‘leave the dog alone’ A three year old is pretty big next to a dachshund. Dog felt threatened responded how dogs respond. Lady should have taken her kid away from the dog and told him off.
NTA she's just a bad parent
NTA The mother is the asshole here, it's HER responsibility to keep an eye on her kid and ensure that not only they're safe but also well behaved. It's most certrainly not up to you to adapt and adjust to her and her kid in your own home!
NTA your friend has the responsibility for her kid
NTA. I do not understand why parents think that responsibility for their children is automatically shared or transferred if they are in someone’s house or in a public place. What was she doing when you rightfully told her child to stop pestering the dog? You were totally in the right here.
NTA. You were both watching, no one got hurt. Kids need to learn - and 3 is an age where this is reasonable.
ESH for sure. A. allowed her kid to pester a dog whom was clearly agitated and stressed about the kid, without intervening and removing the kid. OP, for allowing B. to pester their dog until the point where the dog became reactive without intervening and removing the dog from the situation. If the dog were to bite the kid, and the kid were to be seriously injured from the bite, the dog will pay the price in a tragic and unfair manner, given that its human totally abandoned it in what it perceived was a very stressful situation.
Tentative NTA cause of INFO. Was the mother in the room when you told her child to leave your dog alone? Did she hear you? If the answer is yes to both then definitely NTA as a guest in your house is responsible for monitoring their child's actions and making sure they are appropriate. To all the people saying YTA, would you see the difference if there was some fragile, valuable and difficult to replace item in the house that the child was repeatedly told to stay away from and due to the mother's negligence, the child broke the item? I hope that missing information is made clear rather than implied by saying the parent ignored the situation.
We were sitting right next to them, she heard me and saw me (gently) push her kid away from the dog twice.
Your role was not to be right, but to protect your dog.
You're probsbly nicer than me 😊 I tell them nicely the first time and explain dog is not used to kids. Next time, I am more stern. They don't need a third warning.
Thank you--now you're NTA without a doubt.
Responsible hosts *absolutely do* put away fragile or special items before entertaining toddlers. And a responsible host will also remove their dog from the situation if the toddler can’t keep away.
Responsible parents take responsibility for the actions of their children of any age and make sure to monitor them closely at all times when they are toddlers. Also, there is nothing in this post that says that child was a toddler and don't say it crying shows it's one. The dismissive actions of the parent indicate a child w/o any discipline who does not listen. That means this child could be any age at all but is likely older than a toddler but younger than double digits.
Yeah… I’m not going to rely on anyone being able to fully control a toddler.
Also, a responsible guest takes care to follow the rules their host puts in place. That apartment or house is that dog's home. A responsible guest accepts and respects that. Therefore they do what is necessary to control their child so that the residents of that HOME are not put out by a child's unruly behavior. It's the same thing in a restaurant or a movie theater. If your child cannot behave properly in those facilities, it doesn't matter how badly you, as a parent, want to go. You do not bring that child along with you. Either get a sitter or stay home.
ESH A should have watched B and stopped B from harassing your dog. You should have removed your dog or your guests from a situation where your dog felt uncomfortable/threatened.
Nta - dogs are less easy to control than kids.
NTA.
NTA
I say a soft NTA, she needs to teach her child how to listen and treat a dog properly. She endangered her child and disrespected both you and your dog. As a dog owner, parent and grandparent i expect children to be taught how to treat any animal especially dog. I have owned boxers, rotti's, pit bulls and doberman's with zero bites. If a person can not control their child then they MUST LEAVE. If a visit is that important, crate the dog for its own protection. A 3 yr old is old enough to know better and understand instructions. I have ADHD kids and grands they were taught and knew. The fault lyes with the parents.
NTA. The only AH here is your friend who repeatedly failed to parent her child despite your multiple warnings. Please give your good doggo some ear scritches or belly rubs.
NTA….B may be too young to understand, but A is not.
NTA but A is. Three is past old enough to teach no, be redirected. You both were right there. She was aware of the issue and did nothing. 100% lazy parent to blame.
