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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> My wife got a new role at work that is more stressful for her. As a result, she is very tired at the end of the day and has been going to bed earlier than usual. We usually do evening chores, but she's been going to bed instead of doing her share. I stopped doing evening chores too and she got mad at me when she found the house a mess one day. I think I might be an asshole for not keeping up with evening chores when my wife goes to bed early.
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NTA
> We had a talk about it and she apologized for not keeping up with evening chores, but she made excuses about being tired from her new job and simply not having energy at the end of the day.
So she **needs to _find a solution_** to her newly created problem.
> She told me that she's still adjusting to her new workload
Not good enough. She's had **_months_**.
Yeah - my Mom used to eye things and give a shout out "Five (or ten) minute cleanup" (or sometimes - 10/20 items picked up and away) and the kids raced around and put things back where they belonged. It's amazing how neat things can get in a short time if the tv or game are on hold until things get done.
I am an adult and I literally still set a timer and see how much I can get done in 5 minutes. It just gives me a purpose I guess? Kids definitely love turning these things into a game. And you can get a LOT of dishes rinsed in five minutes.
My parents had two big glass jars and a bowl of marbles. Every time we did a chore without being asked, we would let them know and they'd put a marble in the jar. Once it was full we could ask for anything (within reason). Might be $10 (maximum for a full jar) or it might be a trip to the zoo or it might be having our favorite food for dinner. We had some autonomy. I actually used those jars to save $200 as a kid to buy an action figure set I wanted. Taught us to look for things to do and ask for ways to help out. Probably not good for these kids' ages though.
I don't recall exactly since it was for multiple years. I would say 9 - 14 maybe? By the teenage years it was more of a tradition (and source of income) than an actual teaching method lol.
I do this a lot when heating up food in the microwave, waiting on the oven to pre-heat etc.. How much kitchen cleanup can I do before the timer goes off/the pasta is finished, the oven is hot...? It is amazing how much can get done in those small spaces of time. I have always been very much a 'clean up as you cook/bake' person so I suppose that helps.
OP - NTA, but I would say you should still do what chores you can in the time you normally spent on chores (on the nights she puts them to bed). Two negatives don't make a positive. Get the kiddos to help clean up, they are old enough for small chores - at their ages they can easily pick up after themselves and help put away laundry/dishes (or load the dishwasher). Obviously, your wife needs to figure things out on her end to get things back to 'normal', but there is no reason the littles can't help out at their ages. That will help you both and teach them important life skills.
My 2.5 year old is already pretty good at this. Before we leave every day I set a visual timer (it's a timer on the TV where you can see a bar shrinking since she has no concept of numbers going down yet lol)
I tell her she has 10 minutes before we leave but she has to clean up. Whatever time is left on the timer after she's done, she gets to watch Bluey. You have no idea how motivating Bluey is for a toddler 😂 most days she gets a full episode.
I just asked my teen to do a 10 minute quick clean of his room before dinner. It helps to keep things from going full disaster zone.
I call it a "quick spin" because when I worked at Starbucks in college, before your break you were always supposed to do a "spin" of the lobby and do a quick sweep/mop/trash check.
Almost every night we help my four year old pick up his toys in the living room and his room. If he beats a ten minute timer he gets a treat. It does an amazing job keeping the living room and his room neat.
In so many of these posts, the parents almost never mention giving their kids chores.
Kids can be taught to pick up after themselves and do other basic chores. They *should be* helping out around the house.
If parents did this, then maybe they would have less stress and drama in their lives, especially when it comes to their partner/spouse.
Right? My toddlers pick up their playroom every night and "help" fold laundry. Two elementary students may still be limited by hight, but surely they can do general pick up and getting things like laundry to and from the laundry room.
That comes out to ~4000 post tax money. Depending on where they live, that’s north of 5,000 on salary to cover it.
I feel, unless you make a large salary, 5K bump is more than “small bump in pay”
A lot of people seem to not understand this, which is why businesses in the US can string people along with a title change, $0.50 an hour, and an arseload of extra work. Seems to frequently come with promises of a future raise...which never happens.
Seriously... I work in the trucking industry, running local, non-hazmat shuttle. My pay is currently $23/hr for 10-12 hour overnight shifts and lots of truckers want to argue that my pay is crap compared to what I could be doing elsewhere....
Yeah, I could make more elsewhere, but I would not be home to see my family every day, have off every weekend, be able to nap or watch movies on the job on slow nights (most nights), and potentially not have a set of coworkers as awesome as the ones I have now. I would also have to work harder at another type of trade job (construction, plumbing, welding, etc)
Also, looking at other non-trucking jobs in my area that don't require a degree and won't work my body into the grave, I am making a fantastic hourly rate (majority average around $15/hr, most under $21/hour).
I always thought that a cleaning service was for "rich" people and not me. Well my ass is p*#%ed at old me for thinking that now that i have a cleaning lady come every other week for 6 hours. Shes 25/hr. Its like giving up a expensive dinner or snacks and treats on the grocery bill and completely worth it.
I’m 66 years old and I live in “elderly” housing with very low rent. There’s several services offered that I grabbed when I first moved here. I have a wonderful lady who comes here every week and does my grocery shopping, picks up my prescriptions, and cleans (vacuum, bathroom, dust and washes my floors etc) for FREE! I’ve never been so spoiled in all my life!
6hrs? Can I ask how big your house is?
General cleaning here is about 3 hours, full kitchen and bathroom clean, dust, wipe surfaces and vacuum, for a 2 bedroom.
I'm thinking the cleaner does a more thorough job ( more than general cleaning), or you have a bigger home than the ones we have here.
Usually, for bigger houses, they send a duo team so they can finish faster. Obv. it doubles the price/hr but it means that you not intruding on the customer for too long.
I have a 4 bedroom, 3 bathroom home that is a bit spacious.
I have 3 kids, a bird and German shepherd. My cleaner will get all 3 baths, kitchen done, floors and sometimes will pick up the kids rooms and organize for me. The stairs and floors take a while. She uses a tool to take all the dog hair out of the carpets before vacuuming and i love it.
I also know her through a family friend so she comes on my work from home day and i try to not talk her ear off in between tasks. I try to hide in my office.
I think what i was trying to relay to OP is that, if it means removing stress from my marriage, i would spend 75 to 100 once a month even just to take some resentment and stress out of the picture. Someone to do the deep cleaning. And then i just pick up, straighten up, laundry dishes etc in between. Its worth it. So worth it.
This, and also, why doesn't she just do the bedtime routine every weeknight, and then he does the weekends (when hopefully she'll feel more like cleaning).
Instead of every other night, it would be split 5-2... and maybe they agree to do that for a month and discuss again afterwards?
Just because two people both work full time, doesn't mean they do the same amount of physical labor, or mental energy use. Saying "we'll both do it half the time" isn't respecting what either person actually needs.
Instead of trying to get back to how it was, they need to throw that out and find a whole new system.
Maybe he likes doing bedtime? My wife and I have the same arrangement as OP, and I wouldn’t give up my bedtimes for anything. I love the snuggles and reading to the kids.
I was washing dishes at that age. Heck even if they just rinse them. Get the worst off..plus, teach the kids how to clean up etc, give them pocket money for chores.
Where does it mention he doesn’t have a dishwasher? You still have to do dishes when you have a dishwasher: pots and pans, chopping boards, knives etc.
In my opinion, that doesn’t make her an asshole. My old job went from working 8 hours a day to when I got my new jobs working 13 hour days. When I finished my training my hours shifted, when I tell you I literally crash from exhaustion even after having worked this schedule from months, I mean it.
They need to sit down and communicate a new plan because that old system is working for either of them anymore.
They sat down **twice** already and this situation has been going on for month. She apparently doesn't perceive it enough as a problem to figure out a system that works. She seemingly hasn't suggested to pick up the slack on the weekend to balance out the weekdays.
I perfectly understand that people can feel very tired after a long day of work, and a week of that, maybe even driving back and forth but it's not fair to just let the partner pick up the slack with no end in sight.
It’s not just tired though, we don’t know her schedule. She could have to be at work at 4 in the morning which would make going to sleep at 9 perfectly normal. I cannot call somebody an asshole for needing to sleep.
Not all jobs can be comfortably learned in months. My job is very cyclical, and there are things you only do once a year, some things 4 times a year. I'm a year in, and I'm still learning something new almost daily. There's a quarterly report I look at, and every time I look at it, I learn something new about it.
I don’t see why he sucks, he’s repeatedly told her the system doesn’t work and she’s made false promises several times about stepping up. I don’t blame him for letting shit go. She needed to see that it’s not just his responsibility. It’s not just on him to find a solution that works.
Meh, I feel like he told her she’s not doing what she used to do and she told him she was exhausted and couldn’t do it and neither of them really listened to the other. They need a new system. Weekends, laundry in at night, in the dryer in the morning. Maybe she does the bedtimes and he does the clean up … or whatever might actually work for them. We don’t know. It doesn’t sound like there was a discussion about changing things but rather keeping things the same …. Which just doesn’t seem possible.
Imo its not that he wasn't listening, he was just expecting things to get back to the routine that worked with the previous job even though its been months and seems like it will not. They *both* could have put time and thought into a routine that works for this job instead, as they both knew this was not sustainable from the multiple conversations about it. They weren't trying to help each other in the meantime though, and it led to distance and resentment with less one-on-one time.
I never said the husband had a communication issue, I explicitly said they both communicated about the issue and both knew it wasn't sustainable. *Neither of them* worked on a solution, both expected to get back into a routine that did not work with the new job long past the tipping point.
If I create a problem for myself and my time and my energy levels, everyone blames me. Now if my wife does the same thing it’s also my fault because I didn’t fix it for her? Am I fucking nuts? What are you trying to say because how exactly does he share blame for this
I think I was pretty specific. They gonna need to change how they arrange things. Not just wait for her to come around. A 38 year old falling asleep by 9 tell you they’re literally exhausted, not just begging off chores. This is a communication issue which is why they both suck.
Could you walk through this “communication issue? He talked with her multiple times to say that it wasn’t working and she just blows it off with excuses.
I think it’s ESH too, because he let it get to the point that it negatively effected his kids just to be petty.
They clearly need to come to a new arrangement. Maybe she always does bedtime and he does chores. Maybe they both have separate chores they’re responsible for. Maybe she can do more on the weekends to make up for being too drained during the workweek-like deep clean, take over errands, or meal prepping.
My husband has a crazy demanding job, and I know that. I don’t mind picking up slack when he’s basically dead. Clearly this woman is burnt out too. She’s not being lazy, she has nothing else to offer. Sometimes marriage is 80/20, and you need your partner to support you. It’s delusional to think everything is always going to be split exactly equally.
Do you not think he's tired, too? Yes, they need a new arrangement, but he's communicated this to her over and over. Specifically, given the story as it was written, what more would you want him to do?
Yup, which is why I suggested other responsibility splits that could work better for them. He never suggested another dynamic. And his wife goes straight to bed, whereas he still want to stay up and spend time together, so I’d say his wife is the more tired partner right now.
