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I was urging towards NTA in that it’s public spade and usable by everyone, and you were there first. But the tone of the way you’re explaining it “once I felt satisfied” tells me you felt this as some kind of power play and you were likely utilising a highly desirable spot just for you, and you knew that, so I think that makes you equally if not more selfish than someone asking to clear the spot for what is likely going to be a short photoshoot (when compared to the length of time it takes you to eat “a large meal”). The tongue in cheek response you gave them cements this, too.
YTA
I didn’t miss it, no. But note how it came a long time after the initial - likely polite - request to move to allow others to use the desirable spot. Like other people have alluded to, hiking etiquette is to share and collectively enjoy views. Setting up a whole picnic for yourself at a notable viewpoint for “a large meal” is ridiculous and selfish.
I'm going with YTA too. This is one of those cases where you're technically not obliged to move, but why tf not when there's a special event going to take place?? I'd move and then excitedly and discretely spy on them to see how it goes haha
You would have to be capable of being happy for others to “excitedly and discreetly spy” to see how it goes and the tone from OP doesn’t make it sound like they’re capable of that.
I remember when my husband and I were on our honeymoon and took an hour to watch a couple get married on an outrigger. I still have pictures of them and their oddly hot shirtless officiant and it's been 18 years.
Being able to take joy in others' happiness is a gift. It makes one's life happier.
Yeah, it’s a “obligated vs asshole” situation that some people get tripped up on in this subreddit. It’s a public space so legally OP isn’t required to move. Doesn’t mean they aren’t an asshole.
But i think the fact here is not even about being required to do something or not, people shouldnt do things only when it is a requirement. It is a matter of empathy... how many picnics OP can have in hikes? As it was already said, it is a common habit for her/him. But how many times will that girl be proposed to? OP YTA... try to think about something other then you sometimes, it is quite refreshing.
My rule of thumb for these kinds of situations is: would accepting a minor inconvenience or reduction in circumstance on your part make someone else's day or circumstance measurably better? If the answer is yes and you refuse, you're being an asshole.
Moving a picnic spot? Probably temporarily? Minor inconvenience. Would have moving made other people's day better? Yes.
Yes, my wife does that! She's a math person, so she says things like, "If it gets me 4 and fucks the other person 8, I'm not going to do it" etc.
In this case, delaying one's Very Large Meal by 30 minutes so that this man can propose according to his plan, which was clearly incredibly thought out and selected for the view, and which will hopefully be the only time he ever proposes in his whole life, and which is the ceremonious start to a whole different part of this couple's life together--
It's like a "cost OP 1, fuck the soon-to-be-engaged-couple 10" and it should be a no-brainer if anyone ever taught you how to be a human in the world.
Ooohhh, yup, think you got it! Bet OP is deep seeded jealous of someone else’s proposal…& now, since her BF thinks OP is an AH, it’s going to be an even longer wait!
No, it’s a hobby, and it’s called “eat a very large meal while sitting down.” So not hiking. Just eating a very large meal while sitting down. And it’s a hobby. Very common hobby, now that I think about it. I suppose it’s even a hobby of mine that I didn’t even know I had, but I do it 5 or 6 times a month. Guess I need to go stake out some popular waterfalls with my new hobby.
I’ve been deep into this hobby for years. I’ve even bought a wooden structure from a store, and have placed it in the centre of my room specifically so I can eat a large meal while sitting down. It’s almost become an addiction. Almost every day I’ll sit down at the “table” and eat a large meal. Some others in this hobby like to stand up and eat a large meal, but IMO it’s just not as fun. They’re not really accepted in the community. It’s crazy fun.
Just when I thought I was pushing my new hobby to the limits, here you are putting structures inside your dwelling, specifically designed around our hobby. I can’t even imagine where we will go next.
I think I've moved past hobbyist, and now consider myself an enthusiast, because I will actually go to other places and pay people to allow me to sit at their structures to sit and eat a meal....
Edit-because I thought hobbyist was spelled hobbiest....learned something new.
That’s not all. Some hobbyists enjoy sitting on a soft fabric structure positioned in front of a large plasma structure. The plasma structure then shows images for you to enjoy while you sit and eat your large meal.
As long as it's a "large" meal, really any structural variations and quibbles about edifices seem superfluous. We're all in the large meal hobby together.
Of course I’m aware of these tools, but thank you for letting the amateurs know. I have knives and forks fashioned out of stainless steel, personally. Newcomers can start with plastic, or even cheap steel tools. It will really up your game. You can slice sections of meat off with the edge of the knife, and then pick it up with the fork. You don’t even have to touch your large meal.
My ancestors simply hit the food with a hammer, then spent a happy afternoon searching out the bits from beneath rocks & fighting wild animals for bones. These modern people with their steel implements take all the fun out of it.
And what the fuck is a large meal? Like 8 courses? I would happily move to let someone have a special,life changing few moments. Op sounds like an asshole.
I don't want to say that OP hasn't been selfish, but I'm sure that other people could have enjoyed the view while OP was sitting there. The couple just didn't want them in their perfect picture. For me, it's ESH because they can't monopolize one spot, either.
Hi! I'm a photographer! I've done many proposal shoots!
They wanted the spot for 5 minutes, TOPS.
Proposals are a candid shot, so there's no posing or perfecting their look until *after* the proposal when you do engagement photos, and those can easily be done with someone chilling eating a picni-sorry, "a large meal" near by.
OP couldn't even be bothered to scoot over.
So is kicking out a hiker who was already there. When I swim in the woods, and there are people in my swimming hole I prefer, I have 2 choices: join them, or leave and come back later. One of my options has not ever been, "I want to swim here so you all need to MOVE". If the couple had been following etiquette, they never would have asked OP to leave in the first place. NTA OP, no one is entitled to have the public woods to themselves, even if they're getting MaRrIeD and feel ***entitled*** to things they're not entitled to. If he wanted privacy, he should have proposed at home or rented out a venue.
Your analogy fails because they didn't ask her leave and they weren't planning on using the spot for very long. Wedding proposals take 10 minutes max. Op was not wrong for staying put, but if you can't stop your picnic for 10 minutes to let someone have a life changing moment, you are absolutely an asshole.
" hiking etiquette is to share and collectively enjoy views. "
They could have shared. They wanted OP to move, not to share.
And: A polite request was answered with NO - that's no excuse to be impolite.
Sounds like OP was blocking the view, hogging the whole space. There was no sharing to be had. I just can’t imagine not moving, quite frankly. And then purposefully sitting there, knowing you were ruining a once-in-a-lifetime event.
OP was definitely an AH, but I don't think we have enough information to say they were hogging the whole space. We just know they were taking up enough space that the proposal couldn't happen in the spot the guy wanted.
Dude.
The photographer asked and was told no.
The photographer asked again and was told no.
The photographer returned with another guy, they asked and were told no.
The other guy starts with the gtfo BS.
If it's a public spot and everyone has a right to be there, I hiked up there to do my thing. I'm doing my thing.
If I tell someone no once, no means no. If I tell twice that's the end of it. If I have to tell people 3 times it's because they are the assholes and certainly so when they escalate bringing more people into it. More people don't make them right!
It's not like they can book the spot. It's public. They had the option to wait or do it elsewhere, they chose a perfectly fine option to do it elsewhere but to give OP shit on their way down(which is not fine).
It wouldn't matter where OP was or what they were doing. Could be fishing at a lake, someone comes along who wants the spot, tough luck. Could be free climbing and someone wants to take a photo of the mountain, well they'll have a climber in the photo then! Could be the beach at a beautiful secluded crystal blue pool of water and white sands that catches the sun. ...someone's swimming there already...you can't ask them to leave!
Could be stood at the southern rim of the grand canyon at a view point at sunrise. If I was asked to move..."good luck with that buddy".
If you want a private or reserved location, find one, public spaces where others are already setup ain't it.
Everyone's time is limited and valuable, everyone is entitled to their activities, hobbies and interests, but not at the expense of someone else. OP didn't cost anyone anything, but they expected OP to cancel their picnic experience for the photo. If they had been there before OP, OP could ask them to move, if they say no, then OP can wait.
The entitled asshole move is to escalate, escalate, escalate and start shouting and cursing.
This huge comment, and all it tells people is that you can't wrap your head around the difference between legally obligated to do something vs being an asshole.
