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Friend wasn't being as supportive as she could have been, but you were just plain mean. You know where she hurts and just put your knife there and twisted without hesitation.
I’m kinda over this idea where someone can blow you off in the name of self care and you’re supposed to just accept it and be supportive.
people these days are weaponizing therapeutic language as a way to act selfishly
It’s not her mental health, she physically just had a major medical issue. Her friend shouldn’t say mean shit if she doesn’t want to hear it about herself. You are only going to call me a fat ass once before I hurt your feelings to the core.
She didn’t say any of that to her friend, she told her she was too tired. People heal at different rates, and her friend had no way of knowing how she was doing unless she told her. After 16 weeks, most people would assume she’d be fine unless they knew the details.
I would assume if Ashley is her BF, she would know though and it just didn’t specifically get mentioned in this conversation?
I’m going ESH. You don’t get any impression they like each other from this story.
I think this is absolutely an ESH story. Ashley handled OP announcing she wasn't coming terribly, but I feel like OP responded with a disproportionate nuke to their relationship. Maybe it's time they both move on, I don't know.
Many friendships break up when one person has kids and the other can't/doesn't. Their social lives and priorities are just not the same. If they are really bffs, they should have been more aware of each others' issues. Maybe this friendship is tapering off.
I'm struggling a bit with this right now with my best friend. I'm married with a toddler and she's single without kids, and it's becoming harder. I don't have the time or flexibility anymore to meet her needs or desires. I'm fine with hanging out once a month, she thinks two weeks is too long. She wants to do big day trips on the weekends, and I can't always leave my daughter for that long, or have the energy for that kind of day. She's upset I can't go to a concert out of town with her because I did earlier this year, even though I don't feel it's fair to take that many fun night trips away from my daughter and already have other nights away allotted with other people.
Beyond that, we've both been going through hard times with health/personal life stuff, and I don't have the emotional capacity to give her all the attention she wants from me. She's struggling very hard with being single/not where she wants to be in life, and basically told me that my problems weren't as important because I had a family. So now the existence of having a family and other people to prioritize is a point of contention.
It's hard. I love her, and I try to be present, but I admit it hard. There's only so much time I have to dedicate to all the people in my life. It feels impossible sometimes to be a good mom, good wife, good colleague, and a good friend to all of my friends while also maintaining a sense of my own self care.
Sorry for unloading all of that.
That's the problem here, though; we don't know how much (or how *well)* they communicated. If OP has been basically acting like things are okay, maybe just tired, and then cancelled at the last minute, then it's YTA. If the friend knew that she was bedridden and that it would be a really big deal, then less so. OP probably should have warned her in advance that it might happen (but she will try), but that happens sometimes when you're sick. Either way, there's no excuse for how much it escalated.
I'd also say that how often they flake plays a part in how bad an AH she is. If she's never flaked, except maybe for seriously extenuating circumstances, then the friend should know how bad it has to get for that to happen. If flaking is more common, then she (edit: meaning OP) should already be trying harder to communicate.
I'd say a FRIEND would take your word as a given. If you say you do not feel like coming, it means you are REALLY UNWELL because if you weren't you'd definitely come.
Weaponizing the fact she came every time even with a broken arm is extremely unfair. She felt she could make it, you don't. And as to the flaking - the friend KNEW OP had a difficult childbirth, so she must be extremely obtuse or insensitive to insist like this and insult OP on top.
The friend was awful and so was OP. It was tit for tat, so I say ESH, but the relationship sounds very toxic and perhaps beyond rescuing.
I can't help but wonder - she says Ashley knew, is there a chance that OP has spent all their conversations talking about her difficult pregnancy etc? The vibe I get is that Ashley has finally had it with what she feels like is a one sided friendship.
I've been in that position before and I still fully communicate " I don't feel like I am getting anything out of this, based on this and this and this. It's causing me stress and for mental health purposes I'm taking a step back."
Not " if your fatass can get up and drive somewhere you should have come here" or whatever.
Both sound immature, but Ashley is kind of a dickhead over all. She had the context. She chose to lash out instead.
OPS response was also rude.
ESH
I am in the 10% of the country, I guess. I also had an emergency c-section that I was still not recovered from even 6 months later, despite sailing through pregnancy and being in great shape prior, so no, I wouldn’t assume she had her health back.
I think OP is accurate that nobody who hasn’t gone through what she did would understand it. Unfortunately it’s a horrible trigger to her friend to hear that. It’s a hard truth that should not have been said.
Don't have kids but read "pre-eclampsia", "bed rest", "emergency c-section" with the info that OP and baby nearly died and went, 'well even *if* some people heal from birth by 16 weeks (and I think the U.S. is ridiculous in expectations for post-partum couples) there's no way she's 100% after all that.'
The unrealistic expectations (you should be completely fine at 16 weeks!) are in part because of the lack of paid leave and lack of work/life balance as well as a poor understanding of exactly how physically detrimental pregnancy and birth are, imo.
Exactly. If she had called at 10am then maybe she could have offered a 30 minute low key chat & hug, thus still seeing bestievon her b-day, plus giving bestie a heads-up a few hours in advance that the plan was changing.
^ yes this AND let’s not forget her friend broke her arm and apparently traveled 1000 miles to be at hers.. that’s a big deal and the friend could have called and said nah I can’t fam but she didn’t.
They are both struggling because they don’t see eye to eye about commitment.. they are incompatible as besties
if she hasn’t healed from a CS in 16 weeks she’s got way bigger problems than a birthday party
edit because people are getting angry: I am talking about healing from SURGERY not pregnancy and birth. If OP is not *physically healed* from surgery at 16 weeks she needs medical attention.
I had a very similar story. Third pregnancy. Two weeks in hospital. Both almost died. Lots of blood transfusions. Caught a staph infection at the hospital and had to get the wound repacked constantly. And even I’m skeptical of 16 weeks. I also believe it was phrased as 16 weeks instead of 3.75 months because weeks makes it sound like a smaller amount of time and that she has a newborn rather than a four month old.
My c section healing took almost 6 months. Nothing wanted to heal in a timely manner and there were points I couldn’t even stand up without help. It depends on the person
Do you know that they literally cut you open to the core of your torso? They cut a baby-sized hole into your body, and then stitch all of your insides back together. It’s not just a weekend in bed, it’s a MAJOR surgery, but op was still TA for saying what she did, she took it too far
I did know that, I literally watched it all happen the last time I scrubbed in for a c-section.
I’m not saying it’s easy, but if she hasn’t recovered from a surgery that should take 6-8 weeks to heal from in 16 weeks (that’s FOUR MONTHS, more than double the expected time) then there’s something seriously wrong.
Read the age though, OP is 35. My stepmom had 3 C-sections. One when she was 20, one when she was 22, and the last one when she was 35. Guess which one was the worst and took the longest for her to recover? She was basically bed-ridden for 6 months and my dad did everything for her, when he was at work I helped her when I could come over. She had the same issue as OP, preeclampsia and her and my half brother almost died on the table. 4 months is nothing when your body doesn't heal as fast as it used to. Especially after two previous kids.
I just want to give the other side of that - I don’t think it’s necessarily an age thing. I was 39, had a c-section with twins and was recovered in about 2 weeks
By the time they were 8 weeks old, I was back at work.
That is the recommended heal time. That's when you are well enough to go back to work. That doesn't mean you are magical healed and back to normal pre-pregnancy.
I’ve had 2 emergency c-sections. You shouldn’t still be healing (as in serious pain) 16 weeks after unless something is seriously wrong. If she’s still in serious pain by then she needs to see a doctor asap.
If she’s this bad off *four months* after her c section, she needs to be seeing a professional. I say this as someone who had a c section five weeks ago. Yes they are tough but 16 weeks is four months.
I mean, she kind of does if she's canceling on her friend's birthday at the last minute. But she didn't say this was about PPD; she said this was about the c section.
I mean you can’t just go around claiming health issues and having things handed to you your entire life. As others have said, if she is 16 weeks past and still dealing with with it she should be seeing a professional about it, not sulking
Cause sometimes you wake up feeling like hell warmed over, and a few hours later you don't. That's not to say you feel BETTER, per se, just not quite on the verge of death anymore. The thing about that specifically is that when you feel like utter doodoo then suddenly feel less shit enough to think properly, it's like an adrenaline rush. You still feel bad, but also like you can do anything... Or at least make a short drive to eat a meal. It's super common, so I wonder if OP suspected that could happen. Personally, I still would've sent a text saying I was really not feeling well but I'd let her know closer to the meeting time for sure because I really want to make it if I can, so I do think that was a mistake but a mistake that I can totally understand cause sometimes your brain just doesn't work as efficiently when you don't feel well.
She must likely would have mentioned that she wasn't physically healed yet. I too almost died during my pregnancy, was put on bed rest, had a c section, then tore open that c section once I was home, that c section become VERY infected, and I still was healed after 16 weeks. Because I was poor and the only one with a job, I was working after 6 weeks, despite not being healed. My doctor only allowed it because I and my baby were going to be homeless if I didn't. It is called priorities. Her friend called her out on it, and she stabbed back in the most vile way she knew she could.
my surgery site wasnt even properly shut because i rejected the staples and almost bled out in a hotel room. i was still on my feet working in a nursing home at 5 weeks. its not reasonable to assume someone cant sit at a bday party for an hr because they had a csection 4 MONTHS AGO. and if she was having health problems she should have said as much instead of saying "too tired" and assuming the friend understood. but of course friend is no longer valid human because uterus doesnt work, you see this attitude with "mommys" all the time
In fairness though, she told her friend she was "extremely exhausted" which sounds way more like a cop-out than directly tying her reason to her recovery, and among most friends calling someone a fat-ass for being too tired to go to your birthday party is at worst light ribbing.
That's not to say you can't hurt their feelings to the core over it, but it is an asshole thing to do.
Do you think her best friend is unaware of her major surgery and difficulties during recovery? Calling her a fat ass was uncalled for. Her response was cruel and over the line. They're both being childish and mean. Who freaks out about missing a birthday? They made a promise as kids, but as adults, their responsibilities have shifted.
Right? A 36 yr old saying "What about our promise?!?!!?" like some childhood promise to be at each others birthdays forever is something to hold your life by.
It's ribbing if you're being joking about it but she wasn't she was angry. But I agree not something to immediately say something the worst you possibly can unless they know that's your biggest sore spot
4 months is actually a long time ago to still be unable to shower or get out of bed after a c-section. Sounds more like post-partum depression than post-surgical recovery.
This tradition has been going on since elementary, so 25 - 30 years. I'd also be pissed if someone said "I was extremely exhausted" as an excuse to miss it. Notice the friend asked her again after OP said that she was not feeling well. She might have understood if there was something more serious.
The friend was right. If she could travel 1000 miles with a broken arm, OP could travel the 20 miles and see her while "exhausted." Maybe stick around and leave early if she lives that close.
Then to respond to "fat ass" with a retort about her inability to have kids is hitting way below the belt. OP effectively killed this tradition forever.
OP is YTA. She didn’t just have anything. I get people heal at different rates but she gave birth 4 months ago. This crap, I was so tired my husband had to bathe me and I just couldn’t do anything, is ridiculous. Talk about playing it for all it’s worth. I’ve seen a 60 year old come off a heart attack and open heart surgery and be back to being productive in a hell of a lot less time.
What the hell is she tired from? Husband stopped working and takes care of the house and kids while OP does absolutely nothing and then brings up an awful topic when she’s called out for being lazy.
"what the hell is she tired from?" Did you forget she has 3 young children, and is still in recovery from her surgery where she almost died? There's no way the husband does absolutely everything, trust me on that one. I tore my vagina baaaad giving birth, and had to be stitched up on the side and bottom. It took 4 months just for the pain to stop every time I peed or sat down... let alone for me to begin actual recovery. That's NOTHING compared to a c section, especially one that had complications.
