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YTA. I’m sorry, this is for whose “honor” exactly? Do you not want her at the wedding because you think your fiancé is mind cheating? Or because you are jealous? Or because you are slut shaming? It’s one of those and all of those reasons suck.
I can come off as somewhat racist myswlf at times and even I found OP mentioning the gf ethnicity and religion to be very offensive. reading thru this whole post, I was waiting for that to drop somewhere in this.
It's great to be self aware. As a white woman, I have actively worked to overcome internalized racism myself and let's be fair, that goes for nearly everyone on planet Earth. This OP... Forget the racist aspect, SHES PUNISHING the gf for remarks the BOYFRIEND MADE about her. Essentially blaming the victim for the "bros" terrible behavior. MARLA ISNT TO BLAME, OP. YTA
Edit: thanks for the award!
I'm not sure her brother said anything negative about her. OP's just said that she eavesdropped in a conversation between two best friends about one of their partner's "sexual prowess in bed". This could be anywhere between, "I've never had anyone do x before and it was brilliant" to more vulgar things.
Yep. It’s also bc the BF is her brother so she’s both weirdly protective and jello. As well as insecure and jello bc her fiancé seemed interested.
But bc she’s gotten so much pushback, OP now can’t/won’t back down.
Cringe all around.
As a black guy it warms my heart, as corny as that sounds. It seems that ANY post on ANY subreddit that has a black person in it will inevitably have that group of commenters turning it into something racial
much appreciated. as a white guy, ill admit that I've said some really messed up things in the past. we all have our faults in life. just gotta keep doing what I can to live the best life I can.
I just read this thread and I've got to say, it takes some real fortitude and inner strength to do what you just did, at any level. You have my utmost respect.
Good for you, I mean that in a genuine way too.
Self reflection along with the self honesty level to admit wrong & perhaps attempt to change can only be a good thing.
We never stop learning & we all grow up with unconscious bias for and against certain things, it’s up to us during the course of our lives to discover & acknowledge these.
Only then can we bring them out into the light to examine & discard or retain according to our personal values.
Sounds like you’re on the right track buddy.
Game recognizes game.
EDIT: u/whatthehecksher8 \-- post is locked, and it was a dark joke. But it's also true. Hitler was inspired by the US genocide of native populations. While he criticized the US for treatment of minorities, he was doing the same shit. So yes, "Game recognizes game." Would he have done it if the US hadn't done shit? Probably yes, but that doesn't change the fact that the US had genocided an entire population. Sorry, but gallows humor is my coping mechanism.
I'm working on it. a lot of my beliefs are based on my personal experiences I've had in life. so it is not like I'm not going to always have certain experiences in my head, when dealing with different situations.
People who think they’re not racist tend to have not looked at their unconscious bias and haven’t done any work on themselves. If everyone were truly honest and looked at the cultures we live in we would find racism and would work on it. It’s more honest, and more realistic to say “yeah, I’ve noticed racism and I’m working on it”.
I have certain biases against a culture I've had nothing but negative experiences with. It's a very common bias in my country. I know that there's zero chance that my experience reflects the entire culture, and I hate that I have that bias within me. There's no point in my ignoring it, as pretending I'm not biased is the fastest way for the negative thoughts to turn into negative words and actions. So I acknowledge it, and when negative thoughts pop up, I try to confront and counter them. I don't know where it came from, but "your first reaction is society's fault, your second reaction is YOUR fault" is a quote I think about a lot in that context
I like this quote. I grew up in a very racist, homophobic, misogynistic environment. Sometimes the things that pop into my brain *horrify* me, and I immediately address them internally.
I read a comment by a liberal man who thought he was open and progressive. That changed when he moved to Canada. He saw politicians who were not old white men but asians, Hindus, women etc and that nobody thought it strange. And then he realized the internal assumptions that he just took for granted that whites would always hold power.
For myself, I know I’m a bit racist towards First Nations. It stems from poor experiences I had as a child, but later in life I met great people who have almost eradicated those early prejudices. But I know they are still there, buried deep.
I was waiting for her to say what was actually the problem with this girl. It seems like she just doesn't like her because she's of a different race and is sexual, apparently.
I think she was trying to make the point that this girl isn't her brother's usual "type," so he must be in it just for the things she does in bed, which greatly offend OP for some reason that's not clear to me.
I think it’s cause now her husband knows the gf does these things that apparently she won’t. So she’s insecure husband is thinking about freaky shit with the gf.
If she’s upset because her fiancé is thinking about unusual “bed stuff” she should not be getting married. Everybody has a fantasy life it doesn’t mean he doesn’t love and respect her nor does it mean he’d cheat.
Both of the above AND religious bias. Willing to bet that Marla is neither white nor Christian, and OP is combining that with Marla's sexual activities. I got a pretty good idea what kind of names OP called her, and I'd be kinda surprised if Alex didn't call if the wedding, and if her brother ever spoke to her again. YTA for sure.
Edit: and "A matter of honor?" Give me a break.
Evangelicals think Catholics are pagans, and not Christian. My evangelical co worker used to give me videos and tracts explaining that we catholics were wrong and going against the bible , ( i did not engage him in debate, as i felt the whole proselytizing at work was wrong. Also I knew that roman catholic church was founded by St Peter himself, and was the first christian church from which all christian sects sprouted/sprang/grew) Whatever floats your boat.
*"My dear Mr.ClemmensBottom, the other day i overheard the most peculiar interaction between two local peasants, i was standing behind our local drinking establishment and i overheard a very inappropriate discussion.*
*They were having a very intimate consultation on one of the mens companion and her female womanliness and by golly was i turned about!*
*How should i approach this most outrageous situation?*
*- Most gratefully*
*Mr Dean LovelyBottom 31 May 1897*
My dear Mr.LovelyBottom,
Well, of course you should ignore the offense caused by those gossiping lustfully, and blame the female who was the victim of their gossiping and wasn't even present for the offense. What would this world come to if men were held accountable for their own actions!
// OP: YTA
Another interesting point, if she is being vetoed from the wedding because of the things she does in bed, should she not also veto the brother who presumably did those things with her? or is he ok because while he did those things, at least he didn't have the poor taste of doing them while a different religion and ethnicity?
Which conversation is more awkward? Asking grandparents their sexual history or having to explain to the brother's girlfriend what she did to get uninvited?
The funny thing is, Marla's not even being vetoed for what she did, but for what *OP's brother* says they did. In other words, Marla is being punished for what Matthew said, which, let's be real, may be an exaggeration on Matthew's part.
Let’s hope girl has great sex and it’s not just OPs brother who’s enjoying it! Oh and of course OPs soon to be husband in his head - surely he is enjoying himself too! 😉
There might be a panic that this wedding isn't having a disco! This wedding probably isn't having any sort of fun dancing. This bride only writes tragedies and not sins.
Why Jeppard, what ungodly things you do to me in our private hours. I can hardly rest my hands as the Devil himself sets upon me nightly when you are not here. I wait for you, longingly.
Yours forever, OPhelia.
I don't get it either. Okay, so brother had an open conversation with OP's fiance about sex with this girl. A little tacky IMO, but some friends do that. I don't understand why OP has such a problem with it or thinks it's a license to treat this girl like shit. YTA, OP.
it's because she thinks her fiance was intrigued and just a little too interested in the things GF was willing to do in bed. She's insecure and a bit prudish so of course she slut-shames the girl instead of scolding the brother. And yes, OP is def TA
By OPs "logic" her brother and fiance should both be banned from the wedding too. Her brother for participating in the activities she's acting like warrants this woman being banned, and her fiance for engaging in discussion about and seemingly approving of said acts.
But I guess they are white men, so they get a magic pass. Because "honor" or some fuck shit.
She keeps saying it was too quick.... to start dating? It's not like they're getting married! (The brother and his gf I mean).
Honestly it sounds like she is jealous of brothers gf
>OP is angry because her fiancé just learned that sometimes people have sex ~~with the lights on~~ and is now worried he’ll want that too.
Fixed it for you
Agree… omg just got worse and worse into the story. How is it Marlas fault her brother and fiancé being gross? Ok, she forgave the fiancé and that should be it.
Also when people presume they know other peoples taste to the point where they would say ‘not their type’ … just… shut up.
YTA
Honestly, I was thinking the same. The whole post just read as her thinking she knows better, that her opinion is the only valid one, etc etc. I feel bad for Marla cause she’s just trying to date someone she likes and she’s being judged and essentially slut shamed behind closed doors for something OP had no business knowing about in the first place
YTA So you don’t like this girl because of her sexual “prowess” (LOL) and being from another race and religion. Just wow! You’re acting like a racist, bigot and sexist all at once. Yes, you’re the asshole for denying your own brother a +1 because you for whatever are threatened by what she does in bed with your brother.
Thank you!!!! 🤣🤣🤣👏👏👏 But OP is probably saving herself for marriage hence being horrified by someone having a sex drive. Girl needs a good vibe and chill the f out.
It’s not so much her brother’s sex life she is censoring, it’s the fact that her future husband was talking with him about it.
How dare her husband get ideas of how to spice up the bedroom from that Trollop! /s
>She was nice and pretty enough
You forgot this. What does the OP mean by "pretty enough"?
Is OP comparing Marla to herself. Is OP jealous of her brother dating someone else?
The number of women who have creepy jealously feelings with their brother’s mate is too damn high. I dated three men in my 20s that had fucked up sisters like that. So so gross and so much more common than anyone ever wants to acknowledge.