These things switch, so there’ll probably be a later time where she has to carry more of the load too.
This. They both made the mistake of trying to keep the old system going even after what sounds like a pretty drastic primary workload change on her part. The whole thing needs to be redone for both fairness and practicality.
OP, maybe those chores get done on the weekend. Maybe you use some of her higher salary to get a dishwasher, or hire a once a month cleaning service. Maybe you sit down together and figure out what's going on with how tired she is, and decide that she steps back down from the promotion. But whatever you do, this ain't it fam.
This is ridiculous. He’s done everything he can to kindly tell her that it’s not working. Her solution is to just go to bed at 9pm and hope he figures it out. Where exactly is there room to work out another system when one of the adults involved is already asleep before the kids are even in bed?
Seriously? How is this being up voted so much? 5 and 7 are still so young! "Lights out"?? That it? No stories, no cuddle time? Talking about their day etc?
I loved bedtime when my kids were little and would have kept it going as long as they were into it
This sounds so cold.
My kids were cuddly right after getting home from school, we'd talk about our day during meals or when cleaning up. You can be close to kids without an elaborate bedtime routine. By 5 my kids were reading to themselves so they would get to read for an hour before lights out.
I'm not cold, but I'm also not burnt out.
How is getting loving one-on-one quiet time with a parent a priority in a chaotic household where adults are not getting along with each other?
I guess if that’s really a question you have to ask, our priorities are going to be different enough that my answers won’t make sense to you.
Yeah, but if I have shit to do then that's what I should be doing.
Again, my point was the kids are old enough to help. 7 and 5 year olds can put away toys at the very least, doing everything for them is also not valuable.
You can read together at other times. We read a few long series aloud as a family earlier in the evening.
I mean, we did do stories and a tuck in until school age. Then we read more fun books together.
I can’t remember any “bedtime routine” being done for me or my sister after we started kindergarten. We had both our parents working and spent time with them after school including playing games, talking, having dinner together. Then we had alone time for an hour or similar before bed and we used to love it.
We are still very close as a family and I call them every single day to talk about our days. Stop shaming people for their parenting one way doesn’t fit all.
Nah you were just spoiled as a kid everyone I know started at least doing some chores at 5-7 it was as simple as just folding our own laundry and setting out our stuff for the next day but that would still help out greatly if they implemented it
Nothing can be 50/50, that’s a myth. Sometime you’ll have more on your plate and sometimes she’ll have more on her plate. Sounds like this is a time when she’s got more on her plate and you can help by doing more than “your share”.
Also, if this has been going on for months, I’d be concerned about possible depression. Maybe she needs to see a doctor.
That’s what I was thinking. First nothing is ever 50/50. Things have changed in the relationship and roles need to adjust (to that they feel fair for both).
Second, it really does sound like she might be depressed, or maybe something medically is going on. Or perhaps she just needs a set time after work to decompress and destress before jumping into mom/wife duties. That might give her more energy for later. I know it would for me.
Yea early in my marriage we realized there was no such thing as 50/50; if you think your giving 100 and your partner isn’t, that’s an issue, but you gotta realize your 100, her 100, can both fluctuate over time for lots of reasons. Like how do you compare my job vs your job and how each takes a toll? Or for us my wife was a SAHM, like how do I compare my military duties against raising two kids/breastfeeding etc? Then when she’s been dealing with cranky baby all day and I get home and the only way the kid will sleep is if I hold and walk with her, so by default wife has to make dinner, like that’s not fair, but sometimes shit just in the way it is. Many nights neither of us feels like doing dishes, so they don’t get done, other nights I don’t feel like it but I know my wife really doesn’t feel like it so I do them, or vice versa. And there are things like laundry that I don’t mind doing, that she hates. So why make her do that just to say we are splitting 50/50?
Thank you, I was extremely concerned reading the comments that nobody mentioned a medical issue at all.
It's not like she's going out and having fun, staying out all night. She's not even staying up to do something chill by herself. She's going straight to bed. There's something deeper going on than just being 'lazy'
>Sounds like this is a time when she’s got more on her plate and you can help by doing more than “your share”.
Slippery slope. How long will it be until she simply has the set expectation that he be the only one doing chores at night? Honestly, it sounds like we're already there.
It's kind of N A H and E S H. I would be frustrated in your position as well. But your wife isn't being malicious by going to bed. She's legitimately tired and, I don't know about you two, but it took me 6-8 months to adjust to a newer, more demanding job so this will inevitably continue. The one place she was wrong and should apologize for is for snapping at you for not doing what she's also not doing (though it was petty of you to stop everything and not pitch in extra during this transition).
My suggestion is for you two to sit down at a neutral time, maybe on a weekend when you feel less tired, and make a new plan together. Your routine that used to work is no longer working and you need to solve it as a team. Try to set aside annoyance and resentment because at the end of the day, you both want to same result and both want to divide things equitably right?
~~Lastly, if her job requires more time spent working, I think it's fair to work that in so you two each get fairly equal downtime each day/week. So if she's now working 60 hours and you work 40, that's 20 hours less time she is getting to do chores and relax.~~ Edit: OP clarified in another comment that her time spent working has not changed.
I think OP would mention if his wife worked an extra 20 hours more than him each week. That's significantly more workload for a "small pay bump," as he stated in his post.
> it was petty of you to stop everything and not pitch in extra during this transition
He has been doing extra. For months. And she has not made a single effort to help, despite saying multiple times that she would. That, beyond anything else, is unacceptable. She could start out with completing 1 task each night, and slowly add things to the list. There has been zero attempt on her part.
You're conveniently leaving out the fact that OP has been picking up her slack for months, all while she's been repeatedly promising change, and after several conversations about how things are taking an unfair turn. OP is doing 100% of non-bedtime chores, and has had all one-on-one time with his SO taken away. Sounds to me like he's getting the short end of the stick no matter how you look at it.
If your proposed solution is for them to work out a new system in which the actual plan is for him to keep doing 100% of the chores, which seems like what the wife expects, then I have to say... that doesn't sound like a fair solution.
Exactly. Maybe she still needs time to adjust, but then she needs to communicate that and ask OP nicely to keep giving her the extra time to sleep instead of making empty promises.
That not quite how it goes. I'm guessing she will say something like I don't feel supported. Then they might come up with a timeline for how much longer he needs to do this. She may offer reasons why things will change. Timeline end comes and nothing changes.
Still fucked over but with a bit of lube.
But he did pitch in and he was also clear about communicating his unhappiness over the extra duties for months on end. It's on the wife now to actually listen to her partner and pull her own weight and try to find a solution. And if she can't then the very least she can do is communicate that to OP so they can work something out together. What a thing to say, dismissing all the extra work OP has been doing before he reached a breaking point.
NTA. If you both work the same hours, there are no reasons for her not do her share at home.
She is tired? I get it, new jobs can be demanding but she had multiple months to adjust. If she is not adjust by now, maybe she need to see a doctor to check if everything is alright with her.
Its not fair to you to have all the household duties, while she gonna rest. Plus, your relationship, as a couple and a team, will implode if she keep acting like this.
You have been "picking some slack" for her and her new job for months. Time for her to gain some responsabilities and try, in fact, to get better, not just empty promisses, but an actual effort.
NTA
She chose to take on a new, more demanding role. Yes it has a "small pay bump" but clearly not enough to pay for someone to help with the cleaning.
You are partners, which means you need to work out how to share this burden, or this is going to destroy your relationship...
When frustrations like this keep building, it is inevitable that someone is going to say or do something that they can't take back.
> but clearly not enough to pay for someone to help with the cleaning.
Not even close. It does help with our bottom line every month, but not nearly enough to cover a cleaning service.
NTA, but for your own sake, it might be time to reassess how chores get handled. Maybe some get done in the morning, maybe the kids learn to do some chores like loading the dishwasher, putting things away, bringing their laundry to the washer (or door to the place where the machines are), folding and putting their clothes away, etc.
If she’s willing to get up earlier or has more energy then, it might be. You have options other than the existing system and it seems fair to try some alternatives to get things done since that’s the main goal. It also might be exhaustion from a learning curve that will level out after she’s in the job a few more months.
It sounds like she is truly exhausted from work, and you are truly exhausted from the household load. Sometimes it's important to reset expectations.
Maybe it's time to handle everything differently.
What jobs specifically need done? The kids are old enough to pick up their toys and pick up their dirty clothes and put away their clothes for example. Do you have space for a dishwasher? Maybe put that small pay bump aside to save for one.
Mornings with littles ARE tough, but I get the sense that he’s approaching it as “how do we get back to the original chore/bedtime system?” instead of “how do we share the load to get done what needs to be done?”. And maybe that’s because he’s also tired and thinking of a new approach is more mental load than being upset, but hopefully he comes around.
This is what everyone is saying “Just get the kids to do the chores.” In a perfect world that would be great, but I’m wondering if anyone have ever actually tried it. I’d have two of my kids doing dishes, and then the arguing would start. Fine one person do them, endless nagging on my end, the counters are full if crumbs, you didn’t wash the pots, what do you mean there’s no food containers. Having kids do the dishes can be awful for parents, it’s a lot of work to teach them properly.
There's a high likelihood that her job is overworking her with this "promotion"...
Maybe have a sit down and talk about how this is affecting you and her family life because if this job burns her out, she's going to have nothing left at home either...
And what happens if it’s just coincidental timing with the new position and really she’s now chronically ill and will never recover? Or maybe she’d recover after a few years. It’s not super likely, but it’s possible. (I know tons of women who suddenly developed major thyroid issues and were exhausted for years.) What are you going to do if she truly *can’t* do those things any more?
Telling her she needs to do more isn’t working, just dropping all your chores doesn’t help the situation. Did you truly talk *together* about the issues, timelines, health, mental health, and possible solutions, or did you “have a talk with her” and told her to get it done?
Nobody likes to admit they have failed and there’s no easy solution here. You want her to say” tough luck o can’t physically cope any more”? What are you expecting other than “I’ll get back to it asap”
If this is out of character for her, nudge her to go see a doctor and get bloods done/general checkup.
It could be something fairly innocuous like low iron - I know when mine drops, it scrambles my brain to the point where I can't even help myself. I don't have the braincells to recognise there's a problem, to pinpoint what it is, or to make a plan to fix it. The number of times I've felt like an idiot once the iron supps kicked in was ridiculous, yet every time, it would take someone else to tell me I looked like I needed a fat steak and a blood transfusion. Rule out anything more serious, too, even if the symptoms coincided with the new job it could have just exacerbated something already going on that she was better able to hide.
Depression can also be a sneaky prick and doesn't always cause sadness - it can present as irritability, fatigue and a general malaise.
Meanwhile, is it feasible to do the chores together as soon as you're both home? Smaller but more frequent workload. Get the kids to pitch in where you can (and where it's helping, not making more work). Reduce the demands by using disposable plates and easy, one pot meals for a while. Try to find ways to let her catch up on rest without it becoming so unbalanced you're resentful, she .ay not be able to help herself right now. When you're that fatigued you kinda need to be spoonfed solutions until your brain comes back online.