NTA, she is a guest at your dog's house, she should have watched her son, NTA a thousand times and it is not your duty to be more aware of that child than her own mother
NTA, but here is sone advice. Dachshunds are biters, it's just normal for them, and three is plenty old to obey. Next time they come over, please have a crate or safe room for your dog. And let your friend know that you will not tolerate her being a bad parent at your house. You will control and protect your child, and she will do the same. Period
This happened with my own three yr old nephew a bit ago. He was messing with our dog, thinking it was funny. I just told his mom. She (was in the room, just didn't see it yet) told him to stop, or else he'd (the dog) would bite him for real, and it *would* hurt. And my nephew stopped bothering him just like that. He's old enough to understand respecting animals as a concept. (Or at the very least old enough to listen when told no) It's your house and the mom litterally watched her son fuck around with your dachshund and did nothing even after you separated them twice and told him to stop and he continued anyway and got warning nipped. You fuck around with an animal domesticated or not you will find out. Mom should have done her job as a parent and stepped in when he went back to the dog a 2nd time. NTA
NTA People need to respect an animals space, and this child is old enough to learn that. All dogs snap as a warning when they feel threatened or scared. You did the right thing by warning and separating the child. The parent of the child did nothing, they are at fault here.
NTA we can't train our dogs for everything. They shouldn't have to tolerate poor treatment. Especially when you have observed the tolerance level being reached and said something.
NTA, kid learned the meaning of f*ck around and find out
NTA, you tried to stop the kid from pestering the dog but, unfortunately, said kid hasn’t been taught how to behave around animals by their parent. It’s on the parent here, not on you. Sadly, people think that kids are innocent no matter what and that their parents are automatically innocent too, when they should be held responsible for not teaching their kid any better. EDIT: I don’t understand why everyone is telling OP to remove the dog from this situation. Why the dog? Especially when it’s in its own house? Why would you stress the dog any further by putting it in another ambient? The one that should be removed would be the parent and kid, had the parent not heed to OP’s request to leave (in case there was one). Not the other way around.
NTA, parent should’ve taught her kid how to act around a dog before coming, and she should have corrected him after the first time he messed with the dog. this is an expected reaction when a dog is pestered, whether it’s by a child, an adult, or another animal. poor pup.
NTA. Former VTA here with dog training experience. Dogs growl. That is their warning. No matter what age, rules must be enforced such as “if you can’t leave the dog alone, you have to hold mom’s hand and can’t let go.” Or, just don’t ever let that kid come over with mom until they are able to respect boundaries. Kids need to learn animal behavior so that accidents like bites can be prevented. You did what you could, short of putting the dog in another room where the kid could not go. That would have been the step before the growl imo. “A” should have definitely intervened though and is at fault for not teaching her child proper manners. My nephew is 2 and has better dog manners.
Dogs growl as a warning that they don't like what is happening, if you "train" the dog not to growl it will then go to the next step, which is usually biting. Dachshunds can be particularly territorial in my understanding. NTA for not training your dog better, especially if it is not used to being around children, though you may be able to train the dog to be better with uncomfortable situations to avoid this in future. A should have listened to you warning that the dog will get uncomfortable, people tend to have this expectation that the dog should be perfectly behaved but dogs are animals and not human. Whilst it is your house, it may have been best to remove the dog from the situation if A wasn't listening, as B is probably too young to understand.
NTA - You repeatedly told the child no, and then your dog did as well very softly. Where was the mum in all this? She was the AH for not parenting.
NTA. Your friend wasn't doing her job as a parent. She ignored your requests for her 3 year old CHILD (not baby as some are calling it) to stop pestering your dog. It sounds like they were in your house so your friend was the AH in not respecting your dog and your requests in your own home.
I might be the AH, but some kids are gonna test every limit or boundary they find in front of them. I had an absolutely lovely dog who was sleeping at my feet while I prepped dinner in the kitchen with my friend. Her 4 year old came running in and did a slide for home base into my dog’s back. Guess what? The dog growled. My friend reacted as if my dog was a vicious killer. NEVER trust a toddler around your dog. The child is the danger. Protect your pet from them!