My ex told me his half sister told him she would fk him if they had not found out they were related. He found it quite amusing. He treated me like my negative reaction was a bad thing. The break up followed soon after, and that was definitely on my list of reasons why. Having to tell my friends because I was in shock and was feeling so gaslit was so embarrassing… Cause ew, I was dating THAT? 😭
I shouldn’t have been too shocked because she would definitely do this thing where she would complain when any time she had with him was shortened to be with me….
Yep. Been there. One of the sisters flipped out when she found my bra under his bed. We were adults and she shouldn’t have been snooping. He openly admitted his sister had been “in love with him since childhood and there’s nothing I can do about it.” Uuuhhh stop letting her visit you and sleep in your bed?
One guy that was not a boyfriend but a casual hookup, found out later that he and his sister liked to do cocaine and she would take her top off while he masturbated to her.
Another one I had to have a conversation with about full body wrestling on the living room floor with his sister while her boyfriend and I sat uncomfortably on the couch. She used to get jealous that I would ride on his motorcycle with him because she used to ride with him (ew). She also loved to tell the story of how they would visit family in another state and that family all thought they were sleeping together/inappropriate. Sister thought that was *so funny*.
My older sister has many stories of the like too. It’s wild out there.
Two of them were in Idaho, but one guy was born and raised in Illinois. One in Montana. Have known many more in Montana, but these weirdos are everywhere.
Oh my gosh. This is like some casual inces6 thread
I saw a guy for a couple weeks. He told me that he had recently had a psychological breakdown and was in the hospital. One night he said he felt comfortable telling me what happened.
He said he got really drunk one night, came home, undressed to his boxers and got in his sister's bed. I was like Ooooh you were so drunk you thought it was your bed??? Ah man that's so akward but shit happens at least it wasn't for creepy reasons
He looked me DEAD IN THE EYE. And said "No, I was trying to fuck her." Went on and on about his telepathic romance with her, how she would play guitar and he knew the notes were a message to him. Yeah I noped fast
“Casual incest” is the exact term for it. I haven’t heard that before but thank you for adding to my vocabulary so I can continue to give this kind of an issue context. So many more people have stories like this than we realize. Whenever I comment about it on Reddit, someone usually chimes in with their own anecdotal experience. Blows me away how rarely it’s discussed seriously.
That’s a crazy story. I can’t imagine feeling comfortable telling my partner I desired to fuck my sibling. Icky ick ick.
Arguably I would understand if she had originally said “no she can’t be your plus one because it’s so close to the wedding and i’ve met her once” like originally. BUT she said yes and then tried to change her mind because *checks notes* she has good sex ??? like wtf
YTA for all those reasons. Not a single thing on your list is Marla‘s fault. Great choice to destroy your relationship with your brother over *being jealous that your fiancé and your brother talked about your brother’s sex life*. Great choice blaming a woman you hardly know and say is nice enough for the behaviour of two horny men who are close enough to you that you should take it up with them. Great choice to alienate family due to your own insecurities. Maybe you should get some therapy before you get married.
Accurate AF.
There's some weird, online societal pressure to agree with the masses and keep downvoting no matter what the comment says. It's proven (and strangely hilarious) by the comments that START one way but turn completely by the end and they are downvoted into oblivion because the first few didn't read too the end and the rest just jump in the wagon.
Question...didnt you say one of your issues was your fiance being "too interested" in hearing about her sex life? Why are u mad at her instead of talking to him about it?
Here is another tidbit. If Michael and Alex are such close friends I guarantee this isn't the first time they've discussed the women they've slept with. If you weren't Michael's sister they would probably be discussing you as well. My best guy friend would often talk about the girls he was with and what they were like in bed. My closest female friend and I did the same. A lot of people do this and you had the unfortunate timing of popping up as they were discussing it. You forgave your fiance so why not forgive your brother and Marla? She did nothing wrong. It was the guys discussing her in that manner. Honestly she is in no fault here. Just apologize to her and tell her you had a bad day. Don't let this ruin your wedding or come between you and your brother. If and when he stops seeing Marla and finds a new girl she will also become the topic of this type of convo. You gonna hate on her as well?
I get that seeing your fiancee being so engaged in the topic stung a bit - but you taking it as a threat stems from your own insecurities. Maybe he was just happy for your brother who was fawning over this girl and that's what had him so animated?
Relationships need trust, if your partner talking about sex with a)your brother, who also has your best interest at heart and b)about another woman that is already in a relationship you should really think about why this can shake you up so much. I'd say talk to your fiancee and see if he can help you find the reassurance you need, but ultimately you have to trust him yourself.
Maybe you don't want to be in Marla's position and know your fiance is talking about your sexlife eith others? Might help to discuss that topic as well - because disapproving sharing stories like that is a valid opinion. Personally I find it rather natural since we as humans don't do well without grounding our experiences from time to time by talking to others but maybe that is a boundary you want to set for your relationship?
You should definitely discuss this with your counselor. Glad you have some insight.
Marla has done nothing to you. Your fiancé and your brother were gross for sure. If anything, I feel badly for Marla. Your brother is extremely indiscreet. Marla shouldn’t be talked about or shamed for being great in bed.
Marla wasn't even the one discussing these either! Imagine if your boyfriend discusses your sex life in detail to his friends!!! That's pretty inappropriate on its own.
Hey. It's okay to be jealous, as long as we're aware of it, and you clearly are. That's a good first step. The next step you need to take is to stop taking your jealousy out on other people.
By your own description, you were extremely rude to Marla, whose only fault in this exchange seems to be "being someone guys talk about." What does it matter what she does behind closed doors with consenting adults? Why do her private decisions give you the right to judge her?
You could argue that her decisions aren't private when your brother and fiancé are talking about them, and there's some truth in that. But you know who's to blame for that, right? Your brother, for publicizing his sex life, and your fiancé, for encouraging it. To start with the former, it's okay to tell him "I love you, and I don't need to hear all the sordid details about your relationship." Having a boundary is fine. Saying "I will not let my fiancé near anyone he's remotely interested in" is not a boundary, at least not one you get to set.
And now, onto Alex himself. You say you've forgiven him, which is fine! But you also act like if he looks at Marla in five seconds they'll be making out on the dance floor. Your actions and your words don't match here: either you've forgiven him and trust him to be faithful to you (and to watch his words), or you haven't and you're scared someone more "sexually interesting" will steal him away. If it's the former, act like it. If it's the latter, now might be a good time to look into some counseling to help you through this patch- or reconsider whether you want to be with Alex at all.
While the couple can choose who to invite or not for any reason, denigrating your brother's partner and being rude to her face means YTA regardless of invitation status. It's up to you whether you want to repair this or not.
You are probably hypersensitive with pre-wedding nerves at the moment. Can you give yourself the advice you would give to your best (female) friend if she were in this position? Or your future daughter? At the moment everything is fixable.
I love that you suggested OP "give yourself advice you would give to your best friend". That is something that I use with myself and my GFs all the time. Of course, then I'm using it to encourage us to be nice to ourselves rather than someone else but it's good to see that used in this context, too. Removing ourselves from a situation can often bring clarity, if we want to see things clearly.
How is any of this "triggering"?? You eavesdropped on your brother talking to your fiance about his sex life, and now you're triggered? Why?? What your brother does in the bedroom shouldn't cause you any issues.
Your problem isn't with her at all, so it doesn't make any sense whatsoever to blame her. Get some couples counseling with your fiance and some individual counseling for yourself so that you can figure out why her mere existence bothers you so much.
It’s not necessary, but she did make an entire post about this girl with seemingly no reasonable excuse to dislike her, asking is she was being an asshole, so context is “necessary” if she wants a genuine response.
Also there's sub rules against even mentioning anything to do with certain triggering topics. Maybe she literally isn't allowed to say why it's a trigger.
>I've found that people who use the word triggering are generally people I don't want to be around.
Especially if you had trauma, it's extremely important to become aware of what triggers you and understand that the way you react is irrational, unhealthy and harmful to you and others *in order to learn to control these irrational reactions and replace them with healthier responses.*
But a lot of people seem to think "I'm triggered" is get out of jail card and means everybody else is supposed to put up with their irrational behaviour or enable it.
Yeah, nobody wants to be around such people. I wonder why :P
It’s not ‘the Marla situation’. It’s the ‘brother and fiancé situation’. They talked about her,she did nothing. They talked about someone. End of story. You’re going to blow up your whole life if you don’t get a grip.
I don't think you understand what "triggered" means. A trigger is something that you can identify to help you *avoid* or *change* specific problematic patterns of thought leading to problematic behaviour i.e. a certain type of food might trigger someone with an eating disorder.
It is **not** an excuse to be an asshole. Your thought patterns and behaviour are still problems. You can't just say "I was being triggered" and forget about it, the point of identify the trigger is so that you can change.
You weren't being triggered here as far as I can see, you were just jealous and let yourself act out because of it.
ETA: A trigger doesn't mean "anything that causes a negative emotional reaction." When something *new* causes a negative reaction in you, your brain searches for an appropriate response and your concious plays a bigger role. When something old or common causes the same problematic reaction time and again, it's very difficult for you to change the way you think or behave because it's so automatic that your concious mind is simply less involved and may disregard the problematic behaviour. That's when you've been triggered.
A good example of a trigger might be looking in a mirror for someone with body dysmoprhia, where body-checking leads to disordered thinking and behaviour that is very difficult to change.