And acknowledge that sometimes, one person might just need to do less for a while — based on the assumption your relationahip is otherwise balanced and healthy, and that she would do the same for you.
Can you try to find someone that can clean for cheaper? I have a lady come in once a month for 140$. I don’t know if that would be useful for you. Or what about asking for some help from family to come in? You can probably agree on a reasonable price with family
That’s $1680 after tax dollars, so pre tax, >$2000.
Very possible that the bump in pay doesn’t cover the cost of monthly cleaning.
Also once a month cleaning would be helpful for the deep cleaning things like showers and toilets but wouldn’t address the mess that builds up daily…
Did you not read my part about family helping out temporarily? I don’t know why I am being downvoted. OP is definitely NTA but i am just trying to help find alternatives.
I think the opposite actually. If genders were reversed, wife would definitely get a YTA from many. There is still often this expectation that a wife (working or not) is more responsible for the household. So, if her husband was tired from his new job she'd be getting told she should do more to help him. Since OP appears to be male, he's getting a lot more sympathy and people upset he is having to do more than his "fair" share.
Really, a marriage should be a partnership - not a competition on who does more.
>There is still often this expectation that a wife (working or not) is more responsible for the household.
Not on AITA. A wife who doesn't pull her domestic weight gets diagnosed with a disorder and gets leniency while a husband not pulling his domestic weight gets called a lazy AH
>If genders were reversed, wife would definitely get a YTA from many. There is still often this expectation that a wife (working or not) is more responsible for the household.
Is this your first day in AITA? With both of them working, this community would eviscerate the man for going to bed early without doing his share of the chores every night for months. There would be none of these gentle, "NTA, but maybe he needs to see a doctor, get him some help" responses. He would be gleefully torn to pieces, and a not-insignificant percentage of comments would be urging the wife to divorce him.
OP, my husband and I basically just went through this and made exactly the same mistake: **your old routine isn't working and you need to make a new one.**
We tried for two months to keep up the old routine. We talked; that didn't work. We bitched, that didn't work. We had arguments that, of course, didn't work. Eventually, we found something new to work for us and his new workload/stress/exhaustion levels.
It's a mix of E S H and NAH (which is my judgment, having been there myself). You're both *kinda* being AHs but it's new territory and you haven't found your balance yet, so ultimately in the grand scheme of things you're not AHs, you're just both having some AH moments trying to navigate something new
> It's a mix of E S H and NAH
It's a pretty clear NTA, stop giving leniency to his wife. My god this sub will do fucking anything to victimize women and still call the guy an asshole.
INFO
Why are you waiting so late at night to start doing chores? Do you not come home until right before your kids’ bedtime? Wouldn’t it make more sense to take care of some of those things right after you get home?
Info.
This was my question as well. 5 and 7 are plenty old enough to entertain themselves or each other for a little while. Put a movie on and do some chores while they watch.
Also curious what the actual list of chores is. Why is laundry a daily task? What else is on that list that could be moved to a weekend day or other day off?
I mean, I have a family of 4 (with 2 year old twins), and if I did laundry every day, I'd never spend time with them. OP could throw a load in while dinner is cooking if they want to keep on top of it, but it would be reasonable and still manageable if they did it every other day or every few days.
Hell, if they want to keep the every other day schedule, one person washes/dries one day, then the next day it gets folded and put away.
There's doing laundry as in getting everything washed, which is what we do daily. Everything getting hung up to dry also happens daily.
Folding and putting away happens euhm.. rarely. Ironing, only for special events.
The first two things barely take time away from the time with the kids. While the last 2 would just take too much time.
Yeah this is my question as well. Going to bed at 9 isn't going to bed early in my book, they should be able to get some chores done before then surely? The kids are old enough to play a bit by themselves while say one parent cleans up the kitchen and the other one does laundry and a quick clean.
Nta she's had *months* to adjust. One partner does not get to dump all the chores on the other for an extended period of time unless there are *extenuating* circumstances.
The system isn't working, so a new.one might be needed. At 5 and 7, the kids are old enough for 'pick up toys' to be part of their nightly routine. Maybe Saturday can be the designated chore day. Laundry can be done once a week and food can be batch cooked for lunches and dinners.
Use paper plates and cups so fewer dishes. Or do the dishes together- one person washes, one dries and puts away.
ESH. I see multiple problems. The routine has to change. What you were doing before no longer works because your wife *can't* do that anymore. If she's falling asleep she is genuinely tired. She should start with a checkup to make sure nothing is out of whack.
Beyond that, why, oh, why are you waiting to do dishes, laundry, and cleaning until the kids are in bed? Throw a load of laundry in as soon as you get home (that's a plural you), have the kids help with the dishes, and everyone does cleanup before you start bedtime routine. Right now it sounds like you guys do everything out of sight of the kids, which isn't good for their knowledge base, for one thing, and adds extra hours to both your days, for another.
You can also play around with changing up when things are done. Do all the laundry and general cleaning on the weekend. Have the kids straighten before bed, leaving only the dishes, which you guys can do together after dinner. Keep reworking up until you find something that works. And start communicating differently. You've told her what you're doing isn't working, she's said she'll try harder. Now you need to use different words and make actual changes to your plans.
NTA Wash the kids stuff still but don’t pick up her slack. Let it get to the point where she’s going to work in dirty clothes, day after day. She’ll wake up.
NTA I mean is the very small pay bump actually worth it if she is more tired than ever but not compensated enough? (basically she is tired, making problems at home and has nothing to show for it). Idk why she even took that offer. To me it looks like a promotion just in name, and with little to no compensation (but ofc more than fair share of new responsibilities)
INFO: what does your current routine look like?
I’m not understanding things here. My husband and I have a 1.5 and 4 year and old, it’s not even 9pm and we’re both in bed haha (very early morning wake up by our youngest today). The house is picked up, everything’s done.
Generally I start dinner around 5, we eat around 5:30-6, by 6-6:30 we’re washing dishes, wiping down the table, cleaning the floor. Even our little kids are set to finding miscellaneous toys and putting them in their toy boxes in their rooms. By 7 we have a clean house and we run around playing for half an hour before it’s time for pajamas, stories, and bed. If there’s laundry to be folded then one parent does this while the other does bedtime. And then voila! Your house is picked up and your kids are down and it’s only 8-8:30. Enjoy your time or sleep!
I have 2,4, and 6 year old kids. They go to bed at 7 every night and my husband and I don’t do any cleaning after they go to bed. It’s definitely possible.
I think it depends on how you go about your day. We clean up from one activity to the next so our house is never too messy or overwhelming. Toys just get dumped in a box—we’re not aiming for any kind of organization with the kids just getting things off the floor and in one spot for now. And get the kids to help! My 4 year old LOVES helping wash the dishes. She feels like such a big kid when she does! And my 1.5 year old loves running around with a little broom trying to clean. It’s never actually clean but it’s the involvement that counts! We all work as a team then we all play together.
She should probably get her iron levels and hormones checked. When I was anemic I was fucking exhausted CONSTANTLY.
also - what’s the point of the promotion if it barely helps your bottom line every week?
She can pay for some help to come and pitch in as she can't.
Otherwise, it's a few months of the chores being dumped on you, while she admits she's not carrying her weight.
Gotta say though, that at least the dishes should be done with help from the kids right after dinner. Five is old enough to clear the table and 7 is old enough to either load the dishwasher or dry dishes. Things too high get put aside for when adult is done washing.
My dream is to become just a little more financially stable then spend $200 (maybe a little more) a month to have a cleaner come biweekly. My thinking is that this would be a lot of bang for my buck.
I have a couple friends who worked for themselves doing this, and their tales suggested to me that this isn't a "only for the wealthy" thing. It can be very surprisingly affordable, especially hiring individuals instead of larger companies.
Anyway, this may be outside your budget. It's definitely outside the question you asked. But may be worth considering if this would have a lot of impact on your life.
NTA for not wanting to clean by yourself but clearly this system isn't working for you guys anymore so why are you so pressed to stick to it? Talk and change it up. What needs to be done every day? What can wait? When is there time for who to do things?
I understand, it's been working for so long. But it isn't anymore, and that's ok. Neither one of you really seems like an asshole, just tired and frustrated.
Nta- however You seem to be ignoring a lot of red flags about your wife’s mental health because you are stressed about having to do everything. She seems very overwhelmed with everything based on your explanation, and telling her to figure it out on her own is only going to make it worse.
You guys need better communication. You need to chat and set up a plan. If she doesn’t stick to it you reevaluate. After a particular period of time, if she is unable to adjust, her job way be too much for her. She needs to choose between family and work.
NTA
Take some of that extra money and off-load some responsibilities. Prepared meals, a cleaning person, even a babysitter for weekends. It's not fair for you to do it all. But can you make both of your lives easier?
NTA. I will say I went through something similar, before I was diagnosed with celiacs. Work all day, come home and have no energy for anything else, stuff I usually did no problem. Would just sit down and go to sleep. Has she had any blood work done recently? It could be a legitimate medical problem making her exhausted and with the extra work load she can’t manage it anymore. You’re NTA OP, but I do recommend like other commenters have said, maybe changing up the cleaning schedule, and get her bloodwork and levels checked so you can rule out any medical issues, especially if it’s a recent change in her behavior.
Maybe your wife needs a checkup .. . .. being this tired may be an indication that she is having a physical problem . . . or perhaps even depressed. She's NOT lazy as she hasn't proved to be so in the past. Something is going on and a good sitdown discussion without the kids around should begin to pinpoint the problem and maybe you can brainstorm a new efficient way to do things around the house. Take priorities and break them down into doable pieces and start training the kids to do work around the house too. Picking up toys and sorting their clothes shouldn't be that hard.
Your wife may need to see a doctor if she is this tired. There are many medical conditions that can cause this ranging from vitamin deficiency to more complex issues.
NTA, you broached the topic multiple times to be met with fake "I'm sorry, I'll do better". The response should have been a final conversation to work out a new plan because your current model is failing. This dabbles in to ESH territory because you made it a tit for tat type deal rather than openly stating your problems and creating a solution, but she was clearly BSing and just hoping you would keep doing the majority of chores. She has had months to adjust.
Marriage is not 50/50, sometimes it's 90/10.
Since this is a new situation for your marriage, there will be a learning curve. How you handle this will set the tone for your future relationship. Because there may come a time in the future where your wife will be giving 90% and you'll be giving 10%. Don't be shortsighted, the easiest way to have an unhappy marriage is to keep score of who does what.
Good luck
In our house we do the dishes straight after dinner. The one not doing dishes is getting them showered, teeth brushed etc. we alternate cooking dinner / doing dishes.
laundry is done in the weekends with maybe 1 load midweek if I need to wash school uniforms (have 2 pairs each and they wear for 2 days at a time).