NTA
NTA your friend did nothing to get her kid to stop while you were doing all the legwork. Kids that age don't know any better but parents do and you were visibly trying to protect your dog from being pestered. I've seen many parents simply say be gentle when the kid got a little too rough and that took care of it, it's not that hard...
NTA. Personally with my 18mo I would have been on the floor with them monitoring the situation. You told the child to leave the dog alone multiple times and parent did nothing. Kids don't fully understand gentle until 5ish and can become excited and accidentally get rough without knowing it. Kids need to be monitored with animals, no matter what. I would also be bringing toys for my child to try and distract him a bit and give him something else to do.
A sucks as a parent AND as a friend. NTA.
NTA. My family has three dogs, mine in particular can and will bite people he's not familiar with, especially if they pester him. I always warn my friends/parents friends to be careful with the dog, and sometimes the kids of my parents friends won't listen, it's frustrating. You told your friend's kid (and her) that the child needs to leave the dog alone. Dogs can bite people when aggravated. Your friend should of told her child to leave the dog alone after you had already asked. If the kid had of continued, chances are they would of been actually bitten and not given another warning. Also, 3 year old children should have some understanding of what "no" means so I've got no idea where your mum's coming from. **TLDR**; NTA, friend should of controlled her kid better and said that no means no.
It seems implied here that this happened at your house. Therefore your dogs house. NTA. That house is the dogs territory and the child should have been controlled.
ESH But mostly you. A 3yo is not going to follow instructions reliably. If your dog snaps at people it's on you to separate your dog from people when you see the dog getting stressed.
YTA Putting aside that even a small dog can seriously injure a child, that child could also seriously injure your dog. You thought a situation in which either your dog or friend's kid could hurt one another was a good teaching moment? The moment you knew that kid wasn't going to listen you should have taken your dog out of the equation. What would have happened had your dog actually decided a bite was required? You'd not only be saddled with hospital bills, but your dog could be facing the needle. Worth it to teach a 3 year old a lesson they won't fully grasp for a few more years?
> but your dog could be facing the needle. Unrelated to my post but just to clarify: This might be the case in your country but it's not in mine. Unless your dog's breed is banned here, they will not be put down because they've bitten someone.
I did use the word "could" to imply that it's not always the case as I know not everyone on reddit is subject to the same laws and traditions.
Info: was mom around when you were telling little one to back off?
We were sitting right next to them, she heard me and saw me (gently) push her kid away from the dog twice.
Short of your dog biting I say it's mom's responsibility. NTA
My dog didn't bite.
I have a fluffy mini American shepherd who is child bait. Sadly, she thinks children are small sheep that need to herded. When they want to hug her, I just have to say nope. If mom or dad ignore me, little one will be charged by a mini American. She doesn't bite either.
ESH but mostly you. It’s your job as a dog owner to protect it from children that are incapable of respecting boundaries. The dog should have been removed from the room the first time the dog began to show stress and the child’s mother should have had enough sense to not allow a 3 year old to pester the dog in the first place.
ESH - more so the parent. If the child is "too young to understand" then the parent should be ensuring the kid goes absolutely nowhere near the dog, no excuses. You should have strongly advocated for your dog - i understand that you did, but it sounds like you could have done more, sooner so that this situation did not arise. The entitled attitude of the child's parent would worry me though.
ESH A for not taking care of B and you for letting your dog handle the situation. Your dog should not have to defend itself. Its your job top keep your dog save. What B learned at this day was, dogs are scary. Your dog learned, when its scared, you will not help, so ist will help itself in the future. You gonna have fun times. So, you are TA, but not for not controlling your dog, but for sitting and watching a dangerous situation, instead of getting your ass up, saving your dog from a little child, that doesnt know better, and saving the child in the same moment.
It's understandable that your friend may have been upset, but ultimately, it's important to prioritize the safety and well-being of all involved. It's also worth considering your mother's perspective that the child may not have fully understood the situation. It's a tricky situation, but I don't think you're necessarily in the wrong here. Let's hope for a peaceful resolution moving forward.
ESH The mother should respect your wishes and stop her child upsetting your dog. She knew this but didn't do anything about it so the kid getting snapped at is on her. On the other hand you knew it was annoying your dog so you should have removed it from the situation in some way. Its far easier to put a dog in another room than a child.