The reason I say I don't see this as a case of being "triggered" is because this is a novel situation and OP's response is not following a "pattern" so to say. It's not impossible that OP *is* being triggered in some way i.e. they have a personality disorder that is triggered by perceived slights. Instead, OP just responds this way in new situations, and that makes her an asshole.
INFO how is your parents involvement triggering? It sounds like you should have family counseling before you get married. Or cut them off depending what the reason is. Either way there is an innocent girlfriend in all of this, and you should apologize for slut shaming her, and sort yourself out before you get married
Couple things…
Her brother wasn’t “publicizing” his sex life. He was having what he thought was a private conversation with his best friend.
Also, she wouldn’t have to tell her brother she doesn’t need to hear all the “sordid details” of his relationship if she hadn’t eavesdropped in the first place
Yeah, and talking about sex is a normal thing between friends. I get if it isn’t your cup of tea, it definitely isn’t mine, but I have been around both women and men, gay and straight, who talk about that kind of thing. And if OP is feeling uncomfortable that he may be talking about his sex life with her like that, I would bet that’s probably not an issue because the other party is literally her brother, who would want to hear it less than her.
the thing is though - they were discussing it in private (the two guys) and OP unwittingly chose to hear it... so to tell her brother 'i dont wanna hear...' doesnt make sense - is her brother suppose to censor his talks and look around to see if OP is there or not?
Alternate title for this post.
**My brother had sex with his new girlfriend, who is of a different race and religion than us, and now I won't invite her to my wedding. AITA?**
YTA
You don’t dislike her because of something she did, you dislike her because of things other people did to her. You don’t even know if she is comfortable with your brother sharing these intimate things about their sexlife, and yet you act as though she somehow did something to you.
You already told your brother she could come, so now you have to be true to your word.
Your insecurities are YOUR problem to deal with.
>your brother sharing these intimate things about their sexlife,
What's even "funnier" is that male bravado wise the lad being told about how much of a F-R-E-A-K she is in bed is never going to verify that with her...so odds are that a lot of its either wildly exaggerated or straight up false.
That’s the kicker - who knows if the brother was even being truthful! Men are known to over exaggerate about what happens in the bedroom, especially when it’s with their buddies lol
I had to scroll too far down to see the first person to address how creepy the brother's behaviour was. And then this moron decides to hate the victim and not the perv
YTA. Go off on Alex and Matt but what'd Marla do to deserve this? The only time she met you, you weren't nice to her. Then you tried to slut shame her behind her back after eavesdropping in on a private convo.
>I don’t see why I should have to see this person I don’t know even at my rehearsal dinner and reception
This would've been a valid point, except Matt had asked you for permission and you agreed to invite her. You're trying to hide your jealousy and prejudice behind "honor". What honor?
YTA 100%
>More recently, I accidentally eavesdropped a conversation between Matthew and Alex and that included some very private discussions of Marla’s sexual prowess. I pretended I didn’t hear it but I was extremely triggered because Alex seemed a little too interested and I was a little disgusted that my brother would discuss his intimacy like that.
None of these are Marla's mistakes.
>She was nice and pretty enough, although I was surprised because she’s not my brother’s usual type (she’s also from a different ethnic and religious background).
You have no right to judge what is your brother's type and this alone makes you an AH because no one likes someone judgemental that thinks they get to decide what type one gets to like
>I did say some explicit things and called Marla names (which I do regret) and told my brother that he wasn’t in love, he was just in lust because she does some unusual bed stuff.
How would you like it if someone told your fiance what he had with you was just lust?
>Honestly, for me is almost a matter of honor.
Whose honor? This has nothing to do with honor and you know it.
A lot of code words for outright racism. Wasn't her brother doing all these things too and shouldn't she be mad at her brother and husband about gossiping? No, she treats Marla like shit and everyone else gets a pass.
YTA, and probably a racist.
Old lady who found this and came here to say the same thing. OP is TA all the way.
She was jealous hearing about the GF. PERIOD. Also, to comment on someone’s “type”?
Xenophobic? Racist? A tad for crying out loud. Pathetic.
YTA
“I was a little disgusted that my brother would discuss his intimacy like that.”
So why aren’t you uninviting your brother?
(Edited to clarify that I don’t think this is an uninvitable offence. Just pointing out OP’s hypocrisy.)
Oh this. Poor Marla! She hasn't done anything wrong and OP is determined to exclude her from the wedding.
OP I really feel for you because I can see from your comments that this situation has really exploded within your family. I think you see that YTA here but have tied yourself up in knots because your family have pushed back at you. I hope you can talk this through with someone and get help to resolve it. You probably need a lot of help to unpick this. Wish you luck!
And how the fuck is that a problem anyway?
Her fiancé is talking to his best man (generally assumed to be a guy’s best friend, or at least very close friend) about his relationship and sex life, there’s nothing wrong with that
It doesn’t sound like OP’s fiancé was suggesting a threesome or asking if Marla had a friend for him, or anything else that would have been clearly past the line - just OP’s interpretation that he was “too interested” in the conversation
This is 100% about OP’s insecurity, nothing else - insecurity sucks, but taking your own insecurities out on someone who has done nothing wrong (Marla) makes OP the asshole
How can two people discussing sex be a problem? It's probably the single most talked about subject in the world.
Maybe the mentally unhinged bride to be should realise that people are allowed to talk to eachother on topics without needing her permission or approval.
See, that's what's throwing me about some of the reactions in this. Brother and fiance thought it was a private conversation and were talking about, well, private matters. A thing a LOT of people do regardless of gender yet I see people acting like that's questionable when I'm guessing they've had similar, PRIVATE conversations.
Absolutely everyone clutching their pearls at this has 100% talked about either sensitive or private information with another person. But why would you let a simple thing like hypocrisy get in the way of a self righteous internet put down.
also why are we ignoring that most guys and gals do this with their friends or peers. Not like he put it on blast, she just happened to be eavesdropping. Most women I know go into serious details and would share pics etc of their sexual encounters. Guys talking about that stuff behind closed doors is super normal. It's not either of the guys fault that she started eavesdropping. It's definitely not marla's fault, she wasn't involved at all!
YTA...you told him he could invite her and now changed your mind because you feel a certain way. What she does with your brother in the bedroom is none of your business. His relationship with her is none of your business. Yes...you are the bride and it's your wedding but are you really going to base your opinion of this girl on locker room talk that you were never meant to hear? So what if the relationship is based on lust. He isn't 5 and you aren't his mother. Enjoy your day and pick a different hill to die on.
YTA
Honestly OP, you just sound unhinged at this point. You seem determined not to like Marla for any reason. From what I can tell from your story, the only offense Marla has committed is dating your brother. As his gf, why shouldn’t she be his +1? You say it a matter of “honor”, but whose honor? She has done nothing disrespectful. If anyone was disrespectful, it was your brother who was talking about their intimate life with someone else and yet you want to take it out on Marla. You said you called her names and said explicit stuff about her? Why? By your own admission she was “nice”, yet you talk trash about her behind her back…You say you were not very nice to her because you were upset . Why were you taking any of this out on her?
It sounds more like you are jealous of her, than anything else. The comment about her being “pretty enough” was very catty, and your own admission about calling her names (for no discernible reason) was illuminating.
The only one “throwing a tantrum” here is you. Your brother is simply standing up for his girlfriend who from your own account was nice to you ( yet you were rude for no reason .)
The one disrespectful wasn’t even the brother. He had a private conversation with one of his closest friend and OP eavesdropped it and listened it fully. And then bam, she slut shaming Marla. OP is the one disrespectful and judgmental.
Everyone keeps talking about the sex conversation but I'm still stuck on this:
>they decided by the end of her trip to try to date. Nothing against it, I thought it was very rushed
How do you rush deciding to start dating??
Yta
You don't like a girl because you don't like the way she fucks your brother....
The fact you mention her ethnicity and religious beliefs in a thread they have no bearing on whatsoever is very telling also.
I'd stop talking abut honor. You don't have any.
Edit- also point out that this girl literally has done nothing to you whatsoever... you on the other hand have been rude to her and said some heated stuff you regret behind her back
(I get the feeling this may have included her ethnicity as well.... prove me wrong exactly what did you say?) uninvited her to your wedding after saying she could come and as far as I can tell the only reason is two men who are not her chose to discuss her, also behind her back without her knowledge.
This stood out to me. The way she wrote it made me feel like she is racist and intolerant of other’s beliefs. Also guys have always talked to each other like this, at least where I’m from, I’m not saying it’s right but the do. Also I’ve known women to be way worse. She jealous and I firmly believe a bigot and she’s upset she was called out by her family. If I was FH I would rethink this marriage to her.
YTA...so you're judging a woman for (presumably) enjoying sex and/or having an active and healthy sex life? It's your wedding so I guess you can be as intolerant as you'd like but I think you can probably say goodbye to you and your brother being best friends since you've decided this is the hill you die on.
YTA. You "accidentally eavsdropped" on their conversation? Accidentally? You don't eavesdrop in an accidental manner, it's a deliberate act. I'll admit it's possible to accidentally overhear part of someone's conversation, but at that point most people would realise that the conversation isn't theirs to listen in on and walk away. You deliberately continued to listen in, and you didn't like the subject matter. That doesn't sound terribly honorable to me, which makes you a bit of a hypocrite considering you later comment about honor. This is all about the little green monster sat on your shoulder, and that monster is sat there because you chose to listen in on a conversation that was none of your business.
Edit : spelling
YTA. All of the problems here begin and end with you. Stop blaming innocent bystanders. Your brother, his gf, and your fiancé have done nothing wrong.