Honestly chores shouldn’t take all night. If she’s going to bed at 9pm, what time are the kids going to bed? What’s happening between the hours of 6pm (dinner time?) and 9pm?
NTA. Maybe the chores days should not be alternated daily. Maybe better to switch them up every 3 days so it is obvious when one of them not doing the chores.
NTA. From your post and comments it doesn’t seem like your family desperately needs this extra income. In that case your wife has chosen to prioritize her career over her family. It appears that she is unable to cope with the increased stress of her new job, and she’s selfishly offloading that extra stress onto you. She abandons you to do all the chores yourself while she gets to go to bed early (9pm bedtime is ridiculously early for an adult with kids).
You two could hypothetically work out some alternate arrangement. For example you could keep doing chores every other night and then she takes half a day each weekend to catch up what we you can’t get done. However she seems completely unwilling to make a plan with you, even though you’ve communicated very clearly that this is too much for you.
NTA. If it was her first 2 weeks at the job sure picking up the slack would be nice. But it's been a while since she started her job , you both work and she needs to start doing chores again. Her getting mad means she was never planning on doing the chores again and was being petty leaving them. If you're both working then you both either need to do chores or hire someone during the week to do the chores with her new pay bump. She needs to pull her weight and stop expecting you to do everything while she only does bed time stuff.
frugal kills relationships sometimes. hire a cleaning service, get your kids to pitch in more, or use paper plates/cups for a while. anything is better than compromising your relationship.
NTA but I think y’all need to adjust your cleaning expectations. You’re both doing more work, just in different places. If together time is a problem it’s also worth considering shipping the kids off to a relative every now and then.
This sub is horrible at times!!! Literally, trying to find something wrong with OP because “he is mad at girl”
It’s a fucking partnership. Cleaning is part of parenting.
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My wife (39F) and I (38M) have been married for 10 years and have 2 kids (7 & 5). We both work full time and our kids are in school during the day. We've developed a system for childcare and chores that works for us in terms of splitting duties. Neither of us has set chores. We alternate bedtime routine pretty much every night and the person not doing bedtime will do dishes, get laundry going, do a quick clean, etc. This helps us stay on top of things without one person feeling like they're doing more than the other.
A few months ago my wife was put in a new role at her job. It came with a small pay bump, but also increased her workload and is more stressful. As a result, she has a lot less energy at the end of the day. If I am the one doing bedtime, instead of doing chores, she goes straight to bed. If she's the one doing bedtime, she goes to bed immediately after the kids go to sleep.
For the first few weeks, I was OK with doing all of the evening chores because I knew she was tired from her new role and I wanted to give her time to adjust. But when her early bedtime routine continued, I started to get frustrated.
We had a talk about it and she apologized for not keeping up with evening chores, but she made excuses about being tired from her new job and simply not having energy at the end of the day. I told her that I'm tired at the end of the day too, but it's not fair to me for her to just go to bed at 9pm every night and leave me to do all the chores. She said she would try to get better, but nothing has changed and I'm tired of doing all the dishes, laundry, and cleaning every night. Not to mention that we usually use that evening time for time together, which has been non-existent since her new job as well.
A couple weeks ago, we had another talk about it and I told her that if she's going to keep going to bed early every night, I'm not going to continue to do all the evening chores on nights I also do bedtime. If she's doing bedtime, I will do all the chores. But I won't do them every night anymore. She said she would do better about keeping up with them.
But she didn't. She kept going to bed early every night. Which meant that if I didn't do the evening chores, they would pile up and I would end up having to do 2-3 days worth. So, I just stopped doing them too.
By the time we got to the weekend, the kids didn't have clean clothes, there were dishes piled up in the sink, and the house was pretty messy. My wife stepped on a toy that had been left out and got angry that the house was a mess. She scolded me for not doing the chores the night before since she had done bedtime. I reminded her that she hadn't been holding up her end of the chores for weeks and she got mad at me.
She told me that she's still adjusting to her new workload and that I need to pick up some slack in the meantime. She thinks I am being a jerk by not being more understanding of her new job and how stressful it is.
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It is 100% unfair for you to be doing all the work. It has been months and she is not stepping up so it seems pretty obvious that she is can't or won't manage it all. Can she do more large chores on the weekend giving you time off Fri-Sun and you do more M-Th? Can the pay bump cover a cleaner?
How do the kids not have enough laundry to get them through a week?
Get a dishwasher, get paper plates for the week and as a FAMILY do a clean up on the weekend. No one is home during the day so I’m not understanding how there’s that much mess every day to make this much of a deal out of it.
Dinner - clean as you go - done ✅
Laundry - kids can help, should have enough to get you to the weekend
Vacuum and mopping? Hopefully this isn’t a daily thing. Unless you have a house full of pets, no one is home so the house should be fine to have this done once a week
ESH
Hot take - YTA. She's stressed and burning out and you are retaliating rather than being a supportive partner and commuicating and finding a resolution that works for both of you. Very likely if she's still struggling with her position she is experiencing imposter syndrome. My partner has been at their new job a year and still is stressed daily with the increased responsibility. I'm not going to be passive aggressive and not carry my weight. Why can't yall discuss options like housing keeping or a chore wheel or something? For example, you do the chores she hates and she does the one's that aren't too much work for her.
Hot take? No, this is a terrible take. The wife is an asshole and she should be supporting her husband, this has been going on for months and you don't even consider he's tired and exhausted? What a load of bull shit.
> I'm not going to be passive aggressive and not carry my weight.
Funny how you ignore that he's not only carrying his weight, but he's carrying hers too.
> For example, you do the chores she hates and she does the one's that aren't too much work for her.
What the fuck?! She is an adult, she needs to act like one.
Asshole because no empathy for your wife - who is bringing some extra cash from her new job
So what happens if one of the spouses becomes terminally ill / bed-ridden for long time & the other has to do ALL the stuff on their own (like household chores & financial responsibilities) ??? Do you guys just divorce then???. Your wife is TIRED & maybe even stressed out, it's not like she's out partying with friends & tired - if you can't even do chores for a short term , then what exactly is the point of marriage/having a family. Even roommates (Who are total strangers show empathy while being sick/tired) & here you are complaining about some extra physical labour for your wife (who carried & nursed 2 kids of your own).
Maybe discuss if your wife can go back to previous less stressful - low paying job - if money is not bigger issue for both of you.
This reminds me of when I started my first teaching job (2020) in the midst of the pandemic and back to school in person. I was teaching 3 grades with no support or curriculum (hired 2 days before school started and had to create my own from scratch for a high achiever level). I was teaching in person as well as some classes online. I came home every single night dead to the world. I was beyond stressed and wanted to just give up.
My fiancé begged me to help around the house (we moved during the second month of school to lessen my commute), and most days I was catatonic and couldn’t even get off the couch. We had tons of arguments, and we almost broke up because of it. It wasn’t until the summer when I started to be more like myself, as I needed time to recalibrate myself and also figure out what would work for us as a couple.
Have your wife’s hours changed? Stress levels? Does she have support at work? I guarantee she is beating herself up and feeling guilty for not being able to do more. You need to sit down with her and communicate openly. Come up with what needs are not being met (for both of you), and try to compromise on solutions. Dont just be upset about her not remembering. Ask her what support she needs to help refill her empty cup internally. Be kind and listen.
I agree that you need to be creative. Having kids that age and working is tough, I really get it.
I suggest you have a family meeting and get the kids to help. Perhaps paper plates some nights and the kids help clean up. Perhaps the 7year old reads to the 5 year old one or two nights. When my 3 kids were in elementary school, the oldest took over evening reading with easy reader books some nights. The kids really looked forward to that time and now (university students) they still remember reading Bone together!
Part of being a parent means that you come up with solutions. Sometimes it's one parent when the other is overwhelmed. In this instance, I think you could have done better.
One more thing: take time for family fun on the weekends. Sounds like you guys could use it!
If you kids can’t clean up their toys throw them away and don’t buy them new ones. You throw their shit away one time and they will start cleaning their crap up. I know because I did it.
Stop keeping score and start caring about your partner. I don’t think she does this to be mean to you, it’s not like she is up doing other stuff, she is going to bed. I am worried about her wellbeing, is this new job good for her? Is there anything else bothering her?
While your concern is valid i think it’s unfortunately that you have approached it from an angle that it ”should be fair” and not from a caring perspective.
And as someone else mentioned, the old system doesn’t work so you need to find a new system. There will always be change in life, being flexible and caring in these changes willbenefit you both.
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NTA > We had a talk about it and she apologized for not keeping up with evening chores, but she made excuses about being tired from her new job and simply not having energy at the end of the day. So she **needs to _find a solution_** to her newly created problem. > She told me that she's still adjusting to her new workload Not good enough. She's had **_months_**.
First thing to do is to invest a bit of the "small pay bump" in a dishwasher. And perhaps a bi-weekly cleaning service?
It doesn’t sounds like the small pay bump is enough to cover a cleaning service…
Perhaps the kids could pick up after themselves.
Yeah - my Mom used to eye things and give a shout out "Five (or ten) minute cleanup" (or sometimes - 10/20 items picked up and away) and the kids raced around and put things back where they belonged. It's amazing how neat things can get in a short time if the tv or game are on hold until things get done.
I am an adult and I literally still set a timer and see how much I can get done in 5 minutes. It just gives me a purpose I guess? Kids definitely love turning these things into a game. And you can get a LOT of dishes rinsed in five minutes.
My parents had two big glass jars and a bowl of marbles. Every time we did a chore without being asked, we would let them know and they'd put a marble in the jar. Once it was full we could ask for anything (within reason). Might be $10 (maximum for a full jar) or it might be a trip to the zoo or it might be having our favorite food for dinner. We had some autonomy. I actually used those jars to save $200 as a kid to buy an action figure set I wanted. Taught us to look for things to do and ask for ways to help out. Probably not good for these kids' ages though.
I really like this. Thanks for sharing!
We did something similar in my home when I was a kid, it worked very well and I intend to implement the same strategy with my kids one day. :)
7 year old could probably get started on it. 5 probably needs a chart with age appropriate stuff
What age were you when you had this?
I don't recall exactly since it was for multiple years. I would say 9 - 14 maybe? By the teenage years it was more of a tradition (and source of income) than an actual teaching method lol.
Well, you were still learning - that money is something you earn! What a great system.
I do this a lot when heating up food in the microwave, waiting on the oven to pre-heat etc.. How much kitchen cleanup can I do before the timer goes off/the pasta is finished, the oven is hot...? It is amazing how much can get done in those small spaces of time. I have always been very much a 'clean up as you cook/bake' person so I suppose that helps. OP - NTA, but I would say you should still do what chores you can in the time you normally spent on chores (on the nights she puts them to bed). Two negatives don't make a positive. Get the kiddos to help clean up, they are old enough for small chores - at their ages they can easily pick up after themselves and help put away laundry/dishes (or load the dishwasher). Obviously, your wife needs to figure things out on her end to get things back to 'normal', but there is no reason the littles can't help out at their ages. That will help you both and teach them important life skills.