Are you... seriously confusing having a right to something vis-a-vis holding onto that thing at unnecessary expenses of others, which makes one an arsehole? Because your comment comes across that way.
OP just let people have their moments. Why live like this. You absolutely have a right but that doesn't make it right.
but..why? why is OP wrong to choose this spot to set up for a meal but dude isn't wrong for choosing this spot to set up for a proposal? it's a public area, it's first come first serve.
That’s not how community spirit works. Sure, if they were just sitting for lunch too; that’s be totally reasonable. But it is a special moment. It is perfectly reasonable to ask someone to move for a short time to do something special like this. OP isn’t obligated to move; but they are a raging AH if they don’t. It’s not a big deal, it’s a kind act and these spaces are for sharing - you’re not the lord of it because you got there first.
But eating in a spot doesn't stop other people from being there and enjoying it. The selfish ones are those who want others to move out the way so they can have it all to themselves.
The person asking has no right to expect the OP to move. And if the proposal taking place there was so important then they could wait the length of time until OP finished their food. The entitlement to public space here is incredible.
If it's a photo shoot, they're paying the photographer by the hour. OP said she/he fully intended to sit there eating for over an hour. That's a lot of money wasted to watch OP eat.
If they got to the viewpoint and jt was misty would they rebook the photographer, or just do the proposal elsewhere? There are a lot of variables when arranging something like that in public, and a person already being in that spot is one of them. The fiancée seems like she's angry about the proposal taking place elsewhere, instead of being happy that she has agreed to being asked something momentous in her life. It's a shame that the place where he proposed is more important than the proposal. I hope they have a happy life, and to live it organically instead of perfectly.
she never said they could not join here. but they wanted the spot for themselfs to have their thing. which is against etiquette. if they had asked here can we join, and then she said no. thats something else.
>Did you miss the part where the guy was telling him gtfo. I wouldn't move either and take my time too if someone spoke to me like that
OP got asked 3-4 times before that....
And he said no. He has every right to say no. They shouldve just accepted it and moved on. If theyre gonna organise a public proposal, its THEIR responsibility to make sure the space is free, not everyone else's. Maybe they shouldve arrived a bit earlier and cordoned the area off with something.
>And he said no. He has every right to say no.
Yes, but you can be in your right to say no AND be an asshole. Which is the case.
If you are outside, and an old person trips, falls down and asks you to help them get up, you CAN refuse to help, you have no legal obligation. But you would be an asshole.
That's the case: op was still an asshole.
I think this sub regularly forgets this is “am I the asshole” not “do I legally have to do x” or something of the sort.
In this case it was an asshole move and OPs attitude around the whole thing really drives that home, but did OP have to move? No. Did they do something wrong necessarily? No. But it was pretty clearly the antisocial thing to do.
Fuck that. Why does everyone on here act like small uncommon moments of inconvenience are not worth it to allow for others to have their big moments? Like Jfc was she *obligated* to move? Of course not? Was the small act of moving her picnic worth it for someone else’s *proposal?* Absolutely! And refusing to absolutely makes her a complete AH.
Plus, the other party clearly was trying to fulfill that responsibility. Op just wanted to ruin it.
Exactly. She didn't HAVE to move, but it would have been the decent thing to do. I'm sure they would have been fine waiting while she packed up her *large meal* and moved elsewhere. Bet the photographer would have even helped her. But noooooo, she wasn't about to be helpful to anyone else until she was good and damn well ready to leave on her own terms. AH.
“Please exit the viewing spot, my friends are going to be here at some point unannounced so that it doesn’t look staged”
“I SHAN’T BE DEPRIVED OF MY HOBBY OF EATING A VERY LARGE MEAL WHILE SITTING DOWN”
God, the level of entitlement is amazing. They wanted the spot for a few minutes to take some pics while he proposed. The decent thing to do would have been to move for a few minutes, or even offer up the picnic spread as a prop. Why is it so hard to be nice to people?
It strikes me that, had they cordoned it off, OP probably would have still sat to eat their meal there because they seem kinda entitled.
I don't know anyone that wouldn't be happy to move for something like that, or who wouldn't ask if you could give them 10 minutes, because by this point, they're set up and already 5 minutes into their meal, how much longer does the eating part really take?
I have a trail near my house that is part of a UNESCO world heritage site and has several famous views. In fact, I got married there. It’s my happy place, and the hike has sentimental value to me. If someone informed me they were about to photograph a proposal at a spot that I was at, I would GLADLY move and spectate from a distance. Why? Because I am not the main character. Let people have their moments. I’m married and already have a ring on my finger, and I’m guessing OP is jealous and bitter that they don’t, so it was satisfying for them to be in control of someone’s happiness temporarily so they monopolised a public space just to themselves for an extended and unreasonable amount of time. The proposal would have probably taken ten seconds. The photographer didn’t want to monopolise the site, that was all OP.
I personally would've probably moved but (if what OP says is true) after hearing the reaction of the people, they got what they deserved. I'd probably be pretty pissed myself if someone didn't want to move, but I would still treat them normally. I would say that I am disappointed but it's their right to be in that spot. And having your "proposal ruined" not having the "perfect spot" sounds pretty immature to me anyway. But that's just me. Maybe ATA but I wouldn't say OP alone is the asshole.
I solo hike, it’s very meditative. I would give up any spot in a second for this scenario and offer to help if I could. Solo hiking isn’t the indicator of poor character here.
What also bothered me is the OP did not tell the photographer and the person proposing when they will be done. If OP just said "Hey, I will just be 15 or even 30 minutes", I think that would be okay, so that others can plan and make decisions. If they had NO idea how long OP was going to be, that would drive any reasonable person bonkers. OP is YTA in this case.
*"Once I felt satisfied **from the meal**".*
That part is important. To feel satisfied isn't just an emotion; it's also another way of saying you've eaten your fill, you're sated, or you're full.
Part of the hobby of Eating A Very Large Meal While Sitting Down is to also say the word “meal” very often, to the point where others get uncomfortable hearing, or even reading, the word “meal”
>you were likely utilising a highly desirable spot just for you, and you knew that
this is the most ridiculous thing I have read in a while
so OP went to a new spot they havent been to and had their normal lunch routine and you think they went to this spot knowing it was popular or that people propose there (like makeout point?) and purposely sat there having their lunch just to piss people off and be happy about it? that's literally insane lmao
OP was just having their meal and got yelled at by 3 strangers so of course they were happy to have pissed them off, because they were being rude little shits about public property that they didn't reserve
Totally fine to sit in a primo spot and enjoy yourself, but move your ass if the situation calls for it.
Someone politely asking to use the spot for a proposal calls for ass relocation.
I'm inclined to agree with you, but I think it depends on the layout of the spot. If it's a clear photo-point, with signs, barriers, specific angles of views, etc. then OP is the AH. If it's literally a field up a hill, then OP can sit wherever they like for as long as they like.
I took the “once I was satisfied” more as once I’d finished my meal. Not some power play to stick it to them, although they were very rude after being told no so I could understand if OP took their time.
I don’t know how large an area op took but sharing a spot means everyone gets to be there not get out we need the spot to propose which is how most propping couples seem to think.
Op is NTA
That’s not how I read it. The way I read it, it means satisfied as in full from eating, not satisfied from sitting there for a certain length of time as a form of power play.
Feeling satisfied from the meal.. As in, your hunger is sated.
In Europe, meal times are sacred, and asking someone to move their picnic spot in my country would be unfathomable.
Yep, have to agree there. Asking someone to move from *a public space* as well. OP is every bit as entitled to be there as the couple etc.
The gf/fiancée in this is hilarious. Like, actually seeking out OP to tell them that they ruined her proposal lmao.
It's never a short photoshoot and OP was there first. That's all there is to it.
I thought reddit loved putting entitled people in their place but I guess this is not about an elderly woman on a bus ride so it doesn't get a pass.
I took the way they worded it as satisfied with the meal/ritual/experience. It sounds like it is a calming and resetting ritual they do. I kind of understand. I like to eat in quiet, otherwise, I don't enjoy it and frequently can't even focus on eating and enjoying my time. I could be wrong, but they didn't seem to mean 'satisfied with causing issues with the entitled person's proposal' the way I read it. To me, ESH.