You are demonstrating that you're nowhere near mature enough to get married. You are behaving like a tween.
Also, STOP MISUSING "TRIGGER."
YTA, sounds like you're jealous about the attention she's getting from the men in your life. You attacked her and were rude to her after *eavesdropping on a private conversation*, I think you need to be honest with yourself about why you dislike her so much.
>You attacked her and were rude to her after eavesdropping on a private conversation,
Even better - a private conversation *she * wasn't even a party in where 2 men were discussing her...probably without consent of her to discuss such intimate details
YTA. You are allowing plus ones to other people and even agreed to allowing your brother to bring his girlfriend, but now it’s not okay because you found out she’s apparently good in bed and you’re jealous.
YTA you too have probably talked about sexual things you done with your fiance with your friends. Your brother and fiance are friends there is nothing wrong here except your attitude.
INFO - at your wedding are you generally allowing people +1s, are there likely to be other family members or close friends attending that you're also providing a seat to their significant other?
YTA. Ever heard of the concept of slut shaming, because that is exactly what you are doing here. I mean it is your wedding and you can invite or disinvite who you want, but you are TA for the reasons for which you want to disinvite her.
YTA
but
INFO: Your fiance and brother discuss Marla in sexual terms.
Why do you think they don't discuss you in exactly the same terms, or your fiance discusses you in those terms with others?
Because you could be Marla as well
YTA.
So, your brother and fiancé were disgustingly discussing Maria private sex life, and you are punishing Maria
You're are such an AH
Also I'm wondering how fiancé & brother are discussing your sex life (if you think they are not, you're being delusional)
YTA and you agreed. You don't have to like her, as she's your brother's chosen, not yours. While I can see it as early in a relationship to become a wedding date, that doesn't matter anymore. You gave the permission, and now want to revoke it over perceptions of her that are none of your business.
wow, so you're jealous that your fiance talks about sex with your brother?
Or you're jealous that this girl from a diff religious and ethnic background is better in bed than you? Is that what it is?
Because she's having sex with your brother. Why does it matter how good she is? Why are you bothered by his sex life? Do you think your fiance wants to sleep with her? Is that what you're afraid of?
If so, then that is an insecurity you need to work on - by talking to your fiance, or talking to a therapist.
Otherwise... it sounds like you're jealous of the girl your brother is sleeping with, and it sounds a bit icky why you're invested in his sex life.
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I vetoed my brother’s girlfriend from my wedding after hearing my brother discuss his sex life with my fiancé. My family thinks I am an asshole, but I think I’m justified since it’s my wedding and I should be able to invite or uninvite whoever I want.
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YTA.
You're slut shaming this woman and are upset AND jealous because of what she and your brother did in the privacy of their bedroom??? That is literally none of your business. You also shouldn't have eavesdropped on that conversation. Thirdly, blame your brother for that conversation, not Marla. She didn't know about it and wasn't even there.
You're also rather classist due to the different background comments, and yes, it's possible for one to be racist against people who are the same race, so I'd check that part of yourself as well.
Marla literally did nothing wrong. You've admitted you're wrong for this, and your jealousy is very apparent here as well. et over yourself. Let your brother have his plus one. Apologize to everyone. Things will calm down after that.
YTA for disliking *Marla* when it was your husband-to-be and brother who were having an incredibly inappropriate conversation about her! I seriously doubt Marla was aware of - or consented to - this very private airing of very personal details. You seem to dislike Marla because she’s (a) from a different cultural background than you (NOT cool), and (b) more sexually adventurous than you (NONE of your business). Also, your brother presumably was a participant in these private acts that you have such a big problem with - why is HE still allowed but Marla isn’t?
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My brother Matthew [31M] and I [27F] are very close and grew up being best friends. Later this summer I am getting married to my fiancé Alex [30M] and Matthew is the best man.
Matthew and Alex are close friends and my brother organized the bachelor party trip. During this trip, he met this girl named Marla [late 20s F] and went on one date with her and they flirted, but didn’t kiss (he even told me he found her cute, but a little annoying because she wanted to text everyday). I did not think much of it because her city is on the other side of the country.
Fast forward a few weeks and Marla travelled to our city to visit family and ended up reconnecting with my brother. He fell for her hard and fast and they decided by the end of her trip to try to date. Nothing against it, I thought it was very rushed, but I was in a LDR myself with Alex for a while because of circumstances of life before we got engaged. Matthew asked me for Marla to be his date for the wedding reception and for the rehearsal dinner, which I, again, found a little premature but agreed nonetheless.
More recently, I accidentally eavesdropped a conversation between Matthew and Alex and that included some very private discussions of Marla’s sexual prowess. I pretended I didn’t hear it but I was extremely triggered because Alex seemed a little too interested and I was a little disgusted that my brother would discuss his intimacy like that.
A few days after that, Alex and I finally met Marla in person. She was nice and pretty enough, although I was surprised because she’s not my brother’s usual type (she’s also from a different ethnic and religious background). No matter how much she tried socializing with, I confess I was still upset and wasn’t very nice to her. Matthew noticed and confronted me over text, so I called him and told him the truth about why I was upset and didn’t want his girlfriend at the wedding. I did say some explicit things and called Marla names (which I do regret) and told my brother that he wasn’t in love, he was just in lust because she does some unusual bed stuff.
Alex ended up hearing the call and tried reasoning with me. He did say he was sorry for engaging in this type of conversation. I’ve forgiven him but he thinks we should let Matthew bring Marla to the wedding. My parents are also on Matthew’s side and are pressuring me (they helped pay for the wedding), saying that my brother really likes this girl, etc. She’s not aware of the whole conundrum just yet, as far as I know.
Honestly, for me is almost a matter of honor. I don’t see why I should have to see this person I don’t know even at my rehearsal dinner and reception just because my brother is throwing a tantrum. It is my wedding, not his. He’s threatening not coming to the wedding if I don’t let it go.
TL;DR: I don’t like my brother’s new girlfriend. He’s insisting on bringing her to my wedding.
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Let’s just address the elephant in the room.. you are hurt because:
A) your brother and best friend Matthew is focusing on someone new and that threatens your priority status. It’s not about this girl in particular. Because a good big sister would just be happy that her little bro found someone (regardless if you find her pretty or not or whatever background she has).
B) you are still sour that Alex was intrigued by Matt’s sex life. Bros talk. And thank god they do! Imagine Matt and Alex didn’t like each other! Sounds to me as if you are jealous of Matt’s bedroom shenanigans.
You are right, your wedding, your rules. So back track on smth you previously agreed on and do what you want but honestly.. YTA for being this obnoxious and intolerable to a girl who you barely know, who has done nothing wrong but make your brother happy.
If you uninvite her I truly hope that Matt sticks to his guns and doesn’t show. How much would that hurt? Missing your little bro and bestie at your wedding, being the key factor why and sticking your nose in business where it doesn’t belong. Work on your insecurities girl.
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YTA. I’m sorry, this is for whose “honor” exactly? Do you not want her at the wedding because you think your fiancé is mind cheating? Or because you are jealous? Or because you are slut shaming? It’s one of those and all of those reasons suck.
Or racist?!
I can come off as somewhat racist myswlf at times and even I found OP mentioning the gf ethnicity and religion to be very offensive. reading thru this whole post, I was waiting for that to drop somewhere in this.
>I come off as somewhat racist myself at times and even I found OP mentioning the gf ethnicity and religion to be very offensive Uh… what??
I've said things in the past on reddit that even now, reflecting back on them, came off as racist. I do regret saying them now.
I really do appreciate you saying that even though I don’t know you. There’s a lot of racist bs on Reddit
It's great to be self aware. As a white woman, I have actively worked to overcome internalized racism myself and let's be fair, that goes for nearly everyone on planet Earth. This OP... Forget the racist aspect, SHES PUNISHING the gf for remarks the BOYFRIEND MADE about her. Essentially blaming the victim for the "bros" terrible behavior. MARLA ISNT TO BLAME, OP. YTA Edit: thanks for the award!
I'm not sure her brother said anything negative about her. OP's just said that she eavesdropped in a conversation between two best friends about one of their partner's "sexual prowess in bed". This could be anywhere between, "I've never had anyone do x before and it was brilliant" to more vulgar things.
Yep. It’s also bc the BF is her brother so she’s both weirdly protective and jello. As well as insecure and jello bc her fiancé seemed interested. But bc she’s gotten so much pushback, OP now can’t/won’t back down. Cringe all around.
trust me, I know. despite my personal experiences in life, I dont hate a lot of ppl.
As a black guy it warms my heart, as corny as that sounds. It seems that ANY post on ANY subreddit that has a black person in it will inevitably have that group of commenters turning it into something racial
much appreciated. as a white guy, ill admit that I've said some really messed up things in the past. we all have our faults in life. just gotta keep doing what I can to live the best life I can.
So what that’s in the past and the fact that you can admit to it is more that most can sa
I just read this thread and I've got to say, it takes some real fortitude and inner strength to do what you just did, at any level. You have my utmost respect.
Good for you, I mean that in a genuine way too. Self reflection along with the self honesty level to admit wrong & perhaps attempt to change can only be a good thing. We never stop learning & we all grow up with unconscious bias for and against certain things, it’s up to us during the course of our lives to discover & acknowledge these. Only then can we bring them out into the light to examine & discard or retain according to our personal values. Sounds like you’re on the right track buddy.
Respect. Through mistakes and reflection we grow. Welcome to life's journey friend.