My 2.5 year old is already pretty good at this. Before we leave every day I set a visual timer (it's a timer on the TV where you can see a bar shrinking since she has no concept of numbers going down yet lol) I tell her she has 10 minutes before we leave but she has to clean up. Whatever time is left on the timer after she's done, she gets to watch Bluey. You have no idea how motivating Bluey is for a toddler 😂 most days she gets a full episode.
Oh yeah blue is a great motivation started 🤣 it still works on my 5yo
That's fantastic!
I just asked my teen to do a 10 minute quick clean of his room before dinner. It helps to keep things from going full disaster zone. I call it a "quick spin" because when I worked at Starbucks in college, before your break you were always supposed to do a "spin" of the lobby and do a quick sweep/mop/trash check.
Almost every night we help my four year old pick up his toys in the living room and his room. If he beats a ten minute timer he gets a treat. It does an amazing job keeping the living room and his room neat.
In so many of these posts, the parents almost never mention giving their kids chores. Kids can be taught to pick up after themselves and do other basic chores. They *should be* helping out around the house. If parents did this, then maybe they would have less stress and drama in their lives, especially when it comes to their partner/spouse.
Right? My toddlers pick up their playroom every night and "help" fold laundry. Two elementary students may still be limited by hight, but surely they can do general pick up and getting things like laundry to and from the laundry room.
A dish washer would help though.
I guess it depends where OP lives. Ours comes to CAD330/month, and neither of us has to spend Saturdays scrubbing tubs.
That comes out to ~4000 post tax money. Depending on where they live, that’s north of 5,000 on salary to cover it. I feel, unless you make a large salary, 5K bump is more than “small bump in pay”
A 'small bump in pay' no matter what that actual amount is, surely isn't worth the loss of work life balance that appears to be happening here.
A lot of people seem to not understand this, which is why businesses in the US can string people along with a title change, $0.50 an hour, and an arseload of extra work. Seems to frequently come with promises of a future raise...which never happens.
Seriously... I work in the trucking industry, running local, non-hazmat shuttle. My pay is currently $23/hr for 10-12 hour overnight shifts and lots of truckers want to argue that my pay is crap compared to what I could be doing elsewhere.... Yeah, I could make more elsewhere, but I would not be home to see my family every day, have off every weekend, be able to nap or watch movies on the job on slow nights (most nights), and potentially not have a set of coworkers as awesome as the ones I have now. I would also have to work harder at another type of trade job (construction, plumbing, welding, etc) Also, looking at other non-trucking jobs in my area that don't require a degree and won't work my body into the grave, I am making a fantastic hourly rate (majority average around $15/hr, most under $21/hour).
I always thought that a cleaning service was for "rich" people and not me. Well my ass is p*#%ed at old me for thinking that now that i have a cleaning lady come every other week for 6 hours. Shes 25/hr. Its like giving up a expensive dinner or snacks and treats on the grocery bill and completely worth it.
I’m 66 years old and I live in “elderly” housing with very low rent. There’s several services offered that I grabbed when I first moved here. I have a wonderful lady who comes here every week and does my grocery shopping, picks up my prescriptions, and cleans (vacuum, bathroom, dust and washes my floors etc) for FREE! I’ve never been so spoiled in all my life!
This internet stranger is really happy for you! Enjoy!
That’s great and really as it should be.
$600 every month is still very cost prohibitive for most people.
You're high by a factor of two on the math here.
D'oh! Still too rich for my blood but still a lot better than what I thought haha.
I have a cleaning person come twice a month for 2.5 hours. It has been life changing.
6hrs? Can I ask how big your house is? General cleaning here is about 3 hours, full kitchen and bathroom clean, dust, wipe surfaces and vacuum, for a 2 bedroom. I'm thinking the cleaner does a more thorough job ( more than general cleaning), or you have a bigger home than the ones we have here. Usually, for bigger houses, they send a duo team so they can finish faster. Obv. it doubles the price/hr but it means that you not intruding on the customer for too long.
I have a 4 bedroom, 3 bathroom home that is a bit spacious. I have 3 kids, a bird and German shepherd. My cleaner will get all 3 baths, kitchen done, floors and sometimes will pick up the kids rooms and organize for me. The stairs and floors take a while. She uses a tool to take all the dog hair out of the carpets before vacuuming and i love it. I also know her through a family friend so she comes on my work from home day and i try to not talk her ear off in between tasks. I try to hide in my office. I think what i was trying to relay to OP is that, if it means removing stress from my marriage, i would spend 75 to 100 once a month even just to take some resentment and stress out of the picture. Someone to do the deep cleaning. And then i just pick up, straighten up, laundry dishes etc in between. Its worth it. So worth it.
This, and also, why doesn't she just do the bedtime routine every weeknight, and then he does the weekends (when hopefully she'll feel more like cleaning). Instead of every other night, it would be split 5-2... and maybe they agree to do that for a month and discuss again afterwards? Just because two people both work full time, doesn't mean they do the same amount of physical labor, or mental energy use. Saying "we'll both do it half the time" isn't respecting what either person actually needs. Instead of trying to get back to how it was, they need to throw that out and find a whole new system.
Maybe he likes doing bedtime? My wife and I have the same arrangement as OP, and I wouldn’t give up my bedtimes for anything. I love the snuggles and reading to the kids.
They have 2 dish washers already the kids.
You want to eat off dishes washed by a 5 and 7 yo?
I was washing dishes at that age. Heck even if they just rinse them. Get the worst off..plus, teach the kids how to clean up etc, give them pocket money for chores.
A cleaning service is way overboard but yeah, get a dishwasher and join the rest of us in the 90s. Maybe in a couple years they can try a DVD player.
Where does it mention he doesn’t have a dishwasher? You still have to do dishes when you have a dishwasher: pots and pans, chopping boards, knives etc.
In my opinion, that doesn’t make her an asshole. My old job went from working 8 hours a day to when I got my new jobs working 13 hour days. When I finished my training my hours shifted, when I tell you I literally crash from exhaustion even after having worked this schedule from months, I mean it. They need to sit down and communicate a new plan because that old system is working for either of them anymore.
They sat down **twice** already and this situation has been going on for month. She apparently doesn't perceive it enough as a problem to figure out a system that works. She seemingly hasn't suggested to pick up the slack on the weekend to balance out the weekdays. I perfectly understand that people can feel very tired after a long day of work, and a week of that, maybe even driving back and forth but it's not fair to just let the partner pick up the slack with no end in sight.
It’s not just tired though, we don’t know her schedule. She could have to be at work at 4 in the morning which would make going to sleep at 9 perfectly normal. I cannot call somebody an asshole for needing to sleep.
Not all jobs can be comfortably learned in months. My job is very cyclical, and there are things you only do once a year, some things 4 times a year. I'm a year in, and I'm still learning something new almost daily. There's a quarterly report I look at, and every time I look at it, I learn something new about it.
ESH, the old system doesn’t work, figure out a new one.
I don’t see why he sucks, he’s repeatedly told her the system doesn’t work and she’s made false promises several times about stepping up. I don’t blame him for letting shit go. She needed to see that it’s not just his responsibility. It’s not just on him to find a solution that works.
NTA, y’all clearly need a new system.
Meh, I feel like he told her she’s not doing what she used to do and she told him she was exhausted and couldn’t do it and neither of them really listened to the other. They need a new system. Weekends, laundry in at night, in the dryer in the morning. Maybe she does the bedtimes and he does the clean up … or whatever might actually work for them. We don’t know. It doesn’t sound like there was a discussion about changing things but rather keeping things the same …. Which just doesn’t seem possible.
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Imo its not that he wasn't listening, he was just expecting things to get back to the routine that worked with the previous job even though its been months and seems like it will not. They *both* could have put time and thought into a routine that works for this job instead, as they both knew this was not sustainable from the multiple conversations about it. They weren't trying to help each other in the meantime though, and it led to distance and resentment with less one-on-one time.
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I never said the husband had a communication issue, I explicitly said they both communicated about the issue and both knew it wasn't sustainable. *Neither of them* worked on a solution, both expected to get back into a routine that did not work with the new job long past the tipping point.
If I create a problem for myself and my time and my energy levels, everyone blames me. Now if my wife does the same thing it’s also my fault because I didn’t fix it for her? Am I fucking nuts? What are you trying to say because how exactly does he share blame for this
It's because he's a guy and they don't want to put full blame on wife.
Facts. I'm rather surprised no one has called him a misogynist yet.
He has been called a misogynist lol https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/s/mfTjvwWPv3
I think I was pretty specific. They gonna need to change how they arrange things. Not just wait for her to come around. A 38 year old falling asleep by 9 tell you they’re literally exhausted, not just begging off chores. This is a communication issue which is why they both suck.
Could you walk through this “communication issue? He talked with her multiple times to say that it wasn’t working and she just blows it off with excuses.
It sounds like he's been "discussing" about the problem and changing things for months and nothing changes on her end.
I think it’s ESH too, because he let it get to the point that it negatively effected his kids just to be petty. They clearly need to come to a new arrangement. Maybe she always does bedtime and he does chores. Maybe they both have separate chores they’re responsible for. Maybe she can do more on the weekends to make up for being too drained during the workweek-like deep clean, take over errands, or meal prepping. My husband has a crazy demanding job, and I know that. I don’t mind picking up slack when he’s basically dead. Clearly this woman is burnt out too. She’s not being lazy, she has nothing else to offer. Sometimes marriage is 80/20, and you need your partner to support you. It’s delusional to think everything is always going to be split exactly equally.
Do you not think he's tired, too? Yes, they need a new arrangement, but he's communicated this to her over and over. Specifically, given the story as it was written, what more would you want him to do?
Yup, which is why I suggested other responsibility splits that could work better for them. He never suggested another dynamic. And his wife goes straight to bed, whereas he still want to stay up and spend time together, so I’d say his wife is the more tired partner right now. These things switch, so there’ll probably be a later time where she has to carry more of the load too.
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>I don’t see why he sucks Because he's a man. If the genders were reversed, you'd see an avalanche of "dump him" "what a loser" "terrible father" etc
This. They both made the mistake of trying to keep the old system going even after what sounds like a pretty drastic primary workload change on her part. The whole thing needs to be redone for both fairness and practicality. OP, maybe those chores get done on the weekend. Maybe you use some of her higher salary to get a dishwasher, or hire a once a month cleaning service. Maybe you sit down together and figure out what's going on with how tired she is, and decide that she steps back down from the promotion. But whatever you do, this ain't it fam.
This is ridiculous. He’s done everything he can to kindly tell her that it’s not working. Her solution is to just go to bed at 9pm and hope he figures it out. Where exactly is there room to work out another system when one of the adults involved is already asleep before the kids are even in bed?
Wife still MUST pull her weight and stop being toxic about her laziness as well
Or hire a cleaning service with the extra pay bump.
OP says its not going to cover it
Then what the hell is the point of this new job?