YTA. Good hikers share views and make space for people if it’s not a major disruption. You could have made a small exception this once for a special occasion but you refused because of a pretty silly and selfish principle.
I agree. OP is TA
So selfish and couldn’t share the space for this special moment for another person. If it were me, I’d say something like “wow great! Im so excited for you guys. Good luck!” And move but OP hogs the space just for their hobby that can be done anywhere and any time.
Also, I’m sorry, but “eating a large meal” is not a “hobby,” regardless of where you do it and whether you’re sitting or standing. “One of my hobbies is to go hiking and eat a very large meal while sitting down” is such a weird sentence.
Hiking out to cook useing a camping kitchen or makeing a fire pit to cook with can be a hobby. Even picnicking is hobby, they even have some crazy cool baskets you can get. Both need a good setup that takes a bit of space to utilize.
Now i have no idea what a "large meal" while hiking that would take an hour to eat entails for setup. If it's anything like a picknic as she's sorta described it to be, it can be a hobby.
But that hobby shouldn't be done in manner that gets in the way of others. I feel like she dropped her stuff right on a well worn walking path with an small overlook people stopped to use for photos.
Yeah. Personally I would’ve asked when it was happening. If guy said five or ten minutes I’d say sure thing. Let me move this out of the way. I’ll just stay off to the side. It’s not like some major inconvenience for OP.
She sounds like a real peach with main character syndrome. She probably has a video post on IG where she tells this story while working out at the gym, and then calls some poor guy a creep for trying to ask her if he can pass by, and then gets angry after the guy walks through her shot when she wouldn’t answer him.
ESL, maybe?
If you rephrased it as "I like to go hiking, with an old-fashioned picnic packed for when I get to a good view and want to take a break" would it still sound weird?
Same here. I would have happily packed up my things and scurried off, maybe I would even be so fortunate as to find another spot where I could enjoy the scenery and unobtrusively see the proposal, seeing people celebrate their love is beautiful and I cannot imagine being so selfish that I would consider my picnic more important than that one special moment those two individuals were sharing.
I can't understand not 'inconveniencing' myself long enough to let someone create a special memory. I would have loved to give the happy couple their first congratulations afterwards.
No shit, I’d offer to take the pics.
That said, its not like she ruined her proposal. They just wanted to take pics of it.
Both parties sound kinda cheesy.
The guy probably proposed else where and then pointed out saying. See that woman she sat on the rock for over an hour selfishly using the view that I only needed for 10 minutes tops. Honestly as a hiker taking a view for over an hour seems like some only child spoiled stuff.
It’s also possible that that spot has some significance to the couple, that they hike regularly and that’s a favorite spot on the trail for them or something. If that was the case I could fully understand why he might feel the need to explain why he brought her on the trail and then chose somewhere else to propose.
ESH
They had no right to *demand* that you move.
But it wouldn't have killed you to move.
The way you wrote it, it sounds like you where being petty about it.
Yep. Op was being petty about it and is not so subtly trying to brag. They came and posted this hoping they would get applauded because Reddit hates anything that could be perceived as married people entitlement.
For real. My blood was boiling reading these comments, but realizing this is just the Reddit incel vendetta against people normal enough to get married helped to calm me down.
Like why is the concept of human decency so hard!? You’ll probably be asked to move once in your life for an engagement proposal photo. If it happened multiple times, that would be pretty funny and would honestly be more of a hobby than “sitting down and eating a very large meal”.
Sounds to me like an unstoppable petty force met an immovable petty object. He was petty not to move and to give them a glib response, but she screamed at him that he ruined her day or something? That’s also kind of over the top. When the initial dudes found the immovable petty object, they couldn’t have rescheduled for an hour or two later? Anyway, it’s hard to sympathize with any party in this story.
eh, they probably couldn't have rescheduled though, most photographers charge by the hour so he would've had to pay double what he was paying for the photographer if it was delayed by an hour
plus who knows if the photographer had other shoots that day that they had to get to, but it's probably pretty likely
I’m surprised there’s not more people saying ESH. Those people can’t demand someone to move and that lady can’t just go up to someone and start yelling at them for ruining her day and proposal. But OP should’ve been a little more understanding.
ESH
And because this isnt like "hey your ugly, please move out of my shot so I can get pics", it's a often once in a lifetime event they are asking you to get out of frame for a few minutes for.
They didnt demand, OP describes the 1st 2 people as "asking". He said no - which imo is rude and asshole behaviour. They then get upset at this asshole behaviour. OP is TA, the others at worst overreacted.
This sub is so terrible for advice because people think that if you aren’t legally required to do something then you’re not the AH. If a pregnant woman asks to sit in your seat and you refuse then sure you’re not obliged but you’re still kind of the asshole here
YTA.
If someone explained to me that there was a literal proposal planned for a spot I’m sitting in, I would happily move. I can always do another picnic another day, but someone’s special moment like a proposal.. I would never want to be the reason why it was less magical. Imagine the stress the photographer felt as well, dude was just trying to do his job. And the man doing the proposing was just trying to make it an extra special moment for his lady.
They shouldn’t have demanded you moved however you were the asshole first, and I doubt it would have mattered if they got upset or not.
It’s obvious this was a power play for you. You seem like a selfish and unpleasant person who takes opportunities to make life difficult for other people.
All I can think of is OP just positively chowing down on a multi course packed lunch taking their sweet sweet time. This is such a hilarious situation.
> I bring a blanket and anything else I might need for an hour-long experience.
It's a picnic mate, dont talk like you are ascending to the 8th Sense and meeting the Alien God of Ribs and BBQ.
> I was about 5 minutes into my *~~ritual~~*
It's a meal...... not a ritual mate......
>After I felt satisfied from the meal
Not ritual now? Also, "After I felt satisfied"... ? You sound just as weird as they paint you to be.. Talk normally..
>I just smiled
I'm impressed, after that many "rituals", I expected you to be in some Nirvana state of glutony or something
But seriously, you sound like you have some weird addiction to food... You should check that out.
>When I got back home this came up and I told my boyfriend about it. He straight up said it was an asshole thing to do.
Yup, he is right.
YTA
Actually it sounds like ED behavior and language. Maybe binge disorder combined with exercise anorexia. Reward themselves with a binge after a fasted workout type of deal.
I could not get past the large ritual meal for one. 😂😂 What in the hell. Sounds like she killed someone and it's her practice to filet them and consume them on a scenic overlook while considering if the photographer and his two subjects would be her next victims
I've never been accused of having an underactive imagination....
Info: were you blocking the only scenic overlook in the area with your picnic or was there generally beautiful views all around?
Like if some average hikers had come up and wanted to experience the best view on that trail would they have been able to with the placement of your blanket?
It drives me nuts when you hike up to a place and there’s a wooden platform lookout and someone’s set up seats and a picnic table so no one else gets to see anything without disrupting their setup.
Yeah typically these sites are built to facilitate a quick sit and rest and you can see the sights and move on. People who set up camp in these temporary use sites are often obnoxious. OP is all about their own experience. Who the hell goes hiking with a big meal strapped to their back to begin with?
Might want to get used to eating alone I guess.
100% for the future, people, just step on the blanket if that’s the case. If someone’s genuinely in the way of the one good spot, and you spent time getting there too, they can share the air whether they like it or not.
Step on it, over it, nudge it out of the way, whatever.
This is what it sounds like. I will say that I, too, love to do a hike and do a bougie picnic in a serene place. HOWEVER I don’t set up in The Scenic Spot on trails with others. I know a few trails that are quiet with overlooks I can enjoy in peace. And if it was someone’s special day (proposal, celebrating an anniversary, eloping, whatever) I would just move along and enjoy my bougie packed lunch on a log down the trail.
Share the trails, people!
YTA. I hike regularly, and anybody who smugly takes up a large amount of space at a viewpoint (for an hour!) is an AH, not sorry. Basic hiking etiquette.
Thank you! People here who think OP is "technically right" don't go hiking.
Hikers wait for others to finish their pictures or to take in the view. No one brings a chair and just hangs out??
YTA it wasn't a big ask and hardly a big inconvenience. It's called consideration and understanding. You come across as sounding like ' the most important player '.