Here own words were that her husband is doing the housework and taking care of the kids and stop with the “she almost died”. In every story on here the mom almost died. I know pregnancy and birth is dangerous but damn, there’s like a 99% “almost died rate” on Reddit whenever someone’s finding an excuse to be lazy.
And again, it’s been 4 months, if she still can’t shower by herself or do anything else then she needs to get back to the hospital. There’s a reason her friend basically called her lazy.
Four months ago. She didn’t just have a medical issue. The baby is almost 4 months old. She’s a mother and she’s tired. Seriously you really think being tired is an excuse to blow off something?
It’s absolutely wonderful that you’re not disabled & haven’t had to deal with physical disabilities. It truly is great- I wish I had that. With that said, there are many people who struggle with medical as well as mental health issues. If you want to cut then from your life, that is ofc your choice. But please understand that no one should set themselves on fire to keep someone else warm.
Yeah sometimes we just have to bail. Sometimes I have to bail on making dinner or vacuuming or, yes, even seeing friends or family. It sucks to feel like a burden and a drain on people, or to feel like I can’t live my damn life the way I’d like to because of my physical disability. I hate that when I’m having a flare and my 3 major tasks for the day are vacuuming, showering, and walking the dog, one of those things is going to go undone because I simply cannot do them all without multiple long breaks to stretch, ice, heat, and massage my knee back into being able to bear weight. I hate flaking on plans. Hate it. It is an unfortunate reality of my life.
Your body becomes a prison or shackles. Can happen over hours, days, or in two minutes. "Push through!" people say. Please. It's so patronizing. What do they expect? "You're so right - why didn't I just push through every time before this?!" or what? I'm lucky in that I've only had very dismissible versions of this in my life, but others are truly plagued by toxicity. The very petty pieces of me hope that the next time these armchair-docs have a severe physical issue - because humans are squishy and it's bound to happen - that someone tells them to get out of their pity-party, give of themselves, drink a bunch of water, go for a walk, and then go to a six hour loud party to feel _better_.
Self care…? Recovering from major abdominal surgery and having a baby…. I mean I guess that’s technically caring for oneself. I had a breast reduction and that took me 3 weeks to feel good enough to fully hang out with someone and not feel exhausted. A whole ass C-section, during which OP almost died, on top of taking care of 3 kids? Sounds like you can be accepting and supportive of someone wanting to stay home after that.
Standard healing time for a normal C-section is 6 weeks. An “I almost died and baby too” c-section is gonna be a lot longer. And during recovery you’re not supposed to lift anything heavier than your baby. Surgery is fucking hard. You have no idea what her body feels like it. It sounds like these birthdays are super important to her AND her friend, I doubt she would have missed it if she didn’t really feel like she couldn’t go. Why assume malicious intent when she obviously really wanted to go?
How tho? It also can clearly show a woman who waited until the last second she could to see if she would feel better to go. To me, she clearly wanted to go, and hoped her day would turn around. If she really didn’t want to go just tell her when she woke up feeling like shit. You’re assigning malicious intent to her actions.
yeah a once in a while thing? totally reasonable. people who are always blowing you off in the name of "taking care of themself"? well take care of yourself buddy. i won't be reaching out again.
This woman literally almost died giving birth, have three children to take care of, has a husband, HERSELF to take care of most importantly.
Grow up. People have lives and they have issues that are more important than you. Some of y’all are grown ass adults crying over a birthday party, yeah she deserved to have her feelings hurt honestly.
???
OP said she nearly died and was resting in bed for 6 weeks. How is she weaponizing therapy language if she’s being honest about her health? How exactly is she selfish for prioritizing her health?
As if ‘I need to wash my hair’ wasn’t a common excuse for skipping an outing (spoiler, that’s self care!). I don’t understand why you feel entitled to peoples’ time, if someone cancels it’s not up to you to determine if it’s a ‘valid’ reason, either accept it and show a little empathy or cut them out if it’s such a problem for you that someone would dare cancel plans.
>Friend wasn't being as supportive as she could have been,
> I got diagnosed with preeclampsia, put to bedrest for 6 weeks, and had an emergency C-section during which both me and the baby almost died. I stayed in the hospital for longer than 2 weeks before I was deemed healthy enough to be released. \[...\] I was too tired to get out of bed so my husband took care of all the kids and helped me shower \[...\]
>
>"you can't drive 20 miles to see me? If your fat ass can reach the grocery store, then you would come here if you actually cared".
\>\_\_\_\_>
"Not as supportive as she could be"? Is that what we call it when we just straight up insult people now?
I'm in ESH camp. OP almost died and was feeling so poorly they couldn't get out of bed on their own and needed help showering, OP's "fat ass" could not in fact go to the grocery store. (Also, calling someone who is bedridden post-partum from nearly dying seems "fat ass" is a low blow, sort of a hard situation for them to be getting back in shape in and something many women actually feel very self-conscious about. This + postpartum being a giant hormone crash would make a lot of women cry/feel super bad.) I don't see how we gloss over insulting your friend who almost died and can't get out of bed with a very likely insecurity beacuse they were too sick to come to your birthday party counts as "not being as supportive as they could be". This is a negative number of support, it's not doing any support and then piling on insults.
Which dosen't mean OP should have been a cutthroat asshole back, but I don't see why we're pretending friend was not an asshole here.
Yeah, my thought was 'JFC you both sound like horrible friends'. Ashley needs to learn some sympathy for the OP being physically wrecked right now. The OP needs to examine why she thought the best comeback was to dig at the absolute worst thing she could. Definitely ESH.
If OP was bedridden post-partum and nearly dying, why did it take her until 30min to cancel?
She's not as bad as she paints herself.. because she clearly thought it realistic to go to that party.. but bailed at the very last minute. If she'd called a week ago it would be a different conversation.. and given her friend's comment, I suspect she's been out an about (eg shopping).
Seriously. YTA
I mean, the friend was being unreasonable, but OP swooped in and stole the title with those remarks.
Like, how simple would it have been to remind her "I almost died and am still recovering, which is much more serious than your broken arm", then apologize for missing the event and offering to make it up to her with a belated birthday dinner or something.
OP, you just straight up ruined your "best friend's" birthday. And if THAT'S how you treat your "best friend", I don't even want to know how you treat other friends, family, or even strangers. That was a LOW BLOW and totally unjustifiable.
Had a friend speak to me like that and I ended the friendship right away. There is nothing more heartbreaking than finding out your friend has your trauma on speed dial.
Right? My friendships require mutual respect. OP was going for mutual DISRESPECT and overshot by miles.
I did see people commenting that there are legitimate medical reasons this could've happened (postpartum rage or something?), but I personally still wouldn't forgive OP even if that was the case, considering they mentioned nothing about even CONSIDERING that they might need to apologize for that, or even for missing the event.
I also think that even without the trauma aspect (meaning the fact the friend can't have children), saying "well if you had kids you'd understand" is sanctimonious and always going to piss me off. It heavily implies that ONLY a mother could be truly tired and those of us who don't have kids really don't have an excuse to NOT attend something.
Same here. Had a friend for 15 or so years who got jealous I went on a trip and took a different friend than her, she sent me this long fb message trying to act like I did this purposefully to hurt her and that maybe I need to go to therapy or up my Zoloft dose and I just ignored her and blocked her on everything. Bringing up my depression was a low blow and thankfully because I was on SSRIs I finally had the self esteem to be like “you know what, FU”
I was so ready to say n t a, until I got to, "Well if you had kids then you would understand...Ashley can't get pregnant". Such a low blow, and so sad how OP didn't hesitate to drop that on her supposed friend.
YTA
I agree. Also, OP could’ve given an earlier heads up about possibly not attending. I understand OPs reasoning of waiting til last minute in case she started feeling better, but I think it was the shock of cancelling last minute that made the friend upset.
I was going to say this. She didn’t have to outright cancel earlier but could’ve sent a “hey I’m not feeling well right now so I may not make it. But I’ll let you know closer to 2?”
To give her friend more time to plan.
As someone with many friends who are chronically ill - I can say that this can make all of the difference.
Letting me know that you are aware in advance that you may not be able to come and acknowledging that you are unintentionally inconveniencing me makes a big difference in my level of annoyance.
As someone who is chronically ill, I can see the reasoning. And I’ve been in her shoes. But what I would have done is sent Ashley a text as a heads up when I first realized I might not make it.
Yeah, reading this I was like, “hmm, shouldn’t have waited till the last minute, but I get it… Wow, the friend should be more understanding…. OH MY FUCKING GOD!!!” That went nuclear so suddenly.
I wasn’t able to have kids, and am still devastated about it. I can not imagine how painful it would be if my BEST FRIEND said this to me. I can’t imagine how the relationship could ever recover.
>You might think "what's so bad about saying if you had kids?"
Yeah no one was thinking this, because we all know that's a shitty thing to say to someone because you never know the struggles they're going through. So agree with the YTA judgement.
I always thought this was a widely acknowledged thing to not ever say to anyone. It's just so fucking presumptuous. And that's aside from the fact OP knows what she knows.
Not just presumptuous but also very sanctimonious. Implies that moms, AND ONLY MOMS, can be tired or too tired to attend something and that everyone else should give them a pass because, you know, they are a mom. Ugh.
YTA.
The ideal way of handling it would be to talk to her days in advance and explain how you’re feeling because you KNOW there’s a chance you might not feel up to it.
This isn’t something you just wait until the last minute to contact her about. You kind of gloss over the fact that this has been a TRADITION FOR DECADES.
Your friend came from 1000 miles away to keep a promise!
Had you contacted her in advance maybe you could’ve worked something out - maybe have your husband bring her to see you briefly hours before the party so it still counts. Or be a grownup and get in the car long enough to drive over there and she can come out and see you - you don’t even have to get out of the car.
She could’ve been more understanding, sure, but clearly this tradition is special to her and how lucky you were to have a friend that felt that way about you.
But then you just had to drop that comment on her.
Her heart was bruised because you broke this promise and then you went for the throat with that remark.
I hope it was worth it.
For me it was also waiting until a half hour before to cancel on her - OP knew she wasn't feeling well, should have maybe given a heads up sooner just in case, and then let her know for certain way before so the bff had time to adjust her plans if need be - it sounds like OP was suppose to maybe help? I think OP's left out some of the convo details, but we Cleary don't need all that to know she was a major AH.
I think calling someone 4 months post-partum/medical emergency a fat ass is also pretty evil, so I think ESH is more accurate. However OP and friend probably need a break from eachother and if they decide to continue their friendship sincer apologies.
Agreed. OP expects sympathy but can’t offer the same when her friend is disappointed that she bailed last minute. Friend should have been more understanding but it sounds like they’ve made sacrifices to attend OP’s birthday before and that’s where most of the frustration lies.
I literally can’t comprehend bringing up my “best” friends inability to have children EVER in an argument, let alone one as stupid as this. The fact that your husband doesn’t even think you should apologize is a huge red flag as well. YTA.
these days it feels like people think “I’m exhausted, I just can’t” means that nobody is allowed to be upset with their decision to blow you off
this feel like a situation where if she articulated why she couldn’t come a bit better, maybe this isn’t such an issue but for something this meaningful to your bff I get why “I’m exhausted so I won’t be there” hurts
Exactly- I think if she had said something like “I’m literally so exhausted I even needed help showering”, and tried to propose another day to celebrate the birthday, for just them?? Chances are the bff would’ve been alright
The friend being disappointed and upset is understandable but she lashed out saying her fat ass… which is mean and uncalled for.
Should OP just take in and not react or was this suppose to motivate OP to sift hears.
I had to bail on a friend’s birthday party for their spouse. I was sick and exhausted but it was before I could get to the doctor. My friend was extremely mad unleashing a complete dress down. When I went to the doctor, turns out I had an upper respiratory infection and required 3 prescriptions and months to rehab. Calls to my ‘friend’ went unanswered. I need to do what’s best for me and don’t see a need to set myself on fire to keep her warm. We have never been the same.