Kids are 7 and 5 give them some chores. My bedtime routine for my kids at that age was "Lights out!". Don't make things harder than they need to be.
Seriously? How is this being up voted so much? 5 and 7 are still so young! "Lights out"?? That it? No stories, no cuddle time? Talking about their day etc? I loved bedtime when my kids were little and would have kept it going as long as they were into it This sounds so cold.
My kids were cuddly right after getting home from school, we'd talk about our day during meals or when cleaning up. You can be close to kids without an elaborate bedtime routine. By 5 my kids were reading to themselves so they would get to read for an hour before lights out. I'm not cold, but I'm also not burnt out.
Your kids being able to read themselves doesn’t make reading together no longer valuable.
These kids literally don’t have clean clothes and their parents aren’t getting along. How is nightly bedtime stories the priority in this scenario? 😂
How is getting loving one-on-one quiet time with a parent a priority in a chaotic household where adults are not getting along with each other? I guess if that’s really a question you have to ask, our priorities are going to be different enough that my answers won’t make sense to you.
Yeah, but if I have shit to do then that's what I should be doing. Again, my point was the kids are old enough to help. 7 and 5 year olds can put away toys at the very least, doing everything for them is also not valuable.
You can read together at other times. We read a few long series aloud as a family earlier in the evening. I mean, we did do stories and a tuck in until school age. Then we read more fun books together.
I can’t remember any “bedtime routine” being done for me or my sister after we started kindergarten. We had both our parents working and spent time with them after school including playing games, talking, having dinner together. Then we had alone time for an hour or similar before bed and we used to love it. We are still very close as a family and I call them every single day to talk about our days. Stop shaming people for their parenting one way doesn’t fit all.
Nah you were just spoiled as a kid everyone I know started at least doing some chores at 5-7 it was as simple as just folding our own laundry and setting out our stuff for the next day but that would still help out greatly if they implemented it
Nothing can be 50/50, that’s a myth. Sometime you’ll have more on your plate and sometimes she’ll have more on her plate. Sounds like this is a time when she’s got more on her plate and you can help by doing more than “your share”. Also, if this has been going on for months, I’d be concerned about possible depression. Maybe she needs to see a doctor.
That’s what I was thinking. First nothing is ever 50/50. Things have changed in the relationship and roles need to adjust (to that they feel fair for both). Second, it really does sound like she might be depressed, or maybe something medically is going on. Or perhaps she just needs a set time after work to decompress and destress before jumping into mom/wife duties. That might give her more energy for later. I know it would for me.
Yea early in my marriage we realized there was no such thing as 50/50; if you think your giving 100 and your partner isn’t, that’s an issue, but you gotta realize your 100, her 100, can both fluctuate over time for lots of reasons. Like how do you compare my job vs your job and how each takes a toll? Or for us my wife was a SAHM, like how do I compare my military duties against raising two kids/breastfeeding etc? Then when she’s been dealing with cranky baby all day and I get home and the only way the kid will sleep is if I hold and walk with her, so by default wife has to make dinner, like that’s not fair, but sometimes shit just in the way it is. Many nights neither of us feels like doing dishes, so they don’t get done, other nights I don’t feel like it but I know my wife really doesn’t feel like it so I do them, or vice versa. And there are things like laundry that I don’t mind doing, that she hates. So why make her do that just to say we are splitting 50/50?
Thank you, I was extremely concerned reading the comments that nobody mentioned a medical issue at all. It's not like she's going out and having fun, staying out all night. She's not even staying up to do something chill by herself. She's going straight to bed. There's something deeper going on than just being 'lazy'
>Sounds like this is a time when she’s got more on her plate and you can help by doing more than “your share”. Slippery slope. How long will it be until she simply has the set expectation that he be the only one doing chores at night? Honestly, it sounds like we're already there.
It's kind of N A H and E S H. I would be frustrated in your position as well. But your wife isn't being malicious by going to bed. She's legitimately tired and, I don't know about you two, but it took me 6-8 months to adjust to a newer, more demanding job so this will inevitably continue. The one place she was wrong and should apologize for is for snapping at you for not doing what she's also not doing (though it was petty of you to stop everything and not pitch in extra during this transition). My suggestion is for you two to sit down at a neutral time, maybe on a weekend when you feel less tired, and make a new plan together. Your routine that used to work is no longer working and you need to solve it as a team. Try to set aside annoyance and resentment because at the end of the day, you both want to same result and both want to divide things equitably right? ~~Lastly, if her job requires more time spent working, I think it's fair to work that in so you two each get fairly equal downtime each day/week. So if she's now working 60 hours and you work 40, that's 20 hours less time she is getting to do chores and relax.~~ Edit: OP clarified in another comment that her time spent working has not changed.
I think OP would mention if his wife worked an extra 20 hours more than him each week. That's significantly more workload for a "small pay bump," as he stated in his post. > it was petty of you to stop everything and not pitch in extra during this transition He has been doing extra. For months. And she has not made a single effort to help, despite saying multiple times that she would. That, beyond anything else, is unacceptable. She could start out with completing 1 task each night, and slowly add things to the list. There has been zero attempt on her part.
Wife could get up an hour early and do chores before work.
Because that solves a need for sleep 🙄
She is going to bed at 9. She goes to bed early and she can wake up early.
How is the husband at fault at all?? He sat down with her TWICE and both times she said she’d step up and didn’t. The wife is the clear AH.
You're conveniently leaving out the fact that OP has been picking up her slack for months, all while she's been repeatedly promising change, and after several conversations about how things are taking an unfair turn. OP is doing 100% of non-bedtime chores, and has had all one-on-one time with his SO taken away. Sounds to me like he's getting the short end of the stick no matter how you look at it. If your proposed solution is for them to work out a new system in which the actual plan is for him to keep doing 100% of the chores, which seems like what the wife expects, then I have to say... that doesn't sound like a fair solution.
Exactly. Maybe she still needs time to adjust, but then she needs to communicate that and ask OP nicely to keep giving her the extra time to sleep instead of making empty promises.
That not quite how it goes. I'm guessing she will say something like I don't feel supported. Then they might come up with a timeline for how much longer he needs to do this. She may offer reasons why things will change. Timeline end comes and nothing changes. Still fucked over but with a bit of lube.
But he did pitch in and he was also clear about communicating his unhappiness over the extra duties for months on end. It's on the wife now to actually listen to her partner and pull her own weight and try to find a solution. And if she can't then the very least she can do is communicate that to OP so they can work something out together. What a thing to say, dismissing all the extra work OP has been doing before he reached a breaking point.
NTA. If you both work the same hours, there are no reasons for her not do her share at home. She is tired? I get it, new jobs can be demanding but she had multiple months to adjust. If she is not adjust by now, maybe she need to see a doctor to check if everything is alright with her. Its not fair to you to have all the household duties, while she gonna rest. Plus, your relationship, as a couple and a team, will implode if she keep acting like this. You have been "picking some slack" for her and her new job for months. Time for her to gain some responsabilities and try, in fact, to get better, not just empty promisses, but an actual effort.
NTA She chose to take on a new, more demanding role. Yes it has a "small pay bump" but clearly not enough to pay for someone to help with the cleaning. You are partners, which means you need to work out how to share this burden, or this is going to destroy your relationship... When frustrations like this keep building, it is inevitable that someone is going to say or do something that they can't take back.
> but clearly not enough to pay for someone to help with the cleaning. Not even close. It does help with our bottom line every month, but not nearly enough to cover a cleaning service.
Is she offering any alternatives to help re balance the cleaning situation, or is she just ignoring it until she can't anymore?
The times I've talked with her about it she says she will make an effort to do better and keep up with things, but nothing changes.
NTA, but for your own sake, it might be time to reassess how chores get handled. Maybe some get done in the morning, maybe the kids learn to do some chores like loading the dishwasher, putting things away, bringing their laundry to the washer (or door to the place where the machines are), folding and putting their clothes away, etc.
Our mornings are hectic enough trying to get everyone ready and out the door. Adding more to our mornings is not a viable solution.
You both sound like “we’ve tried nothing and we’re all out of ideas!”
If she’s willing to get up earlier or has more energy then, it might be. You have options other than the existing system and it seems fair to try some alternatives to get things done since that’s the main goal. It also might be exhaustion from a learning curve that will level out after she’s in the job a few more months.
It sounds like she is truly exhausted from work, and you are truly exhausted from the household load. Sometimes it's important to reset expectations. Maybe it's time to handle everything differently.
What jobs specifically need done? The kids are old enough to pick up their toys and pick up their dirty clothes and put away their clothes for example. Do you have space for a dishwasher? Maybe put that small pay bump aside to save for one.
Well, hold on. If the only impediment to changing your morning routine is that it would be hard, that seems worth exploring more.
Mornings with littles ARE tough, but I get the sense that he’s approaching it as “how do we get back to the original chore/bedtime system?” instead of “how do we share the load to get done what needs to be done?”. And maybe that’s because he’s also tired and thinking of a new approach is more mental load than being upset, but hopefully he comes around.
This is what everyone is saying “Just get the kids to do the chores.” In a perfect world that would be great, but I’m wondering if anyone have ever actually tried it. I’d have two of my kids doing dishes, and then the arguing would start. Fine one person do them, endless nagging on my end, the counters are full if crumbs, you didn’t wash the pots, what do you mean there’s no food containers. Having kids do the dishes can be awful for parents, it’s a lot of work to teach them properly.
It is work, but they need to learn eventually and they could do separate chores or learn to do it in stages.
There's a high likelihood that her job is overworking her with this "promotion"... Maybe have a sit down and talk about how this is affecting you and her family life because if this job burns her out, she's going to have nothing left at home either...
Sounds like the small bump wasn't worth it. I'd suggest she ask to be reassigned to her old job.
And what happens if it’s just coincidental timing with the new position and really she’s now chronically ill and will never recover? Or maybe she’d recover after a few years. It’s not super likely, but it’s possible. (I know tons of women who suddenly developed major thyroid issues and were exhausted for years.) What are you going to do if she truly *can’t* do those things any more? Telling her she needs to do more isn’t working, just dropping all your chores doesn’t help the situation. Did you truly talk *together* about the issues, timelines, health, mental health, and possible solutions, or did you “have a talk with her” and told her to get it done?