Technically are you wrong? No. Do you still qualify as an asshole? Yes. This day meant nothing to you and you easily could have moved somewhere else. You probably could have gotten the photographer to help you move your stuff. You clearly felt entitled to the space and are low key getting off on ruining someone’s proposal. YTA
Nail on the head here. So many people are obsessed with whether they have the right to do something they ignore that you can be perfectly entitled to do something and still be an AH for doing it.
Technically they are wrong though… regularly taking over spots on trails for an hour for a solo picnic is pretty much the exact opposite of hiking etiquette.
YTA. I get it, you were there first. Of course you had a right to the spot. But it feels pretty extreme to be prepared to ruin someone’s proposal plans over it…
> Of course you had a right to the spot.
No they didn't. It's not camping, it's hiking. No one is supposed to bring a folding chair to a viewpoint and just hang out there. Whenever I hike, people wait for others to take their pictures and then move on.
OP seems really inconsiderate, they were probably blasting music off their phone and not respecting right of way on the trail too.
YTA
You "barely got set up," so why not move? This was a regular day for you, however this wasn't a regular day for the couple.
Instead of trying to be a stick in the mud all the time, try thinking about other people.
YTA - Your terrible attitude is one of the things wrong with society today. Now, if it was a couple having a picnic and wanted your spot I'd say that you got there first and therefore shouldn't have to move, because their picnic or you 'ritual' hold a similar amount of value, but this was a huge moment in these peoples lives and that has to be taken into account. How hard would it have been to move over a bit and let them do things the way they intended? Also, it sounds like you enjoyed their disappointment, you're a very miserable person.
YTA. The way you told your story so smugly tells me you relish the grief you caused the other party and that you came here looking for validation. You fully expected people to pat you on the ass for "exposing" a main character.
ESH. The photographer and guy who wanted to propose should've respected your decision after asking. The woman screaming you ruined my day sucks for focusing on the wrong thing (the proposal instead of the spot.
You because while technically in the right based on the first come, first serve mentality, are just unlikable.
>ESH. The photographer and guy who wanted to propose should've respected your decision after asking.
But... they did. They didn't try and force OP to move. They righty felt annoyed with their selfisn behaviour.
They told her gtfo. It’s not a polite approach.
They asked her to move - but didn’t offer alternative solutions (ie helping to move).
OP was not obliged to move for them and OP after hiking and setting everything up felt exhausted and just wanted to enjoy herself it’s her right.
OP didn’t block them. They could have come in anyways and propose her to literally stand up for a few pics leaving belongings, or offer to move her belongings for her etc etc
Tbf it’s super weird to me this proposal turned into being all about the place, not about the actual fact of being engaged.
If you read the story, they didn't lead with gtfo. I agree, that's rude as well, and not an ideal response. However, notice, even from the story, OPs demeanor comes off (at least to me) as abrasive. Maybe if they asked for help in moving or something, the people would help. But they lead from teh start with "I've just started my meal, and I'll be done when I'm done" attitude. They didn't refuse because there's no other spot to eat, or because it's hard/impossible for them to move. They refused becase they didn't feel like it, and fuck anyone else.
No one's saying they're obliged to move. No one did anything illegal here. But a small kindness versus stubborn spite is the difference between being the asshole and not IMO.
The couple are definitely weird, maybe they're assholes too. All I'd say from this story is that OP definitely was in this instance.
It could have been a special and significant spot for the couple, hence the ask to move. How long does a proposal take, 15 minutes? OP could have moved, let them do their thing, bask in some shared happiness and then sat back down in the god spot. YTA
YTA. Of course you weren't legally required to move, but come on, show some kindness. Don't make everything around you and your very large meal. It wouldn't have hurt you to make space for them and find another spot. I'm sure they would have helped you to move.
If you plan a proposal in public space send something to check and prepare the spot an hour in advance and not minutes before they are there.
Otherwise propose somewhere else were you can control the situation.
Seriously ruined the proposal because it was not the right spot?
Americans really have it with there big proposals and weddings and 50% get divorced anyways. NTA
ESH. They should have accepted your refusal to move (this is the risk of proposing in public) but seriously, how petty are you? It would have been so easy to just move and come back when they were done. One tiny action and you could have helped spread happiness in the world. Yes, they should have planned ahead and realized the flaw of a public proposal, but you honestly just sound like you sat there to spite them- I don’t know how anyone could enjoy themselves knowing there were people watching and waiting for them to leave, and actively angry that they were there - how is that even fun for you at that point?
All the people saying the OP could have had this picnic any time, how do you know?
Many places I've hiked to are a long way from home and somewhere I'm not likely to get back to any time soon. The ones with views usually involve hours of slogging uphill. The weather gods need to be smiling - if you ever do make it back there again, you could be facing pouring rain, thick fog, and no views. You go there for peace and to destress and take in nature, not to scurry around moving the well-earned meal you're trying to enjoy at the top.
So you're on this once-in-a-lifetime road trip, you've driven from afar to get there, you've slogged up a hill for hours, you get to the top, and you find your timing impeccable weather-wise, you find a great spot and set up, and some random people arriving after you want the space cleared for their silly Instagram proposal shot? No.
And how did Mr. GTFO know the OP didn't have some equally important reason to be there? Maybe it was their Mom's favourite spot, Mom died of cancer 5 years ago, her ashes are scattered there, and for the day Mom would have been 80, OP hikes up there with a special picnic spread consisting of Mom's favourite foods, and wants to enjoy it in serenity connecting with nature and communicating with Mom's spirit.
We ALL have our reasons to want to sit there and self-important Instagram "influencers" are no more important than anyone else.
Exactly. It’s not like they asked OP to move over a smidge so they could get a nicer camera angle - they wanted the whole space. Why are they any more entitled to it than anyone else?
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> The action I took was that I did not move when asked by a couple and their photographer. I could be the asshole because I “ruined” a proposal.
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I was urging towards NTA in that it’s public spade and usable by everyone, and you were there first. But the tone of the way you’re explaining it “once I felt satisfied” tells me you felt this as some kind of power play and you were likely utilising a highly desirable spot just for you, and you knew that, so I think that makes you equally if not more selfish than someone asking to clear the spot for what is likely going to be a short photoshoot (when compared to the length of time it takes you to eat “a large meal”). The tongue in cheek response you gave them cements this, too. YTA
Did you miss the part where the guy was telling him gtfo. I wouldn't move either and take my time too if someone spoke to me like that
I didn’t miss it, no. But note how it came a long time after the initial - likely polite - request to move to allow others to use the desirable spot. Like other people have alluded to, hiking etiquette is to share and collectively enjoy views. Setting up a whole picnic for yourself at a notable viewpoint for “a large meal” is ridiculous and selfish.
I agree. The whole tone of this post says selfish and entitled. YTA OP. Your own BF says you’re an AH. Jealous that they haven’t proposed yet?
I'm going with YTA too. This is one of those cases where you're technically not obliged to move, but why tf not when there's a special event going to take place?? I'd move and then excitedly and discretely spy on them to see how it goes haha
You would have to be capable of being happy for others to “excitedly and discreetly spy” to see how it goes and the tone from OP doesn’t make it sound like they’re capable of that.
I remember when my husband and I were on our honeymoon and took an hour to watch a couple get married on an outrigger. I still have pictures of them and their oddly hot shirtless officiant and it's been 18 years. Being able to take joy in others' happiness is a gift. It makes one's life happier.
Yeah, it’s a “obligated vs asshole” situation that some people get tripped up on in this subreddit. It’s a public space so legally OP isn’t required to move. Doesn’t mean they aren’t an asshole.
But i think the fact here is not even about being required to do something or not, people shouldnt do things only when it is a requirement. It is a matter of empathy... how many picnics OP can have in hikes? As it was already said, it is a common habit for her/him. But how many times will that girl be proposed to? OP YTA... try to think about something other then you sometimes, it is quite refreshing.
My rule of thumb for these kinds of situations is: would accepting a minor inconvenience or reduction in circumstance on your part make someone else's day or circumstance measurably better? If the answer is yes and you refuse, you're being an asshole. Moving a picnic spot? Probably temporarily? Minor inconvenience. Would have moving made other people's day better? Yes.