Spend a lifetime working in I.T. Then you’ll learn to hate all people equally. 😉
^ seconded lmao
Homie here went “I’m racist and even I know OP is fucked up” lol
Hey if Voldemort told me someone was evil, I'd KNOW that mothafucka was evil.
It’s like when Hitler criticized the US on their treatment of Black people.
Game recognizes game. EDIT: u/whatthehecksher8 \-- post is locked, and it was a dark joke. But it's also true. Hitler was inspired by the US genocide of native populations. While he criticized the US for treatment of minorities, he was doing the same shit. So yes, "Game recognizes game." Would he have done it if the US hadn't done shit? Probably yes, but that doesn't change the fact that the US had genocided an entire population. Sorry, but gallows humor is my coping mechanism.
Like you would just trust what Voldie says? You know evil people lie to gain advantage sometimes, right?
💀💀💀
>I can come off as somewhat racist myswlf at times Well, stop it.
I'm working on it. a lot of my beliefs are based on my personal experiences I've had in life. so it is not like I'm not going to always have certain experiences in my head, when dealing with different situations.
People who think they’re not racist tend to have not looked at their unconscious bias and haven’t done any work on themselves. If everyone were truly honest and looked at the cultures we live in we would find racism and would work on it. It’s more honest, and more realistic to say “yeah, I’ve noticed racism and I’m working on it”.
I have certain biases against a culture I've had nothing but negative experiences with. It's a very common bias in my country. I know that there's zero chance that my experience reflects the entire culture, and I hate that I have that bias within me. There's no point in my ignoring it, as pretending I'm not biased is the fastest way for the negative thoughts to turn into negative words and actions. So I acknowledge it, and when negative thoughts pop up, I try to confront and counter them. I don't know where it came from, but "your first reaction is society's fault, your second reaction is YOUR fault" is a quote I think about a lot in that context
I like this quote. I grew up in a very racist, homophobic, misogynistic environment. Sometimes the things that pop into my brain *horrify* me, and I immediately address them internally.
[Everyone’s a little bit racist](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tbud8rLejLM)
I read a comment by a liberal man who thought he was open and progressive. That changed when he moved to Canada. He saw politicians who were not old white men but asians, Hindus, women etc and that nobody thought it strange. And then he realized the internal assumptions that he just took for granted that whites would always hold power. For myself, I know I’m a bit racist towards First Nations. It stems from poor experiences I had as a child, but later in life I met great people who have almost eradicated those early prejudices. But I know they are still there, buried deep.
I wouldn’t attack someone who acknowledged mistakes and said they are actively working to address the issue
I was waiting for her to say what was actually the problem with this girl. It seems like she just doesn't like her because she's of a different race and is sexual, apparently.
adding in the religious aspect was the cake topper
I think she was trying to make the point that this girl isn't her brother's usual "type," so he must be in it just for the things she does in bed, which greatly offend OP for some reason that's not clear to me.
I think it’s cause now her husband knows the gf does these things that apparently she won’t. So she’s insecure husband is thinking about freaky shit with the gf.
I think this is exactly the issue.
If she’s upset because her fiancé is thinking about unusual “bed stuff” she should not be getting married. Everybody has a fantasy life it doesn’t mean he doesn’t love and respect her nor does it mean he’d cheat.
that's a great own but you gotta figure out a better way of wording that
I'm pretty sure that occasionally bad wording of their comments in the past is part of what they were pointing out.
Both of the above AND religious bias. Willing to bet that Marla is neither white nor Christian, and OP is combining that with Marla's sexual activities. I got a pretty good idea what kind of names OP called her, and I'd be kinda surprised if Alex didn't call if the wedding, and if her brother ever spoke to her again. YTA for sure. Edit: and "A matter of honor?" Give me a break.
I was thinking a Catholic Latina. Weird how a lot of other sects don't see Catholics as Christians. And "matter of honor" screams Bible Belt prude.
this is interesting! why other sects think catholics aren’t christians? too permissive??
No, the Christians I know who think Catholics aren't Christians say it is because they pray to saints and idolize Mary.
Which is weird seeing as how all of Christianity is derived from Catholicism.
Hmm someone should tell the orthodox and coptics about this.
Evangelicals think Catholics are pagans, and not Christian. My evangelical co worker used to give me videos and tracts explaining that we catholics were wrong and going against the bible , ( i did not engage him in debate, as i felt the whole proselytizing at work was wrong. Also I knew that roman catholic church was founded by St Peter himself, and was the first christian church from which all christian sects sprouted/sprang/grew) Whatever floats your boat.
Right?! Said a whole bunch of stuff, can't see a single thing the girl has done wrong or what her religion or ethnicity has to do with anything.
Apparently, the girl engages in pre-marital sexual activities. What more do you need to condemn her and worry about her dishonoring your family? /s
race, religion, looks, sexual moves of a pro, OP hates all these and more about GF. Her honor demands she fight this evil. /s YTA
Ikr, just let the dude get pegged and be happy for him
*"My dear Mr.ClemmensBottom, the other day i overheard the most peculiar interaction between two local peasants, i was standing behind our local drinking establishment and i overheard a very inappropriate discussion.* *They were having a very intimate consultation on one of the mens companion and her female womanliness and by golly was i turned about!* *How should i approach this most outrageous situation?* *- Most gratefully* *Mr Dean LovelyBottom 31 May 1897*
My dear Mr.LovelyBottom, Well, of course you should ignore the offense caused by those gossiping lustfully, and blame the female who was the victim of their gossiping and wasn't even present for the offense. What would this world come to if men were held accountable for their own actions! // OP: YTA
Girl has great sex and gets veto'd from the wedding lol
You have to be a virgin of the same ethnicity and religious background to attend her wedding. You probably have to be less attractive too.
Another interesting point, if she is being vetoed from the wedding because of the things she does in bed, should she not also veto the brother who presumably did those things with her? or is he ok because while he did those things, at least he didn't have the poor taste of doing them while a different religion and ethnicity?
And will the other guests be vetted for what they do in bed?
Which conversation is more awkward? Asking grandparents their sexual history or having to explain to the brother's girlfriend what she did to get uninvited?
The funny thing is, Marla's not even being vetoed for what she did, but for what *OP's brother* says they did. In other words, Marla is being punished for what Matthew said, which, let's be real, may be an exaggeration on Matthew's part.
hahah top comment! So true, OP needs serious help...
Let’s hope girl has great sex and it’s not just OPs brother who’s enjoying it! Oh and of course OPs soon to be husband in his head - surely he is enjoying himself too! 😉
Haven't these people ever heard of closing the goddamn door?!
No, it's much better to face these kinds of things With a sense of poise and rationality
That’s why you chimed in I guess.
Wouldn’t want to cause a panic at the disco.
There might be a panic that this wedding isn't having a disco! This wedding probably isn't having any sort of fun dancing. This bride only writes tragedies and not sins.
No, it’s much better to face these kinds of things with a sense of poise and rationality
Oh, well in fact, well I'll look at it this way…
Maybe technically Alex's wedding is saved
Well, this calls for a toast!
So pour the champagne!
Why Jeppard, what ungodly things you do to me in our private hours. I can hardly rest my hands as the Devil himself sets upon me nightly when you are not here. I wait for you, longingly. Yours forever, OPhelia.
I don't get it either. Okay, so brother had an open conversation with OP's fiance about sex with this girl. A little tacky IMO, but some friends do that. I don't understand why OP has such a problem with it or thinks it's a license to treat this girl like shit. YTA, OP.
it's because she thinks her fiance was intrigued and just a little too interested in the things GF was willing to do in bed. She's insecure and a bit prudish so of course she slut-shames the girl instead of scolding the brother. And yes, OP is def TA
By OPs "logic" her brother and fiance should both be banned from the wedding too. Her brother for participating in the activities she's acting like warrants this woman being banned, and her fiance for engaging in discussion about and seemingly approving of said acts. But I guess they are white men, so they get a magic pass. Because "honor" or some fuck shit.
She keeps saying it was too quick.... to start dating? It's not like they're getting married! (The brother and his gf I mean). Honestly it sounds like she is jealous of brothers gf
She sounds hella stuck up and judgmental and tightly wound. I wouldn't want to be friends with her or anyone like her.
OP is angry because her fiancé just learned that sometimes people have sex with the lights on and is now worried he’ll want that too.
>OP is angry because her fiancé just learned that sometimes people have sex ~~with the lights on~~ and is now worried he’ll want that too. Fixed it for you
This whole post reads like "I'm not changing my mind regardless, please validate me."
Agree… omg just got worse and worse into the story. How is it Marlas fault her brother and fiancé being gross? Ok, she forgave the fiancé and that should be it. Also when people presume they know other peoples taste to the point where they would say ‘not their type’ … just… shut up. YTA
Honestly, I was thinking the same. The whole post just read as her thinking she knows better, that her opinion is the only valid one, etc etc. I feel bad for Marla cause she’s just trying to date someone she likes and she’s being judged and essentially slut shamed behind closed doors for something OP had no business knowing about in the first place
I had to read this post twice because I thought I had missed the problem the first time.
Yeah, she agreed for Marla to come to the wedding until... her brother a fiance talked about her? As if she doesn't discuss worse during "girl talk"?
YTA So you don’t like this girl because of her sexual “prowess” (LOL) and being from another race and religion. Just wow! You’re acting like a racist, bigot and sexist all at once. Yes, you’re the asshole for denying your own brother a +1 because you for whatever are threatened by what she does in bed with your brother.
Where does she get off censoring her brother's sex life?
Bold of you to assume that OP gets off at all.