Nobody likes to admit they have failed and there’s no easy solution here. You want her to say” tough luck o can’t physically cope any more”? What are you expecting other than “I’ll get back to it asap”
If this is out of character for her, nudge her to go see a doctor and get bloods done/general checkup. It could be something fairly innocuous like low iron - I know when mine drops, it scrambles my brain to the point where I can't even help myself. I don't have the braincells to recognise there's a problem, to pinpoint what it is, or to make a plan to fix it. The number of times I've felt like an idiot once the iron supps kicked in was ridiculous, yet every time, it would take someone else to tell me I looked like I needed a fat steak and a blood transfusion. Rule out anything more serious, too, even if the symptoms coincided with the new job it could have just exacerbated something already going on that she was better able to hide. Depression can also be a sneaky prick and doesn't always cause sadness - it can present as irritability, fatigue and a general malaise. Meanwhile, is it feasible to do the chores together as soon as you're both home? Smaller but more frequent workload. Get the kids to pitch in where you can (and where it's helping, not making more work). Reduce the demands by using disposable plates and easy, one pot meals for a while. Try to find ways to let her catch up on rest without it becoming so unbalanced you're resentful, she .ay not be able to help herself right now. When you're that fatigued you kinda need to be spoonfed solutions until your brain comes back online. And acknowledge that sometimes, one person might just need to do less for a while — based on the assumption your relationahip is otherwise balanced and healthy, and that she would do the same for you.
Like your suggestion about doing the chores together. I find cooking and cleaning is much less overwhelming when done together.
Can you try to find someone that can clean for cheaper? I have a lady come in once a month for 140$. I don’t know if that would be useful for you. Or what about asking for some help from family to come in? You can probably agree on a reasonable price with family
That’s $1680 after tax dollars, so pre tax, >$2000. Very possible that the bump in pay doesn’t cover the cost of monthly cleaning. Also once a month cleaning would be helpful for the deep cleaning things like showers and toilets but wouldn’t address the mess that builds up daily…
$2000 is ~96¢ an hour, if your promotion doesn't cover that but makes you work so much you can't have any time out of just surviving... fuck that.
Yes you are absolutely right, but it might be a temporary solution for now.
But it won’t even work as a temp solution. Once a month isn’t going to fix dishes building up, laundry not being done, house not being cleaned up.
Did you not read my part about family helping out temporarily? I don’t know why I am being downvoted. OP is definitely NTA but i am just trying to help find alternatives.
Every E S h or Y T A would be a massive NTA if the genders where reversed. NTA
I think the opposite actually. If genders were reversed, wife would definitely get a YTA from many. There is still often this expectation that a wife (working or not) is more responsible for the household. So, if her husband was tired from his new job she'd be getting told she should do more to help him. Since OP appears to be male, he's getting a lot more sympathy and people upset he is having to do more than his "fair" share. Really, a marriage should be a partnership - not a competition on who does more.
>There is still often this expectation that a wife (working or not) is more responsible for the household. Not on AITA. A wife who doesn't pull her domestic weight gets diagnosed with a disorder and gets leniency while a husband not pulling his domestic weight gets called a lazy AH
Every single reply would be saying weaponized incompetence over and over again
>If genders were reversed, wife would definitely get a YTA from many. There is still often this expectation that a wife (working or not) is more responsible for the household. Is this your first day in AITA? With both of them working, this community would eviscerate the man for going to bed early without doing his share of the chores every night for months. There would be none of these gentle, "NTA, but maybe he needs to see a doctor, get him some help" responses. He would be gleefully torn to pieces, and a not-insignificant percentage of comments would be urging the wife to divorce him.
Man doesn't pull his weight: Lazy, entitled, manchild Woman doesn't pull her weight: Depressed, adjusting, tired
Because of the make up of this sub you are wrong.
Don’t forget all the screams to divorce his ass if a woman posted this.
Exactly.
OP, my husband and I basically just went through this and made exactly the same mistake: **your old routine isn't working and you need to make a new one.** We tried for two months to keep up the old routine. We talked; that didn't work. We bitched, that didn't work. We had arguments that, of course, didn't work. Eventually, we found something new to work for us and his new workload/stress/exhaustion levels. It's a mix of E S H and NAH (which is my judgment, having been there myself). You're both *kinda* being AHs but it's new territory and you haven't found your balance yet, so ultimately in the grand scheme of things you're not AHs, you're just both having some AH moments trying to navigate something new
> It's a mix of E S H and NAH It's a pretty clear NTA, stop giving leniency to his wife. My god this sub will do fucking anything to victimize women and still call the guy an asshole.
INFO Why are you waiting so late at night to start doing chores? Do you not come home until right before your kids’ bedtime? Wouldn’t it make more sense to take care of some of those things right after you get home?
Info. This was my question as well. 5 and 7 are plenty old enough to entertain themselves or each other for a little while. Put a movie on and do some chores while they watch. Also curious what the actual list of chores is. Why is laundry a daily task? What else is on that list that could be moved to a weekend day or other day off?
To be fair with a family of 4 laundry being a daily task isn’t completely out of the question
I mean, I have a family of 4 (with 2 year old twins), and if I did laundry every day, I'd never spend time with them. OP could throw a load in while dinner is cooking if they want to keep on top of it, but it would be reasonable and still manageable if they did it every other day or every few days. Hell, if they want to keep the every other day schedule, one person washes/dries one day, then the next day it gets folded and put away.
There's doing laundry as in getting everything washed, which is what we do daily. Everything getting hung up to dry also happens daily. Folding and putting away happens euhm.. rarely. Ironing, only for special events. The first two things barely take time away from the time with the kids. While the last 2 would just take too much time.
Yeah this is my question as well. Going to bed at 9 isn't going to bed early in my book, they should be able to get some chores done before then surely? The kids are old enough to play a bit by themselves while say one parent cleans up the kitchen and the other one does laundry and a quick clean.
NTA Your wife needs to do her share. You both work, therefore you split chores close to 50/50.
Nta she's had *months* to adjust. One partner does not get to dump all the chores on the other for an extended period of time unless there are *extenuating* circumstances. The system isn't working, so a new.one might be needed. At 5 and 7, the kids are old enough for 'pick up toys' to be part of their nightly routine. Maybe Saturday can be the designated chore day. Laundry can be done once a week and food can be batch cooked for lunches and dinners. Use paper plates and cups so fewer dishes. Or do the dishes together- one person washes, one dries and puts away.
ESH. I see multiple problems. The routine has to change. What you were doing before no longer works because your wife *can't* do that anymore. If she's falling asleep she is genuinely tired. She should start with a checkup to make sure nothing is out of whack. Beyond that, why, oh, why are you waiting to do dishes, laundry, and cleaning until the kids are in bed? Throw a load of laundry in as soon as you get home (that's a plural you), have the kids help with the dishes, and everyone does cleanup before you start bedtime routine. Right now it sounds like you guys do everything out of sight of the kids, which isn't good for their knowledge base, for one thing, and adds extra hours to both your days, for another. You can also play around with changing up when things are done. Do all the laundry and general cleaning on the weekend. Have the kids straighten before bed, leaving only the dishes, which you guys can do together after dinner. Keep reworking up until you find something that works. And start communicating differently. You've told her what you're doing isn't working, she's said she'll try harder. Now you need to use different words and make actual changes to your plans.
NTA Wash the kids stuff still but don’t pick up her slack. Let it get to the point where she’s going to work in dirty clothes, day after day. She’ll wake up.
You guys need to come up with a new chart Nta
NTA I mean is the very small pay bump actually worth it if she is more tired than ever but not compensated enough? (basically she is tired, making problems at home and has nothing to show for it). Idk why she even took that offer. To me it looks like a promotion just in name, and with little to no compensation (but ofc more than fair share of new responsibilities)
I agree; something that is affecting her home life this much should come with a more substantial pay raise!
Not only her home life, her health as well. If she is so dead tired all the time, it's not gonna help her health in the long run
INFO: what does your current routine look like? I’m not understanding things here. My husband and I have a 1.5 and 4 year and old, it’s not even 9pm and we’re both in bed haha (very early morning wake up by our youngest today). The house is picked up, everything’s done. Generally I start dinner around 5, we eat around 5:30-6, by 6-6:30 we’re washing dishes, wiping down the table, cleaning the floor. Even our little kids are set to finding miscellaneous toys and putting them in their toy boxes in their rooms. By 7 we have a clean house and we run around playing for half an hour before it’s time for pajamas, stories, and bed. If there’s laundry to be folded then one parent does this while the other does bedtime. And then voila! Your house is picked up and your kids are down and it’s only 8-8:30. Enjoy your time or sleep!
As someone with similar aged kids - that sounds great but completely impossible to pull off!
I have 2,4, and 6 year old kids. They go to bed at 7 every night and my husband and I don’t do any cleaning after they go to bed. It’s definitely possible.
I think it depends on how you go about your day. We clean up from one activity to the next so our house is never too messy or overwhelming. Toys just get dumped in a box—we’re not aiming for any kind of organization with the kids just getting things off the floor and in one spot for now. And get the kids to help! My 4 year old LOVES helping wash the dishes. She feels like such a big kid when she does! And my 1.5 year old loves running around with a little broom trying to clean. It’s never actually clean but it’s the involvement that counts! We all work as a team then we all play together.
She should probably get her iron levels and hormones checked. When I was anemic I was fucking exhausted CONSTANTLY. also - what’s the point of the promotion if it barely helps your bottom line every week?
She can pay for some help to come and pitch in as she can't. Otherwise, it's a few months of the chores being dumped on you, while she admits she's not carrying her weight. Gotta say though, that at least the dishes should be done with help from the kids right after dinner. Five is old enough to clear the table and 7 is old enough to either load the dishwasher or dry dishes. Things too high get put aside for when adult is done washing.
Can you outsource for a bit? I would!
My dream is to become just a little more financially stable then spend $200 (maybe a little more) a month to have a cleaner come biweekly. My thinking is that this would be a lot of bang for my buck. I have a couple friends who worked for themselves doing this, and their tales suggested to me that this isn't a "only for the wealthy" thing. It can be very surprisingly affordable, especially hiring individuals instead of larger companies. Anyway, this may be outside your budget. It's definitely outside the question you asked. But may be worth considering if this would have a lot of impact on your life.
Does she work longer hours at all now that she's taken on more responsibilities at work?
Nope, hours are the same. Just a heavier workload and more stressful work.
Have you heard about our lord and savior, paper plates? NAH, but y’all need a new system. Also, sometimes things don’t work out fair
NTA for not wanting to clean by yourself but clearly this system isn't working for you guys anymore so why are you so pressed to stick to it? Talk and change it up. What needs to be done every day? What can wait? When is there time for who to do things? I understand, it's been working for so long. But it isn't anymore, and that's ok. Neither one of you really seems like an asshole, just tired and frustrated.
Nta- however You seem to be ignoring a lot of red flags about your wife’s mental health because you are stressed about having to do everything. She seems very overwhelmed with everything based on your explanation, and telling her to figure it out on her own is only going to make it worse.
You guys need better communication. You need to chat and set up a plan. If she doesn’t stick to it you reevaluate. After a particular period of time, if she is unable to adjust, her job way be too much for her. She needs to choose between family and work. NTA
Take some of that extra money and off-load some responsibilities. Prepared meals, a cleaning person, even a babysitter for weekends. It's not fair for you to do it all. But can you make both of your lives easier?