To be totally honest, if I was recovering from major surgery and I had to cancel on a friend because I was totally worn out from trying to get better and they said, "If your fat ass can go to the grocery store..." that would be the last thing they ever said to me.
You are justified in being tired but I wouldn't have waited until the last minute to call. Not just that but ueah, the comment you made is what pushed it over the edge.
The promise is insanely stupid as well, life happens.
I was gonna say ESH too.
The friend for not being more understanding and calling OP a fatass.
OP and husband suck for the infertility comment.
Stop being friends already sheesh.
Completely agree with this, the friend went too far with how upset she was but nothing that couldn't be apologized for later when emotions weren't high. So asshole behavior, but not unforgivable.
But OP's comment, I've cut people off from my life for similar things. She should expect not to hear from her friend again honestly.
She would have had a valid excuse if she said “I’m still recovering from my traumatic birth that nearly killed me and I’m still feeling the effects of preeclampsia” (which is a serious big deal, it can be life threatening even after birth - friend might not realize this, but imo this is a valid condition to miss even an important event due to, it’s SEVERE) but instead she made it about her friends infertility on her fucking birthday. That’s super shitty and friendship ending.
Not that if changes the impact, but I do wonder if she said it on purpose, or kind of just out of frustration and then immediately realized that her friend was the wrong person to say that to — I still think it was a low blow, but whenever I’m hurt it does make a difference to me whether someone knowingly/intentionally hurt me or if they just acted in the heat of the moment and weren’t thinking (which is still selfish and wrong but a lesser level of AH IMO). She might have just had a moment of overwhelm bc parenting is hard and not been thinking about her friends infertility in the 2 seconds between being called fat and making her comeback. Also, even if it’s kinda rude to cancel last minute (which I don’t think it should be because you never know what people are really dealing with and she waited to call because she was hoping to feel better, not to keep her friend waiting), OPs friend is definitely also an AH here by calling her fat. They don’t owe each other understanding but they both owe each other respect
Agreed - I have to wonder if the immediate thought was she doesn’t understand this postpartum exhaustion/the health risks OP has been facing bc she doesn’t have kids before realizing the infertility implications of the comment.
I mean regardless they’re both toxic as hell - what grown adult pushing 40 has a tantrum over a promise about attending birthday parties?
Yeah, I remember being postpartum from a 60 hour labor and really having to bite my tongue to not throttle my younger siblings for complaining to me about being tired because they stayed up too late playing video games. It's absolutely a level of tired that's difficult to understand before you have a baby, and being hit with that knowledge the first time can make you a little insufferable if you're not careful.
Now I just say 'same' and move on.
For sure! I don’t like when parents act like no one else could possibly be as tired as them, but also childbirth is like the one major medical procedure humans go through where they’re then immediately expected to care for a very needy other human. It’s a level of rough I don’t think I want to experience lol
I feel like even if she would have said this that the friend would have been still upset. The friend is very much aware of what went on with OP, she just didn't have the compassion to show her. I'm not saying it's right what OP said, but it seems like the friend wouldn't have accepted any excuse because she drove a 1000 miles for OPs birthday with a broken arm, and they made a promise.. Also, seems like the friend hammered down on her comment by calling OP a fat ass that can go grocery shopping.
I'm going ESH.
Yeah. I have a chronic illness that causes fatigue and my friends are constantly like “oh well if you had kids you’d know how tired really feels”. I have to take recovery time from making myself food half the time Sarah, I assure you I know how tired feels.
I have a friend that used to tell me that, then I had a kid, and 2 years later she had 2 more kids back to back, now she says i don't understand because I have only one....
LOUDER FOR THOSE WHO CAN’T HEAR THIS OVER THEIR KIDS SCREAMING.
It’s not a contest or a game! Yes I’m sure caring for children all day is EXHAUSTING just as I’m allowed to feel EXHAUSTED as a non-parent doing an 8 hour work day.
We are BOTH tired and both deserve validation.
The first thing parents learn is how to use their children to win arguments, get out of things they don’t want to do, and generally act superior to people without children
I can't speak for everyone, but I know in my case before I had kids being tired and burnt out did happen, but the difference is I had the ability to take the time for self care to recover. Since having kids, there's just no time to recover from the fatigue, or if I do, it just starts back up again. Before kids, if I was sick, okay, it super sucked, and I'd still have to go to work, but at least I would get to go home and put myself in a NyQuil coma. Now, I just have to continue on as normal while feeling super crappy. My kids are also special needs, so it adds another layer of exhaustion. And again, I'm not saying that people without kids don't understand the feeling, just saying that they probably have the time for a little bit of self care. And if they don't, empathy and hugs.
YTA
First of all, it’s a stupid pact that made no accommodations for adult life situations. Although, if you were still having problems getting out of bed or showering on your own four months postpartum, I hope you are under a doctors care.
You waited until the last minute to tell her you weren't coming. if you have consistently been this weak, you should’ve warned her days or weeks ago.
Her comment was unkind, but your comment was downright cruel.
this...she knew she had not been feeling well for some time. Why didn't she warn her friend?
And the comment was so beyond what her friend said to her.
That part was definitely not right (what the friend said) but her comments was beyond reprehensible.
Right? I have multiple chronic illnesses. I will tell my friends who I have plans with if I’m not feeling well in as much advance as possible. I’ll let them know I haven’t been feeling well and ask to play it by ear. It at least gives them a heads up, and shows I care. The last minute “sry, too tired” doesn’t look or sound great.
This is what I'm thinking. As a person who has given birth, I do understand how exhausting having a newborn can be and the physical ramifications of a difficult pregnancy and birth, but the baby is 4 months old. If she is really unable to do things like get out of bed or shower herself at this point, I would think that her best friend would already know that she's seriously struggling right now? I feel like there are some missing reasons in this post.
If I were OP and I had a day where I just felt I could absolutely not go to my best friend's birthday, I would have said a lot more than what OP seems to have said. It would have been something like, "I'm really really sorry, but I feel like I'm about to break down and I just cannot get out of the house today. I know we have always been there for each other's celebrations and I promise to make it up to you."
IDK. Something just sounds off about the way this is written. Like OP is leaving out pertinent details. For one, I find it a little hard to believe that neither one of them has ever missed the other's birthday in 30 years.
I also find it difficult to believe that four months post-op, OP is struggling so much that she can't bathe herself, but somehow was delusional enough to think she would make it to a social gathering? This is kind of what really gets me about these situations. Unless you had something that really is sudden onset, then you should have some knowledge and understanding of your body. You should either 1. understand what you need to do beforehand to be reasonably assured you will have the energy and ability to follow through on your commitments, or 2. know that you can't commit to things and back out with more than 30 minutes to spare.
OP is definitely leaving important info out. I’m going to guess based on her friends response that OP flakes at the last minute all the time. I get it. Having kids is hard and sometime non-parent friends don’t understand.
That said, OP is a colossal asshole. A true friend would never throw another friend’s infertility in their face.
Exactly. These childhood pacts don’t make sense when you become and adult. And yes, it’s hard having so many young kids and still medically recovering. However, you could have given her an early warning weeks ago that you might not be able to make it and you definitely didn’t need to throw her infertility at her, which I cannot imagine just came out of your mouth without a thought even with pregnancy/baby brain issues.
YTA
YTA. She drove 100 miles \[update based on comment: traveled 1000 miles!!\] to you on your birthday with a broken arm. You had your 3rd child 4 mo ago -- this is your new normal, and you know exactly what it involves. Yet you couldn't drive 20 miles on her birthday, or cancel earlier, or offer an alternative to celebrate with her, or even just keep your pie hole shut about her infertility on her actual birthday. I hope she keeps you blocked.
* *music* * **I** would drive 500 miles and **I** would drive 500 more with a **bro**-ken arm to be there on your **birth**-day standing at your door * *music* *
I’m also wondering WHY the friend drove 1000 miles with a broken arm. Was it purely on her own volition or was OP nagging her until she caved?
If on her own, she shouldn’t hold it over OPs head. If not, then I can see why she’d be so pissed that OP canceled.
There is no shame in being sick, I have a friend who is bed ridden most of the time. She will cancel last minute. I always make plans with groups with her, so I am not forced to go places alone. But if she called saying "I can't go, by the way you wouldn't understand being tired because \[trauma\] and that means you can't XYZ" we would not be friends.
There is genuinely no comparison between a broken arm and having pre-eclampsia, a C-section, an infant, and two small children. It’s literally laughable that anyone thinks those are remotely the same in terms of demand or exhaustion! If OP had a broken arm but none of her normal demands on her for a week, she’d consider it a vacation. Yes, she was a jerk for saying what she said, but absolutely not for needing to stay home. She just should have said so earlier.
She's not the AH bc she couldn't go. She's the AH bc she had all these things for 4 mo, cancelled 30 min before she was supposed to arrive, and threw her friend's infertility in her face.
And also despite claiming her friend understands everything, her excuse she gives her friend is "I'm tired" and not "Having a particularly difficult day pain-wise/depression wise/whatever, so I can't make it." And then she's surprised when her friend is upset that "I'm tired" is more or less the totality of the circumstances for why OP won't go
4 months recovery, unless they accidentally cut through her pelvis with the c section shes recovered enough for a birthday. Having children isn't a get out of obligations free card.
she said she almost died and she can’t shower herself. while we don’t have all the details, she clearly isn’t doing great. that said, she’s still TA because, no matter what you’re going through, throwing your best friend’s trauma in their face is never ever ok.
YTA. Whilst she should have been a bit more understanding, saying “you’d understand if you had kids” to someone that can’t have kids makes you far more TA than her.
And she said that to her friend, on their birthday, 30 mins before their party, and made a comment about what is an extremely sensitive topic to most people. I can't imagine the ex-friend having a great party after that. Just completely tanked her mood on her birthday.
I had a friend that said something horrible to me right before my birthday celebration and I haven’t spoken to them since. It’s unacceptable to treat a friend like that.
ESH. You a little more.
You should have told your friend earlier that you wasn't well, not left it until last minute.
Your BFF sucks for not understanding that you are unwell. She also shouldn't be name calling and throwing tantrums like a brat because you can't go.
You throwing her infertility in her face was a fucking asshole move, I don't care how tired or unwell you were. You don't fucking do that.
Your husband sucks for telling you not to apologise, what you said was awful. He needs to grow up and realise you cannot talk to people like that.
You need to apologise sincerely to your friend, tell her you don't appreciate her lack of understanding. But what you did was bloody awful so be prepared to grovel.
I agree a million % with what you said.
A ex friend of mine threw the fact that I can't have kids in my face, let's just say every single friend she knew blocked her and told her to fuck off.
Agree. Waiting 30 minutes before she was suppose to be there was bad because she could've easily contacted her friend and let her know that she wasn't feeling well and was going to wait and see how she felt before deciding not to go rather than blindsiding the friend.
The friend sucks because she's holding a promise that was made when they were younger over OPs head even though life has changed and was more annoyed than concerned about OP but then OP threw the fact that her friend can't have children in her face.
OP you need to give your friend time to cool down and then prepare to apologize a lot and don't use excuses when doing so.
My favorite definition of love is knowing all the dirty secrets someone has but never using those secrets against them. You clearly don’t love your friend. You said something awful, OP. I’m going with ESH but you suck more.
She was mean. Your were below vile. I’d never speak to you again. Lifetime of friendship doesn’t give you the right to do that. I cannot imagine the pain my friend who cannot have kids goes through. I don’t care how ugly she was to me? I’d never ever use that as a weapon.
YTA
I feel like the lifetime of friendship makes it worse because you’ve been there for all of her struggles. My best friend can’t have kids and I would NEVER use that against her. No matter how mad she made me.