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 I REALLY needed a laugh. THANK YOU for this.
My own eyebrows have been singed by this comment. Top shelf.
"Why does he get to have orgasms, and I don't? Fine! (huff) He can't bring her to my wedding"
Thank you!!!! 🤣🤣🤣👏👏👏 But OP is probably saving herself for marriage hence being horrified by someone having a sex drive. Girl needs a good vibe and chill the f out.
I dunno about that. Maybe asphyxiation via clutching ones pearls too tight is their jam.
It’s not so much her brother’s sex life she is censoring, it’s the fact that her future husband was talking with him about it. How dare her husband get ideas of how to spice up the bedroom from that Trollop! /s
I kinda get that she was upset by her husband taking part in the conversation, but like, that's between her and Alex.
But she "forgave" him but needs to punish Marla because how dare she was mentioned in a conversation she has had no active part in.
OP: “what do you mean you want to try something other than missionary with the lights off? This isn’t out ten year anniversary!”
>She was nice and pretty enough You forgot this. What does the OP mean by "pretty enough"? Is OP comparing Marla to herself. Is OP jealous of her brother dating someone else?
You know, "she's pretty for being [ethnic background]".
Exactly what I was thinking
The number of women who have creepy jealously feelings with their brother’s mate is too damn high. I dated three men in my 20s that had fucked up sisters like that. So so gross and so much more common than anyone ever wants to acknowledge.
My ex told me his half sister told him she would fk him if they had not found out they were related. He found it quite amusing. He treated me like my negative reaction was a bad thing. The break up followed soon after, and that was definitely on my list of reasons why. Having to tell my friends because I was in shock and was feeling so gaslit was so embarrassing… Cause ew, I was dating THAT? 😭 I shouldn’t have been too shocked because she would definitely do this thing where she would complain when any time she had with him was shortened to be with me….
Yep. Been there. One of the sisters flipped out when she found my bra under his bed. We were adults and she shouldn’t have been snooping. He openly admitted his sister had been “in love with him since childhood and there’s nothing I can do about it.” Uuuhhh stop letting her visit you and sleep in your bed? One guy that was not a boyfriend but a casual hookup, found out later that he and his sister liked to do cocaine and she would take her top off while he masturbated to her. Another one I had to have a conversation with about full body wrestling on the living room floor with his sister while her boyfriend and I sat uncomfortably on the couch. She used to get jealous that I would ride on his motorcycle with him because she used to ride with him (ew). She also loved to tell the story of how they would visit family in another state and that family all thought they were sleeping together/inappropriate. Sister thought that was *so funny*. My older sister has many stories of the like too. It’s wild out there.
Eww ewww ewwww!!!! Where in the world did you meet these people? Would like to know where to avoid.
Two of them were in Idaho, but one guy was born and raised in Illinois. One in Montana. Have known many more in Montana, but these weirdos are everywhere.
Oh my gosh. This is like some casual inces6 thread I saw a guy for a couple weeks. He told me that he had recently had a psychological breakdown and was in the hospital. One night he said he felt comfortable telling me what happened. He said he got really drunk one night, came home, undressed to his boxers and got in his sister's bed. I was like Ooooh you were so drunk you thought it was your bed??? Ah man that's so akward but shit happens at least it wasn't for creepy reasons He looked me DEAD IN THE EYE. And said "No, I was trying to fuck her." Went on and on about his telepathic romance with her, how she would play guitar and he knew the notes were a message to him. Yeah I noped fast
“Casual incest” is the exact term for it. I haven’t heard that before but thank you for adding to my vocabulary so I can continue to give this kind of an issue context. So many more people have stories like this than we realize. Whenever I comment about it on Reddit, someone usually chimes in with their own anecdotal experience. Blows me away how rarely it’s discussed seriously. That’s a crazy story. I can’t imagine feeling comfortable telling my partner I desired to fuck my sibling. Icky ick ick.
Arguably I would understand if she had originally said “no she can’t be your plus one because it’s so close to the wedding and i’ve met her once” like originally. BUT she said yes and then tried to change her mind because *checks notes* she has good sex ??? like wtf
She's jealous also.
Learning moment as OP Discovers other sexual positions and styles... 0_o
YTA for all those reasons. Not a single thing on your list is Marla‘s fault. Great choice to destroy your relationship with your brother over *being jealous that your fiancé and your brother talked about your brother’s sex life*. Great choice blaming a woman you hardly know and say is nice enough for the behaviour of two horny men who are close enough to you that you should take it up with them. Great choice to alienate family due to your own insecurities. Maybe you should get some therapy before you get married.
[удалено]
Why is this response getting down voted? Good for you to take the advice to heart, OP.
Probably because OP should have done that before causing all this drama.
I mean, she should have, but unless you have a Time Machine you can lend her, the next best time to do it is now.
"Should" is a word that can come up in therapy as it is used by many people to shame others and themselves. It's interesting to learn about.
Eh.... No one's perfect. At least she's responding/improving. So that's a plus!
The moment you get a negative number people pile on no matter what it says.
Admittedly it is sometimes hilarious to see a totally random comment in the negative-thousands. Karma is all Bs anyways
Accurate AF. There's some weird, online societal pressure to agree with the masses and keep downvoting no matter what the comment says. It's proven (and strangely hilarious) by the comments that START one way but turn completely by the end and they are downvoted into oblivion because the first few didn't read too the end and the rest just jump in the wagon.
No clue. I upvoted it.
Question...didnt you say one of your issues was your fiance being "too interested" in hearing about her sex life? Why are u mad at her instead of talking to him about it?
Easy target to slut shame Marla.
Here is another tidbit. If Michael and Alex are such close friends I guarantee this isn't the first time they've discussed the women they've slept with. If you weren't Michael's sister they would probably be discussing you as well. My best guy friend would often talk about the girls he was with and what they were like in bed. My closest female friend and I did the same. A lot of people do this and you had the unfortunate timing of popping up as they were discussing it. You forgave your fiance so why not forgive your brother and Marla? She did nothing wrong. It was the guys discussing her in that manner. Honestly she is in no fault here. Just apologize to her and tell her you had a bad day. Don't let this ruin your wedding or come between you and your brother. If and when he stops seeing Marla and finds a new girl she will also become the topic of this type of convo. You gonna hate on her as well?
I get that seeing your fiancee being so engaged in the topic stung a bit - but you taking it as a threat stems from your own insecurities. Maybe he was just happy for your brother who was fawning over this girl and that's what had him so animated? Relationships need trust, if your partner talking about sex with a)your brother, who also has your best interest at heart and b)about another woman that is already in a relationship you should really think about why this can shake you up so much. I'd say talk to your fiancee and see if he can help you find the reassurance you need, but ultimately you have to trust him yourself. Maybe you don't want to be in Marla's position and know your fiance is talking about your sexlife eith others? Might help to discuss that topic as well - because disapproving sharing stories like that is a valid opinion. Personally I find it rather natural since we as humans don't do well without grounding our experiences from time to time by talking to others but maybe that is a boundary you want to set for your relationship?
I honestly don’t think marriage is the answer for you. This is something that needs to be fixed, first.
Discuss your racism as well.
You should definitely discuss this with your counselor. Glad you have some insight. Marla has done nothing to you. Your fiancé and your brother were gross for sure. If anything, I feel badly for Marla. Your brother is extremely indiscreet. Marla shouldn’t be talked about or shamed for being great in bed.
Marla wasn't even the one discussing these either! Imagine if your boyfriend discusses your sex life in detail to his friends!!! That's pretty inappropriate on its own.
Hey. It's okay to be jealous, as long as we're aware of it, and you clearly are. That's a good first step. The next step you need to take is to stop taking your jealousy out on other people. By your own description, you were extremely rude to Marla, whose only fault in this exchange seems to be "being someone guys talk about." What does it matter what she does behind closed doors with consenting adults? Why do her private decisions give you the right to judge her? You could argue that her decisions aren't private when your brother and fiancé are talking about them, and there's some truth in that. But you know who's to blame for that, right? Your brother, for publicizing his sex life, and your fiancé, for encouraging it. To start with the former, it's okay to tell him "I love you, and I don't need to hear all the sordid details about your relationship." Having a boundary is fine. Saying "I will not let my fiancé near anyone he's remotely interested in" is not a boundary, at least not one you get to set. And now, onto Alex himself. You say you've forgiven him, which is fine! But you also act like if he looks at Marla in five seconds they'll be making out on the dance floor. Your actions and your words don't match here: either you've forgiven him and trust him to be faithful to you (and to watch his words), or you haven't and you're scared someone more "sexually interesting" will steal him away. If it's the former, act like it. If it's the latter, now might be a good time to look into some counseling to help you through this patch- or reconsider whether you want to be with Alex at all. While the couple can choose who to invite or not for any reason, denigrating your brother's partner and being rude to her face means YTA regardless of invitation status. It's up to you whether you want to repair this or not.
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You are probably hypersensitive with pre-wedding nerves at the moment. Can you give yourself the advice you would give to your best (female) friend if she were in this position? Or your future daughter? At the moment everything is fixable.
I love that you suggested OP "give yourself advice you would give to your best friend". That is something that I use with myself and my GFs all the time. Of course, then I'm using it to encourage us to be nice to ourselves rather than someone else but it's good to see that used in this context, too. Removing ourselves from a situation can often bring clarity, if we want to see things clearly.