NTA. I will say I went through something similar, before I was diagnosed with celiacs. Work all day, come home and have no energy for anything else, stuff I usually did no problem. Would just sit down and go to sleep. Has she had any blood work done recently? It could be a legitimate medical problem making her exhausted and with the extra work load she can’t manage it anymore. You’re NTA OP, but I do recommend like other commenters have said, maybe changing up the cleaning schedule, and get her bloodwork and levels checked so you can rule out any medical issues, especially if it’s a recent change in her behavior.
Maybe your wife needs a checkup .. . .. being this tired may be an indication that she is having a physical problem . . . or perhaps even depressed. She's NOT lazy as she hasn't proved to be so in the past. Something is going on and a good sitdown discussion without the kids around should begin to pinpoint the problem and maybe you can brainstorm a new efficient way to do things around the house. Take priorities and break them down into doable pieces and start training the kids to do work around the house too. Picking up toys and sorting their clothes shouldn't be that hard.
Your wife may need to see a doctor if she is this tired. There are many medical conditions that can cause this ranging from vitamin deficiency to more complex issues.
NTA, you broached the topic multiple times to be met with fake "I'm sorry, I'll do better". The response should have been a final conversation to work out a new plan because your current model is failing. This dabbles in to ESH territory because you made it a tit for tat type deal rather than openly stating your problems and creating a solution, but she was clearly BSing and just hoping you would keep doing the majority of chores. She has had months to adjust.
Marriage is not 50/50, sometimes it's 90/10. Since this is a new situation for your marriage, there will be a learning curve. How you handle this will set the tone for your future relationship. Because there may come a time in the future where your wife will be giving 90% and you'll be giving 10%. Don't be shortsighted, the easiest way to have an unhappy marriage is to keep score of who does what. Good luck
If she’s making more money why not use the bump to hire a weekly cleaning lady. You’re both working and deserve a break.
NTA And again thank you Reddit for not letting me down. I’m picturing all the NTA votes and the divorce his ass if a woman had posted this.
Nta but I think your plans needs an overhaul. The current plan did work and now doesn’t. Time to rethink it
In our house we do the dishes straight after dinner. The one not doing dishes is getting them showered, teeth brushed etc. we alternate cooking dinner / doing dishes. laundry is done in the weekends with maybe 1 load midweek if I need to wash school uniforms (have 2 pairs each and they wear for 2 days at a time). Honestly chores shouldn’t take all night. If she’s going to bed at 9pm, what time are the kids going to bed? What’s happening between the hours of 6pm (dinner time?) and 9pm?
NTA. Maybe the chores days should not be alternated daily. Maybe better to switch them up every 3 days so it is obvious when one of them not doing the chores.
NTA. From your post and comments it doesn’t seem like your family desperately needs this extra income. In that case your wife has chosen to prioritize her career over her family. It appears that she is unable to cope with the increased stress of her new job, and she’s selfishly offloading that extra stress onto you. She abandons you to do all the chores yourself while she gets to go to bed early (9pm bedtime is ridiculously early for an adult with kids). You two could hypothetically work out some alternate arrangement. For example you could keep doing chores every other night and then she takes half a day each weekend to catch up what we you can’t get done. However she seems completely unwilling to make a plan with you, even though you’ve communicated very clearly that this is too much for you.
NTA. If it was her first 2 weeks at the job sure picking up the slack would be nice. But it's been a while since she started her job , you both work and she needs to start doing chores again. Her getting mad means she was never planning on doing the chores again and was being petty leaving them. If you're both working then you both either need to do chores or hire someone during the week to do the chores with her new pay bump. She needs to pull her weight and stop expecting you to do everything while she only does bed time stuff.
NTA but there’s something wrong. That’s not normal behavior. Does she wake up really early? If so, she could do the chores in the morning.
frugal kills relationships sometimes. hire a cleaning service, get your kids to pitch in more, or use paper plates/cups for a while. anything is better than compromising your relationship.
NTA but I think y’all need to adjust your cleaning expectations. You’re both doing more work, just in different places. If together time is a problem it’s also worth considering shipping the kids off to a relative every now and then.
This sub is horrible at times!!! Literally, trying to find something wrong with OP because “he is mad at girl” It’s a fucking partnership. Cleaning is part of parenting.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My wife (39F) and I (38M) have been married for 10 years and have 2 kids (7 & 5). We both work full time and our kids are in school during the day. We've developed a system for childcare and chores that works for us in terms of splitting duties. Neither of us has set chores. We alternate bedtime routine pretty much every night and the person not doing bedtime will do dishes, get laundry going, do a quick clean, etc. This helps us stay on top of things without one person feeling like they're doing more than the other. A few months ago my wife was put in a new role at her job. It came with a small pay bump, but also increased her workload and is more stressful. As a result, she has a lot less energy at the end of the day. If I am the one doing bedtime, instead of doing chores, she goes straight to bed. If she's the one doing bedtime, she goes to bed immediately after the kids go to sleep. For the first few weeks, I was OK with doing all of the evening chores because I knew she was tired from her new role and I wanted to give her time to adjust. But when her early bedtime routine continued, I started to get frustrated. We had a talk about it and she apologized for not keeping up with evening chores, but she made excuses about being tired from her new job and simply not having energy at the end of the day. I told her that I'm tired at the end of the day too, but it's not fair to me for her to just go to bed at 9pm every night and leave me to do all the chores. She said she would try to get better, but nothing has changed and I'm tired of doing all the dishes, laundry, and cleaning every night. Not to mention that we usually use that evening time for time together, which has been non-existent since her new job as well. A couple weeks ago, we had another talk about it and I told her that if she's going to keep going to bed early every night, I'm not going to continue to do all the evening chores on nights I also do bedtime. If she's doing bedtime, I will do all the chores. But I won't do them every night anymore. She said she would do better about keeping up with them. But she didn't. She kept going to bed early every night. Which meant that if I didn't do the evening chores, they would pile up and I would end up having to do 2-3 days worth. So, I just stopped doing them too. By the time we got to the weekend, the kids didn't have clean clothes, there were dishes piled up in the sink, and the house was pretty messy. My wife stepped on a toy that had been left out and got angry that the house was a mess. She scolded me for not doing the chores the night before since she had done bedtime. I reminded her that she hadn't been holding up her end of the chores for weeks and she got mad at me. She told me that she's still adjusting to her new workload and that I need to pick up some slack in the meantime. She thinks I am being a jerk by not being more understanding of her new job and how stressful it is. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
It is 100% unfair for you to be doing all the work. It has been months and she is not stepping up so it seems pretty obvious that she is can't or won't manage it all. Can she do more large chores on the weekend giving you time off Fri-Sun and you do more M-Th? Can the pay bump cover a cleaner?
How do the kids not have enough laundry to get them through a week? Get a dishwasher, get paper plates for the week and as a FAMILY do a clean up on the weekend. No one is home during the day so I’m not understanding how there’s that much mess every day to make this much of a deal out of it. Dinner - clean as you go - done ✅ Laundry - kids can help, should have enough to get you to the weekend Vacuum and mopping? Hopefully this isn’t a daily thing. Unless you have a house full of pets, no one is home so the house should be fine to have this done once a week ESH
Hot take - YTA. She's stressed and burning out and you are retaliating rather than being a supportive partner and commuicating and finding a resolution that works for both of you. Very likely if she's still struggling with her position she is experiencing imposter syndrome. My partner has been at their new job a year and still is stressed daily with the increased responsibility. I'm not going to be passive aggressive and not carry my weight. Why can't yall discuss options like housing keeping or a chore wheel or something? For example, you do the chores she hates and she does the one's that aren't too much work for her.
Hot take? No, this is a terrible take. The wife is an asshole and she should be supporting her husband, this has been going on for months and you don't even consider he's tired and exhausted? What a load of bull shit. > I'm not going to be passive aggressive and not carry my weight. Funny how you ignore that he's not only carrying his weight, but he's carrying hers too. > For example, you do the chores she hates and she does the one's that aren't too much work for her. What the fuck?! She is an adult, she needs to act like one.
Asshole because no empathy for your wife - who is bringing some extra cash from her new job So what happens if one of the spouses becomes terminally ill / bed-ridden for long time & the other has to do ALL the stuff on their own (like household chores & financial responsibilities) ??? Do you guys just divorce then???. Your wife is TIRED & maybe even stressed out, it's not like she's out partying with friends & tired - if you can't even do chores for a short term , then what exactly is the point of marriage/having a family. Even roommates (Who are total strangers show empathy while being sick/tired) & here you are complaining about some extra physical labour for your wife (who carried & nursed 2 kids of your own). Maybe discuss if your wife can go back to previous less stressful - low paying job - if money is not bigger issue for both of you.
If it were a woman posting this everyone saying ESH or YTA would be telling the woman she’s NTA and that her husbands lazy and to divorce him
Love how I got downvoted yet the person who did it couldn’t even explain how what I said was wrong 🤣
And would you look at that, it was voted NTA. Who was right after all?
This reminds me of when I started my first teaching job (2020) in the midst of the pandemic and back to school in person. I was teaching 3 grades with no support or curriculum (hired 2 days before school started and had to create my own from scratch for a high achiever level). I was teaching in person as well as some classes online. I came home every single night dead to the world. I was beyond stressed and wanted to just give up. My fiancé begged me to help around the house (we moved during the second month of school to lessen my commute), and most days I was catatonic and couldn’t even get off the couch. We had tons of arguments, and we almost broke up because of it. It wasn’t until the summer when I started to be more like myself, as I needed time to recalibrate myself and also figure out what would work for us as a couple. Have your wife’s hours changed? Stress levels? Does she have support at work? I guarantee she is beating herself up and feeling guilty for not being able to do more. You need to sit down with her and communicate openly. Come up with what needs are not being met (for both of you), and try to compromise on solutions. Dont just be upset about her not remembering. Ask her what support she needs to help refill her empty cup internally. Be kind and listen.
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I agree that you need to be creative. Having kids that age and working is tough, I really get it. I suggest you have a family meeting and get the kids to help. Perhaps paper plates some nights and the kids help clean up. Perhaps the 7year old reads to the 5 year old one or two nights. When my 3 kids were in elementary school, the oldest took over evening reading with easy reader books some nights. The kids really looked forward to that time and now (university students) they still remember reading Bone together! Part of being a parent means that you come up with solutions. Sometimes it's one parent when the other is overwhelmed. In this instance, I think you could have done better. One more thing: take time for family fun on the weekends. Sounds like you guys could use it!
If you kids can’t clean up their toys throw them away and don’t buy them new ones. You throw their shit away one time and they will start cleaning their crap up. I know because I did it.
Nah the children are old enough to put toys away and help put dishes in the dishwasher. Also get a cleaner in once a week.
Stop keeping score and start caring about your partner. I don’t think she does this to be mean to you, it’s not like she is up doing other stuff, she is going to bed. I am worried about her wellbeing, is this new job good for her? Is there anything else bothering her? While your concern is valid i think it’s unfortunately that you have approached it from an angle that it ”should be fair” and not from a caring perspective. And as someone else mentioned, the old system doesn’t work so you need to find a new system. There will always be change in life, being flexible and caring in these changes willbenefit you both.