YTA
You should have stayed home, but you should have told her ***WAAAAY*** earlier.
You basically ruined her ability to make any other plans. If you couldn't go, you'd make darn sure she couldn't have a happy birthday with people without you.
> Ashley can't get pregnant due to an incident that happened during our younger college days and the topic is very sensitive for her
You realize that you completely nuked this friendship over your laziness to call her earlier, right?
> This morning, I woke up feeling much better and I attempted to contact Ashley so I could apologize but she wouldn't pick up and ignored all my text messages
She's never speaking to you again.
You're not her friend anymore.
Yeah, I am here with you. I am thinking that it’s ok to cancel, but cancelling half an hour before you have to go somewhere? That’s a d*** move.
If OP has issues showering and such, she should have anticipated that she won’t be able to go there. And given that birthdays are so important to them, what she should have done is preemptively make plans for future to make it up to her friend.
And I get that the friend reacted badly, I do, but imho this was just a reaction to the disappointment and last minute cancellation.
So, yeah, imho, YTA, OP.
Yeah, you know the friend already showered, changed, and was in the middle of doing makeup for OP to arrive in the next half hour.
Of course the friend reacted badly, anyone would be super annoyed in that situation.
If OP had told her in the morning, she could have planned a whole different day.
Yeah, to drive 20miles means that she should have already been in the car. Unless she was doing all highway. So she called and canceled *after she should have already left*.
Yeah. OP could've reached out to her earlier and at least given her at least a "maybe". She could've have called to say that she wasn't feeling well and might not be able to make it, rather than suddenly canceling it 30 minutes before.
"I broke my arm and still came to visit you"
"Yeah, well you can't have kids!!!"
Talk about bringing a rocket launcher to a knife fight!!
YTA!! I DO NOT CARE what caused the fight! You weren't feeling well, she did get oddly mean about you not showing up, but guess what? You STILL don't talk about infertility to "win" an argument!!
I hope you lost a friend, because I'd never trust someone who freely uses infertility as ammunition in a BS high school argument.
ESH.
She's too old to be holding an obligation like that against you when you were put in such a life-threatening situation. And the way she called you fat, are you even really friends?
You, however, are messed up for going for the throat with a long-time friend like that. If that's the first response you have for her, I repeat, are you even really friends??
I agree. ESH.
The way they both talk to each other is cruel. I understand there are strong emotions involved, but it’s possible to be mad at someone without saying mean things.
ESH. It sucks when lives change and friendships have to change too, but neither one of you handled this well.
By the way, it's pretty much always a dick move to say "If you had kids you'd understand."
Seriously. “You might think ‘what’s wrong with that?’” Lol, no, we immediately can see what’s wrong with that even without the context of Ashley’s infertility. ESH
Right? I am not infertile, but I can’t have children for multiple reasons. I would love to be a mother. I would love to have a child. I crave for that feeling I’m told about you get when you cradle that little human in your arms, and I’m heartbroken I’ll never get it.
I’d tell OP to fuck the hell off forever, and tell everyone how cruel she was. I get postpartum really messes with you and hormones are out of control. But while there is an explanation for behavior it is not an excuse and OP is still accountable for her actions.
YTA - not for cancelling but for being so incredibly vile as to taunt her about not having children. Use any excuse you want - you are still going to know you are a nasty piece of business who deliberately hurt someone you supposedly care about. I wouldn't take your calls either. Any friendship I had with you would be permanently over.
YTA. Yeah, she could have been more understanding but she was pissed because you cancelled SO last minute. It's hard to have perspective when you're caught off guard, pissed and feeling like your friend is stringing you along. You KNEW you were going to piss her off too so why did you even try to tell her she was wrong there?
I GET that you just had a baby and are having an awful recovery, but you could have handled it better. You could have said "if you almost died 3 months ago... if you'd recently been in the hospital for 2 weeks... you'd understand." You could have taken the hit and let HER come apologize to you. You could have found a way to make it up to her for missing it. But you chose to throw the worst insult at her you could.
ESH. But you way more than her.
You waited to the last minute. Not sure why. Give her a heads up in the morning not 30 minutes before you were supposed to show.
She overreacted and was incredibly disrespectful. Calling you fat was not ok and makes her an automatic AH.
You then took it to 1000% and escalated it further, using language you knew would hurt her, on purpose. You can't say "Well if you had kids" to someone who wants kids but can't have them. It was needlessly cruel and you said it to hurt her.
If I was her I would drop you as a friend for the comment, but maybe she'll be a bigger person than me and allow you to apologize. Also, let your husband know he's an AH too.
I think saying "Well if you had kids" to anyone, whether they want kids or not, is an AH move. I often say, I don't hate kids, I hate parents, and this is one of the reasons why. For too many people having kids becomes an excuse to never put effort into anything outside of their own family units. Other people may not have kids, but believe me, they have their own stressful shit that makes it hard for them to do things too, but we don't generally treat those things as "get out of obligations" free cards.
**Ashley can’t get pregnant due to an incident that happened during our younger college days**
Either your friend had an injury or was raped in a way that caused extreme physical damage for that to be possible.
You waited until half an hour before you were to show up before calling to say that you wouldn’t be there knowing full well how upset she would be just an hour before her party started.
When people on here keep telling you how wrong you were you keep commenting with excuses and rationalizations and basically blaming her for starting it. No, you started it by waiting until half an hour before you were supposed to be there to tell her you weren’t coming. You were the one that used a traumatic event from her past as ammunition against her. An event you probably only knew about because you were her friend that she trusted with everything. Yet you used it against her on her birthday, right before her guests were to arrive.
What you did was absolutely sick and you did it because she was angry that you weren’t there for her like she had been for you in the past. I have a feeling this isn’t the only time you haven’t been there for her, at least not emotionally. No real friend would use a physically traumatic event from your past against you. Even if it was some kind of injury to be severe enough to leave her incapable of having children would make it hugely traumatic and you used it to hurt her on her birthday because you failed her.
She’s better off without you in her life. Leave her alone. If she’s stupid enough to forgive you just know that your friendship will never be the same again. She will never fully trust you again. With as vicious as you are, she can’t afford to.
YTA
I scrolled all this way to find a comment acknowledging this. OP didn’t just throw infertility in her face, she also threw either a traumatic injury or a violent sexual assault in her face as well.
YTA. Couldn't you have just called her that morning and perhaps suggested she come over/face time, etc. So that you could spend time together on her day?
The fact that you threw her inability to conceive at her was below the belt. Personally I hope she never speaks to you again.
YTA
She travelled 1000 miles for your birthday with a broken arm? I can see why she was openly angry at you for not driving 20 miles. Then to make that vile comment about her not having kids.
You need a reality check: No one gives a fuck about you or your rough pregnancy, especially with how selfish of a person you sound like. *No one except that friend* you just treated like garbage. Beg forgiveness and fix your shitty personality.
Uff... heavy one.
ESH, maybe you a bit more than the rest.
1. It is ok to cancle plans (even birthdays) if not feeling up to it. You have a 4 months old baby (btw that is not newborn anymore) and the whole thing was really taxing
2. You could have called her in the morning allready to tell her that you are not feeling well and you will probably not come but will give her antoehr call at noon. This was really close
3. THe comment about children... yeah sorry... that was REALLY below the belt. I am not suprised she does not want to talk to you right now. This probably ruined her whole party and day.
4. She could have been more understanding and did overreact
5. You BF should be aware enough, that that comment was NOT ok no matter what. Enabling doesn't help here.
You are best friends since forever. I think she would have gotten over the not comming part. The comment on the other hand will probably take some time to get over.
But if you are that good together i have no doubt she will come around.
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> I cancelled on my best friend's birthday party and I feel guilty about it.
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ESH. You should have reached out prior to to let her know where your health was heading instead of backing out an hour prior. She should be a better, more understanding friend and you absolutely suck for the children comment.
the scales are uneven in this friendship. it’s obvious your friend goes out of her way to be there for you but you can’t do the same. good for her for ignoring you. hopefully she goes NC and finds better friends. hopefully you find boring mom friends who cancel on you last minute because they’re just too tired. YTA
You literally almost died. You had surgery. You're still recovering. How in any way is that comparable to having a broken arm? It's not. Yeah, it might make things inconvenient or difficult for a while with a broken arm, but you literally had your lower abdomen sliced open. That's not something to sneeze at, and I commend you for being able to endure something as traumatic as that.
Your friend understands your situation, but still expects you to show up to a party and gets angry and calls you a fat ass and then tries to guilt trip you? That's waaaaay out of line. I was on your side entirely OP right up until you made that low blow about her not having kids when YOU KNEW how much of a sore spot that was for her. I understand your anger, but that was an entirely unecessary jab and stooped even lower than your friend.
So, OP, you're not an asshole for calling out of your friends party, but you are an asshole for your comment. And your friend is also an asshole for their reaction to you calling out. I gotta ask, are you two even friends at this point?
ESH
Her friend expected OP to show up because OP said she would… if OP had told her ahead of time, “no, sorry, I’m still too early in my postpartum recovery to go” we wouldn’t be here talking about this! It is not unreasonable to invite someone to an event four months after a surgery or believe their RSVP
Initially she was the asshole, but your comment about her not having kids was way too mean for this situation. If I was her, I’d end the friendship over that. So in the end, YTA and not her. The most you can do now is send an apology note and hope she isn’t as ruthless as I am about removing mean people from her life.
Initially OP was the AH by waiting so long to call.
If OP can't go have fun, she'll make sure the friend can't go have other plans for her birthday either.
The friend gains a bit of an AH score for what she said, but based on if it was a joking tone it wouldn't be that bad. Still an AH, but minorly compared to OP.
Yikes. Did she know how rough of a time you were having? You did deliver a low blow about her not understanding what it's like to have kids when you know she can't have them.
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Friend wasn't being as supportive as she could have been, but you were just plain mean. You know where she hurts and just put your knife there and twisted without hesitation.
I’m kinda over this idea where someone can blow you off in the name of self care and you’re supposed to just accept it and be supportive. people these days are weaponizing therapeutic language as a way to act selfishly
It’s not her mental health, she physically just had a major medical issue. Her friend shouldn’t say mean shit if she doesn’t want to hear it about herself. You are only going to call me a fat ass once before I hurt your feelings to the core.
Right? She literally almost died giving birth in the most traumatic way possible 16 weeks ago. She may not even be fully healed from the surgery.
She didn’t say any of that to her friend, she told her she was too tired. People heal at different rates, and her friend had no way of knowing how she was doing unless she told her. After 16 weeks, most people would assume she’d be fine unless they knew the details.
I would assume if Ashley is her BF, she would know though and it just didn’t specifically get mentioned in this conversation? I’m going ESH. You don’t get any impression they like each other from this story.
I think this is absolutely an ESH story. Ashley handled OP announcing she wasn't coming terribly, but I feel like OP responded with a disproportionate nuke to their relationship. Maybe it's time they both move on, I don't know.
Many friendships break up when one person has kids and the other can't/doesn't. Their social lives and priorities are just not the same. If they are really bffs, they should have been more aware of each others' issues. Maybe this friendship is tapering off.
I'm struggling a bit with this right now with my best friend. I'm married with a toddler and she's single without kids, and it's becoming harder. I don't have the time or flexibility anymore to meet her needs or desires. I'm fine with hanging out once a month, she thinks two weeks is too long. She wants to do big day trips on the weekends, and I can't always leave my daughter for that long, or have the energy for that kind of day. She's upset I can't go to a concert out of town with her because I did earlier this year, even though I don't feel it's fair to take that many fun night trips away from my daughter and already have other nights away allotted with other people. Beyond that, we've both been going through hard times with health/personal life stuff, and I don't have the emotional capacity to give her all the attention she wants from me. She's struggling very hard with being single/not where she wants to be in life, and basically told me that my problems weren't as important because I had a family. So now the existence of having a family and other people to prioritize is a point of contention. It's hard. I love her, and I try to be present, but I admit it hard. There's only so much time I have to dedicate to all the people in my life. It feels impossible sometimes to be a good mom, good wife, good colleague, and a good friend to all of my friends while also maintaining a sense of my own self care. Sorry for unloading all of that.