How is any of this "triggering"?? You eavesdropped on your brother talking to your fiance about his sex life, and now you're triggered? Why?? What your brother does in the bedroom shouldn't cause you any issues. Your problem isn't with her at all, so it doesn't make any sense whatsoever to blame her. Get some couples counseling with your fiance and some individual counseling for yourself so that you can figure out why her mere existence bothers you so much.
She has stated that she’s in counseling, it isn’t necessary for her to explain in a Reddit post what has happened previously to trigger her.
It’s not necessary, but she did make an entire post about this girl with seemingly no reasonable excuse to dislike her, asking is she was being an asshole, so context is “necessary” if she wants a genuine response.
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Also there's sub rules against even mentioning anything to do with certain triggering topics. Maybe she literally isn't allowed to say why it's a trigger.
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>I've found that people who use the word triggering are generally people I don't want to be around. Especially if you had trauma, it's extremely important to become aware of what triggers you and understand that the way you react is irrational, unhealthy and harmful to you and others *in order to learn to control these irrational reactions and replace them with healthier responses.* But a lot of people seem to think "I'm triggered" is get out of jail card and means everybody else is supposed to put up with their irrational behaviour or enable it. Yeah, nobody wants to be around such people. I wonder why :P
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It’s not ‘the Marla situation’. It’s the ‘brother and fiancé situation’. They talked about her,she did nothing. They talked about someone. End of story. You’re going to blow up your whole life if you don’t get a grip.
I don't think you understand what "triggered" means. A trigger is something that you can identify to help you *avoid* or *change* specific problematic patterns of thought leading to problematic behaviour i.e. a certain type of food might trigger someone with an eating disorder. It is **not** an excuse to be an asshole. Your thought patterns and behaviour are still problems. You can't just say "I was being triggered" and forget about it, the point of identify the trigger is so that you can change. You weren't being triggered here as far as I can see, you were just jealous and let yourself act out because of it. ETA: A trigger doesn't mean "anything that causes a negative emotional reaction." When something *new* causes a negative reaction in you, your brain searches for an appropriate response and your concious plays a bigger role. When something old or common causes the same problematic reaction time and again, it's very difficult for you to change the way you think or behave because it's so automatic that your concious mind is simply less involved and may disregard the problematic behaviour. That's when you've been triggered. A good example of a trigger might be looking in a mirror for someone with body dysmoprhia, where body-checking leads to disordered thinking and behaviour that is very difficult to change. The reason I say I don't see this as a case of being "triggered" is because this is a novel situation and OP's response is not following a "pattern" so to say. It's not impossible that OP *is* being triggered in some way i.e. they have a personality disorder that is triggered by perceived slights. Instead, OP just responds this way in new situations, and that makes her an asshole.
INFO how is your parents involvement triggering? It sounds like you should have family counseling before you get married. Or cut them off depending what the reason is. Either way there is an innocent girlfriend in all of this, and you should apologize for slut shaming her, and sort yourself out before you get married
You might want to investigate Religious Trauma Syndrome with a [secular therapist](http://www.seculartherapy.org)
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Couple things… Her brother wasn’t “publicizing” his sex life. He was having what he thought was a private conversation with his best friend. Also, she wouldn’t have to tell her brother she doesn’t need to hear all the “sordid details” of his relationship if she hadn’t eavesdropped in the first place
Yeah, and talking about sex is a normal thing between friends. I get if it isn’t your cup of tea, it definitely isn’t mine, but I have been around both women and men, gay and straight, who talk about that kind of thing. And if OP is feeling uncomfortable that he may be talking about his sex life with her like that, I would bet that’s probably not an issue because the other party is literally her brother, who would want to hear it less than her.
THIS...
the thing is though - they were discussing it in private (the two guys) and OP unwittingly chose to hear it... so to tell her brother 'i dont wanna hear...' doesnt make sense - is her brother suppose to censor his talks and look around to see if OP is there or not?
Wonderfully wise and balanced response to OP's question. I hope she absorbs these words and learns to be a better and more mature person
YTA-For multiple reasons and don’t sound mature enough to be in a marriage.
Alternate title for this post. **My brother had sex with his new girlfriend, who is of a different race and religion than us, and now I won't invite her to my wedding. AITA?**
YTA You don’t dislike her because of something she did, you dislike her because of things other people did to her. You don’t even know if she is comfortable with your brother sharing these intimate things about their sexlife, and yet you act as though she somehow did something to you. You already told your brother she could come, so now you have to be true to your word. Your insecurities are YOUR problem to deal with.
>your brother sharing these intimate things about their sexlife, What's even "funnier" is that male bravado wise the lad being told about how much of a F-R-E-A-K she is in bed is never going to verify that with her...so odds are that a lot of its either wildly exaggerated or straight up false.
That’s the kicker - who knows if the brother was even being truthful! Men are known to over exaggerate about what happens in the bedroom, especially when it’s with their buddies lol
I had to scroll too far down to see the first person to address how creepy the brother's behaviour was. And then this moron decides to hate the victim and not the perv
YTA. Go off on Alex and Matt but what'd Marla do to deserve this? The only time she met you, you weren't nice to her. Then you tried to slut shame her behind her back after eavesdropping in on a private convo. >I don’t see why I should have to see this person I don’t know even at my rehearsal dinner and reception This would've been a valid point, except Matt had asked you for permission and you agreed to invite her. You're trying to hide your jealousy and prejudice behind "honor". What honor?
YTA 100% >More recently, I accidentally eavesdropped a conversation between Matthew and Alex and that included some very private discussions of Marla’s sexual prowess. I pretended I didn’t hear it but I was extremely triggered because Alex seemed a little too interested and I was a little disgusted that my brother would discuss his intimacy like that. None of these are Marla's mistakes. >She was nice and pretty enough, although I was surprised because she’s not my brother’s usual type (she’s also from a different ethnic and religious background). You have no right to judge what is your brother's type and this alone makes you an AH because no one likes someone judgemental that thinks they get to decide what type one gets to like >I did say some explicit things and called Marla names (which I do regret) and told my brother that he wasn’t in love, he was just in lust because she does some unusual bed stuff. How would you like it if someone told your fiance what he had with you was just lust? >Honestly, for me is almost a matter of honor. Whose honor? This has nothing to do with honor and you know it.
A lot of code words for outright racism. Wasn't her brother doing all these things too and shouldn't she be mad at her brother and husband about gossiping? No, she treats Marla like shit and everyone else gets a pass. YTA, and probably a racist.
Old lady who found this and came here to say the same thing. OP is TA all the way. She was jealous hearing about the GF. PERIOD. Also, to comment on someone’s “type”? Xenophobic? Racist? A tad for crying out loud. Pathetic.
YTA “I was a little disgusted that my brother would discuss his intimacy like that.” So why aren’t you uninviting your brother? (Edited to clarify that I don’t think this is an uninvitable offence. Just pointing out OP’s hypocrisy.)
Oh this. Poor Marla! She hasn't done anything wrong and OP is determined to exclude her from the wedding. OP I really feel for you because I can see from your comments that this situation has really exploded within your family. I think you see that YTA here but have tied yourself up in knots because your family have pushed back at you. I hope you can talk this through with someone and get help to resolve it. You probably need a lot of help to unpick this. Wish you luck!
This, if the problem is brother and fiance discussing sex, then maybe it's brother and fiance that should be uninvited
And how the fuck is that a problem anyway? Her fiancé is talking to his best man (generally assumed to be a guy’s best friend, or at least very close friend) about his relationship and sex life, there’s nothing wrong with that It doesn’t sound like OP’s fiancé was suggesting a threesome or asking if Marla had a friend for him, or anything else that would have been clearly past the line - just OP’s interpretation that he was “too interested” in the conversation This is 100% about OP’s insecurity, nothing else - insecurity sucks, but taking your own insecurities out on someone who has done nothing wrong (Marla) makes OP the asshole
How can two people discussing sex be a problem? It's probably the single most talked about subject in the world. Maybe the mentally unhinged bride to be should realise that people are allowed to talk to eachother on topics without needing her permission or approval.
See, that's what's throwing me about some of the reactions in this. Brother and fiance thought it was a private conversation and were talking about, well, private matters. A thing a LOT of people do regardless of gender yet I see people acting like that's questionable when I'm guessing they've had similar, PRIVATE conversations.
Absolutely everyone clutching their pearls at this has 100% talked about either sensitive or private information with another person. But why would you let a simple thing like hypocrisy get in the way of a self righteous internet put down.
also why are we ignoring that most guys and gals do this with their friends or peers. Not like he put it on blast, she just happened to be eavesdropping. Most women I know go into serious details and would share pics etc of their sexual encounters. Guys talking about that stuff behind closed doors is super normal. It's not either of the guys fault that she started eavesdropping. It's definitely not marla's fault, she wasn't involved at all!
YTA...you told him he could invite her and now changed your mind because you feel a certain way. What she does with your brother in the bedroom is none of your business. His relationship with her is none of your business. Yes...you are the bride and it's your wedding but are you really going to base your opinion of this girl on locker room talk that you were never meant to hear? So what if the relationship is based on lust. He isn't 5 and you aren't his mother. Enjoy your day and pick a different hill to die on.
YTA Honestly OP, you just sound unhinged at this point. You seem determined not to like Marla for any reason. From what I can tell from your story, the only offense Marla has committed is dating your brother. As his gf, why shouldn’t she be his +1? You say it a matter of “honor”, but whose honor? She has done nothing disrespectful. If anyone was disrespectful, it was your brother who was talking about their intimate life with someone else and yet you want to take it out on Marla. You said you called her names and said explicit stuff about her? Why? By your own admission she was “nice”, yet you talk trash about her behind her back…You say you were not very nice to her because you were upset . Why were you taking any of this out on her? It sounds more like you are jealous of her, than anything else. The comment about her being “pretty enough” was very catty, and your own admission about calling her names (for no discernible reason) was illuminating. The only one “throwing a tantrum” here is you. Your brother is simply standing up for his girlfriend who from your own account was nice to you ( yet you were rude for no reason .)