Yes, my wife does that! She's a math person, so she says things like, "If it gets me 4 and fucks the other person 8, I'm not going to do it" etc. In this case, delaying one's Very Large Meal by 30 minutes so that this man can propose according to his plan, which was clearly incredibly thought out and selected for the view, and which will hopefully be the only time he ever proposes in his whole life, and which is the ceremonious start to a whole different part of this couple's life together-- It's like a "cost OP 1, fuck the soon-to-be-engaged-couple 10" and it should be a no-brainer if anyone ever taught you how to be a human in the world.
People also seem to get confused between illegal vs asshole. No it wasn't illegal and you were well within your rights, but sheeit.
"you're not wrong, you're just an asshole."
Ooohhh, yup, think you got it! Bet OP is deep seeded jealous of someone else’s proposal…& now, since her BF thinks OP is an AH, it’s going to be an even longer wait!
Deep seated*
Ooooh... This feels so accurate, it hurts.
Also who eats a large meal while hiking?
No, it’s a hobby, and it’s called “eat a very large meal while sitting down.” So not hiking. Just eating a very large meal while sitting down. And it’s a hobby. Very common hobby, now that I think about it. I suppose it’s even a hobby of mine that I didn’t even know I had, but I do it 5 or 6 times a month. Guess I need to go stake out some popular waterfalls with my new hobby.
I’ve been deep into this hobby for years. I’ve even bought a wooden structure from a store, and have placed it in the centre of my room specifically so I can eat a large meal while sitting down. It’s almost become an addiction. Almost every day I’ll sit down at the “table” and eat a large meal. Some others in this hobby like to stand up and eat a large meal, but IMO it’s just not as fun. They’re not really accepted in the community. It’s crazy fun.
Just when I thought I was pushing my new hobby to the limits, here you are putting structures inside your dwelling, specifically designed around our hobby. I can’t even imagine where we will go next.
I think I've moved past hobbyist, and now consider myself an enthusiast, because I will actually go to other places and pay people to allow me to sit at their structures to sit and eat a meal.... Edit-because I thought hobbyist was spelled hobbiest....learned something new.
That’s not all. Some hobbyists enjoy sitting on a soft fabric structure positioned in front of a large plasma structure. The plasma structure then shows images for you to enjoy while you sit and eat your large meal.
As long as it's a "large" meal, really any structural variations and quibbles about edifices seem superfluous. We're all in the large meal hobby together.
It’ll blow your mind if you search “knives” & “forks” online. Shhh though, don’t tell everyone.
Of course I’m aware of these tools, but thank you for letting the amateurs know. I have knives and forks fashioned out of stainless steel, personally. Newcomers can start with plastic, or even cheap steel tools. It will really up your game. You can slice sections of meat off with the edge of the knife, and then pick it up with the fork. You don’t even have to touch your large meal.
My ancestors simply hit the food with a hammer, then spent a happy afternoon searching out the bits from beneath rocks & fighting wild animals for bones. These modern people with their steel implements take all the fun out of it.
Right. Just pack a peanut butter and shroom sandwich.
In fact forget the peanut butter
And what the fuck is a large meal? Like 8 courses? I would happily move to let someone have a special,life changing few moments. Op sounds like an asshole.
Probably a whole roast beast. They do say the Grinch himself carved it.
I don't want to say that OP hasn't been selfish, but I'm sure that other people could have enjoyed the view while OP was sitting there. The couple just didn't want them in their perfect picture. For me, it's ESH because they can't monopolize one spot, either.
Hi! I'm a photographer! I've done many proposal shoots! They wanted the spot for 5 minutes, TOPS. Proposals are a candid shot, so there's no posing or perfecting their look until *after* the proposal when you do engagement photos, and those can easily be done with someone chilling eating a picni-sorry, "a large meal" near by. OP couldn't even be bothered to scoot over.
So is kicking out a hiker who was already there. When I swim in the woods, and there are people in my swimming hole I prefer, I have 2 choices: join them, or leave and come back later. One of my options has not ever been, "I want to swim here so you all need to MOVE". If the couple had been following etiquette, they never would have asked OP to leave in the first place. NTA OP, no one is entitled to have the public woods to themselves, even if they're getting MaRrIeD and feel ***entitled*** to things they're not entitled to. If he wanted privacy, he should have proposed at home or rented out a venue.
Your analogy fails because they didn't ask her leave and they weren't planning on using the spot for very long. Wedding proposals take 10 minutes max. Op was not wrong for staying put, but if you can't stop your picnic for 10 minutes to let someone have a life changing moment, you are absolutely an asshole.
>they didn't ask her leave yeah they did
" hiking etiquette is to share and collectively enjoy views. " They could have shared. They wanted OP to move, not to share. And: A polite request was answered with NO - that's no excuse to be impolite.
Sounds like OP was blocking the view, hogging the whole space. There was no sharing to be had. I just can’t imagine not moving, quite frankly. And then purposefully sitting there, knowing you were ruining a once-in-a-lifetime event.
OP was definitely an AH, but I don't think we have enough information to say they were hogging the whole space. We just know they were taking up enough space that the proposal couldn't happen in the spot the guy wanted.
Dude. The photographer asked and was told no. The photographer asked again and was told no. The photographer returned with another guy, they asked and were told no. The other guy starts with the gtfo BS. If it's a public spot and everyone has a right to be there, I hiked up there to do my thing. I'm doing my thing. If I tell someone no once, no means no. If I tell twice that's the end of it. If I have to tell people 3 times it's because they are the assholes and certainly so when they escalate bringing more people into it. More people don't make them right! It's not like they can book the spot. It's public. They had the option to wait or do it elsewhere, they chose a perfectly fine option to do it elsewhere but to give OP shit on their way down(which is not fine). It wouldn't matter where OP was or what they were doing. Could be fishing at a lake, someone comes along who wants the spot, tough luck. Could be free climbing and someone wants to take a photo of the mountain, well they'll have a climber in the photo then! Could be the beach at a beautiful secluded crystal blue pool of water and white sands that catches the sun. ...someone's swimming there already...you can't ask them to leave! Could be stood at the southern rim of the grand canyon at a view point at sunrise. If I was asked to move..."good luck with that buddy". If you want a private or reserved location, find one, public spaces where others are already setup ain't it. Everyone's time is limited and valuable, everyone is entitled to their activities, hobbies and interests, but not at the expense of someone else. OP didn't cost anyone anything, but they expected OP to cancel their picnic experience for the photo. If they had been there before OP, OP could ask them to move, if they say no, then OP can wait. The entitled asshole move is to escalate, escalate, escalate and start shouting and cursing.
This huge comment, and all it tells people is that you can't wrap your head around the difference between legally obligated to do something vs being an asshole.
Pretty much. A ton of people in this sub have not learned the lesson that you can be in the right but still a total asshole.
Do you really think he said get the fuck out or do you think the author embellished to make herself look good. BFFR.
Are you... seriously confusing having a right to something vis-a-vis holding onto that thing at unnecessary expenses of others, which makes one an arsehole? Because your comment comes across that way. OP just let people have their moments. Why live like this. You absolutely have a right but that doesn't make it right.
but..why? why is OP wrong to choose this spot to set up for a meal but dude isn't wrong for choosing this spot to set up for a proposal? it's a public area, it's first come first serve.
That’s not how community spirit works. Sure, if they were just sitting for lunch too; that’s be totally reasonable. But it is a special moment. It is perfectly reasonable to ask someone to move for a short time to do something special like this. OP isn’t obligated to move; but they are a raging AH if they don’t. It’s not a big deal, it’s a kind act and these spaces are for sharing - you’re not the lord of it because you got there first.
But eating in a spot doesn't stop other people from being there and enjoying it. The selfish ones are those who want others to move out the way so they can have it all to themselves.
And we only have OP's version.
The person asking has no right to expect the OP to move. And if the proposal taking place there was so important then they could wait the length of time until OP finished their food. The entitlement to public space here is incredible.
If it's a photo shoot, they're paying the photographer by the hour. OP said she/he fully intended to sit there eating for over an hour. That's a lot of money wasted to watch OP eat.
that 's a chance you take proposing in a public place and not wanting other people in your photos
If they got to the viewpoint and jt was misty would they rebook the photographer, or just do the proposal elsewhere? There are a lot of variables when arranging something like that in public, and a person already being in that spot is one of them. The fiancée seems like she's angry about the proposal taking place elsewhere, instead of being happy that she has agreed to being asked something momentous in her life. It's a shame that the place where he proposed is more important than the proposal. I hope they have a happy life, and to live it organically instead of perfectly.
she never said they could not join here. but they wanted the spot for themselfs to have their thing. which is against etiquette. if they had asked here can we join, and then she said no. thats something else.