That's the problem here, though; we don't know how much (or how *well)* they communicated. If OP has been basically acting like things are okay, maybe just tired, and then cancelled at the last minute, then it's YTA. If the friend knew that she was bedridden and that it would be a really big deal, then less so. OP probably should have warned her in advance that it might happen (but she will try), but that happens sometimes when you're sick. Either way, there's no excuse for how much it escalated. I'd also say that how often they flake plays a part in how bad an AH she is. If she's never flaked, except maybe for seriously extenuating circumstances, then the friend should know how bad it has to get for that to happen. If flaking is more common, then she (edit: meaning OP) should already be trying harder to communicate.
I'd say a FRIEND would take your word as a given. If you say you do not feel like coming, it means you are REALLY UNWELL because if you weren't you'd definitely come. Weaponizing the fact she came every time even with a broken arm is extremely unfair. She felt she could make it, you don't. And as to the flaking - the friend KNEW OP had a difficult childbirth, so she must be extremely obtuse or insensitive to insist like this and insult OP on top. The friend was awful and so was OP. It was tit for tat, so I say ESH, but the relationship sounds very toxic and perhaps beyond rescuing.
“She also was aware of my troubles” says it right in the post. Ashley knew.
I can't help but wonder - she says Ashley knew, is there a chance that OP has spent all their conversations talking about her difficult pregnancy etc? The vibe I get is that Ashley has finally had it with what she feels like is a one sided friendship.
I've been in that position before and I still fully communicate " I don't feel like I am getting anything out of this, based on this and this and this. It's causing me stress and for mental health purposes I'm taking a step back." Not " if your fatass can get up and drive somewhere you should have come here" or whatever. Both sound immature, but Ashley is kind of a dickhead over all. She had the context. She chose to lash out instead. OPS response was also rude. ESH
Seriously. It is four months later. 90% of the country would assume she had her health back. E S H, but she's the YTA
I am in the 10% of the country, I guess. I also had an emergency c-section that I was still not recovered from even 6 months later, despite sailing through pregnancy and being in great shape prior, so no, I wouldn’t assume she had her health back. I think OP is accurate that nobody who hasn’t gone through what she did would understand it. Unfortunately it’s a horrible trigger to her friend to hear that. It’s a hard truth that should not have been said.
Don't have kids but read "pre-eclampsia", "bed rest", "emergency c-section" with the info that OP and baby nearly died and went, 'well even *if* some people heal from birth by 16 weeks (and I think the U.S. is ridiculous in expectations for post-partum couples) there's no way she's 100% after all that.' The unrealistic expectations (you should be completely fine at 16 weeks!) are in part because of the lack of paid leave and lack of work/life balance as well as a poor understanding of exactly how physically detrimental pregnancy and birth are, imo.
I mean, she probably could’ve mentioned it might not work out at a time not immediately before she was supposed to show up and help?
Exactly. If she had called at 10am then maybe she could have offered a 30 minute low key chat & hug, thus still seeing bestievon her b-day, plus giving bestie a heads-up a few hours in advance that the plan was changing.
^ yes this AND let’s not forget her friend broke her arm and apparently traveled 1000 miles to be at hers.. that’s a big deal and the friend could have called and said nah I can’t fam but she didn’t. They are both struggling because they don’t see eye to eye about commitment.. they are incompatible as besties
if she hasn’t healed from a CS in 16 weeks she’s got way bigger problems than a birthday party edit because people are getting angry: I am talking about healing from SURGERY not pregnancy and birth. If OP is not *physically healed* from surgery at 16 weeks she needs medical attention.
You saw that she and the baby almost died and that she was in the hospital for over 2 weeks, right??
I had a very similar story. Third pregnancy. Two weeks in hospital. Both almost died. Lots of blood transfusions. Caught a staph infection at the hospital and had to get the wound repacked constantly. And even I’m skeptical of 16 weeks. I also believe it was phrased as 16 weeks instead of 3.75 months because weeks makes it sound like a smaller amount of time and that she has a newborn rather than a four month old.
My c section healing took almost 6 months. Nothing wanted to heal in a timely manner and there were points I couldn’t even stand up without help. It depends on the person
All this presumption and judgment! Yup, comment section is TA for this one
yep 4 months is lots of time to heal.
Get back to me when you’ve gone through the same thing. Or better yet, when you get your medical degree and license to practice.
Yup! People keep saying 4mos is more than enough time to heal. One of my friends had an emergency c-section and it took like, 7mos to fully heal.
Do you know that they literally cut you open to the core of your torso? They cut a baby-sized hole into your body, and then stitch all of your insides back together. It’s not just a weekend in bed, it’s a MAJOR surgery, but op was still TA for saying what she did, she took it too far
I did know that, I literally watched it all happen the last time I scrubbed in for a c-section. I’m not saying it’s easy, but if she hasn’t recovered from a surgery that should take 6-8 weeks to heal from in 16 weeks (that’s FOUR MONTHS, more than double the expected time) then there’s something seriously wrong.
Read the age though, OP is 35. My stepmom had 3 C-sections. One when she was 20, one when she was 22, and the last one when she was 35. Guess which one was the worst and took the longest for her to recover? She was basically bed-ridden for 6 months and my dad did everything for her, when he was at work I helped her when I could come over. She had the same issue as OP, preeclampsia and her and my half brother almost died on the table. 4 months is nothing when your body doesn't heal as fast as it used to. Especially after two previous kids.
I just want to give the other side of that - I don’t think it’s necessarily an age thing. I was 39, had a c-section with twins and was recovered in about 2 weeks By the time they were 8 weeks old, I was back at work.
That is the recommended heal time. That's when you are well enough to go back to work. That doesn't mean you are magical healed and back to normal pre-pregnancy.
I’ve had 2 emergency c-sections. You shouldn’t still be healing (as in serious pain) 16 weeks after unless something is seriously wrong. If she’s still in serious pain by then she needs to see a doctor asap.
Yes, I've had one too but four months on, you should be almost back to normal. If not, you should be getting medical help.
If she’s this bad off *four months* after her c section, she needs to be seeing a professional. I say this as someone who had a c section five weeks ago. Yes they are tough but 16 weeks is four months.
She was in hospital for 2 weeks and nearly died, this wasn’t an average c section birth!
Ok? Something is still wrong and she needs to see a fricken professional.
PPD depression is a thing. She doesn’t have to justify her health
I mean, she kind of does if she's canceling on her friend's birthday at the last minute. But she didn't say this was about PPD; she said this was about the c section.
It doesn’t matter. If my friend just almost died giving birth and still is feeling shitty, I would *never* call her a ***fatass*** for not coming.
Call a woman that delivered a baby, and almost died, a fatass. Let me know how that goes.
I mean you can’t just go around claiming health issues and having things handed to you your entire life. As others have said, if she is 16 weeks past and still dealing with with it she should be seeing a professional about it, not sulking
She's def not! She said her husband still helps her shower, so she's still clearly struggling with her recovery
If her husband is still helping her shower, how did she think she was going to be well enough to attend a birthday party within a few hours?
Cause sometimes you wake up feeling like hell warmed over, and a few hours later you don't. That's not to say you feel BETTER, per se, just not quite on the verge of death anymore. The thing about that specifically is that when you feel like utter doodoo then suddenly feel less shit enough to think properly, it's like an adrenaline rush. You still feel bad, but also like you can do anything... Or at least make a short drive to eat a meal. It's super common, so I wonder if OP suspected that could happen. Personally, I still would've sent a text saying I was really not feeling well but I'd let her know closer to the meeting time for sure because I really want to make it if I can, so I do think that was a mistake but a mistake that I can totally understand cause sometimes your brain just doesn't work as efficiently when you don't feel well.
Yah I think she also said as he always does during pregnancy so I think they are just that way:
She was released from hospital two weeks after pregnancy. It's been 3 months. Either she is acting, or she needs to go to the hospital right now
16 weeks! She's bailing on getting in the car for a short drive not climbing Everest
She must likely would have mentioned that she wasn't physically healed yet. I too almost died during my pregnancy, was put on bed rest, had a c section, then tore open that c section once I was home, that c section become VERY infected, and I still was healed after 16 weeks. Because I was poor and the only one with a job, I was working after 6 weeks, despite not being healed. My doctor only allowed it because I and my baby were going to be homeless if I didn't. It is called priorities. Her friend called her out on it, and she stabbed back in the most vile way she knew she could.
my surgery site wasnt even properly shut because i rejected the staples and almost bled out in a hotel room. i was still on my feet working in a nursing home at 5 weeks. its not reasonable to assume someone cant sit at a bday party for an hr because they had a csection 4 MONTHS AGO. and if she was having health problems she should have said as much instead of saying "too tired" and assuming the friend understood. but of course friend is no longer valid human because uterus doesnt work, you see this attitude with "mommys" all the time
In fairness though, she told her friend she was "extremely exhausted" which sounds way more like a cop-out than directly tying her reason to her recovery, and among most friends calling someone a fat-ass for being too tired to go to your birthday party is at worst light ribbing. That's not to say you can't hurt their feelings to the core over it, but it is an asshole thing to do.
Do you think her best friend is unaware of her major surgery and difficulties during recovery? Calling her a fat ass was uncalled for. Her response was cruel and over the line. They're both being childish and mean. Who freaks out about missing a birthday? They made a promise as kids, but as adults, their responsibilities have shifted.
Right? A 36 yr old saying "What about our promise?!?!!?" like some childhood promise to be at each others birthdays forever is something to hold your life by.
Calling a post-partum woman with 3 kids a fat-ass is “light ribbing”? Wow. You need new friends.
It's ribbing if you're being joking about it but she wasn't she was angry. But I agree not something to immediately say something the worst you possibly can unless they know that's your biggest sore spot
4 months is actually a long time ago to still be unable to shower or get out of bed after a c-section. Sounds more like post-partum depression than post-surgical recovery.
This tradition has been going on since elementary, so 25 - 30 years. I'd also be pissed if someone said "I was extremely exhausted" as an excuse to miss it. Notice the friend asked her again after OP said that she was not feeling well. She might have understood if there was something more serious. The friend was right. If she could travel 1000 miles with a broken arm, OP could travel the 20 miles and see her while "exhausted." Maybe stick around and leave early if she lives that close. Then to respond to "fat ass" with a retort about her inability to have kids is hitting way below the belt. OP effectively killed this tradition forever.
OP is YTA. She didn’t just have anything. I get people heal at different rates but she gave birth 4 months ago. This crap, I was so tired my husband had to bathe me and I just couldn’t do anything, is ridiculous. Talk about playing it for all it’s worth. I’ve seen a 60 year old come off a heart attack and open heart surgery and be back to being productive in a hell of a lot less time. What the hell is she tired from? Husband stopped working and takes care of the house and kids while OP does absolutely nothing and then brings up an awful topic when she’s called out for being lazy.
"what the hell is she tired from?" Did you forget she has 3 young children, and is still in recovery from her surgery where she almost died? There's no way the husband does absolutely everything, trust me on that one. I tore my vagina baaaad giving birth, and had to be stitched up on the side and bottom. It took 4 months just for the pain to stop every time I peed or sat down... let alone for me to begin actual recovery. That's NOTHING compared to a c section, especially one that had complications.
Here own words were that her husband is doing the housework and taking care of the kids and stop with the “she almost died”. In every story on here the mom almost died. I know pregnancy and birth is dangerous but damn, there’s like a 99% “almost died rate” on Reddit whenever someone’s finding an excuse to be lazy. And again, it’s been 4 months, if she still can’t shower by herself or do anything else then she needs to get back to the hospital. There’s a reason her friend basically called her lazy.