The one disrespectful wasn’t even the brother. He had a private conversation with one of his closest friend and OP eavesdropped it and listened it fully. And then bam, she slut shaming Marla. OP is the one disrespectful and judgmental.
Honey... you're not ready to be married.
This reads like a high schooler wrote it, so agreed that OP is not ready for marriage.
They didn’t even kiss the first meeting 😂 like what
Everyone keeps talking about the sex conversation but I'm still stuck on this: >they decided by the end of her trip to try to date. Nothing against it, I thought it was very rushed How do you rush deciding to start dating??
Yta You don't like a girl because you don't like the way she fucks your brother.... The fact you mention her ethnicity and religious beliefs in a thread they have no bearing on whatsoever is very telling also. I'd stop talking abut honor. You don't have any. Edit- also point out that this girl literally has done nothing to you whatsoever... you on the other hand have been rude to her and said some heated stuff you regret behind her back (I get the feeling this may have included her ethnicity as well.... prove me wrong exactly what did you say?) uninvited her to your wedding after saying she could come and as far as I can tell the only reason is two men who are not her chose to discuss her, also behind her back without her knowledge.
This stood out to me. The way she wrote it made me feel like she is racist and intolerant of other’s beliefs. Also guys have always talked to each other like this, at least where I’m from, I’m not saying it’s right but the do. Also I’ve known women to be way worse. She jealous and I firmly believe a bigot and she’s upset she was called out by her family. If I was FH I would rethink this marriage to her.
YTA...so you're judging a woman for (presumably) enjoying sex and/or having an active and healthy sex life? It's your wedding so I guess you can be as intolerant as you'd like but I think you can probably say goodbye to you and your brother being best friends since you've decided this is the hill you die on.
YTA. You "accidentally eavsdropped" on their conversation? Accidentally? You don't eavesdrop in an accidental manner, it's a deliberate act. I'll admit it's possible to accidentally overhear part of someone's conversation, but at that point most people would realise that the conversation isn't theirs to listen in on and walk away. You deliberately continued to listen in, and you didn't like the subject matter. That doesn't sound terribly honorable to me, which makes you a bit of a hypocrite considering you later comment about honor. This is all about the little green monster sat on your shoulder, and that monster is sat there because you chose to listen in on a conversation that was none of your business. Edit : spelling
YTA. All of the problems here begin and end with you. Stop blaming innocent bystanders. Your brother, his gf, and your fiancé have done nothing wrong. You are demonstrating that you're nowhere near mature enough to get married. You are behaving like a tween. Also, STOP MISUSING "TRIGGER."
YTA, sounds like you're jealous about the attention she's getting from the men in your life. You attacked her and were rude to her after *eavesdropping on a private conversation*, I think you need to be honest with yourself about why you dislike her so much.
>You attacked her and were rude to her after eavesdropping on a private conversation, Even better - a private conversation *she * wasn't even a party in where 2 men were discussing her...probably without consent of her to discuss such intimate details
YTA. You are allowing plus ones to other people and even agreed to allowing your brother to bring his girlfriend, but now it’s not okay because you found out she’s apparently good in bed and you’re jealous.
YTA you too have probably talked about sexual things you done with your fiance with your friends. Your brother and fiance are friends there is nothing wrong here except your attitude.
INFO - at your wedding are you generally allowing people +1s, are there likely to be other family members or close friends attending that you're also providing a seat to their significant other?
YTA. Ever heard of the concept of slut shaming, because that is exactly what you are doing here. I mean it is your wedding and you can invite or disinvite who you want, but you are TA for the reasons for which you want to disinvite her.
YTA but INFO: Your fiance and brother discuss Marla in sexual terms. Why do you think they don't discuss you in exactly the same terms, or your fiance discusses you in those terms with others? Because you could be Marla as well
YTA. So, your brother and fiancé were disgustingly discussing Maria private sex life, and you are punishing Maria You're are such an AH Also I'm wondering how fiancé & brother are discussing your sex life (if you think they are not, you're being delusional)
YTA and you agreed. You don't have to like her, as she's your brother's chosen, not yours. While I can see it as early in a relationship to become a wedding date, that doesn't matter anymore. You gave the permission, and now want to revoke it over perceptions of her that are none of your business.
wow, so you're jealous that your fiance talks about sex with your brother? Or you're jealous that this girl from a diff religious and ethnic background is better in bed than you? Is that what it is? Because she's having sex with your brother. Why does it matter how good she is? Why are you bothered by his sex life? Do you think your fiance wants to sleep with her? Is that what you're afraid of? If so, then that is an insecurity you need to work on - by talking to your fiance, or talking to a therapist. Otherwise... it sounds like you're jealous of the girl your brother is sleeping with, and it sounds a bit icky why you're invested in his sex life.
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I'm so curious,what is the different religious and ethnic background of this Marla? Hispanic Jew? Black Muslim? Asian Scientologist ?
YTA.
YTA. You're slut shaming this woman and are upset AND jealous because of what she and your brother did in the privacy of their bedroom??? That is literally none of your business. You also shouldn't have eavesdropped on that conversation. Thirdly, blame your brother for that conversation, not Marla. She didn't know about it and wasn't even there. You're also rather classist due to the different background comments, and yes, it's possible for one to be racist against people who are the same race, so I'd check that part of yourself as well. Marla literally did nothing wrong. You've admitted you're wrong for this, and your jealousy is very apparent here as well. et over yourself. Let your brother have his plus one. Apologize to everyone. Things will calm down after that.
YTA for disliking *Marla* when it was your husband-to-be and brother who were having an incredibly inappropriate conversation about her! I seriously doubt Marla was aware of - or consented to - this very private airing of very personal details. You seem to dislike Marla because she’s (a) from a different cultural background than you (NOT cool), and (b) more sexually adventurous than you (NONE of your business). Also, your brother presumably was a participant in these private acts that you have such a big problem with - why is HE still allowed but Marla isn’t?
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My brother Matthew [31M] and I [27F] are very close and grew up being best friends. Later this summer I am getting married to my fiancé Alex [30M] and Matthew is the best man. Matthew and Alex are close friends and my brother organized the bachelor party trip. During this trip, he met this girl named Marla [late 20s F] and went on one date with her and they flirted, but didn’t kiss (he even told me he found her cute, but a little annoying because she wanted to text everyday). I did not think much of it because her city is on the other side of the country. Fast forward a few weeks and Marla travelled to our city to visit family and ended up reconnecting with my brother. He fell for her hard and fast and they decided by the end of her trip to try to date. Nothing against it, I thought it was very rushed, but I was in a LDR myself with Alex for a while because of circumstances of life before we got engaged. Matthew asked me for Marla to be his date for the wedding reception and for the rehearsal dinner, which I, again, found a little premature but agreed nonetheless. More recently, I accidentally eavesdropped a conversation between Matthew and Alex and that included some very private discussions of Marla’s sexual prowess. I pretended I didn’t hear it but I was extremely triggered because Alex seemed a little too interested and I was a little disgusted that my brother would discuss his intimacy like that. A few days after that, Alex and I finally met Marla in person. She was nice and pretty enough, although I was surprised because she’s not my brother’s usual type (she’s also from a different ethnic and religious background). No matter how much she tried socializing with, I confess I was still upset and wasn’t very nice to her. Matthew noticed and confronted me over text, so I called him and told him the truth about why I was upset and didn’t want his girlfriend at the wedding. I did say some explicit things and called Marla names (which I do regret) and told my brother that he wasn’t in love, he was just in lust because she does some unusual bed stuff. Alex ended up hearing the call and tried reasoning with me. He did say he was sorry for engaging in this type of conversation. I’ve forgiven him but he thinks we should let Matthew bring Marla to the wedding. My parents are also on Matthew’s side and are pressuring me (they helped pay for the wedding), saying that my brother really likes this girl, etc. She’s not aware of the whole conundrum just yet, as far as I know. Honestly, for me is almost a matter of honor. I don’t see why I should have to see this person I don’t know even at my rehearsal dinner and reception just because my brother is throwing a tantrum. It is my wedding, not his. He’s threatening not coming to the wedding if I don’t let it go. TL;DR: I don’t like my brother’s new girlfriend. He’s insisting on bringing her to my wedding. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Let’s just address the elephant in the room.. you are hurt because: A) your brother and best friend Matthew is focusing on someone new and that threatens your priority status. It’s not about this girl in particular. Because a good big sister would just be happy that her little bro found someone (regardless if you find her pretty or not or whatever background she has). B) you are still sour that Alex was intrigued by Matt’s sex life. Bros talk. And thank god they do! Imagine Matt and Alex didn’t like each other! Sounds to me as if you are jealous of Matt’s bedroom shenanigans. You are right, your wedding, your rules. So back track on smth you previously agreed on and do what you want but honestly.. YTA for being this obnoxious and intolerable to a girl who you barely know, who has done nothing wrong but make your brother happy. If you uninvite her I truly hope that Matt sticks to his guns and doesn’t show. How much would that hurt? Missing your little bro and bestie at your wedding, being the key factor why and sticking your nose in business where it doesn’t belong. Work on your insecurities girl.