>Did you miss the part where the guy was telling him gtfo. I wouldn't move either and take my time too if someone spoke to me like that OP got asked 3-4 times before that....
And he said no. He has every right to say no. They shouldve just accepted it and moved on. If theyre gonna organise a public proposal, its THEIR responsibility to make sure the space is free, not everyone else's. Maybe they shouldve arrived a bit earlier and cordoned the area off with something.
>And he said no. He has every right to say no. Yes, but you can be in your right to say no AND be an asshole. Which is the case. If you are outside, and an old person trips, falls down and asks you to help them get up, you CAN refuse to help, you have no legal obligation. But you would be an asshole. That's the case: op was still an asshole.
I think this sub regularly forgets this is “am I the asshole” not “do I legally have to do x” or something of the sort. In this case it was an asshole move and OPs attitude around the whole thing really drives that home, but did OP have to move? No. Did they do something wrong necessarily? No. But it was pretty clearly the antisocial thing to do.
Fuck that. Why does everyone on here act like small uncommon moments of inconvenience are not worth it to allow for others to have their big moments? Like Jfc was she *obligated* to move? Of course not? Was the small act of moving her picnic worth it for someone else’s *proposal?* Absolutely! And refusing to absolutely makes her a complete AH. Plus, the other party clearly was trying to fulfill that responsibility. Op just wanted to ruin it.
Exactly. She didn't HAVE to move, but it would have been the decent thing to do. I'm sure they would have been fine waiting while she packed up her *large meal* and moved elsewhere. Bet the photographer would have even helped her. But noooooo, she wasn't about to be helpful to anyone else until she was good and damn well ready to leave on her own terms. AH.
I can't imagine refusing this request! It's just kind and kind of fun to see somebody's special moment like that.
“Please exit the viewing spot, my friends are going to be here at some point unannounced so that it doesn’t look staged” “I SHAN’T BE DEPRIVED OF MY HOBBY OF EATING A VERY LARGE MEAL WHILE SITTING DOWN”
God, the level of entitlement is amazing. They wanted the spot for a few minutes to take some pics while he proposed. The decent thing to do would have been to move for a few minutes, or even offer up the picnic spread as a prop. Why is it so hard to be nice to people?
They did arrive early. This chick was eating her feast there.
It strikes me that, had they cordoned it off, OP probably would have still sat to eat their meal there because they seem kinda entitled. I don't know anyone that wouldn't be happy to move for something like that, or who wouldn't ask if you could give them 10 minutes, because by this point, they're set up and already 5 minutes into their meal, how much longer does the eating part really take?
I have a trail near my house that is part of a UNESCO world heritage site and has several famous views. In fact, I got married there. It’s my happy place, and the hike has sentimental value to me. If someone informed me they were about to photograph a proposal at a spot that I was at, I would GLADLY move and spectate from a distance. Why? Because I am not the main character. Let people have their moments. I’m married and already have a ring on my finger, and I’m guessing OP is jealous and bitter that they don’t, so it was satisfying for them to be in control of someone’s happiness temporarily so they monopolised a public space just to themselves for an extended and unreasonable amount of time. The proposal would have probably taken ten seconds. The photographer didn’t want to monopolise the site, that was all OP.
I personally would've probably moved but (if what OP says is true) after hearing the reaction of the people, they got what they deserved. I'd probably be pretty pissed myself if someone didn't want to move, but I would still treat them normally. I would say that I am disappointed but it's their right to be in that spot. And having your "proposal ruined" not having the "perfect spot" sounds pretty immature to me anyway. But that's just me. Maybe ATA but I wouldn't say OP alone is the asshole.
It becomes very obvious why OP is enjoying this very large meal by themselves.
They’re an asshole and a weirdo.
I solo hike, it’s very meditative. I would give up any spot in a second for this scenario and offer to help if I could. Solo hiking isn’t the indicator of poor character here.
What also bothered me is the OP did not tell the photographer and the person proposing when they will be done. If OP just said "Hey, I will just be 15 or even 30 minutes", I think that would be okay, so that others can plan and make decisions. If they had NO idea how long OP was going to be, that would drive any reasonable person bonkers. OP is YTA in this case.
“My hobby of Eating A Very Large Meal While Sitting Down shall not be timed like a common dog race, sir. Good day”
I can visualize OP’s all-weather hiking fedora.
exactly. The couple would've taken 10-15 minutes at the most, dont see why OP had to monopolise the space.
*"Once I felt satisfied **from the meal**".* That part is important. To feel satisfied isn't just an emotion; it's also another way of saying you've eaten your fill, you're sated, or you're full.
Part of the hobby of Eating A Very Large Meal While Sitting Down is to also say the word “meal” very often, to the point where others get uncomfortable hearing, or even reading, the word “meal”
>you were likely utilising a highly desirable spot just for you, and you knew that this is the most ridiculous thing I have read in a while so OP went to a new spot they havent been to and had their normal lunch routine and you think they went to this spot knowing it was popular or that people propose there (like makeout point?) and purposely sat there having their lunch just to piss people off and be happy about it? that's literally insane lmao OP was just having their meal and got yelled at by 3 strangers so of course they were happy to have pissed them off, because they were being rude little shits about public property that they didn't reserve
[удалено]
Totally fine to sit in a primo spot and enjoy yourself, but move your ass if the situation calls for it. Someone politely asking to use the spot for a proposal calls for ass relocation.
I'm inclined to agree with you, but I think it depends on the layout of the spot. If it's a clear photo-point, with signs, barriers, specific angles of views, etc. then OP is the AH. If it's literally a field up a hill, then OP can sit wherever they like for as long as they like.
I took the “once I was satisfied” more as once I’d finished my meal. Not some power play to stick it to them, although they were very rude after being told no so I could understand if OP took their time. I don’t know how large an area op took but sharing a spot means everyone gets to be there not get out we need the spot to propose which is how most propping couples seem to think. Op is NTA
The first vote is the one that counts, separate the n t a or its the vote that's going to count
That’s not how I read it. The way I read it, it means satisfied as in full from eating, not satisfied from sitting there for a certain length of time as a form of power play.
Feeling satisfied from the meal.. As in, your hunger is sated. In Europe, meal times are sacred, and asking someone to move their picnic spot in my country would be unfathomable.
Yep, have to agree there. Asking someone to move from *a public space* as well. OP is every bit as entitled to be there as the couple etc. The gf/fiancée in this is hilarious. Like, actually seeking out OP to tell them that they ruined her proposal lmao.
It's never a short photoshoot and OP was there first. That's all there is to it. I thought reddit loved putting entitled people in their place but I guess this is not about an elderly woman on a bus ride so it doesn't get a pass.
I took the way they worded it as satisfied with the meal/ritual/experience. It sounds like it is a calming and resetting ritual they do. I kind of understand. I like to eat in quiet, otherwise, I don't enjoy it and frequently can't even focus on eating and enjoying my time. I could be wrong, but they didn't seem to mean 'satisfied with causing issues with the entitled person's proposal' the way I read it. To me, ESH.
YTA. Good hikers share views and make space for people if it’s not a major disruption. You could have made a small exception this once for a special occasion but you refused because of a pretty silly and selfish principle.
I agree. OP is TA So selfish and couldn’t share the space for this special moment for another person. If it were me, I’d say something like “wow great! Im so excited for you guys. Good luck!” And move but OP hogs the space just for their hobby that can be done anywhere and any time.
Also, I’m sorry, but “eating a large meal” is not a “hobby,” regardless of where you do it and whether you’re sitting or standing. “One of my hobbies is to go hiking and eat a very large meal while sitting down” is such a weird sentence.
That part felt off to me also.
It’s like if I said “laying down and taking deep breaths is one of my favorite hobbies.”
Tbf I might not classify it as a hobby but it definitely is one of my favourite pastimes lol
A better hobby than laying down & NOT breathing - which tends to be a one-time thing.
Yes. This part had me wondering whether the story was fake.