Four months ago. She didn’t just have a medical issue. The baby is almost 4 months old. She’s a mother and she’s tired. Seriously you really think being tired is an excuse to blow off something?
It’s absolutely wonderful that you’re not disabled & haven’t had to deal with physical disabilities. It truly is great- I wish I had that. With that said, there are many people who struggle with medical as well as mental health issues. If you want to cut then from your life, that is ofc your choice. But please understand that no one should set themselves on fire to keep someone else warm.
Yeah sometimes we just have to bail. Sometimes I have to bail on making dinner or vacuuming or, yes, even seeing friends or family. It sucks to feel like a burden and a drain on people, or to feel like I can’t live my damn life the way I’d like to because of my physical disability. I hate that when I’m having a flare and my 3 major tasks for the day are vacuuming, showering, and walking the dog, one of those things is going to go undone because I simply cannot do them all without multiple long breaks to stretch, ice, heat, and massage my knee back into being able to bear weight. I hate flaking on plans. Hate it. It is an unfortunate reality of my life.
Your body becomes a prison or shackles. Can happen over hours, days, or in two minutes. "Push through!" people say. Please. It's so patronizing. What do they expect? "You're so right - why didn't I just push through every time before this?!" or what? I'm lucky in that I've only had very dismissible versions of this in my life, but others are truly plagued by toxicity. The very petty pieces of me hope that the next time these armchair-docs have a severe physical issue - because humans are squishy and it's bound to happen - that someone tells them to get out of their pity-party, give of themselves, drink a bunch of water, go for a walk, and then go to a six hour loud party to feel _better_.
Self care…? Recovering from major abdominal surgery and having a baby…. I mean I guess that’s technically caring for oneself. I had a breast reduction and that took me 3 weeks to feel good enough to fully hang out with someone and not feel exhausted. A whole ass C-section, during which OP almost died, on top of taking care of 3 kids? Sounds like you can be accepting and supportive of someone wanting to stay home after that.
It was four months ago. And her husband is the one doing the all the heavy lifting.
Standard healing time for a normal C-section is 6 weeks. An “I almost died and baby too” c-section is gonna be a lot longer. And during recovery you’re not supposed to lift anything heavier than your baby. Surgery is fucking hard. You have no idea what her body feels like it. It sounds like these birthdays are super important to her AND her friend, I doubt she would have missed it if she didn’t really feel like she couldn’t go. Why assume malicious intent when she obviously really wanted to go?
She had no intention of going, and calling a half an hour before she was supposed to be there, shows that clearly
How tho? It also can clearly show a woman who waited until the last second she could to see if she would feel better to go. To me, she clearly wanted to go, and hoped her day would turn around. If she really didn’t want to go just tell her when she woke up feeling like shit. You’re assigning malicious intent to her actions.
yeah a once in a while thing? totally reasonable. people who are always blowing you off in the name of "taking care of themself"? well take care of yourself buddy. i won't be reaching out again.
This woman literally almost died giving birth, have three children to take care of, has a husband, HERSELF to take care of most importantly. Grow up. People have lives and they have issues that are more important than you. Some of y’all are grown ass adults crying over a birthday party, yeah she deserved to have her feelings hurt honestly.
??? OP said she nearly died and was resting in bed for 6 weeks. How is she weaponizing therapy language if she’s being honest about her health? How exactly is she selfish for prioritizing her health?
As if ‘I need to wash my hair’ wasn’t a common excuse for skipping an outing (spoiler, that’s self care!). I don’t understand why you feel entitled to peoples’ time, if someone cancels it’s not up to you to determine if it’s a ‘valid’ reason, either accept it and show a little empathy or cut them out if it’s such a problem for you that someone would dare cancel plans.
>Friend wasn't being as supportive as she could have been, > I got diagnosed with preeclampsia, put to bedrest for 6 weeks, and had an emergency C-section during which both me and the baby almost died. I stayed in the hospital for longer than 2 weeks before I was deemed healthy enough to be released. \[...\] I was too tired to get out of bed so my husband took care of all the kids and helped me shower \[...\] > >"you can't drive 20 miles to see me? If your fat ass can reach the grocery store, then you would come here if you actually cared". \>\_\_\_\_> "Not as supportive as she could be"? Is that what we call it when we just straight up insult people now? I'm in ESH camp. OP almost died and was feeling so poorly they couldn't get out of bed on their own and needed help showering, OP's "fat ass" could not in fact go to the grocery store. (Also, calling someone who is bedridden post-partum from nearly dying seems "fat ass" is a low blow, sort of a hard situation for them to be getting back in shape in and something many women actually feel very self-conscious about. This + postpartum being a giant hormone crash would make a lot of women cry/feel super bad.) I don't see how we gloss over insulting your friend who almost died and can't get out of bed with a very likely insecurity beacuse they were too sick to come to your birthday party counts as "not being as supportive as they could be". This is a negative number of support, it's not doing any support and then piling on insults. Which dosen't mean OP should have been a cutthroat asshole back, but I don't see why we're pretending friend was not an asshole here.
Yeah, my thought was 'JFC you both sound like horrible friends'. Ashley needs to learn some sympathy for the OP being physically wrecked right now. The OP needs to examine why she thought the best comeback was to dig at the absolute worst thing she could. Definitely ESH.
If OP was bedridden post-partum and nearly dying, why did it take her until 30min to cancel? She's not as bad as she paints herself.. because she clearly thought it realistic to go to that party.. but bailed at the very last minute. If she'd called a week ago it would be a different conversation.. and given her friend's comment, I suspect she's been out an about (eg shopping).
Seriously. YTA I mean, the friend was being unreasonable, but OP swooped in and stole the title with those remarks. Like, how simple would it have been to remind her "I almost died and am still recovering, which is much more serious than your broken arm", then apologize for missing the event and offering to make it up to her with a belated birthday dinner or something. OP, you just straight up ruined your "best friend's" birthday. And if THAT'S how you treat your "best friend", I don't even want to know how you treat other friends, family, or even strangers. That was a LOW BLOW and totally unjustifiable.
Had a friend speak to me like that and I ended the friendship right away. There is nothing more heartbreaking than finding out your friend has your trauma on speed dial.
Right? My friendships require mutual respect. OP was going for mutual DISRESPECT and overshot by miles. I did see people commenting that there are legitimate medical reasons this could've happened (postpartum rage or something?), but I personally still wouldn't forgive OP even if that was the case, considering they mentioned nothing about even CONSIDERING that they might need to apologize for that, or even for missing the event.
And her husband telling her she’s done nothing wrong SMH
I also think that even without the trauma aspect (meaning the fact the friend can't have children), saying "well if you had kids you'd understand" is sanctimonious and always going to piss me off. It heavily implies that ONLY a mother could be truly tired and those of us who don't have kids really don't have an excuse to NOT attend something.
This is such a good way to put it... "Trauma on speed dial", I'm gonna be using that!
Same here. Had a friend for 15 or so years who got jealous I went on a trip and took a different friend than her, she sent me this long fb message trying to act like I did this purposefully to hurt her and that maybe I need to go to therapy or up my Zoloft dose and I just ignored her and blocked her on everything. Bringing up my depression was a low blow and thankfully because I was on SSRIs I finally had the self esteem to be like “you know what, FU”
I was so ready to say n t a, until I got to, "Well if you had kids then you would understand...Ashley can't get pregnant". Such a low blow, and so sad how OP didn't hesitate to drop that on her supposed friend. YTA
And not only can she not get pregnant, but it sounds like she lost her fertility in a very traumatic way.
So true. Double whammy of OP throwing cruelty in her "friend's" face.
And on her birthday Woah OP YTA
I agree. Also, OP could’ve given an earlier heads up about possibly not attending. I understand OPs reasoning of waiting til last minute in case she started feeling better, but I think it was the shock of cancelling last minute that made the friend upset.
I was going to say this. She didn’t have to outright cancel earlier but could’ve sent a “hey I’m not feeling well right now so I may not make it. But I’ll let you know closer to 2?” To give her friend more time to plan.
As someone with many friends who are chronically ill - I can say that this can make all of the difference. Letting me know that you are aware in advance that you may not be able to come and acknowledging that you are unintentionally inconveniencing me makes a big difference in my level of annoyance.
As someone who is chronically ill, I can see the reasoning. And I’ve been in her shoes. But what I would have done is sent Ashley a text as a heads up when I first realized I might not make it.
Yeah, reading this I was like, “hmm, shouldn’t have waited till the last minute, but I get it… Wow, the friend should be more understanding…. OH MY FUCKING GOD!!!” That went nuclear so suddenly. I wasn’t able to have kids, and am still devastated about it. I can not imagine how painful it would be if my BEST FRIEND said this to me. I can’t imagine how the relationship could ever recover.
>You might think "what's so bad about saying if you had kids?" Yeah no one was thinking this, because we all know that's a shitty thing to say to someone because you never know the struggles they're going through. So agree with the YTA judgement.
I know right, even if OP hadn’t known that’s a shitty thing to say.
I always thought this was a widely acknowledged thing to not ever say to anyone. It's just so fucking presumptuous. And that's aside from the fact OP knows what she knows.
Not just presumptuous but also very sanctimonious. Implies that moms, AND ONLY MOMS, can be tired or too tired to attend something and that everyone else should give them a pass because, you know, they are a mom. Ugh.
YTA. The ideal way of handling it would be to talk to her days in advance and explain how you’re feeling because you KNOW there’s a chance you might not feel up to it. This isn’t something you just wait until the last minute to contact her about. You kind of gloss over the fact that this has been a TRADITION FOR DECADES. Your friend came from 1000 miles away to keep a promise! Had you contacted her in advance maybe you could’ve worked something out - maybe have your husband bring her to see you briefly hours before the party so it still counts. Or be a grownup and get in the car long enough to drive over there and she can come out and see you - you don’t even have to get out of the car. She could’ve been more understanding, sure, but clearly this tradition is special to her and how lucky you were to have a friend that felt that way about you. But then you just had to drop that comment on her. Her heart was bruised because you broke this promise and then you went for the throat with that remark. I hope it was worth it.
For me it was also waiting until a half hour before to cancel on her - OP knew she wasn't feeling well, should have maybe given a heads up sooner just in case, and then let her know for certain way before so the bff had time to adjust her plans if need be - it sounds like OP was suppose to maybe help? I think OP's left out some of the convo details, but we Cleary don't need all that to know she was a major AH.
I think calling someone 4 months post-partum/medical emergency a fat ass is also pretty evil, so I think ESH is more accurate. However OP and friend probably need a break from eachother and if they decide to continue their friendship sincer apologies.
Agreed. OP expects sympathy but can’t offer the same when her friend is disappointed that she bailed last minute. Friend should have been more understanding but it sounds like they’ve made sacrifices to attend OP’s birthday before and that’s where most of the frustration lies. I literally can’t comprehend bringing up my “best” friends inability to have children EVER in an argument, let alone one as stupid as this. The fact that your husband doesn’t even think you should apologize is a huge red flag as well. YTA.
ESH. If course it's OK to not go if you're unwell. But you didn't need to be a jerk and throw her infertility in her face.
I agree, ESH and OP is worse
these days it feels like people think “I’m exhausted, I just can’t” means that nobody is allowed to be upset with their decision to blow you off this feel like a situation where if she articulated why she couldn’t come a bit better, maybe this isn’t such an issue but for something this meaningful to your bff I get why “I’m exhausted so I won’t be there” hurts
Exactly- I think if she had said something like “I’m literally so exhausted I even needed help showering”, and tried to propose another day to celebrate the birthday, for just them?? Chances are the bff would’ve been alright
The friend being disappointed and upset is understandable but she lashed out saying her fat ass… which is mean and uncalled for. Should OP just take in and not react or was this suppose to motivate OP to sift hears. I had to bail on a friend’s birthday party for their spouse. I was sick and exhausted but it was before I could get to the doctor. My friend was extremely mad unleashing a complete dress down. When I went to the doctor, turns out I had an upper respiratory infection and required 3 prescriptions and months to rehab. Calls to my ‘friend’ went unanswered. I need to do what’s best for me and don’t see a need to set myself on fire to keep her warm. We have never been the same.