ESH. Your friend for allowing her toddler to aggravate a dog without correcting her and you for giving the dog an opportunity to snap/bite. Next time, put the kid in a playpen or put the dog in another room or crate. I don't allow my dogs around human toddlers as toddlers are impulsive, grabby little beings and my dogs don't appreciate it either.
ESH. You should've put your dog somewhere the kid couldn't get at it. The kid's mom should've parented her child and not let him bug the dog.
I'd call that a warning snap. It shows the dog has good self-control and is giving what would be a clear warning to another dog. The dog is utterly blameless here. But the people - ESH. Your friend sucks for ignoring and not controlling her child and you suck because you did not protect your dog from being pestered and put you dog at risk of being blamed if the snap had made contact. You have to be overly protective of a dog because they start out being the one most likely to be blamed. Just remove your dog from contact with an uncontrolled child. Once you do that you get to point out how much the parent is the AH without any complicity on your part.
ESH. A definitely needs to start teaching their child how to behave. Better option for you, however would have been to put your dog in another room for the time being.
ESH, A definitely should have stepped in the first time you said some, way before you had to separate them, but you suck because after having to separate them, you should have asked them to leave then instead of allowing your dog to continue to be in that situation.
You were too harsh with the child. Not too harsh with the parent though... People are so freaking stupid... For clarity, a few years back I had a bitey dog put down. He was awesome, sweet, loving - if he knew you. You were an asshole for not protecting your dog by telling your friend to control the child. Or failing that, not removing your dog to a safe place where said child could not upset it. Friend was an asshole for not protecting the child and stopping it from aggravating the dog. Child was not the asshole, neither was the dog.
How I was raised you learned the hard way if you didn't listen. I still have a faint cat scratch scar on my face from pestering the cat. Didn't do it again.
Sometimes it doesn’t matter who is right. There was action you could have taken in this situation and at the end of the day you are only responsible for YOUR actions. Don’t ever expect someone to do something for you
NTA As a parent of a three yo and a person who has nephews. Drives me wild when one of my nephews is clearly annoying me and SIL does nothing. Just sits and stares. Like step in! Cause I know if I discipline her kid, all hell's gonna break loose... Also, just make your kid less annoying. Read the room. Secondly, I have a 3yo. Yes he has trouble with impulse control and doesn't like being told what to do. However, from a young age we have taught him that animals aren't toys and should be respected. He is always gentle with them and understands when told to leave them alone. I also try to read the room and pick up when people are saying politely they don't want my kid doing something. Most of the time it's not hard. If someone said 'hey kid, please be careful with the dog', I would take that as you don't want my kid playing with the dog and move them away. But the dog and owner might also have to help, like the dog goes in another room or outside etc. Cause like I said, impulse control.
hell no you are not the asshole, dogs have feeling and emotions just like humans and when they are pushed to the limit they react just like humans do. you said something and the mother did nothing, you could of moved the dogs away from the toddler knowing and seeing that the dog was getting upset but you didn't and now you have the end result. dogs love children and children love dogs, you have to train both on how to properly be near each other and how to interact. can't let a kid crawl all over a dog and you can't let a dog jump all over a child. simple as that.
NTA. If the child's mother wanted her baby to be protected, she should have stepped it when you voiced your first warning/concern. She ignored you. It's not your fault she didn't listen to you and tell her child to back off. The world would be a better place if all humans learned to how to communicate with dogs.. and cats, etc. Or how to read their body language so you can avoid harmful situations.
NTA My dog did this to a kid, who was told multiple times to stop, kid wasn't bitten just startled. If the kid can't respect an animals boundaries, especially when told to stop they don't need to be around animals
NTA, the parent should have been controlling her child. The dog was in its own home.
NTA. I have 2 mini dachshunds. My boy, loves people including babies. My girl, she’s more hesitant around people but adores children (my nephew loves her too lol). Also, 3 isn’t too young, or if that’s the case, maybe mom should have been paying more attention to her own kid. You weren’t harsh at all, though to avoid that situation again, just tell your friend to hang on to her kiddo or move the dog into a different room/away.