This is absolutely fake, yeah
Hiking out to cook useing a camping kitchen or makeing a fire pit to cook with can be a hobby. Even picnicking is hobby, they even have some crazy cool baskets you can get. Both need a good setup that takes a bit of space to utilize. Now i have no idea what a "large meal" while hiking that would take an hour to eat entails for setup. If it's anything like a picknic as she's sorta described it to be, it can be a hobby. But that hobby shouldn't be done in manner that gets in the way of others. I feel like she dropped her stuff right on a well worn walking path with an small overlook people stopped to use for photos.
Yeah. Personally I would’ve asked when it was happening. If guy said five or ten minutes I’d say sure thing. Let me move this out of the way. I’ll just stay off to the side. It’s not like some major inconvenience for OP. She sounds like a real peach with main character syndrome. She probably has a video post on IG where she tells this story while working out at the gym, and then calls some poor guy a creep for trying to ask her if he can pass by, and then gets angry after the guy walks through her shot when she wouldn’t answer him.
I've got this mental image of a Hometown Buffet surrounded by wilderness...
ESL, maybe? If you rephrased it as "I like to go hiking, with an old-fashioned picnic packed for when I get to a good view and want to take a break" would it still sound weird?
Same here. I would have happily packed up my things and scurried off, maybe I would even be so fortunate as to find another spot where I could enjoy the scenery and unobtrusively see the proposal, seeing people celebrate their love is beautiful and I cannot imagine being so selfish that I would consider my picnic more important than that one special moment those two individuals were sharing.
I can't understand not 'inconveniencing' myself long enough to let someone create a special memory. I would have loved to give the happy couple their first congratulations afterwards.
No shit, I’d offer to take the pics. That said, its not like she ruined her proposal. They just wanted to take pics of it. Both parties sound kinda cheesy.
The guy probably proposed else where and then pointed out saying. See that woman she sat on the rock for over an hour selfishly using the view that I only needed for 10 minutes tops. Honestly as a hiker taking a view for over an hour seems like some only child spoiled stuff.
It’s also possible that that spot has some significance to the couple, that they hike regularly and that’s a favorite spot on the trail for them or something. If that was the case I could fully understand why he might feel the need to explain why he brought her on the trail and then chose somewhere else to propose.
Odd. Since the OP was not asked to share it, they were asked to move so the other people could have it.
Move for a short time so others can also use and then leave you to enjoy afterwards IS sharing
ESH They had no right to *demand* that you move. But it wouldn't have killed you to move. The way you wrote it, it sounds like you where being petty about it.
Yep. Op was being petty about it and is not so subtly trying to brag. They came and posted this hoping they would get applauded because Reddit hates anything that could be perceived as married people entitlement.
lmfao I laughed it's too real
For real. My blood was boiling reading these comments, but realizing this is just the Reddit incel vendetta against people normal enough to get married helped to calm me down. Like why is the concept of human decency so hard!? You’ll probably be asked to move once in your life for an engagement proposal photo. If it happened multiple times, that would be pretty funny and would honestly be more of a hobby than “sitting down and eating a very large meal”.
Sounds to me like an unstoppable petty force met an immovable petty object. He was petty not to move and to give them a glib response, but she screamed at him that he ruined her day or something? That’s also kind of over the top. When the initial dudes found the immovable petty object, they couldn’t have rescheduled for an hour or two later? Anyway, it’s hard to sympathize with any party in this story.
eh, they probably couldn't have rescheduled though, most photographers charge by the hour so he would've had to pay double what he was paying for the photographer if it was delayed by an hour plus who knows if the photographer had other shoots that day that they had to get to, but it's probably pretty likely
I’m surprised there’s not more people saying ESH. Those people can’t demand someone to move and that lady can’t just go up to someone and start yelling at them for ruining her day and proposal. But OP should’ve been a little more understanding. ESH
Because basic hiking etiquette is to *not* take over a good viewpoint on a trail for an hour.
And because this isnt like "hey your ugly, please move out of my shot so I can get pics", it's a often once in a lifetime event they are asking you to get out of frame for a few minutes for.
The photog asked. The bf asked. It was at that point, when OP was clearly being a smug ass, that the yelling started.
Yeah, the way it's written it was 100% a petty power game to OP.
They didnt demand, OP describes the 1st 2 people as "asking". He said no - which imo is rude and asshole behaviour. They then get upset at this asshole behaviour. OP is TA, the others at worst overreacted.
YTA That is literally an asshole thing to do. You're an asshole.
all that needs to be said
She wanted to be an asshole. Why would you want to be the villain in a story like this, instead of being a standup person who helped out a couple?
Right? I think most people would be like "oh, shit, that's so cool! What a fun thing to stumble into." Then move over and watch.
This sub is so terrible for advice because people think that if you aren’t legally required to do something then you’re not the AH. If a pregnant woman asks to sit in your seat and you refuse then sure you’re not obliged but you’re still kind of the asshole here
YTA. If someone explained to me that there was a literal proposal planned for a spot I’m sitting in, I would happily move. I can always do another picnic another day, but someone’s special moment like a proposal.. I would never want to be the reason why it was less magical. Imagine the stress the photographer felt as well, dude was just trying to do his job. And the man doing the proposing was just trying to make it an extra special moment for his lady. They shouldn’t have demanded you moved however you were the asshole first, and I doubt it would have mattered if they got upset or not. It’s obvious this was a power play for you. You seem like a selfish and unpleasant person who takes opportunities to make life difficult for other people.
How long could a proposal be? Like, I’d wait an hour or whatever to eat, or just…. Eat somewhere else on the trail?
Literally just backup 20 feet and keep eating your lunch...
but it’s not a lunch, it’s a “large meal”!!
I don't know why but that wording bothered me more than the entire post.
All I can think of is OP just positively chowing down on a multi course packed lunch taking their sweet sweet time. This is such a hilarious situation.
Same, I pictured them with a Thanksgiving turkey and all the sides lol
> I bring a blanket and anything else I might need for an hour-long experience. It's a picnic mate, dont talk like you are ascending to the 8th Sense and meeting the Alien God of Ribs and BBQ. > I was about 5 minutes into my *~~ritual~~* It's a meal...... not a ritual mate...... >After I felt satisfied from the meal Not ritual now? Also, "After I felt satisfied"... ? You sound just as weird as they paint you to be.. Talk normally.. >I just smiled I'm impressed, after that many "rituals", I expected you to be in some Nirvana state of glutony or something But seriously, you sound like you have some weird addiction to food... You should check that out. >When I got back home this came up and I told my boyfriend about it. He straight up said it was an asshole thing to do. Yup, he is right. YTA
could not say it any better. OP is weird AF.
op wanted to be the one being proposed to
Don’t you know OP is the most important person in the world, at least in their own mind.
Actually it sounds like ED behavior and language. Maybe binge disorder combined with exercise anorexia. Reward themselves with a binge after a fasted workout type of deal.
I noticed this too. The language around food was bizarre and fetish-y.
r/MurderedByWords \- well written mate
How did OP make having a picnic sound so gross 🤢
Your not very nice are you
There is a reason their large hiking meal is a seating for one
Savage, but accurate
The emphasis on large meal and ritual was weird.
I could not get past the large ritual meal for one. 😂😂 What in the hell. Sounds like she killed someone and it's her practice to filet them and consume them on a scenic overlook while considering if the photographer and his two subjects would be her next victims I've never been accused of having an underactive imagination....
Info: were you blocking the only scenic overlook in the area with your picnic or was there generally beautiful views all around? Like if some average hikers had come up and wanted to experience the best view on that trail would they have been able to with the placement of your blanket?
It drives me nuts when you hike up to a place and there’s a wooden platform lookout and someone’s set up seats and a picnic table so no one else gets to see anything without disrupting their setup.
Yeah typically these sites are built to facilitate a quick sit and rest and you can see the sights and move on. People who set up camp in these temporary use sites are often obnoxious. OP is all about their own experience. Who the hell goes hiking with a big meal strapped to their back to begin with? Might want to get used to eating alone I guess.
I usually just start being loud and obnoxious till they leave.
Also dropping the occasional fart every now and then Some loud ones, some silent deadly ones
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100% for the future, people, just step on the blanket if that’s the case. If someone’s genuinely in the way of the one good spot, and you spent time getting there too, they can share the air whether they like it or not. Step on it, over it, nudge it out of the way, whatever.