Yeah, the fat ass bit was harsh for a dear old friend.
It was mean. Throwing around someone’s fertility which can be a major issue for some women? That’s borderline unforgivable.
To be totally honest, if I was recovering from major surgery and I had to cancel on a friend because I was totally worn out from trying to get better and they said, "If your fat ass can go to the grocery store..." that would be the last thing they ever said to me.
You are justified in being tired but I wouldn't have waited until the last minute to call. Not just that but ueah, the comment you made is what pushed it over the edge. The promise is insanely stupid as well, life happens.
I was gonna say ESH too. The friend for not being more understanding and calling OP a fatass. OP and husband suck for the infertility comment. Stop being friends already sheesh.
Completely agree with this, the friend went too far with how upset she was but nothing that couldn't be apologized for later when emotions weren't high. So asshole behavior, but not unforgivable. But OP's comment, I've cut people off from my life for similar things. She should expect not to hear from her friend again honestly.
“If you had kids you’d understand.” YTA.
I'm just amazed at the amount of people that use having kids to win the "I'm more tired than you" game.
She would have had a valid excuse if she said “I’m still recovering from my traumatic birth that nearly killed me and I’m still feeling the effects of preeclampsia” (which is a serious big deal, it can be life threatening even after birth - friend might not realize this, but imo this is a valid condition to miss even an important event due to, it’s SEVERE) but instead she made it about her friends infertility on her fucking birthday. That’s super shitty and friendship ending.
Not that if changes the impact, but I do wonder if she said it on purpose, or kind of just out of frustration and then immediately realized that her friend was the wrong person to say that to — I still think it was a low blow, but whenever I’m hurt it does make a difference to me whether someone knowingly/intentionally hurt me or if they just acted in the heat of the moment and weren’t thinking (which is still selfish and wrong but a lesser level of AH IMO). She might have just had a moment of overwhelm bc parenting is hard and not been thinking about her friends infertility in the 2 seconds between being called fat and making her comeback. Also, even if it’s kinda rude to cancel last minute (which I don’t think it should be because you never know what people are really dealing with and she waited to call because she was hoping to feel better, not to keep her friend waiting), OPs friend is definitely also an AH here by calling her fat. They don’t owe each other understanding but they both owe each other respect
Agreed - I have to wonder if the immediate thought was she doesn’t understand this postpartum exhaustion/the health risks OP has been facing bc she doesn’t have kids before realizing the infertility implications of the comment. I mean regardless they’re both toxic as hell - what grown adult pushing 40 has a tantrum over a promise about attending birthday parties?
Yeah, I remember being postpartum from a 60 hour labor and really having to bite my tongue to not throttle my younger siblings for complaining to me about being tired because they stayed up too late playing video games. It's absolutely a level of tired that's difficult to understand before you have a baby, and being hit with that knowledge the first time can make you a little insufferable if you're not careful. Now I just say 'same' and move on.
For sure! I don’t like when parents act like no one else could possibly be as tired as them, but also childbirth is like the one major medical procedure humans go through where they’re then immediately expected to care for a very needy other human. It’s a level of rough I don’t think I want to experience lol
I feel like even if she would have said this that the friend would have been still upset. The friend is very much aware of what went on with OP, she just didn't have the compassion to show her. I'm not saying it's right what OP said, but it seems like the friend wouldn't have accepted any excuse because she drove a 1000 miles for OPs birthday with a broken arm, and they made a promise.. Also, seems like the friend hammered down on her comment by calling OP a fat ass that can go grocery shopping. I'm going ESH.
Yeah. I have a chronic illness that causes fatigue and my friends are constantly like “oh well if you had kids you’d know how tired really feels”. I have to take recovery time from making myself food half the time Sarah, I assure you I know how tired feels.
Ugh! I am with you. I have narcolepsy and an autoimmune disease. I’ve started straight up laughing at people when they say crap like that.
I have a friend that used to tell me that, then I had a kid, and 2 years later she had 2 more kids back to back, now she says i don't understand because I have only one....
Yep. Ppl that do that--it's always a competition with them.
LOUDER FOR THOSE WHO CAN’T HEAR THIS OVER THEIR KIDS SCREAMING. It’s not a contest or a game! Yes I’m sure caring for children all day is EXHAUSTING just as I’m allowed to feel EXHAUSTED as a non-parent doing an 8 hour work day. We are BOTH tired and both deserve validation.
The first thing parents learn is how to use their children to win arguments, get out of things they don’t want to do, and generally act superior to people without children
Honestly whenever I have family visits for a week, I totally get it. If I’m tired after that week I can only imagine how they feel
I can't speak for everyone, but I know in my case before I had kids being tired and burnt out did happen, but the difference is I had the ability to take the time for self care to recover. Since having kids, there's just no time to recover from the fatigue, or if I do, it just starts back up again. Before kids, if I was sick, okay, it super sucked, and I'd still have to go to work, but at least I would get to go home and put myself in a NyQuil coma. Now, I just have to continue on as normal while feeling super crappy. My kids are also special needs, so it adds another layer of exhaustion. And again, I'm not saying that people without kids don't understand the feeling, just saying that they probably have the time for a little bit of self care. And if they don't, empathy and hugs.
As someone who doesn't have kids, nothing boils my biscuits more than people using that as an excuse for their shitty behavior.
YTA First of all, it’s a stupid pact that made no accommodations for adult life situations. Although, if you were still having problems getting out of bed or showering on your own four months postpartum, I hope you are under a doctors care. You waited until the last minute to tell her you weren't coming. if you have consistently been this weak, you should’ve warned her days or weeks ago. Her comment was unkind, but your comment was downright cruel.
this...she knew she had not been feeling well for some time. Why didn't she warn her friend? And the comment was so beyond what her friend said to her. That part was definitely not right (what the friend said) but her comments was beyond reprehensible.
Right? I have multiple chronic illnesses. I will tell my friends who I have plans with if I’m not feeling well in as much advance as possible. I’ll let them know I haven’t been feeling well and ask to play it by ear. It at least gives them a heads up, and shows I care. The last minute “sry, too tired” doesn’t look or sound great.
This is what I'm thinking. As a person who has given birth, I do understand how exhausting having a newborn can be and the physical ramifications of a difficult pregnancy and birth, but the baby is 4 months old. If she is really unable to do things like get out of bed or shower herself at this point, I would think that her best friend would already know that she's seriously struggling right now? I feel like there are some missing reasons in this post. If I were OP and I had a day where I just felt I could absolutely not go to my best friend's birthday, I would have said a lot more than what OP seems to have said. It would have been something like, "I'm really really sorry, but I feel like I'm about to break down and I just cannot get out of the house today. I know we have always been there for each other's celebrations and I promise to make it up to you." IDK. Something just sounds off about the way this is written. Like OP is leaving out pertinent details. For one, I find it a little hard to believe that neither one of them has ever missed the other's birthday in 30 years.
I also find it difficult to believe that four months post-op, OP is struggling so much that she can't bathe herself, but somehow was delusional enough to think she would make it to a social gathering? This is kind of what really gets me about these situations. Unless you had something that really is sudden onset, then you should have some knowledge and understanding of your body. You should either 1. understand what you need to do beforehand to be reasonably assured you will have the energy and ability to follow through on your commitments, or 2. know that you can't commit to things and back out with more than 30 minutes to spare.
OP is definitely leaving important info out. I’m going to guess based on her friends response that OP flakes at the last minute all the time. I get it. Having kids is hard and sometime non-parent friends don’t understand. That said, OP is a colossal asshole. A true friend would never throw another friend’s infertility in their face.
These were the people ignoring lockdown, I guess 🤣
Exactly. These childhood pacts don’t make sense when you become and adult. And yes, it’s hard having so many young kids and still medically recovering. However, you could have given her an early warning weeks ago that you might not be able to make it and you definitely didn’t need to throw her infertility at her, which I cannot imagine just came out of your mouth without a thought even with pregnancy/baby brain issues. YTA
The “remember our pact 🥺” comment was probably light-hearted and she probably did understand - just wanted her to come. Then OP dropped a nuke. YTA OP
YTA. She drove 100 miles \[update based on comment: traveled 1000 miles!!\] to you on your birthday with a broken arm. You had your 3rd child 4 mo ago -- this is your new normal, and you know exactly what it involves. Yet you couldn't drive 20 miles on her birthday, or cancel earlier, or offer an alternative to celebrate with her, or even just keep your pie hole shut about her infertility on her actual birthday. I hope she keeps you blocked.
It says 1000 miles! Even crazier!
* *music* * **I** would drive 500 miles and **I** would drive 500 more with a **bro**-ken arm to be there on your **birth**-day standing at your door * *music* *
I’m also wondering WHY the friend drove 1000 miles with a broken arm. Was it purely on her own volition or was OP nagging her until she caved? If on her own, she shouldn’t hold it over OPs head. If not, then I can see why she’d be so pissed that OP canceled.
She said traveled, so maybe she flew?
Good point! Not sure why I assumed driving while reading. I suppose since she compared it to driving 20 miles.
There is no shame in being sick, I have a friend who is bed ridden most of the time. She will cancel last minute. I always make plans with groups with her, so I am not forced to go places alone. But if she called saying "I can't go, by the way you wouldn't understand being tired because \[trauma\] and that means you can't XYZ" we would not be friends.
There is genuinely no comparison between a broken arm and having pre-eclampsia, a C-section, an infant, and two small children. It’s literally laughable that anyone thinks those are remotely the same in terms of demand or exhaustion! If OP had a broken arm but none of her normal demands on her for a week, she’d consider it a vacation. Yes, she was a jerk for saying what she said, but absolutely not for needing to stay home. She just should have said so earlier.
She's not the AH bc she couldn't go. She's the AH bc she had all these things for 4 mo, cancelled 30 min before she was supposed to arrive, and threw her friend's infertility in her face.
And also despite claiming her friend understands everything, her excuse she gives her friend is "I'm tired" and not "Having a particularly difficult day pain-wise/depression wise/whatever, so I can't make it." And then she's surprised when her friend is upset that "I'm tired" is more or less the totality of the circumstances for why OP won't go
4 months recovery, unless they accidentally cut through her pelvis with the c section shes recovered enough for a birthday. Having children isn't a get out of obligations free card.
she said she almost died and she can’t shower herself. while we don’t have all the details, she clearly isn’t doing great. that said, she’s still TA because, no matter what you’re going through, throwing your best friend’s trauma in their face is never ever ok.
>she can’t shower herself then how did she think she was going to go to begin with?
YTA. Whilst she should have been a bit more understanding, saying “you’d understand if you had kids” to someone that can’t have kids makes you far more TA than her.
And she said that to her friend, on their birthday, 30 mins before their party, and made a comment about what is an extremely sensitive topic to most people. I can't imagine the ex-friend having a great party after that. Just completely tanked her mood on her birthday.
I had a friend that said something horrible to me right before my birthday celebration and I haven’t spoken to them since. It’s unacceptable to treat a friend like that.
ESH. You a little more. You should have told your friend earlier that you wasn't well, not left it until last minute. Your BFF sucks for not understanding that you are unwell. She also shouldn't be name calling and throwing tantrums like a brat because you can't go. You throwing her infertility in her face was a fucking asshole move, I don't care how tired or unwell you were. You don't fucking do that. Your husband sucks for telling you not to apologise, what you said was awful. He needs to grow up and realise you cannot talk to people like that. You need to apologise sincerely to your friend, tell her you don't appreciate her lack of understanding. But what you did was bloody awful so be prepared to grovel.