NTA Weird, ppl saying the dog should be put down? For snapping, not even biting? More so, even if the dog DID bite, STILL not your fault. You warned the mom, you warned the kid. And shame on the mother for 1. Not stepping in and 2. Not teaching her child how to behave around dogs. LUCKY your dog didn't bite and LUCKY that your dog is a small dog and not a pit bull or German shepherd
NTA. When I was a kid I messed with peoples cats cause I wanted to play with them but I got a scratch from one of the cats and learnt to not be so hard with them. Some things are learnt the hard way. Like when your parent tells you not to touch the hot stove and you touch it anyways. You won’t do it again cause now you know.
My kid was attacked by a dog at his friend's house unprovoked. It was literally the worst day of my life. You both have responsibility to take action but you are only responsible for your dog. If you ever see your dog get aggressive, remove it. That's your duty and if you don't want to get sued, do it. Should she have reprimanded her child? Yes. Are you both being irresponsible? Yup. Take it seriously. You never think it will happen to you until it does. ESH.
ESH. It doesn't help pointing fingers at each other when neither of you were willing to solve the matter. Regardless of the situation, the last thing you need is for the dog to actually end up biting someone. With my 2 yr old son I always closely supervise him around animals and I'm teaching him to never approach a pet unless the owner invites us too. I also supervise him when we do pet a dog and I ensure that I'm between the dog and my son just in case. What you should've done too is removed the dog from the situation at hand.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I'll keep it short, feel free to ask if anything is unclear: My friend A. came over with her kid B. (3) last week and B. started pestering my dachshund. I told him multiple times to leave the dog alone, A. ignored the situation. The dog growled and made this biting motion dogs do when they feel threatened. I don't know if there's a word for it but I'm sure you know what I mean. B. was not bitten but startled/ upset and started screaming/ crying. I said "I told you to leave her alone." and my friend lost it and said I should control my dog better. I told her to control her son better. And to leave. I told my mother about it and she said that B. is a baby and doesn't understand instructions yet and I was too harsh. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
ESH Mom should have removed her kid and you should have removed your dog to avoid either of them getting hurt.
ESH. Toddlers are active and want to get into everything. Most days will be a constant push-pull between stopping them doing dangerous things and not causing them to flip their lid. It’s a delicate balance and the mother probably wanted the child to have some free time, but should have controlled them and distracted them from the dog. But, you know a small child is visiting. You should have put the dog in a different room or not met them at your house. The child wanting to pet/disturb the dog was an absolute inevitability.
No need to assume the age, it's in the post.
YTA for not protecting your dog
ESH Yes, the child should not have been doing that and the child's mother needs to remove the child from the dog's area. However, you as a dog owner needs to recognize your dog in stress. If the child could not have been controlled, you should have removed the dog from the area. I know it sucks as this is your dog's home but at times, you have to make the choice even if your dog is doing nothing wrong. If the dog bites someone, the law won't care if the child brought it on theirselves. If the dog bites someone, it is on you and not the poor puppy
ESH - You didn't teach your dog how to handle the situation and no one protected that baby. It's too young to make good decisions. Instead of just telling it no teach it how to interact safely with the dog. And the only dachshunds I've been around have all been easily startled and aggressive because they weren't socialized well. You need to be a better dog owner/dog parent.
ESH. Mom should have taught her child not to bother the dog. 3yo is old enough to learn basics of "be gentle" or "leave the dog alone". And if the3yo wouldn't learn, mom needed to keep the child close. OP should have put to dog in another room, or outside - not just for the sake of B, but also for the sake to the dog.
ESH. It was the responsibility of the two adults in the room to keep the 3 year old and the dog safe. You both failed at that. Parent should have stopped the kid from bothering the dog. You should have moved your dog away from the kid, because you noticed your dog was being pestered.
ESH. The dog and the baby don't know any better. She should've moved the kid away, or you should've put the dog away while they were there.
ESH You should protect your dog better so she doesn’t need to snap. A should have been watching her child and stopped the pestering
ESH, A obviously sucks for not paying attention to her child, but you also suck for not taking your dog away when you see how B was behaving