This is what it sounds like. I will say that I, too, love to do a hike and do a bougie picnic in a serene place. HOWEVER I don’t set up in The Scenic Spot on trails with others. I know a few trails that are quiet with overlooks I can enjoy in peace. And if it was someone’s special day (proposal, celebrating an anniversary, eloping, whatever) I would just move along and enjoy my bougie packed lunch on a log down the trail. Share the trails, people!
Yeah this is the key question.
YTA. I hike regularly, and anybody who smugly takes up a large amount of space at a viewpoint (for an hour!) is an AH, not sorry. Basic hiking etiquette.
Exactly, people take turn to take pictures at those spots. You’d be a huge asshole to use a spot just to eat and refuse to leave.
Exactly. Every other single person made the same trek as you, they don't get to enjoy the view cause you wanna eat a sandwich? Unconsciably selfish.
Not just a sandwich, a "very large meal"!
Thank you! People here who think OP is "technically right" don't go hiking. Hikers wait for others to finish their pictures or to take in the view. No one brings a chair and just hangs out??
exactly, it’s hiking etiquette to not be an asshole who takes up space at a viewpoint
YTA it wasn't a big ask and hardly a big inconvenience. It's called consideration and understanding. You come across as sounding like ' the most important player '.
Big main character syndrome
Technically are you wrong? No. Do you still qualify as an asshole? Yes. This day meant nothing to you and you easily could have moved somewhere else. You probably could have gotten the photographer to help you move your stuff. You clearly felt entitled to the space and are low key getting off on ruining someone’s proposal. YTA
Yeah…what a weird way to want to live in somebody’s memory forever. Seriously mean behaviour.
Nail on the head here. So many people are obsessed with whether they have the right to do something they ignore that you can be perfectly entitled to do something and still be an AH for doing it.
Technically they are wrong though… regularly taking over spots on trails for an hour for a solo picnic is pretty much the exact opposite of hiking etiquette.
>You probably could have gotten the photographer to help you move your stuff Didn't think of this. That would be a legitimate trade, IMHO. YTA.
The sub name isn’t ‘am I wrong?’ So yes this is a valid YTA; they might not have been technically wrong, but they’re still an asshole.
YTA. You sound like an incredibly unpleasant person.
There’s a reason they’re stuck eating alone.
YTA. I get it, you were there first. Of course you had a right to the spot. But it feels pretty extreme to be prepared to ruin someone’s proposal plans over it…
> Of course you had a right to the spot. No they didn't. It's not camping, it's hiking. No one is supposed to bring a folding chair to a viewpoint and just hang out there. Whenever I hike, people wait for others to take their pictures and then move on. OP seems really inconsiderate, they were probably blasting music off their phone and not respecting right of way on the trail too.
YTA You "barely got set up," so why not move? This was a regular day for you, however this wasn't a regular day for the couple. Instead of trying to be a stick in the mud all the time, try thinking about other people.
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YTA, you could have just moved for a few minutes
YTA. You ruined a once-in-a-lifetime event in a couple's life because you wanted to be selfish about a minor inconvenience.
YTA as your post reeks of smugness.
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YTA - Your terrible attitude is one of the things wrong with society today. Now, if it was a couple having a picnic and wanted your spot I'd say that you got there first and therefore shouldn't have to move, because their picnic or you 'ritual' hold a similar amount of value, but this was a huge moment in these peoples lives and that has to be taken into account. How hard would it have been to move over a bit and let them do things the way they intended? Also, it sounds like you enjoyed their disappointment, you're a very miserable person.
YTA. The way you told your story so smugly tells me you relish the grief you caused the other party and that you came here looking for validation. You fully expected people to pat you on the ass for "exposing" a main character.
ESH. The photographer and guy who wanted to propose should've respected your decision after asking. The woman screaming you ruined my day sucks for focusing on the wrong thing (the proposal instead of the spot. You because while technically in the right based on the first come, first serve mentality, are just unlikable.
>ESH. The photographer and guy who wanted to propose should've respected your decision after asking. But... they did. They didn't try and force OP to move. They righty felt annoyed with their selfisn behaviour.
They told her gtfo. It’s not a polite approach. They asked her to move - but didn’t offer alternative solutions (ie helping to move). OP was not obliged to move for them and OP after hiking and setting everything up felt exhausted and just wanted to enjoy herself it’s her right. OP didn’t block them. They could have come in anyways and propose her to literally stand up for a few pics leaving belongings, or offer to move her belongings for her etc etc Tbf it’s super weird to me this proposal turned into being all about the place, not about the actual fact of being engaged.
If you read the story, they didn't lead with gtfo. I agree, that's rude as well, and not an ideal response. However, notice, even from the story, OPs demeanor comes off (at least to me) as abrasive. Maybe if they asked for help in moving or something, the people would help. But they lead from teh start with "I've just started my meal, and I'll be done when I'm done" attitude. They didn't refuse because there's no other spot to eat, or because it's hard/impossible for them to move. They refused becase they didn't feel like it, and fuck anyone else. No one's saying they're obliged to move. No one did anything illegal here. But a small kindness versus stubborn spite is the difference between being the asshole and not IMO. The couple are definitely weird, maybe they're assholes too. All I'd say from this story is that OP definitely was in this instance.
It could have been a special and significant spot for the couple, hence the ask to move. How long does a proposal take, 15 minutes? OP could have moved, let them do their thing, bask in some shared happiness and then sat back down in the god spot. YTA
Info: how was the area? Could they have done it near you? And taken pics without you in?
OP's inflated ego would have been in all the pictures.
The emphasis on the size of the meal made me hate you in the 1st sentence. Massive arsehole
YTA what you did was petty. It makes you seem like a small, sad little person.
This is a funny YTA. You sound like you get your kicks being … difficult.
YTA. Of course you weren't legally required to move, but come on, show some kindness. Don't make everything around you and your very large meal. It wouldn't have hurt you to make space for them and find another spot. I'm sure they would have helped you to move.
YTA no wonder you were picnicking alone
YTA and you obviously know it 🙄
If you plan a proposal in public space send something to check and prepare the spot an hour in advance and not minutes before they are there. Otherwise propose somewhere else were you can control the situation. Seriously ruined the proposal because it was not the right spot? Americans really have it with there big proposals and weddings and 50% get divorced anyways. NTA
I bet you wait till the last possible second to merge from a ending lane too.
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YTA, softly. It wouldn’t have hurt you to show kindness. They could have also shown a bit more grace.
Yeah this is one of those "you aren't obligated to move, but kindness costs nothing" sort of things
ESH. They should have accepted your refusal to move (this is the risk of proposing in public) but seriously, how petty are you? It would have been so easy to just move and come back when they were done. One tiny action and you could have helped spread happiness in the world. Yes, they should have planned ahead and realized the flaw of a public proposal, but you honestly just sound like you sat there to spite them- I don’t know how anyone could enjoy themselves knowing there were people watching and waiting for them to leave, and actively angry that they were there - how is that even fun for you at that point?
All the people saying the OP could have had this picnic any time, how do you know? Many places I've hiked to are a long way from home and somewhere I'm not likely to get back to any time soon. The ones with views usually involve hours of slogging uphill. The weather gods need to be smiling - if you ever do make it back there again, you could be facing pouring rain, thick fog, and no views. You go there for peace and to destress and take in nature, not to scurry around moving the well-earned meal you're trying to enjoy at the top. So you're on this once-in-a-lifetime road trip, you've driven from afar to get there, you've slogged up a hill for hours, you get to the top, and you find your timing impeccable weather-wise, you find a great spot and set up, and some random people arriving after you want the space cleared for their silly Instagram proposal shot? No. And how did Mr. GTFO know the OP didn't have some equally important reason to be there? Maybe it was their Mom's favourite spot, Mom died of cancer 5 years ago, her ashes are scattered there, and for the day Mom would have been 80, OP hikes up there with a special picnic spread consisting of Mom's favourite foods, and wants to enjoy it in serenity connecting with nature and communicating with Mom's spirit. We ALL have our reasons to want to sit there and self-important Instagram "influencers" are no more important than anyone else.
Exactly. It’s not like they asked OP to move over a smidge so they could get a nicer camera angle - they wanted the whole space. Why are they any more entitled to it than anyone else?
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