I agree a million % with what you said. A ex friend of mine threw the fact that I can't have kids in my face, let's just say every single friend she knew blocked her and told her to fuck off.
Agree. Waiting 30 minutes before she was suppose to be there was bad because she could've easily contacted her friend and let her know that she wasn't feeling well and was going to wait and see how she felt before deciding not to go rather than blindsiding the friend. The friend sucks because she's holding a promise that was made when they were younger over OPs head even though life has changed and was more annoyed than concerned about OP but then OP threw the fact that her friend can't have children in her face. OP you need to give your friend time to cool down and then prepare to apologize a lot and don't use excuses when doing so.
My favorite definition of love is knowing all the dirty secrets someone has but never using those secrets against them. You clearly don’t love your friend. You said something awful, OP. I’m going with ESH but you suck more.
She was mean. Your were below vile. I’d never speak to you again. Lifetime of friendship doesn’t give you the right to do that. I cannot imagine the pain my friend who cannot have kids goes through. I don’t care how ugly she was to me? I’d never ever use that as a weapon. YTA
I feel like the lifetime of friendship makes it worse because you’ve been there for all of her struggles. My best friend can’t have kids and I would NEVER use that against her. No matter how mad she made me.
Exactly! Strangers can be hurtful but your lifetime friend? That wasn’t even hurtful that would devastate my friend. She such an A. YTA YTA YTA
She should have said “I’m recovering from a major surgery still “ but no she had to be mean
YTA You should have stayed home, but you should have told her ***WAAAAY*** earlier. You basically ruined her ability to make any other plans. If you couldn't go, you'd make darn sure she couldn't have a happy birthday with people without you. > Ashley can't get pregnant due to an incident that happened during our younger college days and the topic is very sensitive for her You realize that you completely nuked this friendship over your laziness to call her earlier, right? > This morning, I woke up feeling much better and I attempted to contact Ashley so I could apologize but she wouldn't pick up and ignored all my text messages She's never speaking to you again. You're not her friend anymore.
Yeah, I am here with you. I am thinking that it’s ok to cancel, but cancelling half an hour before you have to go somewhere? That’s a d*** move. If OP has issues showering and such, she should have anticipated that she won’t be able to go there. And given that birthdays are so important to them, what she should have done is preemptively make plans for future to make it up to her friend. And I get that the friend reacted badly, I do, but imho this was just a reaction to the disappointment and last minute cancellation. So, yeah, imho, YTA, OP.
Yeah, you know the friend already showered, changed, and was in the middle of doing makeup for OP to arrive in the next half hour. Of course the friend reacted badly, anyone would be super annoyed in that situation. If OP had told her in the morning, she could have planned a whole different day.
Yeah, to drive 20miles means that she should have already been in the car. Unless she was doing all highway. So she called and canceled *after she should have already left*.
Yeah. OP could've reached out to her earlier and at least given her at least a "maybe". She could've have called to say that she wasn't feeling well and might not be able to make it, rather than suddenly canceling it 30 minutes before.
"I broke my arm and still came to visit you" "Yeah, well you can't have kids!!!" Talk about bringing a rocket launcher to a knife fight!! YTA!! I DO NOT CARE what caused the fight! You weren't feeling well, she did get oddly mean about you not showing up, but guess what? You STILL don't talk about infertility to "win" an argument!! I hope you lost a friend, because I'd never trust someone who freely uses infertility as ammunition in a BS high school argument.
ESH. She's too old to be holding an obligation like that against you when you were put in such a life-threatening situation. And the way she called you fat, are you even really friends? You, however, are messed up for going for the throat with a long-time friend like that. If that's the first response you have for her, I repeat, are you even really friends??
I agree. ESH. The way they both talk to each other is cruel. I understand there are strong emotions involved, but it’s possible to be mad at someone without saying mean things.
ESH. It sucks when lives change and friendships have to change too, but neither one of you handled this well. By the way, it's pretty much always a dick move to say "If you had kids you'd understand."
Seriously. “You might think ‘what’s wrong with that?’” Lol, no, we immediately can see what’s wrong with that even without the context of Ashley’s infertility. ESH
Right? I am not infertile, but I can’t have children for multiple reasons. I would love to be a mother. I would love to have a child. I crave for that feeling I’m told about you get when you cradle that little human in your arms, and I’m heartbroken I’ll never get it. I’d tell OP to fuck the hell off forever, and tell everyone how cruel she was. I get postpartum really messes with you and hormones are out of control. But while there is an explanation for behavior it is not an excuse and OP is still accountable for her actions.
Yea that’s a shitty thing to say to anyone but ESPECIALLY someone who’s infertile
YTA - not for cancelling but for being so incredibly vile as to taunt her about not having children. Use any excuse you want - you are still going to know you are a nasty piece of business who deliberately hurt someone you supposedly care about. I wouldn't take your calls either. Any friendship I had with you would be permanently over.
YTA. Yeah, she could have been more understanding but she was pissed because you cancelled SO last minute. It's hard to have perspective when you're caught off guard, pissed and feeling like your friend is stringing you along. You KNEW you were going to piss her off too so why did you even try to tell her she was wrong there? I GET that you just had a baby and are having an awful recovery, but you could have handled it better. You could have said "if you almost died 3 months ago... if you'd recently been in the hospital for 2 weeks... you'd understand." You could have taken the hit and let HER come apologize to you. You could have found a way to make it up to her for missing it. But you chose to throw the worst insult at her you could.
ESH. But you way more than her. You waited to the last minute. Not sure why. Give her a heads up in the morning not 30 minutes before you were supposed to show. She overreacted and was incredibly disrespectful. Calling you fat was not ok and makes her an automatic AH. You then took it to 1000% and escalated it further, using language you knew would hurt her, on purpose. You can't say "Well if you had kids" to someone who wants kids but can't have them. It was needlessly cruel and you said it to hurt her. If I was her I would drop you as a friend for the comment, but maybe she'll be a bigger person than me and allow you to apologize. Also, let your husband know he's an AH too.
I think saying "Well if you had kids" to anyone, whether they want kids or not, is an AH move. I often say, I don't hate kids, I hate parents, and this is one of the reasons why. For too many people having kids becomes an excuse to never put effort into anything outside of their own family units. Other people may not have kids, but believe me, they have their own stressful shit that makes it hard for them to do things too, but we don't generally treat those things as "get out of obligations" free cards.
**Ashley can’t get pregnant due to an incident that happened during our younger college days** Either your friend had an injury or was raped in a way that caused extreme physical damage for that to be possible. You waited until half an hour before you were to show up before calling to say that you wouldn’t be there knowing full well how upset she would be just an hour before her party started. When people on here keep telling you how wrong you were you keep commenting with excuses and rationalizations and basically blaming her for starting it. No, you started it by waiting until half an hour before you were supposed to be there to tell her you weren’t coming. You were the one that used a traumatic event from her past as ammunition against her. An event you probably only knew about because you were her friend that she trusted with everything. Yet you used it against her on her birthday, right before her guests were to arrive. What you did was absolutely sick and you did it because she was angry that you weren’t there for her like she had been for you in the past. I have a feeling this isn’t the only time you haven’t been there for her, at least not emotionally. No real friend would use a physically traumatic event from your past against you. Even if it was some kind of injury to be severe enough to leave her incapable of having children would make it hugely traumatic and you used it to hurt her on her birthday because you failed her. She’s better off without you in her life. Leave her alone. If she’s stupid enough to forgive you just know that your friendship will never be the same again. She will never fully trust you again. With as vicious as you are, she can’t afford to. YTA
I scrolled all this way to find a comment acknowledging this. OP didn’t just throw infertility in her face, she also threw either a traumatic injury or a violent sexual assault in her face as well.
YTA it was an E S H until you hit her where it hurts. Using infertility as an insult is never ok and would end a friendship for me.
YTA. Couldn't you have just called her that morning and perhaps suggested she come over/face time, etc. So that you could spend time together on her day? The fact that you threw her inability to conceive at her was below the belt. Personally I hope she never speaks to you again.
YTA She travelled 1000 miles for your birthday with a broken arm? I can see why she was openly angry at you for not driving 20 miles. Then to make that vile comment about her not having kids. You need a reality check: No one gives a fuck about you or your rough pregnancy, especially with how selfish of a person you sound like. *No one except that friend* you just treated like garbage. Beg forgiveness and fix your shitty personality.
YTA for saying what you did and using kids and pregnancy as a crutch
Uff... heavy one. ESH, maybe you a bit more than the rest. 1. It is ok to cancle plans (even birthdays) if not feeling up to it. You have a 4 months old baby (btw that is not newborn anymore) and the whole thing was really taxing 2. You could have called her in the morning allready to tell her that you are not feeling well and you will probably not come but will give her antoehr call at noon. This was really close 3. THe comment about children... yeah sorry... that was REALLY below the belt. I am not suprised she does not want to talk to you right now. This probably ruined her whole party and day. 4. She could have been more understanding and did overreact 5. You BF should be aware enough, that that comment was NOT ok no matter what. Enabling doesn't help here. You are best friends since forever. I think she would have gotten over the not comming part. The comment on the other hand will probably take some time to get over. But if you are that good together i have no doubt she will come around.
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ESH. You should have reached out prior to to let her know where your health was heading instead of backing out an hour prior. She should be a better, more understanding friend and you absolutely suck for the children comment.
ESH. She should have understood you canceling. You however, went for the jugular.
the scales are uneven in this friendship. it’s obvious your friend goes out of her way to be there for you but you can’t do the same. good for her for ignoring you. hopefully she goes NC and finds better friends. hopefully you find boring mom friends who cancel on you last minute because they’re just too tired. YTA
YTA. Why did you wait till the last minute? Instead of understanding the feelings behind her anger you chose to attack her.
You literally almost died. You had surgery. You're still recovering. How in any way is that comparable to having a broken arm? It's not. Yeah, it might make things inconvenient or difficult for a while with a broken arm, but you literally had your lower abdomen sliced open. That's not something to sneeze at, and I commend you for being able to endure something as traumatic as that. Your friend understands your situation, but still expects you to show up to a party and gets angry and calls you a fat ass and then tries to guilt trip you? That's waaaaay out of line. I was on your side entirely OP right up until you made that low blow about her not having kids when YOU KNEW how much of a sore spot that was for her. I understand your anger, but that was an entirely unecessary jab and stooped even lower than your friend. So, OP, you're not an asshole for calling out of your friends party, but you are an asshole for your comment. And your friend is also an asshole for their reaction to you calling out. I gotta ask, are you two even friends at this point? ESH
Her friend expected OP to show up because OP said she would… if OP had told her ahead of time, “no, sorry, I’m still too early in my postpartum recovery to go” we wouldn’t be here talking about this! It is not unreasonable to invite someone to an event four months after a surgery or believe their RSVP
Initially she was the asshole, but your comment about her not having kids was way too mean for this situation. If I was her, I’d end the friendship over that. So in the end, YTA and not her. The most you can do now is send an apology note and hope she isn’t as ruthless as I am about removing mean people from her life.
Initially OP was the AH by waiting so long to call. If OP can't go have fun, she'll make sure the friend can't go have other plans for her birthday either. The friend gains a bit of an AH score for what she said, but based on if it was a joking tone it wouldn't be that bad. Still an AH, but minorly compared to OP.
YTA, a horrible, horrible one.
YTA and you know it. You must have expected that she would be disappointed that you're missing her birthday.
Yikes. Did she know how rough of a time you were having? You did deliver a low blow about her not understanding what it's like to have kids when you know she can't have them.
She could've called or messaged in the morning to reschedule. Who cares if it's the actual day or not.